It seems increasingly unlikely that the Red Sox will utilize a full-time DH, as Rob Bradford of WEEI.com reports. “We’re not looking to have just a DH,” said president of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski. “I think really in today’s game the only way you really do that is to have somebody like David Ortiz and most of the time you really prefer to have some flexibility. It’s not to say somebody won’t settle in most of the time, but your goal is to use the flexibility of the players at this point. We’ll see how that all fits in.” That does leave open the possibility of a regular, of course, and some players who’d profile as a designated hitter — such as big-budget free agent Edwin Encarnacion (who has spent plenty of time recently at first) or the aging Carlos Beltran (who also plays the outfield) — could spend at least some time in the field, possibly allowing the club to slot Hanley Ramirez or others in the hitter-only hole on occasion. It is fair to wonder, too, whether any changes to the CBA — an increased luxury tax floor, if not also the addition of an active roster spot — might change the team’s thinking.
Here’s more from Boston and the rest of the American League:
- Even if the offseason is relatively quiet from an acquisition standpoint, the Red Sox may be in a position to explore some extensions, as Tim Britton of the Providence Journal writes. For Boston, the three obvious candidates are surely shortstop Xander Bogaerts and outfielders Mookie Betts and Jackie Bradley Jr. None figure to come cheap, particularly as their service clocks and stat lines have continued to build, but Britton provides some quotes from rival executives discussing the benefits and drawbacks of pursuing longer-term contracts. Scott Boras, who reps Bogaerts and Bradley, indicated that talks thus far have involved only their pending arbitration cases, and Britton says that the club has yet to seriously consider deals. But it’ll certainly be interesting to see whether discussions take place in earnest later in the offseason.
- The Red Sox have hired Gary DiSarcina as their new bench coach to replace the outgoing Torey Lovullo, as Gerry Callahan of WEEI first reported (story via WEEI.com). A Massachusetts native, DiSarcina has previously skippered Boston’s Triple-A affiliate and has most recently been a part of the Angels’ coaching staff.
- There’s still quite a lot to be sorted out for the Athletics this winter, and we don’t have a ton to go on in assessing the organization’s direction. But there are a pair of pieces worth looking into for fans looking for the sense of those who follow the team most closely. Susan Slusser of the San Francisco Chronicle takes stock of the free agent outfield options, citing reunions with Josh Reddick and Brandon Moss as unlikely. But the organization may look to take a shot on KBO star Eric Thames, she says, while Carlos Gomez and perhaps even Austin Jackson representing possibilities in center. Meanwhile, with some chatter surrounding key veterans Sonny Grey, Steven Vogt, and Sean Doolittle, Joe Stiglich of CSNBayArea.com examines the possibility of one or more significant swaps. He suggests that Doolittle, an affordable but oft-injured power lefty, could be the most likely of that trio to change hands.
- With the Tigers gauging trade interest in much of their roster, it’s mostly guesswork at this point as to who’s drawing the kind of interest that could lead to a deal. Jon Heyman of Fan Rag tweets that the team has drawn hits on all of its biggest names, including second baseman Ian Kinsler, as well as underperforming starters Anibal Sanchez and Mike Pelfrey. We’ve yet to hear much in the way of clear connections between Detroit and rival organizations, though. The Dodgers think Kinsler would fit nicely in L.A., per a tweet from Jon Morosi, but the teams did not discuss the matter at the GM Meetings.
redsox for_life
How will miss on Kendrys??3/33m thats cheap for a 29h 93rbi 276!!now Beltran will cost more
redsox for_life
Imagine now iff Toronto sign EE!!!
JT19
Morales is strictly a DH who might be able to play 1B/corner OF in an extreme pinch. You obviously didn’t read the beginning article. DD doesn’t want a single guy being the DH and I kind of agree. Limits the roster to some degree and if Sandoval comes back at all and can hit at a respectable rate, Hanley/Sandoval/Shaw will probably split 1B/3B/DH while also allowing the team to start another one of the regulars at DH once in a while and let Holt get more regular at-bats.
bradthebluefish
You missed it JT19. The point was that the Red Sox missed out on a bargain in Kendrys Morales.
