Major League Baseball has proposed expanding the postseason field to fourteen teams in collective bargaining discussions with the Players Association, reports Jesse Rogers of ESPN. That’s hardly a surprise, as Commissioner Rob Manfred has publicly advocated for expanding the playoffs (reportedly preferring a 14-team setup) going back to last year, when the league and MLBPA agreed to a 16-team playoff during the shortened 2020 season.
Under the proposed format, the top seed in each league would receive a bye — as is the case with the NFL’s current structure. However, Rogers adds that MLB’s proposal would allow the other two division winners in each league to choose which Wild Card team they’d prefer to face in the first round, which would take the form of a three-game series. The division winner with the second-best record in each league would have its pick of any of the four Wild Card clubs in its league; the final division winner would pick to face one of the other three Wild Card teams; the two Wild Card teams remaining would face one another.
The league has long been expected to prioritize an expanded playoff field in collective bargaining talks. An increased number of postseason games comes with an associated uptick in gate and television revenue, an obvious appeal for ownership groups. The effects for players could be more mixed. While some players could stand to benefit from increased playoff shares, Rogers notes that the MLBPA is concerned that an expanded playoff field could reduce the incentive for teams to aggressively try to bolster their roster.
A broader playoff field increases every team’s odds of getting into the postseason, and front offices may find the greater odds a disincentive to upgrading their roster via free agency or trade. Small-sample postseason series have an inherent high level of randomness. It seems the fear among some on the players’ side is that teams could be satisfied to build a slightly above-average roster (which would stand a much greater chance of making the postseason in a 14-team field than under the current 10-team system) and hope that a hot streak can carry them deep into the playoffs.
MLB, on the other hand, contends that the first-round bye would offer such a significant advantage to the teams with the best record in each league that very good clubs would remain motivated to improve. Meanwhile, the expanded field could offer a greater incentive for teams with mediocre rosters to add short-term impact, since the proposal would significantly increase those teams’ chances of getting to the postseason at all.
Rogers notes that the expanded playoff proposal has been on the table for months, but he reports that MLB recently put forward a new suggestion: a lottery for the top three amateur draft choices. Rather than setting the draft order as the inverse of the league standings — as is the current setup — this proposal would introduce a weighted system that injects more randomness into the process. Teams with the worst records would still have a greater chance of securing higher picks, but any non-playoff team would have a chance at a top three selection.
That offer is in response to players’ concerns that the current system rewards teams that orchestrate long-term rebuilds with perennially high draft choices. Of course, it’s not entirely clear that a weighted lottery would serve as much of a disincentive for tanking, since teams would still have higher probabilities of top picks with worse records.
Rogers’ colleague at ESPN, Jeff Passan, shed some further light on CBA talks this afternoon. Passan reports that the league recently offered a slight raise over the luxury tax thresholds set in the 2016-21 CBA. That’s a turnaround from the league’s earlier efforts to tie a lowered tax threshold to a soft salary floor, an offer the MLBPA rejected. It’s not clear how high the league is willing to set the thresholds, though, and Passan adds that the league’s willingness to raise them might come with associated stiffer penalties for exceeding them. Unsurprisingly, the MLBPA expressed concern that’d counterbalance high-spending teams’ willingness to surpass those thresholds.
Passan further reports that MLB has expressed openness to a “minimal” bump on the league minimum salary, which sat at $570.5K in 2021. MLB’s offer also included the introduction of the designated hitter to the National League, an on-field alteration widely expected to ultimately be put into place. Passan offers an in-depth breakdown of the labor dynamics that is well worth a full read for those interested in the topic.
The current CBA expires on Wednesday at 11:59 pm EST. It’s widely expected that the league will lock out the players if no deal is agreed upon at that point, a move that would come with an accompanying freeze on major league transactions. (Players who were not on a major league roster last season could still sign minor league contracts with clubs, Passan notes). Jon Heyman of the MLB Network tweeted this afternoon that while there’s been “incremental” progress between the two sides of late, there’s “basically no hope” of a deal getting done within the next 48 hours. That reality has been reflected in the flurry of free agent activity we’ve seen in recent days, as many players and teams have been highly motivated to lock in deals before the expected MLB transaction prohibition.
Dumb, if there’s 162 games in a season at least make them mean something
Hey, Mike Trout might make the playoffs after all!
That’s really the point of expanded playoffs… to get casual fans to watch good players in the playoffs. Nevermind that the team Trout plays on is undeserving of a playoff spot, but let’s give them a shot anyway in the postseason!
The NBA has 30 teams and 16 teams make the playoffs. The NFL has 32 teams and 14 teams make the playoffs. I don’t think the MLB proposal is that out of line. Brings more money and more viewers to the game. Long term would likely have a positive financial trickle down effect to salaries.
The NBA sucks, and 12 out of those 16 playoff teams have zero chance to win anything but a participation trophy
I agree with you on the chances of most NBA playoff teams having any sort of a realistic chance. I knew my team (the Mavs) had a low probability of advancing past the first round. Yet my wife and I went to a NBA playoff game & had an absolute blast. To me, it’s a fun atmosphere.
I also went to Rangers playoffs games back in the 90’s when they were playing a loaded Yankees team. My dad, brothers, and I had a blast at those even though we knew the Yankees were going to kick our tails (which they did).
I can’t get enough playoff atmosphere. Can see why some people think more teams is a joke, but the stadiums are always packed and electric. Brings the game more money to help fund higher salaries and also gives some fans a reason to stay engaged longer throughout the year.
My original point is NFL, the NBA, & hockey all have much more teams in the playoffs every year. MLB is a laggard when it comes to playoff opportunities. The current gap is pretty substantial compared to other professional sports.
