The trade of Norichika Aoki to the Royals for southpaw Will Smith was "was coaxed primarily by Aoki's agent to assure more playing time," Tom Haudricourt of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel writes. Khris Davis' impressive rookie season put him in line for a starting job in 2014, and with Ryan Braun and Carlos Gomez locked into the other two starting outfield spots, Aoki was looking at a reduced role with the Brewers next season.
Here's some more Brewers news from Haudricourt's chat with Brewers GM Doug Melvin…
- Melvin reiterated his stance that the Brewers' lack of major offseason moves is due to the belief that the team will improve simply with the continued development of young players and the returns of suspended or injured stars like Braun or Aramis Ramirez.
- The Brewers pursued James Loney, who instead re-signed with the Rays for a three-year, $21MM contract. "We knew if he had the same deal he was probably going to go back to Tampa," Melvin said. Indeed, Loney said that he chose the Rays' contract over similar offers from not just the Brewers, but also the Pirates and Astros.
- Melvin cited some interest in Justin Morneau, who signed with the Rockies last month, but the GM sounded as if he wasn't particularly enamored with the free agent options at first base. "The list wasn't very good. It's one of those years where the position we needed, there were fewer opportunities to get someone," Melvin said.
- In also noting that the trade market for first baseman was thin, Melvin acknowledged he had at least had discussions with the Rangers and Mariners. "There just aren't available guys. Texas, at this point, is not willing to talk about [Mitch] Moreland. Seattle is not interested in moving their guys. So, there aren't a lot of choices."
- The Brewers didn't have much available payroll space this offseason but extra money would've been there if the situation warranted. "We haven't increased it that much, but if the right player was there I would go to (team owner) Mark (Attanasio) and say it's the right player," Melvin said. "When it comes to payroll, we're always guarded to make sure that we don't put ourselves in a hole or a bind that we can't get out of two years from now or three years from now. Our payroll will be in a much better position next year in that regard." The Brewers have only $39.1MM committed for 2015 as Ramirez, Yovani Gallardo and Tom Gorzelanny all come off the books next winter, plus Rickie Weeks seems unlikely to receive the 600 PA he needs this season to trigger his $11.5MM vesting option for 2015.
I have to think Texas would move Moreland in the right deal, but are probably being offered a pittance.
That would be correct, any new word about Jeff Baker as MM right hand complement yet.
Moreland isn’t worth much more than a pittance.
Maybe kendrys morales end up with Milwaukee when it’s all said and done. boras convinced them to sign Lohse pretty late in the offseason last year.
Ugh
I know y’all need a 1b, what do the fans want to see.
Stay in house with Hunter Morris
That is what I was seeing myself even as ranger fan, I nknew that y’all were at your payroll already.
With our attendance, our increased tv dollars and revenue numbers it doesnt seem like we should be at payroll, but they are just being cheap. Maybe our owner is starting to realize you dont have to spend alot – the fans will still come out. At least for now
The Brewers aren’t really being cheap. There just trying to find a way to win and stay within a reasonable budget.
A likely scenario – Keeping Morris in AAA and moving Weeks for 1st to try to show teams that he can still play, and then trading Weeks around the deadline, then bringing Morris up after Weeks is traded.
Who is your potential market if he shows he can still play.
The Rakuten Golden Eagles
The Yankees will need a second baseman. With A-Rod suspended for the whole season, Kelly Johnson has to play 3B everyday which means Brian Roberts is their only quality option to play 2B. Sure, they just signed Scott Sizemore, but he is just depth. Brian Roberts has not been able to stay healthy for years now. Surly Roberts will be on the DL at some point this season.That leaves the Yankees without a second baseman all together really, I mean after last season they are going to do everything possible to get back into the Playoffs this season and that wont happen with Scott Sizemore or Eduardo Nunez starting at 2B. Also, the Baltimore Orioles would be a fit too. Weeks would start at 2B making his little brother depth and Ryan Flaherty a good Utility man
Unfortunately I do not see anything of that nature happening.
This is all in theory of Weeks returning to quality starter form
Would you trade Pedroia out and bring him in, if he returns to form.
