The market for Greg Holland has seemingly been tepid, at best, in recent months. Two teams that have at least considered him as of late, per FanRag’s Jon Heyman, are the Braves and the D-backs. Atlanta has “checked in” on Holland, while Arizona has considered a run at him as well. One oft-connected team that doesn’t seem likely is the Nationals, as Heyman adds that the they’re “not planning” to pursue him at this juncture of the offseason. (That aligns with comments GM Mike Rizzo made to the media early this afternoon.)
The Diamondbacks already have a plethora of arms vying for bullpen spots, though as the Arizona Republic’s Nick Piecoro recently pointed out, there are potentially as many as three spots up for grabs. Archie Bradley is considered to be among the ninth-inning favorites in D-backs camp, with Brad Boxberger and Yoshihisa Hirano also vying for saves, but Holland would give them a more established arm and deepen the overall bullpen mix in a year Arizona plans to contend. Payroll, of course, could be an issue for the D-backs, though it wasn’t long ago that they were trying to find creative ways to fit J.D. Martinez onto the books.
As for the Braves, their late-inning mix is also murky. Arodys Vizcaino figures to open the year in the ninth inning, with Jose Ramirez, A.J. Minter and Sam Freeman among the setup options helping form the bridge from the rotation to Vizcaino. There’s obviously strong incentive for the Braves to forgo signing Holland. As a rebuilding club that may not yet be ready to contend, the Braves surely don’t relish the idea of surrendering draft picks to sign a player who rejected a qualifying offer.
I’d add that at the same time, the Braves needn’t fret much over the international forfeitures they’d face, as they’ll he handcuffed in that regard anyhow following the November scandal that prompted John Coppolella to resign as GM. Beyond that, high-end bullpen arms are always in demand at the deadline, and it’s not outlandish to think the Braves could receive a better prospect than the one they’d acquire with the third round pick they’d be forced to punt. (Losing the slot value of that pick in their draft pool, however, would limit their ability to get creative, though.)
Finding teams that make sense as an on-paper fit for Holland is hardly a problem. Virtually any club in the league could stand to improve by pushing its seventh-best reliever to the minors and adding Holland to the bullpen mix. However, we’ve already seen a significant portion of the league largely sit out the free agent market, and at this stage of the offseason, more teams are up against payroll limits and reluctant to forfeit a draft/international considerations. There’s still enough time in spring that Holland could potentially make a handful of appearances before Opening Day, but the longer he waits, the more his early-season availability will be called into question.
I know right
Angels need someone. Anyone.
“Angels need someone. Anyone.”
You’re right, but the Angels are really in a soft rebuild. They aren’t giving up the draft pick and they won’t trade any of their real prospects.
When this season ends Mike Trout is going to dominate the trade rumors. Shohei Ohtani is the Angels future face player.
Arte would never let Trout be traded, no matter how much sense it makes
What if Trout told him he was out of there when his contract expires? I don’t know why Trout has a fascination with coming back “home” but that’s what we’ve been fed for five years. If it was me I’d be very happy playing there and enjoying a mansion on a cliff in Laguna.
Huh? Casey needs to take better care of her partner and keep him off the drugs lol.
Trout has said forever he wants to be an Angel for life. Their whole core is locked into long term deals, aren’t they?
Casey is a he not a she I think.
Casey’s Partner is a multi-account troll. Do trolls have a particular sex?
“Casey needs to take better care of her partner”
Google: John Middleton Felony Fraud
cxcx……He is the poster formally known as “free_aec” who had his accounts banned from MLB, to Fox sports, to twitter. His blog under his “former name” claims to be a Phillies fan site but is purely vitriolic in nature.
Casey is in reference to Casey Affleck and partner refers to John P. Middleton, the son of John S. Middleton, principal Phillies owner. Middleton the younger is business partners with Affleck and it irritates CP/free_aec to no end as he hates all MLB ownership, but especially the Phillies. When David Montgomery was principal owner he ranted on and on about him.
You know way too much about this. 😉
Wtf lol
BlueSky…if you mean me (so hard to tell on this format) it’s only because my Cousin remembered the name. I knew the rants about the Phillies were familiar when CP started posting and mentioned it to my cousin, an avid MLBTR reader/former poster. He connected the dots and CP/free_aec confirmed it in a long post when he was banned from MLBTR a few months back. His disturbing life is an open book online.
Cat Mando, yes, you!
Such a trail of tears.
BlueSky…..disabled and too much time on my hands…I get bored…lol
Just because you’ve convinced yourself Trout will be a Philly, doesn’t mean its a given.
