The Cubs’ trade of Yu Darvish cleared $62MM from the books over the next three years, but Russell Dorsey of the Chicago Sun-Times writes in his latest mailbag column that it’s still unlikely the team will agree to a contract extension with any of its pending free agents prior to the start of Spring Training. Each of Javier Baez, Anthony Rizzo and Kris Bryant is set to hit the market next year, and while the latter of that trio has seen his name prominently circulated in the rumor mill, Baez and Rizzo have broadly been considered extension candidates. A long-term arrangement could come together once camp is underway, Dorsey notes, but only if the “right situation presented itself.”
Of course, given that no deal has come with Baez despite years of negotiations and that Rizzo already has already signed one team-friendly deal, it’s hard to see either player inking a deal that heavily favors the Cubs. The fact that both players are coming off down seasons only further muddies the matter. Both players have considerable career earnings already and may prefer to bet on a personal rebound rather than selling themselves short after a lackluster 2020 showing.
More out of baseball’s Central divisions…
- In his latest Q&A with readers, Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reports that the Cardinals aren’t actively pursuing rotation upgrades outside of a potential reunion with Adam Wainwright. The Cards aren’t being particularly aggressive in their efforts to re-sign either Wainwright or fellow franchise icon Yadier Molina, per Goold, instead continuing to wait out a glacial free-agent market. Should Wainwright ultimately sign elsewhere, the Cards might pivot and look for a low-cost deal with a comparable veteran, but they’ve “continued to position themselves as a team that will reduce payroll,” Goold writes.
- The Tigers are expected to be among the teams on hand for free-agent right-hander Corey Kluber’s showcase in Florida on Wednesday, Chris McCosky of the Detroit News tweets. It figures to be a well-attended event to watch Kluber, a two-time American League Cy Young winner in Cleveland who endured injury-plagued years in 2019 and ’20. A fractured forearm limited the longtime workhorse to 35 2/3 innings in his last season as a member of the Indians, and then he threw just one frame last year as a Ranger while battling shoulder issues. Still, the 34-year-old looks to carry plenty of appeal as a buy-low candidate. In Detroit’s case, the 34-year-old could help improve a rotation that received dismal production from Matthew Boyd and Michael Fulmer last season, perhaps while mentoring much younger hurlers such as Casey Mize, Tarik Skubal and Matt Manning.
- The Twins, whose interest in Kluber was previously reported, will also be at Kluber’s showcase, per La Velle E. Neal III of the Star Tribune. Kluber has ties to Twins chief baseball officer Derek Falvey, who was part of the Cleveland front office that acquired the former ace.
- The Cubs are yet another Central team that will take in Kluber’s session, Sahadev Sharma of The Athletic relays. They’re in clear need of rotation upgrades beyond Kyle Hendricks and Zach Davies, but they’re not in big-spending mode. It remains to be seen whether Kluber will end up in their price range.
bkbkbkbk
MLB not stepping in on the Ricketts is the biggest insult of the terrible offseason.
24TheKid
Maybe they should get John Marston involved.
StlSwifty
The fact that the cardinals are playing the nickel and dime game with yadi and waino is simply embarrassing.
johnk
Millions are not nickel and dime.
Dutch Vander Linde
I think Arthur Morgan should get involved too.
24TheKid
I don’t think Arthur ever met Landon Ricketts, but might as well.
chitown311
The Ricketts bought up every square foot of business, real estate, restaurant and establishment in Wrigleyville and created their own “pay per view” network. Now that business is bad they are putting the financial failure on what made all the money in the first place, the loyal Cubs fans. It is such a slap in the face and every Cubby fan should be up in arms about what this ownership is doing. I don’t understand how anyone can give them a pass after how they have bled the average Cubs fan fry in price gouging over the past half decade.
1984wasntamanual
I understand that it’s a business, so I’m not up in arms about anything. No one forces people to go to the games or pay the ridiculous prices. If they weren’t able to sell them at that price, they wouldn’t.
As you mentioned, they’ve invested a ton of money in and around the park. With no fans at the games, they’re not getting much, if any, return on that investment, so it’s understandable that they’d be hit harder by this than some other teams are.
They’ve had a top 5 payroll in baseball since what, like 2016? This team peaked years ago (they should have blown it up already). Even if they spent to the levels they’ve been at, this team is still gonna be a weak contender. Sure, they might win the central and then anything can happen, but I can understand not wanting to spend $200m for a team where you’re hoping to get lucky.
