In a stunning development, the Cubs have acquired lefty Jose Quintana from the crosstown rival White Sox, per club announcements. Top prospects Eloy Jimenez and Dylan Cease are going in return, with first baseman Matt Rose and infielder Bryant Flete also included in the package.
On its face, the deal is rather a straightforward one: The defending champion Cubs needed starting pitching, with a controllable arm making obvious sense. And the White Sox have marketed Quintana since last fall, holding out for a big prospect return.
But that hardly accounts for the true drama inherent in this transaction. There has been chatter of late as to whether the two Chicago stalwarts would do business with each other; clearly, any such questions have been answered.
The scuffling Cubs have said the main focus is on internal improvements, but have now acted forcefully in advance of the deadline. As for the White Sox, they now possess a bevy of elite prospects after swinging yet another significant trade. And those wondering about Quintana’s trade value now have their answer as well.
This time last year, the Cubs were lining up another deal that sent out an elite prospect (Gleyber Torres, in the Aroldis Chapman deal) in hopes of spurring a World Series run. This time, though, the piece coming back isn’t a rental. Quintana is just 28 years old and will remain under the Cubs’ control through 2020. His extension includes a $8.85MM guarantee for 2018 and successive options ($10.5MM and $11MM, respectively) for the ensuing two years. In addition to bolstering the Cubs’ staff now, Quintana will also help cover the organization as starters Jake Arrieta, John Lackey, and Brett Anderson reach free agency after the season.
Quintana has not been quite at his best in 2017, with a 4.49 ERA over 104 1/3 innings thus far. But most indicators suggest he has mostly been his usual self, and his recent good form helps support that view. Quintana owns a 15.5% K%-BB% mark on the year, just as he has in recent years while consistently posting low-3 ERAs. And he has racked up 45 strikeouts with a 2.70 ERA over his last forty innings.
The deeper history is yet more promising, of course. Since landing with the South Siders as an utterly unheralded free agent, he has done nothing but produce results. Quintana carried a 3.41 lifetime ERA entering the 2017 season and has not missed a start over the past five seasons. With the contract control baked in, Dave Cameron of Fangraphs just ranked Quintana the 42nd most valuable trade asset in the game.
Understandably, then, the Cubs paid a hefty price to draw the southpaw up town. Jimenez, clearly, is the headliner. A consensus top-ten prospect leaguewide, the twenty-year-old corner outfielder is viewed as a future middle-of-the-order bat. He has impressed thus far in his first attempt at the High-A level, posting a .271/.351/.490 batting line with eight home runs over 174 plate appearances.
The package doesn’t end there, though. Cease is also generally valued as one of the game’s hundred best pre-MLB players, making him arguably the Cubs’ second-best overall prospect and most promising young hurler. While he’s seen as something of a risky asset, given his injury history and relative lack of polish, Cease is tabbed with top-line upside. He carries a 2.79 ERA with 12.9 K/9 against 4.5 BB/9 at the Class A level.
Rose and Flete aren’t without their interest, either, though neither registers as a significant prospect at this stage. The former is a corner infielder who has slashed .227/.281/.481 with 14 long balls through 254 plate appearances this year as a teammate of Jimenez at Myrtle Beach. The 24-year-old Flete has also played there, putting up the best season (.305/.355/.425) thus far in his minors career while playing all over the diamond (including at shortstop).
The move leaves quite a few other teams still looking for controllable starters, with one key asset now off the market. Sonny Gray of the Athletics is perhaps the clearest alternative trade candidate, while quality arms such as Gerrit Cole, Michael Fulmer, and Chris Archer do not appear to be as readily available. Organizations such as the Yankees, Brewers, Twins, and Astros will be looking hard at those and other possibilities over the next two-and-a-half weeks. Today’s big intra-city swap sets an important market marker for those talks.
Wow!!!
My thoughts exactly!
Good to see the White Sox get a fair deal for Quintana. He’s been great and now the White Sox could be in a great position later on.
Cubs also get exactly what they need right now and this could very well spark a turnaround for the team. Making this move over the All-star break is genius.
Just how stacked is the ChiSox farm system? The best in MLB? Could trading Frazier, Melky, Garcia, Robertson make it deeper still? WS in 2012?
2021
I wonder if the Nationals could have traded Robles, Fedde and Kieboom or soto to the whitesox for Quintana and Robertson
double Wow!!
You can’t triple stamp a double stamp! You can’t triple stamp a double stamp! Lloyd! Lloyd! You can’t triple stamp a double stamp!
Still my favorite movie of all time. Well said!
triple wow…cubs got a great dealio
This impacts the cubs in the future more than now. Hard to say this makes them compete with the NL field this season.
SHOUT OUT!!!! To dodgerfan711 for saying Quintana would not bring back one top 50 prospect…..and billy and the yankees fans. How do you like them apples? Ohhhh and Moncada, Jimenez, Kopech and Roberts are all untouchable :p
NO WAY!!! would Theo trade Eloy Jimenez. Jimenez is untouchable! Especially for a number 3 starter like Quintana. LOL (Cubs fans before the trade).
Good trade for both teams. Cubs get a solid pitcher under control. As for my Sox. Luv it. IMO it’s a better trade then…. Getting Frazier,Mateo and Adams. From the Yankees. Mateo may be a better prospect then Cease but Eloy Jimenez is a way better Prospect then Frazier. But only time will tell.
Huge return! Cubs farm system is now depleted!
Just stupid.
Another 108 year wait. Start the clock.
Lol the Cubs are still an amazing team and have Quintana for two years after 2016. They’ll be fine.
three years after this year.
Exactly, prospects don’t win titles, MLB players do.
You and I have different definitions of amazing lol
The Cubs won with some “prospects”
Quintana is the most overrated starting pitcher in my memory and the Cubs don’t need him, their problem is their lineup.
Good call. I’m sure if you said a few years ago that the Cubs shouldn’t care about Bryant, Russell, Schwarber, Hendricks, Contreras, etc. and instead should get Pablo Sandoval, R.A. Dickey, J.D Drew, and Brett Gardner cuz they are MLB players, I’ll bet the Cubs don’t win the W.S and their future looks very bad…Prospects definitely matter
Ans all their best players still have 2+ years of team controle, they will win more ws in that time
Their lineup isn’t hitting because they know that they have to score d @ mn near 5 runs, in order to win almost every game, day-in and day-out.
That gets discouraging and demoralizing. They need to have faith in their pitcher. This boosts their confidence. I say this as someone who played.
One more solid starter, and they’re right back on track. You watch, the hitting will now start to pick up.
Yeah if you said a few years before that that it was good that they held onto Brett Jackson, Josh Vitters, Hayden Simpson, Ryan Harvey, and Felix Pie instead of turning them into viable major league talent also. If you can cherry pick, so can I.
“That gets discouraging and demoralizing. They need to have faith in their pitcher. This boosts their confidence. I say this as someone who played.”
This is exactly backwards. Lineups typically get lazy as you load up the rotation and pen with stoppers.
The best thing that happened to the Nats is their pitching problems. That lineup wants the umpire to call the game as soon as the Nats have five runs and the lead.
Lazy breeds lazy.
All this did was keep the Cubs exactly where they are. And it’s hurting their future. I think that was a dumb trade on the Cubs part. Even if the guy is controllable for x amount of years. His performance this year has only been mediocre . And that fits perfectly with the cubs. Mediocre
Don’t forget Corey Patterson, Hee Seop Choi, Bobby Hill…
@Casey’s Partner – he’s overrated to you because you still look at W/L record as a determining factor in a pitcher’s value.
They have him for 3 and a half years. Lester, Arrieta, Hendricks now Quintana thats scary in the playoffs. Yes I know jake isn’t himself. But he’ll be just fine.
“you still look at W/L record as a determining factor in a pitcher’s value.”
No I don’t.
Try again.
Yeah not all prospects work out. I think that’s obvious. Just like when the Cubs went all in in 2007/2008 and signed a ton of MLB talent and got nothing but 2 division titles and then stuck with these lengthy contracts that were hard to move cuz of course MLB players with a good track record come with a much heftier price and commitment then a top prospect who may in fact put up similar numbers for next to nothing. You can make the argument either way but in the end, most of the top MLB players today were once prospects
Lol no. The starting pitching has been dreadful this year
lester is aging, arrieta is regressing, Quintana is not going to scare the opposition. you also still need to hit
All of those prospects you’ve named are now in the MLB, you don’t need to continue to replenish prospects once they become established MLB players. Prospects matter but, our prospects that you listed have been working out pretty nicely, it’s time to move on to acquire pitching to match those young players, All of our position players are under 30 years old except Zobrist and Jay, I think we’ll be fine with this trade.
The problem with the logic of your last sentence is that while it is technically true, it is misleading. Yes, all top MLB players were once prospects, but not all prospects become MLB players. The key is guessing correctly (and yes it is just a guess, albeit an educated one) which prospects to keep and which to trade away.
