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Reds Have Had Recent Trade Talks Regarding Castillo, Gray, Mahle

By James Hicks and Steve Adams | December 1, 2021 at 9:08am CDT

TODAY: The Rangers are one of the teams who have spoken to the Reds about their starters, according to Jon Morosi (via Twitter).

NOVEMBER 29: The Reds have had talks with multiple teams about starting pitchers Tyler Mahle, Sonny Gray, and Luis Castillo, reports MLB.com’s Jon Morosi (via Twitter). Cincinnati has reportedly been open to dealing starting pitchers for weeks now, but Morosi suggests there have been recent discussions on all three from that trio.

Either Mahle (who has two years of control remaining after a breakout 2021) or Gray (who’s under contract for $10.2MM in 2022, with a $12MM club option for 2023) would figure to cost significantly less in prospect capital than would Castillo, whom Cincinnati is said to be loath to deal. Like Mahle, Castillo has two years of club control remaining. However, he also has a longer track record of consistent high-end production than Mahle, and he’s three years younger and less expensive than Gray, who is playing out the final two years of a contract extennsion.

An earlier report by Morosi had linked the Angels to Castillo, though he described those talks as “preliminary.” MLB Network’s Jon Heyman tweets, however, that the Angels are at the “forefront” of the Castillo push, even as the Reds have told opposing GMs they prefer to hang onto their top starter.

Just how high a price Reds GM Nick Krall is asking for Castillo remains to be seen, but any team that’s come calling will have expected it to be high. In what was actually one of his lesser statistical seasons, Castillo posted a 3.98 ERA (3.75 FIP) across 187 2/3 innings against a career ERA of 3.72 (3.76 FIP) in parts of five major league seasons — all of which were spent playing his home games in the hitter-friendly confines of Cincinnati’s Great American Ball Park. He’s also been remarkably durable, taking the ball at least 31 times in each of his full seasons (and 12 times in the pandemic-shortened 2020 season).

Castillo also closed out the year in particularly impressive fashion, recovering from an ugly April/May showing to post a 2.73 ERA and 3.34 FIP over his final 135 1/3 frames. Combine that with an eminently reasonable $7.6MM projected salary in arbitration (via MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz) and an additional year of club control, through the 2023 season, and it’s easy to see why the ask on Castillo would be sky-high.

The 32-year-old Gray, meanwhile, is plenty affordable in his own right. He hasn’t replicated the 2015 form that saw him finish third in AL Cy Young voting and may never reach that level again, but the right-hander has strongly bounced back from a poor showing with the Yankees that prompted his trade to Cincinnati.

In three years with the Reds, Gray carries a 3.49 ERA with a 28.5% strikeout rate that trounces the 20.9% mark he posted in his pre-Reds career. Last season’s 4.19 ERA was more solid than stellar, clearly, but Gray was also among the best in the game in terms of limiting hard contact. Most fielding-independent metrics feel he was quite a bit better than that baseline ERA indicates.

Mahle doesn’t carry the name value that his teammates do — but he’s developed into a quality mid-rotation arm over the past two seasons. Through his past 227 2/3 frames at the MLB level, Mahle owns a 3.72 ERA with an impressive 28.1% strikeout rate against a respectable 8.9% walk rate. Walks and home runs have both been issues at times in his career, but he posted solid marks in both categories over the past two seasons — and one would imagine that a move away from Cincinnati’s Great American Ball Park could also have a beneficial impact on his home-run rate.

Swartz projects a $5.6MM salary for Mahle, so any team acquiring him would have to figure it’s picking up two years of Mahle for under a total of $15MM in salary. There’s quite a bit of surplus value there, making Mahle a more enticing trade option than most would expect. Mahle turned 27 at the end of September, so he’ll pitch nearly all of the 2022 season at that age. Teams will likely view him as a pitcher whose stock is on the rise, and some may even have designs on extending him after a trade, given his age and recent strides.

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119 Comments

  1. letmeclearmythroat74

    3 years ago

    As a Reds fan , I hope they hang on to Mahle …

    10
    Reply
    • ❤️ MuteButton

      3 years ago

      your team seems to be making it hard to be a fan. They haven’t been serious about contending in a long time. I am aware of what good fans the Reds have. What a pity

      18
      Reply
      • letmeclearmythroat74

        3 years ago

        It’s been rough … I’ve set my sights on the Bengals … but they are heartbreakers too

        5
        Reply
        • BRUH.SF.BRUH

          3 years ago

          @letme not a fan of either, but at least the Bengals won’t trade Burrow in his prime…

          1
          Reply
      • CRDB40

        3 years ago

        Story of my life as a Reds fan. Castellini couldn’t care less about the fanbase.