Blue Jays have done great job in getting a respectable DH for short money while picking up a draft pick via the QO.
JT19
Bargain? Probably, yes. But it still remains that if the Red Sox signed Morales, bargain or no bargain, they would have Morales as strictly a DH, Hanley as 1B/DH, and Shaw/Sandoval splitting time at 1B/3B. Signing Morales would’ve affected their flexibility. With hitting not necessarily being a huge need for the Red Sox, that $11 million a year is better served on pitching.
User 4245925809
3y was to long for boston to give Morales, or any FT DH that isn’t pretty much assured to put up superb numbers. Really.. 2y is also with Sam Travis nearly ready.
I agree with most others that spending money on bats is a wate for the Sox any any monies used should go toward the pen and possible rotation upgrades.
A thought have been having is Verlander where JBJ heads to detroit, along with Sandoval.. Yes.. It overloads an already ugly Tigers IF defensive team (ex SS/2b) and gives them an extra 3b/dh, but would shed 90m (minus sandoval 53m) and other pieces could be added.on either side.
redsox for_life
So what strictly a DH?? Big Papi was that for years!!! 3/33$ is a bargain for players like him!!Hanley Ramirez 22m him 11 almost same production
NorahW
Domnrowski, right or wrong, said they don’t want a full-time DH–they prefer more flexibility. Other teams are doing it the same way.
JT19
And when Morales’ production starts to tail off in a year or two? You’d probably be cursing DD for signing Morales in the first place. The Red Sox DON’T NEED HITTERS right now. They led the league in scoring this past year and where did it get them? Oh yeah, that’s right, a first round exit. They need pitching. As you stated, Hanley puts up similar production, so why spend $33 million on two guys to do the same thing when they can only play 2 positions. That $11 million per year could go to signing another starter or relief pitcher. Not that money is an issue for the Red Sox, but would you rather see Kendry Morales in a Red Sox uniform or see the Red Sox add one or two top set-up guys? If you choose Morales, you obviously didn’t watch the playoffs and obviously didn’t note the importance of a good bullpen.
redsox for_life
Tell me Sandoval/TShaw/Holt or Moncada will replace Ortiz production?? Is 38h 120rbi!! Morales 29h 93rbi Beltran 29h 93rbi!! And yes we need setup plus a pitcher but we need some good production at DH
redsox for_life
Sign Beltran 1/15m plus a option! Trade Pomeranz and Owen for Ozuna!! Sign Hill for 2/30m wt a option/ sign Holland then trade Bradley Devers Korpect plus Marrero for Chris Sale!! Trye to trade Sandoval for something
JT19
If you expect anyone to immediately come in and replace Ortiz’s production then you’re crazy. Yes, you need to find someone to produce in the lineup with Ortiz gone, but Morales was not the answer. Beltran might help replace some of the production, but it still stands that pitching should come first. Ortiz’s production did squat in the playoffs and Boston couldn’t match Cleveland in their pitching. Yeah its great that they can score X amount of runs per game during the regular season but that all goes out the window when the playoffs start. In terms of DH replacement, Hanley can move there and then you hope Shaw and Moncada prove they are the real deal and produce. Why invest all this money/time into prospects and value them so highly if you’re going to find some expensive veteran to take their spot on the roster?
The Jays are not trading Ozuna (at all, let alone in-division) and definitely not unless its a complete overpay. Hill is going to want either more years or more money. And that is not enough for Sale…JBJ would have to be thrown in there.
myaccount
NOBODY is replacing Ortiz’s production. So yes, you go with what will make your overall roster better, particularly when you need pitching… just as JT19 pointed out. Replacing Ortiz with Sandoval/Shaw/Holt/whoever else at DH won’t force the offense to completely regress… as a unit they will still be very good. The pitching staff can’t continue to be mediocre. Outslugging opponents and getting by with mediocre pitching works in the regular season, not the postseason..
redsox for_life
Sorry but Ozuna from the Marlins not the jays!!and a stars wt Jacki Bradley!i don’t trust Shaw and Moncada is not ready! If they don’t trade for Sale or Quintana Velander sp the division is for Toronto or Yankee
jmi1950
There are only 152 games with a DH. Boegy really wore down last year. Pedey isn’t getting any younger. There are only 13 spots to fill and even with Moncada, Swihart & Sam Travis starting at AAA there are 12 taken.
