Shohei Ohtani’s epic season has made him one of the most fascinating players in recent memory, and his contract status may only add to that intrigue. Ohtani is controlled through the 2023 campaign (via the final year of his current two-year contract with the Angels and then a final arbitration-eligible season) and as ESPN’s Buster Olney writes, speculation has already begun about whether a potential Ohtani extension would set new precedents. Rival evaluators feel the Angels could be best served to work out an extension with Ohtani this winter, in order to figure out as soon as possible how to best manage a difficult payroll situation.
It is hard to imagine that the Angels would trade Ohtani or let him walk in free agency, yet Mike Trout and Anthony Rendon are also committed to huge salaries and not going anywhere. Olney estimates that retaining that trio of stars could put Los Angeles on the hook for roughly $120MM-$130MM per year, which wouldn’t leave the Angels with much wiggle room in filling out the rest of the roster. While the luxury tax thresholds could rise in the next collective bargaining agreement and owner Arte Moreno has been willing to spend big, the Angels haven’t paid a tax bill since 2004. With Albert Pujols’ deal still on the books until the end of the season, the Angels are used to top-heavy payrolls, but that tactic has left the team unable to amass much in the way of depth (especially on the pitching side) and the Halos haven’t had a winning season since 2015.
More from the Halos…
- The team hasn’t yet any discussions about the possibility of shutting Trout down for the season, GM Perry Minasian told MLB.com’s Daniel Guerrero and other reporters. Trout is continuing to recover from a right calf strain that has kept him off the field since May 17, and the three-time AL MVP already experienced one setback last month that added a lot of uncertainty to his timeline. Since the Angels are a longshot in the postseason race, there wouldn’t seem to be any urgency to get Trout back for what amount to just a few weeks of meaningless September games. Minasian said that “we will not rush [Trout]. We want him to feel good about how his calf feels,” though he noted that the outfielder is “doing everything he can in his power to get back as soon as he can.”
- Rendon talked to The Athletic’s Sam Blum (Twitter links) and other reporters about his season-ending hip surgery, which is scheduled to take place next week. Rendon spent much of the season on the injured list with a variety of injuries stemming from his hip problem, leaving the third baseman feeling “weak” and like he “had no legs” throughout his 58 games played. The idea is that the surgery will fix the problem once and for all, and Rendon is hopeful that he’ll be ready for the start of Spring Training in February.
- X-rays were negative on Max Stassi’s forearm after the catcher was hit by an Alek Manoah pitch yesterday and was forced to leave the game. Angels manager Joe Maddon told reporters (including Jeff Fletcher of the Southern California News Group) that Stassi is undergoing some more tests but is feeling better, and he might be available to come off the bench in a defensive capacity tonight. Stassi has rather quietly been on fire since the start of the 2020 season, hitting .285/.362/.511 with 17 home runs over his last 309 PA. Of players with at least 300 PA in 2020-21, only 23 players have a better wRC+ than Stassi’s 139 mark.
Stassi could use an extension too. Hopefully a couple of our 20 draft pick pitchers are hits. A cost controlled pitching staff could support the couple overlapping Ohtani/Rendon years.
everywhere i checked angels don’t seem to have signed anyone after 12th round i could be dead wrong but right after the signing deadline it seemed none were signed.
The signed them all. Many right before the deadline Sunday before last.
MLB says they got 19 of 20 signed, but I still expect Arte to ruin their development.
The Angels team that won the WS in 2002 was put together when GM Bill Stoneman convinced The Walt Disney Company that owned the team to build (quickly) from the farm system.
Arte bought the team in 2003 and resorted to doing what Gene Autry had done for years – being impatient with young players in his system, wanting to win now, and spending an exorbitant percentage of the payroll budget on veteran position players.
Autry didn’t believe in giving long-term contracts to pitchers feeling that one day a guy could wake up with a sore arm, leaving the franchise in a squeezed position as a great portion of the payroll budget would be wasted during the remaining length of the contract.
