12:02pm: The two sides do not yet have an agreement in place, tweets MLB.com’s Anthony DiComo. Martino tweets that the Mets have indicated they’re willing to go to four years, however, so the final haggling could be a matter of the exact dollar point associated with that term.
11:29am: The Mets and free-agent catcher James McCann are closing in on what is expected to be a four-year contract, reports Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic (via Twitter). SNY’s Andy Martino reported this morning that talks between the two sides had picked up steam. McCann is represented by the Ballengee Group.
A deal with McCann will obviously take the Mets out of the market for top free-agent catcher J.T. Realmuto, although indications over the past week have been that McCann was the team’s primary catching target — not Realmuto. McCann has long stood out as the No. 2 catcher on this market, and the Mets’ decision to sign him has been linked to their pursuit of higher-profile free agents at other positions, namely center fielder George Springer and right-hander Trevor Bauer.
A four-year pact for McCann would cap off a remarkable turnaround for the 30-year-old backstop, who just two offseasons ago was non-tendered by the Tigers on the heels of a disastrous year at the plate. McCann quickly hooked on with the White Sox, signing a modest one-year deal to serve as a backup, but he broke out both at the plate and behind the plate as a defender during his time on Chicago’s south side — so much that he’s established himself as a clear starting option.
Over the past two seasons in Chicago, McCann has raked at a .276/.334/.474 clip with 25 home runs, 29 doubles and a triple in 587 plate appearances. The uptick in production at the plate is supported by several underlying metrics; McCann’s average exit velocity sat at 87.8 mph in 2018 but jumped to 90.2 mph with the White Sox.
McCann also boosted his hard-hit rate from 37.1 percent with the Tigers in ’18 to 44.9 percent with the South Siders thanks in large part to nearly doubling the rate at which he barrels pitches. McCann’s line-drive rate has risen with the Sox, too, as his infield fly rate has dropped. McCann’s strikeout rate has trended upward a bit with the White Sox, but the extra whiffs have been more than offset by the improvement in the quality of the contact when he does put bat to ball.
Behind the plate, McCann has long been adept at controlling the running game. Even with the Tigers, he nabbed 37 percent of those who attempted to take a base against him. One knock on McCann, however, was on his receiving ability — or lack thereof. McCann ranked well below average in terms of framing metrics for much of his time with the Tigers and even early in his White Sox tenure — a flaw that likely influenced the White Sox’ decision to sign Yasmani Grandal to a four-year pact last winter.
Recognizing that shortcoming, McCann spent the bulk of his offseason working with catching guru Jerry Narron to improve his receiving and framing. The results paid off, as Statcast ranked McCann as much-improved in that regard, particularly with pitches at the bottom of the strike zone, which was where he’d struggled most. McCann went from garnering strike calls on just 44.1 percent of pitches at or slightly below the bottom of the zone to an excellent 61.8 percent. One can suggest that there’s some small-sample smoke and mirrors at play, but McCann’s improvement was pronounced enough that it can’t be entirely dismissed as small-sample noise. It would seem that the Mets agree.
There’s certainly some risk to the deal for the Mets, particularly given the four-year term. While McCann has been excellent since Opening Day 2019, his more limited role early in 2019 and this past season’s shortened slate of games leave us with only about one full season’s worth of data supporting his offensive gains. That said, Mets catchers hit just .239/.294/.403 in 2020, so the bar to clear for overall improvement isn’t a particularly high one.
If the deal with McCann does indeed come to fruition, he’ll be the second notable veteran in as many weeks to join the Mets on a multi-year deal. Longtime Twins setup man Trevor May, one of the market’s top relievers, inked a two-year deal worth a guaranteed $15.5MM last week. The Mets have yet to finalize their search for a new general manager, but former GM Sandy Alderson has returned to the club as team president and is calling the shots in the baseball operations department under new owner Steve Cohen.
Nice. Now let’s get a starter and a CF.
Good news for the Phillies. The Phillies should re-sign Realmuto. Probably, they could give 4-5 years contract to JT to keep him in Philadelphia. By the way, good move by the Mets signing McCann.
Phillies don’t seem to be going after JTR claiming they have no money. I think it will be a slow and odd offseason due to the owners complaining how much money they lost. I’m expecting a slow market for a bit. However for the Mets its good it’ll be less of a bidding war on Bauer and Springer. I still highly doubt they get both of them. I sure wouldn’t mind though.
Weird that they don’t have any money after that Harper deal. 🙂
Yea. I don’t think this means much for the Phillies. JT signing still seems unlikely for them.
With the Mets out, unless the Yankees enter the market and swoop in, JTR may have to wait it out. Expected him to sign first.
Toronto, Phillies, Nats, Yankees, Angels…to name just a few. Still plenty of teams in on the best catcher in baseball. But I do think it will take a long time.
Seems unlikely that the Yankees will pay all that money for JT and gives Sanchez 5.4 mil as a backup
Angels need a starter and two RPs prior to a Catcher.
I doubt they are in on JTR.
They needed that before Rendon too.
Yankees should check the availibity of Salvador Perez. They could probably get him with lesser prospects
If it takes a long time, the money might be spent.
