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Blue Jays Still Looking For Starting Pitching

By Mark Polishuk | January 18, 2025 at 10:38am CDT

After missing out on Roki Sasaki, the Blue Jays “remain involved in” the starting pitching market, Sportsnet’s Ben Nicholson-Smith writes.  While Toronto has been more primarily linked to hitters this winter, the Jays have also been actively considering several starters, including such notable names as Sasaki, Corbin Burnes, Max Fried, Blake Snell, Luis Severino, Nick Pivetta, and Jack Flaherty.

Of that group, only Pivetta and Flaherty remained unsigned, as all of the other names signed with other teams.  The near-misses on Sasaki and Burnes in particular have only added to what has been a frustrating 14 months for the Blue Jays, who have continually come up on short on several high-profile free agent pursuits in the last two offseasons.

The Jays’ current starting five consists of Kevin Gausman, Jose Berrios, Chris Bassitt, Bowden Francis, and Yariel Rodriguez.  This group (and Yusei Kikuchi, who traded to the Astros at the deadline) combined to post roughly middle-of-the-pack numbers in comparison to other rotations around the league, and the starting staff was in many ways Toronto’s most consistent strength given the club’s lackluster lineup and bullpen.  Alek Manoah also pitched reasonably well in five starts before undergoing Tommy John surgery, and he is aiming to be back in the rotation by August.  Adding another starter, of course, would only deepen and help solidify this group.  Bringing a new starter into the rotation would push Rodriguez into relief duty, thus addressing another need by bringing another quality arm into the bullpen mix.

The question remains, however, whether the Blue Jays are looking to supplement this group with more of a frontline type of pitcher like Flaherty, or if they’re looking at more of a back-end hurler for what is technically a fifth starter’s role on paper.  The former would require another significant investment in a starting pitcher, on the heels of Berrios’ hefty extension, big free agent deals for Gausman and Bassitt, plus the $32MM Toronto spent to sign Rodriguez a year ago.

Between their big offers to Burnes and Juan Soto, the Jays front office clearly has some money available to spend, even though Toronto already has around $218MM on the books for 2025 and a luxury-tax number of $245MM (estimates courtesy of RosterResource).  What remains unclear is whether or not GM Ross Atkins was given the green light to stretch the budget in general, or just for special cases like Soto or Burnes.  There’s also the fact that Vladimir Guerrero Jr. is looking for a mega-contract of his own as he approaches free agency, and there is reportedly a sizable gap between the Jays and the star first baseman in extension talks.

Flaherty is reportedly open to a shorter-term contract with opt-outs, though such a deal would still require a sizable average annual value.  Pivetta is surely also looking for a significant salary, plus he would also cost the Blue Jays $500K in int’l pool money and the team’s second-highest pick in the 2025 draft since Pivetta rejected Boston’s qualifying offer.  Pivoting away from these bigger names in the pitching market or perhaps obtaining a starter in a trade might be more of a feasible path for the Jays if they instead opted to spend more heavily in offense, such as rumored targets Anthony Santander or Pete Alonso.

In terms of other expenditures this offseason, the Blue Jays also signed Jeff Hoffman to a three-year, $33MM deal, and took on the remaining $97.5MM on Andres Gimenez’s contract after acquiring the second baseman from the Guardians.  Another $11MM was also taken on in the form of Myles Straw’s contract in yesterday’s trade with Cleveland for $2MM in international bonus pool space, which already looks like a misstep since that $2MM was earmarked for the failed bid for Sasaki.  A rival executive described the Straw trade in pretty blunt terms to Nicholson-Smith, calling the deal as a “masterclass [for Cleveland] to dump off so much money,” as “the Guardians knew [the Jays] were desperate.”

It was another tough blow to a Jays franchise that is facing as much pressure to win as any in baseball, given 2024’s disappointing 74-88 record and the looming free agency of Guerrero and Bo Bichette next winter.  Several holes and unanswered questions remain on the roster, and while there is still plenty of time in the offseason to make moves, Atkins’ efforts won’t be helped by the increased public perception that the Jays “need” to do something big.  Such a perception gives other front offices leverages in trade talks with the Jays, and player agents leverage in contract negotiations.

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Toronto Blue Jays Roki Sasaki

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168 Comments

  1. oldgfan

    5 months ago

    Me thinks the Jays should really focus on the trade market. The free agent thing is not showing any results.

    12
    Reply
    • Mondesi’s Cannon

      5 months ago

      They focused on the trade market and got a real (expensive) gem in Straw. His .500 OPS during the past 3 seasons doesn’t warrant a roster spot. Taking on Gimenez and all that money was also a mistake IMO. Toronto should be focusing on extending Vlad and Bo as they both drop off at the end of the year. FA’s can easily see this is their last big year in a VERY competitive division. They’ll need to overpay like the A’s to get talent signing.

      12
      Reply
      • Unclemike1526

        5 months ago

        I’d be willing to bet Straw doesn’t hit those marks again. It was his career year. So they got 2 million dollars in INTL money but whoops, All the high priced INTL players are signed already. Bad Timing.

        2
        Reply
        • NoSaint

          5 months ago

          #Unclemike1526

          Atkins has a knack for swinging once and missing twice.

          1
          Reply
        • TheHighCheese4Me

          5 months ago

          The Bugs Bunny “(s)low ball effect…

          1
          Reply
      • MLB Top 100 Commenter

        5 months ago

        Mondesi

        Disagree on Gimenez

        Agree re Straw

        Reply
      • JackStrawb

        5 months ago

        Straw’s one season removed from being worth his very modest salary of 6-7m and two seasons removed from being worth 2-3 times what he’ll make in 2025. It was hardly “expensive.”

        The Jays can also use int’l money to scoop up an add’l raft of prospects.

        Atkins also deserves props for picking up Giminez on the cheap—16.7 bWAR over the last 3 seasons compared to 12.2 bWAR for Vlad.

