The Mariners will take full ownership of the ROOT Sports Northwest regional sports network on January 1, according to Ryan Divish and Adam Jude of the Seattle Times. The Mariners had already held a 71% share in ROOT Sports NW since 2013, and they’ll now assume the 29% share previously held by Warner Bros. Discovery, as the corporation is getting out of the RSN business.
This could mean some cuts at ROOT, as Mariners chairman John Stanton met with staffers on Tuesday and “could not promise all staffers that they would retain their jobs,” Divish and Jude write. More clarity will emerge on the organizational side by mid-January, Stanton told the ROOT employees, and in a statement to Divish/Jude, Stanton said “our top priority is to ensure all Mariners fans have access to watch Mariners games from their home each night.”
In addition to the M’s, ROOT is also the broadcast home of the NHL’s Seattle Kraken, as well as the NBA’s Portland Trail Blazers and (in select markets) Utah Jazz, and some college basketball games involving schools in the Pacific Northwest. As such, any decision the Mariners take about ROOT’s future involves several other teams and existing contracts, and it isn’t necessarily a guarantee that the M’s will remain with ROOT in its current form.
As Divish and Jude note, the Mariners might opt to sell their broadcasting rights to Major League Baseball itself, following the path of some teams whose TV rights were impacted by the Diamond Sports Group’s bankruptcy announcement last March. Even the M’s might explore this possibility in the future, however, the “most likely decision” for 2024 is that the team will continue ROOT productions as usual, and simply absorb the new costs associated with full ownership of the network.
Owning a regional sports network has traditionally been seen a positive or even a cash cow for teams in various sports, though the broadcasting landscape has changed rather drastically as more and more customers have either cut back on cable subscriptions or cut the cord entirely. Comcast Xfinity announced in October that it was planning to double the cost of a subscription to ROOT, which could have even more of an adverse impact on viewership.
With WBD out of the picture, the Mariners will now carry the full brunt of additional costs themselves, and the impact is already being seen in the team’s baseball operations decisions. Cutting payroll has been the chief focus of Seattle’s offseason to date, and president of baseball ops Jerry Dipoto has suggested that the M’s may spend beyond their $140MM payroll for 2023, but perhaps not much beyond. Seattle has about $117.24MM on the books for 2024 as per Roster Resource, giving the club some but not a ton of spending flexibility as the Mariners look to upgrade their offense. Dipoto has always been more prone to roster-building via trades than by free agency anyway, but Dipoto might need to be more creative than usual in finding deals that will help the M’s without breaking the bank.
Can’t wait for 3 scrap heap overpays at end of Jan or early Feb
Good for you Mariners! So proud!
Bnick – As long as the M’s continue to lead MLB in profit, probably ain’t gonna change.
Meanwhile,Rob Manfred is doing NOTHING regarding the Diamond Sports bankruptcy which affects those teams dependent on revenue from their tv deals. Cleveland, specifically held in limbo now until the next hearing on Jan 5th. There is no competitive balance in baseball , when a team does not know how much they have to spend for the year!!!
“Rob Manfred doing nothing”…You do realize Rob Manfred is not a bankruptcy judge, right?
There is no offseason World Series. If there was, you’re right, the Mets/Padres/Dodgers would always win. Thankfully there is only 1 World Series every year.
Signed, Braves fan
And just before Christmas!! What a classy act!!
Hey there is no bigger Mariners fan in the AL West right now. I’m definitely rooting for them on ROOT! I look at my Yankees, as the Mariners perfect trading partner if they need some offense, basically we can definitely help each other in 2024 and beyond. Let’s Go M’s!!!
In other words, Yamamoto is still undecided in his next team
The Mariner offseason salary dump will likely extend beyond the team.
Stanton must be suffering enormously. Maybe fans could start a Go Fund Me for his benefit?
It’s getting ridiculous. This ownership group’s integrity is now gone for many fans. If Stanton is running on such very thin margins…. just sell the team. Make your money and let someone else try to bring this city a winner.
I’ve got a job opening in low level management if he wants to apply. Not sure he’s qualified though.
He could be the assistant to the regional manager
“our top priority is to ensure all Mariners fans have access to watch Mariners games from their home each night.”
It sure doesn’t seem like it, as the M’s force fans to decide between two expensive premium subscription services (FUBO or Xfinity). Like many people, I cut the cord on cable several years ago. I would be happy to pay to watch ROOT sports, but I am not going to pay $50-$90 per month for channels I do not want. The Mariners need to fix this, as cable subscriptions will only decrease moving forward..
It is infuriating. I have espn plus, Netflix and that’s it. Whatever time I have for content is totally filled with those two services.
NOW. During the season, I WILL have my mariners on every single night, regardless of how much I can invest into it, it’s always there for me, and that’s how I like to live.
I have to pay $70 a month for one freaking channel during the season. My blood boils just thinking about it. And no it doesn’t hurt my account that much, but I grew up dirt poor and it pisses me off that they exploit fans like this.
Dude you can get the MLB package for 30 bucks a month.