Not a chance. Pedroia is the most valuable second baseman in the majors. He may not have the flashy numbers other guys such as cano has, but Pedroia is a hustler who wants to win, knows how to make his club better, is the best defensive second baseman in the game. When healthy, he can hit 10-20 Homers with a average around .300 while getting clutch his, getting on base and swiping 15-20 bags and leading as a positive example for the other guys.
I would say Profar is the most valuable
he has not proven himself yet. I realize it was only 85 games and it was really his first taste of the majors at only 20 years of age (Not counting 9 games at age 19 in 2012) but he only hit .234 last season with a .308 OBP 26 RBIs and 2-4 in stolen base attempts. And only 6 homers.he has a -0.3 DWAR and .03 OWAR. Now maybe in 5 years from now he turns out to be an elite player like they say he will be, but im talking about who has the most value right now and clearly Profar is not the most valuable second baseman right now.
You can’t say that Profar is the most valuable because he hasn’t proven himself like Dustin has
Weeks returning to form means he hits .400 one month and .100 the rest of the season while playing terrible defense.
I don’t see the Yankees going to the playoffs without Cano. Yes, they have a good outfield, but in the AL east, you need more that just that.
and texiera and jeter. Im thinkin wild card if they stay healthy
Well, they pretty much said they wouldn’t move Weeks to 1st. I don’t think he would be very good at it. I’d guess its more likely that he is traded during ST if he hits.
He’d better not put weeks at 1b.
Nobody wants Weeks. If the Brewers want to compete this year, they won’t start Weeks. The Brewers can’t wait to get him off of their roster so they don’t have to pay his insane contract. Fact is, he is a waist of money and he doesn’t produce.
Hate to say it, but ive been saying get rid of weeks for years.i coulda saved them alot of money
Not sure that he is ready. Hunter might have to repeat Triple A. Hunter had such a bad year he did not get a Sept. call up
That’s a good question.
There are not too many owners or GMs that seem to ask that very question! I know the Orioles don’t do that!
Quite frankly, I have no idea why the Orioles do what they do!
As for Brewer Types, i doubt that they want to see Morales, much less give up a draft pick. Although, I forget if their choice is protected. Either way Morales is an AL guy.
Yes Morales is AL type and should stay in AL if wants f/t AB. I can’t be for sure, but I do believe that it is #7-8.
What did your local papers say about the Balfour thing.
Hahaha, I didn’t think anyone was going to ask or if anyone cared. The Sun, Masn, and Rich D from Comcast all pretty much said the same thing. They all said the physical is pretty stringent. Honestly, I haven’t heard anything really from Balfour. I was hoping he would file a grievance, if anything I would like to the Orioles to still sign him and make it right with him and the fans. A lot of us wanted him. I
I can see why you wanted him as a closer. Did not get why they did that, that is the reason for pending a physical though from 97-98. At the beginning of the off season was something I thought the Rangers needed but then decided we had lots of options from within.
Not give up the 12th pick in the draft for an average at best 1st baseman that won’t even come close to making us a contender.
I thought y’all pick was higher than that.
Nope, had a great last month of the season and screwed ourselves…..
I certainly hope not. Brewers need this draft pick.
I would agree I personally would love to see the Brew Crew in the race again.
I sure as hell hope not I don’t want to give a draft pick for the second year for guys the team sure as hell don’t need.
…no
I thought Weeks had a player option not a vesting option. OH HAPPY DAY!!!!!!
I will be happy to look for you be right back.
The article says he has a 600 AB vesting option
According to bbref 2015 is a team option for 11.5mm if he gets 600 p/a in 2014 or a combined 1200 p/a in 2013/2014 in 2013 he got only 399.
Thanks
No problem, glad to help.
That’s incorrect. If he reaches 600 PA in 2014 the option vests. If he does not it becomes a team option with a $1M buyout if he reaches 400 PA in 2014. This is from Cots.
So the M’s do not plan on moving Smoak then?
@ “The trade of Norichika Aoki to the Royals for southpaw Will Smith was “was coaxed primarily by Aoki’s agent to assure more playing time,” Tom Haudricourt of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel writes. Khris Davis’ impressive rookie season put him in line for a starting job in 2014, and with Ryan Braun and Carlos Gomez locked into the other two starting outfieldspots, Aoki was looking at a reduced role with the Brewers next season.”
