The Marlins’ Pablo Lopez has often come up in trade rumors, but according to Bob Nightengale of USA Today, Lopez is just one of four starters that the Marlins are telling other teams are available in trade talks. The other three are Edward Cabrera, Trevor Rogers and Jesus Luzardo. It’s been widely reported for quite some time that the Marlins were willing to tap into their pitching surplus in trades, but this sheds more light on who the Marlins are willing to trade and who’s seemingly off limits.
The Marlins have a solid stable of controllable pitching with ace Sandy Alcantara and youngster Braxton Garrett joining that quartet, as well as a group of young arms including Sixto Sanchez, Eury Perez and Max Meyer who should be able to help the big league club within the next few seasons. As such, there’s definitely a surplus of pitching in Miami and the team could well look to offload an arm to bolster their offense.
Last summer, it was reported that the Yankees came close to a deal that would’ve sent Lopez to the Bronx in a deal involving Gleyber Torres. It was also reported this winter that the Marlins and Rockies discussed a deal involving Cabrera and Brendan Rodgers, so it’s not secret that Miami is listening on some of their starters. Notably, both of the two players the Fish would have acquired in those trades are second basemen, but they’ve recently gone out and picked up Jean Segura to bolster their infield group.
Instead, the team could look to turn one of their starters into an outfielder. The Padres have been linked with adding another starter, and have reportedly shown a willingness to trade Trent Grisham, so there could be a match there. It’s also been reported that the Pirates are seeking young pitching to headline any deal for Bryan Reynolds, so if the Marlins are really keen to make a big splash perhaps floating Cabrera as part of a deal would get Pittsburgh’s attention.
With six years of control remaining, Cabrera, 24, would certainly be an attractive acquisition for pitching hungry teams. A former top-100 prospect, he tossed 71 2/3 innings of 3.01 ERA ball for the Fish last year, with a solid 25.8% strikeout rate and an 11.3% walk rate.
Luzardo, 25, is hitting arbitration for the first time this year as a Super Two player, and is projected (via Matt Swartz) to make $2MM in 2023. He put together a 3.32 ERA over 100 1/3 innings with a very strong 30% strikeout rate and an 8.8% walk rate. He missed about two-and-a-half months last season with a forearm strain, but a full season of his output would make for a quality starting pitcher. The left-hander is under control for four more years.
Rogers, 25, was excellent in 2021, but took a step back in 2022. The southpaw made the All Star game in ’21 during a season in which he threw 133 innings of 2.64 ERA ball. That was followed up by 107 innings of 5.47 ERA ball in ’22, as Rogers saw his strikeout rate drop by about 6% and his walk rate jump by a percentage point. He also saw his HR/FB rate jump from just 5% in 2021 to 13.2% last year. Rogers is under control for four more seasons, and is due to hit arbitration for the first time next winter.
Lopez, 27 in March, was a steady presence in the rotation for the Fish last season, hurling 180 innings of 3.75 ERA ball over 32 starts. He may not possess the upside of the three younger pitchers, but Lopez has been a consistent pitcher for a few years now, finishing up with ERAs of 3.61, 3.07 and 3.75 in the past three years. Projected to make $5.6MM through arbitration this year, he’s under control for another two seasons and would slot nicely into the middle of a lot of rotations around baseball.
butch779988
Keep an eye on Boston…
Pedro Martinez’s Mango Tree
Or don’t. They won’t trade what it would take to get any of these guys.
Domingo111
I’m not sure it makes sense for boston to do such a trade.they do lack pitching of course but they don’t have many great prospects besides Casas and after losing betts and bogaerts the last couple years their lineup doesn’t have the depth it used to have either.
So they could trade Casas but then they would make their lineup weaker and really rely on an old guy like turner giving them 130+ good games.
I think there isn’t really an easy way out of this for boston, they have some good hitters but not enough to trade away some of them so really the only thing they can do is improving their development of pitching which will take years and until then they need to try to somehow get by with a solid lineup and hoping for overperformance of some of their pitchers.
That’s really how boston functioned the last 20 years and there was some great success with several world series wins but their lack of development also always meant there were some losing seasons in there unlike the Yankees or dodgers.
But then again the Sox won 3 ws the lady 20 years vs the dodgers and Yankees 1 even though they always needed to rely on some pitching luck (everyone staying healthy and back end guys overperforming).
That could happen again albeit of course it would be preferred to be like the dodgers or Astros and develope some damn pitchers.
Rsox
Blaze Jordan, Alex Binelas, and Nick Yorke are all kind of blocked at the MLB level for possibly the next several years so it probably wouldn’t be unthinkable to see the Sox consider moving prospects. However it would have to be for one of Rogers/Cabrera/Luzardo as i don’t think 2 years of Lopez is worth the cost
JoeBrady
I think there isn’t really an easy way out of this for boston, they have some good hitters but not enough to trade away some of them
=============================
Excellent comment. The only way to trade for young controllable pitching is usually to have young controllable hitting. And we generally lack both. Since Theo left after 2011, the only draft picks that have succeeded have been Benni in 2015. And we have a couple of guys with promise in Houck, Casas.
It’ impossible to trade out of that.
Domingo111
Yorke and jordan have a 2025 eta though and the marlins need major leaguers or at least prospects who are ready by mid 2023 to fit in their timeline. So it would need to be guys who have had at least 300 at bats at AA or AAA level. Jordan and Yorke have never played above A ball and Yorke had a down year
Rsox
Under that timeline than it would be Rafaela that would be the likelier to go in a trade. I just do not believe in trading Casas for a Marlins starter unless its Alcantara
deweybelongsinthehall
RSox I agree up to a point. I’m not as familiar with the Fish as I am other teams as I don’t get involved in fantasy baseball. My question is how have their tradable pitchers done in other ball parks? How much of their success is due to the big stadium they pitch 50% of their games in?
Domingo111
Yeah I don’t think they should trade casas unless they are getting an ace.
BTW I’m still not sure how good casas will be. His plate discipline numbers look good, he is young for the level and has good pop and that can improve however he has been more OK than absolute masher in the minors.
His career minors OPS has been around 860 and this year in AAA he also was around 860. That is very solid but guys like vogelbach or Tyler white had higher OPSses in the minors (albeit at an older age) and never really went off.
If you look at the absolute top first basemen they tended to have an OPS of well over 1000, for example Paul goldschmidt had like a 1200 minors OPS.
Of course the IL is not the PCL and casas is young for his level and all his peripherals look good but he never has been this absolute terror masher in the minors but instead was more solid above average.
I think he will be good but I’m not sure whether he is more that 115-120 wrc+ and about 2 to 3 war guy or whether he is really that top 5 first baseman in the majors type.
Is he more good year Josh bell (kinda like hitting 270 with 25-30 Homers) or is he Paul goldschmidt or Pete Alonso.
