The Phillies and right-hander Noah Song are going to attempt something unprecedented, as he is now in camp after spending the past three years in the Navy. Both Song and Phillies president of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski spoke to reporters about the unusual situation today, including Alex Coffey of The Philadelphia Inquirer.
“The reality is it’s a gamble,” Dombroski said of taking Song from the Red Sox in November’s Rule 5 draft. “That’s what it is. I do not know when he picks up a ball and he starts throwing off the mound and puts something into it, once his arm is in good enough shape, I don’t know if he’s going throw 85 or 95. But we think it’s worth the risk.”
Dombrowski is certainly familiar with Song’s past pedigree as a prospect, since he was with the Sox when Song was drafted. Some evaluators considered the youngster to be a first-round talent at that time, but Boston was able to take him in the fourth because clubs were concerned about his commitment to the military. Dombrowski said that taking the gamble this winter was worth it, even though Song was still committed to the Navy at the time, since he could be a “top-of-the-rotation type pitcher” or a “star major leaguer,” the type of player that’s not usually available in the draft. “For us, the [Rule 5] draft price is $100,000, and if we return him [to the Red Sox], it’s $50,000, so that’s not much of a risk, financially,” Dombrowski said. “He’s not counted on our roster, so we haven’t even lost a player to put him on the 40-man roster. We thought it was worth the gamble with the high upside that he could bring.”
For now, the gamble has paid off, in the sense that Song has been transferred from active duty to the reserves. That’s allowed him to pursue baseball but it doesn’t seem he’s completely without limits, as Coffey relays that his transfer to reserve status means he’ll be putting in 12 years of part-time duty instead of six years of full-time. As part of that part-time duty, he’ll still have to serve one weekend per month and two full weeks per year. The logistics of how that will play out during the season remain to be seen.
Song last pitched professionally in High-A in 2019 and will now have to try to get back on track quickly. As a Rule 5 draftee, he has to stick on an active roster all season long or else be put on waivers and offered back to the Sox if he clears. “It felt rough,” Song said of his first bullpen since the news of his transfer. “It felt like I was trying to walk again. Trying to learn new things. But as far as expectations go, just trying to manage expectations, really. I don’t really know what my future or ceiling might be. But just trying to figure out what it is, what the new one is, I guess.”
Song’s journey has already been a unique one and his next stage will be one of the more fascinating spring stories to watch.
Some other notes from the Senior Circuit…
- Nationals left-hander Evan Lee will be treated strictly as a reliever this spring, manager Dave Martinez tells Mark Zuckerman of MASNsports.com. Lee, 26 in June, came up primarily as a starter in his time in the minors, including a 2021 season where he pitched 77 innings in High-A with a 4.32 ERA, 31.4% strikeout rate, 9.7% walk rate and 47.8% ground ball rate. He was added to the club’s 40-man in November of that year to protect him from being selected in the Rule 5 draft. He was able to make his MLB debut in June of last year, putting up a 4.15 ERA over four appearances, but he then went to the injured list with a flexor strain. He made some minor league appearances on a rehab assignment as the season was winding down but didn’t return to the majors and was outrighted off the roster in November. The Nats only have four lefties on their 40-man, with Patrick Corbin and MacKenzie Gore slated to the in the rotation, while Matt Cronin and Jose Ferrer have yet to reach the majors. Perhaps there is a path for Lee to get back to the big leagues but he’ll be competing with non-roster invitees like Sean Doolittle and Anthony Banda.
- The Padres brought veteran lefty Cole Hamels aboard on a minor league deal recently but he won’t factor into their starting pitching depth immediately. Kevin Acee of The San Diego Union-Tribune reports that the southpaw won’t pitch in games until extended Spring Training and will then head to the minors. If he progresses to game readiness and isn’t given a spot on the big league roster, he has monthly opportunities to opt-out of the contract. Hamels missed the past two seasons primarily due to shoulder injuries, in addition to other ailments. He also only made a single start in 2020. Prior to that, however, he was one of the best pitchers in the league for over a decade. “As an athlete, we know we can compete and we’ve done it for a long time,” he tells Acee. “It’s just a matter of (whether) your body will allow you to do it. I think that’s the part that we all battle as our careers kind of come towards those ending points. The body and will you be able to get out there and will you be able to get results? Will you be able to recover? And that’s where we’re at in this stage, and that’s what I’m trying to do.”