Being an Angel for life is not a given either. Trout did ask for a longer extension when they were negotiating but Arte said no. Trout has said “I love it in Anaheim. I can’t say enough about this organization” but he has never said I want to be an Angel for life. He has also said “”Obviously I have a couple more years on my contract, Growing up as a kid, you always want to play for your team,” and he returns home to NJ in the offseason. Anything is possible.
IIRC free_aec had legal troubles, no?
“IIRC free_aec had legal troubles, no?”
Google: John Middleton Felony Fraud
czontixhldr…..In (a paraphrasing of) his own words….Google: free_aec
Core? If the Angels have a core it is very shaky. Besides Trout, the team is not set up to be contending in the future legitimately or right now. Although teams would hate the idea of trading the best player in the game, if the angles were to do so they’d be set up for a long time with the MLB Ready top prospects theyd get. For example, the Braves would have to fork over Acuna, Albies, Gohara, and probably two other players. I don’t think thatd be smart of the Braves but I know there’s a team that would trade something like that. This would set the Angels up to be serious contenders.
Sounds like CP has a personal knowledge of federal convictions…
No need for the braves to go after him honestly unless we think he’ll be an impact for the next couple years. In my opinion we need every pitching slot as possible to allow for the young arms to compete and prove who they are. No need to block a slot with a heavy contract.
Deal him at the deadline?
I completely disagree. Make the young guys fight for a spot, too many guys have already been handed jobs and not ran with them. If the young guys end up being better, deal him at the deadline.
I agree. Giving up a draft pick to sign a reliever in a non competitive year isn’t smart baseball. This is the year the Braves need to play as many of the MLB ready youngsters as possible. In 2019 the team will then have a better idea of what they need in a loaded free agent class.
As the article said though … if Holland pitches well for the Braves and they signed him to a one year deal they should be able to deal him at the deadline for a greater return than the 3rd round pick they’d forfeit … as much as I’d like to see AJ Minter pitch his way into the closer role I think signing Holland and flipping him could prove to be a prudent move
The Braves are dependent on the draft with no international money already would you rather just have aa work worth handcuffs or handcuffs and ankle cuffs?
Not dependent on the draft if they add through trades
But is drafting a guy who is 5 years out with a third round pick going to *potentially* be better than whatever you may end up getting in July? I can see both sides of the coin. You could always end up Jason Grilli-ing and blowing out your Achilles pretty much the night of a trade or flat out being terrible.
The past few trade deadlines have shown that clubs are increasingly reticent to give up much value at all for pure rentals.
Maybe, but, at the same time, they could use his leadership to help shape up the bullpen.
Was it a draft pick? I mean really? How many draft picks actually pan out?
I mean, I understand the desire to grab him and flip him for prospects. But the braves need to phase out of that this year and let this abundance of prospects compete with each other and gain experience at the big league lvl while expectations aren’t exactly high. Time for signing guys and flipping them for prospects are kinda over. Ur current resources are all we should flip at this point and signing Holland with the intention to flip him just isn’t worth it if it takes innings away from the young guys. PLUS flipping him is under the assumption he performs well and stays healthy. U would be investing a lot of money and taking away valuable experience from the kids to hope the stars line up perfectly for u to flip him lol. To me, just isn’t worth it
I would sign him for 3/35 or something. I would love to have him for what I think would be half of what Kimbrel should cost
Cards should pick him and Cobb up on one year deals.
In a perfect Card fan world. Keep dreaming. But as MO says believe believe Card fans. With MM right up his @$$. We are a very good team with who we have. Believe. Believe. Mean time he buying new tires for his Ferarri with ticket money from fans. Believe. Lol
I know they won’t do it. Probably won’t sign either one. But they have too much faith in their pitching staff and should be grabbing at least one of them on a 1yr deal.
I was only giving bs bud. Just playing with you.
I’d be more worried about a reliever than SP
TBH as a Cub fan. I don’t understand why they didn’t get Lynn back. He’s better than Cobb trust me. Watch his stats with Minn this year. Now I’d be mad at brass about that
I am. They should’ve signed Reed and Nicasio, too.
You do know it takes two to sign a contract right. Sure you can.pay more than other teams and they might sign there. But players get a say also. It’s not a free agent draft. Teams, or fans more precisely, can’t just say we sign him.
Who cares what anybody buys with money they earn? Even if he was “buying tires for his new Ferrari” really what business would it be of any fan?
I read the just BSing comment after sorry lol
The Cardinals are now and for the long term a wildcard hopeful team
No. Both are downgrades to the current options.