If he is Paul goldschmidt of course you trade him under no circumstance but if he is more Josh bell maybe you trade him for a young number 3 starter
Domingo111
Correction goldschmidt “only” had a 1.026 minors ops
websoulsurfer
There are no prospects worth an Ace. Casas is a prospect. A maybe.
Rsox
@dewey
Interestingly all four had better road stats than home. That big ballpark apparently offers little in the way of “home field advantage”
GASoxFan
Moncada and kopech with spares for Chris sale beg to differ, but, keep on believing prospects can’t buy an ace.
Mi Casas es tu Casas
Armas and Pavano for pedro
Domingo111
That was a huge package though. Moncada at that time was a top3 overall prospect and almost mlb ready in all the outlets, kopech was top100 and even basabe was considered a solid 3rd piece (like top10 in sox system).
You can definitely get a cost controlled ace for prospects but that essentially takes 2 Triston casas’es and a third piece so not many teams even have the prospects do do that.
The cost in trade for pitching aces have really gone up since more teams are trying the Theo epstein approach of developing hitters and trade for pitchers. That approach is actually very smart since hitting prospects don’t fail as often but if more teams are doing it the price for pitching will skyrocket which why developing pitchers has become profitable again even though so many of them fail.
Sox Need to start developing some pitchers
BaseballisLife
Are you saying no single prospect is worth an Ace. I would agree with that.
Fever Pitch Guy
Pedro – If Bloom trades Casas for Rogers, Lopez and Cabrera then I’ll forgive him for one of the many blunders he’s made … except the Story blunder and the Xander blunder.
SoxFanSince1994
Story isn’t a blunder. Be less dumb.
Fever Pitch Guy
1994Fan – You’re alone on an island when it comes to Story. He was given elite shortstop money and so far has been pathetic on offense and hasn’t played an inning at SS. Time will tell if he ever plays SS again with the Sox.
rememberthecoop
Not a Sox fan, but I side with you so far Fever.
DMacNCheez
Feverdream – After all of the shortstops deals we’ve seen (Machado, Turner, Bogaerts, Tatis, Seager Correa -maybe) how on earth is 6y/140m “elite shortstop money”. Also you clearly didn’t watch or look up any stats if you think he was “pathetic”
Fever Pitch Guy
coop – Thank you.
I hope Story can improve both offensively and physically, as he is a great defensive player when fully healthy.
Bloom paid for 2018-2019 Story, that’s the player I want.
fba0017
Bloom is still on Xmas vacation. He had his Gm negotiate Devers contract.
Fever Pitch Guy
DMac – Exactly 194 of Machado’s 925 career starts were at SS prior to his signing the contract.
I won’t argue with you on what you consider to be elite. If you think $140M is not a lot of money, that’s your choice I guess.
Yes a 102 OPS+ for each of the past two seasons is most definitely pathetic for a guy with a $140M contract.
You want more numbers?
.238 BA
.303 OBP
.434 SLG
30.8% K Rate
-0.4 WPA
.702 OPS vs RHP
.642 Road OPS
.566 OPS in losses
I could provide much more, but that would be overkill.
Pedro Martinez’s Mango Tree
They’re not trading Casas. They haven’t had a good first baseman since Mitch Moreland, they’re not going to give up the best one they’ve had in 3+ seasons, especially when they have him under control for the next six seasons. I wouldn’t trade him either, him Mayer and Bello should be the only ones who are untradeable
Fever Pitch Guy
Pedro – You’re saying you’d trade Yorke?
Moonlight Graham
As a Giants fan who watched division-foe Story for six years rake a mile high and be mostly mediocre closer to sea level, the deal was destined to be a blunder. And it has certainly started that way.
baseballhistory
Story was the far better defensive ss than Boggarts, but Boggarts, to the detriment of the Red Sox, demanded that he play ss. Story will be back where he belongs this year.
Mjm117
@feverpitchguy
If the Marlins don’t include Sixto, Eurry and Sandy along with Cabrera, Lopez, And Rogers for Casas then no deal.
stymeedone
Any contract for over $20MM per should provide elite talent. If not, its an overpay.
Fever Pitch Guy
fba – Pretty sure Bloom doesn’t celebrate Christmas, but I get your point. LOL
Fever Pitch Guy
history – Three things you need to know:
1) Story hurt his arm the year before signing, he had one of the worst mid-infielder arms in MLB last year.
2) Xander was a Gold Glove runnerup last year.
3) There is no guarantee Story will play SS this year, a lot will depend on his arm injury.
Fever Pitch Guy
stymee – That’s how I look at it.
9-figure contracts too (Franco).
givehimtheheater
He only played 94 games and was 2.2 WAR. Over full season probably a 4 WAR. Good player.
MarlinsFanBase
@Fever Pitch Guy
Why would the Marlins trade three SPs that have shown they can pitch at the MLB level for a 1B that has not shown anything yet?
websoulsurfer
Fever, with Story’s arm, it’s doubtful he will ever play solid defense on the left side of the infield.
websoulsurfer
History, WAS being the key word in your comment. Since injuring his arm, Story has not been a good defensive SS. That is why the Red Sox signed him to play 2B.
Pedro Martinez’s Mango Tree
Fever- I’m saying I would make anyone not named Casas, Mayer or Bello available in trades. You have to give something if you want to get something.
websoulsurfer
Pedro, what do the Red Sox have to give beyond those 3 that has value in a trade?
Kennyb217
What world are living in that Story was given elite SS money?
Kennyb217
Look here’s a bunch if stats I cherry picked!
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
You can’t predict injuries. For all we know, Bogaerts could get hurt and be out.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
Probably involved but I doubt Bloom trades Casas, who the Marlins want. Maybe there’s some way we can package Sale or Dalbec with some of out top end prospects not named Casas.
Doubt Sale to Marlins, but who knows. We would obviously pay of that happened, but three way trades too.
Domingo111
Doubt ang wants dalbec, she stated they want to rebuild the marlins offense with more contact guys kinda like the guardians are. They got several lower k guys already , I doubt they want a mid 30% K guy
Ketch
I’ve seen blogs about the Marlins (should-be) interest in Dalbec. So it’s not ridiculous.
It is ridiculous to think any of these starting pitchers are available in any trade where Dalbec matters. Joey Wendle for Dalbec? Maybe. But Cabrera/Luzardo/whoever? No way. I’m hoping Verdugo keeps the conversation going, but not optimist about that.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
I know Dalbec won’t fetch any of those pitchers, hence why I mentioned packaging him.
rememberthecoop
But his presence in a deal won’t push the needle at all, so he’s not even worth considering. Verdugo and Casas will get you one of those pitchers, but Boston won’t do that, of course, so I don’t see a match there.
Domingo111
BTW I still prefer a orioles marlins trade.
Lopez and a marlins pitching prospects for 3-4 of the almost mlb ready orioles prospects.
Henderson and rutschman are untouchable as is eury Perez but I think something like Lopez and eder (and maybe even a third lower ranked pitching prospect) for couser, westburg and Ortiz would tremendously help both teams.
