Back in 2019, Major League Baseball authorized the Tampa Bay Rays to pursue a plan that would involve splitting their home games between Florida and Montreal. However, just a few weeks ago, the league pulled the rug out from under those attempts. That leaves the club in a ticking clock scenario, as their lease at Tropicana Field runs through 2027, giving them until that time to figure out a different path forward.
One option that has at least been discussed is building a stadium on the land currently occupied by the Albert Whitted Airport in St. Petersburg, per a report from Colleen Wright of the Tampa Bay Times. The airport is located right on the bay, just a short drive from Tropicana Field.
As noted by Wright, the mayor of St. Petersburg, Ken Welch, recently addressed the situation on Twitter. “St. Pete is back in the game!,” he tweeted. “I was excited to meet yesterday with the Rays and County leadership. Together with our City Council and community partners, we have re-engaged with urgency to keep baseball in the Sunshine City.” The mayor sent a memo to city council members saying that he wants to study the airport site for “current and potential future community impact.” Wright also quotes Pinellas County Commission Chairperson Charlie Justice on the matter, who says, “The bottom line is, it’s good after every decade or 20 years to look and say, ‘OK, what’s happening. This is 100 acres of valuable land.'” Justice adds, “Does it make sense to keep doing it? Does it need to be changed? We are open to that opportunity.” The plan is somewhat complicated by the fact that the airport is also considering expanding, as detailed by Wright.
However, despite that acknowledgement that the airport site was considered, Justice and Pinellas County Administrator Barry Burton told Wright that there was more focus on other options, such as redeveloping the Tropicana Field or Al Lang Stadium locations. The latter site has previously hosted a ballpark, serving as the spring training venue for various teams over the years, including the Rays, back in the Devil Rays days. However, in 2011, it was turned into a soccer field and is the current home of the Tampa Bay Rowdies of of the USL Championship.
It seems that all options are still in the preliminary discussions stage, which makes sense given that the sister-city plan only died fairly recently. Decisions will have to be made in the near future though, given the limited amount of time remaining on the team’s lease at Tropicana. In a recent poll of MLBTR readers, more than two thirds of voters expect the team to eventually leave the Tampa/St. Pete area.
Ybor=good, St. Pete = Bad
St.Pete would not make much of a difference people do not go because the main Concentration of people are in Tampa and it’s a good 30 to 40 minute drive fighting a lot of traffic To get to Saint Petersburg
All true. I loved visiting St. Pete and the surrounding community. However, the stadium was trash,and it’s a bit of a drive for people living in Tampa.
I hear this argument a lot from Tampa area folks. Do they think it doesn’t take fans in many or most markets a 1/2 hour drive to get their stadiums? It’s always seemed to me to be the argument most made by those living in Hillsborough Co.. Heck Clearwater in Pinellas is about as far away too.
Re the “main concentration” argument, the pop of Hillsborough Co is about 1.5 million, of Pinellas almost 1 million. From a per capita income perspective though Pinellas significantly exceeds that of Hillsborough.
I don’t know that many from the Bradenton or Sarasota areas make the drive to the Trop at this point (seems nobody much wants to make the effort in the area) but each of their counties have pops of about 400,000, and income levels above Hillsborough. But moving to Tampa could increase their drive time. (unless the bridge to St Pete from the south is as big a mess as everybody from Tampa claims for the ones from Tampa there).
Pasco Co no of Hillsborough plays in favor of a Tampa park with 600,000 but income there is far lower than the other 4 counties here. And Polk Co (Lakeland) to the east has nearly 800000 but income significantly lower then even Pasco.
The comps to other franchises (Lightning, Bucs, both in periods like The Rays of contending for championships too) don’t hold much water for me either. Attendance for the Lightning is well above that for the Rays per game these days but more comparable to the Rays attendance a few years ago, in 1/2 as many games. And there are only 9 or so football games and they are almost all on weekends. ?
I know the Rays do well on TV ratings. It just seems like few want to actually make the effort to go to the games – and it seems to be getting worse even with a great team in place. Would that really change with a stadium in Tampa?
The franchise is well run form a baseball standpoint, but the financial picture drives that to an extent and may in fact be a negative in terms of fan attachment – the players never stay around. A bit like the line from “Major League” – “Who are these guys?” And lets face it, the franchise is subsidized in a significant way by the other teams – consistently being one of the top recipients of Revenue Sharing funds.
It just seems at some point the league is just going to give up on the market.
Well said!
The Trop is in a bad spot for drawing fans outside of the city since not enough fans from St Pete go to Rays games themselves.
Getting a stadium built closer to I75 would be the better option. I am long time Rays season ticket holder who has lived in Bradenton, Lakeland & now Dade City since 2020.
Allegiances live strong in the baseball community.