Lol, you hit the nail on the head!
So, which prospects, aside from Russell and Schwarber would you say are not producing. I get your logic, not all prospects pan out and it’s hard to judge based on last year who will falter and who will pan out. However, Russell struggled in the first half last year then was an RBI machine in the second half. The Cubs as a whole are not performing to their ability but, I’m not writing off all these players who played like World Series Champions last year because of a down year or a WS hangover if you will.
Felix Pie…forgot all about that dude. Thanks for the chuckle
Prospects are trading chips. Quintana is a proven player. That said, the Cubs need more than just another starting pitcher.
Are you seriously worried about the Cubs’ “lineup” more than their pitching? Rizzo, Bryant, Baez, Russell, Contreras, Happ, etc. are all tied to team controlled contracts for the foreseeable future. They just traded a great 21 year old prospect and a good 20 year old pitcher with a history of injuries for a guy they can slide firmly into their rotation for the next 3.5 years.
This on a team that is going to lose two starters and their closer to FA next year.
Where would you propose they find a comparable pitcher to put in their rotation over the next 3.5 years and at what price? Free agency? Here are the top 4 Free Agent pitchers available next year as of May per this very web site – Jake Arrieta (he’s going to leave the Cubs), Darvish (injury history), Cueto and Tanaka. You could look at Pineda I guess. But again, at what cost in Free Agency? – A: More than they’ll have to pay Quintana. That has value.
Problem is not the lineup. Its the 4.66 starting rotation ERA. Did you notice the two blowouts against the Cubs last week?
Coming to the NL his Era will get better
They won with MLB players. Do you not understand that minor league players do not play in MLB?
They dont matter in a playoff race to MLB front office personnel – you know, the people who know more than you?
“prospects dont win titles”
so dumb. how do you think the Cubs won?
in no universe are any of those prospects comparable to bryant/rizzo/schwarber/Russell/etc as prospects.
not all free agents work out. follow the top 15 free agent signings and the top 15 prospects.
the prospects out perfoem the free agents and at 1/30th the cost
“you dont need to replenish your prospects”
lol okay. howd that work out in philly vs Boston (who replenished)?
Bottom line is that teams need both young talent and vets. Why do people think that it has to be one or the other?
He was not the first to cherry pick, it was the troll who always bashes prospects who all normal people recognize as being important to organizations beyond just their trade value.
The 2016 stats prove your opinion blatantly false.
The Cubs led the league in team ERA, and scored the 3rd most runs.
What was Jake Arrietas performance 3 years before he won the Cy Young with the Cubs?
No way the Cubs win without Chapman, Lester, Fowler, and Zobrist … all veteran additions
My fear is Arrieta IS being himself now
Yes and you still need to pitch
This is legitimately the most bizarre argument I’ve ever read, and I’ve read some real doozies.
Would’ve been scary last year… regression has taken place and it’s not as scary as it sounds by names
haaaaa good one..
this is a stunner
Quit being thick. Quintana over the past 4 years has posted the 7th best WAR of any starting pitcher in the game. He’s under a reasonable team controlled contract through 2020. He eats a ton of innings. And he does it with solid stats. Every single one of those things helps dictate the market price for him. And do not under estimate the contract terms when thinking value.
What would the Cubs have to pay in free agency for a comparable player? How does that impact their ability to further build out the roster over the next 2-3 years when they are clearly in contend for it all mode? Keep in mind they are going to lose two pitchers in free agency this winter. Find me a better, cost controlled, asset than Quintana to slide into your rotation for the next 3.5 seasons. Good luck.
Your definition of an “Ace” is also absurd. By your standards an Ace is Kershaw. And, to be clear, Kershaw would cost you a ton more than a great 20 year old prospect playing at A+ ball and a good 21 year old prospect with a history of injury problems.
And spare all of us the 108 year drought hyperbole. Every team in baseball has a longer WS drought than the Cubs right now. So something tells me the front office has earned more than a few stripes in managing rosters.
Very well said! The best, most articulate comment on this thread.
Finally someone who understands how baseball works.
Exactly! Most rumors claimed it would cost someone off the 25 man roster, Baez, Happ, Russell, Schwarber, Almora etc… to get a proven, cost controlled pitcher. Q, Gray, Fulmer, Archer etc… Neither Jimenez nor Cease have even been tested above High A. High bust probability for prospects that haven’t even proven themselves at AA. Another great trade by Theo
Really? I’m sure you were one of the many claiming they were both future superstars before this trade. Now that they’re gone, they’re just prospects with a high bust probability. Why do people have to do crap like this after every trade?
Sure seems like an overpay. After winning last year, i would have thought the Cubs would have demonstrated more restraint. Perhaps they’ve lost some enthusiasm for Jimenez?
No they have not lost enthusiasm for Jimenez. Get real. They love him but that was the PRICE you pay. You have to trade someone GOOD not garbage. You think they lost enthusiasm and started calling around to dump Eloy or something? No. They did not want to trade him at all
This package could have got them near sale. Theo messed up big time
reason number 134 why you are not a GM — they gave value equal to what they received. GMs generally use facts when evaluating players As a sox fan i would love to say the Cubs were fleeced– but this is a good deal for both side.s.
Well put. I would’ve loved to get Candellario back as the third piece. Then we could call it a fleecing. This is great value for both sides in my opinion.
No one here is a GM. Your telling me if the cubs offered this exact package in the winter it wouldn’t have been in the ballpark for Sale? Sure it needs more but the difference between Sale and Quintanna is monumental.
No one here is a GM including you buddy. Epstein has a proven record of making mostly good decisions. And if they didn’t give up Jimenez they wouldn’t have gotten Quintana.
All of this Sale speculation is moot
When did I mention that offer would not have been in the ballpark for Sale? I tend to focus on reality– I have no idea if the Sox make this deal for Sale nor do i find it relevant. define “monumental’. This year the difference between Sale and Quintana is vast. However, looking at actual historical evidence, the gap has not been nearly as wide. Output is output — Sale strikes out a ton more guys no one debates that. Sale has way better stuff. Sale has a better chance to dominate a game. No one ever argues that. . And I understand the notion of having more confidence in output resulting from reliable action (more k’s more likely to keep era other numbers low)– especially in limited samples. However, eventually, if a guy keeps producing value at a consistent level (see Q’s fwar over previous four years), you have to stop questioning how he does it and realize he is just a valuable pitcher. I find it absurd that Sox fans have taken such a beating for overvaluing Q, then the actual trade reflects that value, and we still have to defend that Q. This is a great move for the Cubs, and could be a very good move for the Sox. Time to move on– Q has been great and the Sox got a return reflective of that.
What does this “in the ballpark” for Sale mean dummy? What would “in the ballpark”. I bet them that many teams were “in the ballpark” then.
For gods sake, it is spelled ‘Quintana’. How can you be expected to be taken seriously if you cannot even spell the guys name? Even if you are doing it as a slight, again, how do you expect anyone to take you seriously?!
Again, there is no such thing as a GM fleecing another GM. If a GM doesn’t know what he is doing, that is on him.. There is no fleecing of anyone. GM are adults, they are capable of making decisions on their own accord and in doing of their own homework. If a GM makes a bad trade that is on them. Do you notice how no GMs ever say they ‘got ‘fleeced?! Saying they got ‘fleeced’ only makes the GM look incompetent..
Are you kidding? White Sox got the number 1 and number 11 overall prospects in MLB for Sale. This is the number 8 and number 63 overall prospects and two prospects that don’t even rank, I’m pretty sure this was a pretty even deal for a 28 year old pitcher controllable through 2020, who has a 3.52 career ERA.
Meanwhile, Q and Sale have close to the same surplus value considering the extra year of control.
On whose list was Kopech the #11 prospect at time of trade?
Ok, he was ranked 30 out of MLB’s top 100 list when traded, still ranked twice as high as Cease upon trading, also I’m not too familiar with Kopech but, from what I’ve heard it’s a character issue that was hurting his stock last year. So if you really think Cubs could have received Chris Sale for this same package I don’t know what to tell you.
Not the same package but add schwarber and you might have a deal. Sale would have been an absolute game changer on the cubs. Theo should have thought it out a little more last offseason. Thats all.
Sale’s bad attitude does not fit in with the Cub way. Clubhouse cancers end up hurting the team more than their record helps.
Clubhouse cancer what he has been awesome with the Red Sox that is just an ignorant comment.
You obviously know nothing about Sale. All his teammates love him. I’m sure you’re basing it all off of the stupid uniform thing
Add Schwarber? You said this package would get Sale. Adding Schwarber is a vast difference and shows you were wrong in your assessment
Come on the Cubs picked up a known wife beater last year and are dealing with possibly another wife abuser they have the same clubhouse as anyone else as long as you win who cares.