The Os don’t really have any real pitching prospects besides G rod which is remotely mlb ready (hall surely looks like a reliever with huge command issues) and the marlins really lack mlb ready hitters so that trade would help both teams.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
If you’re talking about Lopez on the O’s, he was already traded.
Steve(shs22)
The o s have 2 lefties in DL Hall and Cade Povich that I am high on.
rememberthecoop
I think Hall is better suited for the bullpen long term. He has a high upside but needs better control.
zantigm
Cabrera and elder for hays, norby and tate
fitted54
Not happening the Sox aren’t trading Casas for any Marlins pitchers that were made available
mlb1225
Doesn’t make sense to me for them to make Cabrera, Rogers, or Luzardo avaiable. That is unless they’re looking for major league players rather than more prospects. Even then, their rotation is their biggest strength and something they should build around.
Big Smoke
How do you suppose they can build a winning ball club if they don’t trade from their pitching surplus or refuse to sign any meaningful bats?
mlb1225
It depends on what they get back. But unless they’re getting back proven major league hiters, I don’t see a reason to trade guys with less than 3 years of experience in the majors if the return is more prospects.
baseballhistory
The Marlins have 7 or 8 legitimate major league starting pitchers. They also have an anemic offense. Trading one of those starters for a major league starting position player, is what they have to do.
hiflew
Doesn’t matter. They are sunk for a decade along with the Nats because the top 3 in the East will just keep on spending and the bottom 2 will not catch up. The best hope for the Marlins is for some severe regression from long term deals for the top 3.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
@hiflew completely disagree. Marlins have a ton of good pieces, both hitting and pitching, they just need to avoid getting injured and a bit more offense. One of these years I can see that team clicking on all cylinders if things go right.
Samuel
pwndroia;
They don’t have a “ton” of good pieces – maybe 4-6 which includes their pitchers.
They can trade a pitcher and get 2 good hitters. They’ll still be fighting to finish in 4th place. Any trades are just running in circles. The only hope they have is to build a high quality farm system – meaning they’ll need a strong analytic department as well as a strong scouting department to find young players to draft. Then they’ll need strong coaching throughout their minor league farm system – including advanced methodologies developed by the FO to teach hitting and pitching.
It doesn’t appear they have anything out of the ordinary in those areas…and it takes years to build those.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
Jazz Chisholm isn’t good?
You are right, there’s less than I originally thought but Chisholm is good.
Big whiffa
I’d argue that they’ll never compete again regardless. W braves philis nationals and Mets in division they are worse off than Baltimore. MLB needs to dissolve divisions
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
Never compete again? It’s easy to be wrong on that one
hiflew
How would dissolving divisions fix anything? They would still be competing with the same teams along with 10 others in a league setting.
The only way to fix things is to implement a HARD salary cap and a HARD salary floor. Give everyone the same amount of money to spend and see who can do it the best.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
I think he’s implying that if you dissolve divisions then all 5 teams from the same division could get into the postseason if they have the best records. Very slim chance though.
hiflew
So they would lose to a richer NL East rival in October instead of September?
tutopelotas1
When publicly exposing this “openness” to trade any of these four starters, the Marlins are running the risk of having to offer more than one of them if they want to get a valuable every day player in return – let’s say like Reynolds…. This could really weaken the depth of their starting rotation. …. High Risk taken by GM Ms. Kimberly Ng… Time Will Tell !!.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
@tutopelotas1 I don’t think so. Better to advertise they want to trade than be Hamlet in the corner contemplating to make a move (as they’ve done the past three years IMO). The Marlins just need to pull the trigger either way.
JoeBrady
When publicly exposing this “openness” to trade any of these four starters,
=====================
Everyone knows that Miami has a surplus of SPs and a lack of offense. There are no secrets on this one.
stymeedone
Letting teams know does not mean the value of the players has changed. If anything, it could create a bidding war and increase the return. If the offers are not there, the Marlins will simply keep what they have.
RunDMC
With how shallow the pitching market there is, and how far behind (presumably) this team is within their division, it wouldn’t make sense to not entertain anything that doesn’t have a NTC. Considering how volatile their prized pitching coup has been, listen and get creative for some offense.
websoulsurfer
MLB1225, if I understand correctly, the Marlins have said that they are willing to trade one of that group of young starting pitchers to get an OF. Not all of them.
Domingo111
Yeah a major leaguer would be ideal but high minors hitting prospects who have succeeded with good K/BB rates also would work especially if they get 2 or 3 for them instead of just 1.
Can’t be a guy with a 2025 ETA of course.
bmcferren
Sixto Sanchez, Eury Perez and Max Meyer for Reynolds gets it done
seamaholic 2
Heh. Marlins ain’t trading Perez for almost anyone.
bmcferren
that kind of thinking is why they´ve been in the basement for a while (says the Pirate fan 🙂
seamaholic 2
If you’re offering Shohei or something, sure let’s talk. Perez is the best pitching prospect in baseball, or 2nd best, and they have 8 other dudes they can trade for hitting.
rememberthecoop
Grayson Rosriguez says hello.
Big Smoke
They’re not moving Eury Perez
Bruin1012
Pittsburgh would do that deal in NY minute but that’s a huge overpay by Miami and they wouldn’t do that deal even if they were willing to trade Perez.
bmcferren
Rickety (Meyers) and Crickety (Sixto) are quite the gamble
JoeBrady
Ridiculous offer,
MarlinsFanBase
@bmcferren
I didn’t realize that Reynolds has Mike Trout value.
hiflew
Why not? You seem to think that a broken down Sixto along with two unproven prospects have Mike Trout value.
cuban363566
Here come all the trade suggestions that have the Marlins acquiring nothing but back of rotation/bullpen arms who are already near 30yo, and bats that wont help them until 2-3 yrs down the road.
MarlinsFanBase
@cuban363566
Yep. It should be entertaining like this Reynolds suggestion. Some guys insist on showing everyone how much their blind homerism or just plain stupidity runs.
Bohs and Os
Baltimore on line 1
dpsmith22
Let’s hope so. Elias has been very disappointing this off season, to say the least.
Bohs and Os
That my friend is an understatement to say the least. I’ve been screaming it from the roof tops. We have a ton of talent but I’m petrified they’re going to not prioritize starting pitching and waste this like the Machado years…
poxo0791
I seriously doubt it but I wish. They have so much depth to trade from.
getrealgone2
They need to. I doubt it though
StlSwifty
Dylan Carlson for Jesus Luzardo. Who says no?
Lyman Bostock
Probably St Louis. But that is an intriguing question.
I can see both parties agreeing to that.
dpsmith22
The Marlins. Carlson is a bust.
Ma4170
Yeah marlins w a hard no on that I’m guessing
kripes-brewers
Carlson sure doesn’t look like a bust to this Crew fan. Kid has skillz
Chad623
He just turned 24 years old and has put up 5.3 WAR combined the past 2 seasons. You have an interesting definition of what a “bust” is my friend.