        The Jays will be paying Giminez $20m a year the next 5 years, plus a 6th year at 23m with a cheap buyout—whereas Vlad projects to get something in the 40m AAV neighborhood, for a decade. Adding Giminez for his prime is far better than siging Vlad until he’s out of baseball at 2x the AAV.

        What’s puzzling is that while having trouble signing FAs is nothing new, the Blue Jays FO hasn’t compensated by going the Braves’ route and signing prospects and young players very early in their careers to extensions.

        What are they waiting for?

        Reply
      • Dock_Elvis

        5 months ago

        Mondesi- excellent take! And they probably need to get in the trade market to show Vlad Jr they’re serious about 2025 and beyond.

        Me? I’m not sure I wouldn’t try to flip him early for a ransom and jump that rebuild. This team probably doesn’t have thr juice as it sits. If you’re going to disappoint Jays fans regardless..get back quicker.

        1
        Reply
    • 'Tang It

      5 months ago

      Me thinks the Jays should sell anything of value because they weren’t good and are arguably worse now

      5
      Reply
      • vikingbluejay67

        5 months ago

        Definitely time to start the rebuild. Just need a better management team to oversee it.

        9
        Reply
      • vjwhitmore

        5 months ago

        They need to start a full rebuild, their window is closed and no matter what spare parts they pull in are not going to help.
        Get the best for what they have to sell off…

        1
        Reply
        • JackStrawb

          5 months ago

          It’s hard to believe a 74 win team can make a serious run in 2025 after adding just 4-6 wins in the offseason—-after which they’ll be out of contention for at least 3 years. Better to bite the bullet one year early in this case.

          2
          Reply
        • bucsfan0004

          5 months ago

          Their window closed when their star shortshop wandered into center field to impede a catch from their gold glove centerfielder

          Reply
      • coloredpaper

        5 months ago

        I think it would be a horrible idea to go through a rebuild with the current regime. Atkins has shown that he’s not good at finding and developing talent, as he has overseen a farm system become worse WITH him at the helm compared to the guy that he replaced in AA.

        6
        Reply
        • vjwhitmore

          5 months ago

          Step 1 should be to DUMP the current regime

          3
          Reply
    • towinagain

      5 months ago

      I agree and and I just get the feeling the Jays and Padres really match up well in a trade.

      While it’d be a one year deal would love to see if a Vlad Guerrero deal would work.

      While losing Cease seems counterproductive after Sasaki signing with the Dodgers maybe a deal around him works.

      Cease, Cronenworth,Mayfield, Reynolds and Sanabria for Guerrero?

      Something along those lines? Maybe switch out a piece?

      I don’t know.

      2
      Reply
      • ItsMillerTime

        5 months ago

        If the Jays decide to sell and offload Vlad, it doesn’t make a lot of sense for them to acquire one year of Cease when the goal would be to rebuild. I also don’t see a scenario where the Jays would willingly take on Cronenworth. Perhaps the Marlins might be willing to take him off your hands for a prospect haul?

        5
        Reply
      • Simm

        5 months ago

        Tow- the padres would have a rotation of king, darvish and misfits. While opening up a hole at 2b/1b. While adding 3m more in payroll. They would never do that.

        Reply
        • towinagain

          5 months ago

          Yet, the talk, even after Sasaki signed with the Dodgers was the “need” to trade Cease?

          I’m all for keeping Cease as there is a glaring need for pitching.

          The Padres have failed to develop pitching at their minor league level necessitating the need to acquire an FA starter.

          Trading for starting pitching from you ML roster only weakens the team.

          So, if you are going to trade Cease, package him in a deal for Vlad, not in a deal for prospects with no proven track record.

          No team is going to trade any starters of value from their minors for Cease, that are ready to contribute right away.

          So,yes, I agree they should not trade Cease again, unless it’s for a ML player.

          Reply
      • The Virus

        5 months ago

        They would trade Vlad for a prospect haul or young players with multiple years of control left

        Reply
      • Jarred Kelenic's Beer Can

        5 months ago

        Preller would laugh at you and then block your number.

        Reply
    • Dustyslambchops23

      5 months ago

      The free agent market failure is on the FO.

      They are only focusing on the top end of the market, where there is way more competition and location becomes a differentiator.

      Jays could find success in the tier 2 and tier 3 free agents but spend so much wasted time chasing Soto and Roki that they let that market go by.

      10
      Reply
      • high_upside

        5 months ago

        I agree. They devote so much resources to taking a run at the top guys and then spring training arrives with an incremental improvement here and there but the team being worse and older overall. They’re not just unlucky… it’s three off seasons in a row.

        5
        Reply
      • imissjoebuzas

        5 months ago

        For starters Kyle GIbson, or even Jacob Junis could be possible fits without breaking the bank.
        Gibson is good for 5-6 innings per start, and regularly on rotation.
        And as for Junis, he could swing back into a bullpen role just as easily if he wasn’t starting.

        2
        Reply
        • pohle

          5 months ago

          those guys surely make the jays contenders

          1
          Reply
        • EasternLeagueVeteran

          5 months ago

          I like the Junis idea better: He’s younger, seems to have found himself last year.
          Gibson is just an innings eater, but would allow them to move Rodriguez into the pen and upgrade that area.
          I still think they are a big bat away and wish Bregman becomes a Jay.

          Reply
    • SweetLou

      5 months ago

      Fire shatkins, bring in a proper gm, sell everything and rebuild.
      Had they signed vlad before last season like they should have (10x35ish) were probably talking about a whole different story right now but with no commitment to the toung stars and an aging pitching staff, this team is stuck in no mans land right now..and vlad and bo will leave for greener pastures after this season so ya, strip this thing right down.

      1
      Reply
    • redsorbust

      5 months ago

      Agreed however I did check baseball trade values and was amazed to find how little the Jays have in their organization of value to trade for a decent SP. Being a Reds fan and us needing a power hitting OF or 3B I could find no one to make a trade for one of our MLB ready SP.

      1
      Reply
    • Whyme

      5 months ago

      Jays farm is horrible.

