The Twins have contacted the Royals this offseason about the possibility of acquiring center fielder Michael A. Taylor, reports Dan Hayes of the Athletic. However, Hayes adds that Minnesota was “discouraged” by Kansas City’s ask for right-hander Josh Winder in return. There’s no indication conversations between the clubs are still ongoing.
The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal reported last month that Kansas City was making Taylor available in trade. Minnesota is the first known team to have checked in with Royals GM J.J. Picollo and his staff regarding the defense-first outfielder. Even if talks didn’t advance especially far, Kansas City’s ask for Winder suggests they’re at least opening conversations regarding Taylor with a lofty goal. That might be especially true for an intra-divisional opponent like the Twins.
Winder, 26, is one of the more highly-regarded pitchers in the Minnesota organization. While he entered pro ball with little fanfare as a 7th-round pick out of VMI, he put himself firmly on the radar coming out of the canceled 2020 minor league season. Winder pushed his average fastball velocity up a few ticks into the mid-90s over the lost year and excelled over 10 starts at Double-A Wichita to start the 2021 campaign. He struggled in a four-start look with Triple-A St. Paul to end that season but nevertheless entered 2022 as one of the better prospects in the Twins’ system.
Baseball America slotted the 6’5″ hurler sixth in the Minnesota system heading into last season, calling him a potential mid-rotation starter. Winder broke camp with the MLB club and made his first 15 big league appearances. He made 11 starts and came out of the bullpen four times, working to a 4.70 ERA through 67 innings. His 16.4% strikeout rate and 35% grounder percentage were each markedly below average, though he continued his career-long track record of pounding the strike zone.
While it wasn’t a resoundingly successful debut effort, Winder showed enough promise to believe he could still play a long-term rotation role in the Twin Cities. He mixed four pitches with regularity, led by a 94 MPH fastball and mid-80s slider. Winder has long had above-average or better control and held his own against left-handed batters last season. Even if he never misses enough bats to reach the mid-rotation upside some prospect evaluators had forecasted, he’s an upper-level depth arm who could carve out a back-of-the-rotation spot as soon as this year.
Minnesota optioned Winder on a couple occasions last year. That exhausted his first of three option years but also means he fell shy of accruing a full year of service time. He’s controllable for at least another six seasons and additional assignments back to St. Paul could push his free agent trajectory back further. He won’t qualify for arbitration until after the 2024 season at the earliest.
It’s not surprising the Twins wouldn’t relinquish six-plus years of Winder’s services for Taylor, who is only under contract for the 2023 campaign. Minnesota could see each of Sonny Gray, Tyler Mahle and Kenta Maeda depart via free agency next offseason. That’d leave them with Joe Ryan, Bailey Ober, Chris Paddack and unproven younger arms like Winder, Simeon Woods Richardson and Louie Varland to vie for rotation spots as things stand. The long-term uncertainty has led the Twins to entertain trade possibilities with the Marlins about potentially adding a controllable starter like Pablo López to the mix.
While one season of Taylor’s services isn’t likely to bring back Winder, he should have a decent amount of appeal on the trade market. The veteran outfielder has had a productive two-year run in K.C. after spending the bulk of his career with the Nationals. Taylor has long been a below-average offensive player thanks to swing-and-miss concerns, but he’s one of the sport’s preeminent outfield defenders.
The 31-year-old (32 in March) has played upwards of 1000 innings in center field in each of the last two years. He’s been a stellar fit for spacious Kauffman Stadium, with Defensive Runs Saved estimating he’s been 19 runs better than an average center fielder in both seasons. His cumulative +38 DRS is head and shoulders above the rest of the league at the position, with Myles Straw checking in second at +21 runs. Statcast has been a little more conservative but still pegged Taylor as +19 runs over the past two seasons, tied with Harrison Bader for second behind Straw.
While whether Taylor’s truly the league’s best defensive outfielder or “merely” in the top handful is debatable, it’s clear he’s an elite gloveman. That drives his value, as he carries a modest .249/.304/.357 line in just under 1000 plate appearances as a Royal. To his credit, Taylor has tamped down on the massive strikeout rates of his time in Washington, with last season’s 23.9% strikeout percentage only a couple points worse than the league average. He’s had to sacrifice some hard contact to put the ball in play more frequently, posting the two lowest isolated power marks of his career the last couple seasons.
Even as a bottom-of-the-lineup type, Taylor’s a valuable player. He’s also making just $4.5MM in 2023, meaning he should be able to fit on virtually any club’s payroll ledger. Minnesota eyed him as a fourth outfielder as potential injury insurance behind Byron Buxton and a right-handed bat to integrate into an outfield that skews very left-handed. Yet he could appeal to other clubs as more of an everyday center field option, particularly given the market scarcity at the position. The free agent center field market is barren enough the Red Sox agreed to terms with Adam Duvall — who’s 34 and has been mostly a corner player throughout his career — to play up the middle. Trade possibilities are similarly sparse, particularly since the Pirates have remained firm on their ask for Bryan Reynolds.