Haha sorry dude. First of all “near sale” is not getting Sale. Next that package would not even be close for Sale. Nice try
who lines up as their best prospect now? Lange? little? candelario?
Not really 2 prospects for Chapman and 2 for for quintana. 4 players thrown in. 2 for each deal. Not a bad trade off world series champion 3+ years of Quintana.
What system ranking were these prospects: I know Jimenez & Cease were 1-2, what about the others?
RunDMC – the other two guys were not included in the Cubs’ BA Top 30.
Cubs have traded 25% of their top prospects in the past 2 years while the orioles have done nothing and the Cubs manage to have a better system than then. Eloy Jimenez is the only prospect going the other way that is not replaceable. Cease has potential but is replaceable. The other two.. replaceable easily. Why do you think the Cubs focused on college arms through the draft past few years? More advanced. Cubs system will be restocked with development
I think Theo just dumped his farm system of average minor leaguers that have been there a while and not even in AAA. I say steal for Theo. They didn’t get in return anything near what they were asking Yankees to give up for him.
Yah. You’re right. Eloy was only ranked like 40 spots higher than Frazier on Baseball Americas update, but he’s nowhere near the prospect Frazier is.
High crosstown price on that deal.
White Sox are loaded for the future. They still have a few assets in the bullpen to trade
Yes, very nice selloff.
Yea White Sox looking good. Rick Hahn doing a nice job.
And Todd Frazier, Jose Abreu and Melky Cabrera
I think they keep Abreu bc they want him as a leader for Roberts and Moncada when they come up
Out of nowhere
not really..plans go in to be processed, some quicker than others, yes. this was a quickie shocker
Nah no it won’t haha. The Cubs are still enjoying the hangover of a World Series. This team is nowhere near compared to last seasons team.
didn’t see this coming…
Lol. no one did..I am still in awe
SEE, PROSPECT HOUNDS???? MLB front offices value MLB talent over prospects 100% of the time!!! Why won’t you learn this???
Not 100% of the time
Yes, contending teams will flip any non-MLB player for the pieces they need to win. Get over yourself, hounding prospects – especially while contending – is not how MLB operates.
It isn’t how many sports operate. But young talent is extremely valuable to teams that aren’t** contending.
Actually it is. That’s why the Dodgers refused to part with Urias, Bellinger, and Seager over the last couple years. Cardinals also haven’t turned over top tier prospects to upgrade their roster in season either.
Ok so a contending team will flip prospects to for MLB players now to help them win. Non contenders do the opposite. It’s a moot point. Prospects matter just as much as MLB players. It’s a matter of circumstance
For once JAF, I agree with you
And how many WS titles do the Dodgers have over the past couple of decades?
That’s why the dodgers lost to the Cubs. Had they handed Urias for Chapman, they would likely have a ring right now.
Is that why the Mariners held on to Walker and refused to give him up in a Price trade and why the dodgers held on to pederson and seager as well and refused to include them in a Price trade?
So no, not 100% of the time. Price and Kershaw Greinke would have been elite for the dodgers.
You can find many examples where teams held onto prospects instead of dealing them in deals for MLB talent.
Because the dodgers are smart and wont trade 7 years of urias for 2 months of chapman. hindsight is 20/20 its easy now to cherrypick urias because he got hurt. how about seager, joc or bellinger? should they have traded them too
They only refused to part with them because they weren’t offered what they were looking for. EVERY prospect is trade-able, just look at any top 100 list packed with traded prospects.
Cubs gave up Torres to get Chapman. Torres can turn out to be a multiple time Allstar, but in the end the Cubs got what they wanted, a Championship. And as a fan I’m all I and would do this again in a heartbeat.
As of right now- top 100 mid season only about 1/10th of the top 100 were traded. Note, this doesnt include players who were traded and became a top prospect years later like Frances Martes who was dealt at 18 and has developed into a top prospect since being traded in 3 years.
And JAF doesn’t respond. Can the mods ban this troll? Not even funny like bigpapi4ever, just pure annoying trolling.
Every MLB star was once a prospect. Your logic is ridiculously flawed. If you dont value prospects you will never win a title. Look at every world series winner recently mabey besides boston. They had a core that was once prospects in their organization
I will second that.
Yup once in a 100 years ought to be enough!
dodger fan, I think the point is you don’t appropriately value actual valuable major leaguers.
You obviously know nothing if you think “any prospect” get flipped. Elite prospects need to be pried away. When will you learn this
not sure the yanks were that high on urias.
What am I supposed to respond to? Im not responding to every troll who hates that Im right and theyre wrong.
You dont even know what youre talking about. Moncada got traded, my point all along has been no prospect is “untouchable” like so many dummies in these threads always say.
If that’s the case 100% of the time, why did the White Sox make this trade?
Oh come on, I’m CLEARLY talking about contending teams – dont troll.
how come the Cardinals don’t do it every season? they have the prospects to trade. but they end up hurting for it in late August.
In this case, 50%
Well, one team thinks like that. The other team in this deal obviously thinks precisely the reverse.
60% of the time, it works every time.
Once again silly comment. Cubs are made up of prospects and they are dealing for the one missing piece in there mind. Learn how the game works.
Cubs are NOT “made up of prospects” they are made up of MLB players. Eloy was NOT on the Cubs, christ how can you be so determined to show how dumb you are?
If that were true the Astros and Yankees would of made a deal like this long before the Cubs got involved. The only thing that happened here is the White Sox finally found someone desperate enough to pay their ridiculous asking price.
So thanks Cubs for screwing up the trade market for everyone else.
Cubs would of been better off just taking the hangover and retool in the offseason. The Cubs were built for the long term and to trade this much talent for Quintana is short sighted.
This is how the trade market works. This is how it has always worked. 29 other teams are there to set the market. Your valuation means nothing.
Hence why it’s annoying. It’s one thing if all organization are competently run and understand value, it’s another when a team decides they want to be the New York Knicks if their respective sport.
Are you really trying to say the Cubs aren’t competently run? Man, you are clueless. I could tell from your first post, but this is just icing on the cake.
sure they are,,,they just made a desperation move, period…unless quintana is pitching 5 days a week, playing all infield positions, and hitting 1-9 this move does nothing for the cubs. the entire team is down this year. maybe they aren’t the juggernaut they were anointed to be. Although good, quintana has a lot of innings on that arm and has pitched to an era over 4 at this very moment. he doesn’t put them over the top,,they overpaid and paid for past production and what if.
BAINES03 gets it. Upvoted!
I didn’t realize the Yanks were one starter away? Wow! Houston yes, but the Yanks were one Q away from being a favorite? The Yanks are playing with house money this year and whatever they do is a bonus. When they are set with who they want to build around in the future and with the big 2019 free agent class Im sure then you will see a trade or trades for that one missing piece.
The market dictates player value not the white sox or Cubs. Cubs traded Torres and other prospects for a three month rental. Indians traded their top pitching and top hitting prospect for 1 1/2 years of a relief pitcher. I think the Cubs did very well here.
if your point is that contending teams prefer big league talent over prospects, change your name to captain obvious
So every time an MLB asset is traded for minor league assets… That proves what, exactly?
And it finally begins…
I know now we see everything else fall
Exactly. Domino effect in play. Gonna be a fun couple weeks on this site.
Nice return.
Why?????!! Not Cease!!!!!!! And Eloy!!!!!!!!
Why do you hate winning titles?
cubs arent winning any titles this year.
The Cubs problem is lack of hitting. That’s the difference from last year.
Why do teams think you can fix a lineups lack of production by acquiring pitching? This is a well proven failure yet the idea lives on.
Their pitching hasn’t been great either.
You don’t have to score as many runs if you aren’t giving up as many. That’s the logic.
That’s the “logic” but it has been proven wrong time and time again.
If you can’t hit you can’t win. That’s been true in MLB since the 1980’s.
Actually, the logic is pitching and timely hits wins the Series.
All you need is a great top 3, and clutch hitting in the playoffs to get you that ring.
“clutch hitting”
FAIL
Caseys Partner – getting Quintana is obviously an upgrade for the Cubs, they’re trying to go all in so you can’t rip the deal before any of the prospects have even played a game in the MLB.
Also if pitching and clutch hitting aren’t the recipe for World Series, then you must not have seen any of the giants 3 championships
Pitching wins championships!
Jlmini10 took the words right outta my mouth hahaha
Couldn’t have said it better.
The Cubs will be losing 2 SPS next year (Lackey and Arrieta) and Lester and Hendricks aren’t doing much this year either. 5th spot in rotation has been a carousel all year. Pitching is the definite need!
Huh??? Did you see Lester last Sunday 10 runs in the first inning, 5 earned. Have you seen Lackey pitch this year?
4 earned. Look it up.
It was in .2 innings. And didn’t he give up an “unearned” grand slam and solo shot back-to-back to end his day? Saying he only gave up “4 earned” doesn’t really make it much better.
