8:13pm: Beltran will not receive any of the approximately $3MM owed to him over the course of his three-year deal with the Mets, the New York Post’s Ken Davidoff reports. The team has instead made a $200K donation to Beltran’s charitable foundation.
12:25pm: The Mets have formally announced Beltran’s ousting. COO Jeff Wilpon and general manager Brodie Van Wagenen issued the following statement:
We met with Carlos last night and again this morning and agreed to mutually part ways. This was not an easy decision. Considering the circumstances, it became clear to all parties that it was not in anyone’s best interest for Carlos to move forward as Manager of the New York Mets. We believe that Carlos was honest and forthcoming with us. We are confident that this will not be the final chapter in his baseball career. We remain excited about the talent on this team and are committed to reaching our goals of winning now and in the future.
12:07pm: Carlos Beltran’s time as manager of the Mets will apparently come to a close before he even suits up for a game. Yahoo’s Tim Brown reports (via Twitter) that Beltran has informed the Mets he feels it is best if he steps down.
Beltran was named in commissioner Rob Manfred’s report on the findings of his investigation into the Astros’ sign-stealing scheme earlier this week. While Beltran was a player at the time and wasn’t expected to be disciplined by the league as a result, reports over the past 24 hours have indicated that the Mets have been mulling his future in light of his connection to the scandal.
Whether the decision truly rested with Beltran or whether the wording of the reports (and, presumably, the forthcoming announcement) was structured in a way to allow Beltran to save face to some extent isn’t known at this time. Regardless, his ousting as manager now means that every person listed in Manfred’s Astros report — Astros GM Jeff Luhnow, Astros manager A.J. Hinch, Red Sox manager Alex Cora (formerly Houston’s bench coach) and Beltran — have now lost their jobs in the wake of a scandal that has increasingly shaken Major League Baseball as a whole.
It’s worth emphasizing that The Athletic’s report that broke the Astros’ sign-stealing scandal wide open was published two weeks after Beltran was named Mets manager. As such, there’s no reason to believe that Beltran was asked about the scandal during the interview process — let alone any reason to believe that he was untruthful with the Mets during interviews. That said, Beltran did tell the New York Post’s Joel Sherman shortly after the scandal was brought to public light that he was “not aware of that camera,” denying any improper utilization of technology.
Two months later, Manfred’s report indicated the following: “Approximately two months into the 2017 season, a group of players, including Carlos Beltrán, discussed that the team could improve on decoding opposing teams’ signs and communicating the signs to the batter.”
The Mets, incredibly, are now the third team seeking a new manager in mid-January. They’ll likely interview a mix of internal and external candidates, and it’s worth noting that the club did interview bench coach Hensley Meulens and quality control coach Luis Rojas in its initial search following the firing of Mickey Callaway. While other clubs throughout the league might be less inclined to allow members of their coaching staff to interview now that Spring Training looms in the near future, ESPN analyst Eduardo Perez was also reported to be a leading candidate in New York’s most recent search. One would imagine that he could once again factor prominently into the club’s hunt for a skipper.
Not a huge surprise.
Jessica Mendoza to take over?
Eduardo Perez is the best candidate to be next Mets manager.
Mendoza, Perez…they’re a little too much in the ESPN Sunday Night baseball team. If that’s the case, give me Tim Kurkjian or Karl Ravech.
I usually put the game on mute and play music when my team plays on SNB. The whole production has been terrible for a long time with awful broadcasters and over analyzing one play that happened three innings ago, and it’s even worse with all the statcast BS now.
True, I’d only have MLB Network if MLB did the smart thing and sold it as an individual stream and not have to buy a bunch of useless channel packages, but then they brought John Hart back — and I can’t watch that guy. It’s like watching Joe Buck without John Smoltz.
Same for MNF. That’s just as bad, if not worse.
Agree. It’s hard to listen too. Bring back John Miller!
I can’t even watch because they put that awful K Zone on the screen. It’s insane to me that they’d cover up the live action with a graphic that means absolutely nothing. The only strike zone that matters is the Ump’s and baseball has so much time to show replays that it boggles my mind that they’d put it on top of the live action. It’s like when FOX tried to put that blue dot on top of the hockey puck. Maddening, and makes the game unwatchable for me.
Love me some MLB.TV
No blackouts for my team and I can listen to the opponents broadcast or radio overlaying the TV broadcast. Or park sounds
At least with MNF you have an endless supply of Boog quotes and inevitables memes, which I can’t get enough. Seeing him patrol the sideline 20-ft up with a monitor providing rapid-fire sound-bites is exactly what this ADHD generation needs to tune into organized violence.
Well, yes, there are local blackouts. And for us NYC residents, that means Mets/Yankees – and no, I’m not paying for SNY to watch 20 games/year of Braves vs. Mets.
I’m with you there. I hate the homer chucklehead broadcasters and all the statcast crap. It doesn’t matter to me whether a home run ball barely made it over the outfielder’s glove or knocked a few pixels out of the scoreboard.
But Booger is great and knowledgeable! He said OJ was one of the best QBs of all time!
You sir are correct. Where have you gone Joe Morgan and Jon Miller? It is not easy to watch or listen to.
@excusemeflo
I usually mute the TV when the Cubs play on ESPN and put on the radio stream.
Best of both worlds I guess.
Pat Hughes and Ron Coomer are a pretty good team.
Amazing that they make us pine for the days of Jon Miller and Joe Morgan.
Honestly anybody in Bay Area broadcasting is great except D. Braden, who’s been ESPN-ified. We seem to be the only media market whose announcers don’t yell at you or brim with smugness that would make Bob Costas blush.
Agree. I try to listen and within five minutes the volume if not the game is off.
Definitely not the old Pat and Ron, but Coomer has done a nice job. Still miss me some Santo though!
Or as a Sox fan having to listen to Michael Kay. I can’t believe the same guy can be so good daily in the radio and so much a homer almost as bad as The Scooter. For some reason, I enjoyed listening to Bobby Mercer in the booth as well as both Frank Messer and Bill White. I used to pray though for the late innings when The Money Store man left for the GW bridge.
On the radio, no he doesn’t fit in it…
I do like boog, sad they took him out of the rc lift to put him upstairs. It’s not the same.
I loved the blue dot on the puck and have watched hockey since 1966
is Showalter unavailable?
Terry Collins!
Eduardo Perez mumbles too much. He needs to speak up!
Another puertican? ♂️
Oh man, if the Mets hire Eduardo Perez, this will bring great joy and laughter to so many Marlins fans.
Please oh please let Mendoza take over. It will never happen but a guy can wish.
For what possible reason would Mendoza “take over?”
As punishment for the Mets hiring someone who was part of the Astros sign stealing scandal.
y should the mets b punished? silly.
Because they are the Mets, they will do anything for attention.
Including hiring a softball player to manage big leaguers, lol.
Don’t put it past them.
Oh yeah. I am sure this was his idea.
But she never even played the game at any professional level. And
you want her to manage
the Mets!!?? Is that because you want her to
fall hard (splat!) on her face?
She usually does every time she opens her mouth. In my view, she’s one of the most overrated personalities at ESPN,
LOL she thinks she is an ex MLB player because ESPN wanted to be woke. Thank you Mike Fiers!