Like DD said, Song is worth the gamble.
He is definitely worth the gamble, but hopefully they aren’t rushing him into anything, and they’re still willing to take it slow with him.
Good for Song though, I hope he’s able to make it even though the odds are certainly stacked against him.
Got him for a song, Bloom strikes again
Foolish trolling. Did you miss the part in the article where this was called “unprecedented”? It made sense for Boston to leave him exposed given the low odds of him sticking elsewhere if taken in the Rule 5 draft, just as Philadelphia has little to lose taking a flier on him. The odds still strongly lean towards him being offered back at some point, but if not so be it.
I think the article author is mistaken. Mitch Harris graduated from the Naval academy in 2007, was drafted by St. Louis, who waited for his service obligation to be fulfilled. It t took about 6-7 years before he made the majors for one season.
I think the article author is mistaken. Mitch Harris graduated from the Naval Academy in 2007, was drafted by St. Louis, who waited several years for his service obligation to be fulfilled before he could start in the minors after not pitching for years. It took about 6-7 years before he made the majors for one season, where he pitched well as a middle reliever (ERA in mid 3’s) before injuries caught up with him. Nothing against Noah Song – great story, and I wish him well.
But Harris needed significant minor league time. The unprecedented thing is that Song is attempting to come back from considerable time away from baseman *AND* jump all the way to the majors (or else he has to be offered back).
if he is waived and a team claims him he has to go to the active 26 man right? Can a claiming team hide him on the IL?
If a Rule 5 draftee clears waivers after being waived from the 26 man roster, he must be offered to his original team for $50,000 and can be sent to the minors only if his original team does not wish to acquire him. If Dombrowski decides that his “I’ll stick it to the Red Sox for firing me ploy” doesn’t work out, Song will go back to the Red Sox.
Understood. But he is not on Philadelphias 26 or 40.
Because it’s not the regular season yet. He has to stay on their 26 man or injured list or else he’s gone.
https://www.mlb.com/glossary/transactions/rule-5-draft
“Rule 5 Draft picks are assigned directly to the drafting club’s 26-man roster and must be placed on outright waivers in order to be removed from the 26-man roster in the subsequent season. Should the player clear waivers, he must be offered back to his previous team for $50,000 and can be outrighted to the Minors only if his original club does not wish to reacquire him. A Rule 5 Draft pick can be placed on the Major League injured list, but he must be active for a minimum of 90 days to avoid being subject to the aforementioned roster restrictions in the next campaign.
“Clubs may trade a player selected in the Rule 5 Draft, but the same restrictions apply to the player’s new organization. However, a club may also work out a trade with the Rule 5 pick’s original club to acquire his full rights, thereby allowing him to be optioned to the Minors under traditional circumstances.”
Looks like he has to stay on the active 26 man roster for at least 90 days.
What is his baseline contract value? In other words is he still working under the contract when Boston signed him?
I think the only contract Song is under is the type everyone signs when they are drafted and get a signing bonus.
The whole season not just 90 days. If he gets hurt they can IL him.
90 days on the 26 man with the rest on the IL would be acceptable according to what I posted above from mlb.com.
Hed better be hurt not some phantom toe injury or the Sox will come after DD. There’s real bad blood there.
The article also addressed the IL thing, If the Phils put him on the IL, there will be significant scrutiny due to the Rule V stipulations. There may be a loophole in fitness to pitch provisions, but it’s basically an uncharted loophole with questions about the viability of the approach.
It took the Braves almost 4 years to get to 162 games on the then 25 man roster with Dan Winkler.
“ On December 11, 2014, the Atlanta Braves selected Winkler during the Rule 5 Draft.[9] He was activated from the disabled list in September 2015.[10] Winkler debuted on September 21, striking out two of the three New York Mets batters he faced.[11]
Winkler fractured his elbow on April 10, 2016, while facing the St. Louis Cardinals outfielder Randal Grichuk.[12][13] He missed the remainder of the 2016 season, and as a result, resolved to adjust his mechanics to lessen stress on his elbow.[14][15] Winkler was reactivated in August 2017, but due to injury had not yet fulfilled the major league service time requirement mandated of Rule 5 draftees.[16] In January 2018, the Braves signed Winkler to a one-year contract worth $610,000.[17] For the 2018 season, Winkler posted an ERA of 3.43 in 69 games. He struck out 69 in 60+1⁄3 innings.”