I know but that’s water under the bridge now
Sorry @Francys01 he going to the nats
Could be. I just posted and forgot about the Nats. They might though want to save $$ to see if they can sign Soto long term.
Yeah and trea. They can still get them because in 4 years (3 for trea) castro, will harris, max scherzer, daniel hudson and maybe small contracts. Also Corbin will have contracts gone. So they will have loads of money for trea and soto. ( yes they will probably sign other free agent)
phillies are broke, broseph.
I’ve been a Phillies fan and season ticket holder for many years. I love, love, love JT, but I can’t see the Phillies signing him when their bullpen is a total disaster. I’m not sure the Phillies will be spending much money this year but if they do it needs to be on pitching. They need at least one SP and many relievers.
4 years for McCann A little too lengthy
Dominoes starting to fall now.
Bauer and Springer plz and i will be a happy Mets fan….LFGM
No to Bauer and Springer
Yes to Lindor and Carrasco.
Sign JBJ
Must deal with Nats they will get JT and Bryant
Atlanta loaded
Bauer and Springer would cost only money and you could potentially have them on the team for years.
Lindor and Carrasco would cost a lot of prospects/assets (from an already depleted system) and money and you’d only have them for one and two (plus $14 million option for his age 36 season) seasons, respectively. No thanks.
They probably get Springer or bauer not both
And you know this how?
Probably just guessing the Mets won’t do two 9-figure deals in one off-season.
We knew he wasn’t gonna sign no big time free agents. McCann is good but he ain’t JTR. Jbj is good but he ain’t no springer, and that’s who they will get. Watch. All talk from overly excited mets fans. I don’t care how much he got fleeced, I mean spent for the Mets. He’s being cheap so far.
Why does Cohen watch his X-rated movies backwards? His favorite parts when the chick gives the money back.
Being cheap? The off season has barely started.
The one chance for both could be Springer to a $100m+ deal and then Bauer on a 2yr higher AAV deal. He’s not a $30m AAV level pitcher, but maybe pay 2yr $60m-64m bc it’s short-term and the 2nd year is a mutual option. Mutual options almost never get picked up, but this would allow Bauer to keep his stupid “one year at a time” approach AND also allow some wiggle room in case it’s a good fit for both sides, so an extension can be negotiated to extend upon that 2nd year. Bauer has been willing to bet on himself, so it’ll be the ultimate test if he’ll do it one more year. The Mets did a contract like this w. Cespedes, but it better have a better outcome than that trash experience.
I’d prefer the Mets offer deals to Tanaka, Kluber, and another RP arm for similar $ of $30m to $35m. The Mets have $24m from Cano getting busted they can use to front-load one or more of the contracts. Spread the risk and still have the upside of Tanaka and Kluber.
I’d rather two SP if it came down to that. After deGrom, all the Mets have are question marks. Stroman just sat out a year, Syndergaard is coming off injury, Matz is very injury prone and inconsistent, and who even rounds out the rotation?
The bullpen (on paper) looks fine, and (if McCann is signed) the offense looks great. The defense will suffer again, but starting pitching is by far their biggest issue right now.
Everyone on the market, including Bauer, is a question mark. Bauer somewhat less than the others, but there’s not much out there.
Yes, if you want to be pedantic, every pitcher available is a question mark. There are, however, plenty of SP available who are less of a question mark than Thor (out til June and coming off a major injury), Matz, and whoever they plan to use as a #5, who is currently TBD. Mets need to address that if they want to contend.
You guys will love watching James play, gonna miss having him on the Sox
But are the Blue Jays also talking to him? Inquiring minds want to know.
He’s an MLB free agent, so of course they are.
I guess that don’t want that jtr guy
Holy crap, four years??
what’s so crazy about that? he’s not terribly old and he’s split time at DH in recent years so he’s got less mileage on his legs.
It’s probably not crazy but I was just expecting 2 or 3 years. I thought Realmuto was going to be the only catcher to get four years. Most likely a decent signing I’m just kinda surprised
Does the extra year on this deal make much of a difference to new ownership? I’d be more concerned about extending an extra yea on a higher dollar player like Sprinter.
Catchers tend to age quickly after they turn 30. Of course there are exceptions but I doubt he will be catching regularly 3-4 years from now.
Having seen him in most of his career i would put my money that he will be catching AFTER these 4 years… provided his bat still makes contact.
“Well excuse me!” Said Yadier Molina.
I had McCann potentially getting 5 years, dependant on what Realmuto does. Odd he’d go first, his agents are doing him dirty….
Nothing dirty this year. What happens if the vaccines don’t work as we all hope? He’s not the top catcher available and took a deal he wants. Good for him.
Four years makes a lot of sense, specially considering one of their better prospects is a catcher. Hopefully Alvarez works out and they can split the catching duties during year 3 and 4 of the contract.
Really curious to see what the dollar amount ends up being on this.
Pitching is the priority.
I meant, after McCAnn, go get pitching.
They can trade for pitching. Nobody’s trading catchers though, or centerfielders.
The Cubs might trade Contreras. Also, how about this idea? The Red Sox sign JTR and trade Christian Vasquez, Tanner Houck & Jay Groome to Tampa for Blake Snell. Would be expensive for Boston but it would really remake their roster instantly.