1. We have a bunch of northerners that have kids. Ask them to give up their Rangers, Islanders, Jets or Giants for the Bucs and Lightning? Sure. Or at least they’ll go to games outside of their team coming to visit. Give up the Yankees for the Rays? Absolutely Not. And they’re only going when the Yankees come in.
2. Florida is the spring training home for half the league and these teams have been in the area since way before the Rays. People not only move to Florida and then get to see their favorite team host games in the city they moved to, but their kids have grown up watching the Yankees, Red Sox, Phillies, etc. so why root for the Rays?
3. I’ve heard the complaint from other team’s fans that the Trop doesn’t feel like a baseball environment, which may explain why viewership is solid on TV. The Trop is not a “destination.” I honestly feel like a move to Orlando would be better and would almost be like a Vegas situation when it comes to sports. People visiting Disney or Universal, could say “hey, let’s catch a game while we’re there too. Plus, Orlando has already shown it’s love for successful sports.
The stadium, wherever it’s built, should be multipurpose throughout the year. I still like the idea proposed that they could house a gym for people to workout and restaurants. It attaches people to the venue and therefore may attach people to the team, that may not have done so before.
@nyyfaninla
Most teams see huge turnover during any 6 year period. How many of the current Yankees team were Yankees 6 years ago. Chapman (who left and came back), Gardner (not currently on the team) and who else? Yes, big market teams are better able pay the long term, big dollar contracts, but Cole probably sells more jerseys than Chapman or Gardner, and its not because he’s a long time Yankee. I wouldn’t be surprised to see Franco outsell Cole. Fan attachment has little to do with longevity, and more to do with the talent of the player. Locate the stadium where the fans are located and TV ratings can best indicate where that is, and the attendance will go up.
All teams face some of the transplant team loyalty. It isn’t unique to Tampa. Give people a nice drive and a good stadium. What difference does it make what team they root for? An I-75 location would be ideal. You need customers on all sides.
Funny how these Tampa trilobites whine about current stadium location… you know what, build them a new stadium in a new location and a new host of reasons will emerge as to why its not convenient for them to attend a game. The new stadium for the Rays should be at least 500 miles away from Trop Field
@AlienBob
Tampa isn’t one of those cities where rooting for the local team is the cool new thing to do when you move there. It’s not Chicago, St. Louis, NY, Boston, etc. where it has history or tradition. Allegiances are very heavy. Trust me, I’ve lived it for 35 years. Most of my friends rooted for other teams because their parents and grandparents came from a different area. It’s not easy to stop rooting for their team or at least spend time watching the small market Rays, especially since they’d been bad for so long. The Marlins at least had the luxury of pounding out two WS before their stadium was built. They deal with the same woes we do.
Fans in Florida are very fickle and they rarely carry full loyalty to the local team.
I remember the painful evening when I went to my first Bruins @ Lightning game. I grew up in Boston and had season tickets to the Bruins when I was 15. It wasn’t that hard to do it because tickets in the late 1950’s were cheap and my after-school job provided enough money to afford the tickets, subway fare and and occasional hot dog or soft drink.. Anyway, I was now staring down at a rink where my beloved Bruins were competing against a new team representing my adopted home city. Who should I root for? Finally logic won out over emotion. I was now a Tampaian (Tampan? Tampon?) and planned to live warm and snow-free for the rest of my life. The Lightning were my team now and whether they had winning or losing seasons, I had to support them.
Yes. The Ybor ‘City’ location off of I-4/I-275 makes much more sense than trying to build yet another stadium in the virtual ‘island’ that is downtown St. Petersburg.
For the life of me, I don’t understand why consideration hasn’t been given to building a stadium further NE off of I-4 halfway between Tampa and Disney World which is a 66 mile drive. Building a new stadium somewhere near Lakeland or the Winter Haven exits might allow fans from both the greater Tampa and Orlando metro areas to support the Rays. This seems to be a better “sister city” situation than St. Petersburg and Montreal.
If fans in the Tampa area won’t drive 30-45 minutes to St Pete why would they drive an hour – and far more if you’re an avid current fan from Pinellas?
That’s a good question, something you addressed very well in your comment above. My suggestion was to give consideration to a more localized sister city concept as a last resort before a potential relocation out of the state of Florida. It’s quite evident that other markets are making a push for MLB teams once baseball approves expansion to 32 teams. MLB has also made it clear that expansion won’t be addressed until the Tampa and Oakland stadium issues are resolved. There are more cities vying for MLB teams than just the two expansion franchise will provide. If the Tampa area and the state of Florida don’t resolve the stadium issue with the Rays, they will be gone well before the end of the decade.
Really? I always heard St. Pete was a nice spot. Can you elaborate a little more?
