The Braves tonight announced they’ve extended catcher Sean Murphy on a six-year, $73MM contract. The deal comes with a $15MM club option for 2029 which does not include a buyout. As part of the deal, Murphy will take home $4MM in 2023, $9MM in 2024, and $15MM in 2025-28. He’ll also donate 1% of his salary to the Atlanta Braves Foundation. Atlanta had only acquired the Rowley Sports Management client as the headliner of a three-team trade that included the Brewers and Athletics earlier this month. Murphy was first-year arbitration-eligible going into 2023, so this deal buys out his remaining three years of club control as well as potentially four free agent years.
The move continues Atlanta’s recent trend of extending their core of starting players, and Murphy joins Austin Riley, Matt Olson, Ronald Acuna Jr., Ozzie Albies, Spencer Strider and Michael Harris as players on the current roster that have received long-term extensions while still under club control. That group of players can now be controlled by Atlanta through 2027, while only Acuna Jr. and Albies have deals that expire before 2029.
The 28-year-old Murphy has established himself as one of the best catchers in all of baseball in recent seasons with Oakland. At the plate, he’s hit 46 home runs and a combined .236/.326/.429 line across parts of four big league seasons. That’s been good for a wRC+ of 116, indicating he’s been 16 percent better than the league average hitter. He took a step forward at the plate in 2022 as well, knocking around 5% off his career strikeout rate and posting a .250/.332/.426 line over 612 plate appearances.
Defensively, he’s posted 12 Defensive Runs Saved since 2020 which places him in the top ten league wide. Fangraphs framing metric ranks him as the third-best pitch framer in the sport in that same period as well. That combination of strong defense and above-average offense has amounted to a career haul of 10.6 fWAR, with 2022 accounting for 5.1 of that tally.
Murphy’s form, Oakland’s rebuild and a thin free agent market for catchers made him one of those most hotly talked about trade chips in the sport going into the off-season. Sure enough, as many as nine teams were connected with him in the weeks leading up to his December 12 trade. It was a good old-fashioned blockbuster as well, as the Braves sent Royber Salinas, Manny Pina, Kyle Muller and Freddy Tarnok to Oakland, and William Contreras and Justin Yeager to the Brewers to complete the deal.
The match with Atlanta wasn’t always the most obvious fit on paper, given the Braves had a strong catching trio of Travis D’Arnaud, Pina and Contreras on the books moving forward. Clearly though, general manager Alex Anthopolous saw an opportunity to upgrade that group and shipped out Pina and Contreras to make room for Murphy.
It’s now the second-successive winter that Atlanta have traded for one of Oakland’s stars and immediately extended him. Last off-season, they acquired Olson and a day later signed him to an eight-year, $168MM extension. Olson has already established himself as a key part of the Braves’ core, and now it seems Murphy will do the same from 2023 onwards.
As mentioned earlier, a raft of extensions have established a strong core in Atlanta. As well as those, they also have Max Fried under control through 2024, rookie Vaughn Grissom through 2028, and Kyle Wright through 2026. For a team that won 101 games in 2022, it’s certainly heartening for Braves fans to know that much of that core – and now their biggest off-season addition – will be around long term.
Per MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz’ predictions, Murphy was slated to earn $3.5MM in arbitration this season, so he’ll take home only a $500K raise on that figure for next season. That is significant for luxury tax calculations though, which account for a contract’s AAV. In Murphy’s case, that’ll be an AAV of just over $12MM which pushes the Braves into the first tier of luxury tax, despite RosterResource estimating their actual payroll sitting at around $198MM currently (the first luxury tax threshold is $233MM). Of course, the Braves could look to unload salary to get below that mark, but it’d only be a small penalty on any overage at this stage. Further, they’ll have just over $50MM worth of club options (with no buyouts) on Charlie Morton, D’Arnaud, Kirby Yates, Collin McHugh, Orlando Arcia and Eddie Rosario to decide on next winter, which could comfortably get them back under the threshold.
Because of course they did.
