The Chicago White Sox are in agreement with international free agent Norge Carlos Vera, per ESPN’s Kiley McDaniel. The deal won’t become official until the opening of the new international signing period on July 2. Vera will collect a $1.5MM signing bonus. The deal would leave the White Sox with just under $3.9MM to spend on international free agents, per Baseball America.
Vera is a 19-year-old right-handed pitcher out of Cuba who threw for scouts in late September, hitting as high as 97 mph on the radar gun, per Fangraphs’ Josh Herzenberg. He’s a slim, easy-action righty whom evaluators peg as equivalent to a second round talent. There aren’t a ton of statistics available for the young righty, but a reel of side sessions can be viewed here.
For the White Sox, this represents just their latest foray into the Cuban market. Recent history on the Southside is cluttered with successful Cuban imports, from current mainstays Jose Abreu and Yoan Moncada, to Alexei Ramirez, to Jose Contreras, the winning pitcher in game one of the 2005 World Series. Contreras went 3-1 that postseason for the World Champion White Sox, including a complete game (one of four consecutive for the ChiSox) to punch Chicago’s World Series ticket.
id mention how this is a lottery ticket, but i trust CHW’s judgement after scoring big on Robert
I think scouting has gotten better, along with advanced metrics. If he is indeed a 2nd-round talent, this is a pretty good deal. Plus, the Sox have a history of being better evaluators of pitchers than hitters.
Really? Carson Fulmer must be ready to pay huge dividends this year.
Chris Sale is chuckling.
@louwhitakerisahofer, what about:
– Mark Buehrle (helped us get a WS)
– Chris Sale (Yoan and Kopech)
– Jose Quintana (Eloy and Cease)
But go ahead and pick on the one that has yet to succeed.
Since when does better mean perfect? And name me one team that has had all of their first and second round draft picks work out, even in the past 10 years.
Robert hasn’t done anything yet, seems a little early to say they scored big with him. By the All-Star break you can most likely make that claim!
Robert is going to be a good player! He is very similar to Moncada. Those two guys are going to be special for years to come.
Moneyballer, Pecota projections beg to differ 4.5 WAR in his rookie year. Time will tell.
I’m hoping to make that claim before the end of May!
Every domestic amateur draft pick and young international signing are a “lottery ticket” to some degree. That said, I’d invest in a quick pick for Michael Kopech, Luis Robert, Nick Madrigal and Andrew Vaughn as the current top prospects in the White Sox system. The first three should all figure prominently in the fortunes of the White Sox 2020 season while Vaughn should do likewise in 2021.
I trust it because Cuba is the only place they seem to locate and find talent.
But I’m also wary of most pitchers coming out of Cuba. The pitching there has been down for years.
They’re overdue! The White Sox did well with two Cubans, José Contreras and Orlando (El Duque) Hernández in their 2005 rotation.
Only $1.5m bonus. IDK about the salary.
Sounds like a good deal!
Similar signing bonus to what a 2nd round domestic draft choice would receive these days.
Love the move. Now let’s hope we see a trade….Madrigal and Cease for Arenado!
Not nearly enough for Arenado. Think Kopech, Madrigal and more…
Mmm he has an opt out so his value is diminished w that uncertainty
Kopech is coming back from Tommy John though. Wouldn’t it be wiser to take Cease?
No
@Dorothy_Mantooth, although you’re a saint, i have to ask why you think Nolan is worth so much more? Keep in mind that he can opt out in 2 years and his OPS outside of Coors is .866 – which is great but not elite (like his home OPS of 1.000+). Elite defender too but take him out of Coors and he’s not a top 5 player like we think he is.
Pass on arenado. Keep the prospects break the bank for mookie
Please, no! That would be one of the dumbest things they could do. Arenado’s OPS outside of Coors, both for his career and last year, is about 200 points lower than at home. The glove would translate, but he’d be a slightly above average hitter with a great glove getting paid like a superstar at a position where the White Sox already have a blossoming star in Moncada.
If Moncada and Giolito continue to show last year is their new norm, attempting to extend them is much wiser. Paying a single position player 30+/yr is lunacy unless you are one of the deep pocket clubs. That sort of coin and prospect capital would be reserved for acquiring an ace on a team going the wrong direction.
Why does everyone want to punish players for hitting well in great hitting environments? I think it has been sufficiently proven that Rockies hitters that aren’t already on the downswing like Cargo and Tulo hit just fin with new teams. Look at Matt Holliday and DJ LeMahieu and Andres Galarraga. Even older guys like Larry Walker and Dante Bichette had virtually the same OPS+ the 2-3 seasons after they left Coors.