Its just really hard to get to and I believe most of the population of Tampa lives pretty far from st Petersburg
Google a street map of the greater Tampa metro area. St. Petersburg, particularly anything near the downtown area where Tropicana Field and the proposed Albert Whitted Airport location offers limited access to most of the greater Tampa population. As I stated before, the St. Pete peninsula is a “virtual island” when it comes to driving.
It is somewhat reminiscent to when I lived in the Seattle area which had only two bridges over Lake Washington connecting the city to its most populated eastern suburbs. If you didn’t take one of the two bridges you would have to drive a significantly greater distance to reach downtown Seattle going either north or south around Lake Washington. Because of the limited more ‘direct’ access of just two bridges, the traffic going into and out of the centralized area of Seattle was a nightmare, especially during rush hours.
Still is a mess traffic wise
Where is the Buccaneers stadium located? I never hear anything bad about it’s location. Is there not a site anywhere near there? If not, the team should really consider moving to Orlando and switching names to the Florida Rays so they can keep their TB fan base while increasing the Orlando fan base. Either way, I’m pretty certain eventually one of the Rays or A’s will be moving to Las Vegas. It would probably make the most sense for the A’s to move to Nevada and the Rays to just relocate in Florida. I’ve spent a lot of time in Orlando and it seems like it would be able to support a team better than St. Pete. They already have an NBA team in the Orlando Magic.
I do think that Orlando is at least worth trying…as long as it’s relocation (not expansion). As for the Buccaneers, their “fans” will disappear again now that Tom Brady has retired.
Tropicana is like having a stadium on Bainbridge Island with a single bridge from Alki. You would need to commute across the West Seattle bridge just to get started.
@hammer – the Bucs stadium area has been floated and would be a good location. The problem is the Yankees spring training and minor league stadium is there. They would have to ask them to move so that they weren’t right on top of each other.
draysbay.com/2022/1/3/22862336/rays-new-stadium-ta…
Why not split the difference and build in Lakeland?
There is a six lane freeway (I-275) that goes between Tampa and Bradenton with an exit providing easy access to Tropicana Field. Comparing Downtown St. Petersburg to Bainbridge Island, Washington makes no sense. One is the center of a metropolitan area of several hundred thousand people with good road access from three directions (the waters of Tampa Bay are on the east). The other is an Island with a population of 25,000 which is accessible from the mainland only by one road and a ferry service.
I have been saying this please since pre COVID. The owner of the Magic started a petition to test interest into buying a team in that area. Down the street isCamping World Stafium and stadium for Orlando
@Please, Hammer. Don’t hurt ’em
Are you really going to make a location comparison between the Buccaneers Stadium in Tampa that hosts 8 or 9 NFL home games in a season to the Rays 81 MLB home appearances in St. Petersburg? The freaking Bucs could play in the middle of Lake Okeechobee and sell out their home games!
Clearly the St. Pete location isn’t working enough to properly support an MLB team. Perhaps a stadium in Tampa, Orlando or some point in between won’t work either. The community and politicians will have to figure something out soon before the lease at Tropicana Field expires in 2027. If not, they will be saying goodbye to the Rays.
Awesome spot, but not where the majority of people are at.
True. I live in Lakeland, so I much prefer the Ybor location. Dale Mabry is pain to drive to with all the traffic.
The Ybor plan inluded ZERO new parking and was summarily rejected.
So, rework the Ybor plan so that it includes new parking. That does not sound like a reason that can’t be overcome.
This. MLB figured out thirty years ago that their ballparks best need to be in dense urban centers where there is a ton of other stuff to do, not leafy bedroom communities. Plus, the Trop is a total shithole of a park.
I’m trying to figure out what all the cry babying regarding the possible new stadium location in St. Petersburg. My home in northwest Hillsborough County almost 30 miles from Tropicana Field. The Veterans Expressway (FL-589) is close to my home and on most game nights, I can get to the field in 30 or 35 minutes. The route takes me past Tampa International Airport and the Westshore Business District. It’s in the Westshore area, 589 takes me into I-275 which eventually leads into I-175 which is really a one mile long off-ramp that exits a couple of blocks from the stadium. I used to live in the Boston area and going 12 miles from my home there to Fenway Park was much more of a driving challenge. Plus the parking situation at Tropicana is much better than Fenway and costs much less. Tickets are more reasonably priced as well..
Apparently people voting with their feet and dollars don’t agree with you. It’s cheaper at the Trop because demand is much, much lower. Blaming people for not spending their money how you’d like them to instead of giving them what they want isn’t a very good business plan.
They’ve run the experiment for,a long time. The result is crystal clear – people don’t want to go to St. Pete for baseball.
I think that the Lightning avg game attendance is higher than the Rays. Pretty difficult to claim that the diff is that Tampans prefer hockey to baseball, or that the Rays have not been sufficiently competitive. It’s that nobody wants to do the drive out to the tulies. It they are quick to go downtown. Figure out the parking and get it done, or lose the team. It’s pretty clear cut.