She was basically blaming Fiers for this mess lol. I doubt it.
She’s blaming people?
She should be thanking
them for giving her
something to talk about!
She never lacks for anything to talk about. Unfortunately it usually doesn’t have anything to do with what’s occurring on the field.
She was right when she said Fiers benefited from the cheating in 2017. I’m no Mendoza fan and her answer to Golic is why she’s not a great broadcaster but she was not wrong pointing out Fiers’ hypocrisy. He may as well give back his World Series ring.
@WereAllJustGuestsHere
Fiers’s hypocrisy… He’s been a heckuva lot more honest than Altuve. Altuve should give back his MVP Award.
Funny how as soon as Fiers wasn’t benefitting from the cheating, his moral compass, all of a sudden, got fixed.
I get bored with this “lets hate on Mike Fiers” thing. Yes, I’m an A’s fan. At least he had the plums to blow that whistle. He was off the post season 25 man, so got no share of the post season money? He got a ring? Which has a very hollow ring to it…
He was one of three or four players from the 2017 Astros that admitted wrongdoing – but is the only one named and thus is being hung drawn and quartered. So what about your interpretation of his moral compass.?Why not tar him in pine and feathers (for another no hitter or two)
Go and sit with Judge Judy.
Pine tar equals greenies
Technology equals PEDS
Is there really much if a difference between the greenies that we’re available then and energy drinks that are available today? Purpose of five hour energy is the same as the amphetamines back in the day. Both made you alert and neither gave you more strength or got you back earlier from injuries.
no.
Meaning: no to this equivalence argument. You obviously don’t understand amphetamines if you are saying caffeine and other natural stimulants are the same.
Trying to protect those she’s fond of. I get that but it was simply the wrong time and place. Trying to protect anyone involved is a losing proposition. It’s normally great for a reporter to be the first, just not in this case. What Fiers did was refreshing and as I said before, if he played on Oakland in the late 80s, maybe the PED nightmare would have been handled better. It would have taken a domino effect with many other players publicly shaming the users but who knows?
Well said, dewey…
After what she said? Nada.
Mendoza is atrocious
Hitting a softball is nothing like hitting a baseball…unless you ask someone like Mendoza who likely thinks she could do both. She’s wrong.
Nope. It’s gonna be BamBam.
George Bamburger?
Pebbles boyfriend?
If laughing and saying stupid things on the air constantly is the prerequisite for being a successful manager, then Mendoza is a shoo-in.
Badda Bing!
He was a Yankee for awhile so the fact he cheated is no surprise.
Sorry you have daddy issues.
He was a met first
Why is Jessica a thing for both sides? She’s a random front office employee.
You’re kidding, right?
May as well do it right this time and hire Francesa.
With Mad Dog as co-manager. Would be the best post game pressers ever.
Ozzie Guillen next Mets Mgr.
Bring back Bobby V!
I WOULD LOVE TO SEE KEITH HERNANDEZ BE THE METS NEXT MANAGER ..
Dude, WTF is wrong with Jessica Mendoza? Comes out and criticizes Fiers like she doesn’t know damned well that if Fiers went to MLB, they would have swept this thing under the rug like they already did for like 3 years?
The reality of it is that Fiers and a dozen other people have probably GONE to the league already. And nothing happened.
On a side note, I also sort of suspect that Beltran learned to do this in St. Louis. Remember how much “integrity” went into “the Cardinal Way” when they got caught employing a hacker to steal other teams’ scouting information?
Wanna bet they weren’t also using cameras to steal signs?
Good to get that over with. I think everyone knew it was coming.
Lmao classic Mets
Nah – classic Mets would have been to keep him and stand by him while the team suffered bad press. This was actually uncharacteristic
I agree with luclusciano, I just got done sending an angry email to a fellow Mets fan saying when are they going to do the right thing and fire Beltran.
They had to be dragged kicking and screaming; glad it is over.
Hard enough being a Mets fan…
“Cano sucks” and “fire Beltran” and “it’s hard being a Mets fan”. You know, you can go elsewhere.
But it’s so hard to take your eyes off of the Flushing Meadows dumpster fire!
Yes I can and I can also comment on 2 very bad moves the Met’s made and I am not alone on.
That is what this opinion board is for or in this snowflake society should we all just sing Kumbuya
I am a loyal fan for decades so I just don’t switch just to make it easy and be a fair weather fan
Luis Rojas or Mullens
Dang
Shame.
Not a shame. That mole on the side of the head is the interim manager. Big numbers guy. Mole.
Uh, what?
welp…I wanted Showalter anyway. come back no NY Buck
You did the right thing Carlos.
No he didn’t – that’s why the Mets let him go.
That comment went right
over your head…..
My head? Maybe you can help to explain? A lot of articles are saying he did the right thing by stepping down, he didn’t step down. The Mets did him a solid by saying you can step down or be fired, your choice.
Figures. The cheater has more integrity than the do-nothing Mets management.
The Mets may have told him he could resign rather than being fired.
No.
Wouldn’t surprise me if the Madoffs refused Beltran’s resignation and attacked the media.
Madoffs?
Is there no end to the Madoff skullduggery?!
They likely gave him the option of stepping down or being fired
Gee, you think?
Awesome comment
Resigning is better for Mets. They don’t have to pay his contract or buy him out.
Stupid comment
Mistake
needed to happen
Bang the trash can! Beltran was undefeated as Mets GM! GOAT!
**Pardon…meant Mets manager
Beautiful
He’s also winless
love this take
only boosts his HoF chanses
Sarcasm or stupidity?
both
Yes for trivia fans only 2 NY managers/coaches to never lose a game? Beltran & Belichek. Both cheaters.
Mets – Buck Showalter
Red Sox – Dusty Baker
Astros – John Gibbons
I would love this because it would be like an extra punishment for Sox and Astros
LOL!
Mets aren’t going to pay up to get Buck
you mean the guy who would have been out of a job for another year if not for these new openings?
Exactly. They could have had Giradi if they were willing to pay up. They want to go cheap.
Boom now they are fools
Now? Haha.
Red Sox – Jason Varitek
The chances Chaim Bloom hires Dusty Baker are zero. He’s hiring someone stats oriented who’s willing to take direction from the front office, similar to Baldelli and Cash.
And Roberts!
Clint Hurdle is wondering where he fits in.
He barely fits into his man muumuu
Hurdle would be a good transition choice. He did a lot with very little in Pittsburgh until he finally stopped drinking the Nutting Kool-Aid.
Buck lives in Dallas. He wants the Astros job would be my guess.
No Dusty, please, say the starting pitchers.
Buck no
wow
Well this whole ordeal made the league look like “trash” with all these “cannings”.
Very nice
I see what you did there.
Well done sir!
Nope.
On the weak side…..
Lol mets
Most logical move. Mets need to move forward with someone who doesn’t have egg smear on their face from the fallout with Houston.
The smart move would be to just give the job to Bam Bam Meulens since they just hired him as bench coach. A new search is not great PR right now.
Still stupid players didn’t get punishment.
This is a start.
Well, not really. It’s their employers that are doing it, not MLB. What would be a start is Crane to do an internal investigation and suspend/fire any active players that were involved or key figures (coaches, etc.).