Their pitching has been pretty bad aswell and they can still aquire a hitter. Q gives them a good #2 starter and means they don’t need to give arrieta a price/grienke contract in the offseason
No, the difference from last year is pitching.
There’s a big difference between leading the league in ERA by over half a run and being mired in the middle of the league. There’s also a big difference between leading the entire MLB in first-inning runs.
The rotation is their problem, not the lineup. Yes, they need some more clutch hitting, but their rotation is their primary issue right now and it’s only bound to get worse with two of their five starters leading for FA next year.
What are you smoking Casey? The Cubs starting staff has a 4.66 ERA. Almost 2 runs worse then last year! The got pounded for over 10 runs per game TWICE last week!
Starting pitching is the problem! That is why Theo went to work to solve it in the short term and long term
Y not Schwarber or another position player and not Cease?
Cubs really like schwarbers bat and cease is injury prone
TJ surgery is not being injury prone.
Because the Cubs are better off with Schwarber and keeping the other “nameless position players” on the team.
You dont trade good position players who won the world series and who have talent to do it again off your major league roster to keep a low A ball prospect!! That is nuts!
The bar for starting has now been set. Let the fun begin!
Wish it had been Schwarber
Schwarber probably gets them Mike Pelfrey.
I’m kidding……..kind of.
Lmao
Schwarber nearly got them michael fulmer. He could easily get another ace. Maybe not archer but sonny Gray yes. It would have to be a 3 for 1 deal.
Schwarber did NOT nearly get them Michael Fulmer. Schwarber would have been the starting point. And Jimenez/Cease would have been involved too. You’re talking about a player not only much more effective than Quintana, but also much younger, much cheaper, and controlled much longer than him. He’s probably top 15 for most valuable assets in all of baseball right now
omg, lmao, good teply!!
You wish it was Schwarber because he is struggling? That is short sightedness. When he rebounds then what will you say?
Simply…wow
That’s quite a large return. Wow!
That escalated quickly.
Brick killed a guy!
There running themselves into a deep hole and after all these guys contracts are up or they start retiring (Jon Lester) they aren’t gonna win for a while because they sold all there prospects off
their, not there
They’re*
And they’re.
Love it.
lol
Oh so they should not win now when they have the window? To save prospects to win later??? Huh? Sorry Cubs rebuild is over. Time to win
Holy mackerel! Hats off to the White Sox. Never thought Eloy would be a part of a Quintana package.
Theo giving away the farm for very little.
An ace-level pitcher in a contending year is massive.
is he an ace?
Quintana is ace level? That’s laughable. He’s a solid 2 and a great 3, but he is not and will never be an ace. A lot of his value comes from his consistency.
I would go as a
far as to say he is a solid 3 and the cubs need a 2. its tough bc there are not any solid twos out there. a bunch to 3s
No Quintana isn’t anywhere near an ACE.
Aaron Nola is a lot better than Quintana. Quintana is a solid fourth starter, an innings eater.
Your idea of ace is laughable. Its not reserved for HOFers only
he’s a very good 2 and maybe a one on a lesser team but he’s not an ace. an ace is Kershaw, sale, bum, Scherzer type guy. that said you don’t have to be an ace to be very valuable
He isn’t an ace but he is way better than a “solid 4th starter”.
Nice troll. If you seriously think Q is a #4, please list 3 teams that have three better pitchers in their rotation. Please consider all factors, not just W/L record. Q has been rated in the top 10-20 pitchers in the league for the past 2-3 years.
Aaron Nola may eventually be better, but he is not at the moment better. Quintana is not an ace, but he is a solid #2. He is far more than an innings eater based on all his metrics other than W-L record.
Aaron Nola? Come on dude lol
Hahahaha!
Lol what???
Name one team where he is the 4th starter on and remember he averages about 4.5 war per year I’ve the last 4 years name one 4th starter that can say that. By advanced pitching metrics he is a top 20 pitcher period. Is he an ace no but a very good pitcher he is a 1 on some teams and two on just about any other.
Ace? LMAO, you are something…..
Biasisrelitive- Everyone has their opinion on Quintana’s value. I share yours to the letter. Well said.
13th among active pitchers in ERA and 3 top 8 WAR finishes in an AL hitters park with terrible D behind him… yep 4th starter.
The three team are the Red Sox, Sale, Price, Porcello even though Price and Porcello aren’t having good years but both are still better than Quintana, Indians Kluber, Carrasco, Salazar all better than Quintana, Nationals Scherzer, Roark, and Strasburg so there’s your 3 teams with better pitchers than Quintana case closed.
They have Quintana for 4 years giving up 2 players that will make the ML level 3 years from now. The other two not really who they.are. This is a win for the cubs.
He is a solid #2. Not sure I’d want him for 4 years.
You’re not sure you’d want “a solid #2” for four years?
yeah, who would want a 28yo lefty solid #2 who has never missed a start for 3.5 for just over what old arm lester costs for one?
Let the games begin!!!!
This should help the Cubs get back on top of the division
One thing I love about Theo is he doesn’t screw around.
No screwing around from Theo, he has given away the farm and he threw money at Jason Heyward.
Pure genius.
Look where they were 5 years ago and what happened last year with all the young talent on that roster. He is doing just fine. -Sox fan btw
He also won a Championship last year.. So maybe not so dumb he isn’t..
Would have won without Chapman for sure and without Heyward.
Heyward is more forgivable than draining the farm, though that kind of money for Heyward really causes deep pain.
I think the Chapman get was what put them over the top I don’t think they win last year without him they were having issues with bullpen before he arrived.
Theo has won, what, 3 championships? If that isn’t good enough for you, maybe try a new hobby.
And put together a team to win the World Series after 108 years. …pure genius is correct
Anonymous Internet Commenter Doesn’t Realize He’s a Troll
Caseys Partner, village idiot at MLBTradeRumors, has come out swinging, mocking the “genius” of Theo Epstein, President of the Chicago Cubs.
Epstein, 42, recently ended the Lovable Losers’ 108 year championship drought, the longest in professional sports, only 4 years after taking the reins of the hopeless club. He had previously ended the second longest championship drought in professional sports, as General Manager of the Boston Red Sox, where he was the youngest GM in the history of the game and eventually won 2 MLB World Series before leaving for the Cubs.
Caseys Partner, citing strategic trades of prospects, players who never fail to reach their potential, and one free agent deal that he has strong opinions about as evidence to stand up against Epstein’s 3 World Series Rings.
“The Cubs would have won without Chapman. They would have won without Heyward. I don’t understand what Epstein is thinking,” Caseys Partner added when we reached out for comment, “I mean seriously. Who needs a cost-controlled top-of-the-rotation starter when you can have prospects. Quintana is over-rated. He’ll provide no value to this club. Single-A Prospects – they’re the ones who hold the most value.”
Caseys Parter declined a full interview, citing his busy day of showing people on internet forums how dumb they are. “I’d really love to, but I still have to go on Facebook and prove people wrong about Zuckerberg. I mean, ads on Facebook? Seriously? You can’t make money if Facebook isn’t cool, and ads are not cool. Seriously. Ads. Pure Genius.”
This is cruel and probably against the rules, but I laughed.
Hopefully, people will read this far. May the upvotes be yours.
The Red Sox World Series drought was the third-longest at the time of the 2004 win, not the second-longest.
But other than that, kudos.
Best. Post. Ever. I literally lol.
And this is my why my journalism career begins and ends anonymously in internet forums. haha
Who was longer other then the Cubs?
White Sox. White Sox last World Series title had been in 1917 until they won in 2005.
Very good forgot about that.
Hahahaha gold!!
Yes pure genius from the best baseball executive in baseball who is heading to the hall of fame and already has 3 rings
First questionable move (imo) by Theo and Co. I don’t know if Quintana is worth that haul. If we’re back in 1st place by end of the summer, then maybe.
Reeks alike a desperation move, but they can afford to do it. He’s a controllable top of the rotation pitcher
I agree with you completely, right now this move is very questionable
What is questionable? What is desperate? The Cubs land Q for FOUR pennant races now!! That is FOUR and all in his prime years!
You don’t get solid starting pitching without paying. This isn’t a short term rental. There will be many drafts between now and when the Cubs have to worry. I’m betting a Schwarber deal is next followed by a huge push at signing Otani.
Even if Otani is available this offseason, the Cubs won’t be in a position to sign him. The max they can spend on international signings is $300,000.
The Cubs can sign Otani if he is posted. The international rules do not apply
Wrong. The new CBA says otherwise. They rose the player age from 23 to 25, so if Otani does post this offseason, the Cubs can’t sign him for more than $300,000. Look it up.
“First questionable move (imo) by Theo”
Jason Heyward waves hello.
So does DJ LeMahieu
Joe wins. I have and will always consider the Ian Stewart trade to be Theo’s first mistake (and first trade in general).