        3
        Reply
        • Steve Roberts

          3 years ago

          Castellon needs out of Cincinnati.

          Reply
      • Bud Selig Fan

        3 years ago

        Pandemic ruined the Reds window. They spent big (for a small-market team) with a near $150MM payroll entering the 2020 season and then — boom — truncated season, no fans, no revenue. Team lost as much money due to the pandemic as any team in baseball. Hence, they need to shed. Baseball is broken and needs fixed. Yet another fan base without more than a glimmer of hope.

        5
        Reply
        • mrkinsm

          3 years ago

          The Reds didn’t spend anywhere near 150M$ in 2020. And the team’s value is 4x what it was when Cast bought the team. Show us the books if you’re going to cry poor.

          6
          Reply
        • frontofficegm

          3 years ago

          They did, actually. $160MM to Castellanos, Miley, Moustakas, Akiyama, and Strop during the 2019-20 offseason

          3
          Reply
        • TripleA

          3 years ago

          Pandemic is just an excuse to cry poor. We all know they have the $ to field a competitive team with the new TV contract. They just choose to pocket it.

          Reply
        • Kcole820

          3 years ago

          Kinda hard to cry broke when other teams are spending half a billion dollars towards FA

          Reply
      • mbauza25

        3 years ago

        Very hard , I don’t understand why own a team and not spending money to win

        Reply
    • Mystery Team

      3 years ago

      I could have sworn I read an article on this very site claiming the Reds considered Mahle off limits.

      1
      Reply
      • dsett75

        3 years ago

        Ya did. I did too & commented that very thing. They said Castillo & Mahle were “off-limits”.

        Reply
    • pogo

      3 years ago

      Out of the three Mahle is who I would want. Long time Giants fan and see a lot of “stuff” to work with. Look what Desclafani and Gausman did after their Reds to Giants transition. Doesn’t Lay’s translate but being 27 and can see the Bay Area can revamp a career or help reach a higher ceiling

      2
      Reply
      • cguy

        3 years ago

        What? Reds acquired Gausman off the waiver wire from Braves & Derek Johnson definitely helped put his career back on track. Reds chose to sign Miley the next year & let Gausman walk. As for Disco, he has always pitched well when healthy. He’s just not healthy very often..Mahle has improved every year with the Reds & would be well advised to stay with Cincinnati, if not traded.

        2
        Reply
        • letmeclearmythroat74

          3 years ago

          Gausman wasn’t a Red long enough to even consider .. he was only here for a brief time

          1
          Reply
    • dsett75

      3 years ago

      The other day they said that Mahle AND Castillo were off-limits. So, who knows what they’re thinking! I’m sure they can be persuaded to trade all 3 starters and probably Winker, too.

      Reply
    • wanamba

      3 years ago

      This off season is very depressing for the reds…looks like it’s a rebuild again.

      Reply
    • ChiSox_Fan

      3 years ago

      Rick Hahn is up to something big!

      Reply
    • 17dizzy

      3 years ago

      That trio beat the crap out of the Cardinals!! Ha! Therefore I’d like to see the Cardinals trade for all 3 of them!! At least that way— they couldn’t beat the Cards in 2022!!

      Reply
  2. Bigtimeyankeefan

    3 years ago

    I would think Cashman would be in on Castillo though apparently he’s hibernating for the winter

    3
    Reply
    • Wrian Washman

      3 years ago

      I don’t think Cash is interested in parting with what it would take to get Castillo.

      1
      Reply
      • dave frost nhlpa

        3 years ago

        What do you think it would cost? Cheap pitching and prospects.
        I would move Garcia & Volpe for Castillo.

        Reply
    • Yankee Clipper

      3 years ago

      Out of the three, Tyler Mahle would be my choice. Sounds stupid, but Castillo simply is not worth what they want. They’re making the mistake of overvaluing the market for him imho. They could and should get a decent return, but he is not an ace. Paying a “king’s random” for a solid 3, possibly 2 SP isn’t worth it for how it would affect the farm system.

      3
      Reply
      • Bud Selig Fan

        3 years ago

        Castillo is a #1 starter no question, and as such, with 2 full years of control, will cost more than Berrios did last trade deadline. If no one meets Krall’s asking price, he’ll just hold till the trade-deadline.