No. It wouldn’t. The owners want all the money from expanded playoffs to go in their pockets. That is why the players union already said NO!
And in a CBA situation there is no trickle down. Its either agreed to or it doesn’t happen.
No
Yes
So…how about no.
I guess 2021 was my last season following baseball, thanks manfred!
I’m guessing you said that when they changed the intentional walk rule too.
Baseball will miss you. This message board will miss you. You’ve given so much, and asked so little. I’d say please don’t go, but you are a strong person who is passionate about his principles, clearly, so why fight it. Go, be free, and Godspeed.
Well considering staying the same has caused baseball’s numbers to plummet over the past 15 years, doing something different might replace you with more people. I think they can live with that.
You’re not going anywhere & you know it
Boo.
What a load….half.teams.in the playoffs, really?
Boo…
What idiots.
Almost every other sport operates this way
What other sport has 162 games?
It’s amazing to mean these simpletons go to is but every other sport.
The season is too long. If they had a proposal where they shortened the season to 144 games or something, i could maybe entertain expanded playoffs. But thats an impossibility. So thumbs down to more playoffs.
And your point ?
The NHL should probably shift away from pucks to balls because almost every other sport operates this way.
This is totally not worth it
You can have a subpar team go to the World Series
Like the Braves.
The Braves beat three teams that won at least 95 games and they have won four straight division titles. They were only “subpar” because of the ridiculous number of injuries they had to deal with. They played .667 baseball for the final two months of the season.
@baseballpun I know you’re a butt-hurt Nats fan who hates the Braves, but sub par teams don’t win the World Series. They would’ve gotten stomped if that were the case. You look like a dolt every time you post.
I like the bye proposal. I don’t think the division winners get enough of a reward for winning out over 162, and this would help that a bit. LAD and or SF get a first round bye this year? (I’m no fan of either, so this isn’t homer talk..). I think they deserved it. The season they had, they should get a bye. This makes the lesser teams work harder to get to the finish line, thus slightly diminishing the “random hot team wins WS” probability.
The bye doesn’t really matter though, cause all it does it let them skip straight to the 2nd round…. which would just be the division series, which is right back where we started. The byes just mean the two best teams don’t have to play in the new, extra round they are adding into the whole setup, so they’re not really gaining all that much. If anything, the 3rd division winner is losing out the most here, cause they go from a guaranteed spot in the DS to having to play a 3-game wildcard spot. No playoff team really benefits from this setup.
It’s worth it in terms of $$$ though.
Cash is king
if a “bad” team beats a “good” team then was the “bad” team really worse than the “good” team? sometimes that can happen, but if you win the WS that’s a lot of times to get lucky.
Let’s be honest, Manfred just wants the Yankees to sweep the Twins every single year.
happened in the division era (73 mets, 87 twins, for example).
happened in the wild card era too (06 cards, for one).
Ok thoughts on this one? I think it’s more balanced for both sides. Maybe make it a 12 team playoff bracket (idk how though) and work along those lines, add the DH raise the lux tax and raise the minimum player salary slightly? That’s my two cents
Two teams from each league would get byes. There’s your 12 teams
Yeah, 6 teams, bye for best two division winners. Division winner with worst record and three wild cards seeded 1 to 4, three game series. Two winners play on road against two bye teams five game series. NLCS stays seven games. That is forty percent of teams in playoffs, more detracts from post-season.
Stupid, stop ruining the game.
take it as long as upper threshold is $240 million or higher and lower one higher than $90 mil.
another step in manfred’s quest to turn baseball into hockey
I don’t like the Idea for MLB, but the NHL playoffs are the best show in pro sports.
They are a blast to watch. For reference, 16 teams make the NHL playoffs. 32 teams total.
Baseball has the lowest percentage of major league sports teams make the playoffs. I love the atmosphere of playoff baseball.
So corny and unnecessary, balance the schedule is 168 games, then just have 1 play 4 and 2 play 3.
We literally just saw how these playoffs became last man standing type events, worst quality of playoffs in a long time. Absolute greed and scumbaggery by Manfred and nothing else.
I like inter league games. Could have 15 teams play eleven games against all 14 other teams, or 154 games. Then have four games against each of two teams in other league. So 162 total. Two divisions would work well if they ever have 16 teams in each league, but probably not in the next few years.
Players don’t want a balanced schedule because it makes the travel even worse. The unbalanced schedule is more a quality of life concession to players than anything.
Not a fan.
Expanded playoffs into November is factoring in projected global climate warming I suppose. But the 1 game winner- advance WC game needs to go and the 162 game season needs to mean something.
i mean cmon now, this isnt about physical climate. its fiscal climate. M. O. N. E. Y. money.
I don’t see it helping anything. People will start saying “Its just the playoffs” Why would they want to devalue baseball. STUPID!!!
It would be better if they got rid of the wild card.
You need one wild card if you keep three divisions. You could have three division winners and the non-division winner with the best second half record to keep it interesting.
Ask for 14 and maybe agree on 12 which sounds like a good compromise. The 2 division winners with best records get a bye, the other division winner plays the WC team with the worst record and the other 2 WC teams play each other? Just thinking aloud…
Agree but no one game series, three should be minimum so you cannot have edge having one good starter plus trash.
JOKE !
That completely waters down the product but picking an opponent is kind of fun.
Even picking an opponent would be kinda lame. Teams are just going to say we picked them cause we think they are best and we want to beat the best.
Eff this. The league deserves a lockout if this is the kind of drivel they’re proposing. Midwits will say “but don’t you want to watch more baseball???” We shouldn’t reward ‘just ok’ teams with a playoff berth. Go back to one wild card.