      1
      Reply
    • Bart Harley Jarvis

      5 months ago

      I believe Taijuan Walker is still available.

      Reply
    • Zerbs63

      5 months ago

      I’m sure there are some more private jets flying into Toronto.

      Reply
  2. Captainmike1

    5 months ago

    I hear Stroman is available for just taking his contract

    6
    Reply
    • Bucket Number Six

      5 months ago

      I think they might find a starting pitcher under that rock over there.

      Reply
      • Captainmike1

        5 months ago

        Somebody remind me to laugh

        Reply
    • JackStrawb

      5 months ago

      @Captainmike1 I wouldn’t think they’ll find any takers, particularly since Stroman is still fairly durable and his 18m player option for 2026 kicks in if he gets to 140 IP in 2025.

      Stroman could also rather easily put up an ERA around 5,00 in 2025 for his $18m 2025 salary. The Yankees are (A) going to miss Cortes, and (B) likely to end up at least 30 competent starts shorts in 2025 given Cashman’s habit of treating decent or better starting pitching as if it was a fungible good. It isn’t—and as of today he has six starters 32, 34, 27, 34, 29, and 31 years of age. That’s an old rotation, two of whom didn’t get to 100 innings, and Stroman, who you would have preferred got to 0 innings.

      The Yankees will have to give up a decent prospect to unload Stroman, and anyone willing to take him on will probably prefer Montgomery’s upside. Since they’re probably stuck, can Stroman adjust to a MIRP / spot starter role? I wouldn’t bank on it.

      Reply
  3. enteluj88

    5 months ago

    That trade was not smart, and I feel for Myles Straw being the embodiment of another unforced error by Atkins. Hopefully they spend enough to make that acquisition a non-issue.

    9
    Reply
    • vikingbluejay67

      5 months ago

      They could still turn the international pool money into something towards the inevitable rebuild that’s coming.

      3
      Reply
      • Dustyslambchops23

        5 months ago

        It’s not a deep signing period and the top talent is already committed to.

        Reply
      • JackStrawb

        5 months ago

        @vikingbluejay67 Yes. It might be a blessing in disguise. Straw’s also probably still playable as a 5th OFer on the Jays, an average CFer on defense, still one of the fastest players in MLB albeit with a weak bat (so, just like every other backup CFer in the majors), and at this late date the Jays can now add 20-40 lottery tickets at $50k-100k apiece, assuming they have the facilities for a larger than usual class of int’l signings.

        If they’re smart, they’ll figure it out.

        Reply
  4. fathead0507

    5 months ago

    Jon Gray , Dane Dunning are available for trade

    4
    Reply
  5. johncoltrane

    5 months ago

    Blujays still hoping for another meeting with soto
    And are trading for more intl $ for roki

    6
    Reply
  6. cheesemanforever

    5 months ago

    Time for a tear down and rebuild? Can’t imagine the frustration of Jays fans that their management is always “involved in talks” but never anything to show for it.

    5
    Reply
    • oldgfan

      5 months ago

      Us SFG fans can relate to the frustration.
      Looks that a management change may have been the answer for us, but still early in the new regime.

      1
      Reply
      • foppert3

        5 months ago

        Yes we can and yes it’s still early. Blue Jays just got to keep getting up off the ground and throwing punches. Much empathy.

        3
        Reply
      • Swingandamiss

        5 months ago

        Yall both (SF/Tor) have a lot more in common that has nothing to do with baseball.

        1
        Reply
        • oldgfan

          5 months ago

          Bacon ?
          Sourdough ?
          Ya, I’m not getting it so it must be some political crap or parroted BS.

          3
          Reply
        • foppert3

          5 months ago

          I’m Australian. Very comfortable in the presence of a Canadian. Hang tough.

          4
          Reply
        • kinkykontrol

          5 months ago

          Gotta be. And I’m glad it went over my head too.

          1
          Reply
        • bestone

          5 months ago

          @Swingandamiss….
          California should join Canada! CA,CA could have an unbelievable future.

          4
          Reply
        • Bart Harley Jarvis

          5 months ago

          @Swinga,
          You misspelled ‘Yous’.

          Reply
  7. bbgods

    5 months ago

    If Toronto signs one of the better international amateurs that LAD agreed to sign, it might make up for it.

    1
    Reply
    • momTurphy

      5 months ago

      The Dodgers had a weaker class already and even then their top two already signed with Minnesota and Pittsburgh. That 2M from Cleveland is basically worthless.

      8
      Reply
      • bbgods

        5 months ago

        Thanks.

        Reply
        • momTurphy

          5 months ago

          The good news is they had a solid group before Roki so they’ll keep that group. And have the ability to compete this year or have big leverage for a rebuild which could add several big name prospects if they did decide to.

          Reply
    • yeasties

      5 months ago

      Something I’m a little confused about is that young players out of Taiwan are signed as international free agents using bonus pool money, not subject to the posting system, and appear typically signed by MLB teams in the 18-21 year old time frame rather than at 16. If so, that seems like a place that teams like the Jays can still use that unallocated bonus pool money.

      As example, I just found an article about a kid named Yang Nien-Shi out of Taipei that signed with the Giants in December 2024.

      Reply
      • momTurphy

        5 months ago

        Officially the signing period runs from January 15-December 15. So players can get signed all the way up until then.

        In practice teams have agreements set up years in advance and sign players officially on the first day available.

        For say another amateur Taiwanese pitcher, it is likely advantageous to wait now until 1/15 of next year where teams have all of their money available. But the ugly underbelly of a lot of Latin American deals is there are basically agents navigating these deals and getting cuts of the bonuses which push them to that 1/15 first signing day no matter what. If the Blue Jays reached out to players from countries like Taiwan, Japan, Italy or wherever the shady practices aren’t as common, they could offer them contracts throughout the year. So it isn’t meaningless money for Toronto, but all of the top names have signed this year and are spoken for next year, and it takes new players throwing their name in the mix to get anything of value.

