There’s been plenty of buzz about the Orioles’ poor start to the season and the impending free agency of Manny Machado, with seemingly countless reports connecting Machado to various teams throughout the league. The Cubs have been perhaps the most oft-cited match for Machado, but in a radio appearance on the Mully & Hanley show on 670 The Score, president of baseball operations Theo Epstein scoffed at the very notion that there’s any serious market taking shape for Machado at such an early juncture in the season.
“I understand it’s natural for people to connect the dots and there to be this kind of frenzy from time to time, but it’s honestly something we’re looking at and just rolling our eyes at,” said Epstein. “It’s not like July, where every now and then there’s lots of coverage on deals that are actually being discussed or actually might happen. This one is just out there in fantasy land at this point.”
Addison Russell, in particular, has been an oft-suggested component of Machado trade scenarios (FanRag’s Jon Heyman suggested that match last week, for instance). But Epstein noted that when he sees rumors that appear to be “hyper-focused on one player and if there’s essentially nothing to it,” he’ll typically pull the player aside and explain as much in a one-on-one conversation. While he didn’t outright say that he’s done so with Russell, Epstein strongly suggested that to be the case, and Russell himself told The Athletic’s Patrick Mooney over the weekend that he’s paying little heed to the chatter. Elaborating further, Epstein described the amount of trade discussion that’s taken place so far as “essentially nil.”
There’s been no shortage of rumors pertaining to Machado, though the connection with the Cubs has always been a fairly obvious one. Machado was, after all, reported to be a target of the Cubs this offseason, and Russell was said to be a potential component of those talks all the way back in December when Baltimore initially began fielding offers for him.
There’s no recent precedent for a trade of this magnitude taking place in May, and it’s even rare for such transactions to take place in June. The White Sox’ acquisition of James Shields in 2016 is the most recent example of an early-June swap of any real significance. Russell himself was traded from Oakland to Chicago in 2014’s Jeff Samardzija blockbuster, and even that July 4 swap was an uncharacteristically early agreement for a deal of such import.
In a similar vein, recent reports indicating that the Rangers and Royals are preparing to gauge trade interest in their current assets suggest that such processes are only in the nascent stages. It’d be a surprise if the Orioles were drastically further along in the process, if for no other reason than the fact that most teams have not yet plotted their deadline trajectory.
Most clubs, to this point, are focused on the upcoming amateur draft, after which they’ll begin to truly assess whether they’re interested in acquiring assets, selling them, or utilizing players on their current big league roster to address other needs. (Increasingly, there are active teams at each deadline that don’t fall neatly into the traditional “buyer” or “seller” categories.)
There will undoubtedly be teams that don’t make that final determination until even the day of the deadline. Last year’s Twins, for instance, acquired Jaime Garcia from the Braves in late July, only to lose six of their next seven games while the Royals and Indians went on prolonged winning streaks. Minnesota ultimately traded Garcia to the Yankees just six days after acquiring him and also shipped closer Brandon Kintzler off to the Nationals.
All of that is to say, it’s highly improbable that a clearly defined market for Machado will come together at any point the near future. Perhaps a team with an obvious need on the left side of the infield will bowl the Orioles over with an offer earlier than most would expect, but history gives little reason to expect that to happen until the calendar flips to July.
A Machado trade to some team, of course, feels inevitable at this point. But while the Cubs stand out as a plausible on-paper fit — just as they did throughout the offseason — Epstein’s comments bluntly indicate that such speculation won’t come to fruition for quite some time, if at all.
And Goodbye leverage
How so? Epstein said the right things.
Epsteen is posturing. To think he doesn’t want Manuel Machado is ridiculous. To think the Orioles would accept a package containing Addison Russell is pure stupidity.
Cough it up Epsteen – you want a pennant right?
If the Dodgers were in playoff race, would they be in these trade-talks? Seager’s out for the year, and Kershaw ‘s in a potential contract-year. Dodgers should be in, on the trade-front for Machado.
Who knows,? Maybe Dodgers’ 22-27 record, actually provides them with more leverage. Sorry, I see more Dodgers’ than Cubs, in these hypothetical Machado trade-talks. GM smokescreen.
Good point- but perhaps the Brewers or Rockies have the talent in their system to make a deal?
Rockies need a 1B or a corner OF or a catcher far worse than a SS. Unless Trevor Story is part of the return for Machado. I could get behind a Story, Murphy, Senzatela for Machado trade. It would push for the Rox to get their first ever division title and clear space for Brendan Rodgers in 2019. It could also allow for resigning LeMahieu as well.
That package could probably be bettered by another team though.
In that division everyone’s in the race, minus the Padres of course.
Why?
The only team the padres haven’t been near equal to or better than in the west is the dback and look at them now
West is weak right now it’s anyone’s game
Funny-Funny stuff. Padres..hahaha
Nobody’s running away with the NL West. Dodgers have somehow managed to remain a factor for Machado. I agree, they may be going strong for Machado while Epstein gets a manicure.
I suppose they could be in on it, and they have a little wiggle room under the tax. Maybe they are waiting a month to get salaries paid off a bit. I believe they have about $18 million to play with. .