Your new team the Florida Marlays!!
Sarasota Seahorses
An open air stadium right in the flight path of an airport would be a fitting sequel to the mess that is Tropicana field.
Open air stadium, or one without some kind on retractible roof is something that would be built in central florida by someone who knows zippity about weather here and can’t grasp that summer thunderstorms appear out of nowhere more evenings than not from June thru August.
Raymond James Stadium, where the Buccaneers play, is almost directly under the flight path of a secondary runway for Tampa International Airport. The vast majority of flights use the two parallel two north-south runways which don’t take planes anywhere near the stadium but there are a few days each year when the winds are not favorable for the main runways and force the use of the east-west runway. There’s less than two miles between the stadium and the east end of the runway.
This doesn’t seem like a good solution. It takes time to build a new ballpark, either in the Tampa area of another state and city. This needs resolution within the next year.
Find a location that can be built with minimal taxpayer funds and is close enough to the population center to get more fans so the Rays can keep more of their stars as they get more expensive.
Of course that won’t be easy, but the most likely alternative is for them to move.
no taxpayer money should EVER go to fund a professional sports team’s building unless those tax coffers are being reimbursed in the exact percentage of revenue.
Yes, studies show that the revenues generated by public stadiums is just cannibalization of existing spending. Stadiums are not “economic development” prograns, they are corporate welfare.
BTW I remember when the White Sox got a public funded stadium (which continues to be subsidized in low attendance years) by threatening to move…to Tampa/St Pete!
Stadiums do move the revenue. St Pete can cannibalize money that would otherwise be spent in Tampa, for example. That’s the incentive for cities to contribute. Probably have to outlaw it at the state level to stop it.
So one city takes money from the other. Is that local tax revenue worth hundreds of millions of dollars? Not a chance. And the state gets the same taxes regardless.
LOL, you clearly don’t understand how taxes work. Specifically how much sales tax revenue can be generated in 81 games of a season. Not just on everything sold in the stadium but also the surrounding area. Taxes on hotel rooms etc.
It’s probably true that a FOOTBALL stadium is a losing bet, but not baseball.
99, beginning your reply with a dismissive LOL and implying you clearly understand how taxes work better than others is quite the first impression.
Every *independent* study of ballpark building has shown it’s a poor investment for governments to make.
If we assume the new Rays ballpark will cost $810 million to make things easy math-wise, the new ballpark would have to generate $500k per game in new, incremental tax revenue for 20 years to pay itself off.
At an 8% tax rate (again, assuming all of these taxes are on money that otherwise would not have been spent, and that it all goes to paying off the ballpark), that’s $6.25 million per game in new revenue.
I don’t see that happening.
Gbs, all anyone would need to do to prove your point is Google the debacle that is “loanDepot ” Park and how the inflation and such will cost Miami Dade over a billion dollars. And yeah sure they get some taxes there (and the agreement states they get parking revenue) but overall it was was awful deal foe the city (and I remember vividly pushing for the stadium). The data is actually used often now when cities want funding for stadiums, the city simply tells the poor billionaires “look what happened in Miami”
My only credit to the Ray’s is it seems the owner is willing to actually put up a large sum of the money (way more than Loria did). But when they put in so much money they want even more of the returns.
Either way the ballpark can’t be in St Pete. The hours of traffic to and from the stadium coming from Tampa won’t work. I used to hate on their attendance until I looked further in to it (when I go to games there I stay in St Pete so it was easy). Now my best friend lives in Tampa and we said hey let’s see the Yankees play! Uh oh. Bad idea….especially since we Ubered.
The Ybor plan inluded ZERO new parking and was summarily rejected.
Ok. Then fix that, and get it done.
I disagree. State/local taxpayer funds should be considered when building a new stadium, at least for infrastructure improvements if not funding part of the construction itself. At full MLB stadiums, millions of dollars are spent each game. The city/state generates revenue off of this money whether it be sales tax or meals tax. Plus a new stadium brings a ton of new jobs along with new corporate/residential development too, all generating substantial real estate taxes. If the Rays are a flight risk from Tampa or the state of Florida, all of those tax revenues leave the city/state, so the use of taxpayer funding makes a lot of sense as it will pay for itself over a period of 10-12 years. If the team leaves Florida, all of the existing tax revenue flees the state with them, not to mention the increased tax revenues that would come with more fans at a new park and from all of the ancillary construction that would completed around the location of the new stadium. It’s very short sighted not to consider some sort of public funding. I do agree the city/state should not foot the entire bill of the project like NY did with the Mets stadium and by the sounds of it, the Miami ballpark too but there is a happy medium there that will more than pay for itself once the stadium is completed.
Dorothy and others, sorry this is going to be a long-winded reply.
I can understand infrastructure investment. After all, if a few million people per year attend baseball games at a facility, spending on roads, parking, public transportation, etc. makes sense.