Jesus 4 years?!?
Do NOT take The Lords name in vain.
Do NOT push your religion and values on other people.
“Wait… what!?”
— Jesus Montero
My bad my people I take the Jesus thing back and rather say “holy hell 4 years!?!?”
“Meh. Jesus is just Allright alright” – Doobie
All we need now is Bauer, Springer and another arm or 2 and we should be all set. Lets hope this year and more to come that we can finally be a good team and never have to think of the Wilpons ever again!
If you get Bauer and maybe even another guy, that will make an already really good rotation nasty!
Don’t get your hopes up, money doesn’t equal success
It rarely equals success. LAD struck gold with Betts, but obtained him with an incredible farm, and surrounded him with farm products. NYM is nowhere close to that farm, right now. Takes years to build – even with savviness and money…and a GM.
Successful high-payroll teams only have a high payroll because they pay a lot to keep their players around. Most of the time, these players are ones they drafted or signed, traded for when they were prospects or acquired before they got big, like with LAD and Turner, Taylor and Muncy. Ovbouslsy, there are some teams with big payrolls and some big free agent signings, but they’re usually not as good as ones who develop most of the talent themselves.
Except the Mets current GM was the prior GM who spent 8 years building a squad made up of mostly home grown Allstars (DeGrom, Conforto, McNeil, Alonso, Lugo, Nimmo, D.smith)
Your not getting both bauer and Springer keep dreaming lol
its absolutely a possibility.
Its not
Quite possible actually. No one else is spending except maybe the Blue Jays and Angels. Yanks are out. Red Sox are out. Dodgers already have everything except some bullpen guys. Who else you expect to bid on Bauer and Springer? I’d say Sprniger to Mets is almost a certainty. Bauer may have some more suitors just because he’s a pitcher and everyone needs them.
Anaheim will take a run at him
Anaheim is already paying for Trout and Rendon (and final year of Pujohls or is that done yet?). Those are all massive deals. I think they will be lucky to afford someone like Tanaka.
Steve Cohen is worth 14 billion dollars and if he’s not treating the Mets as a a source of income—he could certainly sign both. Still raking in Hedge Fund cash. If this is his true passion—he could spend some crazy cash. We’ll see how far he wants to go but I wouldn’t count him out on anyone. He’s seems to be a true Mets fan that wants to see the team be great.
Not a bad guy to have as an owner. I’m not a Mets fan but it would be cool to see another owner disregard the bottom line because he’s a fan that wants to win. Obviously not every owner is worth that much money either—so that’s certainly a luxury for him.
The Mets are going to give the dodgers a run for their money this year. I still think the dodgers will go back to back but the Mets will be their biggest competition
It will be close but the Dodgers are a great team themselves. I hope we run like you guys and become the Dodgers of the East Coast lol
The Braves are still better than the Mets even with Springer & Bauer.
Lol. Really? Mets aren’t even close to the Dodgers yet. The Mets have 2 SPs at the moment. That will likely change soon, but we need to calm down. Great moves for the Mets so far though.
3 pitchers. And yes rn dodgers would beat us but that could change soon. Thor coming back good would also make things easier
Definitely could change soon. But Mets need to think about the Braves, not the Dodgers. Solid moves from Cohen so far.
Lol. Really? Mets aren’t even close to the Dodgers yet.
———————————————————–
This reminds me of ‘My Cousin Vinny’.
“It appears to me that you want to skip the arraignment process, go directly to trial, skip that, and get a dismissal.”
Mets fans should worry about getting to .500, and the passing Philly, and then passing Miami, then passing Atlanta, before worrying about the LAD.
I’m a RS fan, I have the same concern. Let’s get to .500 before telling the world how great we are.
Haha, I’m a Mets guy, and I agree. Getting better is nice, but more realistic goals are a nice place to start. Team still has holes, dude still has money, let’s see where this goes. At the least, it’s making for an interesting offseason.
In terms of teams the Mets have passed both Philly and Miami. I really don’t how people take 60 games seriously.
The game isn’t played on paper. Mets didn’t pass anyone yet.
But if you don’t play it on paper before you play on the field, you are likely to lose.
Also true
I’m a Mets guy too, but to tell you the truth I am sick of having “realistic goals”. That’s Wilpons talk. I want to WIN. I think Cohens opting for McCann because he intends to sign both Springer AND Bauer. Besisides while JTR is certainly the best catcher in baseball, I think his agents have prided him out of reality ..He is reportedly looking for 7 years and frankly those kinds of deals are a bottomless pit. If you don’t believe me, I’ve got an old, overpriced second baseman who’s currently suspended for PED’s that I’d like to sell you!
Met fans are still in the ‘new money’ phase, wait til they have a terrible free agent signing, then the real whining starts
Bobby Bonilla on line 1. Yoenis Cespedes on line 2.
-a Mets fan
Without Cespedes you don’t see that 2015 WS. Certainly a terrible end to his tenure, but at least he brought some excitement to the team early on.