@hiflew, ok, let’s assume you’re right. White Sox can either spend $234M on Arenado over the next 7 years (and this is best case, assuming he doesn’t opt out after just 2 years), but at the cost of causing a deep downgrade grade at 2B, displacing their rising star at 3B, and losing a promising young pitcher who won the MiLB Pitcher of the Year Award in 2018. OR they could keep those guys and spend that kind of money on Springer or spend a little more and get Betts, losing just a compensatory draft pick and displacing the only below-average hitter in their lineup in Mazara.
And your argument about those guys is flawed. Look up stats by location. For any stadium in which he had over 50 PA’s, Galarraga’s OPS was at least 75 points higher in Denver. For Holliday, he loved playing in Miami, but otherwise, it was at least 100 points higher in Denver than elsewhere (again, with at least 50 PAs). I’ll grant LeMahieu, but his game was never predicated on power. And keep in mind these are differences over their next favorite commonly played stadium, not home/road splits, which would be bigger. Stadium matters, and you’re fooling yourself if you believe Coors’ thin air doesn’t help hitters.
Finally, if it’s “punishing” a player to bring up relative facts, then yes, let’s all “punish” Arenado. But to not bring it up is akin to saying Luis Robert had 1.001 OPS last year and not mentioning that it was in AAA, not MLB. There’s a difference, and there always will be. I’m not saying Arenado sucks, but I do think he’s seriously overrated and that other teams won’t get the same guy if they trade for him.
Sox Park is a good place for hitters. Arenado will be just fine on the south side
Stop with the Nolan Arenado White Sox rumors. They are preposterous on so many levels. Arenado would be an unnecessary and expensive luxury on a team that already has a budding MVP candidate at 3B in 24-year old Yoan Moncada.
Acquiring Arenado for the likes of SP Dylan Cease, 2B Nick Madrigal or any other top White Sox prospect is equally ludicrous. Cease is a potential TOR who just might make a leap similar to the one Lucas Giolito took last season, especially with new veteran catcher Yasmani Grandal mentoring and ‘framing’ for him. Madrigal will be the White Sox core 2B beginning this season, one who looks to be a perennial AL Gold Glove and Batting Champ contender in the not too distant future.
Aaron, I also think Cease and Madrigal are too much to give up for a couple years of Arenado. Locking up Moncada and Giolito need to be offered fair long term deals.
The Sox can ill-afford trading prospects. This team has to be accentuated with vetted free agents which means ownership needs to give it up.
38 years of treating a major market team as a class A affiliate is enough.
The Sox can ill-afford trading prospects. This team has to be accentuated with vetted free agents which means ownership needs to give it up.
38 years of treating a major market team as a class A affiliate is enough.
The Sox can ill-afford trading prospects. This team has to be accentuated with vetted free agents which means ownership needs to give it up.
38 years of treating a major market team as a class A affiliate is enough.
For what Arenado is scheduled to receive in the last 6 years of his 7 yrs/$260M contract ($207M) the White Sox could lock up Moncada, Giolito, Cease and Madrigal thru their arbitration eligible seasons and perhaps even 1 or 2 years of their free agency.
The White Sox could also allocate those Arenado dollars as a huge down payment toward a Mookie Betts FA contract next offseason. RF is the one position on the White Sox with less future certainty than any other going forward.
Jeez CHW, Yiddi Cappe next?
oscar colas seems more likely. i think cappe has a handshake agreement with miami
I had no idea teams could officially agree to IFA deals now for the next IFA period (July-2020). You usually see a slew of deals on the first day of the new signing period..perhaps they were all agreed to well in advance and not announced? I’m surprised more teams don’t take advantage of this loophole and sign IFAs well ahead of the new signing period.
They do. And they haven’t “officially” done anything. The move was not announced by the team, as it can’t be until July 2.
You are absolutely correct. It should also be pointed out that Vera was technically eligible to sign in the current 2019-2020 period but most teams have already used up their allotment of dollars including the White Sox. The current POTUS administration also made signings more difficult by reversing the Obama-era United States-Cuba détente.
It’s an open secret that these deals are agreed to well before July 2… sometimes as much as 2 years in advance. IFAs can’t sign until the July 2 after they turn 16, but it hasn’t stopped some teams from talking to 14-year-olds.
This guy looks good.
He will headline the second wave of talent around 2023
Who are they trading to get that wave?
Because it certainly isn’t coming through drafting and player development.
Who to look at for the 2nd wave?
SP Vera, Thompson, Dalquist, Guzman
C Mendoza
IF Rodriguez, Sosa, Gladney, Ramos
OF: Bush, Beard, Bailey
All listed are 20 and under and show promise
It’s certainly enough if he opts out; the White Sox have no business making that deal anyway…trading away the pitching is bad news.