Seeing as how the Brewers have a vacancy at 1B, they could have moved Braun to 1B and had an OF of Davis LF Gomez CF Aoka RF. Remember, Davis made his MLB debut last year and only played in 56 games last season and only had 153 PA. He played very well as a rookie in his 56 games and showed good power hitting 11 homeruns. What if he has a sophomore slump in his first full season? If this was to happen and they still had Aoka, then Braun could move back to LF and they could have a platoon at 1B of halton and francisco, but since they no longer have Aoka, their OF will have Davis in LF Gomez CF Braun RF and a platoon of Halton and Francisco at 1B. And if Davis does have a sophomore slump then now who plays LF? Caleb Gindel? or does Francisco play everyday at 1B and Halton everyday in LF? Either way, you can see how they would be in a better situation of they still had Aoka both as far as starters and depth go.
Good points, but the Brewers have two other outfielders that could be ready in Gindl and Schafer. The Brewers are not hurting for outfielders, which unfortunately made Aoki expendable. I didn’t want to see him go, but with only one more year of control…he was as good as gone. Gindl, Schafer, Braun, Gomez, and Davis are all under control much longer than Aoki.
I included Gindl but i see Shafer more as a role player than actual depth…. I see him filling in off the bench spelling someone in the OF a few times a week, pinch hitting and Pinch Running ..Although i do see what you are saying about how they are not “Hurting” for outfielders and how he was good as gone and they have other guys under more control, i see the brewers making an attempt to be in the playoff hunt .With that being said, wouldn’t you want to upgrade as opposed to down grade starters?.. But wouldn’t you rather have Aoka in your lineup everyday than a platoon of Halton and Francisco? I see them definitely attempting to make a playoff run with a young team. Aoka down the stretch is more valuable offensively , defensively and on the base paths than the platoon.
Aoki would have definitely have been better than a platoon, I did not think that y’all got fair market value. To bad g/m do not read these boards, make the fans happy within reason of payroll you get more fans in the seats.
The Brewers already do a pretty good job of getting fans into seats, the issue is their disastrously bad TV contract.
I think the brewers are going to be hurting this year to get fans in the seats, the team hasn’t done anything this winter and who wants to see a cheater and liar on top of it
Which team doesn’t have a PED user and which user hasn’t lied about it?
I don’t think that most Brewer fans care about Braun anymore. They just want to see the Brewers win. Besides, attendance at Miller Park has almost never been an issue.
According to melvin the tv contract is 21 million. Ny times said 31 million. Thats about the same as dbacks who have similar attendance and are adding payroll.
The problem was that same TV contract was considered horrible before and everyone railed on Wendy Selig-Prieb for it but they renegotiated it and it didn’t get much better even with a Playoff Appearance and increased attendance as a negotiating tool. Not sure if there’s anyway to milk more from that deal but Fox seems to be criminally underpaying for the Brewers deal.
My point is if the dback can manage with a similar tv contract, why cant the brewers? Why are they adding payroll and we are cutting?
Because the Dbacks have a much larger market and don’t share the southern part of their market with the Cubs?
Larger market but similar revenue, attendance, and tv contract.
You have to work towards earning money as an owner with the shared owners. There was only Morneau whom I could taken as a signing, but how do you pay him what the Rockies can offer for him with his career? He’ll likely bat 60pts better there than in Milwaukee which when that 2yr deal is up likely nets him a career ending 2-3yr deal worth 2-4mil more per year because of those 60pts in avg.
Why commit to maxxing the payroll every year if the player acquired doesn’t help the team all to much long term? Or near term?
Why are we cutting? I don’t see it all that much as cutting, as I do the available FAs to add don’t fit the team’s needs and/or are too expensive to add long term.
2014 will be the performance seasons of Davis, Gennett, Thornburg, Nelson, Smith, while adding further where they stand: Gallardo, Peralta, and Segura.
Next season as it is stated w/o options being picked up the payroll has a lot of flexibility. To add FAs if needed or not if the names mentioned provide security in the 25man.
Cutting as in payroll is going down and we certainly arent spending any money to get better.
Im glad you are sold on these cant miss prospects we have in the works. Im not as convinced. Morris hit .247 with a .310 obp and struck out 3 times as many times as he walked.
Scouting reports indicate he has a problem with his approach and work ethic.
Thornburg’s aaa era is above 5 and hes projected as a #5 starter or reliever.