The Dodgers squeaked by a Braves team that was missing their ace (Mike Soroka) and was also missing what they thought would be their #3 or #4 in Cole Hammels. With just a healthy Soroka the Dodgers lose that series in 6 games at most. With a healthy Soroka and the addition of Charlie Morton, you’re fooling yourself if you think the Mets will be your biggest competition. I’d be more worried about having to face the team at full strength that basically gifted you a trip to the World Series in 7 games with only two legit starting pitchers.
Rn the dodgers biggest competition is the Braves until proven otherwise. Although I do think that could change for 2022 if the Mets do better. Also Mets make a strong case to be the 3rd most dangerous team in NL with a few more SP
Yea, how about the Mets give the Braves a run for their money before talking about challenging LA. People forget every offseason that winning the offseason doesn’t mean instantly becoming a contender. Mets will no doubt improve this offseason, but it’s going to take more than a year for them to go from a middling franchise to a 100 win behemoth like the Dodgers. Dodgers and Braves have both had their cores together for years. That matters in regards to a winning culture. Mets have had the furthest thing from a winning culture. I believe it’s coming. It’s just probably all not going to come together in 1 season.
@Jfl, I agree with you about the Braves. Both the Mets and the Braves are likely to be the strongest in the NL East. The NL Central is getting hammered by the covid related issues ($ loss for the teams) and on paper, it doesn’t seem that any NLC teams will be very strong next year. But, the Padres could very likely give the Dodgers some competition. Dodgers are, without a doubt, IMO, the super-power, there’s still some NL competition for them.
So what about JTR??
Why not both? Lol
Because why would McCann sign for 4 years to be a back up again?
Money dude
McCann is his backup.
So relieved JT won’t be a Met! That being said, solid upgrade for the Mets. They’ve technically addressed all their needs in some fashion already (Stroman, May, McCann). I’m sure there’s more to come. Still think they need 2 more SPs.
Hedge Fund owner knows you lock in assets when the market price tanks and pass when market peaks. Contrast with Phillies ‘stupid money’.
Buy the fear and sell the greed. It’s been said many times, in different formats, and usually true.
I mean, we have one confirmed deal (May) with which we can judge Cohen on. I wouldn’t start praising him to high heaven just yet.
Mets fans acting like the long-lost cousin of a dude that just won the lottery when Cohen took over.
JTR is not very happy.
Where is JTR going to go?
Angels? 🙂
The Angels have far too many holes to spend that kind of money on Catching.
They need a starting pitcher and two more bullpen arms more than they need a high priced catcher.
Knowing how Moreno is in love with offense i wouldn’t b shocked if JTR lands in Anaheim
To a Tiger’s team that wants him there while they bring their blue chip prospect starting pitching prospects to the MLB level… much like they did when they signed Pudge Rodriguez in 2004.
ohh
Four years? Yikes
Braves are still a better team.
Rn yes. Mets not done tho. And Braves need to replace Ozuna too
Ajrod.
I think a good indication of how good your team is might be is accumulated Team War of last year.
The Braves were 4th, the Mets were 5th.
You know an even better gauge of how good a team is? Their won-loss record.
Team war, lol. Yes, the Braves were just barely better than the Mets last year. Smh
Sideline Redwine
No, it’s not. There are much better ways than that to guess where a team stands in the upcoming season.
Pythagorean W-L record is better than that. It’s why the Mariners broke it all down after winning 89 games in 2018. Their Pythagorean record had them at 77 wins. They were 15th in team WAR.
Project Depth Chart team War for 2021
Braves 9th. Mets 14th. That’s without McCann.
proof that WAR is far from perfect at evaluating production.
Very far from perfect, just closer than almost anything else.
Agreed. Dodgers, Braves, Padres are clearly the top tier of NL with a size-able gap between Padres and whoever is 4th. Mets would need to sign Bauer, Springer or Ozuna, and trade for Lindor to be in the conversation with the big boys.
The Mets have a formidable lineup, I’d argue top 5 in the NL going into 2021. They are thin with Starters and their BP underperformed….again. They are thin in the upper minors and their stats dept was one of the worst prior to Cohen taking over. He’ll invest in infrastructure over the next 2-3 years and hopefully they can be aggressive in the int’l market, but they are at least 2 years away from being being at the same level as an org of the Dodgers, Braves, or Padres. That said, if they can get McCann, Springer, and I’d argue 2 more SP (#3 or better…Tanaka & Kluber), then they will have closed the gap, but they still will be punching up for another season or two.
I say this as a die-hard Mets fan trying to be realistic about the other pieces that aren’t just the guys on the active major league roster.
Mets led the NL in OPS+ last year and signing McCann would, in theory, boost the offense in a big way. Not necessarily because McCann is amazing offensively but because the Mets catchers were an offensive black hole last year. So I agree that they’re a top 5 lineup in the NL, perhaps in all of baseball, though that is difficult to assess because of the DH.
Lol a four year contract? Have fun with that after like year two, mets fans.
McCann has platooned for 2 years so very little mileage on his legs for a 30 year old catcher
You could also argue that the other way, saying he doesn’t have the endurance of full-time starter. 2019 stats seemed to dip when he wasn’t platooning, but he sure looked good in 2020. If the deal goes through, I think he’s a real solid addition. It really depends what he gets, and also what Realmuto ultimately gets.