How do we keep doing this lmao
Raiding the A’s playoff team for 2 of the 3 best players, enabled by a corrupt Oakland ownership focusing on a real estate deal and unwilling to spend anything to extend these two.
Not to mention being ahead of the curve to offer great players lots of money, and having the cahoots to sign these players to long term deals off of a couple of years of financial success.
I hate to break it to you, but one of the primary reasons the Braves are in a position to make all these deals is because of a corrupt real estate deal.
I’m sure the taxpayers that care nothing for baseball were thrilled to pay for all the new infrastructure, American local politics is the best!
The luxury tax is a good point, with the Braves now over it with this deal. Buying out arb years of players with long-term extensions is the only way to keep a solid team top-to-bottom when you have a luxury tax. Allows you to spread the hit evenly across the duration of the contract, rather than having to trade the player right before they become a free agent because their salary jumps 250% from one year to the next.
Yes! It’s totally not because the company that owns them also owns F1, Sirius XM and Live Nation and brings in like $9 billion dollars a year in revenue.
@Smacky
You clearly have no idea how the Braves are owned and operated. The Braves are operated as a completely separate entity. Liberty Media has nothing to do with the day-to-day operations of the Braves. Terry McGuirk acts as the Braves defacto owner and he is the one that sets the Braves payroll and how much they have to spend and it’s all based on the Braves own revenue streams (TV, ticket sales, Battery, ect).
Liberty Media as a publicly traded company isn’t allowed to sign a bunch of blank checks and just pump money into the organization per the terms of their agreement to “buy” the team. There’s a reason payroll never increased for the nearly 10 seasons LM owned the team while they played at Turner Field and only finally went up when they got a huge revenue boost from moving into the new stadium.
This has all been explained so many times you would think it would be common knowledge by now but with how many people still throw out Liberty Media when talking about the Braves it’s clear there’s still a bunch of ignorant people out there.
You do know that we can all look at the books for the Braves, right?
Yes. I’m aware. As a publicly owned and traded company (which is the way the Braves are classified) their finances are required to be made publicly. None of that changes anything I said. Payroll went up after moving into the new stadium because their revenue went up. Liberty Media cannot just pump money into the team. This article is the best explanation of the Braves that I’ve come across.
outfieldflyrule.com/2015/11/13/the-atlanta-braves-…
Dude, respectfully, you have no idea what you’re talking about as what you posted isn’t coherent.
It’s 7 years old and from some obscure blog. I guess that makes it an absolute canon.
@Smacky
Read the article I linked to and stop being ignorant.
@Smacky
There’s a reason the Braves are listed completely separate when Liberty Media posts their quarterly earnings reports and if you read the fine print you’ll see that they’re listed as “Braves Group” for a reason. But if you wanna continue to be ignorant and not be able to understand why payroll stayed the same until the team moved into the new stadium then so be it. I’ll just ignore you.
Cry some more
I get it, you are like most big market fans and don’t want to talk about the advantage your team and about ten others have over the rest of baseball because your team can afford these insane contracts. It’s alright. All the small market fans know the score and that’s why attendance is down and baseball is dying in those markets.
Nothing corrupt about taking loans from the county to get the deal done. It has turned out to be good for both sides. Not only are the loans being repaid, but the revenue from the Battery, generates new tax money for Cobb Co as well. The Braves benefit from all the revenue around the ballpark to go towards paying down their debt ratio faster and having more money to pump into the team. If anything more teams like Oak, TB, Cinn, Pitt, and KC could all do the same thing once their stadium leases run out and build a new ballpark as well as entertainment, restaurants, apartment/condo units to generate more revenue. Lastly where Turner Field was located was not the safest place to be after a game let out.
@AUTiger7222
Thank you for explaining the ownership structure of the Atlanta Braves. You are correct that Liberty Media does not have direct control over the day-to-day operations of the team, and that the team’s payroll and spending is determined by its own revenue streams. However, it is important to note that Liberty Media does own the team and has the ultimate financial responsibility for it. As the owner of the team, Liberty Media has the authority to make decisions about the team’s finances, including setting the payroll.
