After weeks of speculation, Orioles manager Buck Showalter confirmed today to fans and reporters (including MASNsports.com’s Roch Kubatko) that Manny Machado would be moving from third base to shortstop, with Tim Beckham shifting over to the hot corner. This will at least be the club’s setup going into Spring Training, Showalter specified, though plans could still change down the road.
News broke in November that Machado was interested in a move back to his original position, despite developing into one of baseball’s best defensive players as a third baseman. Machado has played just 433 big league innings at shortstop over his six-year career, with the bulk of that action coming in 2016 (380 innings) when he filled in for the injured J.J. Hardy. Machado posted strong metrics that year (5.4 UZR/150, +3 Defensive Runs Saved) as a shortstop, though it’s hard to extrapolate from that small sample size how Machado could fare at the position over the long term.
Given that Machado is just a year away from free agency, it can’t be ignored that the position change widens Machado’s potential market. Proving that he can handle shortstop would only raises Machado’s already sky-high value heading into the 2018-19 offeason. While his first preference would seemingly be to find a team that would allow him to continue at short, Machado could also keep third base-needy teams in the picture or even explore scenarios that would see him play every day at one of the two positions.
The position change also has significant 2018 implications for the Orioles, who now could look to complement the right-handed hitting Beckham with a left-handed platoon partner at third. Given how Beckham impressed in his first month in an O’s uniform, however, the team might want to give him a clear shot at the everyday job. Executive VP Dan Duquette mentioned (via Kubatko) that the Orioles had been talking to long-time utilityman Ryan Flaherty about a possible return; such an addition wouldn’t be any significant threat to reducing Beckham’s status as the starting third baseman. Engelb Vielma or prospect Ryan Mountcastle could also eventually get into the third base or infield backup mix.
On the other hand, the Orioles could go big by moving Beckham into a multi-positional bench role and looking for a full-time third baseman. Mike Moustakas and Todd Frazier are the most notable hot corner names still available in free agency, with Moustakas carrying the bigger price tag (both in terms of salary and draft pick compensation) but his left-handed bat is also a better fit in Baltimore’s lineup. Making a big signing or trade splash for third base could be difficult, however, given that the O’s have a more pressing need in their rotation.
Wow
Wow wow wow
Wow
I don’t understand all the WOWS. He stated before the new year he wanted to play the SS
That is good for him
Interesting…
I don’t really see the significance of this.
Agreed. My guess is he ends up back at third.
Read the article. One of the best 3B defenders is going back to SS which could make him more valuable going into free agency where he was set already to make hundreds of millions of dollars. would be interested in knowing how much more he presumedly could make with the move, considering how the shallow SS market.
Yankees already have a shortstop
A lot of teams have been storing up cash for 2019. PHI could be major players as well, though there’s more a need at 3B for them. The switch would make other teams consider making a bid.
Means he’s probably staying in Baltimore.
Haha. No. Baltimore is probably doing it to make him happy, but no way he forgoes what he can get on the open market just because he’s allowed to play short. he’s gonna get paid, and O’s probably won’t be the team that does if.
I meant this year.
Angelos can’t pay him. Maybe without the Davis contract they could but definitely not with that is the way. It took a lot to get Angelos to just do that. The money Machado will command is way out of our budget. Lamenting O’s fan wishing they would pony up and go for it or rebuild. The window I think has closed for this team to contend unless they can shed Trumbo and Davis quickly which is not possible.
I think it’s better if written that Angelos won’t pay Machado. This team has almost nothing on the books beyond 2018 besides Davis. They are only committed to less than $50m for 2019 and appear set to rely on a large percentage of low-priced younger players moving forward. By the numbers the Orioles can afford Machado but if they let him leave it’s because they CHOOSE not to afford him.
Jack Taddy I don’t think so. That a waste. Even if it meant giving him away for little at TD. If Baltimore is out of it by then which they will be, they will get something for him no matter what. BY TD he will be gone or Baltimore is just plain stupid if he is not. Or know he resign. 3 months to go something is better than nothing. They are just not going to get what they want by then. It be worse not better at TD, even him playing SS.
Like I said who needs a SS at TD, who 1 is going into post season and deep into post season? Who is willing to give up a good if not great prospect or 2 or MLB ready player for him, esp pitching as a player. Probably no one. Certainly NOT the Yanks, Cubs, LAD, Astros, that is for sure
Because they are being Greddy now, they pay dearly in a drop off trade at TD.