Salvi
Im trying to figure out how you get 2.0 BWar and 2.4 FWar in 2022, for Carlson based on stats:
.1 DWAR
100 OPS+
.316 OBP
8 HRs.
Cards fans probably know, I just dont see it.
slider32
Agreed, Lopez to the Cards is a match for a starting controllable position player!
Ma4170
Just another example of WAR not being the be-all end-all on player value. It wasn’t a good year – a clear step back. Luzardo is a young lefty who showed ace ability last year. I think the Marlins say no all day to this offer.
Cardsfan21
Not me. Wondering if Mo has had a change of heart after missing out on Soto to keep him
DefensiveIndifference
Stl is not trading their everyday CF. CF is a black hole around the league right now. That being said, I really want Luzardo.
Ha-Seong Kim
Who says no?
MIA receives: Kim, Zavala, Rosario
SD receives: Cabrera, Rogers, Soler
Big Smoke
Miami hangs up but not before laughing their asses off
seamaholic 2
No they don’t. Soler is a big negative, Rogers was one of the worst pitchers in baseball last year. Cabrera is a good get but has some worrisome peripherals. I think SD likely says no (Kim is a really valuable asset and the other two are Padres top 5 prospects), but it’s a close call.
Ketch
1. There’s no indication Miami is dumping salary.
2. There’s no indication they would move more than one starter.
3. They aren’t moving two starters for Kim plus some mediocrity.
OldSaltUSNR
Read my comment below. You’re undervaluing Kim. Not saying that you’re way wrong, just a bit ignorant of his history, and proven potential.
Ha-Seong Kim
@Big Smoke
Lemme get some of what you’re smokin
MarlinsFanBase
Marlins are trying to improve their offense. Kim doesn’t quite make the grade, especially when the Marlins already have Jazz, Segura and Rojas in the infield.
Javia135
2022 WAR:
Rogers=-0.6
Luzardo=2.0
Cabrera=2.1
Lopez=3.0
Kim=5.1
I know Marlins fans have a serious woody over having pitchers to trade for offense, but you really need to consider what you are trading. Saying you won’t trade a 2-WAR pitcher for a 5-WAR SS? You won’t be getting a Tatis, Ohtani, Alvarez, Soto, Machado or Harper type of bat in return. Not a Julio Rodriguez either. You are looking at a Ty France, Josh Bell or Isaiah-Kiner Falefa type of return. At best. But keep asking for the moon AND the stars.
Also, Sox fans: Casas is worth nowhere near what you think he is. He might, MIGHT be able to get you a Marlin’s starter, but it won’t be one of their best and it sure as hell won’t be multiple starters for Casas.
MarlinsFanBase
You ain’t getting our pitchers for Kim.
WAR is a garbage stat, especially when it’s all that a person is looking at while ignoring every other stat. The Marlins need a hitter that improves their lineup, not another mediocre bat.
And FYI – Rojas is a GG caliber SS in case you didn’t know. Look at the total body of work – not just the worthless WAR.
Javia135
That’s fine, but you are going to have to alter your expectations for a trade to be made. You aren’t trading Greg Maddux or Clayton Kershaw in their prime with 6 years of control. You are trading average pitchers. In return you can expect an average hitter, not a star.
MarlinsFanBase
OK. I’m amazed how so many MLB teams are interested in these “average pitchers”.
Javia135
Fine. What bat do YOU think you can get for one of these guys? Why don’t YOU make a trade suggestion and see what fans of other teams think of YOUR ideas?
MarlinsFanBase
I don’t really do that trade suggestion thing. I just wait for the confirmed rumors and I comment on what is being discussed.
But if you need to hear something.
Of the mentioned rumors:
I’d only give on of these pitchers in trade packages involving Reynolds or Mullins. Same with a trade with Boston involving Casas.
I won’t give up any of these pitchers for Grisham or Kim.
Did I miss any?
Javia135
So you expect to get one of the top 5 centerfielders in baseball for Lopez or Luzardo? I disagree. The Pirates have said they are looking for a “Soto like return” for Reynolds. Do you think 1 of your 4 pitchers is a Soto like return? I disagree.
We are obviously not going to agree on this, so it looks like we will both just have to wait until a trade actually happens I guess.
websoulsurfer
MFB, Every MLB team needs depth. Middle to back of the rotation starters. That is what all of those guys not named Alcantara are. None are an Ace. With the exception of Rogers who was among the worst starters in MLB last season, the rest are league average starters at best.
If you don’t like WAR, then say what stat you do like. Regardless of your feelings for the stat, I can guarantee you that the teams that are trading for these starting pitchers are looking at WAR. They look at many other stats in addition to WAR, but one that is always in the mix is WAR.
The Marlins will get a guy that has some warts. They are not getting a Reynolds type player back without including 2-3 other prospects from their top 5 to get him.
If it’s just one of these starters named in the article involved in the trade, then they are getting a Grisham type player plus some mid-tier prospects. Not saying Grisham, just a guy like him that has some deficiencies in his game.
websoulsurfer
Unfortunately for the Marlins, Rojas cannot hit anymore, and he is going into his age 34 season so it’s reasonable to expect all parts of his game to decline.
Kim was a very good defensive SS and he had a 107 OPS+ last season compared to 73 for Rojas. Kim would be a 34% improvement with the bat for the Marlins while still providing great defense at SS.
The reasons for Kim’s 5.1 WAR vs Rojas’ 2.5 WAR is evident in the other stats.
Not saying the Padres will trade Kim to the Marlins, because I don’t think they will. I am saying Kim is worth more than any of the Marlins starting pitchers not named Alcantara.
Chemo850
Soto is a generational player and Reynolds is not, so the Pirates can want that all they want, but it ain’t gonna happen. Not to mentioned he had a down year. He struggles again this year and the pirates will be lucky to get Sixto straight up
junior25
Cubs and Marlins line up great in a trade
Luzardo and Groshans
For
Madrigal, Amaya and a couple mid Tier Prospects
rememberthecoop
Miami says no to that trade. Madrigal has very little trade value, Amaya is coming off TJ, and Miami wants a major league ready outfielder.
CardsFan57
St Louis has a log jam of MLB ready outfielders. Most of them have been excellent hitters in the minors. Burleson, Yepez, and Gomez. All three have power. I can see St Louis and Miami matching up on a trade. I’m sure it would be a two for one trade. Carlson won’t be included because he’s their only good option in center. Walker definately won’t be included. Luzardo would look good in a Cardinal uniform.
MarlinsFanBase
The Marlins already have corner OFs and need a CF. Why would they just trade for more guys that can’t play CF?