Autry let Nolan Ryan go free agent in 1979. Here was Nolan’s record his last 4 years with the Angels:
1976 / 284 IP / 17-18 W-L / 3.36 ERA
1977 / 299 IP / 19-16 W-L / 2.77 ERA
1978 / 234 IP / 10-13 W-L / 3.72 ERA
1979 / 222 IP / 16-14 W-L / 3.60 ERA
Autry figured Ryan was deteriorating, and his arm could go out shortly. When he refused to negotiate on another contract, Autry famously said: “I can get 2 pitchers that go 8-8 for a lot less money”
Of course Ryan went on to pitch 9 quality years for the Astros and 4 decent years for the Rangers before finally running out of gas in his 5th year at age 46.
Arte has continued the tradition of overspending on name position players, leaving the fans frustrated that the team never has enough pitching to legitimately compete for a championship.
It was Bill Bavasi who said “All I need to replace Ryan is have two 8-7 pitchers.”
They went on to sign Bruce Kison and another scrub pitcher.
Everyone thought Ryan was deteriorating. Ryan in his book threw Fregosi under the bus for not going to bat for him, it came out years later that Fregosi advocated for Ryan hard. I lost a lot of respect for Ryan after that. And in 2002, the Angels won because of Relief Pitching and solid players.
I grew up near where NR lived a few years in Anaheim when he first became an Angel and was his paperboy for the Anaheim Bulletin during this time. Collection for fun. I got to know him a bit. I also played Babe Ruth Baseball at Boysen Park on Jim Fregosi son’s team.
What i can tell you is there is Fregosi’s side and Ryan’s and the real truth. I will side with Ryan because of how he treated all the kids in the area. He was approachable, straightforward, and an amazing role model. My oldest brother, a Dodgers fan and an Angels hater name his son after NR. I also named my son after him years later. This is the impact he had on many of us that knew him as kids.
Hind sight is 20/20 and we all know it was a big mistake. In today’s game teams often pay after players prime years and give the face of the team the big contract. I blame Autry on this one as he was close to Ryan and turned his back on him. Fregosi had a large ego, as his son, was the face of the team in the 60’s and Ryan in the 70’s. Maybe Fregosi had issue with this, we don’t know the true story. But Fregosi brought some pride into being an Angel.
Ryan didn’t know Fregosi went to bat for him. It shows you how great Fregosi was and why he was so respected in this game. Even though Ryan threw him under the bus, Fregosi didn’t throw anyone under the bus.
There is no siding, Ryan got it wrong. When you throw someone under the bus, you should get it right.
1000% agree. The best thing, which won’t happen, is trade Rendon on a resurgent healthy yr, and getting prospects in return. Sign Ohtani to the large contract since he’s obviously significantly more valuable and in his mid 20″s. They won’t need to sign any big named FA pitchers since Ohtani, Sandoval, Barria, and even Detmers and Suarez are more than capable. They should spend significant money on bullpen arms and some left over change on bench players to round out the roster. They drafted a ton of pitching that will add to the rotation or deepen the pen over the next few years. Stoneman let the kids play and they developed into a great team, and picked up a few key FA pitchers along the way.
It was Bill’s dad, Buzzie that said that.
Yeah you are right. Boy i’m getting old.
There is a major difference, Arte a legitimate business man, knows that name recognition is what bring fans to the game. Check the difference in attendance with and without Arte. Except for the run made in 2002, Arte has had the best attendance record.
You do realize that of the 20 pitchers selected they will be lucky if three make the bigs.
dont get why teams extend guys at peak value. i mean, as good as Ohtani is, doing better than this unlikely, and if he needs TJS again then paying him record money wolnt be too good for the payroll.
The closer it gets to his free agency, the more tempting other teams will look.