Hanley,Panda, Shaw DH 82 games. Holt starts at 2B/SS 30 games with Boegy& Pedey DH 15 each. Young DH or “resting” an OF the other 40 games. Everyone stays healthy and rested without missing any AB’s. Some of what you lose from not having Ortiz can be gained by not wearing out your other regulars.
1B/3B (DH -82 games) Hanley, Panda, Shaw
2B/SS/U (DH -30 games) Pedey/Boegy/Holt
OF (DH – 40 games) Betts, JBJ, Beni, Young
C Vasquez, Leon
13th spot and AAA depth: Sam Travis, or Marco Hernandez.
Moncada needs regular AB’s at AAA. Swihart needs regular starts at C at AAA and because he has options left can fill in if Leon or Vas need a DL stint.
This roster is the reason why the most DD is willing to go is 1 yr for Beltran.. If Panda and or Shaw don’t hit he can trade for help during the season.
connorreed
1. Hill will likely sign for at least three years, and probably at a higher AAV than $15 million
2. Hill will only sign somewhere he’s guaranteed a spot in the rotation. With your “plan”, Boston has Sale, Price, Hill, E-Rod, Wright, and Porcello. Are you going to put E-Rod or Wright in the bullpen?
3. Holland missed the entire season after recovering from TJS, and nobody has any idea how he’ll pitch this year
4. That’s not enough to get Sale. At the very least, it will require Bradley, Devers, Kopech or Groome, and at least one of Moncada, Benintendi, Pomeranz, or E-Rod.
5. Nobody wants Sandoval. The Red Sox would have to trade away prospects with him to get anybody to take him.
6. Please, for the love of God, learn how to spell KOPECH! Every post it’s “Korpect”. You’re not even close man!
redsox for_life
So what!!Kopech !! Happy now!!
jmi1950
Also, only Young is a free agent in 2018. A 2-5 yr aging DH will only clog a young roster with Moncada, Sam Travis, Devers, Dubon needing AB’s in 2018-19.
thetruth 2
He meant Marcell Ozuna I believe.
theo2016
could see a massive trade…
cabrera, kinsler, j.d. Martinez
for Juan lagares, wilmer flores, Lucas duda, zach wheeler, bruce, gsellmen and dom smith
Mets could still afford Fowler.
tigers get out of miggys contract, get some average players with control and a couple high upside guys.
jbravo17
I think Wilmer Flores really pushes the return over the top. Al Avila would have to be crazy to pass up a deal like that.
I mean, Lucas Duda, amirite?!
theo2016
yeah a few average players under control and some upside plays for declining assets is positive long term value. you might say get devers, kopech and dubon from the red Sox and they end up producing 0 war in the bigs. this package offers a major league floor imo.
myaccount
I don’t see it. I think that deal has far too many variables. For both teams, honestly.
A'sfaninUK
Uh no way are the Mets getting those guys without giving up 2 of the big 4 SP.
theo2016
cabreras contract offers negative surplus value, the tigers have to include something or take a decently big contract back to get anything of real consequence imo.
A'sfaninUK
But you listed none of those, except maybe Bruce?
Quit wasting peoples time here and go back to your video games. The Mets absolutely are never getting any elite MLB All-Star regulars without giving up one of the big 4.
theo2016
bruce, duda, lagares, flores is about 27 mil dollars of 2017 commitment. after that only lagares is a multi year garuntee. the package is like one high upside dsl prospect short most likely but it is very fair.
redsox for_life
Cabrera?? In NL i don’t think so!! 7 years more and 212 m plus no Dh in NL team
theo2016
you just used hr, rbi, and average to justify the Morales signing… lol.
jrwhite21
And to criticize a team who is looking to go another direction on not signing him…dude….
redsox for_life
So??
marmaduke
adshadbolt
That makes no sense from a tigers standpoint the only players worth anything in that deal smith and wheeler( if he comes back healthy) everyone else is worthless. If the tigers are gonna trade them why would the not get high value prospects because if they trade them they are committing to a rebuild so why would they take on non prospects that aren’t good.