And then I have to use a vpn to bypass. And a browser. I don’t want to have to do that. If blackouts weren’t a thing, you wouldn’t hear me bitching at all because we’d all be able to watch our favorite teams for a very reasonable price, like $5-10 a month. Actually try to spread the game and expose it to kids instead of withholding it cause “capitalism demands!!!”
ALSO. I get the MLB package free with my flex season ticket membership every year. The app and the tech are total ass. Terrible product, they need serious upgrades.
So you could pay 30 a month instead of 70 but you simply don’t want to have to do that?
Well…….
Heck T Mobile give you free MLB package.
Again. The tech sucks. Half the time it doesn’t work, and I pay for the highest speed internet.
Not sure why you’re up my butt, I make a totally valid point that many people agree with. Just because you don’t doesn’t make our point any less valid. It should be better, it should be more accessible.
I am a Cardinal fan who lives in Denver. The app works perfectly fine for me.
I’m sure it does, you’re not subject to blackout. Congratulations on your advertisement for the MLB App! Your check is in the mail
Of course it should be more accessible but it sounds like you aren’t making a real effort and instead are looking for excuses. Mine works all the time if the internet isn’t working properly that’s a separate issue.
I have done the MLB tv only thing several times, thought to myself “this will be sweet my problem is solved.” I have made the effort. There are many others like me completely displeased and having issues with the app, you are wrong. Everybody wants to jump to call somebody lazy.
MLB package blacks-out every local game. I have a mlb annual package, I am a flex season ticket member… and I still can’t watch M’s games on TV because ROOT only plays on FUBO or Xfinity.
Are you seriously suggesting it’s the fans that need to get with it and pay for a VPN so they can circumvent all the black-outs mlb has put on their own product?
I don’t think you have made much effort at all. I think it used to be easier and now you are mad about it.
Oh, yeah it works great for watching out-of-town games. Try being a fan of the team where you live… mlb makes it a nightmare.
lol, what a jerk. Productive discussion bud. Thumbs up
I’ve done the same thing SODOMOJO. Joel P doesn’t know what he’s talking about.
Chester I have xfinity where I live and we also have root sports. I pay about 60 a month on top of what my internet costs for cable. I don’t get MLB games those I get through the mlb package free with t mobile. I pay for cable because I get lots and lots of channels besides baseball. To act as if you only watch baseball and that costs all the money is ignorant and incorrect.
Dude you are mad that the games that you grew up watching for free are not as free as they used to be. And because of that you refuse to learn or do anything differently just so you can get on your soapbox like you did here.
So why again can’t you just get cable? Because it’s 70 bucks a month and you are the only guy on the planet who watches nothing else except baseball games????
You are dense. MANY people have cut cable and will not go back. They will NOT pay for channels they don’t want. These people are now fully streaming services like HULU, Netflix, etc. They will not double pay for the shows they want, just because the M’s product is not available on anything but the antiquated cable system… they will just forgo M’s games.
The fact that you can’t grasp that and keep saying “cable” makes me think I’m talking to John Stanton himself.
You want to be a rebel and cut the cord great well I guess you dont get to watch baseball games then. Quit making excuses when you control your own fate here.
The MLB package blacks out local games. You said you live in Denver? Isn’t it kind of a bummer you can’t watch the Rockies through the app? I get the package every year because I watch a ton of baseball, but it’s frustrating I can’t watch my favorite team. I’d even pay extra to remove the blackout restrictions, and I’m sure a lot of other fans would too. Seems shortsighted to make it difficult for your customers to buy your product.
I live in Denver from St Louis I don’t watch Rockies games unless they are playing the Cardinals.
Root sports has been a jacked up mess since I have lived here. I believe you still can’t watch Avalanche games here even with Root sports.
You can change your VPN and watch whatever you want. Or in this case with Seattle you could simply pay for cable. The issue is these guys don’t want to pay for cable.
Also very short-sided to pipe up on this topic without knowing what the hell you’re talking about
“Works great for me!”
WELL! Then everybody ELSE complaining must be the dumbasses eh?
You understand this isn’t a personal issue, right? RSNs are failing all around the country. Screaming, “stick to the script” at everybody isn’t a solution… it’s someone that doesn’t understand the problem.
Dude I watched every baseball game I wanted to last year. Did you? If so I guess it’s not an issue. If you didn’t then perhaps you are the dumb dumb.
I don’t want to pay for cable either – I don’t want to pay for a bunch of channels I’ll never watch. I’d be willing to pay extra to be able to watch local games, but I’m not paying more than twice as much to watch one team as I’m paying to watch 29 others.
If only we were allowed to posts gifs. Then I could properly convey how comical this discussion is
Dude if you want to miss baseball games so you can protest RSNs and the cable system do it. That’s on you. But stop complaining about it on a freaking baseball forum. It’s 10 in the morning in December and you are talking baseball here. Obviously you are a pretty big fan. If you want to cut off your nose to spite your face do it.
Do you think it’s smart for MLB to force its customers to buy something they don’t want in order to be able to buy what they actually want? How is that a good idea?
You don’t watch any TV except baseball?
Nonsense.
Get a VPN. Look it up if you need to.
They blackout the mariners if you live locally.