If Ohtani needs TJ surgery he can still DH. If he hurts his arm, he can play RF. He’s the safest pitching pick in the history of baseball.
but if you’re paying him to do both then a major injury has you down not only a starter and your DH, but payroll space dedicated towards both of those positions. its conceivable that he cant get full value for both parts of his game because that wouldn’t be managable on a payroll, but in theory the value he provides for pitching to even just a 3.00 ERA and ~30 HR .270 (ie probably the minimum value that his agent would likely suggest for his next contract) is already worth loads. you’re just about locked into giving him crazy money – something that would only be worth it if he stayed healthy for almost the entirety of the contract.
I think they’re looking at more than just performance valuations. You must consider the unique ability Ohtani is to fully understand extending him.
There may literally be no other player like him for the rest of our lives if he can continue performing on both sides of the ball. Committing a player like that to your team long-term will reap other financial and marketing rewards. And I say this as one of the most critical people of Ohtani’s ability to succeed at both. Right now, he’s proving me way wrong.
He throws 100 and leads the league in HRs – unbelievable, truly.
Cap & Crunch
Darkside makes a good point-
There is definitely value in extending your guys early (if they are willing) before they hit peak value
It’s a matter of good internal evaluation and willingness to take a risk
But most Gm’s are fairly risk adverse as it jeopardizes their own job security
Add it all up and I agree that Darkside is hitting on something (tho it’s hard to define)
I personally like the gamebook the CWS are currently running out.
I hope it yields fruits…
All pro leagues are copy-cat leagues so their model will be replicated by many if they do as well I think they will the next half decade
If Ohtani didn’t pitch, I’d say don’t spend the money on a huge extension. But he does pitch, and he pitches well, so an extension would anchor the rotation and the DH for several years assuming he stays healthy..
The cap increasing is irrelevant. Moreno has his own cap and it has averaged around 175m a year for the last several years. He won’t spend the money he needs to for pitching. He makes low ball offers to free agent pitchers just to be able to say he was “in on him but he wanted to play elsewhere”.
Well said Prov356. I hope you are doing well in TN. God bless.
The article says Olney estimates $120-$130M on the trio of Trout, Rendon, and Ohtani. Since Trout and Rendon are $75M a year, it means he estimates $45 – $55M a year on Ohtani. I honestly don’t believe teams are going to spend that much per year on one player..
One of the reason Ohtani joined the Angels is because the Angels never had a Japanese star, unlike some of the other teams that were pursuing him, like the Mariners and Yankees. Ohtani also give all his Home Run Derby earnings to staff members. Ohtani is built a little differently.. I do believe that a long term extension gets figured out next off season (not this one). He is not all about the money and cares more about team. He is going to get plenty of money from the Angels, just maybe not the most money.
It would be nice to see what the team can do if Trout, Ohtani, and Rendon are all in peak form. This is Ohtani’s break out year and he took off right after Trout was injured. Last year, Rendon was good and Ohtani was off. It just seems to be the baseball gods way of teasing me for being an Angel’s fan.
Based on Moreno’s history, whatever he does, he will screw it up. For the last several years he’s needed to surround a Trout with a competitive starting rotation, but he chooses to focus on offense like with Rendon who’s been injured.
Would you rather have an owner that doesn’t give a flying leap if players cheat?I think Texas is the only other team in the division that has any integrity. I can’t remember any cheaters they brought in or extended
I’m actually glad we have an owner that spends and has some integrity. I can live with him being a little prideful.
@neuro You obviously don’t follow the Angels to just borrow tired and false narratives people spew about Arte. Fact is he does go after pictures on the FA market, from Grienke to Cole and many top starters in between. Not his fault the pitchers choose to go elsewhere. He spends money and tries to improve the team every year. And also the starting pitching has not been the major issues, it’s been the pen. Tendon was a great signing, we didn’t get Cole, so he improves a weak position with no other top notch pitchers available. The Angels haven’t had a 3rd baseman since Glaus really. Their lineup is stacked. They have been drafting arms and signing the ones they can, it’s not a money issue. They will be fine. I actually hope they grab a top SS in the off season, imagine that lineup when healthy. Get some bullpen arms and they are in good shape. So don’t know what history you’re referring to but you definitely don’t know or follow the Angels.