Dombrowski is gonna mess Song’s development up.
Even the great Sandy Koufax, a bonus baby, took many years before he dominated.
I guess the Phillies (or a team Song is traded to) could keep Song on the IL for the first half of the year and get him in shape and keep him on the 26 man roster for the last 90 days of the season.
Worked out well for him in the end, didn’t it?
With all due respect, this isn’t “unprecedented.” Mitch Harris was drafted by St. Louis in 2007 from the Naval Academy, then proceeded to complete his military service obligation before returning to baseball several years later. He eventually made it to the majors, pitched well as a reliever for the Cardinals, but arm issues cut his career short. It’s no disrespect for this young man’s journey, just noting that his hard path has been trod before.
He also wasn’t a R5 pick. Harris completed his service but still spent multiple full seasons in the Minors before making the Majors.
Harris didnt go fron active duty right to the show lol..come on
The article is referring to trying to make a Rule 5 pick pitcher who hasn’t pitched professionally for years stick. You’re correct regarding the military history and that’s a nice example to share.
DD let his ego get in the way and this one makes no sense. Song now takes up a 40-man roster spot for a 26-year who hasn’t pitched since 2019? Sorry dominating A ball as a college senior is like pitching to advanced HS kids. Not much of challenge and not something I would crow about if I was DD..
The Phillies can try to buy Song off the Red Sox so they would be able to stash him in the minors. A month of spring training is not going to replace 3 years of no Baseball activities. That being said i do hope Song does make it to a Major League mound at some point
Wow…..look it’s a lottery ticket man??? And a free looksee at a former first round talent.
Phillies have Cotham, so it’s worth it to at least let him have a look at Song…
Ever heard of a man named Jim Morris? If not, Google it. Every once in a blue moon a unique circumstance will come up and a man (player) will succeed when the odds are completely stacked against him. Another example is Jim Abbott.
Jim Morris was a novelty act for a last place Devil Rays team to draw a little national attention at the end of ’99 season. Jim Abbott never missed any significant time and went from college right into the big leagues.
No one is rooting against Song all i suggested was DD trying to work out a way to keep him without having to send him back to Boston so they can have the option of sending him to the minors if need be. But hey, take everything out of context if you will. Who knows, maybe Dennis Quaid can play him in the movie too
Hey Phillies fans, doesn’t it feel great having a front office you can actually stand behind, respect and TRUST ! DD is a beast and as a Mets fan I hated the Phillies getting him, I knew right there the NL east was going to be that much
more difficult.
Good luck this season, it should be a fun ride.
Lol, good post
Cohen – he just spends stupid money… like the Padres and Mets now. Why do you think the Red Sox fired him? It will bite him in the end. The Phillies aren’t good. They only made the playoffs because of Manfeajd’s new NBA style playoffs, and then they got hot. Real front offices are the Dodgers and Rays
The Phillies are very good.
Last I checked, Rays haven’t won anything. Ever. Not say DD is good or anything. Just saying “real front offices” win. Which barely puts LA there.
So the Nationals are a real front office right now because they won in 2019? Their team looks pretty awful
I honestly think the Nats won because they let Harper walk. But no, I don’t think they’re a good front office. They let Lerner dictate too much of the roster.
A good front office can go bad, just bring in someone like DD.
To me, the Rays are tinkerers. They made some splashy headlines. They got close, but got nothing to show for it. They’re the 2020 version of moneyball. Dual home stadiums? Openers? The TROP? What’s next? Disco Demolition Night Revamped? (This would be destroying old iPods, of course)
Nah. The Nats were stacked and would have been even better with Harper. The Nats won because they were good. Scherzer, Soto, Turner, Rendon, Strasburg…and most spectacularly, everyone was healthy at the right time.
Yeah I can agree with that. But they were stacked with Harper and didn’t get close. Still doesn’t take a good front office to pick Stras and Harper 1-1 in back to back years. Every single team would have done the same.