TheMichigan
Gsellman is an alright prospect but no way Tigers take that, Bruce and Duda are just terrible contracts imo.
Flores doesn’t put this deal over the top too.
I also personally believe that Wheeler is done, I mean he will have a decent career maybe, but he will never hit his ceiling.
So I feel even with Miggys contract, he’s a decent defensive first baseman who can play in the NL but not for that haul.
theo2016
I don’t think you understand, cabreras contract actually had negative value. you aren’t getting the top end prospects prospects for him.
duda was worth 3 war in each 2014 and 2015. rebound candidate/evens first year money
lagares is a 2 war c.f. if given an every day job.
flores is a 2 war guy if given the everyday job.
Bruce is to even out some money but also offer a little upside.
wheeler is a high ceiling guy if fully healthy.
gsellmen looks like a number 5 with 6 more years of cheap control
dom smith is probably roughly a 40-60 prospect with a decent floor.
in summation it’s a high floor package that doesn’t get you the exciting prospects people think are the only way to build a team. it gets you players who provide value by playing on contracts cheaper than the market rate. AND they get out of cabreras contract, Martinez has one year left and kinsler only 2 yrs.
to the guy talking about cabrera in the n.l. he is an above average firstbasemen at least for the first few years of the deal and you can trade him to an a.l team in a few years by eating some cash if he gets to extreme value suck point of defense.
kiermaier
No team is going to take on miggy’s contract, tigers will have to pay most of it, he’s still an elite player with ton of value.
theo2016
the trade I proposed has the Mets taking the money, hence the “prospect” cost isn’t as high and a guy like Bruce included is basically to eat 13 mil.
Megadro2000
Tigers Die of laughter and hang up… JD is almost worth most of that alone
theo2016
with one year left at ~15 mil… no. no he is not. he projects for 3 war.
cubsfan2489
Dude, go away. That’s the dumbest proposal I’ve seen on here since bigpapi4ever was roaming around!
A'sfaninUK
^ LOL co-sign
God this is so dumb, the Mets are the last team that would do this. Oakland and the Rays would do this trade before the Mets would.
I cannot stand seeing trade proposals for elite veterans that do not include elite cost-controlled younger players going back. At least put Syndergaard in the deal if you think you can get Miggy and Verlander!
JT19
This deal only makes any sense for the Tigers if they are trying to retool, not rebuild. Even then, the Tigers are not nearly getting enough back to warrant throwing in J.D. (even with his pending free agency) AND Kinsler. Duda is a streaky player and Lagares is a platoon OF. Bruce essentially replaces J.D. (mitigating some of the cost) but Flores has an injury history and is not nearly as valuable as Kinsler. So the deal essentially amounts to Miggy and Kinsler for Flores (poor man’s Kinsler), Wheeler (who is basically worthless), Duda (streaky and injury history), Lagares (again platoon OF who at least fills their CF hole), Gsellman, and Smith. Despite Miggy’s contract, he’s still a good enough all-around hitter to expect him to play well for another couple of years (I say 2-4 but I wouldn’t be surprised if he plays similarily to David Ortiz’s final years). If the Tigers are looking to retool, then sure, this might be a plausible trade idea. If they’re looking to rebuild, then the Mets would need to insert more prospects or at least one of Thor/Matz/deGrom (probably Matz though) while also removing probably Duda, Bruce, and J.D. from the deal.
theo2016
lagares isn’t a platoon outfielder. his defense makes up for his bat. he is a league average full time c.f..
streaky really doesn’t matter. as long as the cummulative is good it doesn’t matter the grouping.
wheeler is not basically worthless, but theoretically he might be better in the bullpen now as a high k reliever, he will also only make like a mil to see.
jackstigers 2
You’re a Mets fan, aren’t you? This is a horrible trade suggestion and I can’t for the life of me figure out why you are defending it so much. You’ve essentially made a list of the players you don’t really want and the players who are already at those positions, and decided you’re going acquire MVP caliber talent for them. Would you accept DeGrom, Matz, and Thor for Zimmermann, Gose, McCann, Joe Jimenez, Dixon Machado, and Derek Hill? No, because that’s insane, yet you’ve come up with the same trade, just from the Mets point of view.