I follow the Angels more than you proof read. And “yes,” I must be completely wrong as this team struggles to stay at .500
Perhaps Arte will throw some spare change at Jake Arrieta to eat some innings and finish out the season.
If you take the #3 and #4 hitters off any team, they will struggle. You lose a lot of production when you take 2 hitters 900 to 1000+ OPS off any team. Not a lot of teams wouldn’t struggle if you take 2 such hitters out of the line up for most of the year.
Considering Adell.s improvements both offensively and defensively, the potential of the lineup is off the charts. It is loaded top to bottom. Even the starting rotation looks more promising than it has in years. The bullpen needs a overhaul, but there are a lot of good FA options at bullpen this year. I don’t see how they blow this off season as they have in years past when pitching is the only thing left to fix.
I agree that their offense looks like rocket fuel when healthy and I’m rooting for Adell to figure it out. He has been pressured as their can’t miss prospect for some time now while other less touted players like Walsh thrive.
I’m not convinced with their rotation – what can they do to strengthen it now instead of waiting for their young arms to develop while Trout is in his prime and they still have Ohtani in his walk year? The next year’s free agent class is largely populated by very successful but older pitchers. Do they overpay for a Scherzer, Kershaw (not leaving Dodgers), Verlander or Grienke? Or do they break the bank on someone younger & talented but is coming off a major injury like Syndergaard? I anticipate them making a big move and sign The Sho to a long term deal but how much money is left over to fill out the rest of the pitching arsenal?
@neurogame. Hit the nail on the head. He also tries for superstars and scrubs instead of just a solid lineup that would be more consistent. But the big deal, as you said, is he ignores pitching. I don’t know what metrics he’s looking at that tell him it’s unimportant, but when I’m looking at the Angels in the standings, that’s the only metric I need to tell me how important it is.
I need to be fair and say he doesn’t completely ignore starting pitching. He did offer Gerrit Cole a contract, it just wasn’t as lucrative as the Yankees…. nor the Dodgers! You’d think Arte would want to outbid a team in an adjacent area code with a bigger culture of winning, but he didn’t. Then to allocate that money to Rendon while thinking the team can climb on the backs of Cobb, Quintana, Canning and Bundy while gambling on Ohtani to pitch as well as he has up to this point (that risk paid off) towards a playoff bound season was delusional.
Now, The Angels are going have to pay big money to keep the Sho in Anaheim and somehow still have enough cash to go around for better pitching. This is going to be a very expensive team.
Angels need pitching but are gonna somehow end up paying someone like Bryant ,marte, Correa, seagar , or story with their money and hoping they can piece together a starting staff similar to the giants this year like it happens all the time lol
What pitcher do you want them to sign? What pitcher did you want him to sign last year?
There were a lot of pitchers who were available who would have improved their rotation and pen
The angels tend to swing for the fences with their signings
Maybe they do, but what seems unarguable right now is the fact that Ohtani looks to be the best signing in recent history – certainly the best international signing.
Like?????? Who???? Who did they not try and sign? Seriously, it’s delusional to thing that the Angels problems could be solved by FA starting pitching. I’ve done the homework. In the past 10 years there are 3 or arguably 4 “Top of the Rotation” FA deals that have worked out positively for the signing team.
Idk but what the angels don’t need to do is sign another position player like Bryant , seagar , or Correa to a 175 million contract or more then that either! That’s throwing a lot of money to a non problematic, if they need another bat semien should be the guy
I posted multiple times about this. Tomoyuki Sugano from Japan was available. Dude is a complete stud. Would have been Angels #1 or #2 and likely could have signed him around 15/year on 3 years (he signed less back in Japan). No idea why Angels didn’t make a move. Would have been a steal for how good he is.
You forgot the posting fee.
@Noel Again somebody with no clue on the Angels. They tried to sign starters, can’t force a player to sign. Their problem is their bullpen, they have money and will get arms. And I hope they do get a seagar at or Correa type SS to have a monster of a lineup. And they will of course go after starters again, but their issue is the pen.