Knowing how stupid Tony Clark is, he’ll take this deal in a heartbeat and call himself the hero that saved the season.
Until he leaves some gaping loophole in a different area that owners exploit; and then he will complain about it for the duration of the contract because he wasn’t paying attention.
Clark: “Wait, what do you mean there was a clause that allows for teams to pay players in scratch-off tickets?”
Players: “Paragraph 1, Line 1, sir.”
Manfred thinks he’s running the NBA. What’s the point of playing 162 if you’re going to let about half of them into the playoffs? I will never watch baseball again if some stupid sub-.500 team who has no business of even getting a whiff of the playoffs ends up winning it all because Manfred wants the playoffs to be, “Anything can happen”.
This idiot may be a great businessman, but baseball isnt just a business and he’s destroying it little by little with his dumbassery.
It’s just a business, though. The owners will lockout or the players will strike, and neither will care one bit about your passion for the actual sport… because it’s a business.
Every other major professional sports has roughly half the teams making the playoffs…
@CursedRangers – You said “Every other major professional sports has roughly half the teams making the playoffs:”;
Maybe this will put it into perspective.
Number of games in a regular season:
MLB: 162
NBA: 82
NFL: 16
NHL: 82
MLS 34 (placed here solely for comic effect)
The repeated argument that “Every other professional sports team has roughly half the teams make the playoffs so MLB should do the same” is bad “logic” because those other leagues have MUCH less games in which they may display their competitive competence, or lack thereof. If MLB is going to expand the playoffs, they should correspondingly reduce the number of regular season games because the expansion of the playoffs theoretically greatly reduces the importance of the regular season. And I, as a long-time baseball fan, do not like a scenario where there is less baseball. I recognize using that logic means I should embrace a post-season which includes more teams. Again, the expansion of the playoffs greatly reduces the need for and a competitive value of a 162-game season.
MLB should understand that “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” and leave the playoffs alone. Their tinkering is ruining what made MLB so great.
MLB is broke though. It’s losing fans and doing little to attract new fans. I get that baseball was/is a brilliant game that took off in the 1800’s. If all of society used your short sighted, can’t think outside of the box, approach of ‘if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it’ we’d all still be riding horses. I know it’s hard for stubborn people to accept change, but change is good. But I do appreciate you letting me know how many games baseball plays every year. That was a really valuable insight.
@CursedRangers – There’s a big difference between the development of technology and the rules of a game. You extrapolated my approach to the management of the postseason into a silly and exaggerated direction it was never intended.
You might also be well served to know sarcasm is a weapon of the weak, and apparently the insecure as well.
This proposal is to the benefit of owners, not players. It’s additional TV revenue for clubs. Meanwhile, the “slight” increase in the luxury tax will amount to a cut based on inflation, meaning the two items taken together will further increase the clubs’ share of revenue while decreasing the players.
In other words, they’re not making any progress.
It benefits both the players and the owners. Look at how the owners are spending money. They make money, and then pay bigger salaries to the players so they can make even more money. This is the strongest MLB has ever been, yet fans want to say Manfred is ruining the sport. That makes no sense.
It makes perfect sense if the argument can be made based on facts.
The same way a really good commissioner wouldn’t be able to make the CFL bigger than the NFL is the way a bad commissioner wouldn’t be able to ruin the MLB, doesn’t mean he’s doing a good job or that fans can’t criticize him.
The league itself has its own trajectory and momentum that no one single man, not even the commissioner can impact.
Are you suggesting David Stern didn’t impact the NBA? He took the sports overseas, which MLB will need to do to stay afloat. Interest in spectator sports is way down among young Americans. Generally speaking, most Americans don’t follow sports at all. That means MLB and the other sports will have to come up with creative ways to expand their audience. The NBA created a blueprint that MLB will soon follow. David Stern’s influence. A sports league commissioner.
As for facts, the financial aspect of MLB is on the rise. The sport is not being ruined by anyone.
Not suggesting that at all, merely suggesting that the sport, the players, society, economy etc are all bigger factors than the commissioner.
Michael Jordan did more for the game than David Stern could ever dream of. My point is simply that because baseball is financially healthy right now that is not a direct correlation to job performance from Manfred. The game has never had younger, more exciting super stars playing within the same generation.
I tend to give more credit to Ohtani and Verlanders of the league for growing the game vs any suit. Manfred is the guy at the Ferrari dealership picking out colours and options, there’s only so much he can improve and only so much he can ruin it, regardless it’s still going to be a Ferrari
Fair enough. But since the game is on an upward trajectory, it’s foolish for anyone to suggest Manfred is ruining it. Who is he ruining it for, a bunch of cranky old fans who want to live in the past? News flash to those fans: The game of baseball will be around long after you’re gone. You are not irreplaceable.
Yeah what a sin it is to make money if you are a business owner. Shame on you owners!
I don’t mind 14 teams. If anything I think it makes teams on the bubble want to push vs give up. If you know your team can’t make it then it’s easier to sell and align for next year.
Plus, more fans engaged in baseball in September is a good thing, no? I don’t care is a mediocre team makes the playoffs, I want to be invested in my team after labor day. More butts in seats equals more money for everyone.
Expanding the playoff field will be great for the game’s growth. More teams having a chance at the post-season will lead to fewer lengthy rebuilds that screw fans. It will also mean fewer empty seats in the second half of the season when teams are hopelessly out of contention. These days, competition for our entertainment dollar is greater than ever. In order for the game to continue growing, both sides need to be receptive to change. Otherwise, baseball will fall behind due to inaction.
If they go down this route they have to reduce the number of games, so the regular season becomes less important.