That on top of spring training, finding a new GM/manager and fill out your available roster while teaching your wet behind the ears son the family business…? And we’re not even talking about the legal ramifications when MLBPA gets involved for suspending players for actions almost 3 years ago. If you see junk ahead you walk around it, you don’t step into the middle of it.
Crane should have been punished. LALALALA I can’t see my players and coaches installing equipment LALALALA I have no idea about anything baseball LALALALA
It Crane steps up and fines\suspends players he would become my favorite owner in sports! The Comish doesn’t have the stones to do it, but it needs to be done
MLB didn’t want to give the MLBPA any excuse to raise a ruckus and turn it into something much bigger than it already is.
Players won’t be punished at all. Players union protects them.
Players union is supposed to protect ALL players, I doubt the players on the 15-25 innocent teams feel protected right now
“…15-25 innocent teams…” LOL, far less than that amount…
More like the 3-5 innocent teams! Why do you think every team has 4-5+ different sets of signs and constantly changes them throughout the game? It’s because they know cameras are on them and someone is watching what the catchers are putting down. They used to only do this when runners reached second base. Now signs are being changed at the start of an inning and sometimes in the middle of each inning with no runners on base! Every team knows it is being done, most likely because they do something similar themselves. I just hope that it stops here and more disgruntled ex-players don’t start singing like canaries too. I do believe that with Manfred’s harsh penalties, this will finally come to a grinding halt; however, there are 20+ teams (and MLB too) holding their collective breaths that nothing leaks out about what they were doing or have done in the past. Yankees were fined in 2017 for inappropriate use of cameras too, so this most likely goes a lot deeper than just Houston and Boston. Houston certainly took it to a whole new level and were probably the only ones smug (or stupid) enough to signal batters from the dugout about the upcoming pitch, but there’s no question that a host of other teams were reviewing in game tapes to get some sort of home field advantage, whether it be actual sign stealing or tipping of pitches.
Yankees were NOT fined for inappropriate use of cameras in 2017. They were fined for having a phone. The commissioner’s office looked into the Red Sox’s suspicious allegation that the NYY used the YES Network and found the claim “had no merit” due to “insufficient evidence.” Stop LYING, Dorothy. And stop deflecting.
There’s 15 teams TRYING to lose, why would they cheat to win?
“Why do you think every team has 4-5+ different sets of signs and constantly changes them throughout the game?”
Because they are nervous about the opposition picking up signs. What the Astros and Red Sox did was different. Joe Baseball picking up signs from second base is different then Joe Nerd installing a camera in center field to steal sign’s and then notifying the hitter as to what’s coming.
Every team in baseball does the former but I would doubt that any more then 3-4 teams (at most) were doing the latter.
@Dorothy Mantooth
The NYY were NOT fined for “inappropriate use of cameras” in 2017, as you claim. That’s complete fabrication. They were fined for having a phone. The commissioner’s office looked into the Red Sox’s spurious allegation that the NYY used the YES Network and found the claim “had no merit” due to “insufficient evidence.” Please get your facts straight.
The commissioner previously made it clear that the front office would be held accountable for these types of violations. The players don’t have any real control over the facilities so if management installs the necessary equipment and provides the information to the players to use, the players are going to use it.
As a side note, are you going to punish every player on the active roster for Houston and the Red Sox? Your quest for infinite vengeance is overzealous, unfair and misguided.
Cheating the integrity of baseball is ten times more overzealous,unfair and misguided
Every player participated actively or through complicity. They all benefited. No one stopped it. Yes, they should all be punished. Coaches too.
Manfred would never pick that fight with the MLBPA. Not in a million years.
I am an Astros fan, think that way too much is being made of this, but totally agree. To use the PED analogy, if you test positive it doesn’t matter what team you’re on, you get suspended. If it hurts their current club so be it. If Houston has to basically field a replacement team, fine.
This may hurt that group in FA. Maybe that will be passive punishment.
Nor should they have been punished, because how do you decide who’s guilty with any certainty? A guy in the dugout might have banged on a trashcan, but that doesn’t mean the batter asked him to. If you asked, of course they’d all lie. Then again, maybe a player or two wanted no parts of it. It’s not what you know, or believe; it’s what you are able to prove.
They were all involved either actively or through complicity. They all benefited. No one stopped it.
After Beltran was named in the report he was “Dead Manager Walking.”
Lol
Beltran obviously lied during the interview process, had he told the truth, he would have never been hired.
If an employee lies to the employer, he’s not going to keep his/her job.
Not remotely true. It depends on what a person lies about.
Aside from that, how is it that Beltran “obviously lied?” Were you part of the interview process? As MLBTR pointed out, it’s unlikely Beltran was even asked about the sign stealing issue.
November 14, 2019: In the Rosenthal report that came out Wednesday night, Beltran — who texted Rosenthal — said he was not part of the alleged sign-stealing that involved the center field camera. “I’m not aware of that [center field] camera”
Thanks for proving his point. Beltran was hired Nov. 1, two weeks before this report came out. He clearly lied later, but the Mets had no reason to ask him about this beforehand.
Clint Hurdle is ready
Bobby Valentine baby!
Good for Him.
Wow. Cora ya just knew, but wasnt so sure that Beltran would be out as well
never shouldve been hired to start with
Bye bye beltran! Don’t let the door hit you in the….wait he never really made it through the door for it to hit him
Quite the fallout from the sign-stealing scandal. Also a bonanza for any former manager who failed to secure a gig this offseason like Buck Showalter and Dusty Baker. Three teams with solid rosters and high postseason expectations are now looking to fill their void in the dugout on the eve of spring training.
This is becoming a real sellers market!
Bet BVW wishes he had gone with Girardi.
Not sure Girardi ever really wanted the job, but they definitely should have made the offer.
Wouldn’t be surprised. BVW strikes me as someone who wouldn’t want a big named manager.
As a Mets fan say it is so Joe,
Van Lunchwagon wanted a puppet all along and was only interviewing Girardi to pacify Mets fans like me and would have never hired him.
When Beltran came out and said he would “cooperate” with GM the word was not meant in its normal meaning.
This is the stupid media being little babies. Good job guys!
lol
It’s New York…when there’s a s— storm in their backyard, they’ll be all over it. And really, BVW can’t stand to get this one wrong. He’s now onto 3 managers in 2 years under his watch. It’s not like Beltran was a HoF manager with a sterling record and years of experience. This was risky before the story broke and the wrong move after.
If they wait any longer, they won’t have what’s left of a managerial choice, considering other better jobs (HOU, BOS, Staples service associate) are available.
The media made this a way bigger deal than it really was IMHO. I don’t think Carlos should have lost his job.
If that’s true, what does that say about NYM and their inability to stand up for their new manager and former star player if they believe he was either not complicit (after the report) or is the right guy for the job?
If nothing else, give the Mets some credit for doing the right thing and not wanting to start a very important time in their franchise by bringing unnecessary baggage to Citi Field, when it’s already going to be hard enough to manage in the NL East, in New York, with the East Coast bias media breathing down your neck.
Not sure of your fandom, but the Mets being indecisive is a running joke around the franchise. By not issuing a statement, they let it get bigger than it needed to be for them. Also, if true that he stepped down, they should not get credit for “doing the right thing”. It was a decision made for them.