Norge Carlos Vera will join another prominent Cuban prospect in the White Sox system, SS Yolbert Sanchez who signed a $2.5 million bonus at the beginning of the current 2019-20 international signing period this past July. Sanchez immediately became the best shortstop talent in Chicago’s farm system and is currently ranked as their #21 overall prospect. Vera will likely join Sanchez in the next updated White Sox top-30 prospect list later this summer.
To Mr. Jerry Reinsdorf (or relayed through PR representatives),
AJ Reid is implicated through public investigative work to have participated in the 2017 Astros cheating scandal. With sincerity, I ask you to please communicate to him that a public apology for his actions is necessary or to remove him from the White Sox organization at your earliest convenience.
Thank you,
Rallyshirt
Dear Mr. Rallyshirt,
The latest reports of the Astros sign stealing scandal are now alleged to include 2018 and 2019 in addition to their 2017 World championship season. During 2017 and 2018 A.J. Reid compiled 9 PA’s with the Astros and never collected a hit or walk. If anybody owes an apology it would be Reid to the Astros.
Thank you,
AaronSapoznik
LOL Well played, Aaron.
Dear RallyShirt,
Quit being so soft.
Sincerely,
Your family and friends
It looks the White Sox are solidifying their farm system to be a competitive team for the next six to eight years.
Once Robert, Kopech and Madrigal graduate this season, they will have a bottom ten system.
They need to do a lot more work and prove they can hit on guys who aren’t drafted in the top ten or given record-breaking signing bonuses.
It’d help, but I’m not sure it’s truly necessary. With improved scouting, first-round picks seem to be better than they were in the past. And international signing rules have changed, limiting the money that can be paid, so that can’t happen anyway, regardless of the talent. It’s usually the premium talent that makes the biggest difference, not the guys who are drafted in the 10th round to be #3 pitchers or middle relievers.
The White Sox still have a high draft pick this up coming year along with developing guys they drafted to international signings in the last two years. One guy we should keep an eye on is Konnor Pinklington. He had a good start in single A but he struggled in A advanced, however, he came in the organization after being a top starter in college and the Sox want him to work on his pitching. People need to give Hahn a little credit with the trades, draft picks and international signings he has been making in the past three years.
I’ll give Hahn credit for the trades.
His drafts and international signing record is terrible, to say nothing of player development.
“farm system to be a competitive team for the next six to eight years. ”
You sound like a Cub fan. Get real.
What, are the Sox drafting 8th graders ?
Your comment literally makes no sense. A player drafted or signed today won’t likely won’t reach the majors for another couple years. The team then has 6 years of control left.
Per James Fox of The Athletic on Twitter (@JamesFox917):
Source: In addition to Norge Vera, the WhiteSox also have interest in Cuban OF/P Oscar Colas in the upcoming international market. The club should have just under $6 million to spend in the upcoming period.
That source could be ESPN’s Kiley McDaniel who also mentioned this in his report link with this article.
So how much international money will the white Sox have after this signing? Just under $6 million or $3.9 million ?
Math isn’t my best subject. That said, I have the following equations for your answer to the White Sox 2020/2021 international bonus allotment question:
$5.4M (White Sox pool allotment) – $1.5M (Vera bonus) = $3.9M (remaining balance for Colas, etc.)
OR
$6M (White Sox pool allotment) – $1.5M (Vera bonus) = $4.5M (remaining balance for Colas, etc.)
Note: The $5.4M figure comes from the ESPN Kiley McDaniel article link which he estimates was the approximate amount of the White Sox 2019/2020 or current international signing bonus allotment. James Fox has ‘estimated’ the White Sox 2020/2021 allotment at just under $6M. Using both those figures as criteria, their balance after signing Vera at the beginning of the next period on July 2nd will be somewhere between $3.9M – $4.5M.
Correction note: James Fox is the Senior Editor @FutureSox. James Fegan is the White Sox reporter for The Athletic. They are both terrific!
A guy from Cuba signing with the White Sox. Who would had think it?!
I like the way the beige socks have been making moves this off season. Next year they could be favorites for the central with the veteran adds. They also have a lot of prospects moving up and young ML players developing
What a beauty! An old Norge.
The Sox can ill-afford trading prospects. This team has to be accentuated with vetted free agents which means ownership needs to give it up.
38 years of treating a major market team as a class A affiliate is enough.
You should probably do a little research next time… From 2006-11, they were top 5 in payroll 4 times. The 2 years they weren’t in the top 5, they were #12 and #7. In 2012 and ’13, they were #11 and #8.