CardsFan57
I think their centerfielder is their best outfielder. They said they want an outfielder. Miami mostly needs power bats.
brazzy07
No their best outfielder is left fielder playing out of position in center. They’ve stated multiple times they’re looking contact oriented centerfielder no corner power hitters
brazzy07
Maybe was never better then a 4th outfielder and Rogers value is 10x that of Adell
CardsFan57
Jesus Sanches gives them decent centerfield defense and near league average offense. That’s pretty good compared to centerfielders around the league. I didn’t know what Miami was looking for coming into this. Unfortunately there’s nothing in the article. I was going off the first comment. I look at their roster and it’s badly starved for offense.
I just took a look around the league. One of the few things more rare than starting pitching is a centerfielder who can both hit and field. I now see the Bader/Montgomery trade differently. It was a fair trade for both sides. I only found two centerfielders who were both fielding at least average and hitting well, Trout and Julio Rodriguez. The rest either barely hit or they are a corner outfielder playing center. I’ll be surprised if Miami can find a true centerfielder who can hit available.
CardsFan57
Sorry, make that 3 centerfielders. I forgot Michael Harris in Atlanta.
BaseballisLife
That’s a very interesting trade proposal. I think the Padres say no.
Both Kim and Rosario will be on the Padres opening day roster. On a team with depth issues in the infield, trading both would be a problem.
Zavala is going to be on most top 100 lists to start 2023. He is just 18 and has the skills to stick in CF.
I think if you had just said Kim and Zavala that would have been a possible trade, but still not probable. Soler is expensive, $24 million guaranteed left on his contact, and was bad in 2022. Rogers was one of the worst starters with 100 IP in 2022. Cabrera has some red flags with his control. The 6 years of team control and his velocity would be what might make the deal possible if the Padres are only including Kim and Zavala.
OldSaltUSNR
I think Kim is a lot more valuable than most other-team’s-fans realize.
GM’s aren’t only looking at past MLB numbers when they work on match-ups. They look at the history of the players. Taking Kim’s age (27) and somewhat mediocre MLB offensive numbers at face value, and he looks like a glove-first, defensive IF replacement. However, take a prospect from AA/AAA who hit > .300 consistently, hit with power, had high OBP, and was a multiple-year batting champion, put him two years into the majors, with Kim’s defense and current offense numbers, and that prospect looks like a superstar in the making. Now, either one, that imaginary prospect or Kim, could end up becoming less than his history projects, but that risk is there for every young MLB star.
Adding in Kim’s KBO numbers, and he has that profile, NINE years of professional baseball, just 27 years old, and with proven potential. If another team wants Kim, they’re going to have to pay him according to that profile. He IS, just that good – 12 WAR since he arrived just two years ago. I don’t believe last year was his “career year”. I think last year was just the beginning for him.
OldSaltUSNR
re: “they’re going to have to pay him according to that profile”
I meant, they’re going to have to PAY FOR HIM … in trade, etc.. Yeah, 2 more years of control, and he’ll get paid. That’s probably the biggest negative of a team trading for Kim, only two years of control. They’ll want to extend him as part of the deal, or immediately afterwards.
JoeBrady
OldSaltUSNR3 hours ago
He IS, just that good
============================
I like Kim quite a bit., but Preller just paid almost $300M to replace him. It gives the impression that SD does value him quite as high.
It also devalues his defense. Once he is at 2nd, what’s the difference between him and Wong, for example?
websoulsurfer
They also moved Tatis to the OF to make room for Bogaerts, Does that mean they don’t value Tatis?
Chemo850
I think the Marlins would strongly consider this deal. Risk on both sides but high reward as well.
implant
Angels should give the Adell. Perfect player for the Fish
Ma4170
Rogers for Adell?
iron
Adell is Cameron Maybin 2.0
R.D.
Maybin had a decent career tho
seamaholic 2
No there’s no indication so far he’ll be as good as Maybin, who was quite good in his prime.
Big Smoke
The Marlins can wait for Adell to get DFA’d before getting him
Ketch
Sure. But they won’t get any of the Mismi starters for him. Maybe if they still had Brandon Marsh?
Happyfoolsteve
The Orioles should be in on these guys. Start by offering Hays and Ortiz or Westburg and go from there. I’d hate lose Santander’s power, but if the Marlins insist on him I’d deal him for a controllable SP.
Ketch
Westburg and Hays for Lopez works on BTV
iron
Would love this for the Marlins
Ketch
Jose Miranda for Jesus Luzardo. Who says no?
3768902
Luzardo for Kiriloff
seamaholic 2
Yeah that’s not a bad idea.
Ketch
Kiriloff is young, but also has yet to get to a .300 OBP. He’s the bigger risk.
I think Miranda gets you Luzardo.
BuyBuyMets
There’s almost zero chance of a Miranda deal.
If they intended to make Miranda available, tne Twins wouldn’t have both moved Urshela AND non-tendered Sano.
If anything they’ll trade from their depth in corner OF depth along with prospects
Steve(shs22)
That makes some sense
sliderwithcheeze
Keep the others and just deal Alcantara. He will bring the most in a return. The haul they would get would help them win more than hanging on to Sandy would.
seamaholic 2
Gotta have at least someone the (few) Marlins fans might want to buy a ticket to see.
Dexxter
Maybe Orelvis Martínez and Biggio gets something started for the Jays here?
Ketch
Nobody wants Biggio.
HalosHeavenJJ
Luzardo for Adell
Two guys who have yet to fulfill their promise get a change of scenery.
Won’t happen, but makes sense.
seamaholic 2
Luzardo is worth WAY more than Adell, who is pretty much a neutral asset at best right now.
HalosHeavenJJ
True.
Last year they were about equal on the sim but went opposite directions.
steven st croix
Adell does not get Luzardo
Jrnomo100
Gorman for Cabrera
rememberthecoop
Halos fans have been trying to trade Adell since before he even got on the field and he has been bad so far. I’d say no if I was Ng.
implant
Adell was a top prospect, is young and still has tremendous upside. Not to mention he is Uber controllable. Whether or not a one for one works the Angels should be looking to use him and another piece if needed
tutopelotas1
When publicly exposing this “openness” to trade any of these four starters, the Marlins are running the risk of having to offer more than one of them if they want to get a valuable every day player in return – let’s say like Reynolds…. This could really weaken the depth of their starting rotation. …. High Risk taken by GM Ms. Kimberly Ng… Time Will Tell !!.
Lefty_Orioles_Fan
Is Sixto Snachez available
If he is, what would the Marlins want
Plus, where is he in his rehab??
baseballhistory
Sanchez has a world of talent. His history, unfortunately is of arm problems throughout his minor keague career ( and short mlb stint). It’s hard to gauge his value for this reason. I believe the Marlins want to keep Sanchez.
stymeedone
Me thinks you asked those questions in the wrong order. Better to know if he’s healthy before making an offer. Declining acquisitions because of failed physicals is so last year.
gbs42
The line “the team could look to turn one of their starters into an outfielder” made me think of Rick Ankiel and his conversion from the mound to the grass.
rememberthecoop
And don’t forget the PEDs.
placido my polanco
Rangers could use an 8th starting pitcher…
TheRealMilo
They probably could….given that most of the 7 other guys will spend more time on the DL than on the active roster.
whyhayzee
“Instead, the team could look to turn one of their starters into an outfielder.”