I think the Angels will be fine going forward. There’s a lot of good, young pitching on the staff and plenty of fresh arms in the system for the bullpen. We need to stop wasting money on veteran pitching. Low market teams build pitching staffs through the draft and development. With pitchers needing TJ as a norm, paying for pitching is like paying for running backs. Totally unnecessary!!
Yep it is
They have had several good young pitching prospects since 2002. None have panned out. Suddenly you think it is going to happen? Arte’s problem is he can’t control himself and after missing out on Gerritt Cole and way over spends on Rendon. Nobody was going to give him that kind of $$$. Same way with Pujols and the others.
None have panned out. Weaver and Lackey didn’t pan out. Ohtani has not panned out?
Rodriguez and Sandoval are promising. Detmers killed it in AA and he’s getting some good exposure to MLB hitters, so hopefully he can settle down by next year. There’s 3 of your 5 right there. Go after someone like Desclafani, Stro, Thor, Rodon, or Ray in FA and maybe resign Cobb for depth. Along with Ohtani that’s a competent staff right there.. It’s the pen that needs more work.
Wasted youth in Anaheim.
Playing for the Angels is great, if you like October vacations
All Angel fans that wanted Bauer or Strassberg need to stop blaming Moreno for not spending on pitching. You should be praising him.
I wanted Wheeler. I couldn’t get a single person to agree with me We might have been able to sign Wheeler, there was no way we were ever going to sign Cole.
I wanted Wheeler too but he said he wouldn’t sign with a West coast team
I didn’t get anyone who agreed with me that we should make him our number one priority. We may have never been able to sign him, but then how can anyone blame Moreno for not adding pitching?
How is he suppose to sign pitchers that are not signable? And why is anyone blaming him for not signing Bauer or Strassberg?
Some people sound like weasels when they complain about such things.
Wheeler seemed like a decent pitching risk to sign. Now? His signing looks like a brilliant move. He always did have good pure stuff though, and high SOs.
A lot of people and teams wanted Wheeler. The Angels pursued him pretty heavily. He said he wanted to stay close to his wife’s family in New Jersey. He signed with Philly so I guess he stuck true to his word.
The Angels would have had to go after Wheeler hard and quickly. No one wanted to do that. They wanted to hit the home run.
I kept writing that and it’s revisionist to say people wanted Wheeler. After the free agent market played out they may have settled for Wheeler but I can’t remember a single poster that wanted to make him our number one priority.
There were a lot of articles written when it occurred.
A team cannot get the free agents they want all the time. He was the 2nd best free agent pitcher at the time behind Cole. Wheeler wanted to play on east coast and Cole wanted to be a Yankee. The Angels ultimately didn’t have a chance in either case.
I believe you that the Angels didn’t have a chance for either pitcher.
If they would have signed Bauer or Strasburg it would have been a disaster.
Well, that is the thing with these FA. You dont know how they will turn out. Who would have thought Wheeler would be better than Cole at this point? I wanted be the first to admit I wanted Cole over Wheeler. However, I was no way interested in Cole for 9 years. The Angels may have dodged a bullet on Cole as well.
Wheeler did not want to come to the Angels because of Mick the Dick Pic Callaway who screwed him in NY with the Mets.
I was born in NY still follow my boyhood team the Mets but am an Angel Honk for life as I have lived the past 11 years in SoCal and routinely go to Angel games as it really does not conflict.
My point being Wheeler pitched to a bad calling and framing catcher Wilson Ramos who even Thor complained about and Mickey Mouse Callaway always left Wheeler in 1 to 2 batters to late even with a high pitch count even when the Mets where technically out of the playoff race in his walk year. I always wondered in the back of my mind if that was intentional to drive up his ERA and numbers and lower his value in FA.
My hope is we drafted all pitchers and picked up some at the deadline so maybe pitching will finally be a priority
Angels & NL West
I wanted Wheeler, Gausman and Kennedy. I also wanted some pitchers who have not fared well this season so my suckcess ratio is approximately 50%.