        Reply
        • yeasties

          5 months ago

          “it takes new players throwing their name in the mix to get anything of value.” – I agree with that

          Reply
  8. dbacksrs

    5 months ago

    Want Jordan Montgomery?

    5
    Reply
    • Motor City Beach Bum

      5 months ago

      Somebody should go after him. One of the top bounce back candidates for 2025. I’d love for the Tigers to kick the tires with him and Tork as the framework of a deal.

      4
      Reply
      • Unclemike1526

        5 months ago

        Montgomery would be an awesome comeback choice. The only issue with him is he probably isn’t going to like Toronto because his significant other is doing residency in Boston. I’m not sure why more teams aren’t looking in his direction. East Coast would make him happier but the Red Sox are full up. They go at least about 8 deep in starters.

        2
        Reply
        • YankeesBleacherCreature

          5 months ago

          It’s a two-hour flight from TOR to BOS.

          2
          Reply
        • Unclemike1526

          5 months ago

          It’s probably 3 hours from AZ. The point is? After Boras screwed him last year and talked into holding out he was probably going to sign with Boston last year and would have been where he wanted to be. That’s why he fired Boras.

          Reply
        • YankeesBleacherCreature

          5 months ago

          4 hours from Phoenix to Toronto. I understand Monty being upset about his situation. However, it was his choice to be repped by Boras and the accompanying associated risks. There’s a reason why Boras charges the max rate of 5% commission and he comes through for his clients more often than not. They’re both grown men playing a high stakes game. It would be stupid to not seek outside third party opinions on any incoming contract offers. That’s on Monty.

          2
          Reply
        • Unclemike1526

          5 months ago

          You’re right there as eventually the player holds his own fate in his own hands. I think the Red Sox offered him like a 2 or 3 year deal that was less than he wanted but then he and his I don’t want to say wife because I’m not sure what they were then and then she could have done what she needed to do and so could he and then they could have decided where they wanted to be together. But you hire an agent and then don’t listen to him why did you hire him in the first place? Is hi down year because he wasn’t happy or just a down year? That’s why I say he’d be a great comeback candidate.

          1
          Reply
        • YankeesBleacherCreature

          5 months ago

          I think he’ll have a much better year. It was really unusual for DBacks owner to publicly disparage Monty so there has to be more to the story which I don’t really care to know of.

          Reply
        • 'Tang It

          5 months ago

          More like 5

          Reply
      • JackStrawb

        5 months ago

        @Motor City Beach Bum Montgomery would also be a good pickup for the Mets, despite his pushing them over the 4th LT threshold. If he recovers his 2021-2023 form he’d give them a postseason-caliber arm and won’t cost much of anything in prospect capital.

        Ideal for a team with an average farm system but huge amounts of cash making it difficult to find the door.

        If the Tigers want him, he won’t cost a prospect unless it’s a deal where the D’backs send money along with Monty for a prospect / young player. That works, too, if AZ likes Tork—and I suppose the Mets could also go that route if they want to avoid the punishment of moving their draft pick back by going over the 4th threshold. .

        1
        Reply
  9. thebirds

    5 months ago

    I read the title as “Blue Jays still waiting for starting pitching” lol which seems accurate. But I agree, trade market seems more beneficial for them at this point. They should reach out to the Cardinals and see if Sonny Gray would consider waiving his clause. He would fit in nicely to their rotation.

    3
    Reply
    • spudchukar

      5 months ago

      Gray chose the Cards were closer to his home. Don’t think Toronto fits that descripción, plus he has a no trade contract.

      Reply
      • thebirds

        5 months ago

        Yeah my comment said it would fit for Toronto. Didn’t say it would be Grays preference. Also I mentioned the clause in his contract. I feel like you read my comment but gave up on the comprehension part? Lol

        Reply
  10. momTurphy

    5 months ago

    Blue Jays will pursue Corbin Burnes, Max Friend and Jack Flaherty (right before he signs with Detroit).

    2
    Reply
    • Motor City Beach Bum

      5 months ago

      I like that last prediction!

      1
      Reply
  11. Yankee Clipper

    5 months ago

    If only there were, like, 20 SPs on the market at the start of this offseason …… oh, wait.

    8
    Reply
  12. Lefty_Orioles_Fan

    5 months ago

    I was interested in Nick Pivetta because Jim Palmer was interested in Nick…that is what got my attention…so Blue Jays should consider him and he may consider a one year deal…worth a gamble and sign Santander

    2
    Reply
    • mlbnyyfan

      5 months ago

      Feel free to have Stroman for 6 baseballs.

      4
      Reply
      • Lefty_Orioles_Fan

        5 months ago

        No one seems to be interested in the Bread Man

        1
        Reply
        • Unclemike1526

          5 months ago

          Can Panarin pitch? Who knew, Lefty? LOL

          4
          Reply
        • Lefty_Orioles_Fan

          5 months ago

          Well, The Bread Man always rises to the top

          Reply
      • Dustyslambchops23

        5 months ago

        I would honestly take Stroman, nothing wrong with him as a 4/5. Also I’m sure being given away would put a chip (another) on his shoulder

        5
        Reply
      • MLB Top 100 Commenter

        5 months ago

        Pay his salary down to $5 million per year for two years and you’ll get a taker

        4
        Reply
    • Dorothy_Mantooth

      5 months ago

      I’m not sure Toronto would sign Pivetta to a one year deal since he will cost them draft picks (he turned down a QO). They would need to sign him for at least 3 years to offset the draft pick compensation and losing some of their 2026 IFA funds as well.

      They’d be better off going after Flaherty on a short term deal with a higher AAV or trading for a 4th or 5th starter with Minnesota or Texas.

      Reply
    • Whyme

      5 months ago

      Pivetta cost a pick no way should the Jay’s sign him

      1
      Reply
  13. jimmertee

    5 months ago

    There was no near miss on Ohtani, there was no near miss on Soto, there was no near miss on Sasaki.

    None of these players were ever coming to Toronto and it was reported as such well in advance of them signing elsewhere. Players in free agency use the BlueJays as a bargaining chip to leverage the most money and term and sign in the City they wanted in the first place.