I would argue the plan has been to move him at the deadline all along. The Orioles dangled him as trade bait simply to gauge value. I’m sure in the talks teams said something like ” are you sure he can play shortstop as good as third?” You will always get more value at the deadline when teams are making a playoff run, or have an injury. Machado is playing short stop only to boost his trade value. It’s a win win because it could also help him in free agency, but this seems orchestrated by Baltimore.
“If we make him a shortstop, we can ask for more at the deadline.”
This is the answer, yup
You have to have a buyer. He be a 3 month rental. 3 month rentals go to teams that are almost 99.9 certain they are going to post season. Probably deep into post season, and that is the one piece that will put them over the top, or at least give them a shot. That team also has to pay for that 3 month rental So at what price. prospect top 1? Pitcher MLB ready or and top Pitching prospect?
To me it won’t make a difference. You have to have the team and the star aligned. As with the Cubs/Chapman – Astros/ Verlander
Manny does the no one no good as a 3 month rental if they are NOT in post season. So start there. Then the position – SS
Both elements have to be there to make that trade work right off the bat.
Then you have to find a team that willing to pay the price. That a steep price if your asking top prospects, pitching pr several MLB ready players for 3 months. You better be sure he get you deep or a title in Post Season, otherwise not interested.
Everyone else can wait to FA next Winter
Haha you can ask for MORE at the deadline huh? No chance. His market at the deadline is already sky high as a third baseman. Its not going higher
In fact if he is not as good on defense at short, which is likely, or has issues with his knees or range, you may get significantly less at the deadline
I do not see the significance either nor do I get all the wow comments and this has been known to be happening for months
It’s not our fault your brain doesn’t function properly.
Who cares what you think
I still believe there is match up in a 3 way deal involving the O’s, the DBacks & the Braves with Arizona getting Machado & the Braves getting Greinke. It is just a matter of what would go back to Baltimore.
Corbin, Lamb, an org top 5 prospect from braves, top 30 prospect from dbacks.
The only way that works is if dbacks extend machado. Lamb Corbin a top 30 and grienke is a lot for a year of machado especially when he’s coming off a down year for him. (Much better in 2nd half though)
especially since they’re not willing to give up lamb straight up for one year of mechado
i think the question is how much are the dbacks paying the braves to take greinke
How would that work? This reads as a DBacks’ fan wanting Machado, but realizing Arizona doesn’t have the chips to get him, then eyeing another team that does—the Braves—and having them pay the premium while Arizona also dumps Greinke’s contract.
Don’t see how this scenario works out at all for the Braves. It seems they would pay the most, get the least, and absorb the worst contract. If anything, why wouldn’t the Braves just go get Machado themselves? And if they had the ability to absorb the Greinke contract, they could easily attach a few more dollars per year and re-sign Machado.
With all the young guys coming up they will need a leader for the rotation and with the young guys not a lot of money would be allocated to the rotation so the cost of Greinke is split basically across 5 slots.
The trade could have 2 parts by the Braves taking Greinke’s contract Arizona throws in Drury to Bmore. The Braves then move say Newcomb, Wiegel & Wentz with Markakis & Kazmir.
In this scenario the Dbacks shed Greinke’s salary & get Machado
The Orioles get a rotation piece with controllable years , an infielder that has been reported they wanted, a LH OF & 2 pitching prospects.
The Braves get an ace to lead the young staff, lose Markakis & Kazmir salaries for this year and didn’t give up the cream of the crop prospects.
On the Orioles part it may be a little bit more of Quantity over quality but what do they really expect as a haul for 1 year of Machado ?
Now if other players switch out or whatever but I feel the framework could be there for a deal to work
BAL isn’t giving up Machado for Newcomb, Wiegel (rehabbing from TJ) and Wentz. Our farm is deep, but BAL not getting any of our top-5 would be hilarious.
And as much as I like Greinke, I’d rather have the cash freed up for a run at Kershaw, Keuchel, MadBum, Sale over the next 2 offseasons, if the youngins do indeed need that stable arm.
With the way the market moved this year I can’t see any of those pitchers leaving their respected teams.
To be honest Arizona would probably give up Greinke for just Travis Demeritte, if they even required that much. It isn’t that Greinke can’t pitch well still (surely he can), but the fact that his value because of his contract is negative. The contract is the issue, not the pitcher.
The trade scenario you mention has the Braves GREATLY over paying for someone they could probably get for almost nothing.
This market is moving so slow, in part, because of those free agents. There is world of difference between Yu/Arrieta and Kershaw/Keuchel that most teams that can afford them won’t mind allocating the necessary funds. Same for MadBum/Sale. I would even say lower-tier SPs like Patrick Corbin should stand to do very well with teams missing out K & K (injuries and poor performance notwithstanding to Corbin).