Ha, that’s fair I suppose. Defense wins games though. And J-Hey gives you plenty of that. His bat is coming back around. Would I have given him the crazy amount $ they gave him? Probably not. But then I again, I drive a Toyota, what do I know?
Edwin Jackson???
Players from A ball are no guarantee to make the bigs. I personally believe that the White Sox should have been looking for talent closer to the Majors, No less than AA talent.. I consider this a win for the Cubs. Not a single sure thing for a valuable pitcher.
“Eloy is UNTOUCHABLE” – an utterly clueless fan who doesn’t understand how MLB operates.
Or they weren’t paying attention was Sale was traded
Not surprised to see Cubs get a starter
Lackey is long relief now
Based off of how Joe generally operates, I would imagine Lackey stays in the rotation and Montgomery goes back to the bullpen. I would rather get rid of Lackey, but this is just how I see it actually playing out.
Very happy my Yankees didn’t get him and trade away Torres or Frazier, Cashman is smart and knows not to trade away our future this makes me incredibly happy congratulations Cubs.
You say that now, but Sonny Gray will be suiting up for you and Frazier will be in Oakland by the end of the month, lol
Sorry buddy Frazier isn’t going anywhere not going to happen if the Yankees didnt trade him for Quintana they arent trading him for Gray get a clue.
I would have taken Frazier and more to get Quintana so Frazier and a little less can still get moved for Gray and maybe even Alonso
Funniest post of the day! Gray cost went up not down since he is by far the top starter on the market. Got to love Yank fans who think you can get quality players by giving up nothing for them.
We don’t know enough about what starters are truly available to flat out call Gray the top starter on the market. With Gray’s injury issues I sincerely doubt that he nets a comparable price to Quintana. Gray also has one less year of control than Quintana.
If you read who is on the trading block Gray is now the top starter mentioned. Yanks would need to give up Frazier in the deal to get Gray. Whatever teams feel Gray is worth the A’s are not selling low budget on him for a few mid level prospects. Baseball is all about supply and demand in the trade market. There are many back of rotation starters available to pick up if a team wants to budget shop.
No kidding – was on a post where a Yankee fan thought Ellsbury for Cueto was a good trade for the Giants. Delusional.
Again Frazier is not being traded for anyone and if that means we dont get a big name player than I am fine with that, Cashman didnt want to trade Frazier and others for Sale and Quintana so what makes you think hes going to now all of a sudden turn around and trade these guys for a pitcher who’s not even close to as good as Sale not happening keep dreaming we aren’t gutting our farm and future stars for absolute over the hill garbage.
This clown again. “I’m very happy my Yankees didn’t get a great pitcher for minor leaguers.”
Classic delusional NY stupidity
Quintana is not a great pitcher you are the clown the guy has a 4.49 ERA are you blind? Sorry you are upset that we didnt gut our future for a guy who’s at best a number 3 starter go polish up on your baseball knowledge because you don’t know jack.
Fraizer aint going anywhere..
I have the clues, you’re bragging before the deadline how your team isnt going to deal anyone when they absolutely are.
@arc89 comin in with FACTS ONLY.
You’re a good one around here, glad you post!
Trading prospects for pitching isn’t always the best move, chopper. I’m sure Blue Jays fans would’ve rather kept Syndergaard. But according to you, they’d be delusional and stupid to think that…
Sounds like you 2 are fudge packing brothers LMAO
Calling Quintana a great pitcher just shows how much baseball knowledge you actually lack, Chris Sale, Kershaw, Scherzer, Bumgarner, those are GREAT pitchers not Quintana what did day care let you out early today?
No, Sale, Kershaw, and Scherzer are ELITE pitchers.
Quintana is a great pitcher. There’s a reason he’s been in the Top 10 WAR for the past several years. The fact that you’re ONLY looking at his ERA from this season (which is elevated from a poor April) tells me that YOU don’t have much baseball knowledge.
His best year was last year when he went 13-12 that’s not impressive he was almost .500 I know more baseball than you will ever know and i’ll say it again hes not a GREAT pitcher, in another year or so the Cubs will regret this trade for a guy who at best is a number 3 starter. If he’s so great then why didn’t he make the all star team this year? Yeah exactly because he’s not as good as everyone makes him out to be he’s overrated. Id rather have Cole Hamels who is a way better pitcher than Quintana and has pitched and been successful in the world series.
You immediately lost the “I know more baseball than you will ever know” claim the second you referenced W-L record as the main factor in deciding his best season,. There’s no need to even continue this conversation because you immediately lost the argument in your first sentence.
I guess that means King Felix was “average” when he went 13-12 in his Cy Young winning season.
He’s NY stupid. There’s a lot of it out there. It amuses me how stupid this Chris dude is though. New levels being reached here today.
Cole Hamels and his 4.9/9 K rate? Good luck with that.
Chris thinks win loss record is how you rate how good a pitcher is!! Hilarious!!
Chris. I am breathing a sigh of relief too.
Cashman is smart, he knows who he has..
our pitching rotation is giving me agita!!! Sever and Montgomery are great in my book..
You know it. Cash Ninja knows is looking to build something long term and not trade the farm for a good number two last year and mid rotation innings water in the AL this year. Small tweaks and when they are ready then go for that ace if available. Cheerios will be happy hearing that. Then go spend 400mill. We are all in agreement but we just maybe are looking at it how to get there a little differently.
Frazier is not going to be that good, Torres had TJ surgery. nobody wants Yanks bum prospects
Lol
You mad bro?
You mad bro? Lol you said the samething about Judge a year ago who’s the bum now? What a fool !!!
We gave up too much but I’ll take it. We needed starting pitching about as bad as anything
Thank God there will be no more rumours. Now Atlanta, send Teheran the Dodgers and we can put these rumours behind us
Thank you Cash. Great move Cubs. Your one pitcher away! Even though he’s no ace you have Lester. Smart baseball decision for Cubs to repeat. Awesome move all around. Cheerios!!!!! Where you at son?
I’m sorry Cash Ninja didn’t trade away the farm as you suggested since they are far away from being one player away like the cubbies and Red Sawxxxx!
Cheerios?
Very happy Cashman didn’t cave and trade away all of our prospects he’s not stupid were looking toward the future we want to win CHAMPIONSHIPS not just a CHAMPIONSHIP this must make all the Yankee haters upset that we didn’t get fleeced into trading away our future for a guy who’s not really worth it.
yeah, that’s it
Considering the Cubs already won a championship, this move is to get them to CHAMPIONSHIPS. It’s almost as if Theo knows what he’s doing more than you do!
No one is getting fleeced. Saying a GM gets fleeced by another GM only shows your ignorance (that is of course if your fan boy preaching of never trade any prospects because they will all turn out awesome does not make people see this already)
Good, now we don’t have to face him several times a year.
But in a few years the Indians will have to deal with the White Sox 19 times a year and that doesn’t seem too fun either
Wow Crazy life offer. Great young controllable pitcher for the cubs and great return white sox.
wow. you could have gotten more from Oakland..like Lowerie/Gray….don’t understand…why give them so much we got so little…
Is Gray + Lowerie more than Quintana?
I can’t wait to see Oakland trade Madson & Alonso for Frazier next week, should be ghost town with all the insaneo Yankee fan posters on here having a collective heart attack, but the rest of us can see them trading Frazier this month so easily.
not sure if the Yanks will make a trade since they are barely keeping above .500. My bet is the Brewers offer up Brinson for Gray who fits the A’s need for a CF. Frazier is a corner OF with more power but his defense is only suited for corner OF position.
Not happening the Yankees would never trade Frazier for Madson and a rental like Alonso you truly are a clown too bad we are keeping all of our top prospects I know that makes you angry. Get a life you probably dont even have a job sitting on your computer all day, you are one of those pretend to be tough guys hiding behind a computer monitor and wouldn’t stand a chance in a real fight because you would run the other way looking for mommy LOL
Says the guy who thinks the A’s would trade Gray for a package around Andujar. My guess you are the same person that posted that terrible package on the chat yesterday that was shot down as no way without a top prospect included.
Sonny Gray is not worth Frazier or Torres end of story.
not bad,I like Eloy
I’m not thrilled with this move. I didn’t want the Cubs to move Jimenez to begin with, especially to the White Sox…
While I agree the price was steep, Quintana immediately becomes the Cubs’ Ace. Was probably a necessary move if they want any chance of defending their World Series title.
Quintana becomes the #3
Wrong
You cannot be serious… Quintana is instantly the Cub’s most reliable starter!!
Could be the worst comment of the year
Maybe in NL he can become a great two but ace???