The “old school” mentality regarding your comment is “all players are useless after 35”, McCann will be younger than that the rest of the deal, so you’re WAY off here.
Players tend to start going downhill at 31. By 35 most of them have been golfing for 2 years.
Well by then they’ll have two titles.
I wish we could re-visit this board in a couple years and gauge reaction. I agree, four years is too many–doesn’t matter that he platooned, dh’d, whatever. He had one really good year, essentially, yet fans want to give him four years at $70 million. This is why they are not gm’s…and likely have their own financial problems.
Are you always bitter and joyless? Stop projecting your own financial difficulties
4/50 seems much more reasonable for McCann. I’m sure he’s asking for 4/60+.
shouldve predicted this over the Angles. well, i didnt predict JT to the Mets so im happy.
You also should have predicted the slope of the angles- rise divided by run!
dang it, done in again by poor proofreading
Realamulto contract is going to be a heads up for lindor and the rest of the top free agents this year and the future
Realmuto will still get paid. Odds are the Mets just didn’t want to do it because they have designs on another major addition. Signing two of the top 10 FA on the market is a big ask for any team, regardless of financial muscle.
Ik Alvarez could be a bust(doubt it) but this contract is probably not that expensive. When McCann is 34 he’ll be fine since he’ll probably be a back up and he should do good in that role.
Four years? While this is admittedly a much needed area of improvement for the Mets, let’s not overlook his CAREER stats.
Ave. .249
Obp. .300
Ops. .696
Age during contract: 30-34.
If he brings gold glove caliber defense, it’s a very good acquisition. But we need TWO catchers because McCann averaged only about 105 games a year in the AL where he could also dh. That leaves a full THIRD of the season where we still need another catcher upgrade. That is, unless the team feels we can win with Nido as the starting catcher for 50-60 games.
This is all assuming McCann is 100% healthy throughout his early 30’s. He ranked (yahoo) out as a very average offensive catcher the past 2 seasons, at #12. He wasn’t even considered the starter on his own team, mind you.
Wrong, we shouldn’t look at his career batting stats, because he changed his approach recently and got better results.
From opening day 2019-present
Ave. .276
Obp. .324
Ops. .800
Age during contract: 30-34
All of this is very reasonable. Why would act like he would go back to being the terrible hitter he was out of nowhere for 4 years? No player does that. Once you figure something out, it usually stays.
Imagine thinking 30-34 year old MLBers are all unproductive smh, lay off the smoke.
Bit of a straw man there–where does the original post say all players that age are unproductive? It doesn’t.
There are plenty of examples of players who find a year or two of success, then revert to being league average or below. Truth is, neither of us knows how McCann will turn out.
Too bad that someone makes a valid point but you don’t agree so simply chalk it up to “smoke”. Then again, civility and critical thinking do not represent the standard on this board. Well, except for my posts.
The Mets, like any team with any free agent, care very little (or at all) about what player McCann was four to five years ago when he was a well below-average hitter. They’re paying him based on what he’s been over the past two seasons and with the belief that he’ll maintain it.
I struggle with the logic of looking at career stats; if he’d bombed in 2019-20 but still had strong career numbers because he was great in 2015-18, would the four-year deal be more sensible?
Taking career numbers in their totality really only works for a player who has been very good or very poor from their debut through present day, which is pretty uncommon.
And by what measure is Yahoo indicating that he was average? Fantasy rank or something? That would be meaningless. McCann’s 116 wRC+ over the past two seasons is 27 points better than the league-average catcher.
Marty’s right. McCann has set personal bests in hard hit% and Barrel%. He’s hitting the ball harder.
Also, career stats are misused when you use them as you suggest. It treats players like they are this static thing that doesn’t change.
I believe career stats are useful because they represent one of the predictive inputs. The idea is not to give it too much weight when recent experience is different. There is also the overall average player stats that get some weight.
So I see a three way weighting procedure, maybe 60% recent two years, 20% career and 20% overall average. That actually means you are utilizing the last two years in two places so it gets more than 60% of the weight.
This is all cocktail napkin stuff but it would be instructive to crank it out. I do agree that when performance changes from history it is worthy of extra consideration. There also has to be consideration of how much variation over time.
In other words if a player hit .260, .260, .260, .260, .280, .280, I might take the .280 as more predictive but if a player hit .260, .240, .280, .260, then .290, ..270, I might be less inclined to expect the .280.
Four years is a bit much for a catcher over 30, period. When the Jays signed Russell Martin, he was way too old for a 5 year deal. Let’s see how the deal plays out. Hopefully, Mets fans won’t expect James McCann to be Gary Carter but he’s a huge upgrade over Wilson Ramos.
Catchers are also signed for a lot more than just hitting stats, FYI. Off field, leadership stuff, they’re the only link between offense and pitching. I hope people keep that in mind before going “.690 OPS bad”
Thanks for that Marty. You didn’t refute what Frank said. Frank was correct. Martin contract was long, expensive and not the position of-need at the time.