The 3 way trade is possible but highly unlikely. Arz would have to give up Lamb, and ZG and pay probably 50% of that contract.
1. The Braves don’t need ZG – They for sure don’t need him with all their prospects. It might sound cool to have ZG on your team, but not when you will be paying him 34.5 Million at 36, 37, 38 years of age. NO pitcher is worth 34.5 Million at 38, or 37 NO pitcher. Even 20 Million at 36,37,38
2. The Braves would pay a dear price. at least two or 3 of their prospects headed to Balt IF Arz pick up 1/2 the money of ZG.
3. Arz would have to get something from the deal IF it was only ZG Probably a pitcher or and Prospect pitcher. Macho for a year and dumping ZG paying half his salary wouldn’t be enough. Add Lamb into it your taking even more prospects or MLB players.
The Braves would be pretty much knocking out a lot of farm. For what? Braves wouldn’t bite to big of an over pay on their part.
ZG? Not worth it at his age. They still have to pay him near 18 to 20 Million.
Doubtful if not impossible that Arz pays 50%. Maybe 30% – 35% at most IF they were to do it. But it take more than Macho to get them to bite
I’d be interested to know how much ARZ would be interested in paying on ZG’s contract. If they can get indication that on a Goldy extension, they might use that as motivation to clear some payroll off to make room for him. Would be sad to see Pollock, Goldy, Corbin leave ARZ though.
Well this means he’s probably staying in Baltimore this year and will be marketed as a shortstop instead of a third baseman when he hits the market. If he will only be a shortstop then a team like the Yankees will be out on machado if they are interested unless they move di di to another position (which I don’t want them to do)
Wah Wah Wah, I wanna play SS. I wanna, I wanna, I wanna!
It’s crazy as he has a very good glove at third. Is shortstop that much more enjoyable for him or is it something else ? An ego thing ?
He played SS in high school and played SS in the minors. He was only moved to 3B because that’s back when Hardy was still good.
Wouldn’t be first ss with a ego. Jeter should have moved to 2b when arod arrived
If that happened cano would have been traded in that randy Johnson trade and we would have had a big hole at third. Moving arod to third worked out fantastically for the team
I thought Jeter wouldn’t move to third and that’s why Aros ended up there
Wrong but nice try…
“It’s crazy as he has a very good glove at third. Is shortstop that much more enjoyable for him or is it something else ? An ego thing ?”
$$$$$$$$
Elite third baseman get paid. Elite shortstops get PAID. It’s all about money. SS is the most demand position (outside of catcher) on the field, and providing tremendous defense there, along with an elite bat, makes him more valuable and provides more money.
In today’s market the difference between the two positions, at the top of the market, is probably $50M+. That’s the only reason this move is happening.
Unless Machado is clearly a better defensive SS than Beckham, why would the Orioles do this? Just to make a player happy who makes no bones about the fact that he’s leaving at first opportunity? Just to increase his price further beyond your reach while, at best, not helping your team? I don’t understand this move.
This makes them worse defensively. Machado has bad knees and Beckham is learning a new position entirely. He’s a decent SS but nothing to write home about, Beckham is, but keeping them at 3B and SS makes sense.
“who makes no bones about the fact that he’s leaving at first opportunity” he’s never said that unless you have a link to it. He wants to test the FA market and just because won’t sign an extension doesn’t mean anything of that nature. He probably won’t return but who actually knows.
I do not understand either but since its the O’s it makes some sense. No organization is dumber then them.
Machado had been a shortstop until getting to the majors. His defense at shortstop in the majors has been definitely adequate. There is absolutely no reason to think that Machado can’t be a superstar shortstop.
@southi
Really? What a poor argument. Superstar shortstop haha with “adequate” defense. Too funny.
You see he IS a superstar third baseman as it includes terrific top defense. An adequate defense SS is not a superstar. Thats just an offensive minded shortstop.
Terrible move by all parties
By adequate, I’m talking about better than major league average (sorry I wasn’t specific). Through in Machado’s bat being far more than an average SS bat and that translates into superstar shortstop.
Definitely adds versatility to the Orioles for now, but the real implications will be his free agency frenzy next off-season.
With that being said, I’m not so sure how smart of an idea this is by Machado. Playing a different position, than your body is accustomed to, increases the likelihood of getting injured.
Even though Machado has shown he’s more than physically capable of playing SS, he still hasn’t played the position over a long period of time in quite a long time.