They’re current options at starter, after Martinez, are all high upside with major injury and inexperience risks. They need another arm in there for depth, if nothing else.
They have Gregerson tagged to close. No way Holland isn’t an upgrade over whoever ends up being the 7th reliever. I wouldn’t sign Holland to a multi-year deal, but he’s going to sign for a year at $10 mil or less. I’d take it.
They currently have 7 starters to give innings to. Cobb has a 4.38 projected FIP this year.
That’s behind Martinez, Wacha, Mikolas, Weaver, and Flaherty, and barely ahead of Wainwright’s projected 4.40
You want the cards to waste money and picks on a guy for depth?
Leone is pretty clearly the OD closer, and if he falters than Gregerson who was riddled with bad luck last year, will take over.
Holland would be the Cards projected 8th best reliever based on projected FIP, 3.87
These guys aren’t upgrades.
Mikolas has done nothing in MLB to prove that he’s better than Cobb. Get out of here with that nonsense.
So it’s called a projection, and there is plenty of data on both to create that projection.
Holland’s projections aren’t better than the current options, and Cobb would be the 6th starter.
Both cost money and draft picks and international money and would limit the teams flexibility to add at the deadline
The Cards are going to need more than 5 starters. Probably more than 6. No way that rotation stays effective and healthy all season.
They should be gathering as many arms who can pitch in late innings as possible because the bullpen will have to be sorted out on the fly. If they only got one, I’d prefer Cobb b/c you could still bump a young starter to the pen.
The average team uses 7 starters per year for at least 5 starts
Martinez
Wacha
Wainwright
Flaherty
Mikolas
Weaver
Reyes
Beyond that, there is Gomber and Greene. And in season additions are possible if things get out of hand
He does have a point. Money n pick. St L should have got Lynn. Least he can eat innings.
I would’ve preferred Lynn, but too late now.
Twins should pick him up.
How amazing it would be to capitalize again on this market
Angels…
Braves can sign Holland to two year contract, loading more money on the back end of deal.
Angels at $6.5? Yes? Please?
The Braves actually would lose a 4th round pick, not the 3rd round pick. It was forfeited already in the MLB punishment handed out last fall.
good point! thank you.
Another bad misjudgment of the market by Boras for a client. Walked away from an offer of 3/51 from the Rockies (not to mention a QO) and is looking at significantly less for one year now.
3/52
We don’t actually know if he was offered that much. They signed Davis, a better reliever for that much. Were left guessing on what he turned down.
I saw it was 3/52 on some site. USA today think. Then the went Davis. It was stated what they offer was
Not even a good p anymore.
If the Brewers went maybe 2/18 or 3/27 on him, with Holland, Knebel, and Harder on the back couple innings, maybe our starting rotation is good enough. We sure should be able to hit. Unconventional a bit, but smarter than 126,000,000 for Darvish. Just thinking out loud, but could work….
*Hader. Damn autocorrect…lol
Watch Lackey back to StL for a 1 yr 2 mil deal. Heard it here first.
I thought the Rangers were considering Holland?
Dodgers.
A good fit, but not going to happen.
Some of the numbers you guys are throwing out are ridiculous with him. He’s not getting what he wanted. If I was a team right now I’d offer him 1/3.5. Don’t like it don’t sign
He’ll get more than that. Neil Walker had zero interest, couldn’t get anything better than a minor league invite and Yanks still gave him 5 million.
I’d offer him 2 years, year 1 at 6 million, year 2 at 10 million with player option and a 2 million dollar buyout. Throw in some standars incentives
Phillies make sense, ton of spending capacity and already punted a pick.
See if he’ll take something lame like 3/$25. It’d be a bigger guarantee than the QO at least so he could save a little face.
Where did everybody go who thought Holland was smart to turn down the QO?
He got offered Wade Davis’ contract, so they weren’t wrong? He was (arguably) smart to turn down the QO. It was dumb to turn down that rockies’ offer.
He was smart to turn down one year at $17m? How many relief pitchers ever see that kind of money for one year of work?
$17mm plus the new guarantee of never receiving a QO again.
That too. He has to be kicking his own backside halfway around the planet for not taking it.
Wondering now, when does the QO draft pick burden disappear? I assume it doesn’t follow him around forever.
This makes no sense. A team should be interested just to be able to flip him for prospects at the TD like the Yankees did when they traded for Chapman in the off season. Pay him for half a year and get 1-2 good prospects. Duh.
I wish he’d sign a one year deal with the Cubs
Dodgers need him as a setup man
They would have to clear some cap space. Kemp might get moved if he keeps playing good.