Queens resident, Braves fan — their running jokes are the background noise to my dinners. Trust me, I know more than I want to. Mets can give the MTA a lesson in excuses to fail with astounding originality.
Don’t get it wrong – Cora and Beltran aren’t stepping down. Believe that if you want. They’re getting fired. They don’t need a reference for their next job, but they’re allowing Beltran to fail with dignity.
I agree with you on that. It is a firing in everything but name only. I just don’t like how everyone is making it out to be that Beltran was one of the head honchos just because his name was mentioned once in the whole report. He wasn’t the mastermind. He wanted a better way of stealing signs, but gave no plan on how. I have no problem with that. That’s as old as the game itself. Cora took it too far, something we can all agree on. The entire thing is a mess that he got caught up in.
Agreed. Unfortunately, MLBPA is the shield in this s—storm and with Beltran no longer playing, he can’t hide behind them. If he was, he’d just be a footnote in the report and Cora would have to quell those bloodthirsty.
Without reading the report, I’d love to know the active players instrumental in it. Honestly, very fascinating, especially when you know they took down the CF camera after the CWS game Farquar caught on. Everyone knew what they were doing was wrong.
It’s really something to marvel about. I just wonder how many other teams were doing something similar. But alas, the people got their pound of flesh (or 4 pounds to be more accurate). I hope those who wanted Beltran to be fired protest if their team trades for Altuve or Springer or Bregman (unrealistic I know). I doubt any of them will. I would welcome Altuve for Cano and not blink twice about it.
We have been rethinking things here on the left coast. Giants will trade Kapler to the Mets for $5,000 in International cap money and a revised employee handbook, up to date with all the new laws.
This whole thing is so stupid. 4 guys have lost their jobs over something that happens at all levels of the game. It’s a part of the game! Just like the steroids, the media is blowing this out of proportion.
Hmm…Mets manager position is open. Is Carrot Top available? Put that guy in a blue suit and he could show up to a press conference sporting the Mets colors. That, among other things, makes him perfect for the job.
Funny – the yankees hire the guy and it’s a great move, then the Mets hire him and it’s a joke. Um, ok.
Maybe it’s because the Mets are a joke in general.
Um, ok.
All a matter of timing. I’m sure if he was still in the Yankees FO, they would get rid of him.
I’m not surprised you can’t parse those circumstances, WayHazy.
Carlos was not a bad signing. Until we learned he readily had no issue cheating and lied about it. Pretty sure you want to be able to trust tour coach – but that’s just my opinion.
At least they just did interviews so they can pray their second choice is still available
High Pitch Eric going to be next manager show them all why he really has the nickname High Pitch
Who’s High Pitch ? This is Kelly Clarkson.
He’s from Howard Stern called this firing said he’s going to work for the Astros because he doesn’t know anything about baseball
Most obvious candidate is Terry Collins. Still in the organization and he holds the spot warm for Brody-bro Hinch next year
Pretty sure the lesson here is when MLB comes out with a statement you don’t want your name in the same sentence as the word “scheme.”
Manfred didnt want to challenge the Players Union and open up pandora box that would have led to even more convictions across the board and once again players are saved ala the mitchell report we will keep it behind hush doors whom was involved until a whistleblower back then like now put MLB on the spot to reveal whom was on that list.
This is not about the fans as Baseball does not care all they care about is putting butts on the seats for every stadium possible which is why the balls were juiced last year and record hitting HomeRuns were hit .
Still the Houston Astros Owner got away with murder what is a $5 million dollar fine when they easily surpassed that with championship gear sells as well as raising tickets following year. Houston should have been fined $20 million, loss of international draft money and slots along with draft picks and finally those players involved should have been suspended for at least 30 games for their involvement then that would hit the team where it hurts in the standings where they would have had to bring up players from their minors to try and get by and that will almost surely guarantees a rough start to the season that would set them back.
$5MM was the max allowed by the current rules. The Astros should’ve been barred from postseason play for 2 years. Then, all the high-priced talent would demand trades to other teams. The Astros would’ve been punished and the rest of the league would benefit as well.
Yeah, bigtwinsfan14, because cheating players would suddenly be ok if they’re on your team…
The $5 million maximum fine was probably decided on with the input of owners. MLB knows unhappy owners create a roadblock. I’m sure they collaborate with the owners constantly on the handling of various issues and rules.
They can’t fine Crane anymore than 5 mil
Goodbye, Beltrash
A nicer way of saying your fired.
Okay – now go investigate the Red Sox, Yankees, Dodgers, Blue Jays, Rangers, Cubs, Diamondbacks, and the Indians.
I remember when the Jays were in their Playoff run, the Yankees made a big deal about a guy in CF relaying signs
Except they had closed the CF seating sections due to complaints from their own players about the ball being hard to pick up out of the pitchers hands
And we didnt make it to the WS either year, so either the Jays weren’t actually cheating ala Houston or Boston, or we suck at cheating
Ah well, why not:
Mets: Buck. Don’t forget Steinbrenner was suspended when Showalter took over Yanks; he can handle the chaos.
Sox: Brad Asmus: You know those Ivy League guys are shower buddies
Astros: Dusty Baker: Nice, safe, calming.
Should read Beltran ran off by PC police as mets manager. BS superficial super fake mlb with their BS image mirage.
Our society has been morally bankrupt for a very long time. All these guys cheat and it’s been that way for decades or more. That’s why all the teams have their own media on staff. Bunch of frauds reading teleprompters just like on fox and cnn.
I could care less about Beltran or the Mets. Just worn from the endless superficial sacrifices to protect a lie we all figured out in 1998.
lol
Go BAM BAM! (and i’m not hitting a trash can)
Mendoza blew her chance by pretty much supporting cheating in the game.
Beltran joins the great ranks of managers who never lost a game at the helm along side with Backman. Congrats!
Her chance at what?
Another job she’s not qualified for (or good at)?
She wasn’t going to be the manager.
Anyone have the number for Tire World?
Nice
The Mount Rushmore of Cheatgate is complete
Lunhow, Hinch, Cora and Beltran!
Lol
It was a stupid idea to hire him as a manager In the first place, regardless of the issue.
Agreed. Saved themselves from their own bad choice.
It was dumb because he’s been mentioned as a huge participant since the scandal broke. It’s hardly surprising that news came out that the info was all true. Just such a dumb hire with all that going on.
Curious if Terry Collins steps up as a one-year interim or will Mets go back to candidates like Eduardo Perez?
I think Bam Bam Meulens is a more likely choice since he was just hired as bench coach. They could ask TC to be his bench coach.
This just in, Carlos Beltran goes undefeated as NY Mets manager!
This also just in – Carlos Beltran winless as Mets manager.
Joe Girardi
That was quick.
Next up
Cora’s Lifetime ban and player punishments.
Is everyone delirious making / letting the player walk?
5 million dollar fine. 81 game suspension.
Can’t fine every player $5 million. Guys like Bregman haven’t even made $2 million in their careers. They should be suspended (without pay), and probably be fined the equivalent of their championship bonuses.
Bregman got a $5.9M signing bonus when he was drafted, and he got a $10M signing bonus on his new contract. He has already made over $18M in his career, and he’s set to make another $100M over the next 5 years. Poor example.
Next up – Fiers comes out with a book.