It won’t impact his shoulder or throwing motion, as much as say Fredie Freeman moving from 1st to 3rd which led to Freeman suffering a shoulder injury, but it is still a little bit of a different angle. Not to mention, Machado will also have to cover more ground, and MOST IMPORTANTLY, he will have to turn countless double plays as their SS.
All it takes is one really hard slide from a runner barreling into 2nd base, and BAM Machado is hurt and out for 8-12 months from a serious knee or leg injury..
If I was Machado’s agent, I would have fought with him until the bitter end, trying to get him to stay at 3rd base. Now, if there is any player that can get hurt, and it still not affect his value much at all it is Manny Machado, but still why take the risk!?!?
The move cannot possibly be about increasing his value, because Machado’s value couldn’t be any higher honestly..Maybe it is to attract more teams that might already have a cornerstone player at 3rd base?? Personally, I just honestly believe Machado must REALLY want to play SS, and playing SS, rather than 3rd, must be what makes the man happy…Other than that, to me, it wouldn’t make sense…
He’ll now be the top shortstop on the market next season. He won’t be competing with Donaldson and others at 3rd so his potential suitor list should increase.
How does the suitor list increase if he will not play third? Also for the money he wants there are maybe 5 teams who can afford it. So there is no increase in suitors
He’s gonna stay and re-sign in Baltimore if they give him the keys to SS long term. /s
No he’s not
no lol
Matt Chapman Gold Glove at third now
This may sound ridiculous, but does anyone feel like maybe Orioles and Machado has a deal before arbitration that he would agree to his contract if they moved him to SS? He agreed to a deal a little under projected. He takes a million or two hit this year, but in doing so possibly greatly improves his FA options and therefore contract. I just can’t see Orioles and Showalter doing this just to meet his request, and I also don’t think they are doing this thinking this will help them extend him. It seems that ship has sailed unless they are willing to be highest bidder and I don’t see it
NO – Personally this is what I think. I may be wrong but probably close.
I don’t think the Orioles care personally. This is all about them, and what is best for them and really don’t care about anything else.
There are 5 facts here.
1. The Orioles are NOT going to resign him next winter. That is is 100% for sure. They are not going to extend him this year, that is 100% for sure. They are NOT going to be better than a 3rd place team, I have them at 4th. Let be real here. The Yank and Bost are 10X a head of them. NY maybe 20 lol
2. The Market been slow, Baltimore wants to get the best deal possible and the most they can. This won’t be easy not even for Machado. Without an extension that he stays with the team that he is traded to no one going to give up 4/5 players. Esp top Prospects or MLB ready players with control. It is plain just stupid.
3. As I said Baltimore is only thinking about themselves at this point and how to get the most out of Machado. When he stated, and I do stress stated NOT demanded he like to play short stop. It really opened up another window for Baltimore. Their thinking is maybe the market will open up more for them, showing teams interested that he can play short also. Baltimore could care less where he plays when he is gone as long as he is gone before he reaches FA.
Balimore NOT getting what they want at this point so anything that will help their cause they are all in for.
4. This is a BIG risk TBH in my view. For one you have to look at the market. ALL 30 teams even if they are Miami lol. First off what teams need a SS? Need a 3rd baseman. Would he be willing to play 3rd. I’m sure he would if it meant money. How set is he at winning a title or trying to. Last and most important who can pay him being realistic. Now add all those together.
The teams that could afford to pay him are simple. Yanks, Dodgers, Cubs, Phillies, Giants, Boston, Wash, St.L As far as Money – Your looking at probably a 10 year 350 million dollar deal. Maybe a bit less 10/320 – You can toss out LAD right off the bat. Playing SS – Seager going no place. Add the Cubs off that list – Not with a crowded infield and next years market coming up, to add they still need a SP. Arbitration coming up. Nice to want all these big players but what about all those young players you HAVE to pay. Add SF to the list of no thanks. Lux tax is maxed. People forget it not just the Money that goes against Lux tax. benefits, bonuses, ext also add to the tax. Boston has more important things to get. Like a CF. If they really want JD Manny not going to Boston. Boston is stretched thin as it is with Lux tax. JD will put them right there. The Nats who I forgot to add are Maxed out. Thank Mad Max, and Strasb. With FA coming up they have other issues. St.L is a good fit, at 3rd base NOT SS. Mo NOT going to trade Ryes so no sense of even saying trade this and that. As far as paying him next year, it possible but I doubt MO spends over a quarter BIllion on one guy unless it a for sure thing St.L is going back to the dance. Not many teams left? Yanks and Phillies. If Manny dead set on SS that will take out NY. Then there is only one team left. Now his market stuck, the Phillies could get him for under 300 more to the tune of 280-275. Before someone says it. It not as easy to say trade these 6 guys do this do that then there is room. Last thing you want to do is disrupt and core to just make room for one guy.