Beyond that, though, sports facilities are financial net losers for communities. Here are a couple of studies of several baseball stadiums that questions the benefit of the investment.
surface.syr.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1270&#…
pbs.org/newshour/nation/public-money-used-build-sp…
As the later points out, “St. Louis, for example, is still paying $6 million a year on debt from building the Edward Jones Dome, the old home of the Rams that opened in 1995, despite the team’s move to California.”
Hoosiers continued to pay millions of dollars per year for the RCA Dome long after the Colts moved to Lucas Oil Stadium.
Yes, MLB and the NFL are different, but the results are similar.
You point out that millions of dollars are spent each game, but how much tax revenue does that generate? And more importantly, how much of that is *additional* tax revenue compared to what the old stadium generated?
Also, “a new stadium brings a ton of new jobs,” but those are short-term construction jobs that are gone when the stadium is complete. Most of the jobs for people working during games existed before.
“it will pay for itself over a period of 10-12 years.” I would have to see evidence that the payoff is that short. if the team leaves, yes tax revenues will decline, but that also means hundreds of millions of tax dollars were not spent on a stadium.
I agree there is a solution involving public and private investment that would be a win for both sides, but that solution needs to be heavily financed by the team, with essentially ancillary investment by the community.
Yeah and with all that infrastructure stuff, just look at Miami and Atlanta. I went to a game at Truist Park last season to watch the marlins. The stadium has a world around it of stores restaurants bars and such, all were packed and raking it in. It was a Friday or Saturday but I imagine the area does well no matter what. I agree with you about the “stadium jobs” as they are seasonal (a bunch don’t pay well and are usually someone’s second or third job) and the construction is great but that is not for long. But at least it looked like the whole area around Truist Park was thriving with many places who employ many people and such (even though I don’t don’t should have left Atlanta but that’s another argument)
Then Miami built the stadium and made a bunch of surrounding buildings for bars restaurants and stores. And even though Loria spent all that money on the team (bringing in Reyes Buehrle and Bell along with Hanley and Stanton in the lineup) no one took those spots. There is plenty of real estate to be rented out to stores and bars and such. Its a perfect example of the plan failing. And as you mentioned the St Louis thing with thwm still paying for thay stadium it is estimated that Miami will be paying for the park for 30 years and the inflation and interest will make it cost over a billion. But hey they get the parking! Either way Miami is a Fairweather city and I feel they are building a team that can be good for years so you will finally start to see that area paying off. But overall it was s bad deal like so many.
The Ray’s owner I believe is willing to pay for half the stadium and i feel that should be the way it is. Billionaires can afford the stadiums on their own and make more than enough every game to recoup their losses while the city takes way longer. I am all for the city pitching in and helping but not at the amounts some of these owners ask for. I really wanted the Marlins to stay and I advocated for that stadium….but in hindsight I don’t know how I feel.
And that exactly was the plan initially as they sold St Pete on building a stadium in a depressed area to “revitalize” it even before they had a team. Didn’t work, although downtown St Pete has become a very hot area but it never helped the stadium area which remains for the most part, depressed.
Trading away stars before they decline has been working pretty well for the Rays. It may be an actual good plan rather than just something they do out of necessity.
Cosmo2, yes they’ve been very good at succeeding while turning over their roster and not spending a lot. I wonder how many more fans they would get if they had players around for a long time to market around. We’ll see if he keep Wander Franco for the long haul.
They have traded or let players walk when the time was right. Price, Crawford, BJUpton, Shields, and Zunino… Others have still done well Huff, Joyce, Odorizi, Cobb and others. Zobrist was one I can’t remember how well he did but thought his first year or two was okay but the contract was high for them. I don’t know which you think would have brought in more fans and get your point, (I’m not into college sports partly for that reason) but they’ve done pretty well getting their monies worth.
Here’s how to fix the Tampa (and Oakland) stadium issues…Mr. Sternberg, open your wallet, peddle to your Wall Street friends, speculate (correctly) and generate the funds privately you need to finance a ballpark. Stop asking for tax-payer money for your billion-dollar company.
Well said, Tom. Taxpayers giving hundreds of millions of dollars to sports facilities is foolish.
This is where you are mistaken. Typically, the taxpayer is not giving it to the team. They are loaning it to the team. The bonds get repaid by taxes attached to the tickets. .
Loaning it to the team is not always how it works. When Raymond James stadium in Tampa was built, it was paid for through loans based on future revenue from a sales tax increase which is applied to all taxable purchases made in Hillsborough County. The Glazer family, which owns the Buccaneers, does not have to pay back these funds.
Tropicana is an embarrassment to MLB. Though, I do enjoy the Ted Williams Hitters Hall of Fame.
They closed the museum this year and turned it into a bar area.