Good for him, after making a bad mistake, owning up and doing the right there to avoid any future issues for the team. Now…. if the Mets could just go hire some bum off the street that knows nothing about baseball and causes them to fall out of control so that they are never a good team again, the rest of the league would much appreciate it….
Nobody knows what went on. The Mets probably gave him an option to say he’s stepping away, rather than have them and him have their names dragged through the mud anymore.
Now that Beltran is out who is Andy Martino, Ken Davidoff and Joel Sherman going after next?
Yeah, it was their fault he cheated.
Astros and Redsox should be stripped of World Series titles and Altuve and Betts should be stripped of MVP and handed down to the runner ups.
Ban all those clowns for cheating. That messed up baseball the last three years. People lost jobs for losing and players stats got all messed up to a bunch of cheaters.
Entire 1990s has entered the chat
No one will, but Ozzie Guillen is worth interviewing. Baseball can use some characters. Take him over Dusty any day!
Return of the blizzard? I like it.
Eduardo Perez should be the next mgr
Mets have an advantage here given that they had already interviewed a bunch of candidates earlier this offseason. Boston and Houston have to start a search from scratch
Genius work AGAIN Mets. Ok, we’ll take your word for it, even though your heavily mentioned from the very beginning of the scandal. This is sooo Mets…
So Mets… but will still finish with a better record than cubs next year!
Good one. You really got me there. SMH. The Cubs aren’t even trying to win this year, so yeah most teams will probably have better records. But your such a creative genius anyway….
If Beltran is being punished for something that happened when he was a active player doesn’t this mean that any player on Astros can’t become a manager ever in the future
It’s like anything in life that just needs time to die down. I mean he was taking over when the report came out. I’d imagine in a few years it won’t be as highly discussed and on everyone’s minds.
I really hope that the Baseball Prospectus writers circle back and re-write their version of the LOLMets’ previous and/or upcoming season
Good but where do the Dodgers go to get satisfaction? Can’t give the Dodgers the WS. That would be ridiculous. The only just thing to do is vacate the Astros and Red Sox titles. No winners in 2017 or 2018. THAT will send the proper message!
Kind of like the 2005 Heisman Trophy, which Reggie Bush was forced to return and remained vacated, rather than giving it to Vince Young, who was the runner-up.
Where do the Dodgers go to get satisfaction? Ask Logan Morrison, he DIRECTLY ACCUSED the Dodgers of using video to steal signs…
Yes, and that’s the same thing as being found guilty on video and after 60 interviews. The exact same thing. Logan Morrison. SMH.
If we’re going to start vacating records then be prepared for a lot of records to go away. Even Dodgers fans should be prepared for issues if they want to vacate the 2017 and 2018 World Series… two of their wins in the 1988 WS came from Orel Hershiser who was accused of doctoring the ball during his career.
I really am loving how other fan bases are going all holier than thou on the Astros and Red Sox… name a franchise and odds are they will have had a prominent cheater help them. Possible exception being the Rays…
Where do the Dodgers go? They go home and pray this all dies down before they get busted too.
Day 4: Gaylord Perry Hall of Fame Ejection Watch
Mr Manfred, please install Danny Farquhar as MLB’s Tsar of investigations into cheating rumors and accusations.
Why there isn’t such a facility in place already is a mystery, unless you don’t go looking for what you don’t want to find.
Meanwhile, across the NFL landscape, Odell Beckham just had an arrest warrant issued because he slapped a police officer’s bottom……….
Sports just ain’t what it used to be………
All is these “punishments” were too light.
1 yr suspension… BS. Poor Pete Rose still banned for life while juice heads are coaching (McGwire) ,announcing games (A-Roid) and people who flat out cheated the game, fans and fellow major leaguers will serve a short suspension.
FIRE A-ROD
A-Rod was suspended for a year and a half. More than any of these players… And he fessed up, unlike any Astros other than Fiers.
I don’t think this is remotely good for the Mets. Their front office and ownership is looking more dysfunctional than ever at this point. If I were a decent candidate for a managerial role, I’d have serious questions about whether or not I’d want to work in such an organization since it only takes a couple black marks on a resume to end your managerial career.
The Mets shouldn’t have thrown him under the bus in the first place. They should have released a statement similar to:
“We’re aware of the commissioners findings from the sign stealing investigation. Our organization does not condone and will not allow these types of tactics and we’ve emphasized that with our entire operations and management staff. All members of our organization are aware of our expectations the Mets operate in an honorable fashion, and we’re looking forward to the upcoming season.”
Instead, they threw Beltran under the bus publicly right off the bat while they decided in the background how they wanted to handle it.
Moving forward, I think holding the Manager and GM responsible is an effective deterrent. Several posters mentioned that Hinch should have stood up to the players and stopped the cheating. The manager is in the dugout, should be aware of what’s going on around him, and if he knows he’ll get fired and maybe banned from baseball for life, he’ll be motivated to stop the cheating. And the GM will have to back him up, or he faces the same fate. I think this was the best solution for curbing future cheating. May not be a perfect solution, but it should keep a lid on blatant rule breaking.
I love the Mets, I’ve been a die-hard fan all my life. I wasn’t alive to see them in ’86 but I have watched them lose the WS twice. When the Mets finally do win the WS again, I don’t want to go through the pain and misery of what Astros fans are going through right now, having their only championship in almost 60 seasons as a franchise tarnished forever due to selfish, out of control players and do-nothing coaches. For the next few years, all of those Astros players are going to be booed and ridiculed for what they did, and rightly so, and their fans, who did nothing wrong, are going to have to suffer for it.
No fans deserve that, and I don’t want that to happen to us Met fans either, No matter who he is or what he accomplished as a Met, letting Carlos go was 1000% the right thing to do. Hard to do, but the right thing to do. If you follow the commissioner’s write-up, maybe cutting Beltran loose isn’t justified, as he said that players wouldn’t be disciplined, but I think de facto branding Carlos as a cheater for what he did, and implying everyone else on that team did the same, is punishment enough to blacklist those players from becoming managers, GMs, or among the top money makers in free agency due to their concerns for a team’s public image.
Bottom line, pro sports is about making money, but you do that by devoting the whole enterprise towards the fans. Fans don’t deserve to have their sports heroes cheating and their entertainment dollars spent on something like this. Treat the fans right, and serve justice.
He wasn’t just one of the guys going along with it. Reports are he along with cora were the ones who came up and implemented the idea. Allowing him to manage with that on his resume is a deal breaker. Mets would not have hired him with this knowledge and firing him based on this is entirely justified. The manager represents the franchise and an organization with any integrity at all would not want someone who demonstrates poor moral judgement leading them.
I’ve wasted way too much time reading comments about this over the last few days, but this may be my favorite. Well said.
Every other manager should take note and if they’re doing the crap that this trio (Cora, Hinch, Beltran) was doing – halt immediately or risk their jobs! Baseball is a tough sport, but play it fair – fans deserve to see a straight up champion each year.
No, no, too late for that, Moneyballer, if they’re still doing that “crap” they and their team must meet the same fate as the Astros…
Oh trust me, the other teams doing this, and I FULLY BELIEVE there are other teams….will shutdown that stuff asap if they haven’t already. The biggest thing that is suspect league-wide is that live-feed replay room. Just way too easy to use that in real time during games – boston et al.