YourDreamGM
Well said 1984. Only point I will disagree on is they should have blown it up already. You contradict yourself there. Since they spent all that money on wrigley billed they needed people to come there to reap their rewards. So blowing up a competitive team by trading likable players would have been, well I don’t know if there is a word to describe it, bad awful terrible catastrophic aren’t powerful enough.
However with limited fans 2021 is a perfect time to refresh the farm system by trading away assets. I wouldn’t count on baez rizzo being signed to extensions. Maybe brought back if the free agent market isn’t hot for them. Their best days are behind them but they will put people in the seats. Bryant is gone for sure.
kylegocougs
They shouldn’t get a free ride on their investments, the rich are never allowed to fail in this country.
1984wasntamanual
I meant that they should have solely from a team building position.
Even though they manage to sell out when they’re not great, I understand why they didn’t blow it up before. There is also their network that they launched. You want a competitive team if you’re gonna try to do that as well.
I think they pretty clearly expected this core (or whatever you want to call it) to stay competitive a few years longer than they did and ended up being pot committed already when they realized they weren’t.
1984wasntamanual
Free ride on their investment? What does this comment even mean?
drasco036
The core was highly competitive, they made the playoffs 5 of 6 years and posted a mark above .500 in 6 of 6 years.
Not having fans in the stands in 2020 and potentially 2021, with the addition of the final bill for Wrigley renovations being due is what caused the Cubs financial issues, not The Ricketts being cheap, not Theo being a bad, reckless president, not the core being unproductive.
Counter point on “cheap Tom”- he allowed the Cubs to spend well over the luxury tax last season (before the loss of fans) despite his desires as an owner to be below the luxury tax and knowing the money was due for the renovations.
Counter point to people who think Theo was reckless- The Cubs sat roughly 55 million below the luxury tax prior to the trade of Yu Darvish. That is more than enough money to have made the tweaks to the roster that would have been necessary to field a playoff caliber team. Also, the farm system is a lot better than “experts” have given it credit for. Aside from Marquez, Amaya and Davis who are all very highly regarded prospects, there are several that sniff around the top 100 (Azolay Howard, Roederer, and Strumpf). They also have a lot of youthful prospects that have very high ceilings and the newly developed “pitch lab” has seen positive results.
1984wasntamanual
I don’t consider just making the playoffs as being competitive. I can see how you would count it as such, but what I mean by that is a legitimate title contender (no, not in the get in and get lucky way). You’re free to disagree, but I have to imagine that they expected this team to be better than it is, for longer than it was.
bpfrank8
What are you talking about? Who’s being forced to subsidize them?
jabraaten13
They should have blown it up 2 years ago. Why are people mad that they are getting rid of big contacts. Its a business
drasco036
As Collin Cowherd always says, “Fan is short for Fanatic”… That is why they get upset. They are emotionally invested in teams for whatever reason.
Also, as for a lot of these Cubs fans, they have been die hard fans since 2015…
ABCD
You’re so right, Chitown. And you know what – Reinsdorf is the greatest and his late partner Einhorn was such an innovator with pay TV. I hope Jerry lives ten more years so he can finagle a new stadium when the lease on the Grate is done. He deserves it so much and the taxpayers should be lining up to hand over it to him.
(Shhhhh, don’t tell Chitown but every MLB owners’ goal is to vacuum as many dollars as they can out of your pocket.)
drasco036
Nobody wants to see the Cubs succeed more than I do but you have to realize that those investments the Cubs have made have not come to fruition yet and the City of Chicago refused to help out with the Wrigley renovations despite the money the Cubs bring in for the city.
The writing was on the wall but apparently Cubs fans fail to read. The Ricketts family had a massive payment due for Wrigley renovations at the end of the 2020 season, a season where they took a steep financial loss but the work was done, it’s continuing to be done, the bills are piling up and there is no guarantee there will be fans in the stands in 2021.
You can B*$%^ moan and complain all you want but the Ricketts family just shelled out a BILLION dollars to renovate Wrigley, that was $500 million over budget and didn’t receive a penny from the city. Do you have a half billion laying around to help cover expenses? Not only did they not receive any financial support from the city, unlike every other ball club in every other city,
To put things into perspective for a second, the city of Chicago funded then entirety of the dumpster of a stadium in the South (167 million in 1991) and paid $430 million to renovate the crap hole along with Solider Field. The North Siders, who bring in more money didn’t get a red cent from Chicago. Not only did they get a penny from Chicago, they agreed to PAY the city of Chicago an additional 5 million in infrastructure payments.