    The simple truth is the majority of players don’t want to work for Shapiro and Atkins.

    4
    Reply
    • RGR

      5 months ago

      Very true and well said and a complete mystery as to why ownership is acting so clueless

      1
      Reply
    • MLB Top 100 Commenter

      5 months ago

      Jimmer

      Agree on Ohtani, Soto and Sasaki

      Disagree on “majority of players”

      1
      Reply
    • kinkykontrol

      5 months ago

      I think it’s as simple as looking at your options. You have organizations actively improving, in what most cases, are an already strong team. You have a club that has a punchless offense, middling rotation, and have shown no assertiveness in addressing any of that. They’re busy signing glove first utility players. Why would any player choose the latter?

      The Jays should be playing small market and signing upside guys to shore up their roster, adding some offensive minded players. But they put all their energy into swinging for the fences with the biggest names out there. Shoot your shot, sure, but multitask and plug some holes at the same time.

      It’s less about the front office (which I agree is a disaster) and more about the team not being very good, so why would you want to go there?

      2
      Reply
      • JackStrawb

        5 months ago

        @kinkykontrol Good comment, but why is no one bothering to compliment the FO for picking up Giminez? He’s put up 133% of Vlad’s value since he became a full-time player at 23 in 2022 as a platinum glove 2Bman with Cleveland and the Jays have him for 5/97m..

        Reply
    • 'Tang It

      5 months ago

      They don’t want to move to Canada and pay those taxes all to play for a bad team.

      Reply
  14. Digdugler

    5 months ago

    Only 1 year deals for any FA. Ross already completely f**** the team.

    1
    Reply
  15. riffraff

    5 months ago

    Susuki, Hoerner, Assad and lottery ticket minor league pitcher for Springer and Bichette.

    Jays save a few bucks and a pitcher- cubs move Bichette to 3b shaw to 2b Springer dh/4th Of

    Reply
    • Dustyslambchops23

      5 months ago

      Doubtful Bo would be able to play 3B

      Reply
  16. Scott_11

    5 months ago

    Trade for Alacantra before he is lights out and his value goes back up

    1
    Reply
    • ReyDay

      5 months ago

      Why would the Marlins want to trade Sandy while is value is the lowest it’s been? He has 3 years remaining no need to trade him now.

      4
      Reply
      • Dustyslambchops23

        5 months ago

        Beyond that, jays don’t have the pieces to beat other teams if marlins actually put him on the market

        Reply
      • JackStrawb

        5 months ago

        @ReyDay Exactly. If teams don’t want to trade on the assumption he’s back in form, hold onto him until he is.

        And if he isn’t, at least you didn’t trade low, and you have 3 full years to wait for him to have a good stretch then deal him for what some optimist is willing to give you.

        Reply
  17. jamesryu14

    5 months ago

    The Jays’ front office has been incompetent when it comes to managing the farm system, but I don’t blame them for not signing Guerrero Jr. to a long-term deal earlier. His inconsistency year to year made it a tough call. However, now is the time to let both Guerrero and Bichette walk and start fresh by retooling.

    The organization needs new leadership—specifically a President and GM who are talented, balanced, and focused on both scouting and analytics. They must build a sustainable farm system, consistently developing a strong young core. Teams like the Dodgers (under Andrew Friedman), Brewers (under Dave Stearns), and Orioles (under Mike Elias) have succeeded by following this approach—creating a robust pipeline and pairing it with smart free-agent signings.

    The Jays have the payroll to be a sustainable contender, but they need leadership that can scout, draft, and develop players effectively, then use that foundation to complement the team with big free agents. With the right vision, the Jays can finally build a perennial winner.

    7
    Reply
    • Digdugler

      5 months ago

      Keep in mind no FA go to Toronto, but there is no reason they cant be someone like the Orioles, Really it all starts with drafting well which the Jays havent done for Atkin’s entire 9 year tenure.

      2
      Reply
    • Dustyslambchops23

      5 months ago

      I don’t get the Vlad comment. His inconsistency is on the ceiling not on the floor, it’s more lofty expectations than anything else. Yes 2023 wasn’t good but the fact that it appears that’s as bad he can be and he’s still an average hitter at his worst is a plus.

      Add to the fact that starting in 2022 the jays stripped him of support year over year and felt it was appropriate to have a 23 year old carry the offense and then tried to rebuild his approach and stance. Like everything this FO has done, they botched it. Atkins waited out the market that exploded and now it will cost 100+ mil more because of that.

      FO is 100% to blame for that

      4
      Reply
      • jamesryu14

        5 months ago

        Yeah, but generational talents like Soto and Ohtani consistently put up MVP type of number year after year, and Guerrero Jr. is expecting a salary and terms similar to theirs. I just can’t commit to him if he’s only going to put up MVP-type numbers every other year. However, if he becomes more consistent, why not?

        Reply
        • Dustyslambchops23

          5 months ago

          Ugh. First off Vlad isn’t getting Soto or Ohtani money.

          The argument that because he’s not as consistent as Soto doesn’t make sense here when Soto will presumably walk away with 200 million more in guarantees, that’s what the consistency got him.

          Lots of Generational talents didn’t have smooth Starts, especially the ones who started young.

          Reply
      • RGR

        5 months ago

        The mistake, again on the FO, was in not getting both of Bo and Vlad locked up literally years ago when the price would hv been much lower….everyone other than Ross Atkins could see the impact Ohtani and Soto would hv on salaries in general but Atkins has to differ himself into a 10ft deep hole just thinking about going to the washroom

        1
        Reply
        • jamesryu14

          5 months ago

          I still wouldn’t commit to Guerrero Jr. for 10+ year contract that he was looking for, even at a discounted AAV. He’s been durable and grades out at 40 speed on the 20–80 scouting scale, which is good. Even though he’s not a stolen-base threat, he hasn’t been a base-clogger. However, if he gains weight in his 30s and his speed drops to 30, and that could come with increased his injury risk and speedy decline. (Miguel Cabrera) I think he’s extremely talented, but he also comes across as a bit lazy to me, given the year-to-year inconsistencies.