That being said I hate the sound of that and don’t like the idea of expanded playoffs
A compromise could be a more dynamic schedule, have a balanced schedule majority of the year then maybe the last month of the season schedule teams to play eachother with playoff implications on the line. This way you still get 162 games but teams that don’t make the playoffs play a couple exciting, playoff type games down the stretch.
Teams with the bottom 10 records with 30 games to go play for the #1 pick etc. best record from that bunch gets #1, second best #2 and so on. Like a draft playoff. Make those teams games mean something and eliminate tanking!
Great idea. That fits in nicely
14 would be a disaster. Why not aim to win 85 every year and hope you get hot like the Braves. This isn’t the NBA – playoffs are a crapshoot.
I think 12 would be fine – would much rather stick w/ 10 — where the first round is best of 3 and divison series move to best of 7. That’s a lot more playoff games and keeps the regular season meaning something.
because if you aim for 85 and dont get hot it doesn’t matter, or you aim for 85 and then end up below that because of injuries. people say the current setup is too much yet there is meaningful baseball played every September for almost every playoff spot.
No. It works fine now. Heck it worked fine with four teams. Two were too few.
A third of the teams is more than enough. Almost half? Give me a break!!!
I don’t like 14 but just to spitball. Why not make the 4-7 teams basically an nba style play-in?
7-6 (one game)
7/6-5 (one game)
7/6/5 – (have to beat #4 team 2x)
The upside is yes, more teams technically make it but it would be 4 wins in 4 days for a 7 seed and 3 wins in 3 for the 6, etc. Nobody is going to want to be these teams and their odds of advancing are very low. Big incentive to at least be #4 as well.
i would imagine logistics are a consideration, and, again, the almighty dollar.
This is stupid. Why do they even consider such incredibly stupid ideas. You play 162 games, and then almost half of major league baseball players another bunch of games?
That is stupid, children. Stupid.
$$$$$$$$$$
Further expanding playoffs is absolute trash and yet another ploy by the owners to avoid paying high salaries to superstars. Next thing you know every team will be in the playoffs, NHL style.
Avoid paying high salaries to superstars? Have you been paying attention these past few days? Owners are investing a boatload of money in players, so of whom aren’t even all-stars. The more money the owners make, the more money players will be paid in the future.
The best way to get the players their $ is to give everybody on the 40 man roster a 10% pay increase if they make the playoffs.
The way they’re doing it is working better. Why should a player’s earning power be hindered by the performance of his teammates? No good player would ever want to sign with a bad team.
Just another money making scheme from owners and players of MLB.
Agree. And who would do the choosing when playing the wild card teams? The owners? The managers? If the owners do it, possible collusion and corruption opportunities. Let the numbers decide, not greedy owners.
This is full indication that we’re getting a lockout. The way the playoff picture is perfect. Don’t fix it if it ain’t broke. Just get rid of the man on 2nd in extra and 7 inning double headers. Personally I’d love to the nl to never get a DH. It was only a matter of time before that happened though unfortunately
If they want a 14 team playoff structure, give all 3 division winners byes. The 4 wild card teams can play the standard, 1 game, winner take all series. There would just be 2 of them.
If the goal is to have more playoff games on tv, make the Division Series a 7 game series instead of a 5 game series. I’m not a fan of a 3 game series for Round 1 at all. How would the travel work? It would probably have to be played all in the same park, so the team with the worst record wouldn’t see any home park revenue. They can’t make it a 1-1-1 series, as that would stretch it to a 5 day series due to travel. Bad idea.
I would like if they just left the playoff teams as is, and made the wildcard game a best of 3. Like you said play all 3 games in the home ballpark. No travel.
Team with better record gets the first two games at home as reward for having the better record. Team with worse record has to earn their home game by winning on the road but gets the deciding game of the series at home. Or flip it. Doesn’t have to be alternating home games for a series.
The Dodgers won 106 of 162 games and their entire season came down to a 1 game WC game. I hate that. No more 1 game series.
That’s never happened before. And they can change that by eliminating divisions and just having the 4 top teams make it, which is what they should do.
A three-game series at the ballpark of the team with the better record would be incredibly exciting. TV audiences would be glued to the screen and new rivalries would emerge. It would be like the first few days of the NCAA Basketball Tournament. Wall-to-wall baseball but better because teams wouldn’t be eliminated after one loss. Fans would plan their vacation days around something like that. The whole thing would last four days and make the sport a ton of money while generating enormous interest in the game. Why would a baseball fan not want that?
Or make it like NCAA. Four wild cards go to city with best wild card record. First day wild card one plays wc4, one game. WV2 plays WV3 one game. Winners play each other and then you’ve have five game division series with three division winners and the one wild card team.
The owners are back baby!
I like it. more teams playing meaningful games later into the year is generally better for business. if they don’t belong they lose early. if they don’t lose early than did they really not belong? yes, the regular season does matter if you want to have a favorable road to the WS and homefield advantage. teams want that, plain and simple. dont like it, dont watch the low seed play. id rather have the choice, personally.
In a small sample size any team can beat a good team. The long season removes any small sample size out, which minus a few exceptions, ensures bad teams are not playing in the playoffs
Yuck. No thanks.
Seems like we all hate it. Wonder if the players will hate it ?
The players will hate it unless it allows them to make more money…then they’ll love it!
Yay…..we’re medicore!
Then the NFL and MLB would both play on Thanksgiving.
Or, MLB can mirror the NFL’s schedule and play 17 games a year! Yay stupidity!
Or, the owners, who I usually side with, can stop using this as a force tactic they know won’t be approved to leverage a lockout.