I personally greatly enjoyed watching the Cubs play competitive baseball and win their first World Series in my life-time the past half decade. And while you complain about “price gouging”, maybe understand that the Ricketts family went into a great amount of debt to bring Chicago their first World Series.
In the long run, these investments will return a profit to the Cubs but as I said before, I don’t care how much money you have (unless you are Elon Musk or Bezo) a half billion dollar bath hurts.
1984wasntamanual
I believe that they also mentioned previously that they specifically planned to use gate revenue and the revenue from the area around the field to fund these projects. So when you have that source of income pretty much eliminated, I have to imagine it screws up any plans and budgeting you had even if everything else had stuck to the budget they originally planned.
SimonSwings
Yeah, but how much did Chicago City pony up?
dresman92
This is your first post that you made fun of the Cubs that I have to agree with. Being a Cubs fan for over 40 years I could careless about this team after that Ricketts has done to it. Too much I need more money. I get it that they dont want a payroll over 200 but should be in top 10 of 5.
dshires4
There’s just no way MLB needs to (or should) step in while simultaneously giving Oakland, Tampa, and Pittsburgh a free ride on their frugal spending.
tom brunanskys black sock
Did you not notice TB playing in the World Series last year?
dshires4
I did. I also don’t care about how they spend their money. They’re insanely efficient at how they operate. MLB can’t and shouldn’t come down on the Cubs if they’re not going to come down on other franchises. That’s the point. How the Cubs operate should be of no business to anybody other than the Cubs. If they want to piss away 120 years of fandom by being cheap, so be it. If I were a Cubs fan I wouldn’t be watching the games or spending money on the team.
kylegocougs
Then they ripped it apart to save $29mm
Sideline Redwine
Oakland and Tampa Bay are just fine, thank you. They are simply more efficient in their spending (yes, frugal), maybe other teams should take note.
ChiSox_Fan
“Central Rumors”?!
I was expecting to see another White Sox signing!!
1984wasntamanual
Stepping in for what? Is there a rule that says they need to spend x amount of money? Throwing money at the problem isn’t going to fix their situation.
Technically correct
It is still less than one calendar year from when everyone’s plans/budgets/lives were blown up. We just heard this week that the plan is for 162 games in 2021, so I don’t think it’s unreasonable for owners to be acting more cautiously. The NBA is perfect example of how things are still very much in flux going forward. Cheers if you are still spending at the same discretionary level as January 2020. I sure as hell am not.
kylegocougs
The wealthy owners and shareholders have done immensely well in 2020
1984wasntamanual
Do you mean in general, or team owners? Would you care to provide proof of the Rickett’s doing well in 2020, especially them doing well specifically on cubs related finances.
bpfrank8
Hey comrade…are you insinuating that the owners of the Cubs & other MLB organizations shouldn’t work with a budget? Shouldn’t try to maximize profit? It’s a business.
Rangers29
Kluber was terrific in his 1 inning with us. Terrific trade, and he’ll always be one of my icons because of it.
Ducky Buckin Fent
Lol
This is a bit uncharitable, @Rangers29. Don’t tell me you were missing Delino DeShields last summer.
Rangers29
I’d donate Deshields to anybody… except the Dolans. I hate that franchise because of the owners alone.
Ducky Buckin Fent
The Dolans of NYC destroyed my NBA fandom, serious. I couldn’t even tell you the Knicks starting lineup.
I’m actually sorta grateful for that.
Rangers29
The *Indians* are ran by a different group of Dolans, but they suck just as much lol. Cheap bassturds (as I like to put it).
Ducky Buckin Fent
Uncle & nephew.
Same clan.
& – yeah – same suckiness.
Rangers29
Ok, I replied on the Kim thread, and it’s really long lol. Almost half the length of some of the essays I write lol.
YourDreamGM
Dolan’s are great. Not only do they keep the team in cleveland but they field winning teams. You can only spend as much as your market and fan base allows.
Superbear29
Indians haven’t won anything in 60+ years basically the Lions of baseball.
1984wasntamanual
So the only thing that counts as, “anything”, is a WS? That’s an interesting definition.
miggy4prez
Lol
mlb1225
Might as well retire #28 in Kluber’s honor.
warnbeeb
The question is if the Tigers sign Kluber and he breaks down by June 1st, does he go into the HOF as a Ranger or a Tiger?
angt222
Lots of Kluber suitors. BOS, DET.. I thought MIL or MIN would have been all over him.
Ducky Buckin Fent
I think Kluber is going to have a good ’21. The broken arm* was a fluke & he didn’t need surgery last summer. Could certainly argue that being shut down saved some wear & tear, even.