        Reply
        • pogo

          3 years ago

          No question? He’s wild. His stuff is nasty. Like a right handed Johnathon Sanchez. When he’s on He’s got no hit stuff. When he’s off he walks 5 and is out by third inning.

          Reply
        • Ma4170

          3 years ago

          He’s not an ace on a good team

          Reply
      • jbryant0693

        3 years ago

        Castillo since June ’21, 9th overall in MLB in xFIP.. Since 2019, 7th in xFIP and 9th in fWAR. He is an ace, factually speaking.

        1
        Reply
        • Ma4170

          3 years ago

          fWAR is not a good stat to use for pitching value and xFIP isn’t that reliable either… he’s a very good sp, he’s not an ace and has bad periods of inconsistency…. he’s a number 2

          1
          Reply
        • jbryant0693

          3 years ago

          @Ma4170 Can you explain why those widely referenced advanced stats are not reliable? Do you even know what they are? Would you prefer non-advanced stats like ERA? How about SIERA?

          Reply
        • Ma4170

          3 years ago

          You have no idea how they’re being evaluated, and it’s def not by cherry picking a couple of favorable stats for a guy you like… FIP is limited because it will overvalue pitchers w high K rates and low HR rates… a lot more goes into overall valuation… the only ones referencing the flawed WAR stat for pitchers are their agents… run prevention and base runners will always be how pitchers are primarily assessed and for good reason… a 1.25 whip last three years is not ace level… his era of 3.61 in that time is not ace level… his walk rate of 3.5+ per 9 is definitely not ace level… his K/BB rate of 2.85 in that time is far from ace… he’s a top 20-30 sp, not an ace… if you expand your parameters to 300Ip over last three years you’ll see some of the truer aces push him down the list anyway… is he degrom scherzer or Cole level? Is he buehler or Bieber level? He’s not… he’s not even wheeler level… he can be at times but his BB rates will keep him from being that consistently

          Reply
      • Joeyjoejoe

        3 years ago

        Castillo has pitched like an ace more often than not in his time outside of a bad start to the year. Don’t forget that he’s got 2 years of control at a very affordable rate. It’s not like picking up an ace that you’re paying $20-$25M

        Reply
        • Ma4170

          3 years ago

          It was two horrendous months

          1
          Reply
        • bucsfan0004

          3 years ago

          After his start in Colorado, he was statistically the worst pitcher in baseball. He really turned it around the last 3-4 months of the season.

          Reply
  3. fathead0507

    3 years ago

    Rangers.. all in

    2
    Reply
  4. nk

    3 years ago

    Wonder if the Mets are looking at Gray as a middle of rotation guy. If they sign Scherzer with degrom, Taiwan Walker and Gray would be a nice top 4.

    1
    Reply
    • Lars MacDonald

      3 years ago

      I’d be a little leery of bringing Sonny Gray back to NYC. Maybe it was just a bad fit with the Yankees’ pitching coach and/or philosophy, but the pressure of pitching in the big city isn’t for everyone.

      2
      Reply
      • solaris602

        3 years ago

        Yep, just ask Randy Johnson

        Reply
  5. For Love of the Game

    3 years ago

    Reds holding a yard sale. Rebuild, go cheap and dump Iglesias to save on salary, then put a for-sale-make-offer tag on everyone. Very hard on the fans.

    4
    Reply
    • MartialArtisan

      3 years ago

      Hopefully the new CBA will limit team’s incentive to operate that way, but I’m not holding my breath.

      Reply
    • Yankee Clipper

      3 years ago

      Exactly! This, much more than high spending, should be what’s addressed, as it adversely affects the sport, the fans, and the players.

      Reply
  6. Steve7seven

    3 years ago

    Bosox might take a look in typical chaim bloom fashion. Poke and poke then just pick someone recently dfa’d. Mathew Boyd anyone?

    1
    Reply
  7. mp9

    3 years ago

    Sonny would be a great addition to Twins
    Get it done Falveyy!!!

    2
    Reply
    • letmeclearmythroat74

      3 years ago

      Sonny is very inconsistent… not sure “ great addition” and “Sonny” can be used in the same sentence. One day he is an ace , 5 days later he can’t get out of the 2nd inning. I for one don’t care if he goes. I would want to keep Mahle, Castillo, Gray … in that order

      2
      Reply
      • Sky14

        3 years ago

        The Twins cupboard is bare for starting pitching right now so inconsistent would be a massive upgrade.