So I’m really not sure what Baltimore is thinking here TBH. If they are thinking it opens up his market more. I think it really constricts it more unless your talking EITHER OR SS / 3rd base?
The Biggest risk is will his knees hold out a whole MLB season. Will he get hurt? If he does then everything has back fired and it all be done. NO one will take him this year. I think Baltimore will wait it out until FA and hope and pray he makes it, and two a team will take him as a 3 month rental. For that team to do that, they will for one have to be almost 100% going to post season. You only make trades like that when your at the door, and you better be almost 99.9% sure you can finish the job and that is the guy who will put you over. (Cubs Chapman deal), (Verlander Astros Deal). Otherwise is not worth the payment. Stil,a risk but at least it worth the gamble if it means a title or a great chance at one.
Again now the market shrink for this year. Lets be honest here the teams that will probably make post season or let me say have a chance at it.
AL – NY, Boston, Clev, Houston, LAA, Maybe Minn, Maybe Seattle –
NL – LAD, Wash, Cubs, St.L, Arz, Maybe Colorado, Maybe Milw
Now who needs a SS or 3rd baseman? – who willing to pay a top prospect and more and who going deep into post season? There is the answer and team he will go to at TD – He will be traded, but not now. TD. Balimore wants to show him off at SS to expand the market for TD That the real truth.
Sorry so long
@ michaelw
Seriously? You think anyone read whatever novel you just wrote? Its just an eyesore
I’m sure some people did. I’m sorry if you can’t read. If you don’t like it then skip over it. I suppose it better than reading all the bs troll stuff.
But it to the point which most people should understand. Most.
Some have no clue. I agree with you his market will fall at TD and Balt will get next to nothing. SS means nothing at this point
So the day after he no shows on FanFest without giving a reason we reward him by giving him what he wants and making us worse defensively. Sounds like a typical day in the Orioles FO.
Could you imagine if the Orioles actually signed Moustakas? 3 4 5 of Davis Trumbo Moose….might as well sign Joey Bats to hit 6th just so you can be certain to kill any and all rallies.
Yeah they hit 10 home runs a game, score 12 runs and their pitching would give up 15 runs. Just like the last 3 years. What’s the point?
Strikeout, HR, double. Wow. Scary
This will be the Orioles biggest move this off season
What a prima donna. I have lost all respect for him. I don’t care how good he is. I do not want him as a free agent next year now. He and his narcissistic ego are not worth half of what his asking price will be.
As much as I give Yank Pat a hard time for trolling my Cubs (all in good fun)
I have to 100% agree with him.
No doubt he will be in Bault this Spring unless someone comes up with an over paid crazy offer.
I don’t see Bault doing better than 4th this year, so he will probably be shipped out at TD to a team who’s a player away from post season or even better.
As far as short stop. This could be good or bad. It does limited his market if he’s dead set on that spot. I don’t think he’s dead set, more of wishful thinking and he would “like” to go back and play it.
I’m sure if the Yankees want him bad enough, and pay him he play were they ask. Money talks BS walks. So it is not like SS or nothing.
As far as playing it. Big difference. Been awhile since he played that spot. His knees may not be able to take it a whole season. Time will tell. A nightmare senerio would be ge gets hurt there then it be the Zack Britton situation part two.
Be interesting that’s for sure.
I’ve been worried about his knees too. Moving to the more demanding shortstop position will put more stress on them
100% correct. Yank Pat Not say he cant play SS. But a whole season is another story. Esp since its been years since he played there. I hate to see him pull something or tweak a knee. Then his market will be a whole other game.
Plus if his defense declines at shortstop due to his knees that would mean his value as a shortstop on the free agent market will take a hit. Long term he’s better suited for third for numerous reasons
For sure it would.
Please no Yankees posts about how it’s certain he’s coming to the Bronx.
If he’s staying at shortstop it would be the complete opposite of him being a sure thing. Di di isn fantastic at the position and there would be 0 reason to move him out of position. Doing so might prove to be more harm than good. Quite frankly I’d rather let andujar develop at third and let the Phillies sign machado lol
I think an overlooked angle of this move is that Machado is worried about his historical legacy. This is a generalization of course, but good defensive shortstops who can hit like Machado are usually viewed in a different light than great defensive third baseman who hit like Manny. It’s the difference between, say, Adrian Beltre’s reputation versus Derek Jeter’s. It’s pretty easy to argue that Beltre statistically has had a better career, but the average baseball fan considers Jeter to be an inner circle Hall of Famer while Beltre has only recently begun to be seen as a future HOFer.