Good lord. Another terrible idea. Move this franchise by midnight. I’ll help.
Ted would’ve approved.
Any stadium in St. Pete seems like a non starter due to the traffic issues that have been blamed for the poor attendance. I don’t know the area. Someone please tell why the congested Ybor City location is preferable to a site farther east near the Florida State Fairgrounds? It seems goal one should be to solve the access issues for the fans.
I live in Lakeland, so I’d love the fairgrounds location. Plus, there isn’t a lot going on around there (aside from the casino and amphitheatre), so it would be a good opportunity to build a stadium complex with restaurants and bars around the stadium.
@Chupa
… and that is how new stadiums in Portland and Oakland are being designed. You need the development to include office, hotel, retail and housing construction to make the investment make sense for all including government. The stadium becomes the center piece for an urban renewal. Government comes on board when they see the dollars will create homeless housing and increased tax revenues.
Alien – there is insufficient reason in St. Pete for people to endure the hassle of going there. It is very well established that fans will flock to downtown centers because they come early, eat, stay and party in the bars, etc.
Regarding the comments about public ROI on stadium projects…. This is. It 1992 any more. There are far savvier players now, and a properly designed project can make a stadium a centerpiece of revitalization. It’s not infinite, but a couple of hundred million for a baseball park can be a good public investment. Football is not – they play 1/10th the number of games as baseball, and the fans spending overall is much less.
Regarding any talk about keeping the ballpark anywhere in limited access St Pete.
Fool me one, shame on you
Fool me twice, I’m an idiot.
Move them to Las Vegas
Call them the Las Vegas Gamblers
Hire Pete Rose to manage them
There…done…you’re welcome
Las Vegas Aces
Las Vegas Parlays
Vegas will eventually get a new franchise, not an existing one.
This. MLB isn’t terribly interested in giving up a couple of billions in expansion fees by burning a great market if they can avoid it. Plus, an East Coast team is way more likely to end up in Nashville.
I liked the Las Vegas 51s name. I’d just extend the concept by giving every player the uniform number 51, and only signing foreign players so they can all be aliens. Stadium should be saucer-shaped, of course.
Keeping the ballpark in St. Pete isn’t going to solve anything. There is a lack of mass transit from Tampa to St Pete, which plays a huge factor of those traveling from Tampa, and baseball is played 6-7 days a week unlike football or hockey.
You’ve hit a sore point with me. There is a lack of mass transit throughout the entire Tampa Bay area. Most people here just won’t ride it. There are no light rail or heavy rail (subway type trains). There is no commuter rail. The closest thing that we have to rail transit is a heritage trolley line between downtown Tampa and Ybor City. The cars are about 15 years old but they were manufactured using the design of 1920’s Birney Cars. Because the line is single track with turnouts, it can take 2o or 25 minutes to go the 2.5 miles. One can travel the route by automobile or bus in 7 minutes.
Have to laugh at all the commenters here that say “no tax dollars to fund a stadium.” Very few stadiums in the US are funded purely through private funds. At a minimum, cities and states need to assist with land acquisition, road and sewer improvements, etc, and that does cost taxpayer dollars.
Studies do show that building sports stadiums do not have the massive economic impact their proponents tout, true. But it is not without economic benefit, and having a sports team is also a matter of civic pride. Plus there are indirect benefits to cities that are not accounted for by these studies. Bottom line though is this: Unless your sports team owner is 100% committed to keeping his team in your city, you’d better be willing to help him build his stadium or he’ll find another city that will.
Don’t twist the issue. so called “impact” improvements for a stadium are no different than for a building going up and far, far less than forking over half of say.. 250m of a 500m total cost stadium, THEN having to pay for those very same improvements anyway.
People in Florida, just like in many southern states are not all that keen about getting soaked with taxes, hence -0- state income tax and one of the places a good portion of others from other states flee to in order to escape burdens.. like being soaked with nonsense like anything their elected officials can dream up. Most of us here don’t tolerate that nonsense and our officials pretty much know they won’t stay around if they do.
I wonder if they think sports teams are the only super rich corporations that get public money?
As just one example, all of those car manufacturing plants in TN, SC, AL, etc. where they start their workers at $14 an hour instead of $30 like in Detroit…all of them given tax breaks, tax incentives, public funding for infrastructure or some other form of taxpayer money to lure them there.
If you bothered to read the earlier comments providing infrastructure was not part of the argument. While civic pride is somewhat important, the economic benefits do not exceed the cost and studies have shown that over and over again. They are a bad investment and the benefits to the city you speak of that are not accounted for are few and far between and again don’t make up for the money lost.
As embarrassing as “The Trop” is as a Major League ballpark…it still isn’t as bad as “The Owe” aka Olympic Stadium in Montreal was.
The O was horrible, but the Trop gives it a real run for its money. The stadium was 8 years old before the Rays even played their first game.