Additionally, it is worth noting that the team’s move to a new stadium did result in an increase in revenue, which likely contributed to the increase in payroll. However, it is also possible that other factors, such as changes in the team’s financial performance or strategic decisions made by the team’s management, played a role in the increase.
In any case, it is important to have a nuanced understanding of the ownership and financial structure of a sports team, and to recognize that there are often multiple factors at play in determining a team’s spending and payroll.
Cobb county commissioner that made the middle of the night deal to move the Braves was voted out immediately. If it had been put to a referendum it would not have passed; however, the Braves and Cobb county have made the most of the move. The Battery is very nice except for the person who decided parking was sufficient.
@smacky
Autiger is completely correct in this situation. It’s been well documented many, many times how the Braves are run. LM is hands off as required by their buyers agreement. It’s public record too. So no he’s not being incoherent, he’s just re-iterating what has been said so many times.
Doesn’t change the relevance of the article’s topic, plus I read it back then and many others that have posted online since. The info is out there, just look it up for yourself.
I will say to your point that thanks to TBS the Braves had/have one of the largest and broadest fan bases out there. Now I just looked at an aerial map of GABP and what there is around the stadium for dining and entertainment doesn’t belong to the team, the parking that’s available- does the team get all the revenue from that or is it split with the city? A re-worked TV deal to broaden the reach of the team geographically could also help. There are ways to deepen the revenue, your ownership is where you might want to start your protest.
You obviously know nothing about some of the markets you cited.
Fans don’t go to games, why should ownership spend money? A new stadium would bring fans which would allow for more spending.
Luxury tax just isn’t that big a deal for large market teams… The money is there to go over it without big ramifications.
And racist voting laws… Argh!!!
dan – I’m guessing you meant cajones instead of cahoots, but I agree with you.
I’ve often said, this approach to locking up young talent longterm is the key to success. This is what Bloom should be doing with players such as Devers, instead of waiting until their final season of team control before trying to extend him. If it’s a matter of not really wanting the player, which was clearly the case with Xander, then Bloom should be trading them before they walk and the team gets nothing in return.
Only what I can see from an aerial view of the ball parks, I admit to having not been to as many as I would like. However point remains, some of the new big money teams ie…Atl and SD have done so by adding to the outside experience of the park as much as in it. Smaller team markets need to find more ways to generate. So what can your Reds do to make more?
Because you believe certain ethnicities can’t get an ID? How do they enter a government building, or get gov’t benefits without ID?
And those “racist” voting laws are no more restrictive than Colorado, Delaware and countless other states.
When will Manfred apologize and give Atlanta its AGS?
It’s funny how a certain stripe caviling about government overreach and government IDs were somehow absolutely fine with government intrusion and government IDs when it restricted voting among groups that tended not to vote their way, and even though in-person vote fraud was effectively non-existent in the United States.
Real funny. It’s almost as if intellectual integrity was wholly absent in this regard.
—Still, what are you lot even arguing about? You don’t live in anything like an actual democracy. Even Jimmy Carter said, decades ago, that the U.S. had become an oligarchy. The question of which of the oligarchy’s bought pols pretend to represent you is the least of your problems.
Quoting Jimmy Carter won’t win you any arguments.
Some people don’t want to hear the truth of the message no matter who the messenger is.
This is why we need to leave politics out of a baseball discussion.
So your telling me Blackrock owns the braves too?
I’ll quote Jimmy Carter till the day I die. Dude gives a $&!%, except about the American need to drive a gasoline ran automobile to work everyday. Sounds way ahead of his time
If you ever wanna start an argument just bring up politics, or religion, you succeed everytime and all of the fools that participate are a victim of its evil like a witch having them under her spell
I’ll still enjoy watching the Phillies.
But will watch the Braves as well. This is an incredibly smart organization with a smart, professional manger, coaches, and players. Pure class.
The Braves are the anthesis of the Mets that throw money around because they can’t compete any other way.
Braves fans have something special!
It does take time to build an organization though. Orioles are 5 years into a rebuild and now looking like postseason contenders.