Just leave the game ALONE
Why? There is untapped money out there for the sport to make. Why shouldn’t they go after it?
Traditional baseball fans are weird. The sport is finding ways to thrive like never before and they want to put a stop to it. Weird.
Additionally, the owners aren’t putting the money back into the sport at near the same rate at which they’re making it, and that’s just clean profit, not including interest on that money which is a multiplier.
Bottom line: this has a ripple effect on all future MLB players and fans. But what will happen is that fans will lose even more interest as MLB attempts to mirror other sports, and they won’t be drawing interest because youth will still be drawn more to ….you guessed it – other sports.
Are the owners Manfred works for paying their players more money than ever before? Yes or no.
In a lockout do players get paid?
Nope.
So this is why the Mets and Rangers spent so much.
“Middling orgs.” The Cards finished with a better record than the Braves. smh
They also went 1-6 against ATL this year. Georgia gang rise up!
I like the 14 team playoff structure. It should help incentivize winning. So many more teams will be with a shot. Having said that, I wouldn’t want to expand the playoffs at the expense of the length of the regular season which is where this may be headed.
Kind of defeats the purpose of a 162 game season. Plus aside from from the team getting the bye the other 6 teams there very little difference other than an additional home game between winning the division and the wild card. There should be more incentive to winning the division which is one of the reasons why the wildcard game was added. Manfred always trying to change the game and make something it is not.
Clown Town
Hate this idea.
How does allowing a team to choose it’s opponent in the playoffs do anything positive for either competitive or labor relation purposes? Let’s be honest, the concept had to be based around the idea of letting high payroll, large market teams that typically end up with better regular season records because they can afford depth pieces equivalent to small market teams’ regulars the option to avoid playing a team like the Rays have been the past two years. Thereby enhancing the chances that large market teams make deeper playoff run to guarantee a higher floor of prospective TV viewers for the playoffs to make the league and owners more money off of TV deals. Expanding the playoff field is also a means to have more leverage in negotiating TV contracts for the leagues playoff games as well. I don’t think that maximizing potential profits during the playoffs is a bad thing in and of itself but expanding the pool of teams waters down the competition a bit and allowing teams to pick opponents makes a mockery of competition.
A lottery for the draft and a three game wild card series are both pretty good ideas though so I feel like this is a step in the right direction and gives me more hope that the season will start as scheduled in the spring after the seemingly inevitable lockout.
Mets might finally make the playoffs.
Nah.
Expand from 30 to 32 teams and then have four 8-team leagues. That would allow a change back to a 154-game regular season. From there, they should be able to figure out post-season play to make up for the lost games and still make things shorter than than it currently is.
We are heading toward expansion, although MLB doesn’t seem ready for it. They likely first want to get a new CBA in place. Existing teams also don’t want to share TV revenue with the new teams and also don’t want to expand until the situations in Tampa and Oakland are fixed. Can’t expand to new cities if those two teams go there. That’s why I think MLB will first increase the postseason to 12 teams, and then they’ll increase it to 14 teams when they expand to two new teams. I don’t like it, but it’s coming.
I do hope they go away from the unbalanced schedule. As a fan of an AL East team, I’m tired of playing the same teams 19 times each.
@rob. Just what baseball needs more teams to dilute the MLB talent. Almost every club has a few to half a dozen or more players who should be in AAA instead of active roster spot on a MLB team. What MLB needs is contraction of a couple teams to increase the competitiveness.
Diluting the playoff field doesn’t make teams more competitive. Just look at the NBA.
The NBA has experienced enormous growth in recent years. The proof is in the money players now make. Next up for MLB will be more games played in foreign cities a la the London Series. There’s a lot of money to be made in introducing MLB to a global audience that will include global TV money. In a few years, Americans will go on European vacations and see the locals wearing Soto and Tatis jerseys. That will be great for the game, just as it’s been great for the NBA.
Yeah, culture of mediocrity. Baseball is trying its hardest not to be the best sport despite efforts to keep it that way.
Then how do you explain the game making money like never before in its history? The old days were not better…in anything.
@CeyHey- “Then how do you explain the game making money like never before in its history? The old days were not better…in anything.”.
Really? Money is not the only indicator of how good a business is operated. Values are important too. 40 years ago teams didn’t have an annual special day at their ballpark to pridefully and publicly celebrate the most popular perversion of the day. In that regard the “old days” are way better than the current “we’ll openly and proudly support any deranged behavior in exchange for the greedy “more money” attitude. Some things are worth much more than the money you seem to value so much.
Making more money because there are more people, prices are higher and they have enormous television contracts. It’s not apples to apples, and I’m not arguing the old days were better, but there’s no good reason to water the sport down.
The argument referencing other sports is fallible because they aren’t better by any measure. If your only measure is money, than that’s a poor perspective.
More playoff teams will generate interest in more markets. That’s not a bad thing. Like any other professional sport, Major League Baseball is a business. That makes money the proper perspective. What would be a better way to measure it?
This will only lead to more innings limits, rest days, and abbreviated starting pitching outings.
Literally no point in wasting your guys in April and May when almost half the league makes the postseason.
Or in September if you’re not competing for best record and have a playoff spot locked up.
Remove interleague play except for the obvoius exceptions aka Mets vs Yankees or Whitesox vs Cubs. Decrease games to 150 and increase the number of playoff teams to 12. 3 division winners in each league get a 5 day bi. Top 3 next best records are wild card teams with the two lowest records do bo1, then winner plays the highest in a bo3
Or just don’t change it at all.
Yes no change at all I agree. Expanding makes the 162 worthless. If they want to expand, maybe just turn the wildcard game into a best of 3 playing three days straight. But leave the playoff teams at 10.