Those catwalks are awful.
Not to be outdone, Olympic stadium used to have part of the roof painted to indicate foul territory since it was possible to hit it on occasion.
Move them the hell out of Tampa. They have a top notch team and they don’t draw worth a damn. Move them to a city that wants and will support a team.
Exactly, make them and the owner of the Baltimore orioles,swap everything, Baltimore finally has a decent ball club and nobody else cares!
The Ybor plan inluded ZERO new parking and was summarily rejected.
We get the point.
They’re not in Tampa. They’re in St. Petersburg.
Perhaps they should just build in Tampa. When they do studies as to where teams would be successful, they researched the population of Tampa, not St. Pete. Getting there is a pain, and the dome is a disaster. Go build it next to the football field. Hell, the Bucs and Lightning seem to be thriving playing in their named city.
As a Tampa resident currently eating lunch in Pinellas County, let me add some background.
1. The airport in question is a municipal airport that handles small planes.
2. A big part of the appeal of downtown St. Pete, at least to me, is the lack of interstate access. It has a walkable, small-town type of appeal, with top-notch art and museums.
3. The area around the Trop did not become a popular development area as expected when the Rays came. A few years back that area became an artsy area, and people started moving there and related businesses started opening.
4. Rental housing in Florida is bonkers right now. If they tore down the Trop and built apartments there that would probably be the best use of that land.
5. Lakeland is half-way between Orlando and Tampa, and it is too far away from both to draw enough fans during the week, and probably on the weekend.
6. Ybor City is fairly easily accessible to I-4, which runs east and west, and I-275 and I-75, which are north and south. Also millennials are starting to move into downtown Tampa, which is right around the corner from Ybor.
7. I’m a Rays fan and generally get over to about 10 games per year. I rarely go during the week because the traffic wears me out and I’d be tired at work the next day. I would probably be able to go to more games if the stadium were in Tampa, but the prices would probably go up, so who knows?
8. I personally don’t think public money should go towards building a new stadium in Tampa so $tu can line his pockets. I’d much rather public money be used for the upkeep of infrastructure so the roads I drive on don’t collapse or swallow my car someday.
9. I don’t care what anyone else says. I like the Trop. Always have.
10. I remember watching a documentary on Bill “Spaceman” Lee, and a reporter asked him what he would do now that he was out of MLB and done with baseball. Lee said something to the effect that MLB doesn’t own baseball, and he would “never be done with baseball.” As a fan if the Rays leave I would be disappointed, but there’s always the Florida League.
Thanks for letting me give my opinion, and enjoy your day.
@raydh Since you live in the area, how would you feel about the Glazer family leasing out Bucs stadium?
Well written but I have an obvious question. You like the Trop? Fine. Besides the fact that it has AC, what specifically do you like about it? Barren and plain outside, and inside no field visible concourse, catwalks… etc. Again….what?
Make them and Baltimore switch everything, Baltimore finally gets a decent team and nobody in Tampa cares
Does it actually matter to you that the Rays don’t play jn Tampa?
The TAMPA BAY Rays should reside in TAMPA. I don’t know why this is such a hard concept for people to grasp. They don’t need to move out of state, there are plenty of Rays fans here, but the commute to Tropicana is horrific at rush hour. Three bridges can take you into Pinellas county but if there’s an accident you’re screwed. People don’t want to spend an hour+ trying to drive to a game for their home team.
A stadium in Hillsborough county, in an area not far from 275/1-4 would be ideal. Ybor was a solid option, but they went about it the wrong way. In a perfect world, they’d be able to buy Steinbrenner Field across from RayJay, expand/update it, and it would be perfect in terms of location.
The Ybor plan was summaril rejected because it included no NEW parking.
Do you think saying this another five times means that there is no Ybor solution? Give it a rest.
Steinbrenner Field across from RayJay,. i heard that. and reason Steinbrenner brought that land.
Orlando Talking MLB also if rays need help..
long as they keep same color logo and devil /ray name i am happy.
die hard marlins fan sent 1992 but jeter killing that. along with yanks fans say e could do no wrong. he killng marlibs die hard fans like marlins man has not been back. after jeter turn him down. after marlins man offer to buy three years of season tickets. plus he give away and buy ticket for other from time to time.++++
They don’t need to move out of state, because tv deal will always be big. mlb leave lot of money on table if they did
FORGET ABOUT MONTREAL. They should become the Halifax Demon Ducks.
Yeah guys they need to be in Tampa to really draw. And they know that…. But they also have a very tight fisted owner, that I’m sure wants the stadium to be paid with public funds which more then likely is not going to fly, and looking at the TV contract money, it shouldn’t
@hammer – the Bucs stadium area has been floated and would be a good location. The problem is the Yankees spring training and minor league stadium is there. They would have to ask them to move so that they weren’t right on top of each other.
draysbay.com/2022/1/3/22862336/rays-new-stadium-ta…
Having watched the Ray’s stadium drama and general lack of fan support play out for decades now, there is only one solution….. leave Florida.