That couldn’t happen overnight. Cohen wanted to win immediately. Money is the only real answer to that question. We’ll see if he decides to build a real organization that is top notch in the future.
You’d think a hedge fund manager would do so sooner rather than later.
He wants exactly that, but also to compete now. The Orioles and most teams have to totally tank to build up their system. Cohen doesn’t have to rely on trading away talent for prospects. He can eat the cost of paying good players while drafting talent to solidify his organization top to bottom. And he’s making the Mets a free agent destination for future stars.
Agreed and several of their top stars are homegrown. One just got paid (Nimmo). The other two (Alonso and McNeil) should be extended, but I feel “Uncle Steve” will do what’s necessary to keep them in Queens.
“The Braves are the anthesis of the Mets that throw money around because they can’t compete any other way.”
The Braves have thrown an absolute boatload of money around recently (currently at the luxury tax) and have traded away a lot of their farm system. Their farm system is one of the worst in the league at the moment.
They’ve been a successful franchise for decades, but this approach they’re currently doing is fairly new and we’ll see how it pans out. If even a few of the huge extensions they’ve signed don’t work, they might be in a little trouble.
Also, “pure class” when the fans do The Chop and are encouraged to do so. Hah.
Everybody said that the Braves minor league system was bare before last year and we ended up having the two top vote getters for rookie of the year.
rct;
Pure Class. Ya betcha.
I was talking about how the Braves acquire, and develop players. How the players are use in games, and how they perform.
You compare the Braves to the Mets in throwing money around? LOL The Braves TRADE for players – meaning they have quality young players other teams want. The Mets buy players. How many $200-300 free agent contracts have the Braves given out?
Most importantly – the Braves are YOUNG – and MLB is a young mans game. Just like with the Yankees every year we have to hear: “Oh, my team would have won but the injuries”. Well, when your team has to give out long-term contracts to players over 30 because you don’t have a surplus of quality players to use in trade – then we’re back to old players get injured more often and take longer to heal then young players do.
As for your ridiculous argument that the Braves got over the Luxury Tax – the Mets are spending something like DOUBLE what the Braves have on the books for 2023, and as desperate as the Mets are rest assured that they’ll be spending sending and spending into the season and during the season.
Atlanta is awash in money. The studios cleared out of political California. Atlanta has been their destination. Houses are being bulldozed down and McMansion’s built right up to the property line. I didn’t like it in LA, but it’s a sign of an area becoming affluent. The fans of Atlanta will continue to support all their sports teams – professional and college.
Personally i am waiting for some of the players we traded to oakland to make the majors and thrive. Oakland would probably trade them back.
We will…. but we demand a package of prospects that have already failed at the major league level!
Not Shea though and that one hurt.
A lone bright spot, be happy for us!
They do it by looking for, and acquiring, talent not represented by Boras.
You can thank John Mozeliak for hanging up the phone when the A’s wanted Lars Nootbaar, Brendan Donovan, and top pitching prospect Gordon Graceffo, instead of negotiating futher and calling up Contereas agent and saying…. “ummm… yeah… how many years and extra dollars to bring Willson to St Louis again, okay another year to make 4th at 18 million with a club option for a 5th at 18 million, done”
Noot and Donovan have already accumulated millions in surplus value and most likely will continue to. Graceffo is no guaranteed asset but looks the part. These three could net the Cardinals 50-60m in surplus value in arbitration years. This is how the Cardinals operate.
I think the better question is why. Half the guys signed to these extensions won’t pan out and that shouldn’t be surprising since most of them haven’t had more than a season of any type of success.
@PintheB; I hear ya! Maybe it’s because Braves ownership has a yearly payroll line item budget constraint. Longer deals with younger players keeps the monies spent well below that luxury tax line? This approach can win but because it can often require external action, prospects are lost. Quite the Catch 22.
@putitinthebooks
You need to worry about your own team a lot more instead of incessantly talking rubbish about the Braves, and incessantly looking over your shoulder seeing the Braves in your rear vision mirror and your side mirrors all the time. In fact, even when you sleep you see the Braves in your dreams.