theo2016
cubs fan… I just understand major league players hold more value than prospects. what mvp caliber talent? you have guys on the wrong side of 30, there is no improving in that group only decline.
jackstigers 2
All you’ve done is prove that you DONT understand the value of major league players. Have you noticed that many people have said that your proposal is insane, yet not a single person has agreed? Do you think that’s coincidence?
alproof
You’re out of your mind.
takeyourbase
No disrespect but that seems like a junk return for 3 major stars. I would think any team would need to give up the farm for a trade like that. No way a single team gets those 3 players by themselves.
theo2016
See this is wrong way of thinking about value, any team would be taking on 270 mil dollars of future committments. money matters people. also, look at jd martinez, his defense eats away at his offensive value, certainly not a star. very soon cabreras contract looks like pujols and people will be clamoring about how bad it is and yet still think he is worth elite prospects now… this is why people are shortsighted.
JT19
So on that theory, Mets should package Wright, Thor, deGrom together and send them to some team who can send back expiring contracts…you know, because future committments. Or using your tag “theo2016” I’ll assume your a Cubs fans…so the Cubs should package Heyward and Lester and send them for expiring contracts. This trade literally makes no sense. Teams don’t want a “high floor” if it means acquiring pending free agents or streaky players when they are giving up their best hitters. And if Lagares was as valuable as you claim, why would the Mets trade him (THE GUY ISN’T EVEN IN THEIR OUTFIELD DISCUSSION BECAUSE OF HOW PACKED IT IS) and yes, teams care about streakiness. Why would any team want to field a guy who is hot one day and ice cold the next month when they could just try to find a guy who, you know, is a little more consistent? If teams want a streaky player, hell they should sign me. I could probably play well for one game and then absolutely suck the next month, but hey, as long as I play respectable D, I’m valuable right?
mp7ski
Theo2016…………You’re kidding right???… JDs defense hurts his value???… lmao. Obviously haven’t done your research or watched him play. He is one of the best defensive RFs in the game. Has a cannon for an arm and is rated among the best in range statistics. Many media outlets wrote about how he was robbed in 2015 for not being named a gold glove finalist and many actually thought he should have won it. Ranked at the top in assists, range submetrics, and fielding % for RF. Seriously… can’t believe you just said that… it actually helps his value… a lot. What hurts his value is that he’ll be a rental since he’s eligible for FA after the coming season… not his defense… smh
theo2016
he was -20 runs on defense last year… to the other guy you realize Ben zobrist is a streaky hitter too, but at the end of the day the hot streaks out weigh the cold, hence how they finish the year as above average hitters.
ccater40
hahahahaha this gave me a good laugh hahaha
jligenza708
Are you crazy hell no
ahtigers
Don’t see much reason for det to do that I don’t think they want to just give miggy away
ahtigers
I don’t think they are trying to trade him either and they could get a better return on jd and kinsler separate imo
theo2016
sure you can, but then no one is taking miggy without eating significant money and that defeats the purpose…
connorreed
Some corrections on your evaluations of this Mets package:
Lucas Duda being a “bounceback” candidate is another way of saying “also a good chance he really sucks again”
Juan Lagares was pretty much given an everyday job in 2015, and he produced a 0.6 WAR.
Wilmer Flores is an awful defender. He’s produced a WAR of 0.7 over 345 major league games. At best, he’s a 1.0 WAR guy.
Jay Bruce is a replacement player, at best. He’s declining, too. And since 2014, in 441 games, he’s produced a 0.2 WAR.
Zack Wheeler is 26 now. Zack Wheeler has pitched a grand total of one inning of professional baseball in the past 25 months.
Dominic Smith is a low ceiling prospect as well, with a lot of question marks. And he’s a 70-90 prospect, not a 40-60 prospect.