143 comments in 20 mimutes!
That’s gotta be a record!
There must be a lot of people living in the NYC area!
Yoooge!
LFG!!!!!!!!!!
Gonna miss Beltran. Only undefeated manager in Mets history.
Not me, he couldn’t even manage to get 1 single win. He was a bum!
Eduardo Perez mumbles too much. He is going to have to speak up!
How many managers lost their jobs during the steroids era? Everyone knew they were cheating at that time?
Unless the manager was injecting his players with roids, how can he be blamed for that? Different situation entirely.
Sometimes common sense isn’t very common.
Mets should just have resurrected Casey stengel to manage
Maybe Beltran and Cora can fill the Astros open roles?
Resurrection is cheating.
Resurrection? There’s no resurrection in baseball!!
Maybe Beltran and Cora can fill the Astros open roles?
All this from 2017. I have not read anywhere about 2018-2019. Do we assume it was still going on? Thanks ahead if anyone here can post links relating to 2018-19 sign stealing.
Gigorilla………
2016 season: MLB’s investigation did “not reveal any other scheme or method utilized by the Astros” to steal signs.
Early 2017: The center field feed was used to decode signs when the Astros had a runner on second base. Once decoded, the sequence would be relayed to the dugout, and the runner at second would decode the signs and signal to the hitter at the plate.
Two months into 2017: The garbage can method was implemented and the team began to pump a live feed to a new monitor in the tunnel. The Astros initially tried whistling and clapping before settling on the garbage can. The scheme is called “player-driven,” with current Mets manager Carlos Beltran mentioned by name. Both systems were used throughout the 2017 season.
Postseason 2017: Manfred’s report says the club continued using their systems to steal signs during the postseason, even after all 30 clubs were warned that September to not use electronics improperly to steal signs.
Prior to 2018: With MLB’s approval, the Astros relocated their video room to a room closer to the dugout at Minute Maid Park, to a location similar to ballparks around the league.
2018 season: The Astros continued to use their video room to decode signs and relay them to the dugout. At some point during the season they stopped decoding signs “because the players no longer believed it was effective.”
2018 postseason: MLB’s investigation uncovered no evidence the Astros used electronic equipment to decode signs during the 2018 postseason.
2019 season: MLB’s investigation “revealed no violations” during the 2019 regular season or postseason.
cbssports.com/mlb/news/houston-astros-cheating-sca…
Cat — thanks for the reply and link. Interesting that Astros were 4-8 in home playoff games 2018-19.
This should clean things up for a while in MLB.
Why did the report mention Beltran, but no other players?
No questions! Only obey!
The rest of the people are really CGI. What you know is not reality.
Because he is no longer and active player
I think it mentioned it because he played a more prominent role than the others. During his Mets interviewing process, everyone everywhere talked about how, for his last few years as a player, Carlos was a mentor and a de facto “player/coach” with the Yankees, Rangers, and Astros. Therefore it would be in line with that persona that he would have been a likely “ringleader” among the players in this scheme if he garnered that level of trust and respect. All of this is speculation of course.
In reality though, I think that all of the players should be held accountable anyway: Manfred didn’t do enough in that regard and yes, if it meant that the 2020 Astros needed to play the entire season with any members of the 17-18 Astros suspended, forcing them to lose 100 games and still not get a 1st round pick, then that sounds like a good punishment.
The players union would strongly protect active players. Beltran doesn’t fall into that category.
What really bothers me is how simplistic the approach was the astros used. I can think of many more ways to do the exact same thing without raising alarm bells that even fans in the stadium could detect! Begs the question, what else are other more resourceful teams doing? Players know, its only a matter of time before someone else reveals a bombshell.
Mutually agreed to part ways….lmao
Just like Cora and the Red Sox mutually decided to part ways….like Cora and Beltran’s morals and integrity led them to step down voluntarily…..
The Indians are the next to be implicated. You thought that guy who bangs the drum in the bleachers was just an avid fan. Nope. Stealing signals.
Oh please that guy would have to be a former player very adept at reading sign sequences to be doing that. He would have to have binoculars looking in and the ability to know what he’s seeing. There’s just no way!
It’s called “a joke.”
I highly doubt AJ Hinch, Alex Cora, and Carlos Beltran “mutually agreed” on anything. They should just say what actually happened, FIRED against their will – that would be honest reporting there.
Reporters are doing their job. They’re reporting the info they can confirm. Viewers are smart enough to know the truth and not have to watch Crane throwing a lamp at Hinch or watching Beltran walk out of Citi Field with a legal-sized filing box filled with his PS4 and signed picture of himself.
I guess it’s a way of letting them escape with their dignity intact, which is more than they deserve.
Luhnow: a baseball genius who revolutionized the game with his usage of analytics, looked up to by a whole generation of up and coming baseball execs, fostered a hostile and toxic work environment and never kept control of his coaching staff or players
Hinch: managed Houston to it’s first WS win in over 50 years as a franchise, but was proven to be too weak to be the boss and do the right thing with his players.
Cora: first ever full-time manager from Puerto Rico, who goes on to win the World Series, shrouds a starving fan base and a proud one with TWO World Series that will forever be seen as fraudulent due to his inability to exercise control and be a just leader
Beltran: one of the greatest Puerto Rican baseball players of all time, a hero for an entire generation of players all over the world and a living legend as a player and a manager whom everyone looked up to, abused his position to work with Cora to cheat his way to get that first World Series ring before retirement.
All four reputations ruined.
In a sport where this is obviously commonplace and has been for a very long time… the reputations that are ruined imo are the players (who cheated and weren’t punished) and the commissioner for not implementing measures to make illegal sign stealing difficult. Since the commissioner is appointed by the owners, ownerships reputation is completely destroyed.
Agreed. Nobody is really talking about this yet, but what happens some day if/when Bregman, Altuve, Springer, Correa, and McCann get looked at for the Hall of Fame? Given the media’s reaction now, and the fans, I don’t think people are likely to forget this no matter what they do.
It’s an interesting reverse effect for Beltran, or maybe also for a guy like Barry Bonds or Roger Clemens. Played fair and clean for most of their careers (probably) then did stuff towards the end that ruined their reputation forever. Hall voters and (most) fans haven’t forgiven or forgotten about Bonds and Clemens, and I could see Beltran getting the same look.
Another thought on this is the hypocrisy from the Astros pitchers, particularly Mr. High and Mighty Justin Verlander. I’d love for him to look Yu Darvish in the face and say the same stuff he’s repeatedly complained about about what’s “fair” and what isn’t.
It’s fair to question whether Beltran played the game fair for his career. He certainly seemed to have a passion for breaking the rules and that interview Cora had where he singled out Beltran very suspiciously said a lot. He practically accused the Yankees of cheating at the direction of Beltran! Corrupt Carlos!
Moral of the story. Choose your heroes wisely.
Now that the 3 major players are gone what about the rest of the coaching staff? We going to assume the hitting coach or base coaches didn’t know what was going on or didn’t have a responsibility to report it?
When is the whole Astros team going to get suspended or fined
Never. Players will go on as if nothing happened and when they all hit 15-20 points lower next season, we can all laugh at them.
Kershaw was robbed of his best performance in the post season.