Such an objectively horrible idea.
Oh yeah pick your opponent. How cool. While we’re at it, How about the 2 wild card teams hold a draft and take the 25 best players between them and make a super wild card team to compete.
Id watch that. The ultimate small market revenge series.
Like the first round of the NCAA hoops tournament.
MLB Playoffs are all about who gets hot at the right time. Expanding the playoff picture only makes the regular season worthless. All teams would need to do is hover at .500 and hope. Why spend an extra $50-$75Million to improve a few wins if you can back into the post season and ride the tornado?
You made the exact point why the players (heavily influenced by Boras) oppose the proposal. People need to just relax and let it play out
Exactly. And I think this also means less trades at the deadline since more teams would be hovering around that 500. I hate the expanded playoffs idea, as you said really makes the 162 worthless.
Here’s my proposal…
– 12 teams in the postseason
– Go back to two divisions per league
– Give the two division winners in each league a first round bye and have four wild cards per league
– Have the four wild cards in each league play a best-of-three wild card round with the winners advancing to play the division winners in the Division Series
You need an even number of teams in each division for it to be fair, it works with 32 teams but that is a decade or more away.
It’s really not that unfair with that many wild cards. One division would have seven and the other would have eight but the next four best records in each league would all get in.
I’m not sure what MLB wants in total out of these negotiations. I’m sure the status quo is at the top of the list as MLB’s share of the revenue pie has increased and players’ decreased while revenues have exploded, but there are two other items they seem to be shooting for here: Expanded playoffs for the additional gate and TV revenue and the establishment of an international draft. Both are about money through increased revenue and controlling costs. On the latter, MLBPA has shown time and time again they will sell away the rights of their future members, so I can see them giving that one up. Hopefully they hold out for something worthwhile, something they haven’t done in the past. The expanded postseason is a big one, so they should be able to get a few choice concessions if they hold their ground.
For the most part, the MLBPA is not going to change everything in one agreement. They need to do what the owners did, which is to slowly chip away and redirect things over the course of a few CBAs. Get the ship pointed in a new direction.
It does seem the owners came forward with some legitimate ideas this time. Increasing the luxury tax threshold and having a lottery on the first three draft picks. Directionally it”s good, but it’s pretty weak too. Not unexpected. Start low and negotiate from there. For whatever reason, the players have never tried to index the luxury tax thresholds to growth in player salaries. Great for the owners; bad for the players. A lottery for the top three picks is too little. Have a lottery for the top ten picks. The players need to get to free agency sooner and increase the minimum significantly. I don’t believe they’ll accomplish all of this, but they need to begin to change the framework. Let’s see where this goes next.
At the minimum, at least the owners have come forward with something the MLBPA can begin to react to and provide counterproposals.
Great post RobM
162 should mean something. I’d honestly prefer it if they just had division winners in the playoffs (maybe 1 wild card team). Then play a round robin format to see who wins the pennant in their respective leagues. Everyone has to play everyone. 1 game at home, one game away. Every playoff team is guaranteed the same amount of home games as everyone else (minus the World Series). World Series would be a traditional best of 7 series.
I hate all of this. It’s all garbage. It all stinks. They need to just leave the game alone because with Robbie in charge they can only mess it up.
A week off in the NFL is a godsend for teams and players to regroup and get healthy. A week off in Baseball means the odds of the teams with the best records in each league going home after one round increase exponentially.
Baseball is not the NBA/NHL. It doesn’t need half of the teams in each league to make the playoffs. The Baseball season is already six months long, add another month and a half for playoffs and by the time the World Series ends it’ll be time for spring training.
Manfred does not like baseball, he wants to turn it into one of the other sports. always trying to reinvent the game. They want to speed things up then add a pitch clock.
Nope. Playoffs are already watered down with the extra wild cards.
No word on all DH yet?
I read they had made progress on non-critical issues, including the DH. The word progress indicates a change, meaning the Universal DH will happen.
I think the universal DH will ( and should) happen
But that could simply mean they agree one way or another and check it off and no longer need to talk about it.
But you are likely right
Here is an idea that I have never seen. Food for thought.
1- Go back to 2 divisions per league.
2- Division winners get a bye
3- 4x wild cards play in a pool, 1 game against each other. Tie decided by run differential.
4-Remainder of playoffs per normal.
Benefits
1- Removes some of the schedule imbalance and a good team in a bad division getting in over an even better team missing the post season.
2- Incentive to win the division
3-The pool play would get a ton of eyeballs. Pool play in the 2 best wild card cities. More regular season incentive.
Intelligent discourse welcome.
With the field of dreams pop up baseball event as successful as it was, they should have a traveling team where they play in 26 cities across the US. Would a team like the Pirates get more than 10,000 people coming to a game if they were to play in Charlotte or Fargo?
Expanded playoffs are happening. League expansion is happening. Period.
It’s all about money. And there is plenty to go around.
But the NFL and NBA have overtaken MLB over the past couple of decades. Changes must happen before MLB all but disappears like pro boxing or horse racing ( as far as national popularity)
1) add playoffs but shorten the season so MLB is only going head to head with NBA and NFL during playoffs.
2) expand so number of additional playoff teams are somewhat offset by more teams.
3) completely change leagues and divisions by geography to encourage more local/regional rivalries and reduce travel. Same rules for all teams.
4) balance the schedule.
5) make the first level of “wildcard games” an NCAA tournament style round Robin played as an event at a neutral site. (spread the wealth and experience to new/different fans)
6) include playoff stats as “official stats” to limit the impact of reduced games to the historical record books.
7) make umpires full time employees and accountable for performance. Use technology for balls/strikes but leave all other calls alone.