          Reply
        • Dustyslambchops23

          5 months ago

          The guy takes the field every day, the fact that you even have the gull to call him lazy says way more about you than it does Vladdy.

          Reply
        • jamesryu14

          5 months ago

          He totally annihilated minors and got called up first time and struggled for few years. He said at the interview that’s when he realized that he needs to start doing things he’s never done while he was a minor leaguer. (e.g. Conditioning, batting practice, video analysis and continuous adjustment to his swings) Remember when he showed up at 270 lbs? Now he is in better shape but I shadowed him So yeah I think he was pretty lazy. Not many generational talents seem to have year to year inconsistencies. You should see how meticulous Ohtani and Soto are in pre-game preparations. They are talented, but they make so much more efforts.

          Reply
    • JackStrawb

      5 months ago

      @jamesryu14 Atkins simply hasn’t been that bad of late. Sure 2024 was disappointing, but he brought the Jays back from the bottom in 2020 through 2023. I won’t presume to know if that took him longer than it should have, but the universal screaming for his head after a pro-rated 86-76 record in 2020 then 91, 92, and 89 wins before 2024 in a brutal division is hardly fair.

      Plus it’s fair to acknowledge Toronto being outside the US is a distinct and enduring disadvantage, a drawback he overcame when adding Springer in FA (it didn’t turn out as well as you’d like, but George was the premier CFer available, by far, and the Jays had to overpay by at least 20% to get him), by dealing for Berrios then persuading him to sign the extension, by signing Gaussman in FA, signing Bassitt in FA, signing Kikuch in FA then spinning him for prospects, and now by adding Giminez in trade and getting his cheap extension in the process.

      If Guerrero didn’t want to sign a reasonable extension and Atkins didn’t want to pay him as if he was a perennial 6 win player (he isn’t, and it’s not close), how is that a black mark against Atkins?

      If Bichette didn’t want to sign a big extension but just put up a replacement level year in 2024, how is that a black mark against Atkins? That evaluation may change if Bo puts up a 5 win season in 2025, but that’s hardly a sure thing. He’s 27, he already has only average speed, and he dealt with a serious leg injury in 2024. We’ll see what comes, but the Jays may have dodged a $250-300m bullet.

      Reply
  18. drdback

    5 months ago

    Jays should consider trading Bichette and Ricky Tiedeman to the DBacks for Jordan Montgomery and Geraldo Perdomo.

    1
    Reply
    • JackStrawb

      5 months ago

      Seems like the Jays can better use an OFer than another MIer.

      Reply
  19. Bob Sacamano 310

    5 months ago

    Go all in. Sign Flaherty, Santander, and then either Bregman or Alonso

    2
    Reply
    • Best Screenname Ever

      5 months ago

      Excellent idea. Bury the club for years in bad contracts, and give up draft picks for the privilege. Hard to see why they’re not steaming ahead.

      9
      Reply
      • ItsMillerTime

        5 months ago

        Nonsense! They can just defer those payments for the next 20 years! As for the draft picks part, who needs ’em? They’ll probably just bust anyways!

        Reply
    • Dustyslambchops23

      5 months ago

      They can’t afford all that

      Reply
    • Enrico Pallazzo

      5 months ago

      Great idea minus Alonso. Big giant guys who play poor defense and strike out a lot don’t age well

      1
      Reply
      • Bob Sacamano 310

        5 months ago

        He seems like a bad Angels signing

        1
        Reply
    • Rww59

      5 months ago

      Don’t forget Scott

      1
      Reply
    • JackStrawb

      5 months ago

      “Sign Alonso!” is its own refutation.

      Reply
  20. Mikenmn

    5 months ago

    Perhaps they’d be interested in the 2025 Stroman? Leather seats and dashboard, zero to 89 MPH heater, and….available with special financing

    5
    Reply
    • Best Screenname Ever

      5 months ago

      And he can take along his personal trainer. I’m sure she’ll be welcomed too.

      1
      Reply
  21. Old York

    5 months ago

    Jays should be trading some assets or waiting till the trade deadline. Their team is cooked.

    2
    Reply
    • Digdugler

      5 months ago

      I dont see how Vlad could have a higher value at the deadline than now so I see no reason to wait. Either you extend or trade in the next 3 weeks. You listen in on Bo but given his injuries last year you may have to wait until the deadline. Berrios is reasonably priced, should be able to get a haul for him as well.

      1
      Reply
      • Dustyslambchops23

        5 months ago

        Agree 100%
        It’s been worst case scenario with this FO. So I’m expecting the jays to let him go in to a walk year, he has an MVP type season but he gets hurt around the deadline and they can’t trade him.

        1
        Reply
      • RGR

        5 months ago

        Again it comes down to whats best for this FO vs whats best for the organization…..dealing Vlad is a death knell for Atkins and Shapiro and they know it

        1
        Reply
        • Dustyslambchops23

          5 months ago

          I think at this point they need to wave the white flag, the writing is on the wall.

          It’s been so politely managed in guessing Atkins won’t ever get another shot at being GM. Shapiro will probably survive because of the business side

          Reply
        • Jerry Hairston Jr's Toupee

          5 months ago

          They’ll have a hard time selling tickets, concessions and merch if they gut the roster in the middle of January as opposed to late July….

          Reply
  22. Digdugler

    5 months ago

    Its funny because the Jays needed 2 above average bats more than anything this offseason and the only moves Atkins has made to address the lineup is traded their 2nd best batter for Gimenez and absorbed Myles Straw salary for free.

    2
    Reply
  23. larkraxm

    5 months ago

    Stroman is still available.

    2
    Reply
    • JackStrawb

      5 months ago

      @larkraxm He’ll be on the Yankees as of OD. It’ll be interesting to see if the Yankees can turn Stroman into a placid spot starter / multi-inning reliever until the inevitable injury in their rotation.