That all makes Taylor a potentially interesting trade candidate. The Royals’ discussions with the Twins suggest they’re not prepared to move him without getting a strong return. That seems unlikely to come from Minnesota, though teams like the Marlins, Dodgers, Rangers and Rockies could check in as they continue to seek out help at the position.
The Royals never sought Samuel, he just appeared.
So, I’m guessing bringing in Taylor frees them to use Kepler in a Lopez package.
Kepler would have to be a secondary piece in a Lopez deal. He had a fluky year in 2019 in the year of jacked-up ball. A 95 OPS+ hitter won’t land a quality starter in today’s game.
Yeah, that’s I said they would “use him” in a package and not “headline” a package.
Fair enough, Wagner!
Bringing in Gallo allowed for that. Not really sure why the Twins are seeking a CF unless its to move Buxton at a corner or more frequently as a DH
Are the Twins tiring of Buxton?
Not because of his talent and attitude (very talented and seems to be a big personality)
However, he can’t stay healthy!!!
Why don’t the Twins kick the tires on Cedric Mullins from the O’s
I would take Buxton in return (yes, there will be other pieces), but the Twins need consistency to win the AL Central and an always healthy Mullins could help
They knew he was injury-prone and unlikely to play many (if any) full seasons when they extended him. Going after a quality defensive RHH backup to complement their slate of LHH outfielders doesn’t have anything to do with their feelings toward Buxton. Maybe with their feelings toward Gilberto Celestino, who’s currently slated for that role, though.
Buxton has a full no-trade clause, and the Twins have zero want to trade him anyhow.
@Steve
Okay, thank you.
Buxton has a full no-trade clause, and the Twins have zero want to trade him anyhow.
The above answers many questions
I would add that there has been little indication that the O’s want to trade Mullins anyway.
@The Coop
Well, there has been very little indication of anything in Charm City
Not that WAR is the end all be all but let’s compare Buxton and Mullins from last year real quick
Buxton, 4.0 WAR, 92 games
Mullins, 3.8 WAR, 156 games
Mullins may stay health you but he’s not in Buxtons class
I mean, I’m a Royals fan so I’m probably biased here, but it seems fair. He’s 26, and seems pretty much just an average prospect for an average mlb player. Not a crazy ask by any means.
As was stated in the article, the amount of player control makes it unfair. Taylor for a year vs Winder for 6 years doesn’t match up.
Control value is relatively valuable to the talent. 6 years is a lot but for a mid rotation ceiling for one of, if not the best, defensive CF in the league for 1 year still doesn’t feel outlandish. Maybe a bit steep but I’d have probably taken that deal if I were the Twins
He can’t hit! This trade is insane. I hope the Twins just hung up. Mid-rotation pitching for 6 years is one of the most valuable commodities out there. Taylor is a borderline starter with that bat.
That, and pitching is an area of need for the twins, they shouldn’t be parting with big league arms
If he is 26 and not in the big leagues yet, I would say he has moved from prospect to suspect.
Read the article or look at his stats page. HE’S ALREADY PITCHED IN THE BIG LEAGUES
Has he stayed?
Any minor league player has six years of potential control. Does that mean they don’t want to trade a minor leaguer for him? What if the ceiling is back end rotation instead of mid rotation? (Is that really much of a distinction when talking ceilings?)
Why would we need another outfielder and why would Josh Winder be too high a price? Asking both rhetorically and genuinely
All of the minor league depth at OF is pretty much left-handed (Kirilloff, Wallner, Larnach). Most of the non-roster invite OFers are right-handed. They’re looking for right-handed OF depth.
Read the post.
@25strikes – Technically speaking, you cannot have it both ways. ; )
Twins want to pay a price for Taylor that reflects how they see him and want to use him, as a reserve defensive specialist CF / Buxton insurance. Royals want to sell Taylor for how they see him – one of the best defenders in the game who can at times add some offensive value.
Winder doesn’t seem like much to me, however it appears that both the Twinkies and Royals see things differently, as KC wants him and the Twins don’t want to give him up.
I think it’s a reasonable ask for KC, though I understand why the Twins are reluctant to part with the six years controls of Winder. Maybe the Royals could throw in a lower level pitching prospect?
Six years of control over any player of reasonable potential in exchange for a single season of a veteran is rather expensive. I could see it if a prospect had a handful of years of control but had exhausted his options as a more balanced deal. Multiple options remaining combined with more than just a couple years of team control is quite an ask by KC.
I mean I guess he’s a backup for Buxton but if Buxton is healthy he brings no real value because he’s a defensive first center fielder. Playing him in the corners ruins his value.
Yeah of all teams, I’m pretty sure the Twins would be one of the last I’d guess would be interested in MAT. Unless they know something about Buxton we don’t.
If the Twins are really high on Winder then I get that they wouldn’t want to move him, especially given the control he still has. But a 26 year old starter who hasn’t established himself yet for a year of a 3+ win player really doesn’t seem like an absurd request to me.