Unless they can get some form of injury waiver placement for Song, I don’t see how it works. There is no way for him to ramp it up in time to be ready for a 26 man slot, nor is there a way to fast track the development process. So unless he is a unicorn, it is hard to see how it works.
However, DD got him for a Song, so…
Song is a narrative which MLB loves and I’m rooting for him as well. He can stub a toe and Manfred will easily give him an IL hall pass followed by an extended “rehab assignment”. Who is really going to complain?
The Red Sox, that’s who. Manfred is bound by the rules and subject to legal action.
Not “legal action” as much as MLB arbitration, though I doubt it would get that far.
nor is there a way to fast track the development process.
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That’s where I stand on this. I don’t see any way to replicate the development process unless you are using him in the minors. Even if they only used him when they are down 7 runs, it won’t be enough innings, and I presume almost any ML hitter will hit him.
Song was projected to go late 1st round….so the talent was there.
Just seems a little daunting to try and ramp him up in ST for 50-60 MLB ip on a team w/ World Series Aspirations….
But hey it’s DD, so we’ll see
Baseball has totally screwed this young man who did nothing but serve his country. How the heck is going to be a major league pitcher after all this time when he’s barely pitched at the professional level? This is a truly pathetic situation. Oh well, ruin another arm. Why not. They’re a dime a dozen these days.
Good luck and really hope he makes it to the show.
Anchors Away is another Navy song
Man’s game. Song is a true hero in a world that has Manny Machado’s
I don’t give a fudge about bending over backwards, like so many on this site, to worship a man who fought in the military. But he did have excellent numbers (albeit as an elder) in low A ball in 2019. It was not many games but shows he can compete with boys. Can he compete with men? We’ll see. But with so much time off, I doubt it.
Song never got within 5,000 miles of a shot fired in anger. He signed a contract that furnished him a college degree in return for five years of service. The man is no Audie Murphy.
Rule 5 question for you all: Can Song be traded while on the 25-man roster? I can see him not being worth the spot for the Phillies, but the A’s or Tigers or someone being willing to give him a shot for the rest of the year. Thanks in advance!
Yes, they can be traded.
Song, or any Rule V pick, can be traded, but the Rule V stipulations remain attached to him unless he passes through waivers and has been offered back to his original team or a team to which the original team has traded his rights.
Looking at the bullpen options for the Phillies, injuries aside it might come down to:
Song > or < Nick Nelson?
Nelson has 2 options left….
Nelson is even in the mix to possibly start. It’s extremely unlikely, but Philly Rob mentioned him as an option.
Yes and so has Plassmeyer and Sanchez. The 5th starter will be intriguing, think it comes down to Falter/Painter.
Now Nelson was a starter in the minors and did a very good job (although many don’t think so?) in his 65+ ip last year.
So then it comes down to Nelson Bellatti? Again if Song really is in play… The 1st 6 spots are locked down….
Will be a fun thing to watch as the offense is set, barring injury.
Snowball’s chance in heck. He’s probably relieving.
Bloom needed to keep that roster spot for the immortal Ryan Brasier. Anyone care to bet that Brasier is DFA’d before the end of 2023?? Bloom is a buffoon.
This was the first strike against Scotty, beam me up, Harris as far as I am concerned. A total coup for “the Dom”.
There is a Reserve Naval Base right down the road a piece, in Detroit.
Song has received his gold wings. He will have to serve at a location where he will be flying, not just any Naval reserve base. The Navy will determine where he serves.
Song gettin the Kyrie treatmeant. That’s cool
Wonder what happened to Patrick Corbin, did he forget how to pitch or say screw it got paid and doesn’t care anymore?
Probably the most likely scenario is that be gets a “dead arm” that requires an IL stint since he hasn’t pitched in so long. Then, once he is back, I don’t believe there is a rule that says they can’t have him pitch in the minors if they wish, they just need to keep him on the 26 man active roster and the 40 man roster. Kind of a wasted roster spot for this season, but that would be better for his development anyway, I would think.
Corbin could be put on the IL (though word is that he’s coming around in ST). He can then be sent to to the minors for a brief rehab, without being activated. At that point, he has to be activated to the majors, assigned to the minors (which would contractually require his permission, I believe), or released. If he is on the 26 man active roster, the Nats cannot just have him pitch in the minors.