        1
        Reply
  8. Joe It All

    3 years ago

    I’m a diehard Reds fan and it’s not the complete doom and gloom of being a fan of them that others make it out to be. Hunter Greene and Nick Lodolo both have future ace stuff and should be joining the big leagues this year so I’m fine with the Reds listening on what Castillo, Gray and Major would bring back in a trade package. They’re not going to give Castillo away. It will take a King’s ransom and a trade package that prospect hounds of other teams will hate because it’s going to hurt. They’re only going to deal Castillo if they get a better package than what the Twins got for Berrios. I’ve seen too many suggestions on here that a team will get him in a salary dump attached to Moustakas. That’s never going to happen so it’s a waste of time to even propose it. The Reds have screwed up a lot of transactions but Castillo is not going to be one of those blunders.!

    Reply
    • LarsAnderson

      3 years ago

      Joe, if nothing else you have a positive attitude and terrific eyebrows. Hopefully you are correct regarding the Reds and Castillo.

      3
      Reply
    • Joe It All

      3 years ago

      Mahle*

      Reply
    • JoeBrady

      3 years ago

      it’s not the complete doom and gloom
      =====================================
      I agree 100%. It’s just that they’ve screwed up the rebuild every chance they got. I won’t get into the Gray/Downs for Puig trade.

      But they should’ve seen the writing on the wall last off-season. They were decent, but once they jettisoned Castillo and Bradley, at best, they were vying for a WC.

      Had they traded Gray, Castillo, and Suarez, they’d have gotten a huge haul, and would still most of their core team for a long window of contention, starting as soon as 2023. Stephenson, India, Senzel, Winker, and maybe Barrero, plus Greene & Lodolo coming up, is a really good core. IMHO, they should’ve sold off for 1/2 years, and then gone all in.

      It works out the same in the long-run, but it feels like they are choosing a steady stream of .525 instead of choosing a couple of .450 teams, followed by 5-6 years of 90+ wins.

      Reply
  9. Baseball dude

    3 years ago

    Trader jerry hasn’t done much. Mariners may be in play here.

    1
    Reply
  10. Mystery Team

    3 years ago

    I don’t get the Reds they were so close to being a legit contender. Trading young controllable pitching for prospects seems stupid to me at this point. They’re where teams like to be before they make the right additions to make a run. Who in their right mind tears it down at this juncture?

    3
    Reply
    • paindonthurt

      3 years ago

      Ask the Marlins.

      Reply
    • Joeyjoejoe

      3 years ago

      I don’t get the concept of “still trying to contend” while trading their whole rotation. If you’re going to dump everyone, just do it. A rebuild is fine and expected even for a small market but I don’t think fans trust this front office to be the one to manage it. If they had done a better job the last time we wouldn’t see a second rebuild so fast.

      Reply
  11. warnbeeb

    3 years ago

    The Tigers have a ton of prospects.

    1
    Reply
  12. losrojos

    3 years ago

    Krall will give them all up for low level prospects and then claim it was the best they could do. He’s a clown being controlled by bigger clowns.

    3
    Reply
  13. bravesfan

    3 years ago

    Really no reason to wave the white flag if your the reds. I get the frustration but that’s still a solid team… add piece, don’t rebuild

    Reply
  14. A Blue Jay from Cuba

    3 years ago

    Jays please trade for Castillo and our rotation will be one of the best in baseball

    Reply
    • jdgoat

      3 years ago

      I’d probably prefer Gray assuming the package will be quite a bit less. While Castillo would put their rotation over the top, it might not be necessary if it means having to part with Moreno or Pearson (or one of Gurriel or Teoscar).

      Reply
      • TalkSomeSense

        3 years ago

        JD
        I agree, Gray as our #5 would be a good look. Mgmt need to thread the needle now and balance a long window against maxing a deep playoff run .

        There is so many variables to winning a WS that pushing all in for 1-2 shots would not be wise.

        Reply
      • Dustyslambchops23

        3 years ago

        Problem is gurriel or teo won’t be attractive to the reds.

        So it will be more like Pearson, Biggio and Groshans. Which yeah will be tough but I’d do it

        Reply
  15. cguy

    3 years ago

    Sonny Gray trade would be an opportunity for Reds to improve their already deep minor league system & save about $11-12MM in a season that so far has no CBA. To acquire Mahle or Castillo, a team will have to overpay. For starting pitching, it has become a sellers market.