Under no circumstances did I, or would I, want Cole, Bauer or any other high end SP coming off a career year.
I see the Astros and A’s 2 yrs of contention at most. A’s may even start a rebuild and trade off this offseason. That will be angels window to put together a playoff quality roster but they never seem to find the right mix of pitchers
Buster is full of crap. The Angels are done with Pujols’ contract this year and Upton’s next season. They have Trout, Rendon & Fletcher locked up and control all their young players with additional contracts coming off the books this winter (Jose & Raisel Iglesias, Cobb, Suzuki). They’re in a good position to extend Ohtani and pick up a SP, elite short stop and address the bullpen.
I agree. Buster Olney lives in New York and has always been East Coast biased. I honestly don’t put much value into anything that comes out of ESPN.
The Angels are in great shape to sign Ohtani and I’d argue that with Trout and Ohtani, have probably the highest marketing punch in MLB.
I also agree with several in this board that it’s about BULLPEN. Get some solid bullpen pieces, each year if you have to, to surround a competent (not all star) rotation and they’ll win games.
They also need to have Mike reduce his muscle mass, lean out a bit, to stay healthier for 162+.
They can’t extend because they won’t have a DH position with all the old sticks.
What people don’t realize that the angels are set for the next 5 years with an outfielde they fully control. And an infield they control everyone except their shortstop and catcher . There’s not many holes. At this point it’s about creating depth and yes the bullpen. With all the pictchers they have signed you will see that bullpen depth start to emerge. So free agents will become complement pieces instead of expected to be superstars like they’ve done in the past
Cap & Crunch
Im not trying to be controversial or stir any pot
But I (loosely) only see 3 ways to skin this cat
1- They pay Ohtani the bag, keep Trout and Rendon till end of days and are cash crippled the next 5 years to spread the cheese around. This is most likely result /can be debated if ideal
2- They trade off Rendon for a pretty massive loss while also having to eat a large sum of money each year the next 5 years (say *8~10 mill) . This would be the hardest option to pull off but Id at least look into it to see if anybody had interest Taking off 10 per still leaves him at a 5/135 so prospects need to go as well unless ya find a sucker
3- Now breath, you know what I’m going to say, they trade Trout for assets and also use his 37 AAV elsewhere.
I’ve brought this up before and it doesn’t go over well….but I thought the time and place for this post was this article. Ofc Trout has a NTC so you’d have to approach him and see if he’s willing . If he was willing at Id least feel around the offers.
In short, there are NO easy answers for Ana moving forward
Hear me out: you trade ohtani and get idek but plenty of youth and controllable players, still have trout and rendon and can have an even more affordable core with $$ to throw somewhere.
Cap & Crunch
I like it…4 options then !
Tho ill add, I’ve never seen Trout whip that crowd into a frenzy like Ohtani does
That shouldn’t matter, but we are talking Arte here
Cap – I’ve said this before in response to “trade Trout” comments: You don’t make your team better by trading away the best player in the history of the game. You make it worse. Trout chose to be an Angel for his career. The only problem this team has is the owner refuses to build a decent pitching staff. If someone could knock some sense into Mr. Moreno, we could build a pitching staff that can get us there. We have the offense and defense.
Hey Cap. Not sure if you can guess by my screen name here but… I am very much against trading Ohtani. I know it’s a tricky situation but, if they trade him… I will tantrum.
The Angels never learn from their mistakes. I remain puzzled as to why Trout would sign long term with such a confused franchise.
I think if the Angels get healthy and get good, they should use Ohtani where he is most needed. If they need his pitching and they don’t need his bat as much, then have him concentrate on pitching. Right now, they’re free to do whatever, they’re just not good enough to worry about it. I’d like to see him pitch because that’s my favorite part of baseball, watching a great pitcher. Which he can be!
Ohtani needs to take a hard look at how the Angels operate under Moreno and then decide if he wants to spend his career in mediocrity and out of the postseason, or take his act on the road.