Davis might pan out if he can start hitting lefties. ..though hes old for a prospect. Hes already at his prime.
hopefully gallrado figures out where he lost his velocity and effectiveness.
We are putting way too much stock in the hopes all the guys you named will over-achieve.
If they don’t we will be back in the basement with the cubs.
What’s the point of drafting and developing your picks if when they finally reach the Big Club, you don’t give them a chance to stick?
I don’t know how well Morris will do didn’t even mention him in my reply.
I believe in Thornburg being effective, you’re worried about his 5+era in AAA last year but ignore his under 4ERA the year prior in it.
I am worried too about Gallardo and his velocity but that is why I like the Aoki trade even more because Smith has SP ability along with Nelson I think if Gallardo funks the Crew can actually put Yo in the bullpen and not miss him now.
Im doubtful smith and/or nelson would equal a healthy gallardo at this point in their careers
I really like Aoka. I think he is great defensively and can get on base, steal some bags and stretch a long single into a double better than most of the guys in the Majors. i would have extended his contract for 2 or 3 years. Tyrone taylor and Victor Roache’s ETA is two or three years away so just as Aoka (Who will be in his mid-30s by then and more than likely declining in speed which would affect his baserunning, stealing and defense) is coming off the books, They have two guy who are highly regarded prospects ready to be given an opportunity to start.
I’m happy with the move. Smith has the shot to be a #5, and if he doesn’t earn it, he’s going to be a valuable Bullpen piece for the next 5 seasons. 1 Year of Aoki isn’t worth more than the 5years of Smith.
I love that the Brewers got Wil Smith with 5years team control for 1 last year of Aoki. I will roll the dice with Davis because Smith’s roll on Milwaukee should equal Aoki’s impact. Anything from Davis is a bonus..and then every year after 2014 with Smith is added bonus.
Smith better be one heck of a pitcher. Aoki was a very good outfielder and I agree they are putting too much faith in davis.
Gindl opened eyes last year too. He’s got a stroke and body type very similar to a young Matt Stairs who blossomed in his late 20’s into a big power bat. If Davis stumbles out of the gate look for Gindl to see playing time in LF. Halton’s an option there too.
Who didnt have their power bat blossom in oakland in the 90s? He prolly had a locker next to canseco
Depends what you expect as a heckuva pitcher. It would appear as a #5 SP he may be of 4.5ERA territory. Now he’s 6’5″ so bodyframe you’d think he can go 185IP or more if given 30+Starts. Is that good for Aoki? What if Milw got 3 years out of Smith with those numbers? I’d say so.
As a RP, his stuff must play up and if he can consistently come out of the Bullpen with 3ERA or better, being Lefty mind you, That is awesome get for Milwaukee for Aoki.
While there may be too much faith in Davis, what is real about him is the power in his bat. When you look offensively at a player via OPS Davis’s Slg projection around .465 makes him just being Replacement level with OB to eclipse what Aoki can get with OPS. And if he does better than Replacement level…being .310 He’s far better than Aoki when it comes to OPS.
You gotta look at it as 1year fall-off between Aoki to Khris(if there is any) and the 1yr+ gain in Swingman/RP Smith. If Khris Davis is 1WAR less than Aoki but Smith is 1WAR better than the RP he’s taking over the trade is equal this year with every year after Smith adding to the win in trade for Milw.
My only problem with all of that is why do we assume, as brewer fans that aoki would be gone after this season. There is such a thing as re signing a guy. Hes a good rf and a very good 4th of.
I think I would have explored putting braun at 1b or leaving him where he is and keepig aoki. If you recall most of brau s errors at 3b when he came up erre of the throwimg variety. I think we gave up on him as an if too soon.
Whats done is done now. We just need to add a real 1b now.
At the same time, how long can Aoki last at the ML level? He pounds the ball in to the ground and beats out a number for hits, but age slows one down and or injury which without his speed you take his batting approach at .285/.350 and it becomes .235/.300. And again you have Davis,Shafer along with Taylor/Roache/Haniger coming up. There needs to be playing time for Davis/Shafer the Gindls and Haltons to figure out who sticks on the 25man in a year or 2 and who needs to be waived or traded.
I guess there are teams that opens doors for young guys and hope they perform and there are teams that make the young guys force open those doors by performing.