‘But we’re 10.5 games in front’.
‘We’re going to win the NL East easily’
‘Mets are better than the Braves’
What happened in the final series that counted at Truist in 2022, where the formula was that you had to win 1 game? It was a sweep,
3-0, the Braves beat Scherzer, De Grom, and Bassitt. There are some good Mets fans, but you’re one of them that give their fan base a most horrid reputation and a bad name.
Basically a 3 year $55M extension as he was only arb1 in 2023. Not that cheap especially when you consider Wilson Contreras is getting less than $18M a year in his new contract albeit for longer.
Bad deal. Braves FO loves to confuse the inattentive fan by buying out the arb years and making it seem like they’re getting great team deals. Here’s out it really breaks down:
Via arb
2023 est: 3.3 mil
2024 est: 6 mil
2025 est: 10 mil
This is a fair estimation for him assuming he continues to play at a similar pace. Totals roughly $20 mil
Braves basically signed him to a 3 yr/$53 mil contract for the years following arb which is roughly $18 mil/yr for a guy who has proven to be nothing more than an average hitter and good defensive catcher
Then they say they can’t sign Swanson for $25ish mil/year when there’s an obvious need at SS for a premium position that is hard to fill for many clubs.
The Braves are horribly run. We’ve once again extended an overrated As player before he ever steps on the field for us. Olson is already looking like a mistake 1 year in. People who disagree will likely say it’s only been 1 year. Ok fair enough… so you’re 0/1 on the contract with him.
Now we do the same thing with Murphy. If you asked me last year coming off the WS win how many years we would be competitive I would have easily said 5 at minimum. Braves FO has managed to totally flip that much faster than I even thought possible.
There holes are rapidly growing and we just ignore them while handing out dumb contracts to overrated players while trying to sell them off as a young core with a bright future.
That was true with the first few signings. Then they failed to bring Freeman and Swanson back and turned around and signed bad contracts with Olson and Murphy.
When they try to sell you on the fact they can’t resign Max Fried after this season keep all of this in mind. We’ll have yet another massive hole they’ll refuse to plug once he departs.
We’re looking at a WC birth in 2023. After that I can’t even be confident we’ll be a playoff contender in 2024 and beyond.
Such an implosion for such a promising core in the blink of an eye because the Braves won’t go that one extra mile to spend for established players to fill the 2 or 3 obvious holes they have on the roster.
@MJ, an absolutely horrible take. Swanson was streaky at best at the plate. We don’t know the true story with regards to Freeman, but for you to say the Olson and Murphy deals are bad is asinine. Murphy will thrive in Atlanta having protection in that batting order.
It cost them a ton of prospects and money and years for players who had never played for them. Murphy is an average hitter. Olson didn’t have a great first year. You guessing they will “thrive” is a guess. Swanson may have been streaky but then so is Olson who also hit significantly lower in average than Swanson. It’s not a horrible take, it’s pretty sound.
No, Murphy is not an “average hitter.” If you bothered to read the article you would see that he was 16 percent over league average in 2022. But of course if you’re one of those dinosaurs who rate hitters by batting average, then you probably mistakenly believe that he’s average.
I don’t even want to talk about the complete destruction of the farm system to bring in Olson and Murphy as well. If you want to say Olson was cheaper than Freeman… honestly was he? Maybe in dollars but after you factor the prospects lost in addition to it… was he really cheaper? Certainly doesn’t look like it.
Now same thing with Murphy. Was Murphy really cheaper than Swanson when you factor in the prospects? I’m going with another no.
But on a pure dollar assessment the Braves are too cheap to spend. If you look at actual value of what they lost to bring in Olson and Murphy it wasn’t much different than what Freeman and Swanson respectively ended up getting. The Braves are just cheap financially at the end of the day. Better to pull from the farm and cripple the org that way to save a couple dollars, all while bringing in inferior, less than ideal players in the process.
RIP Braves. You should have had a stranglehold in the East for a decade plus. Now it looks like it’s already over. What a train wreck of a management job.