It amazes me that people don’t see the path forward. If this team solved its bullpen issues last off season it would be right in the thick of things and going forward this team is in much better shape than it was a year ago
People really need to open their eyes and focus.
Angels & NL West
The Angels are in better financial shape and closer to being a playoff contender than some people think. They have several effective, cost controlled arms that have arrived, or will be arriving soon, that offset the contracts of Trout, Rendon and Ohtani. Adell and Marsh also offer upside at a reasonable price.
Perry arrived at a good time with young talent starting to bubble up to the major league level. And its beginning to be clear to me that he is one of the really sharp, young GMs in the game. I’m optomistic the Angels are headed in the right direction for the first time in a few years.
A really sharp GM would have addressed the obvious bullpen problems. Perry, and no one else is the reason the Angels are out of it
With the information we have, which is limited, he doesn’t appear to be all that sharp. He screwed up big time. When the information changes, my opinion will be adjusted.
Just to add, Iglesias hasn’t come into games in the 8th inning with a four run lead. That’s pathetic.
Angels & NL West
I like how Perry has maneuvered getting 900-1000 innings over 162 games from 11 SP on the heels of a short season while balancing the need to increase workloads for young SP. Veterans did the heavy lifting early while the young arms gained more seasoning in the BP or minors. Now the young arms have taken over and are gaining valuable experience at the major league level.
While the BP has been horrible, some of the Angels pitching woes lay at the feet of Maddon. He should keep SP in the game longer when they are effective and their pitch count is manageable. SP are performing at a much higher level than RP. Stop going for the quick hook after a couple of soft contact singles on good pitches. And don’t automatically default to righty/righty, etc match-ups. Which brings me to my next point, minimize bringing in a RP mid-inning with runners on base. Inherited runners are scoring at an alarming rate. Any SP is better equipped to get out of trouble than any RP not named Iglesies.
Today relief pitching has lower ERAs than starters. The game has changed Anyway, you get three relief pitchers with a history of success. Then get pitchers like Mayers, who might be for real and might not be. You find out if he’s worth anything in low leverage situations. When one of the top three needs to be replaced, then you go to the stage two pitchers. And you have young pitchers with options.
Until you have those pitchers in place, you don’t add pitchers like Claudio, Guerra, Cishek and Watson. Claudio and Guerra were incompetent signings.
He blew it big time. You can’t blame Maddon for not having anyone for the 6th through 8th innings.
Angels & NL West
We like the Angels and MLBTR so we will both be here to see how this plays out over the next few years, but I believe the following:
1) Perry will prove to be an excellent GM,
2) Maddon’s strength is massaging 26 egos, but definitely not managing a BP, and
3) Perry will sign or trade for one high leverage RP in the off-season, but will otherwise go with young, homegrown, cost controllable arms in the BP next year.
Regardless of who is correct, we can both agree on, GO ANGELS!!!
Time to sell off Trout,Rendon,Ohtani and get real pitching They will never win with the team out there now.Bad GM,Mgr Maddon is over rated.Time to rebuild.
At most, there is only one team in baseball that will win it all with the team they have now.
The Angels cord and future looks pretty good. But you have to know something about baseball to make insightful posts. You obviously don’t.
Ohtani deserves a ring get out of Anaheim while you can!
Just curious, has your team won a World Series this century. Had the best record over a season this century. Have been to seven championship series this century and has never lost more than 95 games. The answer is no.
And your team probably signs cheaters and or illegally steals signs. I’m proud to be Angel fan.
Ohtani deserves to play for an honorable organization that tries to win every year.
Which is more important, playing for an organization that tries and fails to win or one that actually wins? As far as that title 19 years ago, great, but how many people from then are still playing? None on the Angels (at least not that I can think of) and maybe only a handful from anywhere. So that doesn’t prove they’re a great team. As for the honor, I’d doubt the Angels have never signed someone who doctors the ball or injects anything into themselves. That would be truly remarkable.
What’s better? That’s your answer, I didn’t ask.