I don’t agree with the sentiment that Russell Martin was ever a bad player and I think he was never bad for any season of that contract, though *shrugs*. $20M for a veteran multi-time all-star is market value.
According to WAR, he was a top 10 player on every Blue Jays team he was on, what more do you want?
Being top 10 WAR on a team is a misleading statement or too vague and maybe both. If you are top 10 on the 2019 or 2020 Dodgers that means a little more. Russell was on some pretty BAD Blue Jays teams as well as some good ones. Also, being top 10..on a team..isn’t THAT impressive when a considerable portion of the team is relievers and utility players.
If you look at the squad they had at the time, they needed a pitcher. They had Navarro who had a fine 2014, and Josh Thole who caught RA Dickey. The signing to make that offseason was Scherzer. The next order of business was to address LF with Melky leaving via free agency. Jays opted to clear salary by dealing Happ for Michael Saunders, Lind for Estrada (miraculously worked out), to clear salary for Martin, a player that wasn’t needed. Then the Jays played .500 ball with no LF and a hole at SP. They addressed that with the David Price trade.
As for WAR, it’s like Philly acquiring Carlos Santana a few years ago. Good WAR player, not a player necessary for that team because of Hoskins. They move him to LF, he couldn’t play D. That WAR is nice but who cares about WAR if players fill positions on your team when you do not need said player.
In Canada, Sportsnet continues to claim that the Jays are about to finish off their first major move of the offseason, Mets pushing hard on McCann…I’m convinced J.T.’a heading to Toronto!
If the jays sign jtr, could be a trade coming involving their catching depth…..
I think they’re trading at least 1 or 2 catchers whether they sign Realmuto or not. There’s no way you can carry five on the 40 man at the same time throughout the season.
I agree, they should cash that prospect capitol now before they lose value.
Seems to be, most likely Jansen,Gurriel and whatever else for Lindor…which if Lindor signs an extension(apparently it’s the only was Toronto does a deal) that would be amazing. Springer would be great, probably be a cheaper option like JBJ, add an SP or 2…good to go
Why would Lindor do that?
@Jim….because he’s already stated he’s open to signing an extension,roster is stacked with talent and Toronto is a great city!
Toronto’s biggest problem is that it’s in Canada.
Why say that…why would you dislike people just because of where they come from?
@Kanucklehead no he hasn’t, that stacked roster was barely above .500 in 2020 and a Puerto Rican dude definitely doesn’t see playing in Canada as a plus.
I literally just read an article the other day where his agent said that he’s (Lindor) aware of the Blue Jays rumor and he’d consider an extension if traded…
Jays apparently wanna know what that looks like before giving up anything. As for his ethnicity, you clearly don’t know much about Toronto or Canada for that matter, lots of culture, lots of acceptance.
Gonna need to see a link. And even then, of course he’s going to say that.
Also, the Puerto Rican comment wasn’t a shot at his ethnicity. Just think he’d want to play somewhere with warmer weather, all other things equal.
Puerto Rico is part of America and they are Americans. The vast majority of people in Puerto Rico are white… even more so than the lower 48 states.
Reese McGuire gettin’ excited.
(Sorry)
lol
Evidently, they feel that McCann will provide more surplus value on his contract than JTR will. I’m not convinced but we’ll certainly find out.
Without the DH, If McCann hits towards the bottom of the lineup, then his bat has much less value.
Like the DH, don’t like the DH, the problem with pitchers hitting is they make everyone who hits around them less valuable.
Not entirely true, their own stats don’t get harmed too much, just means more walks in the stat column for them. I agree a good hitter before a pitcher is an automatic IBB, which is why pitchers hitting actually devalues the game, not enhances.
He’s a nice player in a limited role. If you checkout ‘19 he struggled in the second half. If you could platoon him, you’d get the best out of him!
Who cares!
McCann 9 months older than Realmuto. Means that fifth year is a must for Realmuto. And I can honestly see him and his agent starting out asking for a sixth year. Would still be younger when his contract expires than Harper will be when his expires.
taking a team off the board could just as easily indirectly take a year off of what JT can ask for.
McCann signed through his age-34 season. No way Realmuto, a better player, doesn’t also get signed through his age-34 season.
supply and demand. I think the market for JT should still be strong, but there is one less team demanding a C now. less supply too, granted, but you never know.
I guess the question is what is the market for a nine figure catcher? How many teams? Which ones have the the need, the $ and the financial commitment to spend that much on a catcher?
@DarkSide830 but all the other teams that want a catcher can now no longer “just sign McCann instead.”
Mets about to give something like 4/60 to a catcher who turns 31 in June and has one decent full season on his resume.
You think it’s that expensive? Probably better than the 5 years 110 that Realmuto wants
If the contract is for 4 years at a good price and the Mets get 2 good years that could work out as by then the Mets # 1 prospect who is a catcher (19 years old) Francisco Alvarez could be ready
LGM! I have been saying for a while that Mccann has way more value than J.T. Really good move by the Mets!
I wouldn’t say that. James is a great catcher but Realmuto is the best in the league
He may be the best, but you get more bang for your buck with Mccann. Especially if he gets around 13-15 a year.