Then there are playoff teams and non playoff teams
Depends what you expect as a heckuva pitcher. It would appear as a #5 SP he may be of 4.5ERA territory. Now he’s 6’5″ so bodyframe you’d think he can go 185IP or more if given 30+Starts. Is that good for Aoki? What if Milw got 3 years out of Smith with those numbers? I’d say so.
As a RP, his stuff must play up and if he can consistently come out of the Bullpen with 3ERA or better, being Lefty mind you, That is awesome get for Milwaukee for Aoki.
While there may be too much faith in Davis, what is real about him is the power in his bat. When you look offensively at a player via OPS Davis’s Slg projection around .465 makes him just being Replacement level with OB to eclipse what Aoki can get with OPS. And if he does better than Replacement level…being .310 He’s far better than Aoki when it comes to OPS.
You gotta look at it as 1year fall-off between Aoki to Khris(if there is any) and the 1yr+ gain in Swingman/RP Smith. If Khris Davis is 1WAR less than Aoki but Smith is 1WAR better than the RP he’s taking over the trade is equal this year with every year after Smith adding to the win in trade for Milw.
Been a pleasure chatting with y’all for the last hour, have a great day.
I’m starting to think a Michael Young signing for first base wouldn’t be that bad.
he has been great throughout his career. will get some HOF discussion eventually. I’m not saying he is a HOF or Is NOT but he sure will be talked about when his time comes. Sure, he is well into his 30s now and is clearly not as good as he was 5 years ago but he is still a well above average defender at 3B, 2B and now 2B even if he no longer is up for Gold Gloves and he can still get on base for you. I have always liked Michael Young a lot.But at this stage of his career i hope you have a Plan B for 1B because I do not see him lasting 162 games. he will prob be on the DL at some point and he will get his days off to rest. between those two things, i hope you have another guy capable of holding down 1B for 40-80 games.If you are referring to the Brewers, I guess a Halton and francisco platoon would pass for that 40-80 game period.
He’s not a Hall of Famer. That’s the discussion.
I emphasized that I NEVER SAID HE WAS or WAS NOT . But what I DID SAY was that he will at least be talked about when he becomes eligible.
I really don’t think he’ll even be in discussion. He was a great player in his prime, but he fell several years short of having a Hall-worthy career. Biggio had a far better career than Young and he won’t get in until multiple years of eligibility have passed. I doubt Young ever sniffs it.
No kidding. Biggio should have gotten in this year over frank Thomas….. I think young will get considered. I think he was great for enough years to get consideration
A-Rod unfortunately along with Bonds and Clemons was a Hall of Famer without steroids.But they took them, got caught and will probably never get in
Are you one of those people who think Roger Clemons and Barry Bonds and Sammy Sosa are not HOFrs? If so then I disagree with you on Clemons and Bonds and agree on Sosa. I believe that with the steroid guys you need to find out when they did them and when they did not. Clemons and Bonds were HOF caliber before steroids. Bonds probably would not have hit so many Homers and Clemons probably would not have lasted as long, but if you take out the years they were on steroids they are still HOFers. Sosa on the other hand was an average player before he started doing steroids. This is why I believe Clemons and Bonds are Hall of Famers and Sosa is not.
I typically don’t differentiate between the two. That’s a pretty subjective way of deciding who gets in and who stays out. The voting is already a huge joke; might as well make it as easy as possible for those boneheads.
i agree that it is a joke. the hall of fame was supposed to be for the best of the best of all time. Cy Young and Bob Gibson types, in more recent years there have been guys who have gotten in who are only half the player Gibson, Koufax, Mantle, Ruth, Cy Young etc. were
Casey Kotchman, mark Reynalds, jeff baker, michael Young and Travis Hafner are the best FA options left out there for 1B. I would have to say this would be the order from best to worst of how much they would be worth to the Brewers: Young, Raynalds, Baker, Hafner, Kotchman
Here is the evaluation: vs LHP Here is how they hit (Best To worst in 2013 exception of kotchman because he only appeared in a handful of games in 2013 so i basd him off of 2012)— baker, Young Reynalds, hafner, Kotchman
vs rhp—-Young, reynalds, Hafner, Kotchman, Baker
Defensive evaluation- Reynalds, Young, Kotchman, Baker,Hafner
For a platoon your best bet is: Baker vs LHP Young vs RHP
For a starter: Young
For enough of an upgrade to make it worth it: none.