That’s exactly how cable has worked since it’s existence. You saw an episode of South Park and think you are enlightened now. And if you understood how to get a VPN perhaps you would be. But you don’t so you are just whining about it here.
You can’t watch in market games.
Haven’t watched cable or broadcast TV in years. Watch a ton of YouTube. And a ton of baseball. Also don’t need to look up vpn’s lol. Thanks though. Its stupid to make people buy something they don’t want just for the right to buy your product, and I think it will hurt MLB in the long run. All things being equal, they should want as many willing customers as possible to be able to buy what they’re selling, not make it more difficult.
Joel P- there are a few things going on here. The first is that cable is a rip off. It’s mostly 90 channels of religious broadcasting and home shopping. I, and many people, have gone to a more à la carte approach to entertainment. I have Hulu live for the half the price of cable. I use the savings to get MLB tv. I live in the Seattle area, but I’m a Yankees fan, so I get to see my team play except when they play the Mariners and my games are blocked out then I’m looking for a stream on Reddit or otherwise trying to circumvent the MLB blackout rules with a VPN that you also have to pay for. I’m not lazy, and I want to watch the Yankees games enough that I end up watching it on my laptop through a choppy illegal stream. The second problem is that all of this is for advertising dollars, correct? Making your games unwatchable to viewers makes them less attractive to advertisers as well as the viewers. You and root Sports can continue to dig in and be as inaccessible as the PAC-12 network and tell fans to purchase a product that they are moving away from or get bent if you want, but don’t be surprised when Root Sports suffers the same fate as PAC- 12 network.
It probably will hurt baseball in the long run. Growing up it used to be on basic TV and then you had to have cable to watch baseball games.
Things change. Either play the game or don’t man.
Sounds like you aren’t buying anything. You want something for free and are mad you can’t have it. I don’t think this is the kind of customer they are going to miss.
Dude I believe the whole system is failing and the bankruptcy of Ballys is the first domino.
I think they are scaring away new fans at a time when they really could use them. The average age of a baseball fan gets older by the day and old people die.
But I like baseball. And I want to watch it. So I do what I have to do.
Right. Because it is too expensive and sucks. The Mariners think they can force us to buy cable that we don’t want, and that is the issue. You can watch every out of market MLB game for the whole season for $100 on MLB TV, and cable is over $100 per month. That is why people don’t like Root sports. It isn’t just bad for the fans, it’s bad for the team because nobody is watching and no one is watching no one is buying advertising, which is the point of owning your own sports network is to get advertising dollars. More access would mean more advertising, which would lead to more money. In the case of the Mariners, ownership would just pocket it, but other teams use that money to improve their rosters.
Cable isn’t 100 a month. Where I live is xfinity same as Seattle and I pay about 60 dollars more than I would for just internet. And obviously the internet is a need. And if I did nothing but streaming I would run out of data because I watch a lot of TV.
If you want to make a statement then don’t pay for it. Great. But stop complaining about it. You might be a marketing genius but it’s not your business.
What color is the sky in your world, Joel?
They cracked down on VPN usage.
“The issue is these guys don’t want to pay for cable.”
Paying for cable’s great. I loved the price increases and paying exorbitant fees so much I got rid of it and switched to Hulu Live.
Enjoy Hulu. But some people want to watch games. Like these guys commenting.
Blackouts. You can’t watch home games on through mlb TV. T-mobile offered free mlb premium and it was worthless because you couldn’t even watch half the season
You have to get a VPN. Look it up.
ROOT is also on DirecTV
You must be fun at parties
“Enjoy Hulu. But some people want to watch games. Like these guys commenting.”
I want to watch games too, and as a T-Mobile customer I can. But I’m an out of market fan, and after hearing how much the Dodgers’ commentary sucks without Vin, I’m more than happy to skip those 6-7 games I used to have access to on Spectrum.
The Mariners are blacked out for us who live in WA state.
The only thing I use cable for is baseball. I watch everything else off of Amazon prime and Netflix. I wouldnt even bother with cable except that it isn’t any cheaper to get rid of it due to the stupid packages they force you to get with home internet.
Except you will probably need an Apple TV subscription when the ream plays on a Friday night and they get the exclusive rights. Any way the owners and players can slice off a revenue opportunity they will do until fans say no more which they refuse to do.
162 games a year. You really gotta watch the 3 games that are on Apple TV?
Again people just want to complain.
I have that too! All of the money I don’t spend on cable allows me to get Apple TV, Hulu, Disney+, and espn+, MLB TV, Netflix, and even Paramount +.
And what do you use for internet service? Many areas you can’t stream everything without running out of data. Depends on how much TV you watch. You may have all those options but without unlimited internet you are still limited.
I have unlimited internet because when my kids were doing online school, we needed more data. Still cheaper than cable TV, and I got free Peacock streaming service!
Many areas don’t provide unlimited data. And many areas don’t have good enough internet service to stream all day.
Yes its cheaper. And you don’t get to watch baseball. So…….