As a cubs fan I would love it if LA made a move to go back over the penalty threshold this summer and screwed themselves heading into next off-season.
That said, outside of the Cardinals, an NL West team seems like the best fit to me.
As a LA fan I was ecstatic that the cubs signed Darvish. I like huge bloated contracts on their payroll.
Um The Dodgers spent the last few years brand building by taking on massive contracts. They don’t have the funds to cover the contracts and went deep into debt. The company that owns then is footing the bill. Now the Dodgers are trying to get more in line financially with the rest of the league and they simply can’t afford any big contracts. The Dodgers holding company has a very long term plan, but criticizing any teams financials as a Dodgers fan is laughable at best.
You keep telling yourself that. The only reason the Dodgers are under the tax is because the penalties have would have been really huge if they stayed over again. Re setting back to no luxury tax penalty puts them in easy position to spend big this offseason. Take off you orange and black glasses so you can see reality. It has nothing to do with debt
That is not at all true. They spent a TDL brand building to get fans into back to the stadium that much is known. Which is where they took on a majority of there egregious contracts sans Colletti. If you’d like discuss the so called egregiousness of the middling 50M type contracts be my guest, but I don’t think anyone is going to spend their time on. It might cripple a middling market, but not one pulling a 300M+ annual tv contract and 4M+ fans beyond all the extra income sources.The simple fact is the majority of the debt was set by the courts. Which quiet honestly was negotiated into the tv contract, which like all billionaires will be set to be paid off without spending their own money. I know other teams weren’t happy about their pay in’s to rev sharing program as the % was extremely favorable before and after the new CBA. Especially the in the new iteration of the CBA. So sure if you’d like to believe they couldn’t afford blah blah blah be my guest. But in all reality the plan was made clear from the get go. They were going to take on the huge expensive contracts to shed themselves of long term commitments,buy prospects, and give themselves a chance to contend/get people back to the stadium while attempting to build through the farm. Which they followed and never deviated from. In a market like LA that’s important to note especially seeing as how the fans essentially forced McCourt out and rebuilding wasn’t an option. Did they lose money? Sure, from the aspect that owners weren’t putting excessive amounts of revenue back into their pockets, but in reality they didn’t. The reason they weren’t able go over the threshold was pretty simple, they destroyed their rev/debt ratio on one time expenditures to exploit a loophole in the former CBA. Out of the grace period they weren’t going to do the same as it was undoubtedly a league mandate and they weren’t going to face the consequences of mlb action. Plus it doesn’t hurt that the loopholes were closed in the CBA. So let’s please try again with facts and be a bit more informed.
Without the sweeping generalizations. This feels like a prime discussion with PadsFan.
Given today’s market, it really isn’t huge or bloated. Cubs own a printing press, and are printing their own currency.
Like the Dodgers can’t do the same
1. I don’t take it as a given Manny gets traded. The Orioles are below their historical salary ceiling and will be even further below this off-season. They have money to play in the ‘Manny sweepstakes’ so taking a chance by holding on to him is a distinct possibility.
2. I see 9 teams, impacting 5 division races, registering interest, in no order Cubs, Cardinals, Dodgers, D-backs, Braves, Phillies, Astros, Yankees and Red Sox. Manny won’t come cheap in a trade or free agency.
3. On timing, the Orioles have a potential move to make once the Manny situation is resolved. If Manny is moved, I’m figuring the O’s retain Adam Jones and work to re-sign him.
4. Based on performance this year, Manny offers approx. an additional +6.2 in WAR if traded now. By the trade deadline it will be less. You could say, “Who cares in the long run?” but the market will care because only contenders will be in on trade talks. Some of those 9 teams may no longer be contenders by July 31.
Take the Yankees off that list.
Trading Machado doesn’t mean the Orioles can’t re-sign him. They aren’t making the playoffs this year so his last 2 months of control really have no value to them while the prospects Machado would net in a trade do. If they want to keep him they should try to do what the Yankees did with Chapman.
Why would he want to waste his best years in a baseball black hole of misery?
LAD nor the cubs or Yankees or redsox will AQUIRE Machado. I would write why but it will take to long
And since you didn’t say why every one ignores you and assumes you’re a child not capable of dimensional thought.
Being able to succintly state your argument is an invaluable skill. The best comments on MLBTR, IMO, include details to support their arguments, yet aren’t 250+ words. The least you can do is try.
I have this thought that no one trades for him and he turns down a qo
that would be a very Orioles thing to do
Starting to get the feeling that this will happen myself.
ngl, i would put money on it.. the same goes for britton, jones, etc. i feel like they will hold on to jones since he is the face of the franchise, machado cause they wouldnt like the return, and britton due to relative underperformance making no teams willing to take the risk.
Machado will be traded but just for a little more than JD. Machado is a pure rental and the price for those has been established. He will fetch a little more than Martinez but that is do to the multiple positions he can defend at a high level. This is why Baltimore is playing him at short.
He will be traded because the value of the team get from the player turning down a QO has dropped. Machado will get traded for a little bit more than Detroit received for JD due the defensive value of Machado.