@Rangers29
True, I didn’t really think of it that way you have a good point brother! It’s been a pretty good couple of days for both of your franchises. You probably got to be pretty happy. By the way I appreciate your posts man, you usually have pretty good analysis and I have enjoyed reading your thoughts these past couple years.
Thanks, man. It’s nice to see the ball roiling with both of these recently despaired franchises. Mets have Cohen making moves, and the Rangers finally got a new GM to have another voice in the room with JD. It’s starting to look up for both.
How do we know that when we don’t have any dollar amounts yet?
Realmuto produces more than Mccann, and he’s slotted in to get 25 a year. Mccann is at 10 a year. With that being said, I don’t think Mccann gets 10, that’s way too little imo. Instead, even if you jump that number up to 15, he’d still be a great bang for your buck.
Since the arguments they are having right now are over monetary value, I expect that to raise his price tag even more. I think he ends up getting a 4 for 64 deal (16 AAV). If he got that, I’d still say that’s a great deal for the Mets.
Not to mention what Jim Stern just said below about Mccann playing less games per season than J.T. What I said is probably the max amount he’d get.
He didn’t say McCann was better, just a better value. Paying $23M for 4.0WAR provides less value than paying $10M for 3.0WAR.
I guess the thing is: will JTR get $23MM? How large is his market? Who says someone is going to pay $23MM? Or $100MM? Who is this team, especially now that the Mets are off the board? It could happen, of course, but let’s wait to see if it does. Also, who says McCann is getting $10MM AAV? What if it’s $13-$15MM AAV?
People act as though McCann plays every day. He averages about 105 games a year and, after his career year in 2019, his own team went out and paid big for another catcher to START.
I don’t care what you pay McCann for his +2 WAR because Realmuto starts 35-40 MORE games than McCann, doubles his offensive production and is a year younger. McCann, in his best season can’t dream about producing an AVERAGE Realmuto season, offensively.
So contractually, Realmuto has to be worth 33% more, not to mention playing 140 games to 100. The only reason we are talking about this type of contract is because the catcher position is extremely limited. We are comparing 500 at bats to 2700 career at bats and rounded off numbers instead of actual time spent on the field.
Forget about money because it’s not ours to spend. The Mets need to spend close to 20 million per season on catchers. So who provides more wins? McCann in 100 games or Realmuto in 140?
My values are based off the FA predictions from here, with just a little adjustment based on my own thoughts. McCann only has one full season’s worth of good results, while JTR has been a beast for a while now. If the Mets are off the table, sure, the market shrinks significantly, but I still think JTR signs for an AAV of $20M+. McCann is just not as good a hitter or defender, though he’s certainly earned the right to start for a good team.
Forget about the money? That is the main issue here. If money wasnt the issue the mets could have signed Gerrit Cole last year instead of Porcello or Wacha. If money isnt the issue what stops every team from signing signing the big 4 …. plus also sign mccann to be the backup as well.
In a bubble yes realmuto is better than mccann overall there is no denying that but going forward is he worth 2x the price? Mccann i think gets between 10-12M per at minimum unless something major happens its hard to see Realmuto accepting anything less than 20 per year or maybe doing a pillow year and trying again next year.. The question would be more around is Realmuto worth more than McCann plus say Brad Hand plus another potential non-tender person which would be the equivalent salary plus the draft pick you will lose for signing Realmuto.
I really do like Realmuto and hoped he would be a met but reading through the boards the McCann plus arguments have swayed me more to that side of the fence.
Yeah I love this move
Good for McCann
Good for McCann, glad to see him turn it around
I’m a little surprised it’s four years instead of three, but more curious to see what big-time FA the Mets pursue. Bauer is my guess, as he’s probably a hotter commodity than Springer, whose market shrunk once the Reinsdorf’s comments about paying CF prices for a corner OF came out. Doubt the Red Sox are willing to spend that kind of money. A’s, Cubs, Indians, and Rays are too cheap/poor (sarcasm in the Cubs’ case). Yankees and Twins don’t have a real need. Braves, maybe, but they have some of the top OF prospects in the game. Seems like going back to Astros isn’t happening. Really, not many contenders for Springer’s services.
lmao second time now. these insiders need to focus more on being right over being first
Great! I’m loving it
Where’s the blue jays rumors ?
Getting to be the oldest joke known to man.
I smelll desperation….McCann feasted on pitching from PIT/KC/DET last year and if he gets anything north of 3yrs/$21MM this is a bad signing.
There isn’t a salary demand or offer that can’t be debated as an “over offer” or “over pay”….regardless of who he “feasted on” last year, this years pitching staffs on those same teams will be constituted differently and if he does come over to the National League, there is no telling who he might “feast on” there…..good signing by the Mets and I’m a Yankee fan…..they seem to have their eyes on the right prizes these days!
Do you not know the Lord, God almighty will NOT be mocked
I guess you’re right. He’s omniscient, so he knows in advance whether or not someone will disobey him, whether or not he will have to torture them for ever and ever in hell. And he goes ahead and creates them anyway, even knowing that he will have to torture them for all all eternity. Even if there is free will, he knows in advance what they will do, and proceeds anyway. Billions of people in hell. Just like he planned. So I guess you’re right.