We will see.
he was already a great 2 in the AL. and a #2 AL pitcher just started the NL all-star game. stuff will play up facing 8 hitters. it happens to literally every pitcher that makes the jump.
yeah good call, Max Scherzer is totally a #2. LOL
I think he meant max was a #2 in AL, and he kinda has a point
what in the hell are you talking about
He was behind a still Cy Young contending Verlander. He doesn’t so much have a point so much as he has a technicality. Scherzer would be the ace on nearly every team in baseball regardless of AL or NL.
Scherzer is far better than Q though….2 different tiers…..Q was a number 2 behind Sale because they didn’t have anyone good after Sale…..Q became the ace by default….Scherzer is an ace on any team even if it means he is a co-ace
But Scherzer has been even more dominant in the NL which is his point.
its not just scherzer. its every 1/2 that goes over to the NL that goes from good to dominant. look at CC, greinke, roy halladay, even guys like gio gonzalez and jeremy hellickson who are 5s in the AL come over and become 2s or 3s
the idea that Q “maybe could become a #2” by moving to the NL is ridiculous when he was already a high end #2 in a more difficult league to pitch in.
Are you calling Sale a number 2? Wow that’s so wrong.
AL Scherzer: 3.52 ERA, 117 ERA+
AL Quintana: 3.51 ERA, 115 ERA+
I don’t see much difference.
They didn’t acquire him to be a per se ace. Obviously he’s been really solid.
But there are really very few “ace” pitchers in the true sense of the word. The Cubs acquired him because he is really good, eats innings and is the best cost controlled pitching asset they could expect to acquire in a trade from anyone. They are going to lose two starters and potentially their closer in FA this year. A move like this was inevitable for the Cubs. It isn’t as if their farm is replete with good pitching prospects that are near ML ready. A move like this makes a ton of sense for this year and the next few years.
Q is NOT the ace
So two top-100s and two other dudes who exist. Interesting.
A top 5-10 and a top 50 and 2 other pieces, A’s fans are going to be salivating if Sonny Gray brings in a similar package.
It’s a top 10 and another top 100 player plus two others. Cease was in the lower third on BA’s mid-season rankings., they normally do a good job on rankings.
BBA had Eloy at #5 and Cease at #83 on their midyear list
link to baseballamerica.com
@Just Another Fan – which is exactly what he said
Eloy was #5 (a top 10) and Cease was #83 (in the lower third)
Good the Cubs are young cause we traded the farm for a avg pitcher but there ain’t many out there. Hurting bad but I trust Theo
“Average”
“A average”
He’s not average bro
Evidently this is a minority opinion, but I think this is a great move for the Cubs. Eloy’s a great prospect, and has massive power upside no question, but he’s still in A- Ball. Great get, but a ton of risk there.
I would’ve expected the White Sox to get two top prospects for Quintana, but evidently they were willing to take a chance on the most upside in one player they could get. Understandable, given where they’re at, but I did always expect Quintana to pull a bigger package from someone else, given his talent and contract
The White Sox did get two “top prospects”. Two Top 100 prospects.
Not what I meant. Cease has massive reliever risk, issuing 5 walks per nine in A- Ball. Eric Longenhagen at Fangraphs had a 45 FV on him before the season. I know other outlets have him higher, and his fastball is elite, but Cease isn’t exactly the kind of secondary guy I would’ve expected for Quintana
This isn’t a one big fish trade though. Cease is a big time prospect too.
Meh.. 21 in Low A.. Pitching prospects are volatile AF. Just ask Urias, Reyes or the plummeting stock Lucas Gioloito.. And all those guys were better ranked.. Eloy is the prize
Great move for both sides, makes sense both ways.
I guess they aren’t interested in Fulmer and/or Norris from the Tigers anymore?
If the Tigers decide to trade Fulmer for Schwarber I’m sure he’s still available.
Cubs fans need to start reassessing the value of Kyle Schwarber.
Would have rather seen them trade Schwarber, but he didn’t really give them a choice with the way he’s handled the bat thus far in 2017.
White Sox in all liklihood have the #1 farm now. Well done Hahn.
Unfortunately I would say that’s correct. I would say we still have more depth and with the way players get injured that’s pretty nice, but they have more top tier prospects than we do.
Na Yankees have 10 prospects who’d be #1 in those farms.
10? A bit too high.
Ok nine..
Lol the number one prospect was already on the White Sox. They now have what three at least in the top 30.
Come on. You haven’t read Billy’s untouchable prospect list he’s been working on with Baseball America,Fangraphs,MLBpipeline,Minorleagueball,and sitting in on the top prospect show on MLB network.
Billy is a bit out there there are a couple of Yankee posters who aren’t living in reality.
According to MLB.com top 100, the White Sox now have 9 and they are all in the top 70.
Is there a trophy for that? Must be something new. That would make the goal to trade anything of value on the major league roster and then spend years not competing. All with no assurance that winning at the ML level will actually happen. Hahn can have that title.
People freaking out about them depleting the Farm..you realize most of their ML roster is young controllable players? Now they have added another.
that’s a good point
Maybe now you go look for a lead off hitter? It’s hard to imagine benching anyone on that team, but maybe a time share between Baez/Russel and Dee Gordon? Can Gordon play short? Or if Schwarber doesn’t start clicking you get someone in the OF that can lead off..like that Dexter Fowler guy..but obviously not him haha. Really the only NEED I feel like they still have.
Finally let trade season begin
The White Sox are going to be the best team in the league in a couple of years
If everyone of there prospects pans out to there potential then yes but that won’t happen. They should be very much improved in a few years though regardless.
I hope the Pirates talk of keeping Gerrit Cole was just lip service. Quintana going to a team few expected means the Astros and others still need a SP and have one less to choose from…
Whether or not they are in rebuild mode, the Bucs still need a horse, an ace starter. If they still think Cole can be that guy, then they shouldn’t be looking to move him. If, on the other hand, they think Taillon is that guy, I agree with you completely.
I personally like Taillon and Nova much more than Cole. Keith Law thinks Mitch Keller can be an ace.
If there was any chance to keep the Boras lead Cole, I’d feel differently, but now is the time to cash him in.
Flip the return for Sonny Gray or someone you could actually keep long term if you want to keep the same dynamic.
agreed on all counts.
A lot will depend upon how the Bucs come out of the gate after the break if they move Cole now, after the season or next year. Same with Cutch. Depends upon where they stand and what is being offered for both. I am glad that they did not give up a kings ransom for Quintana. Very good pitcher but not sure worth what was reportedly being requested from the Sox.. Cole will never resign with the Bucs and I am not sure I would want to resign Cutch long term given his age.
This definitely sets the bar high for other starting pitchers, especially Gray. Hopefully, this helps JV’s value, but I doubt it.
I had been very much in favor of the Pirates pursuing Quintana, but not for that much return. Doesn’t mean I’m looking to him pitching against the Bucs, of course.
Yeah Bucs to cheap. I look for a fire sale in Pittsburgh on July 31.
Feel free to look for it. There will be trades, but not a fire sale.
And nothing about not trading for Quintana makes the Bucs cheap.
Love the Bucs are cheap comments. They did not throw money at Neil Walker and they are cheap even though he has been on the DL for much of the time he has been with the Mets. He would not have helped the Bucs last year because his back gave out and missed the end of the year when they would have needed him to get to the post season. He would be gone now. again. Not paying a guy multi millions who has injury problems and aging is cheap now I guess.
A local fat guy, in order to paint the Pirates in a bad light, was reduced to including Walker, Liriano, Happ and PEDRO ALVAREZ on a list of “key” players the Pirates got rid of from the 98 win team.
Key. Players.
Walker is overpaid and hurt. Liriano is overpaid and bad. The same people whining that they are cheap losers for not keeping Happ are the exact same people who whined that they were cheap losers for acquiring Happ when they got him. And Pedro is in freaking AAA. In the OF of all things.
Never mind that Nova has been better than Happ. Never mind that Williams has been better than Liriano. Never mind that Bell is an emerging star at first. Never mind that Harrison was an All Star at second.
Never mind that the Pirates replaced all of the above with better players, NOT keeping those bums “PROVES” they are cheap and don’t want to win. Or something.
This definitely seems like an overpay by the Cubs. But let trade season begin!
Looks like the Cubs won’t be the best team in Chicago much longer. THEY JUST GOT ROBBED!!
no they didn’t
Cubs have established young hitters, Sox have a ton of prospects which you better hope pan out before putting your team ahead of anyone else.
Thank the lord in heaven the Yankees held onto Mickey Rutherford because he’s gonna start,hit third,and close games starting in September 2017..the face of MLB. Study your prospect lists now!!
Also Torres and Frazier these guys are our future Cashman isn’t stupid and wasnt going to get fleeced by Rick Hahn.
Yea I know..but silly Billy needs his lithium!