    Reply
  16. JohnJasoJingleHeimerSchmidt

    3 years ago

    Gray to the Giants seems like a strong possibility. He was very comfortable, and very good with Curt Casali, and the Giants need front-line rotation guys.

    1
    Reply
  17. msqboxer

    3 years ago

    It’s the perfect time to rebuild. Teams missing out on top starting pitching FA pitching will pay a premium. This team should build around India. Greene and Mahle and call Seattle and build some deals around Hancock or Kirby + prospects or Texas Jung + prospects or CWS since they have some guys blocked on the MLB roster like Adolfo, Cespedes, Burger etc.

    Reply
    • Poundsy24

      3 years ago

      Unfortunately, Seattle already said they aren’t moving any of their top prospects. I think they should and do it for a guy like Castillo. I think the only way Seattle budges is if the Reds include both Gray and Castillo and SEA should be willing to move any prospect for two proven MLB all-star caliber arms

      Reply
    • Poundsy24

      3 years ago

      And I also think that at the going rate for prospects that no team is willing to part with a high-end prospect that they think could have all-star value. You just don’t see top-100 prospects, let alone multiple, moved all too often unless it’s Dave Dombrowski falling the shots.

      Reply
    • kwolf68

      3 years ago

      I can’t speak for Texas, but I think Jung is off-limits. Rumors of moving IKF seem to indicate Jung may actually be in their plans to start opening day. This kid is a PURE HITTER and the power is now there. Jung is their cornerstone 3B for the next 5-10 years I think.

      Reply
    • AllinTX

      3 years ago

      Jung, Leiter aren’t going anywhere. Unless it’s for someone like Trevor Rogers.

      Reply
  18. msqboxer

    3 years ago

    Well Seattle isn’t getting Castillo or Gray without a top prospect, someone on their 40 man roster and a projectable future prospect.

    Reply
  19. Poundsy24

    3 years ago

    I think the Red Sox could offer and interesting package if they’re willing to shed some prospects.

    I think for pitchers Groome, Bello, Mata, Song there’s upside potential of mid-rotation starters and obviously years of control. I think for position players Mayer, Casas, and Yorke are the only untouchables but all else should be available

    Maybe an interesting package:

    Reds receive:
    Houck, Durran, Dalbec

    Red Sox receive:
    Castillo

    Reply
    • JoeBrady

      3 years ago

      I wouldn’t give up Houck straight up for Castillo. Houck is certainly a gamble, and Castillo certainly better, but according to B-R, Houck has 6 control years left. Even accounting for a bit of reversion, 6 years of 2.5 WAR by Houck is worth more than two years of 4 WAR by Castillo.

      I’d certainly do Duran, and I would certainly do Downs.

      Reply
      • hiflew

        3 years ago

        That is faulty math. 2 years of 4 WAR is worth far more than 6 years of 2.5 WAR when you account for the 4 years of the player replacing the first pitcher on the roster. This is always what fail to take into account. They aren’t just going to leave the roster spot empty after 2 years. You can always find a 2.5 WAR guy (or since it is Boston probably even higher) on the open market after those 2 years and then the 2,5 WAR guy is barely missed.

        2
        Reply
    • dsett75

      3 years ago

      That’s way too much for Castillo, imho. Granted, he pitched in what may be the best park for hitters in the entire league and has been extremely durable, but I’d really have to talk myself into just Houck alone, lol. Let alone saying yes to all 3 of em for Castillo. Imho, they would have to throw in someone with a big contract, like, Suarez or Moustakas, for example, and Cincy pay most of it. Even then, I’m not sure that I’d give up all 3 of em.

      Reply
  20. msqboxer

    3 years ago

    I don’t think the Red Sox give up 3 MLB ready players for a #3 type starter. Maybe two of the above and a A ball prospect.

    Reply
    • jbryant0693

      3 years ago

      #3? pfft. Castillo is an ace. SInce 2019, 7th in xFIP and 9th in fWAR among MLB starters. Since June ’21, 9th in xFIP.

      4
      Reply
      • msqboxer

        3 years ago

        Ace on the Reds staff maybe….on the Red Sox a #3 after Sale and Eovaldi. He has a better chance of becoming the next Carlos Martinez than a #1.

        1
        Reply
        • JoeBrady

          3 years ago

          Rankings usually only work on a league-wide scale. You could be the #2 on Baltimore, but that doesn’t make you a #2 pitcher. Castillo, imo, is easily a good #2.