I’ve wanted this guy on the Yanks for years, man. I’ve seen him throw out here. Really good pitcher.
*have you fellas seen the video of when he broke his arm? mercy. there’s a tough guy’s tough guy
CKinSTL
Yeah, it is incredible to watch his reaction to the broken arm. His body language and facial expressions are alway expressionless on the mound.. It is really amazing. Maybe he has a second career as a poker player once he is done with this baseball stuff..
Ducky Buckin Fent
Good gravy.
It hurts to just watch it. I couldn’t help flinching just *watching* it, man. He doesn’t react at all. Yeah, Kluber can play on my squad any day.
Rangers29
I have loved Kluber before his injuries and now I just plain adore him after those injuries. Not because I hate him, but because I love how he deals with strife. I’ve always been a believer that people who handle their struggles well, are successful people in general. The way he walked into the dugout after feeling his shoulder pain in his one Rangers’ inning was so calm and collective that you’d think he was just going in to get a drink. But it was – in reality – shoulder pain.
I love this video about Kluber, it’s probably the greatest made Youtube video you’ll find about baseball… anywhere. Excellent production and presentation, in fact, I think I’ll watch it again (even though I’ve seen it about 5 times). Just shows the complete awesomeness of Kluber. The vid: youtube.com/watch?v=vIjQtoL1MEg
Ducky Buckin Fent
Sweeet.
Thanks for the link.
102 mph off his forearm. And he still got the ball to 1b! Hard to not root for the guy.
Rangers29
Kluber is awesome. I’ve modeled my game after several players, but I think I might need to take a *literal* mental note from Kluber.
Btw, I’m going to reply on the Kim thread soon.
Ducky Buckin Fent
All you need to do is learn how to throw a curve like that, uh.
I’d forgotten how absolutely ridiculous that pitch is.
Logjammer D"Baggagecling
It’s a mistake not extending Baez and Rizzo.
ChiSoxCity
Read the tea leaves (and stop drinking the koolaid). Why would they extend anyone if they’re no trying to contend for the foreseeable future? They are moving on.
Logjammer D"Baggagecling
Because why not? Rizzo is the face of the franchise and Baez is a franchise player. There’s no reason not to extend then and then extend Contreras in 2 years.
ChiSoxCity
Look, all that franchise stuff means nothing when your window has closed. Franchise players get moved all the time, too.
There was no reason to trade Darvish and Caratini either, but they did. The Cubs are pressing the reset button.
Logjammer D"Baggagecling
Its not a full on rebuild. Though. They have a good enough team to win the division. A weak one at that. They need to spend money not save it. Trades talks for anyone other than Bryant is dumb. The Ricketts quadrupled the team value in less than anl decade. Yet they refuse to spend money on improving the team.
1984wasntamanual
This idea that they refuse to spend is just asinine. They clearly showed that they were willing to spend the previous 5 or so years. Do you think that value improvement just happened? They had to invest money to increase the value. Money they are required to pay back regardless of their attendance. Team value =/= liquid cash for payroll.
I don’t even think the Ricketts are particularly good owners, but some of the criticism of them on here just makes no sense.
drasco036
Because the Cubs would have no leverage in extending either right now. Give them the QO at the end of the season and negotiate a new deal during their exclusive window.
drasco036
Again, love the user name.
I cannot agree more, Ricketts family has spent like crazy both on the team and the facilities. People fail to realize how much last season hurt them.
No one is more annoyed that the Cubs are not spending to the luxury tax threshold than I am but I completely understand. I think this team needed a few minor tweaks and I completely understood getting out of Darvish’s contract (regardless of how well he pitched the last several months) and non-tendering Schwarber (even if they were to spend to the LT, they needed to open his position and have some extra cash liquidity) but I’m by no means happy about their lack of spending.
Wong, Tanaka, LaStella and JA Happ or TJ Walker would not have broke the bank and would have given the Cubs a division winning team while leaving enough to add a couple relievers and some slush to make deadline improvements. Fact is however, 2020 and the possibility of not having fans in 2021 (or limited fans) AND a potential strike on 2022 can be financially devastating.
There are too many unknowns but I’d be willing to bet that if the Cubs move back to 3 million plus fans (or signs of normalcy in fanbase) then they go back to being major players in the 2021-2022 free agent class.
Also, just for giggles, I’m not sold on the Cubs being complete non-factors next season. They could trade several players and use that prospect capital to add younger players also.