I agree, Michael. Neither an absurd request by KC nor a slam dunk of a trade from Minnesota’s perspective.
LOLING @ THE ROYALS TRYING TO BE SLICK….
Extreme overvaluation of Taylor by the Royals. No harm in asking though, but Taylor is a defensive specialist who pushed the boundaries of his offense last year. He’s a 4th OFer on a contending team. He only starts because he’s in KC.
What would Winder be on a contending team? Long relief? Emergency starter? Seems pretty fair ask to me.
6th starter this year but solid chance he grows into a #4 starter. If not, his stuff should make him a decent bullpen weapon. You don’t trade 6 years of a pitcher for 1 year of a 4th OF.
Nonsense unless some team has been asking about Buxton, who doesn’t come across as being bright.
I thought this sentence in the article was Hysterical: “Kansas City’s ask for Winder suggests they’re at least opening conversations regarding Taylor with a lofty goal.”
Let me get this straight, KC’s asking was “lofty” (still laughing over that word choice) for a pitcher:
— who still hasn’t established himself in the majors in his mid-20s
— who looks like he may never be better than a 5th or 6th or 7th starter
— whose peripherals were substantially below league average last year.
Sorry, asking for a decidedly mediocre-to-bad pitcher in return for an established great fielding CFer with a mediocre bat seems quite reasonable to me, even considering their service time differences.
Btw, to those who said they don’t understand why the Twins would want another CF, given that they have Buxton, the answer is quite obvious, really: look at Buxton’s injury history. Will he ever play a complete season going forward? He’s played 100+ games ONCE in his career & that was 6 Years Ago.
Btw, I’m not a KC or Twins fan, and I don’t hate either team, so my opinions aren’t colored by loyalty to either side on this issue. (If you can’t figure out who my team is from my screen moniker, who’re not much of a baseball fan. 😉
Why isn’t it at least reasonable to think the price is lofty? Taylor’s a rental who is probably a 4th outfielder on a contender and MIN isn’t exactly in a grave position of need in the outfield.
Mediocre bat? He’s a career 81 OPS+ The four prior years, its 69, 73, 79 and 77. That’s not mediocre. That’s BAD. That’s below the league average for catchers. He’s 32. There is little upside. He just had his career year that is highly unlikely to be repeated. He’s a player that good teams store on the bench to come in to play defense in the 9th of close games. He has a year of control, so he won’t land the Royals much, although I do understand why they’d want to move him now. See what they can get.
Mantle, it’s all about years of control with most front offices these days. The player doesn’t even have to be especially good. If he has a pulse and years of control he has value.
Yes, you’re right, but I think that philosophy is shortsighted.
At the MLB level, the primary thought should be who can help us Win the most games, not what mediocre player can we keep for the longest.
Also, in answer to DarkSide830 & RobM, a Standout Defensive CFer who hits at Taylor’s level is a mediocre hitter. Yes, he’d be bad if he was just a good CFer, but he’s exceptional on defense & more & more teams are recognizing the value in that at premium defensive positions.
Moreover, the Twins would have to be Delusional to think it’s a sure thing that they’ll get 140+ games out of Buxton.
My guess is, given Buxton’s historic injury problems, including last year, they want to split time for him between CF & DH to keep him healthy & in the lineup, a situation similar to the one the Yankees face with Stanton.
So, wanting Taylor on the team as a 3.5 starter (let’s call it) is a reasonable desire. His bat isn’t a complete disaster — unlike Hicks on the Yankees — so there’s value in his hitting ONLY because his defense is exceptional.
If you’re a Twins fan, I certainly can empathize with your desire to have a better bat in the lineup than Taylor, but great teams are very often comprised of important role players.
I saw Winder pitch several times last year. The Twins should jump at this deal.
Trade seems even to me considering the twins were playing guys like Jake cave I. The outfield. Yes I am a royals fan but still
This asking price is probably why they went out and got Gallo. He can cover CF capably while Buxton is DHing or injured
Nick Gordon is a better centerfielder than Michael Taylor.
Why waste starting pitching depth on a reserve outfielder when the Twins are LOADED with reserve outfielders?
Is Winder really in the Twins plans for their future rotation? Maybe Carlos should have asked some questions before signing.
He’s probably not going to end up in the rotation. They may be able to turn him into a weapon in the BP…or at least long relief which the Twins didn’t have last year.
I mean, Nick Gordon is not a better defensive CF than Taylor. Gordon also hits lefty with extreme splits. They do need a RH OF.
My question would be why not have Garlick on the 40 man and save Winder since Gallo can play CF with no major split issue and Garlick/Gordon or Garlick/Larnach makes a very nice LF platoon.
Royals are nuts.
As a rare Center Fielder who can actually field his position and not kill you offensively the Royals can ask for a hefty return, doesn’t mean they will get it but they can definitely ask for it
Twins don’t seem to match up. A team has to view him as a starter or a 120 game starter kind of player to justify this. That isn’t the Twins.
I have always referred to him as Michael K. Taylor,