          Reply
        • Joe It All

          3 years ago

          What are you smoking? Castillo is an ace on the Red Sox whether you want to believe it or not. There isn’t one team in MLB that would slot Eovaldi in front of Luis Castillo in their rotation and after Sale being injured most of last year, most would put Castillo as the #1 and Sale as the #2 at the present moment. He is more like a young Pedro Martinez than he is a Carlos Martinez. Watch him pitch and the way he attacks hitters and you will be reminded of Pedro.

          5
          Reply
        • jbryant0693

          3 years ago

          @msqboxer – Except he’s already a #1 but only those who are stat literate would know that.

          1
          Reply
        • muskie73

          3 years ago

          Since the start of the 2019 season Luis Castillo has posted 10.4 fWAR in 77 starts while Nathan Eovaldi has posted 6.2 fWAR in 64 appearances (including 53 starts) and Chris Sale has posted 4.4 fWAR in 34 starts.

          Reply
      • hiflew

        3 years ago

        He’s not an ace. He is the next Javier Vazquez or Jose Quintana or Chris Archer. A guy that looks good on paper, but can’t ever get real results on the field.

        Reply
        • jbryant0693

          3 years ago

          @ hiflew – Here, I’ll put it on paper for you:

          Since 2019, 7th in xFIP and 9th in fWAR among MLB starters.

          That’s 3 years. Now we can both agree his results are on paper and he’s an aca, factually speaking.

          4
          Reply
        • hiflew

          3 years ago

          Try to read and understand

          A guy that looks good on paper, but can’t ever get real results on the field.

          Your argument just backed mine up. Yes he looks good on paper, but the results aren’t there.

          Why do I even bother? Nobody really cares anyway.

          Reply
        • jbryant0693

          3 years ago

          @hiflew, Stats are results. Try xFIP, fWAR, SIERRA. Educate yourself.

          Reply
        • hiflew

          3 years ago

          I have nothing else to say to you. We are not going to agree on this no matter how much alphabet soup you throw at me. Although I will put my Master’s degree up against any education you have.

          Reply
    • 30 Parks

      3 years ago

      Eovaldi is overrated.

      Reply
    • Poundsy24

      3 years ago

      Castillo has been durable and effective despite pitching in a hitter friendly environment.

      It takes something to get something. I honestly think teams could offer more for him from a prospect perspective but the Red Sox can offer Houck and Dalbec who have a good amount of MLB experience. Houck has had success and Dalbec comes with questions, hence why including Duran becomes part of the equation.

      This would also free up a spot at 1B and I can think of a couple 1B on the market that would be great for Boston.

      Win for Boston getting a top-end arm who has been durable without sacrificing too much MLB and prospect depth and the ability to sign Rizzo (who they’ve previously had interest in) or Freeman (would be a dream).

      Win for the Reds who get two controllable MLB players who have shown success and a top-100 prospect that is nearly MLB ready.

      Reply
  21. HalosHeavenJJ

    3 years ago

    I’d love Castillo but considering the acquisition cost and our thin prospect position, Gray makes the most sense.

    Thor, Ohtani, Gray, Sandoval, Suarez with Lorenzen and Barria battling for the last spot would be a massive improvement and likely not kill our farm.

    3
    Reply
    • DC13

      3 years ago

      Unless you take on one of their albatross contracts, Castillo is probably too costly from a top end prospect perspective for the Angels.

      Getting Gray would be a plus. Look at the high end trade market at the deadline assuming their in the mix.

      Good off season so far.

      Reply
  22. Vizionaire

    3 years ago

    don’t forget detmers.

    Reply
  23. WHeitzman

    3 years ago

    Reds also listening to offers Ken Griffey Jr

    1
    Reply
  24. Christopher Wilson 2

    3 years ago

    I’ve always felt like Gray to the Phillies ever since Cotham was hired really made a lot of sense. I sure hope they don’t feel stable enough in the rotation that they don’t add to it… Altho I’ve seen that written recently.

    Reply
  25. Redleg Roy

    3 years ago

    Given the choice, I’d rather trade Castillo. He is the biggest name, and going to get the biggest return, while simultaneously not being really demonstrably better than Gray or Mahle.. Of course this decision would have been much easier if they’d just paid Wade Miley.