      At least it’s a fairly honorable way of reducing the chance he reaches the 140 IP his 2026 player option require.

      Reply
  24. TellItGoodbye

    5 months ago

    What I wouldn’t give to see the Blue Jays win this year’s WS and the Dodger$ get swept by the Giants or Pads in the playoffs.

    2
    Reply
    • Jaysfansince92

      5 months ago

      Honestly, unless they get some bats I’m not sure why they’re even bothering trying to get starting pitching.

      This kind of feels like putting the cart before the horse. If they can’t get bats then they might as well tear it down and trade everyone that’s not nailed down away and start the rebuild now. No idea why Atkins is so obsessed with pitching and defense when the team can’t even hit. They already tried winning all their games 1-0 and it didn’t work

      2
      Reply
    • high_upside

      5 months ago

      Unfortunately what you’d have to give for that is an elite MLB roster which the jays couldn’t get now with a 500m dollar payroll.

      Reply
  25. Rww59

    5 months ago

    Straw is a stopgap for Varsho and can be optioned to buffalo after.

    2
    Reply
    • OilCanLloyd

      5 months ago

      Loperfido has options too I think.

      Reply
    • Jays_Jen

      5 months ago

      An expensive one.

      Reply
      • Diggydugler

        5 months ago

        and an awful one. Although Varsho is no stud with the bat, at least he is playable.

        Reply
  26. brucenewton

    5 months ago

    Earmarked for another last place finish. They need to start the rebuild. Looking at a 90 loss season at best.

    1
    Reply
  27. dano62

    5 months ago

    Seems like signing Pivetta would help make up for the Straw blunder – that $500k penalty would come from the excess they acquired, plus Pivetta’s Canadian. Personally if you don’t have a stomach for those penalties plus the commitment, especially if you can ink Santander, I’d be happy with Heaney. But firing Shapiro-Adkins has to be Job One. Then let the new guy trade Bo & Vladdy.

    Reply
    • foppert3

      5 months ago

      Would you consider Zaidi or be thinking that is just more of the same ?

      Reply
      • oldgfan

        5 months ago

        I got on for ya Fopp….
        Would you trade Eldridge, Birdsong, Luciano for Vlad, if you could get an extension out of him ?

        Reply
        • foppert3

          5 months ago

          I’m not really across how good Vlad is. Not on my radar. But no. On the surface of it and this is harsh I know, but I don’t like the body type. Long term scares me. But I stress, that’s pretty much going off pictures only. I don’t know enough about him.

          I’m also desperate for a star out of the farm. They pumped tens of millions into Papago. They deserve a result imo. At the moment, Eldridge appears to be the best chance.

          1
          Reply
        • oldgfan

          5 months ago

          Vlad is a natural hitter like his dad was, but has Pablo’s weight issues.
          I’m with you on Eldridge, but you just never know on a prospect. I would like to see some trade with the young arm surplus and I really don’t see any position for Luciano, if he even gets it figured out. Same with Schmitt.

          1
          Reply
        • foppert3

          5 months ago

          Yeah. It’s a constant battle for the endomorph. I did enjoy watching his old man’s highlights.

          In terms of getting a human, I also hope Buster loses his virginity on the trade front this off season. I imagine the first one would be the hardest. Just no idea who for.

          1
          Reply
    • bestone

      5 months ago

      dano62…
      This is shapiro’s last year in contract.
      He doesn’t care beyond this year.
      If he gets re-signed….the fans are going to walk.
      Yes…job1 is to get a front office that has a vision beyond ‘25.

      Reply
  28. Dorothy_Mantooth

    5 months ago

    I do believe Toronto will eventually sign Santander. They will just need to overpay him like they did with Springer. Everyone knew the last couple of years of the Springer deal would be painful. Same goes for Santander, Alonso and even Bregman.

    1
    Reply
  29. Jays_Jen

    5 months ago

    Other teams are signing player extensions, albeit shorter ones for fewer dollars; but if I was a FA, I would look to those teams before the Jays at this point, hands-down. Will Vlad even take their money, anymore? It’s a terrible state of affairs and absolutely mind-boggling Atkins is still employed (the last two seasons weren’t enough?!). This isn’t squarely on Atkins (although the vast majority of it is…), it’s the entire FO and that starts with Rogers. I know he’s greenlighting the $$, but why would he give $$ to an inept fool who can NEVER seal any deal. While I love Gimenez, Cleveland is laughing at them like crazy. Rogers seems oblivious to baseball…he just likes the revenue it and the other TO sports bring in. I don’t think there’s any way Atkins can redeem himself at this point. I don’t care where we are in the offseason…fire him. Send a damn message for once.

    If they go the trade route (seems like the only thing to do, now), it will suck because they finally got some promising young players at the deadline last season. Fans don’t want them to be traded. And the other younger players aren’t great, as the farm system absolutely sucks. They spent too much time and way too many resources going after players who would never sign there…what does that say to Vlad and Bo? Or any FA who signs there? What a total debacle. I am waiting for the headline: “Blue Jays sign Daniel Vogelbach and Brandon Belt to one-year deals”.

    Jays’ fans don’t deserve this BS.

    1
    Reply
  30. ❤️ MuteButton

    5 months ago

    It seems like the Blue Jays, Dodgers, Mets get the best coverage on this site. Any other opinions? Also if you feel like your team gets slighted I’d like to know who that is?

    Reply
    • larkraxm

      5 months ago

      I think that lots of teams are not trying to do anything, so they are not making any news…even rumors of news. The teams that are active will get more coverage on a rumors website. The Jays are in on everyone so they come up a lot.

      Reply
    • Hank Murphy

      5 months ago

      Blue Jays get coverage because they are a train wreck. The Shatkins regime have turned them into a laughing stock, a real dumpster fire of an organization.
      The only thing they could do to get worse is to get some front office/ownership people from the Jacksonville Jaguars to add to the organization.