I watch baseball because I don’t care about the Mariners except the 7 games a year they play the Yankees, and when they are in Seattle, I just go to the game. This isn’t about me. It’s about the Mariners alienating their fans and advertisers. Lots of people “don’t get to watch baseball” which I empathize with, but also the Mariners and their advertisers are losing viewers. That is a problem for the club and MLB. Remember the Pac-12?
Baseball has been on cable TV where I am from Missouri for as long as I can remember. Were they alienating their fans and advertisers then?
Cable is competing against the streaming services. And this is something they use to compete. If you don’t like it don’t pay for it fine but stop telling everyone about the poor future fan and all this nonsense
My wife insists on having cable, but I never watch it, other than a little RedZone, because I loathe commercials. I watch YouTube Premium with no commercials and that’s it. And I have the MLB TV app also, only because it’s free with TMobile. So your assertion that no one watches only sports on cable is wrong, as someone else above also mentioned. I haven’t kept up with a TV series in years. National “news” is scripted BS. And reality shows are all staged, so why do I want to watch that fakery? I’m surviving just fine without television shows. I can go to YouTube, watch whatever I’m interested in, and listen to podcasts.
Yes, it helps the cable providers at the expense of MLB and its fans. You acknowledged that it hurts baseball in the long run. Why do you think that is?
It’s not baseballs job to provide free entertainment to you. Again what kind of customer are you if you only want to watch if it’s free? Not the kind of customer a business needs.
No one is asking for it to be free Joel- I’d be happy to pay what it’s worth. I’m not willing to buy something I don’t want just for the right to buy your product. And it’s silly to make buying your product unnecessary complicated. It’s bad for baseball long term – as you acknowledged, because it alienates their customers.
Those that watch baseball on TV pay by sitting through all of the commercials.
Why do you think it hurts baseball in the long run? You’re just dodging the question and making a straw man argument about people wanting something for free.
The whole argument is about fans not wanting to pay for games not what’s best for baseballs future. It’s quite noble of you to defend or care about baseballs future in a way that allows you to whine about the cost of watching it on television.
Again baseball has been on cable since I started watching baseball 30 years ago. And now you don’t want to pay for cable anymore you want to make excuses and complain.
It’s not the whole argument. The argument is about MLB making it unnecessary expensive and difficult to watch your favorite team, which alienates fans, which is bad for baseball. Why are you defending a system that makes people buy something they don’t want, just to watch baseball? Because 30 years? That makes no sense. I’m still waiting to hear your answer, btw. Why is it bad for baseball long term to have this setup?
Dude if you don’t want to pay for cable get the MLB package. Get a VPN. There are options here. You aren’t stuck nobody is it’s just a bunch of whiny people here who want to get on their soapbox about how bad cable is. If you don’t like cable don’t get it. Stop complaining about it.
Why do you think it’s bad for baseball long term? You said it. “It probably will hurt baseball in the long run.” -Joel P
Because free TV is a better way to grow a fan base. But it’s also less profitable for the business. And it’s not my business. Baseball doesn’t owe me free TV. I have cable and the MLB package both. Good lord T Mobile gives me the MLB package and my wife’s got Verizon which gives me Disney and Hulu.
If you want to watch baseball you can figure this stuff out it’s not that difficult. It’s more difficult than turning on a local station like you would 40 years ago but it’s pretty darn easy.
People ARE willing to pay- however, many of us aren’t willing to pay for things we don’t want. Tying access to local games to a product many don’t want is stupid and short sighted. No one is demanding anything for free except your straw man.
Local access isn’t a birthright. Baseball doesn’t owe you that. Yes 40 years ago you could watch baseball for free on a local channel. But I am pretty sure you couldn’t watch all 162 games in the season. Then cable showed up and that made all of that possible. What did you do back then did you have cable then or not?
Nowadays there are numerous ways to watch baseball. Some cost very little or no money at all. Why is that not good enough for you? Again don’t like cable get the MLB package. If you are local get a VPN. Problem solved.
Again with the straw man! No one said anything about a birthright. Do you really think it’s optimal for mlb to sell a television package that includes every team except your favorite team? And no way to get it unless you buy a cable package that you don’t want? That’s bad business, and it’s alienating fans. It’s not about birthrights or not being good enough for me. The point is that people who want to BUY their product are discouraged from doing so by the unnecessarily complicated setup. I’d be happy to pay 10-20 bucks a month extra to remove the local blackout restrictions. But I’m not willing to shell out $70 + a month for cable. They could sell a lot more games if they figured that out.
You’re still here? Complaining about my complaining?
Again, thumbs up to you bud. Very productive discussion here.
“Hurr durr you’re all dumb and I’m smart”
I think you need to write a book with all this material. Why are you complaining? Pull yourself up by your bootstraps and leave this site if you don’t like talking to Mariner fans. Don’t comment on a Mariner post if you don’t like Mariner fans.