The move I would love to see is for the Cubs to deal Contreras to the Rays for Zunino (3 million remaining) Kiermaier (26 million remaining) Brujan one of Baz, Wilcox or McClanahan and I’d love Honeywell (high risk) but it may be too hopeful.
Kiermaier would be going in the opposite direction of the Cubs needs but Brujan would give us a second baseman with crazy speed, potential future leadoff hitter and insurance if Baez leaves.
BeeVeeTee
It’s all full rebuild since the Cubs spent all of the resources on the MLB team and neglected the farm system in the last four years of the Theo regime. Not one legit starting pitcher coming out of the Cubs’ farm system. Theo and the Cubs never developed pitching and just spent money on it while it’s young core was being not being paid the big bucks. Schwarber was untouchable at one time where the Cubs would never thought of trading him but recently let him go for nothing.
drasco036
Clearly you don’t know anything about the Cubs farm system.
iml12
The Cubs farm is looking very good. The problem is they cut, traded, and diced this team apart and probably no help for 2021. Brailyn Marquez is a legit mlb pitching prospect.
drasco036
It’s hard to count on prospect help when there was no 2020 minor league season.
It’s funny, I have the least amount of faith in Marquez. I just think he will end up being a high leverage reliever, which isn’t bad, but not starter material.
That said, the Cubs farm is vastly underrated. They have a lot of extremely high ceiling young guys, a lot of guys that project to be solid major leaguers and a couple guys that could be superstars. My guy to watch is Nwogu… I have a feeling that he will be scary good. He’s developed so much since dedicating himself to baseball and has all the intangibles. I didn’t think for one second the Cubs were going to be able to ink him.
I was a bit surprised that the Cubs went with Howard over Mitchell. I had Mitchell tabbed for the Cubs from the get go give his defensive position and experience. I thought he was an ideal fit for a team that was in the situation that the Cubs were in.
iml12
Marquez has seemed to steadily improve every single year in the Cubs farm. It’s hard not to get excited about a lefty that can hit triple digits with and above averafe breaking ball. Brennen Davis is flying up the prospect rankings too. You don’t even have to look at their depth they should have 3 highly rated prospects that should contribute sometime in 2021 Amaya, Davis, Marquez and be on the roster full time in 2022 . They could sneak 5-6 guys into the top 100 by the end of the year.
babybears
Do not forget Alzolay. If the guy can stay healthy he is easily a 3-4 pitcher.. Stumpf is also someone that does not get the recognition he deserves. Happ and Nico may also see an uptick in production this year. The cupboard is not bare in the Cubs farm. In 2-3 years they could have a top 5 farm system again. LOTS of money is there to spend when they are ready also. I am ok with what we are doing this year. We do need a solid OF guy to go along with what we have currently though.
drasco036
I’m really excited about the kids we got in the Darvish deal. A lot of “experts” were bashing the deal because we didn’t get a top 100 prospect but every last one of those kids have the upside to be a top 100 and impact ML player.
A lot of people only know the top 100, and it’s exciting to know them… but if you ever get bored, look at the top prospect lists now, and then go back and look at where some of these guys ranked in their systems farm 2-3 years ago… guys like Spencer Howard who is 28 now, didn’t rank at all when he was drafted and was the organizations 15-20 ranked prospect. Hell, Kyle Hendricks never sniffed a top 100 list and he’s one of the best pitcher in the league.
YourDreamGM
I would be a mistake to pay them what it would take to extend them. Let them have a dose of reality. A 30 something first baseman and baez can have fun competing with all the other shortstops. I see them as declining players who want too much money. They can come back for the right price.
drasco036
Extending anyone on their last year (outside of a situation like Betts and Lindor where you trade high level talent) is a huge mistake.
The Cubs have zero leverage in negotiations right now except for the poor seasons offensively by those three. How much will Rizzo’s value be hurt if you strap him with a Qualifying Offer? How much is Baez’s value going to decrease being in a free agent market with possibly Lindor, Story, Corerea and Seager? Not to mention guys like Semein, Didi and Simmons could be free agents also.
This is what “fans” fail to realize… they move to panic mode and think “we have to extend! we have to extend!” The last year of a guys contract is the worst time to extend a player, let it play out, a guy could have a contract altering injury (or worse yet a career altering injury), saddle them with a QO and you have your negotiating window. Do people forget your have that window after the season you can negotiate? If you are going to offer fair market value, which is what it’s going to take in their last year anyway, that is the time to do it.
tigerdoc616
The only way the Tigers sign Kluber is if he blows his showcase and good teams lose interest. If he does reasonably well he should get a decent team or two interested in him.