      Reply
      • larkraxm

        5 months ago

        Sure. They are a train wreck. A train wreck that has been connected to every available player. The Mariners, for example, told us all in November that they have $16 million to spend on upgrades. That disconnected them from 90% of FA. Hence, we don’t see a lot of reporting on the Mariner’s plan to do nothing.

        Reply
  31. Expos The Manfraud

    5 months ago

    Atkins has to go immediately. He cannot be trusted with the Vlad negotiations and a summer full of lame duck GM moves will destroy what little value the Jays have left.

    1
    Reply
    • bestone

      5 months ago

      Given that this is shapiro’s last year and Atkins has two left….the negotiations should be between Rogers and Vladdie.

      1
      Reply
      • Expos The Manfraud

        5 months ago

        Bring Beeston out of retirement for the special assignment lmao

        1
        Reply
  32. redsorbust

    5 months ago

    I am not a Jays fan but I follow baseball in general. If I were a Jays fan then I would be all in on trading Guerrero Jr. rather than have him for one last meaningless year ala Ohtani and the Angels and get nothing in return. I would look to be able to look at the big picture instead of a few more wins during the 25 season.

    Reply
    • Expos The Manfraud

      5 months ago

      You say that, until you investigate how poorly those two operate when ‘selling’ during trades. Shatkins are completely incapable of evaluating or developing pre-MLB talent.

      3
      Reply
    • Diggydugler

      5 months ago

      No REAL Jays fans want the Jays to add additional FA. Unless you are extending Vlad, in the next 2 weeks, he must be sold. The Jays are horrible in 2025, so there is no need for any player currently on the roster.

      Reply
  33. dakroz

    5 months ago

    As a Phillies fan I acknowledge Ranger Suarez had a bad second half due to injury but his first half was amazing and so is his track record as a playoff performer. With Luzardo joining the Phils and Painter due to join the Phils rotation mid-season, I am surprised you don’t hear rumors for teams like the Blue Jays but more so the Orioles trying to pry him away. I can’t imagine it would take much more than a back end top 100 prospect to get Ranger and clear his money off the books. If the Phillies shop Ranger is my theory of a back end top 100 prospect realistic? Too much to ask for? Too little to ask for?

    Reply
  34. nwwh

    5 months ago

    “…still” – Lionel Richie

    Reply
  35. retsubllab

    5 months ago

    Love being able to research history on the internet – just looked up potential Toronto Blue Jay free agent pitcher signings and came across Red Ruffing, Satchel Paige and the Big Train himself as players who headed elsewhere.

    Reply
  36. dasit

    5 months ago

    how are the blue jays like bedsheets at a five-star hotel? they get turned down every day

    Reply
  37. Naylor01

    5 months ago

    They should be looking for a new president and gm

    3
    Reply
  38. Rsox

    5 months ago

    As much as i would hate to see Pivetta pitch for the Jays, bringing him home makes sense and he would be a very good addition to the Jays staff

    Reply
    • Whyme

      5 months ago

      Lol his numbers were terrible and costs a pick. Dumb move.

      Reply
      • Rsox

        5 months ago

        Against the other starters on the Blue Jays staff with at least 10 starts he would have led the team in strikeouts, been 3rd in walks allowed, 4th in innings, 4th in ERA, and 4th in starts last season.

        Reply
    • Ashleyr

      5 months ago

      To sign Pivetta, Toronto LOSE their 2nd round pick, plus international funds. They need to rebuild their roster and draft picks are imperative. They can’t afford to throw them away on a here and now pitcher that makes no difference in the scheme of things. The Jays should trade Guerrero to Boston for Casas, Anthony, who is the number 1 prospect in MLB and is an outfielder that the Jays need. They also receive Campbell and if they have to take Yoshida, the Jays ask for Mayer, which goes a long way in creating a new foundation. Trade Bo for other young players, Basset, Gausman, and Springer starting the rebuild. Yes, it means bottom finishes for the next few years, but it works out in the long term with an exciting team that players will want to be part of. First things first, discard Shapiro and Atkins and let the new team discard the long term players and bad contracts. Rebuild the youth on the team and nobody cares if they lose 100 games a year as long as they are making an effort to create a contender again. For fans demanding the team spends 100 M on free agents in their thirties, they missed the boat and the Jays aren’t a player or two away from contention. There are too many holes to fill and no depth when injuries hit. I doubt anyone will agree with me, but such is life.

      Reply
      • Rsox

        5 months ago

        The only way the Red Sox part with Roman Anthony in a deal for Guerrero is if Guerrero agrees to a long-term extension on day 1. Your propsal of Anthony, Casas, Campbell, Mayer and Yoshida is a gross overpay for a one year rental, no matter who it is

        Reply
  39. RogerBeshensFootballSlider

    5 months ago

    If a team seeks pitchers outside the organization it suggests that somone isn’t effectively teaching the Roger Beshens Football Slider at all levels.
    Roger Beshens is in Phoenix teaching 17 professional pitchers how to throw his Football Slider.
    Roger Beshens recently said after his Session with Beshens Football Slider workout near Salt River Fields: ‘To get the best results of my Football Slider you need to learn how to shape it PROPERLY even if you have all the data:
    “I teach it better than anyone else that’s why I was in the Dbacks Clubhouse teaching it last May.”
    The Blue Jays should hire Roger Beshens and they will quickly see the benefits.

    Reply
  40. Seaver rules

    5 months ago

    Why not Quintana? I wish the Mets kept him rather than relying on Montas, Holmes and Blackburn. Q was lights out in August-September.

    Reply
  41. Hank Murphy

    5 months ago

    Does no one remember just how bad Blue Jays the offense was in 2024? Why aren’t they looking for someone who can, you know, hit the ball with consistency?

    1
    Reply
    • Whyme

      5 months ago

      No one wants to sign long term to a team that was horrible and where the 2 best offensive players are going to leave after this year.

      Reply
  42. Whyme

    5 months ago

    Fire shatkins and start the rebuild. This team has zero chance of competing. The offense could be some of the worst ever.

    1
    Reply

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