Stop whining
Joel P earlier in the thread;
“Of course it should be more accesible”
Thanks for agreeing, and then flip flopping just to stir up an argument, and then refusing to let it go
You need to get off this site, you don’t intend to have productive discussion, all you’ve done is pick a fight. I’ll be reporting you vehemently until we get rid of you. Go to Reddit if it 4chan if your objective is to fight and call fellow fans/Americans names. You are the worst kind of internet user
I’m not ignoring anything. That’s only more proof of how stupid the setup is. MLB could be selling games to all the VPN users AND the people who don’t want to buy a bunch of crappy cable channels they’ll never watch. They’re losing out on all of that because of these antiquated cable contracts. It’s stupid and shortsighted. I don’t know why you’re defending it.
Oh now you wanna switch back to talking about the topic instead of calling Mariners fans names? After I held you accountable for simply being a jerk?
You can’t let it go, even when you know you’ve been a jerk
Nobody is selling anything to you Bobby because you aren’t paying. That’s the point here. You said you would pay 10 to 20 dollars more a month to avoid the blackouts. That’s a VPN that’s EXACTLY how that works. So what’s the problem here?
You want to hate cable cool. There are other options out there. Back in the day there really wasn’t now there are.
Dude I don’t recall calling anyone here a name. And then you just called me a jerk lol.
Mute button champ. Try it.
Joel P earlier in the thread:
“Of course it should be more accessible”
The Mariners fans are cheap? Lol, I guess if you can’t articulate an effective argument, this is where you go!
No, I’ll be hitting the flag button, because the point of a discussion board isn’t to fight and argue. It’s to have productive discussion. You continue to fail to practice productive discussion, you just go “lol you’re the dumb one”
I’ll be flagging you, not because I’m soft, or you hurt my feelings, because I think you are a lousy contributor to this site and I want you gone. So I’m gonna do something about it. Instead of complaining
Dude most fans don’t freak out about this kind of stuff. In other cities they have a special network that you pay separately for and in many cases its not cheap. Ask a Cubs or Yankees fan I don’t know the details but I know it isn’t cheap. In Seattle you are lucky enough to be able to get it with cable and you act like you are being taken advantage of. The next step is a private network but clearly the Mariners fans wouldn’t pay for it. Clearly.
Nobodies freaking out. We’re here to have productive discussion.
Please go
Lol it’s not your site. Just like you don’t own the team you don’t own the site. Seriously who do you think you are?
Get a life man. Nobody is making you comment.
Again, thanks for your opinion, but I don’t want it. Thanks for offering though. Again.
“Get a life man”
Flagged
You speak for yourself and yourself only. You don’t get to win arguments because you pay for a membership. Listen to yourself dude. Get over yourself. This is garbage talk. And I am definitely flagging it…….
The point is MLB shouldn’t be making it unnecessarily difficult to but their product. It’s stupid. It’s annoying. And it’s shortsighted. VPNs have nothing to do with MLB. The fact that there is a workaround doesn’t change anything.
And your replies have been productive????
I am speaking about the subject. You are making it weirdly personal.
You called people whiny, dumb and cheap. “Jerk” is so much worse though huh?
This is not personal at all Joel P I don’t know you. I know you’ve done nothing here to pick a fight.
“I think Mariners fans are cheap and they deserve their ownership”
Were you trying to be nice to me here? I made this personal?
“I don’t remember calling anybody any names”
*but pick a fight
It isn’t about a birth right. Selling the games to fans isn’t where broadcasting revenue is generated. It’s generated by selling beer and cars in between innings. More eyes on game = more advertising dollars. Fewer eyes on games = less advertising dollars. It isn’t that I’m mad because I can’t figure out an illegal way to watch baseball, it’s that by limiting access to viewers you are limiting access to advertising money which should be used to improve the on field product.
You refuse to listen when we tell you:
we tried the vpn thing, and it only works on a computer browser, and it doesn’t always work; despite paying for the maximum internet
Do you actually read these responses? It doesn’t seem like it, you just continue to basically say
“I didn’t do anything wrong, I think you guys are cheap, I’m smart and your dumb”
Flagged
Lol calm down dude.
People need to learn to take responsibility for their words. And intentions. You’re not here to talk ball
Lark you just want it for free and you are hiding behind the fact that advertising dollars equals more money to spend as if that all just magically works out. They get a ton of money from the cable companies that’s why they do it this way because it’s profitable. I am sure you are a smart guy but stop acting like you know more than the people making these decisions. You don’t.
Again it’s very noble of everyone to say “we deserve free baseball” as if you are Robin Hood when all you really care about is yourself.
“Free baseball”
Me earlier
“affordable and reasonable baseball like $5-10 a month”
Thanks for reading and actually participating
Flagged
Straw man. No one is demanding anything for free. You’re not good at this Joel.
Now you are saying VPNs don’t work????
Since when?????
Perhaps you can’t figure it out. That’s the problem.
Good gosh. Be accountable. Just making excuses.
At no point did I say anything other than, sometimes the Vpns don’t work
Flagged for not reading and actually participating, just trying to fight
I refuse to let it go? You are replying 3 times to my 1. You are saying words like we as if you represent someone besides yourself when you don’t. You are trolling.
I am done here. You can go ahead and get the last word I am done. Peace.