Cuz Jeter played for the Yankees. Yankees have had tons of players make the Hall who weren’t as good as guys who played on other teams at the same time and aren’t in the Hall.
How close is Jomar Reyes to the show? I think he is a third base prospect
Beckham is more valuable at SS. Subpar 3B. Gotta upgrade there.
Good. Now trade him to Arizona for Greinke, Drury, Duplantier, and Pavin Smith
Good move. This guarantees they won’t be able to afford his free agent price. No team benefit here.
If the O’s were smart he would be moved to another team. They are at best 3rd place in the AL East and long shots for the 2nd wc.
Not even 3rd TBH – The Jays have better pitching
ego driven decision. I am one of the best at 3b bit I can make more by being a less successful, though great offensive, SS.
ridiculous
I don’t understand where you get the “Less successful” shortstop. He’s proven in both the minors, and majors he can easily handle short.
Yes , he was younger and didn’t have the wear and tear of being an MLB 3b. Knees, shoulders have been recent issues and playing SS will not help.
He is also bigger now than he was then and thst will impact range as well as add to wear and tear.
Dump him.
Defensive numbers won’t be as good as 3rd. Offensive numbers won’t be as good as 3rd.
Hope he knows what he’s doing.
I don’t understand why some people are so angry he was ok with moving to short. This benefits him, and The Orioles. If The Orioles decide to trade him at the deadline, this will broaden his market for teams in need for a 3rd basemen, and shortstops, and they could get more back because of his versatility. Plus, this will help him in free agency, because more teams could be interested in him, if he didn’t move to short.
One problem with that idea. Teams are NOT going to trade for Manny for 3 months, unless they are 1. in Post Season, and 2. need a SS and 3 willing to take him on a fair cheap deal. Meaning NOT Top prospect(s) or MLB ready pitchers or good players, NOT for 3 months. So it does nothing for him TBH. Esp if he won’t play 3rd. All 3 things have to be there. Otherwise it a waste of time, money, and players. A team not contending shouldn’t touch Macho this year, for what to gain another 4-5 wins. lol.
So it does nothing for him this year. That is for sure. Off season maybe. If he holds out all year long. IF.
Otherwise your looking at him being traded to a team that can resign him in the winter, and needs him at that spot.
And if they can sign him next winter they’re better off waiting until the winter to do that and keeping their prospects
Why fix something that’s not broken. For one, it’s a dumb idea because Beckham probably has never played 3rd base before. 2. I think that it’s a mistake on Machado’s part because he can go down as one of the greatest to ever do it at that position. 3. He’s had 2 major knee surgeries and is moving to the most demanding position in the game. Smh
Not broken?*
I was excited till I read “to shortstop”. Compensation pick to be named later. He’s leaving for nothing.
Exciting news for Fanfest today along with no Machado and no Schoop. They shouldn’t even charge to attend.
Simple process of elimination.
Only 3 teams really need him. Yanks, Cards, Phillies,
Only 3 teams that can get him this year can afford to resign him next Winter
Only 2 of those teams will make post season. Yanks and Cards Or at least one. Yanks lol
Only 1 team could use him at SS – Phillies
All 3 teams can use him at 3rd
Only one team would pay with top prospects Phillies
His market is limited. Unless teams dump players and if so it won’t be any top contending teams.
My guess – he traded at TD to Phillies for next to nothing, and is resigned by them next winter IF he stays at SS. If he willing to move back to 3rd he be a Yankee. Nothing else works – If your being honest, serious and not pipe dreaming. It is a matter of Math and placement
it would seem that a team in contention would give a little more then next to nothing to help them win this year, so hard for me to see him ending up on the phils in that regard..
Phils can certainly afford him- if MM requires being played at shorstop, and crawford moving to third, maybe could do that for a year but crawford is the better defensive short stop long time.. i still have mixed thoughts on Phils signing Machado- for the impact in the lineup, what’s Machado going to be like after he gets paid? is he going to be a team guy or all about himself?
I agree Raef. But if the Phils can get him fairly cheap, key is WHAT is CHEAP?
No team in their right mind is going to send top prospects for a 3 month rental NOT even for Manny if they aren’t contending. What would be the purpose and gain?