So in summary, you think the Tigers should trade three players worth a WAR of 12.8 last season for four players who will likely give the Tigers a total of 2.5 WAR, plus the always injured Zack Wheeler, a 6th starter, and a decent prospect…
————————————————
And also, why are you so insistent that Miguel Cabrera has negative value? Of course, his contract is not a great one. But there’s no sign that says he’s going to be worthless anytime soon. In fact, he’s still among the best hitters in the American League. Cabrera is 34 next season. And you can point to Pujols and try to use it as evidence, but I can also point to David Ortiz (40 years old), Carlos Beltran (39 years old), Nelson Cruz (36 years old), Adrian Beltre (37 years old), Ben Zobrist (35 years old), and Curtis Granderson (35 years old) as proof that not all guys become worthless when they get to their late 30’s.
————————————-
It makes no sense to trade Miguel Cabrera to a NL team given his contract. He has seven years remaining, and he’s already a slightly below average defender at first-base.
—————————————
What in the world makes you think Mets ownership would want Cabrera? In the past decade, there have been 52 free agents signed for 5+ year deals. Not one has been with the Mets. They don’t like long contracts, and they’re also stuck with $67 million owed to Wright over the next four years. They couldn’t muster enough money to re-sign Murphy last season – how are they going to afford $212 million over the next seven years?
theo2016
ok so much wrong here, lagares was playing through a fuked up shoulder all of 2015.
flores is 25 and projects for 2 war next year despite his defense, go ahead Google steamer projections.
I said Bruce was just to eat money. period. but he has been good before hence a little upside.
in regards to wheeler do you remember Jameson tallion missing 3 years and being good this year?
you can’t reasonably expect repeat performances from cabrera, martinez, and kinsler, at the very least they will lose one war.
the package the tigers would get I would say is a 5 war, with upside of being worth 10 just this next year. add in 20 mil of cost savings this year alone.
lastly to prove your point of aging you list 35 year olds… I said cabrera is likely to remain excellent for a few years, but he is signed through age 41 for over 30 mil a year. beltran wasn’t all that valuable last year by the way. the one example is ortiz, but even he had bad years after 35….
thetruth 2
A backup OF who can’t hit, another backup player, a RF who can’t play defense and is declining in his contract year, a low ceiling prospect, and a guy who didn’t picth for years for a good 2B with 2 years of control at a bargain price, arguably the best hitter in the game bad contract or not and a very good RF in a contract year. The Tigers can do SO MUCH better that it’s not even funny. This is a horrible offer.
giants51
Bosox need to focus on pitching….. Fill a pen that can help you win a championship…..???
jrwhite21
Agreed. I’m upset they’re not bringing Ziegler back
dwilson10
I wonder if the O’s could look to trade with the A’s. The deal would be made around Britton on the O’s side. Maybe Britton, Reyes, and Walker for Gray and Doolittle?
A'sfaninUK
A’s won’t move Gray unless it’s a premium package coming back, and no one’s offering that. Better off to see him go back to normal for a year then trade him next year.
markmc1235
Why would the A’ s make a trade cerntered around Britton who has 2 years of control left? How does gray and Doolittle for Britton even make a little sense? I could see them trying to get Britton if they were close to being a playoff team I suppose.
davidcoonce74
Why would being a playoff team matter if you were trying to trade for Britton? He clearly can’t pitch in the playoffs, right? I mean, his own manager valued Ubaldo Jiminez higher than him in high-leverage post-season situations.
JT19
Or perhaps Buck Showalter is an idiot? The guy had the .54 ERA over 67 IP. Only an idiot would use a sub 1.00 ERA pitcher that much in the regular season but never in the postseason (barring injury). Also, the only time Britton even pitched in the playoffs was back in 2014, no manager is having postseason trust issues of his closer two years later (let alone leave him as is his closer for two years if he had trust issues).
theo2016
e.r.a is a terrible evaluator for relievers since inherited runners don’t count against them.
JT19
His FIP was still a very good 1.94
theo2016
a’s are still rebuilding. no need for a closer.
A'sfaninUK
They have Madson, Doolittle and Axford and also Dull who has closer stuff.
lol
theo2016
none of those guys are on brittons level….
arc89
Britton may be better but why would a team in last place trade their best assets for a closer? The A’s want good young prospects that are for the future.
theo2016
that’s what I said dude. no need for a closer.