It is name calling Joel. But its ok, i forgive you for losing your composure. And the argument was never that I was stuck or didnt have options. The point is that MLB is shooting themselves in the foot with the current setup. They are alienating fans and losing revenue long term. The only people who really benefit are the cable companies. You can either engage in the actual discussion and attempt to respond to the points Im making, or you can continue to argue with your straw man.
Joel P. I don’t want anything for free or otherwise from the Mariners. I don’t have any interest in the Mariners-Royals matchup on Tuesday in May. I really don’t care. Your repeated suggestion of illegally accessing the broadcast by masking your IP address with a VPN is how you get “free baseball”. I’m glad you are having fun today with this, but you got me pegged all wrong. I just feel bad for m’s fans that want to watch their team and have to get around the cable paywall to do it. You do not feel bad for them. I got it. We have different opinions on this subject. You think they should access the game illegally and not expect free baseball. You are one hell of a debater. I would almost call you a master debater.
It isn’t even a good argument!!!
“ You think they should access the game illegally and not expect free baseball. “ This is priceless. Well said sir. I wonder if Joel can explain this apparent contradiction in his logic?
@bobby
Lmao. Joel doesn’t realize that installing a VPN to circumvent streaming restrictions is in fact illegal.
You’re paying money and still doing something illegal, Joel!
MLB needs to take over all local TV contracts and distribute the revenue equally among the teams.
No, etex211, that would be communism or socialism. America is supposed to the the champion of free enterprise, remember?
Or do people even think anymore?
I’m a Korean War vet, and I fought for that principle. I can’t forget so easily.
Baseball is still a private industry. I agree with your sentiment, but I don’t think mlb owning TV rights is a bad thing… as long as it allows me access!!
Oh and… thank you for your service Fred.
Every time someone feeds a poor person, or acknowledges that the NY Yankees are less interesting because other teams can’t afford to field full teams to compete against them, you don’t have to flip out about communism taking over and invalidating your sacrifices. The freedom you fought for wasn’t supposed to be the freedom for the haves to crush everyone else under their heels.
“I didn’t fight in Korea to have publicly funded roads, bridges, schools, supervision of air travel safety, police, fire protection or, ironically, the military!”
Interesting everytime large market apologists are faced with those talking about taking away their EXTREME advantage, they want to call it communism or socialism.
My father is also a Korean War vet who would whole heartedly agree with what Bookbook said above, along with sadness about how the country he fought for is going backwards.
MLB is not the government.
ETA: The NFL sucks, but their TV contract arrangement is the gold standard for all of sports.
One more thought: Individual Wal-Mart stores don’t get to make their own deals with vendors. That’s all handled in Bentonville, AR. MLB is the parent company of all MLB teams.
Etex, I understand your view, but it’s based on a false assumption. To start, the NFL has a national TV contract because it’s a national game. MLB is a regional game with crossover into national revenue, hence the current sharing model. The NFL doesn’t have local RSNs because it’s a different sport and revenue model. All NFL games are televised nationally. MLB games are mostly televised regionally except for the annoying national games of the week! Your “solution” is to make the large markets who bring in the revenue for the national TV contracts devalued, and since they would then have to share ALL their local revenue equally under your plan, they’d have less incentive to invest and to build out their local revenue. That’s what’s sort of is happening now with teams like Oakland. They can now survive totally on the national TV contract and the pooled local revenue that mostly exists because of the major market teams. All teams, btw, pay 48% of their local revenue into a shared pool, so the idea that none of it is shared is false. They’re trying to find a balance, but it’s one that’s failing not because of the big markets; it’s failing because some smaller markets are pocketing funds and taking advantage of the system. Larger market teams should be outraged by what the A’s are doing, but they really can’t stop it.
MLB has a form of a cap at the top, but they failed to enact an equivalent floor to tax teams that don’t spend. Let’s start by fixing that.
To add to your comment, LD99, full sharing of local revenue means markets outside of LA, NY and a few others will have a significant advantage over the big markets. Lower tax rates, easier living means with access to the exact same revenue that’s mostly coming from the major markets, coupled with spending caps, means they have an advantage signing the top players. The OP simply hasn’t thought this through.
Here’s a shocking thought. MLB actually has created a system that works, that has been shown time and time again to have more competitive balance than the so-called “hard cap” leagues. You can build successful baseball teams in different ways. All teams now make money. MLB is the second highest revenue sport in the entire world. TV ratings were up this year, and the game had its highest attendance since 2017. Things need to be tweaked; they don’t need to be overhauled. Those who want full revenue sharing are likely jealousy driven, sure the grass is greener on the other side of the fence.
The champion of free enterprise? Well what about all that corporate welfare that the great and wonderful US government continually lavishes upon the corporations and rich people of this country?
So the NFL is communist then? I’m sure you still watch it lol. FOH keyboard warrior clown
Fred, that’s exactly how the NFL works and there are no “small market” teams in football.
There aren’t any in baseball, either, just owners that won’t even spend their revenue sharing check on payroll. $110 million to start the season in revenue sharing, and half the teams have a payroll under that amount. Spend your revenue sharing money first before crying.
MLB relies on “socialism” already, with their government-secured monopoly.