8) have one single process for gaining amateur talent. No more U.S. draft vs international signings vs foreign league postings.
9) have salary floor and whatever ceiling device that can be agreed upon as a counter.
10) incentivize players to stay with teams rather than leave when free agency is earned.
Well, that’s a lot to process. Hopefully myself and others can expound on these ideas. Not that anything will come of it.
2 team expansion to Charlotte and Las Vegas.
Relocate Tampa Bay to Montreal and Oakland to San Jose or maybe Riverside area.
North
Blue Jays
Rays
Pirates
Twins
Tigers
Guardians
Cubs
White Sox
West
Dodgers
Mariners
A’s
Giants
Angels
Padres
Diamondbacks
Las Vegas team
Central
Astros
Rangers
Rockies
Cardinals
Royals
Brewers
Reds
Guardians
Atlantic
Marlins
Braves
Charlotte team
Nationals
Red Sox
Phillies
Yankees
Mets
Each team plays every other team 5 times – 155 game season.
Interesting. I like the idea. I had one very similar:
If the DH indeed goes away, MLB might as well do away with the AL/NL format and split the leagues up using the Mississippi River as the general dividing liine to create a Wetern and Eastern Conference.
That way you can keep existing rivalries like Red Sox/Yankees, Cubs/Cards, etc.
Make North and South disvisions for each conference. Each Conference plays within itself. Rather than an interleague play, each disvision plays a couonterpart disivion in the opposing conference and it is alternated every year, similar to what the NFL is doing.
4 divsion winners, 2 WC teams for each conference. WC Teams have best of 3, then Conference Championship and WS are best of 7.
Single season records matter in baseball. If Soto hits 398 in 150 games would he have reached 400 in 162? Or careers…if Tatis hits 705 HRs playing 12 less games a year how does he compare to others? I don’t think it’s petty to care as much or more for the consistency of the game than it is for its optimal financial marketing. Obviously from the FA signings we’re seeing, the owners and players are going just fine.
You’re presenting a logical argument to illogical non-baseball fans.
I think 12 would be perfect- still puts emphasis on the regular season, top 2 teams get byes, just like the old NFL format
Should be at least 14 teams in playoffs. It gives fans more to cheer about in September and still less than half the teams. This idea that the playoffs are somehow sacred is so old fashioned, kind of like thinking the shift is evil and watching pitchers bat is fun and strategic.
Then why play a gruelling schedule just to have crappy WC teams “earn” a postseason spot. Pathetic.
I completely agree. Out of curiosity I glanced at 2021 standings. Under 14 team playoff format Seattle and Toronto get in AL, Cincy and Philly NL. The worst record is from the Phillies at 82-80.
What’s the point of 162 then Manfred? Get back to the drawing board, because I’m ok with a lockout if you’re bringing this type of deal forward
On one hand I do like the idea of it being more likely for my team to make the playoffs, and I’m sure that matchup-picking event would be a lot of fun. But man, months and months of games just to eliminate 16 teams feels wrong.
I don’t see how having a bye is an advantage for teams that play a precision sport? The 1996 Yankees come to mind as a team that won the ALCS very quickly, and had a week to sit around, and wait. Ultimately they won the World Series, but they looked terrible in the first two games, and not every team is going to be able to recover like that. It will make for boring, uncompetitive baseball in the long run.
That would be a good idea, the players just have to ask for a floor, 100M,120M?
Can everyone agree that Manfred needs to go, resolve that piece and then start negotiating. This guy is a cancer in the game.
I think the only thing that people can agree on, both baseball and non-baseball fans, is that baseball needs major changes in order to survive.
I would HATE to see changes made to the on-field product (like robo umps), but there are major opportunities for procedural and structural changes. Some things I personally would love to see:
1- the draft completely restructured with global eligibility and reduced rounds (I.e. NBA structure).
NBA 2 rounds and 5 starters on court
NHL 7 rounds and 6 players on ice
NFL 7 rounds and 11 players on field
MLB 40 rounds and 9 players on field
This brings me to
2- reduce affiliate teams in MiLB
MLB teams often have 5 affiliate clubs (DSL, A, A+, AA, AAA) while every other major sport has max 2 (NHL – ECHL and AHL). It is a known fact that MiLB players are treated poorly and one way to improve conditions is to unfortunately remove some affiliates and consolidate budget. Having 2 teams I think would be best. On the surface, this may not look the best for the MLB to remove affiliates, but players will still have the opportunity to be scouted and signed in other leagues that would inherently become more talented. Reducing affiliates will improve conditions for the remaining affiliates and increase the level of competition/importance of internal player development.
3- Make draft picks eligible to be traded
The MLB is the only major sport where you cannot trade draft picks. How many future 1st rounders do you think someone would pay to acquire Betts or Scherzer at the deadline? Then fans can follow the college level more closely to see which players they think their team should take.
4- This going to be unpopular but reduce the schedule to 120 games
Losing out on revenue for 42 games will sting, but this will make each game more meaningful and increase urgency/competition within those games. Plus, I’m sure the players won’t complain about receiving more off days where they have only about 4 each month, which are mainly used for rest/travel. They will have more time in-season for family, recovery (mentally and physically), and autonomy. This would reduce the need for a 5 man rotation and would create more marquis matchups between aces. No more games of the Red Sox fifth starter vs Orioles 5th starter. The issue with this would be that some players will lose their job and the price for high end talent will continue to increase where I already think players are overpaid (again, another unpopular opinion). I do think it’s awesome for players to get their 10 year, $325million contracts (congrats Seager), but there are maybe 10 players in the entire league that have even a $200million contract and this – believe it or not – leaves teams strapped for cash to sign additional talent and if that one player gets hurt they’re retaining 0 value and have no depth to sustain success. Sorry Yankees fans, but this is why you haven’t won much this millennium. The best team I can think off that pays fair value for FAs and prioritizes internal development and has sustained success: anybody, anybody, Buehler, anybody?