There isnt a forum for this and i want to see what people think so im putting here. Are you one of those people who think Roger Clemons and Barry Bonds and Sammy Sosa are not HOFrs?
If so then I disagree with you on Clemons and Bonds and agree on Sosa. I
believe that with the steroid guys you need to find out when they did
them and when they did not. Clemons and Bonds were HOF caliber before
steroids. Bonds probably would not have hit so many Homers and Clemons
probably would not have lasted as long, but if you take out the years
they were on steroids they are still HOFers. Sosa on the other hand was
an average player before he started doing steroids. This is why I
believe Clemons and Bonds are Hall of Famers and Sosa is not.
You miss one of the things when voting for HOF…player integrity and what they did off the field.
For cheating and lying they all get F’s. So no HOF
Breaking news: there are all sorts of liars and cheaters in there. Heck, they’re going to put in LaRussa. I can’t imagine having less integrity than him.
what they did off the field should mean nothing. Mantle was an alcoholic off the field , does that mean he should not be in the HOF? …. If the player was HOF caliber while not on steroids/ PEDS then he should get in. if he is HOF caliber with the steroids but not without then he should not get in.
Drinking alcohol doesn’t enhance your performance, therefore it’s not cheating, therefore don’t bring that up. To me, a cheater’s a cheater. Yeah, I agree Bonds and Clemens were going to be HOFers without the steroids, but they did a lot of damage to the game of baseball through their cheating and lying. It’s obviously a subjective call, but in my eyes bringing them into the HOF is a slap in the face to the integrity of the game.
Yeah melvin no 1b were available. Just morrison, davis, morse, valencia, morneau, loney, mcgehee…. with more rumored to be available. Carp, moreland, middlebrooks.. and that’s just off the top of my head. All of which are better options than betancourt who u better not even think of re signing. Geez, even fielder was available. Loyal brewer fans deserve better than this. You and mark a should be ashamed
When did Valencia,McGehee,Middlebrooks become 1b options? Being 3bmen.
All 3 could play 1b. Middlebrooks could be moved to 3b full time next season when ramirez is gone and morris may be ready. Mcgehee has played a fair amount of 1b
Middlebrooks hasn’t logged 1 professional inning at 1b. He’s struggling with his bat and you believe moving him to 1b where he’s going to have to learn how to play won’t affect his batting while doing so? Rather then spending 1-2hours in the cage he’ll be spending 1-2 hours on the field fielding grounders, taking throws and probably learning where he should be on the field in different circumstances.
Valencia is a RHB in a Platoon not an everyday starter when the majority are RHP.
And McGehee? His last 3 years in the Majors was about as good as Yuni Betancourt, where is he an upgrade from even Juan Francisco?
I believe Young will be signed to play 1b when it’s all said and done. Probably in week 1 of Spring Training after seeing the in house 1b bat some live pitching. Either they’ll look good enough to remain 1b options or Young will be given a 1yr deal probably in the 8mil-11mil range spending about all the available funds you believe as cutting payroll.
Actually he has 9 innings at 1b. Whoopie, I know, but hes a young athletic 3b. He can play 1b. And yes he struggled but even while struggling and getting only 300 some abs he still managed 17 homers and still has loads of potential.
Mcgehee was just another example of available 1b options. Over last 3 years he hit 45 homers in limited abs – more than yuni and will carry a better obp and play a better 1b. Even so, just a stop gap measure and a sign melvin is doing something.
Valencia is a platoon guy.thats correct.
I listed 10 guys and there were/are probably 5 more available and u have a problem with 3 of them?
When did Valencia,McGehee,Middlebrooks become 1b options? Being 3bmen.
Late to this conversation but I hope to see anybody but Juan Francisco starting at 1B (unless of course it’s Yuni B).
I wouldn’t mind a Juan and Halton platoon at all.
I think the Brewers screwed up in the Nori deal. They should have kept Nori in right, moved Braun to third, and Aramis to first.
Braun was moved to the OF because he can’t play 3B. He turned himself into a very good outfielder. That was never going to happen. Aoki’s a nice player, but he’s in his 30’s and was going to get expensive after this year. They badly needed a lefty arm and Smith could turn out to be a steal.