I’m fully against this unless the terms state a mandatory percentage must be invested into the teams roster. Otherwise teams like Oakland, Pittsburgh etc. will continue to spend nothing and pocket more money.
Nobody ever said free enterprise will please everyone all the time. You still can’t take money from the rich and give it to the poor.
MLB is a monopoly. It’s not free enterprise.
Actually, the NFL does just that quite successfully. No government involvement required … provided a league’s owners have any interest in giving their customers a more competitive sport.
It’s not free enterprise or communism. All 30 teams are working together they should share the benefit. Without the Pirates and Athletics of the world the Yankees and Mets wouldn’t be able to exist.
Nope. It only flows one way. From the poor to the rich.
Progressive taxation made America great. It’s absolutely why just about every industrialized democracy has longer lifespans and higher quality of life than the United States. Every team should be forced to maintain a minimum payroll high enough to justify the revenue sharing.. The kind of tank job the A’s just did was not good for the sport.
The cap is the worst part of NFL.
This argument that my team suck so yours should too is not really a sound argument. My billionaire is less of a billionaire than your billionaire, and that isn’t fair. Some teams prioritize winning and see it as a way to make money, and some just want to make money and can do that without winning one game if they don’t spend their revenue sharing on payroll. I don’t know what to say except that maybe you should get a new favorite team until your old favorite teams gets a new billionaire.
Fred, we’ve been doing it for the past century under the New Deal. Every industrialized nation does exactly this.
Yeah, I realized this but only after I shot my mouth off.
The second part of full media revenue sharing would be the elimination of CBT. Allow franchises to fail if they wish.
Full revenue sharing should include both a hard cap and a hard floor.
What would be the incentive for a smaller market team to contribute anything?
Teams received $110 million in revenue sharing in 2022. Half of MLB teams had a payroll of less than $100 million. How much money should be siphoned out of teams trying to compete to pay the Mariner’s ownership to pocket the revenue other teams are generating. First, spend the money you get for free before crying that you don’t have enough money to compete.
Until teams like the Pirates and Rays can afford to have a $250+ million payroll like the Yankees and Dodgers, we don’t have enough revenue sharing.
Without the Pirates and Rays coming to town, the Yankees and Dodgers don’t even have a product to sell.
Why should they share more revenue when they don’t spend the revenue they get on payroll. I would only agree to more revenue sharing if the owners weren’t allowed to pocket it. It would have to be spent on player salaries only. Then I wouldn’t care. I also think they could “afford” it now, they just don’t want to.
Sans a salary cap(which we know is a non-starter with MLBPA) that is the only way to enable any semblance of competitive balance. The luxury tax has failed as a de facto cap.
If Milwaukee can’t offer a FA more money, then why would they sign there? All things being equal, players will form super teams in Miami, LA, and NY with their buddies where they have more chances for endorsements and other off field earning opportunities. Salary caps in other leagues have not created fairness. Why can’t the Pirates at least spend what they receive in revenue sharing??? Spend that first before crying.
There is already revenue sharing in RSN’s throughout MLB. It’s not equal sharing, but it has been done for a long time.
“our top priority is to ensure all Mariners fans have access to watch Mariners games from their home each night.”
Is this ownerships idea of how to make us feel better about not spending money on players? If so, it does not work what so ever.
Is there anyway that this helps the Mariners spend more on free agents? I cannot see it where we sit right now but I don’t know all of the future benefits or concerns of this decision.
I would say the salary dumping nature of this offseason for the Mariners shows the concern.
Watch the games on bootleg. And get ready for a lot of blacked out games.
I am Root
Still trying to figure out the endgame of this move, Que bono? I don’t believe a word coming out of that front office
*cui bono
JFC
Might as well put Christmas bonuses and pink slips in the same envelope…
Tried to…. the “jelly of the month” club envelopes came pre-sealed.
Jelly of the month club. It’s the gift you can enjoy all year long!
This channel had/has MLB, NHL, NBA, and college sports? That is a ton of content for an RSN channel, and probably priced to cover the rights fees for all of them. Seems like the M’s could slim it down by cutting the other stuff and do just baseball. That would in principle allow lower prices targeting the baseball-only fan who doesn’t want the other stuff.
This is interesting and may be the trend with Time Warner getting out of the RSN business and Diamond/Bally bankruptcy. The RSN model was too tied into cable TV and with so many cutting the cord, broadcasters will have to get better in capturing fans through streaming. MLB Network already has a streaming platform which will likely get more robust as the RSN’s continue to collapse. Maybe why Mariners would consider selling the rights to MLB Network. I know that one of the few RSN’s that has done well is Bally Sports Detroit. Or at least they keep making their payments to the Tigers. But even the Tigers see the changing landscape and hired its own main play by play man this off season (Benetti) instead of having BSD hire him. But BSD also has a streaming option for games unlike some of the other RSN’s so it may survive a bit longer.
MLB needs to find a better way to economically stream it’s product if it wants to remain relevant and more importantly gain new fans. Most people I know have cut the cable cord which pretty much guarantees that the Gen Z base will never hook up in the future. Streaming is the future and that doesn’t include forcing customers to buy channels they don’t want.