Ducky Buckin Fent
Like almost all free agents, he’ll more than likely end up wherever he was offered the best contract.
Give that, I’m not sure why that would preclude the Tigers from signing him.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
But why pass up sometime in FLA avoiding the cold front…….they will all be there……… no such thing as a free lunch.
Ducky Buckin Fent
Hah.
The fools. Don’t they realize grouse season is coming to a close?
paindonthurt
How do you extend Baez or Rizzo after the 20’ season?
Curveball1984
The Cubs are gonna try to get a discount and Bazzo (is that a thing yet) are gonna bet on themselves. We’ll see who wins out. I’m thinking the Cubs do. Rizzo imho is on that backside of the peak now might resign but it’ll be at less years & less cash, and Baez has admitted he’s nothing without in-game video. Wouldn’t be shocked if he settles in a Jose Hernandez-type of career. 23-30HR’s .215-.230AVG .295-320OBP, LOTS of K’s Dave Kingman-style, with an excellent glove. The Cubs should only spend so many years & $$$ on that. It really depends on where he’s at mid-season 2021. If he struggles again… i’d let him walk. And I love the guy — he’s my favorite player.
drasco036
You make a good point about Baez and the in-game video. (Did baseball say they are bringing that back?)
Watching Baez last season, his swing was insanely long and as a result (rookie year long), his opposite field approach seemed nonexistent for the majority of the season. That approach, his ability to protect the down and outside portion of the plate is what turned Baez into an offensive force the past couple years. His swing was too long and he was pulling the head off. Maybe in-game video would have helped him notice it.
The crazy thing about Baez is he is so good at shortening his swing when he chooses to (when runners are on) and picking up singles and doubles. The guy has the talent to drive in 100 RBI’s a season if he gets back to his previous approach.
tom brunanskys black sock
History! Tradition! Culture! These are not concepts. These are trophies I keep in my den as paperweights!
lolzmets
Mommy mommy! Monte needs attention! He’s not racist, give him a cookie! It isn’t cute or funny. See how it just sits here and everyone ignores it?
rumham
Underrated movie.
IronBallsMcGinty
Cubs are gonna be back to Completely Useless By September
ChiSox_Fan
They already are useless!!
Either that or pathetic at best.
iml12
I’d say a white Sox fan trolling every single article about the cubs is useless and pathetic at best. Seriously, go enjoy your team.
Oddvark
They were really comfortable being the Lovable Losers for all those years. Being a championship caliber team just didn’t fit with their brand.
Moneyballer
Twins should double dip and take on Kluber and Hand.
Superbear29
Sure you need a lefty to face Jimenez, Robert, Abreu, Anderson and Graendal.
Moneyballer
Well they smash lefties so no we don’t.
Jeff Zanghi
I think Baez is a risky player to sign to a long term extension. He just really doesn’t have much patience at the plate and so his production is entirely tied to his batting average. So if it slips even a little his value plummets with it. Whereas Rizzo at least also draws a ton of walks. So even if his average were to dip going forward his obp and power could still provide ample value as he enters his mid 30s.
seamaholic 2
Rizzo is gonna fall off a cliff production-wise, and it may have started. His whole gimmick is to stand on top of the plate, take away the outside edge, and still be quick enough to turn hard on inside fastballs. He loses those reflexes and he’s a complete goner. And that goes with age. If I’m the Cubs I much rather bet on Bryant returning to form than Rizzo ever again being what he was a couple years ago.
drasco036
I’m not overly concerned about Rizzo’s production falling off, I am concerned about his back hindering him which is why I’d let 2021 play out before trying to re-sign him.
Everyone is quick to talk about needing to extend Rizzo but apparently they forget of choose to look the other way that he has missed time due to his back in consecutive years (i.e. a recurring back problem) and that doesn’t seem to get better with age. It’s so bad that Rizzo cut a lot of weight BETWEEN spring training ending and before re-reporting to “spring training” or whatever before the season began. That indicates it is/was a serious enough issue that Rizzo believes he needed to make a change to his physic. To me, that is a BIG red flag and enough for me personally to play the waiting game.
1984wasntamanual
Baez also has power and plays solid defense, but I agree and have said for years that I wouldn’t extend him. Once his bat speed starts to slip, I think he craters offensively.
iml12
I still see no semblance of a plan from Hoyer. How much below the luxury tax do they have to be at this point. They have nobody signed after 2021 and 75 million under the luxury tax.