Interesting. Which one of them can hit? And cover ground? And field? I’m guessing they all can throw. It will be fun to watch this happen.
88dodgers
All of a sudden they want to make moves after sitting out all free agency
seamaholic 2
The small market teams are priced out of free agency completely. What about that simple fact confuses people?
BaseballisLife
San Diego a small market team. They still recieve the competitive balance draft pick and revenue sharing. Every team can spend today.
seamaholic 2
They’re the exception that proves the rule. They’re planning on hitting a wall after this year (they will let Machado go and not re-sign Soto the year after) but want to see how far they can go in a brief window. They’re almost certainly operating in the red right now, which no other team is willing to do.
websoulsurfer
Padres will extend Machado. Seidler has made clear in public statements and behind closed doors that he wants Machado long term. Seidler and Preller approached Machado regarding Soto before the trade last season. They took him to Colorado to see the Rockies new home clubhouse this offseason in preparation for the Padres renovation of their home clubhouse next offseason.
Machado has made clear he wants to be a Padre for life. He said this offseason that his goal is to have a statue next to Tony Gwynn.
None of us know what the Padres exact level of revenue is or their ability to maintain a large payroll. Seidler, who is worth $3 billion and has already survived cancer twice, has said that “you can’t take it with you” and that he is committed to bringing a WS title to SD. In the same interview in 2023 where he talked about Machado, Seidler also said that he wants to extend Soto and understands the cost.
Do any of those things sound like a team or player that are not making preparations to have Machado around long term?
BuyBuyMets
There’s not a team “priced out of free agency” unless it’s by choice.
Every team can easily afford a minimum $120M payroll, but some find it more expedient to continue to go through the motions and simply collect the National TV money and CBT windfall, which guarantees an easy profit.
cuban363566
Its that simple? Because every small market team can easily afford $120 million payroll, can every small market team just afford to sign a guy to a 10-11 year contract knowing they’ll be eating that money in the back end of that deal as well? Kind of have to take that into account.
websoulsurfer
San Diego have historically been one of the 7 small market teams that receive money from the large market teams and get an extra draft pick. The only reason they are not in 2023 is that they exceeded the CBT threshold in 2022. If they can get up to and beyond the CBT threshold for multiple seasons, any team can at least get close.
Another thing to factor in is the knowns. Atlanta and Toronto are owned by public corporations, so we know their revenue and expenses. They were both over $500 million in revenue and around $130 million in total non-baseball operations expenses for the 2022 season according to their 3rd quarter earnings statements. I would add a few million more for salaries and rents that are paid for November to December, so $132-134 million is realistic non-baseball related expenses for both of those teams and for every other team in baseball. That includes executive salaries, so the owners are already getting paid.
Even teams like the A’s, Reds, Pirates, and Orioles that have CBT payrolls of less than $90 million in 2023.as of today are spending that much or less on everything else, so they are under $220 million for total expenses.
We also know from public statements by MLB and the MLBPA during the CBA negotiations that in 2022 that all teams were projected by MLB to be over $250 million in revenue.
According to Manfred, MLB was projected to have $12 billion in revenue in 2022. 30 teams. A $400 million average. If the lowest is above $250 million, the Braves and Blue Jays were $545 million and $510 million respectively with neither being in the top 5 in total revenue according to Manfred, and the top 2 being in the $700 million range, that means that nearly all teams are over $300 million to make the numbers work.
$300 million in revenue. $134 million in non-baseball expenses
Leaves nearly every team with at least $150 million to spend on CBT payroll items while giving the owner a gross profit of $16 million over and above whatever salary he is paid. The teams I mentioned are more than $60 million short of that $150 million figure.
In fact, 13 teams will not surpass $150 million in CBT payroll for 2023 unless they somehow find a way to spend a substantial amount between now and the end of the season.
To answer your original question, yes, it’s that simple.
MarlinsFanBase
@88dodgers
Kim Ng seems like she’s under pressure that was self-inflicted. She’s been getting ripped by the fan base and some of the local media for her sitting out GM duties from the trade deadline to now.
This self-inflicted pressure situation puts her in a situation where she has to do something this year or she’s gone. She knows it. The fan base knows it. The local media knows it.
88dodgers
I agree. She waited too long.
baseballteam
Do the Marlins always have good starters or is it the pitchers park?
seamaholic 2
Park factors exist. Yeah, they’re good.
iron
Last 3 years it’s become a neutral park, but suppresses HR. Previously, it was a pitchers park. So I would say both.
friarfootin
Grisham for Cabrera and Luzardo. Pads might have to throw a prospect in to get it done but that’s a fair price
seamaholic 2
Oh come on.
Big Smoke
Thank God fans you’re not working in a front office
rememberthecoop
That is just plain silly. I hope this is sarcasm.
Moonlight Graham
Why anybody thinks Grisham has value, I have no idea.
Mjm117
I like where you head is at @friarfootin
But if Sandy is not included to the Pads for Grisham then no deal.
Grisham going win the next 7 triple crowns.
MarlinsFanBase
@friarfootin
Back in my day there was a saying that went, “better to stay quiet and let people think you’re a fool instead of opening your mouth and leaving no doubt.” I think you should learn that.
websoulsurfer
Padres would have to throw in a lot more than a prospect to get that done. Grisham alone may not net any of the Marlins starting pitchers.
C Yards Jeff
Looks like Ng is looking for a CF that plays D like Grisham and hits like Reynolds. Hmmm. Cedric Mullins? Don’t do it Mike Elias, don’t do it!!!!!
seamaholic 2
Marlins won’t be interested in Mullins. They want guys with more than 3 years control left.
websoulsurfer
Where did you hear that? Mullins would be a huge upgrade in their OF, so he would be a good target for the Marlins. Are the O’s willing to give him up?
AZ1998
Dbacks should get some more bullpen help first, and I know they just resigned Davies, have MadBum, and have a plethora of young pitchers they are confident in. But they still have a lot of guys who will struggle to get playing time. Fletcher, Smith, Beer, Berrosa, Alexander, all guys on their 40 man that are decent gets. Also guys like Canzone in AAA.
JV
Red Sox don’t trade Casas for anything short of Garrett (I guess he’s not even available)…..
I could see a deal featuring Caedanne Rafaela and Verdugo for Ed Cabrera, J Wendle, and. V Mesa Jr…….
MarlinsFanBase
I know that Kim Ng is stupid, but I don’t believe she’s stupid enough to go for this.
websoulsurfer
MFB, there is a saying that goes, “better to stay quiet and let people think you’re a fool instead of opening your mouth and leaving no doubt.” I think you should learn that.