Yanks prospects are bums
Yeah sure they are so if they are such bums then why does every team want Torres and Frazier in trades? Yeah that’s what I thought the only bum here is you
Cashman may not be stupid but you surely are Chrissy
Is that what you say to your boyfriend every morning burly? Lol fool
Fleeced by Hahn? God, now I know you really know nothing and are a typical fan boy. First your comments of something akin to ‘oh my team cannot trade any of their prospects because they are better than established MLB players’, and then this fleece talk. GMs are grown men and know, or should know, what they are doing.. NO ONE gets fleeced as a MLB GM, NO ONE! If someone fails to do their homework then they are incompetent.
Fleeced means someone got the better of them. Whether that ignorance is from a lack of due diligence is not the issue. Several GMs have been fleeced throughout history. Not sure why you’re so against his comment.
Trolling is great isn’t it Cheerios. Sorry about Q but Rutherford could be dealt for an ACE and then Harper gets his 400 mill!
Lmao
Man in the mirror!!!
Cheerios I bet you one day you will love this decision not gutting the farm for Q. Trust in the process. We will make trades for an ace when the tine is right and maybe go spend that 400 mill. Cool your jets and breathe. Have patience my young fruit loop.
Wow, stunning! This may not put them in first place, but it sure doesn’t help Pirates out. Of course Bucs are too cheap anyway!
I think it definitely helps the Pirates out, sets the market for Cole a lot higher.
The market for Cole was already higher them this. Nothing is set higher
At least the Cubs are helping the best team in Chicago get better.
Cubs will always be the better team no matter what.
Wow! Did not see that coming at all! I read the headline and was like “for real?!?!”
Saw this watching international talk. My first thought was wtf why did they trade eloy Jimenez. This is awesome.
Only about 2 maybe 3 weeks before they play each other. Hope he faces the white Sox in the crosstown showdown.
As a Braves fan I happy that the Braves didn’t pull the trigger seeing what the Cubs gave up. I will say this Jose Quintana will help the Cubs starting rotation. He should be pencil in as a number 2 starter. As far the White Sox you hate to trade away your ace but wow you have to love the returned that you got from the Cubs. The Cubs number one and number two overall Prospects. I bet the weather is sunny right now in the North and South side of Chicago.
With Quintana gone the price tag on Julio Tehran just went way up. I won’t be surprise to see the Braves trade him and get great value back. I do think that Tehran might be dealt before Sunny Gary does.
Steep price, but very well could be the best move for the Cubs because Quintana might can push them over the top.
I am glad that the Braves didn’t pay a comparable price (Acuna and Allard plus others). Not that Quintana won’t be worth it, but because in my opinion the Braves have far more issues than one starting pitcher can fix.
Over the top and down the cliff they go. 108 more years!
Acuna and Allard are not a comparable price. More like Anderson/Gohara as the second piece.
Finally!
Wow, White Sox farm system is a juggernaut now. Great work by the front office
I like Quintana, but OH MY GOD! Eloy Jimenez PLUS Dylan Cease PLUS two other guys? You have GOT to be kidding me. Is Dave Dombrowski working for the Cubs now?
the two other guys are almost non prospects but those are a big 1-2
Yes plus “two other guys” that you never heard of and could not even name but that part the trade upsets you?
Good move for the Cubs as now they can have $$$ for another starter this winter or to try to entice Kris Bryant to sign a huge prearb deal. GREAT move for the Sox and My boy Rick Hahn. Any Yankee fans out there think Torres not going in a deal for Q got their answer. No Torres, no Q. Yes his value is that high boys and girls and Hahn made sure of it
The Cubs needed to add a young starter long term and are currently around .500. They needed pitching to replace the ones they’re gonna lose at the of the season and get back in the race. They traded from strength. They have a lot of outfielders. Expensive but needed.
as expected, quintana got a return that fell between the chris sale and adam eaton returns. would have preferred a better third piece, but wow what a centerpiece.
They got 2 top 100 prospects for a #2 starter, that’s a great deal!
So glad the Yanks didn’t give up any big prospects. Keep building!
I was 100 percent wrong to all those people i was debating Q with. However even you guys mist admit this is as overpay as this package could have got close to sale
As a Sox fan I admit this is more than I though they’d get. And that’s with me valuing him as a high end #2. Teams are just so reluctant to move high end prospects these days. I prefer this over any of the other deals speculated on. Hahn may be the best GM in the game. Don’t sleep on the fact that Hahn is the main negotiator in the Sale and Quintana extensions
No… people don’t have to admit this is an overpay. That’s what people have been trying to say, they thought a package like this was coming. Not necessarily from the Cubs, but the same type of deal.
Most of the people screaming overpay still call Q a “solid 3” lol. The dude is really good and controllable at a known price.
I know dang well you weren’t expecting Eloy Jiminez. Come on i heared 2 top 20s but not top 5
I literally just said I wasn’t even expecting it to be the Cubs.
But actually yes, tons of people thought it would be a really high prospect. 2 20s or 1 top 5 is close to the same thing.
This is actually exactly the type of package I thought they’d get (top 2 guys plus fillers) if they traded Q to the North Side…
I dont think trading him to the cubs is a big deal. After all it is an NL team. good trade however and i will take my L on this one. never expected this much
I back Priggs up on this. Correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t you call it exactly. Jimenez, Cease, and two lower level guys in another thread
good for just taking the hit there. and I think it’s a slight overpay but it’s a good piece for the Cubs that said I’m happy the dodgers didn’t do it
Chris Sale got the games top prospect who was in AAA and will be ready this year, along with a big power arm who is top 20 I believe in Michael Kopech who is in AA and could even come up this year also. Quintanas return got a top ten prospect(not top overall) and is still years away along with Cease who is years away and ranked near 60. This package would not have got Sale…
Next big thing..three way trade Angels get Clint Frazier Dodgers get Chance Adams..Yankees get Kershaw and Trout and payment of 50% of their remaining salaries..win win win!
Stop lol
Getting Trout starts with Kershaw, judge and Dodger and Yankee prospects.
stop trolling
he can’t help himself. I think he’s a Yankee fan but one can never tell because I don’t know this many silly Yankee fans.
silly=Billy and the untouchables
Back to Anaheim pal!
I wouldn’t say that would get Kershaw or Trout. Two prospects, not even top for best pitcher and best player in baseball? Pass it twice around room with the execs before you propose that one.
THANK GOD the braves didn’t get him! The asking price, and ultimately the price paid is far too much. Good for the white sox for taking advantage. Braves take notes, we might not have a horribly overrated trade piece like the sox, but we still have some assets we can trade to continue the rebuild.
Well that’s just great.
Wow. Wouldn’t have expected this kind of a trade between these 2 teams. I’m also really high on Jimenez, so I don’t know if I’d have been able to risk sending him across town….but the Cubs obviously have a bunch of young position players, and need pitching, so it’s not shocking or anything.
Moncada 1
Jimenez 8
Kopeck 11
Robert 23
Giolito 28
Lopez 36
Fulmer 59
Cease 63
Collins 68
That’s nine of the top 68 prospects… and that’s not including Alec Hansen who some rank as the second best pitching prospect behind kopeck.
And depending on what you think of Jake Burger, he could be in there somewhere
Such a good farm now! Just keep selling what you can and wait 3-4 years and should be a good ball club!
spencer adams & dane dunning are also playing up this year.
i’m confident mlb will drop at least 4 of those guys back in their mid-season rankings, but the farm is looking pretty great regardless
Key word “prospects”
Nice job Rick! Can’t wait to see the haul for Robertson. That should line the Pale Hose up for a top 3 draft pick next year. Love it!
Isn’t Robertson out for the year?
No, that’s Nate Jones.
No. Nate Jones is
Oh yea that’s right sorry
I’m a Cubs fan but I like this trade for both teams.
Quintana is a big plus for the rotation and they didn’t give up anyone off the major league roster. I think another pitching move is coming, soon, and it will cost someone off the current roster.
Baseball is all about pitching, did you see most of the pitchers in the All Star game shutting down the best sluggers in the game ? It happens every year.
yikes…. and i was just thinking i was liking the Pirates chances of catching the cubs ( though it was still tough ) Now… well… geez.
I know it hurts to give up a prospect or two.. But look at the Cubs depth chart.. Where wuld Eloy even play at this point? Controlled players at each position and veteran back ups (Jay, Zobrist).. Pitching was the issue and they addressed it.. I don’t love it, but I don’t hate it..
“I don’t love it, but I don’t hate it..”
I think those are the best trades. When two intelligent GM’s deal, both teams should benefit.
The White Sox told Maddon he couldn’t have Renteria’s job so they would have to settle for Quintana
if another person calls Quintana and ace, I’m going to bash in my computer screen
Quintana’s an ace.
See ya!
Quintana is an ace… bash away
Not only an ace but a future HOF!
I don’t get the people saying Quintana is insanely over rated. Hes a very good pitcher, I dont think he’s an ace but probably a high 2. I’m not going to say the Cubs made out in the deal, but lets not pretend the Cubs didnt get any value out of it either.