YourDreamGM
Good points on rizzo baez. It’s not about the luxury tax. No fans equals no incentive to spend money. The farm system needs to improve so 2021 is a perfect storm to achieve that goal.
babybears
All they got is Heyward (25 mil) Hendricks and Bote. I actually like what they are doing. If they want to see how guys play out and then go after FAs or their own guys that is a good idea. They have the money to spend on Baez, Bryant, Rizzo if they want to. while their youth develops you spend on FA contracts for 4-5 years and then you are able to sign and do arbitration with the young guys when their contracts are up.
They will have over 120 million to spend next offseason at their current pace. If they do trade Contreras, Bryant, Baez or Hendricks you can spend and let the prospects develop. That is what the plan is looking like to me.
Moneyballer
I would sign him, clutch bat sterling defense! Baez is just an all-around great baseball player!
seth3120
Do the Cardinals have a chance to win the central by doing next to nothing?
iml12
They have to be considered massive front runners right now with or without Molina and wainwright
Android Dawesome
Please elaborate. You can make a case that they are front runners but “massive” is a massive over statement.
iml12
Massive might have been an over statement at this point but before the offseason is over they will probably be the clear front runners. Reds trade any of their pitching or Suarez they are toast. Cubs dump Bryant and spend no money they are toast. Brewers have done nothing. The cardinals at least have sp depth locked down and a few big prospects that could make an impact in 2021.
ABCD
Actually, the Brewers and even the Reds have as much of a chance this season as the Cubs and Cards. It is a four team race just like it was last year.
Oddvark
With all the moves those teams have been making, they seem to be trying to make it a 5 team race — but the Pirates won’t let them.
YourDreamGM
None of the teams have lost enough to change much. Now if someone offers enough for the Cubs to move more players and if they aren’t replaced with talent then they will be out. I don’t see the reds trading much away. Brewers are just sitting tight. Pirates are trying to sell 4 starting pitchers but there are no buyers.
Curveball1984
The only team currently that are frontrunners in the division are the Cubs, and I say that because they won the division last season. Even without Yu & Schwarbs, I haven’t seen enough from the Cards, Brews or Reds (or Cubs) to give anyone a distinct advantage. Spoiler Alert: the Pirates do not will the NLC in 21.
drasco036
I have the Cardinals out in front due to their pitching and ML prospect depth.
The Cubs on paper have the better offense, even without Schwarber but they need to do something about either LF or CF depending on where they intended to play Happ. The solution at the moment may be Happ in LF with Hoerner in CF but I really think Nico needs to be in AAA to start the season.
Cardinals however have the edge in pitching, both starting and relief, and has guys that could break through on the ML roster to help the offense. I disregard most of the 2020 numbers and Edman, is a pretty decent replacement for Pham if that ends up being the case. Carlson and Herrera could boost the offense, same with Montero. Who knows, maybe even Matt Carpenter starts using his “salsa” again.
Ma4170
Not sure he’ll be a “buy low” candidate if the session goes well with all those teams interested
everlastingdave
I can’t think of a single team that shouldn’t have interest in Kluber.
YourDreamGM
If his price is over 5 million I can think of at least a dozen.
Lloyd Emerson
Junkyard Jed wants everybody to forget about dumpster diving Theo and create his own garbage fire. But you can’t blame him because he’s just a puppet for the Ricketts. They got their championship, bought up Wrigleyville, and turned it into Rickettsville. Now they’ll sit pretty on their mountains of millions while crying to poverty stricken America about their biblical losses.
Curveball1984
Yeah… remember there’s no profit in Baseball. LolzTrickyRicketts
artfay
Maybe extension candidates? Why is this news?
la verdad
We don’t need Bryant, we got Bote!!
Deleted Userrr
Trade Rizzo, Bryant and Baez. Now.
YourDreamGM
They would like to but who is buying them?
Moneyballer
Umm if they made Baez and Rizzo available there would be a bidding war for a trade.
Deleted Userrr
Everyone
lolzmets
What about the Realmuto trade? Talk about that. Again.
Deleted Userrr
Here’s $20. Go buy a new joke.
Curveball1984
why?
Deleted Userrr
Because their club control (and with it, their trade value) is rapidly evaporating.
bykoric
Best case scenario is Baez & Rizzo play out the year and then we hear some BS how they’re being “unreasonable” in their demands and how it makes no sense to allocate all that money to 1 or 2 players and they walk after 2021. (Seriously, watch how the Cubs spin Rizzo & Baez as the “bad guys” when they don’t resign them).