John Stanton has just confirmed Root Sports newest partners are going to be Cartoon Network and The Comedy Channel!
Sell the team John, sell the frick’n team!
“Imagine if instead of having to subscribe to all of the different streaming services for all the content you want, it was all in one place.
And then imagine that instead of buffering and lagging and waiting to load there was a special dedicated wire that offered it all instantly in high quality.
Crazy, I know.”
“Cutting payroll has been the chief focus of Seattle’s offseason to date”.
More like ‘let’s get rid of a 200k/sub .250 hitter and bring in someone that can hit for avg and K half as much.
Can you imagine what kind of production can be produced from 100 or so AB’S where there is no K? 200k’s vs 100K’s.
Can’t wait! 100 roll-overs to the second baseman instead of a 100 Ks!!
IMO, you’re right, Hoof! All those Ks have a cumulative effect on run production. Fewer guys on base, fewer runners moved over, fewer sac flies, fewer runs driven in. Having the #2 and #3 K leaders in MLB gone (as well as a talented young guy who doesn’t control his temper and also Ks a bunch)? Golden, except that they haven’t really done anything yet to replace the departed players, and the trade return for those guys looks truly awful so far. My fingers are crossed that the M’s will bring in some players who can actually help, but this ROOT thing makes me doubtful.
I get it, but who?? FA are signing with clubs, and the players who can actually help will have all signed. The Mariners are not in on any of the remaining top FA and every one that is left is not a major upgrade of the players they have moved. It sounds good in theory, but in practice you need those productive hitters that don’t strike out, don’t have a temper, and will sign a below market contract to come to Seattle. Who are the names that you think the Mariners should sign as a FA that fit the “players that can actually help”??
There aren’t any. And there are virtually no teams trading for prospects. If you had payroll, teams are lining up to dump player salary everywhere cause of the RSN issues everywhere. So basically, M’s fans need to be prepared to see prospect overpay, for good players. Or more bargain basement 1yr signings. let’s be honest, bargain basement is the most likely. If this payroll thing is going to keep up, then prepare to trade Castillo, Gilbert, Ray, Raleigh and France next off-season for prospects. Ms are about to become the Ray’s. Those players could nab massive prospects to fuel the next CHEAP core. Mark my words, it’s more likely than you think.
Agreed. They might trade Castillo this off season.
I’d rather they trade Castillo than Gilbert, Kirby, Miller or Woo.
Really? Stanton ent and actually talked to employees at a business he owns? This organization is a joke. Should’ve moved the mariners and not the Sonics, at least they won a title.
A couple of economic comments since that is where this thread seems to have gone:
Increased revenue-sharing is anticompetitive within MLB but in this case not anti-capitalist–the economic entity is the league and the teams are franchisees operating under a franchise agreement. A McDonald’s franchisee can’t tell corporate in Chicago, “hands off, all this money is mine.” But it’s not clear that increased revenue sharing is better for the league, even if it is for certain individual teams.
Everyone who thought cord-cutting would result in cheaper a la carte service were wrong. It was a reasonable prediction, but the streaming market coalesced into structures that are little different from cable companies. Transactions have to be good for both the buyer and seller, and a la carte clearly has not worked for sellers.
Mariners fans have been getting “rooted” (Aussie slang) for some time now.
The cable model is dying fast. Almost all programming I want to watch is available on streaming for dramatically lower prices and–even more importantly–without commercials.
The one thing I would watch on cable is local baseball. Maybe cable would be worth it if I were going to watch a big variety of shows on it, but until they start broadcasting those shows without commercials that’s a big nope for me.
I’m aware of the VPN option but I am not a thief. If what I want to buy is not for sale, then there’s no deal, and I’ll just get my entertainment in other ways. But I’m not gonna steal it.
I used to have cable and was happy with the product but the pricing became ridiculous. I switched to streaming and like the reduced cost but I do get frustrated with the glitches and pixelization that happens way more often with streaming apps. As far as people at Root losing their jobs I nominate Jen Mueller. I’m sure she’s a wonderful person and I hate for anyone to lose their job but she’s just painful to listen to. The silly games and driving with Jen are a complete waste of time.
Fubo TV specializes in sports and carries the Mariners. After switching the price isn’t much different than Xfinity.
The Gen Xers that run Root Sports are about to learn when you mess with the bull you often get the horns.
I live 212 miles from my favorite team and my zip code is in the blackout zone on mlbtv.
Personally, i wish local networks would carry Baseball games like they used to. This all or nothing cable approach is slowly going down in flames (Bally Sports) and the straming packages are ridiculously overpriced. On answer would be to do away with blackout restrictions and let people pay a certain price for the team they actually want to watch
Is it known how much MLB pays to clubs for streaming rights?
Makes you wonder about the contract language of the deal between Root and Xfinity. So they have exposure to huge losses which must be unnerving. Shame more of the profits from the past few years weren’t reinvested back into the team.
I don’t understand why everyone is up in arms about the M’s. Jerry is just getting ready to enact phase II of the rebuild and we should be in a viable place to contend and spend money by 2028-2030 and ready himself and Scott another extension.
#KickTheCanDownTheRoad