JT19
While Britton is amazingly good, it doesn’t warrant giving up Gray. While Doolittle is no Britton, he’s still a respectable closer. A’s aren’t going to give up a good closer and their best starting pitcher just to get a better closer. Getting a better closer won’t mean much if the A’s don’t have the pitching to get to him anyway.
phillies012tg
Sonny gray to the cubs for Soler, happ, underwood, And zagunis ? Maybe add someone like Edwards or stinnet? Or is that to much for gray coming off his bad year? I feel like Oakland will have to get back a huge haul for him. Maybe even throw in Doolittle with gray?
JT19
A’s aren’t selling low on Gray. And if the A’s did throw in Doolittle, the Cubs would need to throw back more. Carl Edwards would definitely need to be thrown in. Probably also Montgomery.
pd14athletics
I can definitely see Gray going to Cubs. But a year from now, after Gray has rebuilt has value and Cubs are facing likely departure of Arrieta to FA and balking at his asking price.
cubsfan2489
Way to much considering the year he just had. If you’re looking at a potential trade right now, Edwards and Happ aren’t in that conversation. Montgomery wouldn’t be either.
JT19
Agreed, but that’s why the A’s wouldn’t trade him at his lowest value. They’d at least wait for his value to get back up. At a relatively high value, Gray would cost the Cubs probably Soler, one of Edwards/Montgomery (and possibly both if Gray pitches like his old self), plus other prospects. Seems high, but that would be his price if he plays to his pre-2016 stats and trading for a Win-Now piece always costs more.
A'sfaninUK
I think the A’s and Cubs match up extremely well in a trade, but unless the Cubs are willing to view Gray like 2016 didn’t happen, Beane won’t trade him. Better off to wait until at least the 2017 deadline to show everyone he’s back to normal.
If 2016 didn’t happen for Gray (please read that part) I’d say Gray+Doolittle for Soler, Baez, Happ, Hendricks, La Stella & Underwood is a nice deal for the win-now Cubs and rebuilding A’s. But sadly 2016 did happen for Sonny, and that package looks absurd now.
cubsfan2489
Baez and Hendricks are not going anywhere anytime soon. Take those two out and you’d still have enough for that deal. But, those two specifically are not going anywhere other than the Wrigley home clubhouse for years to come. Especially after the postseason those two had!
connorreed
No disrespect meant, but I still think that package looks a little absurd even if 2016 didn’t happen for Gray. Note that even before his implosion this season, there were a lot of doubts about his 2015 campaign. He out pitched all his peripherals by a huge margin,
Hendricks is just as good as Gray and has an extra year of control.
I think 2016 and beyond Hendricks has more value than 2015 and beyond Sonny Gray, but even if you just consider that a wash, that leaves Soler, Happ, Baez, La Stella, and Underwood for Doolittle.
Why would the Cubs give up:
– a 23 year old (with 5 years of control left) who posted a 3+ WAR and is still improving
– a Top 50 Prospect (who they’re very high on)
– a 24 year old who has posted great numbers in the past, and even now, is at least a replacement-level player
– a very solid bench player with four years of control left
– a former top prospect who’s struggled with control problems and injuries lately but is still only 22
…for three years of Sean Doolittle?
Makes even less sense when you consider the current reliever market. Granted, not all are as good as Doolittle, but there are some who are (Chapman, Jansen, Melancon), a few bounceback candidates who have posted those numbers recently (Rodney, Casilla, Romo, Holland), and a bunch of guys who will likely be excellent relievers next season (Uehara, Ziegler, Blevins, Blanton, Belise, Salas, Torres, etc.), not to mention other potential trade candidates (Robertson, Colome, Miller, Britton).
thetruth 2
Hendricks is better than Gray though.. Gray’s peripherals never matched his ERA
davidn17
Verlander/Kinsler to LAD for Urias prospects. #DropTheMic
A'sfaninUK
I can dig this, how many prospects though?
JT19
I think the idea is good, just can’t imagine LA trading Urias except for a younger, controllable ace.
kbarr888
LA is not trading Urias….He’s an Elite Prospect. They have said that repeatedly. I doubt they trade guys like Micah Johnson, Austin Barnes, or Verdugo. They are the Future stars in LA (potentially)
I agree that they chase someone younger and probably less expensive ($106 million over the next 4 years…?????….)……than Verlander.