How do the Astros MLB fix that?
they don’t. how far do you or others want this to go? is suspensions or firings not enough? seems like people won’t be happy until the astros and red Sox are left bleeding on the side of the road.
Bill Skiles – Which Kershaw performance are you talking about?
No. Suspensions and fines would do,
That’s an easy one… Never!!
Rick Renteria is looking better everyday.
Rick Renteria will look even better when he’s named the 2020 AL Manager of the Year next November.
Where did this come from? 28.5 games back last year guys, other managers would have been shown the door. I think it could go either way, if the sox finish under .500 he’ll be gone! Reality check white sox fans, twins are a beast that just got better!
I was joking about him not being fired for a cheating scandal or anything like that.
Congrats to Beltran on becoming the first undefeated manager!
Nope!: baseball-reference.com/managers/
Del Wilber, Jo-jo White, Bibb Falk, Andy Cohen, Bill Burwell, and Vern Benson were all 1-0. Dick Tracewski and Clyde Sukeforth were 2-0. Mel Harder was 3-0 over 2 seasons.
Mel Harder: Greatest Manager of All-Time! As a testament to how awesome baseball-reference is, I looked at the box scores of those games and found that maybe Mel really WAS a great manager!
Win #1 was the last game of the 1961 season, with his Indians beating the Angels 8-5. Despite a young Mudcat Grant (future 20-game winner) struggling for him on the mound, walking 6 and giving up 2 HR, he stuck with him for the complete game win backed by Walt Bond, who went 4-5 with 2 HRs despite only hitting .173 all season.
Win #2 and #3 was a doubleheader, also against the Angels on the last day of the 1962 season. Weirdly enough, Walt Bond was once again the hero, going 3-9 with 2 RBIs across both games. Bond only had a career WAR of 2.5, so I guess between sticking with Grant and getting the best out of a fringe player, Mel Harder really was a great manager!
Next up
Fire Brodie for being a bonehead
Really glad the Pirates got their guy before all of this fallout too place.
Manfred is a joke
Time to launch a companion website to MLBTR. Call it MLBMR—MLB Muck Rakers. On line investigative journalism into rumors, innuendos and suspicions of cheating, ethics violations and all things related to the seamier side of baseball. All fans are invited to invent or repeat any rumors or suspicions they have about any team or individual. The burgeoning new arena of sports gambling will be a major thread, with charges of throwing a game levied against any player who seems to dog it on a given day, or any manager that makes a bone-headed or questionable move at any single game. Highly interactive for fans. Don’t really need to hire and pay for expensive, professional staff, when fans have such prolific minds.
I say the Astros should be banned from postseason play for 2020 and 2021. Send a message to the rest of baseball. You cheat and you will pay the price.
I think postseason banning would be going a bit too far. It would create a situation where the Astros would have no reason to remain competitive, and therefore make the rest of the AL West better, thereby making it harder for teams in the other two divisions to make the Wild Card. A better solution would be a de facto “ban” where you suspend any and all 17-18 Astros around the league for 1 season, therefore making the Astros terrible for at least one year and also giving their young players a chance to shine. (On that note, I think they should try to waive the minor league options for those players so that they aren’t put in a tough spot when Bregman, Altuve, etc come back)
Maybe you shouldn’t cheat then, you don’t have to worry about crippling punishments. Too bad Manfred is weak and slapped them on the wrist instead.
larrybrownsports.com/baseball/new-allegations-astr…
I wonder what the truth is in this then? Maybe the players will get more than a slap on the wrist this time.
Interestingly enough the article you chose makes a point of mentioning they’re not certain about the source. considering the woman says she’s Beltran’s niece and is not actually Beltran’s niece.
That pic of Josh Reddick is pretty damning evidence of more than trash can banging going on
Sure, but it just broke. There’s a bunch of other outlets reporting it as well, so I’m sure in the coming days/weeks it’ll either be confirmed or denied. Either way, it’s more trouble brewing for the Astros and it’s a shame for baseball.
And where would you have it stop?
Should the Red Sox and Yankees also be banned? I like where this is going.
Yankees were not fined for sign stealing. The Commissioner’s office investigated and found the Red Sox’s claim to have “no merit” based on “insufficient evidence.” They were fined for having a phone (no use of camera). Get it straight.
Baseball World is in a mess !
Make Baseball Great Again!
My sources tell me Bobby Valentine will be brought back as the manager!
Beltran’s niece said on Twitter today that Astros players put a a device under their uniform at the shoulder that would buzz from the hallway video guy. She says she has pictures from the locker room but didn’t show them.
If she actually has pictures that prove this then she should give them to the commissioner’s office.
Agree. It’s extremely irresponsible to say this and not show the public photos you’ve allegedly got, or say you’ve sent them to MLB.
If she knows, other outside the game know. Wonder if anyone else will step forward.
Scroll up a bit, PSUMetsFan has a link with picture of Josh Reddick and a wire taped on his shoulder
Bang the Drums, er…trash cans…Slowly
Wow it looks like Mets fans got some good news.
Hensley! Hensley! Hensley! ……. Buck Showalter?
Just call him Wally Backman
No-brainer..it was just a matter of time for Beltran. When all of the details finally spill out, it is going to be delicious.
The Wilpons should have gone with Girardi like EVERY SINGLE METS FAN wanted to begin with!!! SMH
GTF over it! that ship has sailed
So, he kept his bat on his shoulder. Again.
You ain’t smiling now are you, you….cheater.
You tell ‘im!
I know that it is illegal to have a monopoly, but I think I’m okay with the Mets having a monopoly on their former players being hired and fired as managers before they even manage the team.
Wally Backman: 0-0 managerial record with the D-Backs
Carlos Beltran: 0-0 managerial record with the Mets
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again.
Every Marlins, Braves, Phillies and Nats fan can always rejoice in knowing that, no matter how bad any of our teams are at any given moment, we can always count on the Mets to be the laughing stock of the division by their constant display of how they are the most incompetently run team in the division. They’re lucky they are in NY and can outspend most teams. If it wasn’t for that, they would have many more 100-loss seasons, and a few more where they challenged to overtake their 1962 record.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again.
Everyone on this site can always rejoice in knowing that, no matter what the article is about, we can always count on you belittling the Mets despite being a fan of the worst team of the decade.
Speaking of spend, since 2010 the Mets have an average year spend of $124,162,104. League average spend is $117,796,980.
So are you trying to say that the $7mil extra the Mets spent is the difference of them going from 86-76 (last seasons record) to 62-100? There’s being a hater and being ignorant my guy.
Yes, I root for the worst NL East team of the decade while you root for the team with the longest championship drought among the NL East teams.
Uh, interesting you go with the average for the Mets during a chosen period, but go with their 1-year win total for your argument. That 86-76 record was done with a payroll that was 8th in 2019 at $161,865,003 and 6th in CBT Payroll at $196,115,003. The average payroll for MLB was $127,151,002 and the average CBT Payroll was $149,216,739. So the differences were over $34 million for payroll and almost $47 million for CBT Payroll above the average. So, would taking away $34 million ($47 million in CBT) turn an 86-76 team into a 62-100 team? Yes, without a doubt it can unless you are talking about a savvy front office, which the Mets haven’t had since the 1980s.