    Reply
  26. redsorbust

    3 years ago

    Hi all. Teams that are a player or two away from playoffs and WS contending need to overpay for premium players at premium positions. It depends on what a teams real desire is. Glory now or possible glory later. So anytime a GM or fan posting that they would not trade any of their top talent then they do so at their own risk. Perhaps another team in their division says yes to overpaying and wins the division. I wonder if that happens the GM or fan would have wished they had made the trade?

    Reply
  27. b00giem@n

    3 years ago

    If you’re going to do this then you need to let Votto go elsewhere too. I am a Reds fan and there were times I felt bad for the dude. If you’re going to start another rebuild around our young guys, give him an option to try and win something.

    Reply
    • WHeitzman

      3 years ago

      Does Votto actually want to go anywhere? With a full no trade clause he will only go where he wants. Additionally no one is taking on that full contract so either the Reds pay a big portion of it or send prospects along with Votto. That contract is really just a sunk cost at this point, not that he didn’t earn it, be it he isn’t going to provide $25 million of production

      Reply
      • b00giem@n

        3 years ago

        You have a very valid point, I’m only speculating however and if he wants to stay and retire a Red, I’d say he’s earned this right just as much as if he wanted to try and win a series.

        Reply
  28. Tiger22matt

    3 years ago

    Saying a player is a #3 or 4 so you can get them cheaper doesn’t make it true. If a team wants Castillo it’s going to take some top prospects.The Reds are not swinging another Aroldis Chapman deal where they get garbage back.

    Reply
  29. Johhn

    3 years ago

    So far reading I am understanding more and more. They should have picked up the miley contract, but he is getting older and I get the risk, but they really should of took the contract and traded or keep him. You got many options, but clearly castillo is a top 10 Mlb starter the last 3 years based off comments. Gray is solid veteran guy who would fit any club looking for depth. Solid. Mahle is a beast on the road and is constantly improving. The Reds seem to rebuilding/ half contending which isn’t terrible, but they should have figured this out earlier before the Downs/gray crap. could you imagine Lodolo, Greene, Gray as are future starters sheeesh. Unproven indeed. Anyways you got 3 guys obviosly value is castillo, mahle, gray in order. I say you don’t trade any unless you get top tier stuff which they seem to be doing. Many people make it sound like the depth is clearly very high. Lodolo, greene, vladdy, reiver, Obrien, Santilla, all looking for jobs, As a deep reds fan I don’t see any trade happening, unless the deal is just amazing, but trading gray would be nice for the payroll and you could have greene, lodolo or reiver take his place. Then I would use ALL the money on nick castallanos. I am hearing reports that Nick wants a 7-8 contract and I really don’t seeing it worth it unless its a 20-25 mil a year type of deal, but I think its a no brainer they have a talented young core, but the problem is if you trade your 3 dragon you kinow by the time your in contention again, votto, will be retired.

    Also I would like to note, If they rebuild I think it would be awsome if they traded Votto to the bluejays, but also WHAT ABOUT THE ANGELS, I mean like imagine Trout and Votto finally getting a ring they deserve. You know while we are at it, why not just full send and completely reubuild. Angels trade us your entire farm system. We will give you Votto, winker, castillo, mahle.
    (I am obviously kidding, but I really want votto to winna ring and IN cincinnati preferable).

    Reply
  30. angt222

    3 years ago

    I have to say, good for the Rangers to try and hit the ground running for 2022. Matt Olson is also on their radar.

    Reply
    • AllinTX

      3 years ago

      Nathaniel is reliable enough and has potential to be better.

      Reply
  31. slslinde

    3 years ago

    Mn Twins need to trade for SP Castillo

    Reply
  32. cguy

    3 years ago

    This story has become baseball equivalent of crying wolf. Is it news that the Reds entertain offers on their 3 “front of the rotation” SP? It would be news if they wouldn’t talk trade.

    Reply
  33. rangers13

    3 years ago

    Castillo would be a very nice pick-up, but prospect capital would be high. Rather trade Solak and DJ Peters for Gray. The remaining money left on his contract is comparable to the 3/30 ones Texas is fond of handing out for vets and having Gray on the team would be great in Spring training for younger Vandy alum pitchers Venasco and Leiter.

    Reply
    • LordD99

      3 years ago

      The Reds can get a good return for Gray, who remains a 3-4 WAR pitcher. Solak and Peters doesn’t get a returned phone call.

      Reply
      • rangers13

        3 years ago

        With recent additions of Seimien and Seager TX could probably add Duran or Smith and perhaps Otto.