Next for the teams that are contending it would have to be near lets say a 98% chance they will go deep into post season, maybe win a title. IF so does Manny give them a better shot, is he the piece that WILL make a difference. With 2016 Cubs it was a no brainier. No doubt wo Chapman the Cubs probably would have won the WS. Even then it was a risk as anything could happen as you saw and they pulled it out. But at least it was in percentage window. Big question is Does the team need him? With Chapman the answer was YES. The next question is at what expense and will it work with the player or players being traded. Balt not just going to give him away for garbage. With the Cubs they gave up a #1 prospect. He was blocked anyway, with all the infield he did no good in the minors. Esp since the opportunity was there to win a title or at least try. It was a rental but the price they paid to AT least have a shot. With the Astros it was Verlander. he was a rental but his contract was high. I do believe no matter what people think WO him, Astros would have fell to the Yanks if not LAD. But those are what your looking at.
With Philly it is a different story. They are not going into post season and for sure to the WS this year. However – If the supply and demand for him at TD is down to a few teams or just one, Balt will trade him. Why wouldn’t they?
In less than 3 months he will be gone. Might as well get something, anything for him. But it wont be no #1 prospects or 3 – 4 players that for sure. If people think that, they are pipe dreaming. IF I do say IF Philly can resign him, then sure it worth trading a few players for him. Not great players, but a few 2nd tier prospects or something like that. I put Philly In there because they are one of very very few teams that can afford him next Winter. You have to be realistic. That is a BIG Cap hit and a BIG contract probably over 10 years plus. As with young players, they will all have to be paid.
The problem with having young prospects and good ones are they will have to be paid at some time. Hard to balance pay role, Lux tax, budget, and sign great players all in one. Takes a good mind and good GM to figure it all out. This is not fantasy baseball.
No different than the Cubs. Sure we want Harper. Sure they have the money for him. But in the block of 4 to 8 years everyone has to be paid on that young team. Including KB – That contract going to be the same or near in the area of Harper, Trout Macho, Mad Max CK. That will be hard to do. It exciting to see all the great players and the BIG 2019 FA season coming. But realistically to see 2-3 of those guys on one team will be near impossible.
Even if one landed both Harper and Manny say, your going to have drop people off that pay role. Now your depending on two guys to lift a 25 man roster, Balance always works better. The Yanks are a good fir for Manny, but they will enver stay under the Cap adding both Harper and Many, impossible. Trying to get YU this year wo him taking a BIG cut like 15 Million a year they can’t do. To add they have Stratton’s contract. I doubt he opps out. I just don’t see anyone paying him more than that in 2 years. Not even the LAD who have their own Lux tax issues. not to mention Seager, belg, have to be paid those wont come cheap, and CK to deal with, Now you see why LAD didn’t get Stratton. Then you add all those young players who will be up. Don’t forget Judge and Torres got pay them. Get it. Not as easy as people think buy buy buy trade trade,
So Unless Balt is 100% sure they resign him next Winter he is gone at TD. Where who knows but only a few teams can really get him that would make it worth the trade.
Cubs Wouldn’t have won the WS wo Champman Typo sorry
Astros Verlander wasn’t a rental Typo Sorry
I got cut off by the edit. But anyway I didn’t say a team going to get him cheap if they are contending. I don’t think they will get as much for him as people think or say, even at SS. he has to be a FIT. The Yanks aren’t going to just get Manny because lets go get Manny. If they really think they need him to win the title this year then ok, shoot 2 2nd tier prospects. Or shoot one of those outfielders, Fraiser lets say… Yank fans will disagree it not worth it, but really if Manny was the missing piece to get them a title this year it is worth it. Really with all the outfielders, and 2019 FA coming up, that be no brainer to me.
But that about what your looking at. Maybe Fraiser and a 2nd tier 3rd tier guy. But on the flip side, Cashman will think, do we really need this guy this year? Can we win the title wo him, and just deal with him in FA?
If I were betting, the Yanks can easy win a title this year wo Manny.
2nd senerio would be take Ellsebury and his contract and a 2nd tier prospect.
Balt fans will call me crazy, and yep probably am, But if I’m going to take Manny for 3 months, that my offer. I have no guarantees he will resign. Most important we don’t need him to win in post season, we don’t need that Bat.
Take it or leave it.
Other than that again, nothing else works for anyone else.
If so I like to know. I’ll tell you why Not
(Wouldn’t have won the WS typo sorry)
Why would the Phillies trade for him!? To make a run on the Braves and 4th in the division????
Your missing the point. They wouldn’t I agree. The only way the Phils trade for him is to get a jump on next years FA.
On the flip side the Phils have a few things going. One they can afford him next year IF he resigned. Most important, again Balt has to find a BUYER.