They might consider trading DeLeon, who has similar talent, but not the tremendous upside. They also have Montas and Holmes……..but they probably wouldn’t trade all 3.
Puig & Trayce Thompson are certainly available, too……. and keep your eyes open for Willie Calhoun and Kyle Farmer to be available as secondary additions to sweeten a trade.
kbarr888
admittedly, the 4th year for Verlander is a vesting option that may not happen…….
JT19
I didn’t say that LA would trade Urias. I said I can’t imagine them trading him except for an ace that is young and controllable. Urias can fill that role too but he’s still probably a year or two away from being a true ace.
phillies012tg
The dodgers don’t have montas or holmes….
bobbleheadguru
The price tag for JV or Miggy will be sky high.
Both are like tourist attractions on their own.
Tigers still have huge ratings and large attendance numbers for a mid-market team.
People travel large distances to see them.
Performing to their contract is only a piece of their value… the marketing aspect for Detroit should not be underestimated.
A'sfaninUK
This. I honestly don’t think either will be traded but its nice to figure out what their value is.
JD, Kinsler, and everyone else not making the minimum on that team though….
vvadnala
I agree that JV and Miggy aren’t going anywhere. However I see the Dodgers as a good fit for Kinsler (or even JD). Something around Willie Calhoun and Trayce Thompson as a return, perhaps?
theo2016
verlander sure, his contract is so much better than miggys though that he actually has surplus value and their is a lack of pitching.
miggy is different, tigers fans will be bitching in a few years about a pujols like contract.
User 4245925809
I wouldn’t call 90m owed to a 34yo pitcher over the next 3 seasons a good contract who pitched poorly just 1 season ago.
Think Avilla may be using him (verlander) front and cent as the one bad contract he has which *might* bring back something to help rebuild his team, but think also he will be limited there also. JD has just 1 season left. VMart is limited to DH and Miggy’s contract is just awful.
kbarr888
just to clarify……..Verlander is at $84 million over the next 3 years, then a vesting option possible after 2019, that adds an additional $22 million for a grand total of $106 million……..
JT19
How do you know Miggy is going to regress to Pujols level? Miggy isn’t purely a power bat. THE GUY WON A FRICKIN TRIPLE CROWN which means he’s an all around hitter and has been the past few years. Even if he falls off his triple crown-caliber production, doesn’t mean his production will just completely fall off (David Ortiz, anyone?).
theo2016
pujols hit over .300 like 8 times. just this last year cabrera was worth -10! baseruns so it’s already starting. come back in 3 years and realize age related decline is a thing. I don’t think he will fall off a map but paying 32 mil for a 2 war player every year is not a plus.
justacubsfan
Lol theo2016, better stick to MLB the show 16, actually those trades don’t work in that game either… there’s no way the tigers trade kinsler for anything short of a stud prospect. Still think miggy would require multiple prospects maybe 1 top 100. Same with Verlander. Tigers aren’t just trying to give away a stud for salary relief. Realistically, there’s only a handful of teams with that capability anyway. The mets are not one.
theo2016
verlander wasn’t in the deal. kinsler was. I will literally bet if cabrera is traded the tigers eat at least 40 mil or get back nothing but organizational fodder in return.
Mr Pike
About the Cabrera contract. $210 million over 7 years seems like a lot at first glance. However, the qualifying offer currently is $17..2 million That’s $120 million. It is only going up every year, and by a lot.
Consider not only the additional productivity you’d get from Cabrera over a qualifying offer player but also the additional revenue. Attendance, tv revenue, merchandise, playoff possibilities. The example he sets in the clubhouse and mentoring of young players is well documented and has value..
If he goes anywhere it will be to a seriously contending team with young players and the return will be a lot.
theo2016
he’s overweight and got a dui the morning before a clinching game like 3 years ago… the example he sets…
dirtybird
Theo2016, you are trying to justify trading scrubs and injured players for a generational talent, and 2 all stars.
Cabrera was pulled over in February 2011 before spring training not the morning before a game.
jackstigers 2
You’ve lost what little credibility you may have had left with this comment. Please educate yourself on the facts and show yourself out.