MarlinsFanBase
@websoulsurfer
It’s funny how you repeat something that I stated to someone else. Did you forget which account you were posting from?
websoulsurfer
Nope. Was pointing out you were leaving no doubt.
cuban363566
Could you explain why that deal would be something that the Marlins would entertain?
Mystery Team
Why would the Marlins trade any of those guys for Trent Grisham?
rememberthecoop
It seems the Fish want a major league-ready outfielder in return for one of those starters. One that maybe hasn’t hit arbitration yet but has played a season or two in the majors. That, along with a lower-level prospect would get it done. Which team has that to trade? The Yankees perhaps, although they’re trying to solve their own left field issue so that’s unlikely. The DBacks, but since the Varsho trade, I’m not sure they want to move Thomas for example. Maybe the Fish think they can turn around Kelenic? But the M’s don’t really need another starting pitcher. I would love to see the Cubs add another proven starter, but they don’t have an outfielder that fits this description. The Dodgers? Who else am I missing?
MLB Top 100 Commenter
If I am the Marlins, I would trade two of Lopez, Luzardo and Rogers to the Dodgers for Cartaya and Vargas. I would have to crunch the numbers for the best match.
slider32
Cabrera is a interesting option for most teams, he could be a #1 starter down the road. I would think the Marlins would want a good controllable position player that is major league ready for him.
stretch123
Pirates – Cabrera, Fulton/Eder, Jacob Miller/Milibrant, Bleday for Reynolds.
Red Sox – Lopez, Wendle/Rojas for Verdugo, Rafaela, Mata.
Orioles – Lopez for Hays, Westburg
Couple of deals off the top of my heads I love for both teams.
JV
You’re not getting Bryan Mata in this deal unless you’re sending back a whole bunch more than Lopez and two walk year middle infielders
seamaholic 2
Those are all not bad, except the Red Sox one, which is very Marlins-leaning. Lopez isn’t worth that much.
CarverAndrews
They should probably have a built-in trade value calculator on here that automatically disappears about 90% based upon how ridiculous they are.
The deals that happen are usually going to have fans up in arms. I remember absolutely loving the Phils acquiring Doc and Cliff Lee in separate deals, but being really worried about who we sent out. Wrong. I also remember loving the fact that the Phils acquired JT Realmuto, but bemoaning the loss of Sixto Sanchez, given the amount of control that was left for JTR. I was wrong again.
The fact is that the Fishies need to get this right – they cannot afford to give up that controlled pitching depth without getting prospects that will make an impact in return. They are too close to the edge when it comes to payroll and talent. But they also have to unload a couple of them before the world finds out that they are going to stall in their development. The trick, of course, is deciding who to unload and who to keep.
joew
seems like there could be a nice near straight up trade for Bryan Reynolds here.
Aaron Sapoznik
25-year old southpaw Jesus Lazardo would be a great addition for the White Sox. They could use a lefty in their rotation in 2023. Lazardo also provides insurance for the likely departure of pending free agent Lucas Giolito from their rotation in 2024.
Lazardo’s 4 years of team control also cushions against the loss of Lance Lynn next year or following the 2024 season pending the team’s willingness to exercise the veteran’s $18MM option or their $1MM buyout.
New FA acquisition Mike Clevinger only has one year of guaranteed control with a $12MM 2024 mutual option and a $4MM buyout.
The White Sox have additional control over their 3 remaining starters. Dylan Cease and Michael Kopech each have 3 more years of control. Projected 2024 southpaw starter Garrett Crochet matches Lazardo’s 4 years of control. Crochet is returning from spring TJ surgery and will likely assume a limited bullpen role in 2023 once he is deemed ready to pitch.
Seamaholic
Sox have nothing to trade
Motor City Beach Bum
Tigers flip the Meadows bros and Alex Lange to Florida for Rogers, JJ Bleday and Khalil Watson? A framework for something. Change the parts around?
stymeedone
I think Jomenez and Soto being traded, along with Fulmer earlier, and Chafin opting out has made the Tigers remaining relievers safe from trades. Cisnero might be gotten but Lange will be much more difficult with his control for 5-6 years. The Tigers don’t need starting pitching so Rogers would be of little interest.
tbone0816
STL gets Joey Wendle and Pablo Lopez
MIA gets Tyler O’neal, Juan Yepez, Paul DeJong, Dakota Hudson, Matthew Libbatore
Kershaw's Lesser Known Right Arm
I think Miami would jump at the chance to get this package. But by BTV it’s actually fairly even
Bobby Mongan
Ok Mr. Elias, it’s time to make a deal. Maybe Santander or Hays with a infield prospect to Miami for Lopez or maybe Hays and a lower ranked prospect for Rogers.
cookmeister 2
Rengifo and Adell for Cabrera and a BP arm?
Seamaholic
Marlins can do way better than that.
MarlinsFanBase
@cookmeister 2
To make this trade suggestion fair, remove Cabrera.
Rengifo and Adell for one of our BP arms. We’ll even throw in a second BP arm if needed…all of them if you want.
frankpr21
Nothing productive come out of a statement like this. In term of pitchers their talent is probably the best of any organization. So learn to use it wisely. For this year make a small adjustment wait for mid season and then lets the games begin. Marlins can sit pretty and really have the upper hand and get whatever they want. As for now, reality is they are not in the same league with Braves, Philly or Mets. So keep the capital and and wait for the right moment when others teams will be desperate for a wildcard entry and then Marlins will dance and shout.
Oh, this also will include Alcantara. As it is Marlins are way out if the possibility of a wildcard position. So stop the insanity, nonsense and just be competitive and with patience and perseverance and being smart by 24 will be in a better position to compete and be a contender. So for now no trades of this capital and just small adjustments. Unless you can get a Reynolds for Rogers and Sanchez or Sanchez and Luzardo for Roger’s. Otherwise won’t even bother. Oh! acknowledging that even with Reynolds they just would a bit better more like 5 to 7 games better and that my friends won’t get the a wildcard position.
drew ford
Horrible timing. Many teams have already addressed their needs or traded prospects that they could have used to acquire these players.
Seamaholic
The trade market has barely opened.
MarlinsFanBase
@drew ford
We’re talking about Kim Ng here. She hasn’t gotten anything done right with her timing of things.
In Seager/Hader We Trust > the 70 MM DH Ohtani
The fact that a 24 year old with 6 years of cheap control left coming off a 3.01 ERA is on the market shows how wildly incompetent the new Marlins’ GM is. They need a real GM in charge soon before their franchise gets worse. I can sympathize with Marlins’ fans here.
Seamaholic
It’s a very pitcher friendly place. That 3 ERA is closer to 4 in a mildly hitter friendly park.
Armaments216
Anyway it’s not as is they’re actually trading all these guys. The Marlins are just floating names to see if they get any offers good enough to actually follow through with.