How has the value dropped for the Orioles if he turns down a QO? They wouldn’t still get a pick after the first round just like they always would have in the QO system.
Ricketts told Epstein “I’m not signing a player like that so don’t give up anyone you need next year.”
Ricketts doesn’t involve himself in baseball decisions. He said Theo runs the team, and he backs whatever decision(s) he makes. Theo has an endless wallet, as well.
He will go to a team that will offer him a deal next year ….
He’s not signing an extension unless some team wants to just offer him $400MM+ in July/August. He’s going to be a 26-year-old free agent, which is virtually unheard of. He’s a pure rental unless the acquiring team utterly shatters Giancarlo Stanton’s current $325MM record.
Of course, Bryce Harper will also be joining Manny Machado as one of those “virtually unheard of” 26-year old free agents this offseason. The Cubs figure to be strong contenders for either next winter where one of them may join yet another another one from December of 2015 in Jason Heyward (ouch).
It would take an incredible offer to make him sign an early extension
Cubs need pitchers, not more hitters.
Cubs need their pitchers to perform better. The talent is already there, I don’t think they need to go and acquire any more pitching. Except bullpen help, every team could use that.
It’s all about improving… cubs technically need more help with pitching, but if there really isn’t a deal might as well improve in other areas. And to the guy above there’s really only Cubs, Dbacks, Cards, Brewers, Dodgers in the Machado stakes. AL contenders would have to massively overpay (especially AL east) and there is tons of options for bats this deadline. I think the cubs need to bank on improvements from Yu, Chatwood, Quintana and more consistency offensively. The defense is there, the offense is solid, bull pen is good enough (but injuries happen and technically anyone could use 1 arm for depth) but SP needs to improve. If they are still hanging near other NL central teams and the offense stalls, I think they instantly become favorites to trade for him. But cards, Dodgers, Brewers all have more to give likely than cubs. I really think people need to relax is what Epstein is saying. It’s end of May, there’s almost 2 months before they really need to make that decision to trade for help or stay the course. If the last 3 years says anything, the cubs will trade for a couple guys minor or major, to improve quality or give depth to get through summer.
And why I don’t think the Braves or Phillies will trade for him is cost. They are still doing a marvelous job rebuilding and you don’t make a move like this until you are in go for broke stage of rebuild. They might be starting to get towards that. Another team I could honestly see trading for him is Nationals. They desperately want to win, and could have him at SS and move Turner to 2B if Murphy is hurt or OF until Eaton is healthy. I don’t know how much Baltimore will be aching to help Nats, but it’s more likely than Braves or Phills.
Justacubsfan: You gave yourself away when you suggested the Nationals. Peter Angelos feels the Nats have invaded his market and his revenue stream. Angelos would sooner send Machado to the Korean League than to Washington. He would be sending his fan base a short distance down Hwy. 95. In your terms, imagine St. Louis was 40 miles from Chicago and the tv deals, etc. reflected 2 teams with substantial fan overlap. Then picture the movement of a superstar from 1 team to the other. Or imagine the Chicago teams competing in the same league. If that weren’t enough, the Nats have a guy named Bryce Harper with a contract to think about. Washington could try for Machado in free agency if Harper were to bolt. But it would be a monumental bidding war.
Philly and Atlanta are realistic destinations for Machado. More than Milwaukee. You’re misreading the state of their respective rebuilds. Look at the standings.
If I look around the league the only fit I see is te Dodgers, only if they turn it around…Cleveland, but only if they can beat out….the Cardinals…who have questions about the roster moves to make but as for as prospects they have the Os covered better than anyone but the dodgers maybe…but like I said have to turn it around and find a trade to get under the luxury tax…will the Cardinals do it?
You do realize the Indians are pretty set at shortstop.
He also plays third base…and don’t say he doesn’t want to play third…he will play where the team who traded for him ie. The Indians, tells him to play…I’m sure he won’t mind if it’s a contender
Theo Epstein would have been a little more convincing with his scoffing of the Manny Machado rumors had he omitted those last three words from his public statement. (insert eye roll here).
I personally don’t see the Cubs as much of a match. Baltimore needs pitching, and a lot of it. The Cubs are incredibly thin in terms of pitching depth after putting an emphasis on their offense, which is why they went after Darvish. Trading away any of their top pitching prospects is really going to hurt them in the near future, pitching depth doesn’t get replenished overnight and there’s only so many times you can sign a free agent to cover that gap until you are stuck with a rotation of aging, declining pitchers on large contracts
A Machado trade is not inevitable. Remember who the owner of the Orioles is, along with his fellow incompetents running the team. The Orioles are going to over-ask and no one will bite. Manny will finish the season as the Orioles shortstop, and they’ll get a compensation pick for him next year. I have no confidence in the management of this team to make a trade.
He’s better off trying to sign him outright when he’s a free agent. That’s why he’s saying it laughable, because it is laughable to try and trade for him. Why give up a huge haul and then still have to (potentially) give up a ton of money to try and sign him?
………he’s not suggesting he isn’t interested in obtaining him, but for that price…..forget it. The O’s have no leverage.
They dont need him and probably cant afford him anyway. Don’t break up their core players for a rental. Not worth it.