But since you asked, a team that tries to win every year is going to make a championship series 7 times this century. Add to that it has integrity, I’ll take the Angels.
You can make that claim about 15 other teams just because we got some superstars there’s about 15 other teams that aren’t going anywhere Why pick on the Angels just because We got superstars People are jealous
Ohtani doesn’t strike me as a guy who cares primarily about money. When he came over, most people had him pegged to go to the Yankees. They had the bright lights of stardom, lots of media and commercial opportunities, etc. He could have waited a little and gotten a megadeal, but wanted to come to the US and play on the highest level.
If his motivations haven’t changed, it wouldn’t surprise me if he left the Angels to be on a team with a brighter future. I know the Angels have some money coming off the books, but they’ve shown an ineptitude in Trout’s tenure in fielding a playoff team.
Othani is going to care when the Angels only offer him $20 million a season while Rendon makes $38`million a season that will sink in for Shohei
Hey Nostradamus How do you know what the Angels are going to offer Ohtani a year?
20 million a year
Look at their payroll with Trout and Rendon…you think any one franchise can have 3 players making $38 million each?? Trout is locked in to 2031, Rendon is locked in to 2027. Trout and Rendon also have a no trade clause.
The Angels won’t pay Othani $38 million like Rendon because they won’t have the money come 2024 when he is a FA.
Why do you think sport writers are beginning to write about Othani future earnings? Because they are beginning to realize the Angels will have a payroll problem. I bet you the Yankees and Redsox will watch Othani contract talks closely.
Unless of course Othani is happy with sidekick money and never making the playoffs with the Angels then what I speculate is all moot.
As soon as Rendon is healthy and putting up numbers, trade him for pitching and/or prospects. Signing Ohtani should be a priority since he’s in his mid 20’s and you just can’t match his talent with any other player. The smart thing which won’t happen is trade Trout and stack up on top rated prospects. They can hold off on FA starting pitchers in the off-season and should allocate money towards big time bullpen arms. Their ERA, minus Bundy since the break has been top 5 in the AL. The bullpen outside of Iglesias has been a disaster.
I like your idea of trading Rendon Angels would have to eat at least 75% of that $230 million contract
Arte Moreno Tied up another one man island contract for
That kind of money you could’ve signed maybe 4 free agent players
Cap & Crunch
Rendon is going to be one tough Cookie to trade –
Your going to need another GM who’s on the hot seat or feeling a little desperate or has a bad contract they want to shed as well
Maybe Yanks consider it for Aaron Hicks, he’d fit well in theory
Maybe the Padres for Hosmer, move Manny back to Ss for a little Tatis to Of
Not too many options out there. I always like Rendon as a player but hated that contract as I felt he wouldn’t age well
Why are you deleting my comments? Why rules did I break?
Arte Moreno Needs to stay away from baseball decisions when it comes to players and free agent Let the GM build the team stay out of the way Arte Moreno
Sometimes you have to make marketing decisions so you can afford others to make baseball decisions.
Pujols made the Angels money that could be spent elsewhere. And he absolutely made the angels money. People who think otherwise have no idea what they are talking about.
Tonight’s game (Saturday) was poorly managed. Maddon took Barria out after 3 but left Guerra in after 2 walks and a single in the 6th to surrender a Grand slam, and then still kept him in. I get that we don’t have a major league level bull pen, so stop removing the staters so soon. Plus we are 1-8 with RISP so far on the 6th. Frustrating team to watch all the way around.
And Marsh must have dirt on someone because he should have been sent back to Salt Lake a long time ago.
Angels & NL West
I concur that Maddon is not great at managing a BP. He pulls the SP too soon. He should leave the SP in when they are effective and their pitch count is manageable. I provide more details on this subject above.
Yep. And what really irritates me is there isn’t a writer anywhere talking about how crappy this team’s pitching is. It’s the elephant in the room but all we hear about is “Ohtani did something great”. Oh, we lost again, but look over here at shiny Ohtani and ignore that we lost…again.