        Reply
    • AllinTX

      3 years ago

      That’s a laughable offer and I’m a Rangers’ fan.

      1
      Reply
  34. MLB Top 100 Commenter

    3 years ago

    I still think Reds should keep Castillo unless it allows them to get rid of the Suarez or Moose contract in the deal. Package Castillo with Suarez, and Gray or Mahle with Moose, and the only big contract would be Votto who (to my shock) was back last year. But if the Suarez and Moose contracts cannot be shed, then I see Castillo and Mahle staying, and just Sonny Gray going to Angels, Dodgers or Mets for a top 20 to 30 prospect.

    Reply
    • Armaments216

      3 years ago

      If they can dump the Moustakas contract and spend that savings to address other holes in their roster, sure. But Reds fans should be pissed off if they lose Castillo only to cut payroll.

      Reply
  35. ShawnM 2

    3 years ago

    I have no problem with the Reds trading anyone with value if we ain’t going to try to win. It would be dumb to add bad contracts to any trade made. We need to improve the roster. If we trade our best players, we ain’t going to win anyway. Just eat the money.

    Reply
  36. anotherdamncardinalfan

    3 years ago

    TANK, TANK, TANK….I’m a Cardinal fan and I hate to see them with a fire sale…and with the Commish wanting to expand the playoffs to 14 (insane) teams.

    Reply
  37. tonyinsingapore

    3 years ago

    Castellini owns 15% of the team. There’s a Blackstone billionaire, among others that have bought in. And the ROI for ownership is in the equity, not the year-on-year P/L.

    Though MLB has designated Castellini as lead-owner it is the entire group that should make a financial commitment to fielding a competitive team. Similar situations for other teams as well. I’m not sure why there’s not more written about this…

    Reply
  38. dsett75

    3 years ago

    It’s a tough situation with Castillo in particular, imho. On one hand, I understand why Cincy would want a lot for him. He’s controllable, extremely durable and pitched in a park with an extreme advantage for hitters. However, on the other hand, I wouldn’t wanna give up the entire farm for a guy that’s inconsistent. Also, if they get a new CBA & they expand the playoffs to 14 teams, that may persuade the Reds to go for it and keep everyone basically. After all, I feel like they’re only a few players away from contending if they keep everyone. That’s a big if though! For them & for Oakland, who’s basically in the same situation with Manaea, Montas, Bassitt, Olson, Laureano and Chapman.

    Reply
  39. Kcole820

    3 years ago

    I doubt any of them will be traded right now, unless the Reds don’t care what kind of return they get. If they want to win a trade then they need to do what they’re good at dealing away someone like Aquino, or Senzel.

    Reply
  40. Mikel Grady

    3 years ago

    Instant starting rotation for Cubs

    Reply
  41. kingsfan1968

    3 years ago

    Any one of them to the Angels!

    Reply
  42. redsorbust

    3 years ago

    Angels and Texas should be the main two teams going at it for Castillo services in that order, IMO.
    Angels are too close to making the playoffs and beyond right now. Plus there is the Trout and Ohtani factors to consider. What is the point having two blue chip players like that on your team and not making the playoffs or going all in to get there? Trout is already getting injured and been on the team for a decade! How long can they they keep sending Othani out to hit and pitch before a serious injury happens.
    Seattle and Texas going big just made big additions to their rosters. Texas seems to be checking in on Reds starters and they have the prospects to get it done.
    Angels need to give up their top prospect plus a serious sweetener at the least IMO.
    Many teams could really use a Castillo but can’t think of a team that needs one as much as Angeles at this time.

    Reply
  43. bigredsfan41017

    3 years ago

    Castellini just needs to just sell the Reds if he isn’t going to invest in the team. He’s the one that have Votto the ridiculous contract that bind the team revenue up. I’m sick of him for the past 4 darn years building the team up, then down, then up and now down. He brings in the worst GMs, we need an experienced well known GM, but the problem there he doesn’t want to spend the money. If he trades out top pitchers fabs should boycott the Refs if they even play next season due to the lockout but this is pathetic!

    Reply
    • jbryant0693

      3 years ago

      In the first sentence, you criticize the owner for NOT investing in the club, and in the second sentence you criticize him for investing in the club via the Votto contract which happens to be the best oontract in club history, producing close to 30 fWAR and 3 top 7 MVP finishes in 8 seasons.

      I think you should win some sort of award for consecutive, most contradicting statements.

      Reply

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