With what the Cubs just gave up to get Quintana they could have gave up a similar package to have gotten Sale who’s 100 times better than Quintana I think we can all agree on that, it makes you wonder if you are a Cubs fan.
Giants fan, try again
Before Sale got traded, there was a lot of discussion that Quintana had more trade value of the two because of his better contract situation.
This package got Q now, but his value has also dropped because (1) he has a half season less of control and (2) he’s been having a down year., so you can’t really compare apples to apples here.
Sox got the top prospect in all of baseball and a higher ranked prospect than Cease for Sale. How would Quintanas return come close to getting Sale? Keep in mind the Cubs gave up single A prospects who still need to show they can progress through the system.
Yankees made out the most Chapman for the #2 prospect torres for a top 5 closer and only three months. Sale(3 years ) 1,20 prospects for top 5 pitcher in all of baseball Sox were robbed
Sales package was better and it should of been he is a bonafide ace.
No way the Cubs get Sale with that package!! No way!! Jimenez and Cease were only in Single A ball. Let’s not get ahead of ourselves. Cubs traded from a position of strength to address a position of need. Great trade for both teams!! Quintana will be a staple for the Cubs for the next 3 years.
Really tho, the white sox farm now contains jiminez, cease, Collins, roberts, moncada, koepech, giolito, Lopez, dunning, and their draft picks, not to mention Anderson. I’m tigers fan and in a few years this is gonna suck lol. Congrats to the white sox on a good build tho. It’s gonna b fun and sad to watch!
Foolish trade! The Theo Epstein that got himself run out of Boston is back. Quintana is a solid #3 starter. They could have easily gotten similar for Schwarber from an AL team, Especially now that they really dont have anywhere to put him on the field with Happ in the majors doing well and Zobrist coming back. As a Brewers fan, I love that their farm system is depleted again. First Torres and now Jimenez and Cease….yikes!
say what you will about the trade but Theo’s got three rings from two lovable loser franchises.
“lovable.”
I’m a Brewers fan too, but they weren’t getting anything close to Quintana or Fulmer for Schwarber.
Ok mister he is a three what teams is he a three on seriously?
Probably only the Nationals or Dodgers which isn’t reflective of the league as a whole. Actually I think he will be the #3 on the Cubs due to Arrieta holding onto 2 by default until FA.
the trade of torres got them a ring so stop it. Anyone who pays attention to the sports world on sites like these cannot criticize genious’ like theo. He’s trading prospects for rings. stop it
Ok Brewer fan be happy then cry me a river when Q and the Cubs win the division and you are not even in the playoffs
Bravo Theo. Smart move … go for more. You can’t always build for the future. Sometimes you gotta poo or get off the pot. Theo dropped a bomb in bowl. Good for him.
I would think the Tigers would have given up Fulmer for slightly more than this.
Qs ERA in the weak AL Central is 4.49. You are hoping he returns to form. Fulmer would have given you league minimum salary and 4.5 years of control.
Should be really good in the other weak central. Then add in removing the 9th hitter. 1.78 era in June. The potential is below a 1 era for July in his new division.
White Sox have done an amazing job over the past 7 months. Wow.
So::
What if you STILL don;t catch the Brewers?
What if there’s injuries?
What’s the plan now? The farm system is now officially barren..
What if they do? What if there’s not? What if they win the WS again?
Farm systems are EASY to replenish for big spending clubs. Just a couple of years ago everyone was saying that the Yankees will be in for years of losing because their farm system was so bare. That didn’t happen either.
WRONG
Very tight restrictions everywhere now making the replenishment of a farm very difficult.
Dude please just get a journal, your emotional rants are adding nothing to the value of this site.
Very tight restrictions? There are no tight restrictions. There are only taxes. If you pay enough you can get around anything. The Cubs just need to go crazy on international spending while buying up spending slots with fringe minor leaguers. Eloy Jimenez and Gleyber Torres were a product of crazy international spending not that long ago.
what do they do now if they don’t win this year? They are still stacked with young talent… and caseys partner, your not as smart as you think you are. please stop replying to everyone just bashing what they say
Ummm if they don’t, they can go out and sign another SP next year? They’re fine. They have young MLB controllable players at MLB level that they are having trouble finding spots for.
Oh now its “officially barren”. Haha ok
Were are the Yankee fans saying that Quintana would cost Mateo and 2 lesser prospects?
I wish I could tag…
I’m loving this — as a Cardinals fan. The Cubs give away their future for Quintana? Sonny Gray was a better option. Cubs can’t fix all their problems with Quintana alone. Go White Sox! Lol
Who said Quintana is their only acquisition? There’s plenty more pitchers available and plenty free agents to be had in the offseason as well.
Sonny Gray has never had a single year as good as any of Quintana’s 2014-16.
Agreed, I would take Quintana over Gray any day. Not sure why people are so high on Gray? Quintana is going to take off on a better team and they will feed off each other.
Fact: Quintana and Gray are very similar statistically. Quintana has been healthier and also has one year more control over Gray. Therefore. I’d rather have Q.
Enjoy being tied with the Cubs for now. This is the best the Cards can do this season while the Cubs are playing at their worst lately. The Cards run officially ended with the loss to the Cubs in 2015. They will be back though so hang in there…
This trade makes SO much sense that it’s kind of shocking it went down. Great move by both clubs. Now we can put an end to the “Sox and Cubs won’t trade with each other” nonsense. As excited as I am to get Eloy and Cease back (which is extremely excited), I can’t wait to see how good Quintana is for the Cubs. No, I’m not turning into a Cubs fan, but I’ll certainly be rooting for him.
Priggs89 and Joe Kerr are not typical hater Sox fans. Kudos!
I am happy for the Sox as well and they will be a force in 3-4 years in the AL. Mighty big of you to keep rooting for Quintana, rare find on here.
I’ll root for the Cubs once every 5 games. Me and the Q share Colombian heritage. Can’t root against my guy.
Jose Quintana to the Cubs makes perfect sense. Both had years way over their heads in 2016 and are in the midst of major regression in 2017. It’s a match made in heaven.
What no Theo is a garbage GM? You’ve got that Troll thing down…Cards fan?
Nope, guess again.
Yeah, the Cubs won 97 games in 2015 and 103 games in 2016. When a team goes 200-124 over 324 regular season games it is obviously just a fluke.
Oh Theo.
Surprised the White Sox didn’t ask for Schwarber as well and plug him into the DH spot, Yanks will probably get Gray and Doolittle now most likely for Andujar, Sheffield, and probably 2 more prospects. Sorry folks those 2 other prospects aren’t Torres or Frazier either.
Sox are deep with DH types: Davidson, Collins, Burger,
The Cubs just gave up a prospect comparable to Torres and better than anyone else in your farm. You think you are getting a similar pitcher + a good reliever for Adujar/Sheffield + fillers? Good luck.
You just love to respond to anything I say huh you are a troll who just hates the Yankees, Torres and Frazier are better than the crap your White Sux received nice try though its pretty clear you have no life and no job because you are on this site everyday lol. By the way you brainless fool Andujar is better than Eloy, your new boy toy Eloy got compared to Jorge Soler LOL how has that turned out? LOL what a mindless fool go back to day care no one wants to hear your fu*king mouth.
You’re an easily triggered little guy, aren’t ya?
Don’t worry sweetheart, I’m sure Frazier will keep slugging .900, and that .309 OBP won’t come back to bite him. And you’re right, Andujar is way better than Eloy. I have no idea how all the prospect outlets keep messing that up.
Jealous much? That we have the best farm system in baseball and that we aren’t trading Frazier, Eloy is overrated he will be another Jorge Soler all these praises about Eloy we all heard the same thing about Soler a few years ago when he was suppose to be the next Barry Bonds lol. White Sux are terrible and a disgrace to all of baseball look at the name of their stadium Guaranteed Rate Field and it has a arrow pointing down lol meaning the team is going DOWN!!!!!! LMAO
Yup. I already agreed with you. Eloy is overrated. And all the Yankees top 30 prospects are future superstars. All the top 10 guys would be #1 in any other system. How many times do I have to agree with you?
You aren’t getting Gray for much less then it would cost for Q and if Doolittle is added the package will start with Rutherford if not one of Frazier or Torres. I don’t think the Yanks are going to trade for him though unless they truly feel they can win the division if they fall back further in the next two weeks then they might even turn into slight sellers. If they stay in this and feel good about there chances and want want Gray then bye bye Rutherford, Sheffield and at others.
No problem with not getting Gray if it means Torres or Frazier are going to be traded he’s not worth those type of players, Id rather trade those guys for a pitcher like Stroman hes younger and a better pitcher than Gray, plus Gray has been hurt a lot the last few years Stroman hasn’t and I wouldn’t call a blister being injured..
that package might, just might fetch Brad Hand. Probably does, but maybe not.