Mets will over pay for a back-up catcher. His career BA isn’t even over .250. Perfect Mess (aka: Mets) signing. Starting off on the wrong foot.
except he’s a better player now then when he was with DET.
It’s not like this all came out of nowhere. The metrics back up his improvement for the most part and has put in the work to become even better defensively as well
We are going to see just how much this organization is going to have to overpay to get people to come. This guy should not get more than 15 million a year. But I bet you he ends up getting for years 75 million
I will guess 4 years 50 million.
I think closer to 4 yrs/$40M.
I’m guessing 4/$42.
Drives JTR’s price down ( probably a lot ) w Mets out of the bidding
Does it tho? The Mets are only one team. And now all the other teams that want a catcher can no longer “just go after McCann instead.”
McCann out of it drives up Yadi’s price more than it drives down Realmuto’s. Realmuto is the best position player upgrade in the free agent market. In one signing, you can instantly get the best player in his prime at his position in MLB, which happens to be one of the most important positions on the diamond, that would also help develop your staff. Catchers shouldn’t get $100M, but give this man $100M+.
I’d agree, who else would have a catching need so great they’d pay $20M+ for a catcher with injury history and is over 30 y/o. Maybe Toronto because they have the DH but the last expensive catcher they signed didn’t end well (Russ Martin). PHI is crying broke so I’d imagine maybe the Nats to try and get back to being contenders for a WS.
what injury history? his injury this year was the only real blip he’s had.
He’s had a history of back injuries
I agree that JTR’s market shrinks a lot of the Mets sign McCann. If the Yankees somehow lose DJL then they could get into the JTR sweepstakes but I don’t see NY losing DJL, they are made for each other. JTR’s “real” market shrinks to the Nats and the Phillies, with an outside chance of Toronto or Anaheim but that’s about it. I guess Detroit could offer him a boatload of money but they really aren’t at the point where adding JTR makes sense as they are still 2-3 years away. Even if McCann gets 4 years, it’s going to be hard for JTR to get over 4 years himself, and I doubt he gets $25M AAV. I could see a 4/80 offer with a $10M buyout on a year 5 option, so his final deal would be 4/90. I just don’t see any team left willing to pay him 5/110 unless it is a lesser team like Detroit. If he signs there, he’ll be miserable!
JTR is better than McCann and McCann got signed through his age 34 season. 5 years is the minimum for JT.
There’s really no reason to ever have a comma before the word “too.”
“According to The Chicago Manual of Style, a comma before too should be used only to note an abrupt shift in thought.” Typically best to avoid absolutes.
Shut it, college boy.
Not Realmuto, but a needed upgrade at catcher for the Mets. Might look like a bad deal near the end if he regresses but right now it’s a good signing
Great Move!
Ramos was a bad framer and poor game caller.
JTR was too expensive with all of the other moves that need to be made. CF, Starters, etc.
JBJ and Bauer
One thing you would have to say is that Realmuto is the best catcher today, and he hit in the East last year, while McCann hit in the Central . McCann also doesn’t have the track record that Realmuto has the last 5 years. He is not a game changer for the Mets.
McCann doesn’t have to be a game changer, all he needs to do is provide stability. His defense and ability to work with pitchers is likely more important than his offense.
I’ll guess 4/38-40m. He’ll be productive and worth it. Everybody happy. I always liked McCannon in Detroit.
I don’t understand the hype on McCann. I bet the Mets will be looking for another catcher in 2 years time
Probably
Thats kind of the point, in two years they hope Alvarez is ready and can start transitioning into the role as McCann serves as his backup
I think this was the right move for the Mets. Let another team overpay for Realmuto and put that saved money towards Springer and/or pitching.
Almost to the day in 2018, NYM bypasses dealing for JT Realmuto and signs Wilson Ramos for 2/$19M (with buyout). Now, they bypass trading for Realmuto in favor of James McCann to twice the amount of years. Will be interesting to see how this all plays out.
Realmuto is a free agent…
Congrats to McCann. Hate to see him go
Good for the Mets, taking the decent fit over the sexy name.
McCann hasn’t sign yet idk what your talking about Mets fans.
“Hi, Sandy. Yeah, we hear what you are saying and your numbers are in the ballpark. Hold on, I’ve got (laughing, hand over phone) another call coming in again. (Chuckle) I’ll get back to you shortly.”
Don’t be a sucker. If all this guy cares about is just how rich he can be, get someone else. The Mets need guys who want to win, not guys trying to just cash in on backup catcher numbers. Platoon or part time players routinely have enhanced numbers until they are exposed in full time duty.
McCann is an OK catcher and a fair hitter. 276 is not “raking”. This is settling. I’m sick of settling. JT Realmuto is the best C available. By a lot. When the Mets have been great, they’ve been led by great catching: Grote, Carter, Piazza. McCann does not belong in that group.
Neither does Realmuto. And batting average is a bat solo stat upon which to judge a hitter.
How is this a major upgrade over Ramos?
Better offense, better defense?
4 years for this guy should be a non-starter, he’s going to be useless after year 2 maybe even after year 1, it is beyond dumb to give him 4 years