Why would they move him if he’s playing good? They need him if he’s playing good. If he’s hitting for average and power he’s a must keep to play LF . Defense may be complete garbage but I’d take it if he’s hitting.
That’s just the point. Kemp’s bat this spring might well win him a roster spot and he’s the only player on the roster who the Dodgers can realistically move to give them the payroll space for another free agent signing opportunity.
Wish Dodgers would get him but he wants more than what they wanna offer
Clearly he wants more than any team is offering. It doesn’t appear the Dodgers are offering him anything and they aren’t going to offer him anything unless they can clear the payroll. No signs of that happening.
I hope that the Cubs have opened up a spot on their MLB roster with the release of Justin Grimmin in order to sign FA closer Greg Holland. It’s getting late in spring training and Holland is running out of time and options before opening day. His QO could be a hindrance to a rebuilding team like the Braves and his contract demands would likely dissuade the Cardinals who have never been fond of signing expensive free agent relievers.
I’m guessing that Holland would settle for a shorter term deal with a higher AAV at this point, perhaps a one year contract with an option or two year deal with an opt-out. If that’s the case, why not sign with a team like the Cubs who are a strong World Series contender that also currently lacks a dominating closer on its pitching staff.
I’m tired of all the negativity surrounding Holland’s dismal second half performance with the Rockies last season. Fact is, he only had one bad month in August in which he surrendered multiple runs in 5 of eleven appearances which killed his otherwise stellar numbers during the season. He finished 2017 with a strong September before allowing a couple of runs in a non-save situation wild card loss to the Diamondbacks in October. It’s also best to keep in mind that Holland was pitching half of his games in Colorado and also coming off a lost 2016 season to injury. Is it not possible that he hit a wall in August due to not pitching in 2016?
Some also say the Cubs may be reluctant to part with a second round draft pick by signing Holland. A counter argument could be made that they have already gained two compensatory picks when their own similarly tagged FA’s signed elsewhere, Jake Arrieta with the Phillies and as irony would have it, last season’s closer Wade Davis with the Rockies.
If Holland is willing to sign a short term deal guaranteed only for the 2018 season it would behoove the Cubs to be the team that signs him. Holland could potentially be eligible for free agency once again next offseason, one in which he won’t have to worry about being tagged with a QO ever again.
Not that All-Star selection is always the best indicator of a player since it often is based on their first half stats but Holland was one last season. He also earned the honor twice before with the Royals.
Cub fans really ought to check out his career numbers and even those from last season. Holland was coming off a missed 2016 season due to TJ surgery in September of 2015 which kept him from being the Royals closer in their World Championship season. He was their closer the season before and pitched flawlessly despite his team losing to the Giants in 7 games that year. Fact is, up until his performance in last year’s wild card game, Holland had given up just one run in 11 postseason innings with the Royals in 2014. He’s was also one of the truly dominant closers in a Royal bullpen that was so good Wade Davis was their setup man until taking over the role late in the 2015 season when Holland had his surgery.
Clearly Holland was sufficiently recovered from the TJ surgery last season to post the numbers he did with the Rockies. An unhealthy pitcher wouldn’t post 41 saves along with only allowing 40 hits in 57.2 IP’s if he was still hurt or lost a great amount of velocity. Did I also mention that Holland stuck out 70 batters in those same amount of innings giving him an 11.0/9 ratio that nearly matched his career metric of 11.9/9? I should also point out that the righty throwing Holland cut his same hand index finger on August 3rd last season, the month in which he allowed 14 of his 24 runs in just 5 appearances. He never went on the DL and continued to pitch around the cut which had to effect his feel for the baseball and his release point. He finished strong in September before becoming a FA. Holland is also 32-years old, two months younger than Wade Davis who did get paid by the Rockies in free agency despite his own QO following his excellent 2017 season as the Cubs closer.
With Holland likely available at a great discount now, why wouldn’t the Cubs sign him to either be their closer or as an insurance policy in case Brandon Morrow struggles in the role. Morrow is 33 and has 18 career saves in his 11 MLB season including just 2 last season as Kenley Jansen’s setup man with the Dodgers. Holland has 186 saves in his 7 year career that also saw him average 42 per season during his last 4 years in the role in 2013, 2014, 2015 and 2017. To me it’s a no-brainer, especially if Holland is also being pursued by the division rival Cardinals or the Nationals in the East, both teams lacking a proven and dominating closer, just like the Cubs. How does subtracting Justin Grimm from the roster and replacing him with Holland instead of Eddie Butler not make the Cubs a better team in 2018?