Just like Miami had to find a Buyer for Stratton.
They started out with the best trades SF and St.L He be there now if he hadn’t blocked the trade.
Then the Market went South. This fell into the Yanks wheelhouse. LAD couldn’t Afford him. The Cubs and Astros didn’t need him. Who’s left? The Yanks
Guess what? Here are offer take it or leave it. Miami had no choice. Played perfect in the Yanks hands.
Anyone will take Manny if it cheap trade esp if they think they can resign him. His market next Winter is not as big as one would think. Again go through the teams you will see..
It is NOT about Philly doesn’t need him this year. It about Balt needs to find a team that will take him, and try to get something before FA. Philly is the best FIT unless The Yanks do something close to what I suggested. Because that is how Cashman will think. I’m a Cubs fans but Cashman is a Brilliant GM and the Yanks are lucky to have him in the FO.
My what is missing the point?
Trading for him does not get them a jump on next year’s FA. They will have to pay the market rate to sign him no matter what so why give up prospects on top of that?
You say the Phillies can afford him. If that is the case it will be the case regardless of who he ends the season with. Machado has NO value to the Phillies at this point because they will NOT contend and he will NOT take an extension. They wouldn’t even trade a fringe prospect for him. What they will do is wait until next offseason and sign him away from the Orioles.
Oh wow you know proper grammar! Way to go bud!
Yes and if you had paid attention in school you would have too.
Ha, pretty sure I did dumb dumb. Go catch those Pokémon! Your mom says hi!
Yeah your missing the point Ryan.
Don’t take it personal.
Teams are not going to just trade for Manny to just trade for him. Their is no point. There still has to be a purpose. You just don’t trade for a player wo cause.
To add you be disrupting a core.
Exsample. Let’s say the Cubs traded for him. Your looking at 3 players at the very least. So even if you did Russle, Happ and say Baez or AA sure you get Manny but your giving up control a good 5 years worth and several players to add making more holes than your filling which in all honesty don’t need to be filled. The biggest thing is him resigning. You can dance around with wishful thought all you want he still has to resign. Again if you read it NOT about the Phil’s needing him it’s about Bault finding a fit n a buyer. Only 2 teams make the fit at this point.
Balt will have to trade them by TD. They have no choice. They have to find a buyer. They have to find anyone who could use him but in return get something worth while. If not they lose everything unless they resign him. So yeah your missing the point. You can pick this team n that team all you want but they also have to give up a lot. For what 3 months on the hope he resigns. Come on man.
I hear your debate but have yet to hear what you think and we’re he goes. You can criticize me but you either don’t have a clue or just posting a rebuttal wo any back up. Your missing the point that for sure. Am I 100% he go to the Phil’s. Nope I’m not but it is one of few fits. It also has one a few teams that Balt will have an option for. Just like Stratton trade, Yelich trade. Yelich would have have been a Blue Jay today if G Jr went in the trade. They kept their prospect unlike Milw.
That’s 5. Years control. Who do think going to pay a #1 prospect for 3 months of control. Not many teams.
You really think Balt going to hold on to him all season? Lol you are not very smart are you? If you were a GM you be terrible at it.
Maybe being a SD has your brain in another direction.
If I were the owner and you were the GM and held on to Manny the complete season you be fired the next day. Yeah you missed the point, the boat and everything inbetween.
At least my parents aren’t first cousins like yours.
Only teams that are contending at the deadline are fits for Manny. That eliminates the Phillies. No team that isn’t contending is going to give up anything with control and upside for a guy they are at risk of losing after the season.
Actually if I were the GM I would trade Manny to the highest bidder right now. And none of this “Hold onto him because the offers aren’t good enough” or “Has to have a window to negotiate an extension” nonsense. Offers aren’t going to get better at the deadline and Machado isn’t signing an extension.
Ha, kid you probably don’t even know who your daddy is! Your mom is like that song, she’s been everywhere man!
So apparently incest is legal in Missouri. That explains you.
I’m from Illinois dumba$$. I work for the state of Missouri. Hour south of Chicago is where I’m from. So nice try. Go read some more comments about how I proved you wrong. Oh and I played baseball agains Roark. Ya know, the Nationals starter/swingman. Has a brother who isn’t near as good. They are actually from the incest town in Illinois. Called Wilmington. Anyways, you’re a moron who obviously has mommy and daddy issues. Keep on keeping on, loser.
The only state you work for is the state of confusion. And the only one with mommy and daddy issues here is you, with those issues being the fact that they are first cousins.
Trade him before spring training. They are making a huge mistake by hanging on the Him.