YourDreamGM
Wish a team could just be honest. I would say Cubs fans get in your cars and take a ride to Detroit Cincinnati St Louis and have a good look at what big contracts do to 30 year old first baseman.
ChiSoxCity
So many koolaid drinking Cubs fans in this message section. That’s ok, because you guys are going to need it to get thru the next 5-10 years. The Ricketts are done doing charity—it’s bargain basement from here on out. Sucks to be you.
jdan74
Just my opinion, but I think Rizzo is the only one deserving (leader and face of the franchise), and playing 1st base, I’m sure he’ll be able to effectively club the ball well into his late 30’s. I think you go and get a King’s ransom for Baez and a decent haul (although it won’t be great) for Bryant.
drasco036
I’ll repeat this, Rizzo has back issues. Rizzo has dealt with back issues dating back to 2014. He doesn’t miss a lot of playing time but back injures are concerning, they were concerning enough for Rizzo to drop 25 pounds between spring training and the start of the condensed season. Regardless of how the financial state is looking for the Cubs, I think that is probably the number one reason why the Cubs have not extended Rizzo.
justacubsfan
So would it have been a green flag if he got bigger instead of dropping the 25 lbs? I don’t get how you “see” that as a red flag. But then again, im not a doctor. Where did you get your MD at?
drasco036
What an ignorant comment.
He went to spring training and hurt his back, its such a concern for Rizzo he felt he needed to lose 25 pounds and came back after the weight loss and hurt his back… That is a red flag.
Spike 13
The teams aggressively addressing their needs are those with adequate controllable players and deep minor league talent, and or plenty of cash. They see their window of opportunity. I would wager that with the uncertainty going forward, and the contraction of minor league teams, this will be a season of rookies making it to the show in droves for the teams that aren’t going for it. For those veterans not willing to take one year short money contracts, their careers may be over. Minors deals in record numbers.
justacubsfan
Extend Rizzo, but let the rest walk. Rizzo is a guy who has been underpaid his whole career. He’s been a huge clubhouse guy and has a ton of intangible factors attractive to the Cubs. He would likely not require some 8-10 year deal. A 4-5 year extension at a reasonable rate 80-120MM would be my guess as to the range. He’s definitely someone who will age better than most due to high bat to ball skills and patience at the plate. If the DH returns to the NL, he could even take that spot in the future.
17dizzy
And why do the Cardinals need to reduce payroll??? Not because of the 2020 Covid years!! It’s because their current president of baseball operations, John Mozeliak, has strapped the ball club with so many far fetched multi year, high dollar contracts over the past 5 years to over rated players.
Mozeliak’s inept ability has put the CARDINALS in a position of mediocrity. Having to pay high salaries to non productive players such as Brett Cecil, Mike Leake, Derrick Fowler, plus a absolutely stupid $36 million 2 year extension to a player who has barely hit what he weighs over the past 2 seasons. Matt Carpenter and Derrick Fowler plus Andrew Miller’s salaries are a waste of millions of dollars for 2021. Totally financial liabilities!!
By not being able to judge and foresee talent of Cardinal minor league prospects, plus Mozeliak’s attitude of buying low hanging fruit and looking for that possibility of finding his lightning in a bottle, is a tactic of hit or miss. With the most likely to be a miss because of players diminished talents.
John Mozeliak’s strategy of ruling a MLB team is now prehistoric. Sure they have had over 10 straight seasons of playing over .500 baseball. But with a little insight, or even one trade or acquisition of one impact player at those trading deadlines could have made the difference in a .500 contending team to a National League Pennant contending team.
John Mozeliak is not the same person when he was first announced as the new Cardinals GM. He seems too complacent where he and his team is in concept of their structure and had no intent to improve the Cardinals by obtaining impact players to fill the weak outfield, having guts enough to bench Carpenter and play younger, more healthy and consistently higher preforming players.
Until John Mozeliak is gone, the Cardinals will always remain a .500 ball club. Never obtaining those big bats the Cardinals desperately need.
babybears
Extending anyone on the Cubs is a mistake right now. Except maybe Hendricks for 2 more years.
Strunk Flugget
Isn’t it interesting that the only people who continuously bash the Cubs and their fans are White Sox fans who are jealous that, even when they win, their team will never get the attention that the Cubs do?
troll
cardinals are looking everywhere. dewitt is looking at dewallet
ddilts
Stl shedding payroll is BS. This team makes 50-100+mil a year, I think they can afford to ride out the Covid losses and still actually try to win.
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