In Seager/Hader We Trust > the 70 MM DH Ohtani
Here is something a Pirates fan told me that I didn’t consider. If you keep trading your developed prospects for less developed ones, you will always be rebuilding. I get the other 3 guys, but this one should be untouchable (unless they know something and they are trying to sell high).
JoeBrady
The Marlins are just floating names
===========================
Spot on correct. The way to make your best trade is to figure out who the most overrated player you have is.
I’m cherry-picking a small sample here, but Cabrera had a 4.86/6.02 ERA/FIP in his last 7 starts. He’s a good target, but he is certainly not bullet-proof.
Mjm117
If Craig Mish hasn’t confirmed it then It’s not true.
BuyBuyMets
Doesn’t this beg the question;
“Why didn’t the Marlins address just a couple of their greatest needs tnrough free agency without breaking the bank, and keep all of their top controllable starring pitchers, therefore guaranteeing they’ll be competitive at least l the next couple of years rather than staying in perpetual rebuild mode?
Seamaholic
They don’t have any money because they tried to do what you suggest last year and it failed. And small market teams don’t get to make mistakes.
BuyBuyMets
B.S.
For one thing, they didn’t have this kind of pitching depth a year ago- or at least they weren’t sure they did.
In fact, they get $110M from TV alone, plus what they rake in from CBT. That’s before ticket sales merchandising radio etc etc
They could easily afford a couple of significant free agents but its safer abd easier to take the guaranteed profit rather than risking a smaller one and giving your fans a decent product.
MarlinsFanBase
@$21002046
Kim Ng was too busy doing interviews, giving speeches, casting no-brainer vote for Fred McGriff, and making other self-promoting appearances. She was too busy to do her job as GM of the Marlins.
TJT88
Way to throw in the towel before pitchers and catchers even starts. Jesus
Devlsh
Tyler O’Neill and OF prospect Moises Gomez (294/371/624 in AA/AAA) for Trevor Rogers and a prospect both clubs can agree evens out the deal. .
Marlins solve their CF problem (which is where O’Neill played extensively last year) with an offensive prospect to dream on while Cardinals solve their 2024 shortage of SP (and if Rogers bounces back sooner, all the better).
O’Neill and Rogers are bounce back candidates; both were excellent in 2021.. There’s a lot of uncertainty here: can Rogers at least partially bounce back, can some of Gomez’ bat can translate to the bigs, will O’Neill stay healthy;.but it provides a framework, which both clubs could tweak as necessary.
Seamaholic
Rogers ain’t worth that much.
Chemo850
What are you smoking? Kid was an all-star already and is unhittable when he’s on and both the guys mentioned are absolute trash
marooned in NE
Padres fan here…this is where AJ finds the pitching he wants.
websoulsurfer
I am thinking Preller finds it 90 miles up the 5. Angels badly need a SS and the Padres happen to have a great one that would otherwise play 2B in SD.
Troutahni
Why was Brian Reynolds even mentioned in this article. He becomes a free agent in 1925,so they would have to sign him. Unless they were to pick him up for this season and then trade him at the deadline next season. Sounds pointless to me, just like the scenarios conjured uo by the writer. None of it is rumor and it isn’t even speculation. I would consider this to be word filler.
The Marlins should try to make a deal similar to Detroit’s Soto deal, but with an extra proven MLB hitter in return. Try to pick up two to three positional players that are mlb ready or close to it. At least one proven MLB hitters and two young players either blocked from advancing to the big leagues or being close to be promoted. Have the new guys compete for a full time job in Spring Training.
JoeBrady
He becomes a free agent in 1925,so they would have to sign him.
===========================
He becomes a FA after 2025, so they have him for three years. If TB wants to make any type of run, this is the way to go.
In Seager/Hader We Trust > the 70 MM DH Ohtani
1925 happened quite a long time ago.
Yadi Dadi
The Cardinals currently only have Steven Matz and youngsters like Hudson and Liberatore under contract entering 2024. I think they will absolutely be in on one of these guys which is funny because a few years ago they dealt from their own pitching “surplus” to get Ozuna and ended up dealing away a couple of certified cost controlled aces
Rubble44
Cabrera, Rogers and a prospect like Mesa for Reynolds.
MarlinsFanBase
Nope.
21Clemente21
Pirates will not trade Reynolds for scraps, not saying any offers listed are bad, just not what Pirates are looking for, hence he hasn’t been traded
If Reynolds was say a Yankee past 4 years he would have ample production to far exceed what he has done for Pirates to date, he would have good hitters surrounding him in Yankeeville.
all teams know Reynolds will produce outside a pitchers park such as Pirates stadium
The price for him should and is steep.
sdpadsfan11
Grisham and Zavala for Cabrera and Eder
Mjm117
Plus Sandy and Eury. Marlins might need to send money in the deal too.
Grisham is low-key future perennial MVP and Zavala already being talked about as possible HOF’er
countryjedi3
Boston should offer Casas and Sale for one of the pitchers and Jazz…others probably included
cuban363566
Is the point of this offer to get laughed at until they hang up the phone?
sdpadsfan11
@cuban
Stick to basketball Mark. Your out of your league.
cuban363566
“You’re”
Im guessing being grammatically correct isn’t part of your league, is it?
That being said, what exactly isn’t comical about a 34yo who has made 11 starts in 3 years and a completely unproven 1b being offered for a talented young arm who has pitched at the highest level, and a middle infielder who can hit in the middle of the order and has actually proven himself?
cuban363566
May i also add that both Jazz and whatever pitcher the Marlins dealt would both be considerably more affordable than Sale alone, which tends to be the sort of thing a cost-conscious team like the Marlins tends to value highly.
Javia135
I think that the Marlins should go back to the Yankees and see if Torres is still available.
nottinghamforest13
So Kim Ng has been too much incompetent to add talent to the roster, has noticed the team has a strong rotation (the most difficult area of the roster to assemble) and her brilliant idea is to tear down said rotation to paper over her other shortcomings.
Habeto
This article can be misleading. Despite 4 starters are available, only one will be traded.
Also, I think Garrett is included in those four, as the quartet should be López, Rogers, Garrett and, in a lesser extent, Luzardo.
I think the Fish is reluctant to trade Cabrera after how he did last year.
jimd-2
Marlins are years away from contending in a brutal division. I think they should make Alcantara available now to maximize his value. I am sure they could a huge package for him. I think the Cardinals will be in front of the line to reacquire him. Cards have the young OFs that the Marlins are looking for. This type of trade would be a WIN/WIan for both organizations!!
Mjm117
Aside from Goldy or Arenado, and both too expensive, the Cards having nothing to even remotely consider it a win/win.
Trading away Sandy will require the Marlins winning the trade by a landslide.
But you know what, since you asked politely, Fish should trade Sandy and Eury to the cards for Carlson. Win/win
Terry B
After kicking Bauer to the curbside( Thank you Dodger brain trust, it was the right move), I could easily see Dodgers in on Lopez!