Then Hahn made a little splash with free agent signings but injuries to bad signings hurt the team for a few years but Hahn made some bold moves with trading away Sale, Frazier, Eaton and Quintana in an one year period to put the White Sox in this position right now.
Good job with the signing. Though from here on out, Hahn would be very wise to quit trading away int’l money. I would hate to see them lose out on a great prospect because they meaninglessly gave away int’l money (ex. Castillo trade).
Yes, please stop with the Arenado rumors. In fact, also stop with trying to trade Madrigal before he’s played a game for the Sox. What’s the rush in trading him? Why don’t we see what we have in him before trying to trade him?
I concur
For all the myopia chirping about Madrigal,
I have 2 words.
Dustin Pedroia
At some point, people need to accept who Madrigal is.
Anything is possible, but there is nothing in his profile that suggests he is going to have even average power.
And that’s fine, so long as he hits for average and continues to improve his walk rate. But he is no Pedrioa, and certainly no Altuve.
Everyone is just a couple of bangs on a dugout garbage can from Altuve,
or
Is that your garage door opener taped to your chest?
If you really have been paying attention to the White Sox for the last 10 to 15 years is that then organization does not like signing free agents to big deal after having two big years before hitting free agency. Certain players don’t perform well after getting that pay day. The White Sox want guys looking to win and not looking for a pay day. The market does put prices high on a guys like Grandal and Kuechel but players like that help a team full of young talent.
A more accurate statement is that the organization doesn’t like signing any players to big deals.
They still haven’t signed anyone to a guaranteed deal of more than $100 million.
Nice pick up.
At least 2 years away from the Majors.
Equivalent to a second round draft pick of a College pitcher.
Back to 2020.
With a recent debacle of Dodgers trades, the White Sox should make a move on the Dodger’s Stripling. Let him compete for a starting position or put him in the Bull pen.
Forget Stripling’s age (30) right now. We’re talking about a young arm when it comes to baseball life. Heading into spring training, Stripling only has just 52 starts and 387 big-league innings on his right arm. We’re watching a late bloomer grow, and he can’t hit free agency until after the 2022 season.
Dude looks like a young El Duke. Absolutely take a flyer on Stripling, he was pretty dominant for the majority of the past 2 seasons when starting. Beyond Giolito, Kopech & Keuchel our rotation is pretty meh.
We have Cease, still young with potential, We have Rodon coming back, Dunning had huge potential but injury delayed it, Lopez….still decent…can be 4th/5th starter. And farm system has some good ones that can excel.
I like where we are.
I concur
For all the myopia chirping about Madrigal,
I have 2 words.
Dustin Pedroia
A $1.5MM signing bonus is a BARGIN, look at Thompson’s signing cost in 2019.
International free agent Norge Carlos Vera will collect a $1.5M signing bonus. Vera is a 19-year-old right-handed pitcher out of Cuba who threw for scouts in late September, hitting as high as 97 mph on the radar gun, Vera is a slim, easy-action righty whom evaluators peg as equivalent to a second round talent.
Vera was listed at 6-foot-4 and 185. He’s lean and long-limbed, with broad shoulders and a lanky lower half. It is a plus frame for a teenager, one that oozes physical projection and projects to be able to put on weight as he matures. He has a simple delivery that is fairly slow-paced and while he occasionally alters the rhythm and height of his leg kick, he maintains solid direction throughout.
As a 2019 point of reference:
Matthew Thompson, WS’ 2019 2nd Round (45):
Cypress Ranch H.S. (Cypress, Texas)
Right-Handed Starting Pitcher
Age 18
Bats Right
Throws Right
Rankings
Baseball America 49
MLB 69
FanGraphs 86
Matthew Thompson has a relatively slender frame (6´3´´, 184 pounds), but with his long arms, certainly has plenty of physical projection. His fastball currently tops out at 96 mph, but typically runs in the low-to-mid 90s. He possesses an easy, fluid delivery, throws from a high three-quarter slot with electric arm speed which provides a bit of deception to an otherwise straight fastball, and shows great feel to spin the baseball.
Matthew Thompson, RHP, 6-2, 185, Cypress Ranch HS (Tex.)
Status: Signed
Bonus: $2.1 million (Slot was $1,650,200)
Assigned: AZL White Sox
If Vera is about a 2nd-rounder, then $1.5M vs $2.1M is small in baseball terms. That’s about a guy on a minimum deal. The bigger thing is they basically got an additional 2nd round pick. I like the deal, but more because of the player they got than the deal relative to other 2nd-round picks.
Howcome this guy doesn’t show up here?
m.mlb.com/prospects/2019?list=int
Does he make the top 50 international list?
Try again. He’s in there at #4 now.