Nashville, Charlotte or Montreal take your pick. You all know New Jersey would support a teams in a heartbeat, as none of us enjoy the nightmare of going into NYC or Philly to a lesser extent. But we all know those three teams would never allow a team to relocate to NJ.
It’s just time of the Rays and A’s to head to greener pastures, then MLB can expand by 2 to 32 and try to recoup some lost revenue from the pandemic years.
As baseball nuts Connecticut is they really could support a team in Hartford. That area loves baseball but absolutely no way the 2 new York teams or Boston signs off on it.
Great read in the comments.. When politicans open their mouths and speack, out come lies???? What shall anyone believe!!
I live in Lakeland, so I’d love the fairgrounds location. Plus, there isn’t a lot going on around there (aside from the casino and amphitheatre), so it would be a good opportunity to build a stadium complex with restaurants and bars around the stadium.
Why not make a leasing deal with the Glazer family and use the Bucs stadium which is actually in Tampa? What was Candlestick Park used to house both the 49ers and the Giants. The Glazer family is getting their teeth kicked in with their soccer venture in Europe. Seems like a opportunity worth investigating you ask me.
Owners are consistent…they want dollars from the new CBA, and more from the taxpayers.
That is not going to work. They need to get on the Tampa side of the bay Bridge.
Whatever they come up with, it’ll make a thousand times more sense than having split home towns. That idea was a joke.
I hope they dont split time between Tampa and Montreal. Just move to Montreal
Incorrect. Montreal already had its shot. Vancouver should be first in line for a team in Canada.
You are right about Vancouver BC. They do not have the French influence you see in Ontario and Montreal. BC is loaded with Asians with money and they like baseball. Initially the team could play in BC Place until a baseball only stadium is built.
Meh, Vancouver is a fickle sports town. They are up and down on the Canucks, dont really support the Lions, and you will recall that they had the NBA for a while.
And the taxes are crazy in BC.
A lot of Canadians go to Seattle games when the Jays visit, but that includes a lot from outside Vancouver. 162 games would be tough.
Can’t see another MLB team in Canada for a while
Just move already. Salt Lake City here they come!
I thought the underlying problem was that no one is willing to drive from Tampa across the causeway to St. Petes. Choosing another site in St. Petes isn’t going to solve the problem. If the site isn’t going to be in Tampa, then it makes more sense to move to Portland, Montreal, Nashville or just about anywhere else.
Can St.Petersburg incorporate/annex across the bridge? Sounds like it’s a lot of pain to get there. I love that they built the stadium to bring in a team and wouldn’t mind seeing them get to stay a part of it. If they can’t draw more than 25,000 a game they need to move. Nashville makes alot of sense. Decent average income was an up and coming, entertainment driven city with basketball and football big in the state already theirs a huge sports market already.
Joke playing there.Move to Vegas,Nashville,Charlotte,Portland,Indy,Okc,San Antonio,Louisville or how about Brooklyn
Joke playing there.Move to Vegas,Nashville,Charlotte,Portland,Indy,Okc,San Antonio,Louisville or how about Brooklyn
Joke playing there.Move to Vegas,Nashville,Charlotte,Portland,Indy,Okc,San Antonio,Louisville or how about Brooklyn
no ,Nashville if name stay ,Nashville Stars . Tennessee and mlb owners i read want to capitalize on Tennessee titans poplar . i read. and investment group in ,Nashville want ,Nashville Stars .
plus ,Nashville Stars is one star. not stars like logo they using.
other wise Nashville and ,Portland are leading. stadium location put Nashville, over the top . ,Portland leading in money right now. as i also read.
Brooklyn would never happen yanks and mets said they never improve of.
Vegas mlb never improve of
Vancouver is third on list.
Orlando Talking MLB: Could It Be The Tampa Bay Rays?
According to a video report by local TV station WFTV, that politician, Armando Gutierrez,
is trying to assemble investors to move a Major League Baseball team to Orlando .
Gutierrez has not named the investors yet, but has a meeting scheduled this week to finalize
the details of their work. But he did say that the team would move into a privately-financed baseball
stadium built at one of four possible sites: Disney, the Citrus Bowl area, the Airport area, or Orange County Convention Center.
I could care less as long as devil/ rays stay part of the name
Of course, that doesn’t leave very many possibilities. There are only three teams that are in stadiums 20 or more years old that have not received, or are not scheduled to receive, new stadiums or major renovations to their current stadiums: the Oakland Athletics, Toronto Blue Jays and Tampa Bay Rays. And you can forget the Blue Jays, because they have shown no interest of leaving Rogers Centre.