Yeah, definitely a difference in being a hater and being the ignorant guy the same way it is different being the guy that presents correct facts and figures is different from the guy that alters the information to suit is deceitful agenda.
Ok let’s talk about last year. On payroll the Mets were still paying for Cespedes and Wright for a total of $44mil. So if you want to account for injuries and retirements I can readjust my numbers.
Oh yeah, and the Mets averaged 79-83 record for the period you cited for the payroll.
Interesting – very far off from 100 loss seasons.
So you still want to continue with this after your “facts” were shown to be distorted?
Or do you want to really say that taking $34 million in payroll from an 86-76 team won’t make them a losing team, that very likely goes well past 90 losses?
Please see my reply above. It has already been answered.
Good luck to the Marlins this year, guy.
Okay, I see it now.
You’re stuck with those contracts no matter what.
You know what that $34 million would’ve changed? Your ability to extend deGrom. You would’ve had to trade him. You wouldn’t have been able to trade for Stroman. And there would be other changes needed because you can’t just move off the bad contracts because teams are stuck with bad contracts unless trading for another bad contract.
Take just deGrom off of the Mets and how many wins does that take away just with him? And then, you can’t even trade for Stroman. The Mets wouldn’t even sniff 86-76 with just these two changes.
None of us are arguing with you that the Mets have been mediocre over the last few years, which is why we’ve changed managers, changed general managers, and are in the midst of changing owners. That’s what teams do when they get stuck in a rut and need to get better. What are you trying to get us to say? That we stink in picking the right people to win championships? Yes, yes we do, which is why we haven’t won one in over 30 years. We acknowledge this, no Met fan is denying it.
We’re always optimistic because we care about our team, and we’re always critical on our players and coaches because we strive for excellence. We shower praise when it’s due and shower boos when they’re due. We get a lot of press and attention because we’re the biggest media market in the world. At least we spend more money than half the teams in the league do to try to win. We as fans expect them to spend more and to try harder, but that’s because we expect excellence and expect effort. We’re the Mets.
You guys have bottom 5 payroll and bottom 5 attendance year after year despite your minor league system and scouting staff developing some of the best MLB talent of this generation. Your organization is so incompetent that despite playing in a state that produces more MLB talent than almost any other, and winning 2 World Series’ in the last 25 years, they have to put a tarp over most of the upper deck to cover up all of the empty seats. It’s a shame to see such a new stadium go to waste, from a revolving carousel of owners that don’t care about their fans. (I’ve been there several times, it is a beautiful ballpark that feels authentically Miami).
You can take shots like you always do, trash talk is a great part of the game, but don’t think we won’t talk back. LFGM!
Okay, I completely respect this post.
With that said, I have to say that I truly feel bad for Mets fans like you that are diehards like those of us that are diehard Marlins fans and other diehards from the other fan bases. I feel bad that you guys have the Wilpons. I feel bad that you guys have to deal with the blowhard, homer beat writers. I feel bad that garbage networks like E!SPN and FOX Sports put the spotlight on you guys all the time, even when you guys don’t want it. And I feel bad about how your team has been run ever since Frank Cashen stepped down many many many many years ago.
But it’s baseball. We gotta love it…even when it breaks our hearts.
You say “Let’s go Mets” and I say “Go Marlins”. Let’s see how 2020 turns out.
Oh, and you heard it first. The Marlins may in all likelihood finish in last again this year, but this is a year that I’m not 100% sold on that. We’re a lot tougher going in this year, with many young players going to make their debut at different parts of this season.
Well said. All of this really, really makes me feel bad for the Astros fans. I can’t even imagine how this must feel, especially if you’re an older fan who’s been rooting for them since they were the Colt .45s and had Joe Morgan zooming around the bases. Now you finally see them win, and then this happens. Maybe the only ones who can really sympathize with them are fans of the 1919 White Sox… I wonder if any of them lived to see them win again finally in 2005?
(P.S. Ozzie is a hilarious dude and was so much fun to watch as manager for the stuff he said. Love him or hate him, truly one of the great “characters” in the game)
I feel sorry for them too, but there are a lot of chuckles to be had at the same time.
I don’t know if you saw it already, but you should check out Chris ‘Mad Dog’ Russo’s rant about what the Astros. A tear comes to my eye every time I view it.
Right….coming from a fan of the Marlins with that ridiculous, tax payer funded, consistently empty stadium in Little,Havana, A previous corrupt owner in Jeff Loria and now an ownership group that apparently wasn’t able to actually afford the team.
Keep spewing the same narrative and try to band with “every” Braves, Philly and Nats fan…
Wow, a fan of the Mets knocking the Marlins ownership groups. Now that’s priceless.
Yep, knocking the ownership group. Just like I do the Mets. Enjoy last place again.
man the bitterness between dodger and Yankee fans is real! so many swear up and down that they would of won those years. they ran in to a buzzsaw of a team regardless of the scandal.they were just better why can’t they just understand that. not to mention they want mvp award taken away like altuve wasn’t the better player in the al that year and some post season restrictions what will it take for you all to be satisfied. btw where is the investigation into the accusations about the Yankees?
Agreed. Lame and angry excuse for why they got beat. Have to blame something I guess.
Right, because knowing what pitch is coming definitely did not give the Astros any advantage whatsoever. I know most players prefer to not know what pitch is coming.
You are brilliant. Almost as smart as the fella you responded to that forgot the start of a sentence should be capitalized, not to mention their amazing grasp of the language.
Boy, the amazing life you two haters must lead.
Lol no hate what so ever just seems like disliking cheating is one thing but anything extra from what I seen is crying because they think they took their “chances” away but thank you for the kind words much appreciated.
If stealing signs wasn’t a huge benefit then the Stros would not have gone to such lengths for so long to use it. The Astros’ success was fraudulent. Can’t shake that off.
Wrong. You said the Yankees and Dodger “ran into a buzzsaw” despite the scandal.
Your comment shows your ignorance and SaberSmuckers called you out on it and rightfully so.
@wordonthestreet Astros was just the better team period. They would of beat them with out sign stealing. Sorry that was too hard for you to follow, that’s something else with you entirely. Nice try though
If sign stealing is not effective, why did the Astros go to such lengths and break the rules…for years? Your argument makes no sense.
Looks like the Mets did the right thing…for a change!
After they did the wrong thing in the first place? Okay.
What exactly did they do wrong?
They either failed to do their due diligence or they did, and still hired him thinking that it wouldn’t be a problem. Either way, they made the wrong decision in hiring him.
yankees hired him first.
And that’s relevant how? Only in your twisted universe… Can you go two hours without trying to trash the Yankees? Does your childish obsession know no bounds?
yankees cheated too
Now we know why the Yankees offense was so good last year despite so many injuries. Will Aaron Boone be the next one to be fired?
Alternatively, will the nonsensical Yankee haters ever give it a rest?
Yankees have not been found or fined to have stolen signs…ever. Based on a spurious Red Sox complaint (intended to deflect from the fact that the Sox WERE caught and fined for stealing signs), the NYY were investigated in 2017. The Commisoner’s office found the claim to have “no merit” based on “insufficient evidence.” There was no camera used. They were fined a small amount for having a phone. Get it straight, will ya? You’ve had two and a half years…
Agreed, I’m not a Yankee fan but I’m tired of this