Cardinals
Which leads me to 5:
5- I personally think the MLB should adopt a hard salary cap but the players would never go for it so instead they should increase the ramifications for exceeding the luxury tax threshold… which would essentially be the same thing as creating a hard cap without actually creating one
Back to my previous example of the Seager signing… Seager is making over $30mil/season. The Dodgers had a salary level of ~$200mil last season. The $30mil level represents 15% of the highest paid team’s salary allocated to one player on a 25 man MLB roster. If everyone were paid evenly, a player should receive 4% on the 25-man roster but this doesn’t even include teams that have deferred payments (Bobby Bonilla day), retained salary (Sox paying the Dodgers $16mil next year for David Price), or minor league salary, so these numbers are even more skewed to the extreme than what I show. It’s no secret that deals over $200mil generally turn out bad. In fact, to me only the Joey Votto contract looks to have worked out while the remaining $200mil contracts have mostly been signed in the past 5 years and are still too soon to judge but I assume teams would love to take back major contracts to Pujols, Stanton, David Price, Greinke, and more just to cherry pick a few (not very good that we can all think of more bad contracts than good contracts at this price level).
The point I’m making is that having this level of budget allocated to a single player is EXTREMELY risky. If that player gets hurt, the team retains 0 value for each game that player doesn’t play and is left with the players making ~2% of their budget which are mostly pre-arb players and low-tier/minor league signings. Removing these contracts by increasing the consequences for signing them would be better for the game overall by promoting a more balanced pay structure for all teams and would allow teams to become more flexible with making improvements to their team.
I’ve got more but I also have a day job to get back to but let me know what y’all think.
Well, for starters, MLB does NOT need “major changes in order to survive”, just a few minor ones to reflect the basics of the game itself: eliminate the DH, go back to 154 game season, 2 or 4 divisions in each league with NO “wild card”, scrap interleague play and FIRE Manfred.
It seems like they could give the league what they want by expanding the playoffs, and the players get what they want by restructuring contracts so young players get paid what they are worth.
I’m not going to pretend like I know how these things work, so I guess this is more of a pipedream
14 teams make it? Good bye major rivalries. Good bye division titles meaning much. Devalue the long grind of the regular season. The most exciting games down the stretch will be exclusively between mediocre teams. Terrible.
Picking your opponent is the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard of!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is ridiculous; half the league making the playoffs? I don’t think that this will help prevent tanking (see NBA/NHL) or encourage owners to spend on free agents. I don’t see how this is of any help except to line the league’s/owners pockets with revenue and give fans worse playoffs that will be even LONGER than they already are.
Like I always said, just put all the teams in one division and whoever wins the division is the champion
Fourteen teams playoff. Ah, the relentless drive in contemporary America to reward mediocracy. Why strive to be the best in your league, when being just above average gets you a shot at the WS? Heck, with inter-league play, you might not even have to be an above 500 ball team. Is this a great country or what? Wait, do we have to change that phrase to “is this a mediocre country or what?”
Can’t wait for the counter proposal from the players association asking for participation trophies.
You really are an idiot. You are making the regular season meaningless. Wild Card MUST be 1 GAME. And, ban astro-turf and the DH. At this point, I only have HOCKEY left, which as already proven time and again the regular season is meaningless… There is HOPE the new mutation will take out EVERYONE under 50 and the world, and MLB, will be saved. AMERICA VOTE WITH YOUR FEET, STOP GOING TO REGULAR SEASON GAMES, they will listen …
They could propose a 29 team playoff and the Pirates would still miss them.
Why bother with a season? Just have all the teams in a mud-slinging three month playoff. Then take your bats and balls and go home.
Go down to 150 games
The best way to deal with tanking is to have a reverse draft order between the six worst teams. That would usually, but not always be the cellar dweller of the respective division. So the team with the best record among the six worst teams gets the first pick.
This has several beneficial goals:
1) it incentivizes winning, so teams no longer have a reason to tank
2) It increases the value of cheap and almost washed up free agents, because teams need to try and get that extra win or two.
3) It creates enthusiasm among the fan bases, because they are rooting for their team to win rather than lose, and there’s a source of pride in being the best of the worst, even if you’re one of the worst. It eliminates that schadenfreude of “hey we’re a laughingstock! But we got the first pick!”
4) It makes it harder on the teams who are looking forward to pummeling a fellow division team 19 times a season, and would help balance out the unbalanced strengths between the divisions.
5) Because those bottoms six teams would now be trying to win instead of lose, it would make more watchable baseball all around.
Finally, the seventh and eighth worst teams are probably good enough that there would be no benefit to them to tank so as to get into that group of six, so the benefit of the tanking process would be minimized overall.
JUST…PLAIN…STUPID
Stop talking about yourself.
Seriously, what do you think is wrong with it and what do you suggest instead, or do you prefer the status quo?
There are proposals offered in any negotiation that tend to fall in three categories: Plausable, Improbable and JUST…PLAIN…STUPID.
If you need help regarding the latter category, you obviously don’t follow baseball. You’ve just motivated me to finally avail myself of the “”Mute” button.
Whatever happens during the CBA negotiations, I hope Baltimore gets a Major League Team.
Get rid of interleague games. Need to get back to playing more in your own league. These AL/NL games in the last month of the season are just stupid.
Endless buffoonery from this clown