Holding on to all your prospects is a suckers game. 5 straight division titles and a world series win. I think AA has a little better grasp on who to trade and who to sign than most.
@MJ
I agree with you in part on the Olson and Freddie comparison.
Freddie was the DNA of the 21 team.
But, all you can ask for is a team that’s good enough to get to the dance every year.
That’s the way this teams always designed themselves and I don’t see it stopping anytime soon.
That said, give me guys who step up in the biggest moments.
This core?
Acuna GS in 2019 Vs LA
Ozzie – solid, dependable. Might not wow you in October but won’t choke.
Harris – yet to be tested.
Strider – choked in Philly. Hopefully gets better from it.
Riley – Clutch.
Olson – the new chipper vs the Mets and the only
Guy who rembered how to hit last year.
Murphy? Glove first with plus bat with new rule changes? Sounds good to me
@MJ what a horrible take. Olson’s deal looks like a mistake? I’ll take 34 HRs and 44 Doubles with stellar defense from him any time. He is also just about the only hitter who actually showed up in the playoffs with a 1.362 OPS
Also, your “fair” estimation of Murphy’s arbitration is the low end of the spectrum. He could easily end up going 3.5M, 7M, 15M. One advantage you’re not mentioning is that his AAV is only 12M, which will be very useful on the back end of the contract for Luxury tax purposes.
You guys give him way too much credit for his WS win.
He threw a bunch of stuff at the wall with Rosario, Pederson, and Soler and managed to have it all stick simultaneously.
Look we’re all grateful for the good fortunes there. But it’s not like AA took any risk at all bringing that group in.
All he did was brought in a bunch of no risk players and managed to strike gold that they ALL went off.
You see he tried to do it again this year with Rosario and look what happened. If you want to give him credit for Rosario when he was good and gave us a WS then you can easily argue his decision to stick with Rosario in 2022 cost us a WS. He was an automatic out all year. You can’t win a WS with an automatic out in your lineup.
But you all seem totally overlook that.
And his 5 division titles? He had nothing to do with bringing in Acuna, Albies, Freeman, Swanson, Riley, Fried, etc.
If anything he’s piggy backed off the good scouting of Hart and Coppy while taking no risks and striking gold on some below average players all catching fire at the right time.
When has AA taken a risk that worked out for us? That’s the mark of a good GM. Someone who can take a shot and get it right. Not someone who sits there and plays it safe hoping to win the lottery when nothing is on the line.
He’s basically been the guy who’s made no decisions so you can’t burn him for doing something dumb, but at the same time deserves no credit for anything positive either. He’s been indifferent the entire way.
I can sit in his chair and make a bunch of no risk moves to ensure there’s no buildings burning down that people can point to and say are my fault. That’s incredibly easy.
You’re right @MJ AA and Chaim Bloom are the exact same.
Man I sure wish the Braves had AJ Preller or Chris Young rn.
Man I wish we could have gave bogarts and Tatis over half a billion!!
No he wasn’t. Freddie is intellectually limited (see how his contract situation played out) who led by bullying. And Dansby isn’t going to be a big leadership loss either. He’s an introvert who just wants to be left alone – not a fan of attention. He didn’t like being the face of the franchise and the city. Everybody put that on him b/c the Braves fan have a weird fetish on guys from Georgia.
Olson was also the only one to show up for the A’s in one of our playoff years. He seems pretty good against top rate pitching.
And people not realize getting traded into a new league and the division with the best pitching in baseball might impact his performance. And then Freeman goes to the NL West where the only good pitchers not in LA were Rodon & Darvish.
You are a poop salesman with a mouth full of samples.
apparently you didn’t realize the prospects that Oakland got from us are all garbage besides the catcher we sent them. our farm is tapped out in the upper minors. but if fried leaves we have Anderson and whats his face coming back from his foot injuries. and if he turns a corner he’s an ace. So losing fried isn’t a big deal. I think AA has done a great job locking people up long term and cheaply. setting the core up for winning for a while. AA is expecting that he is going to save on these deals and I see them saving on each of them. it sucks to lose Swanson but he wasn’t a top tier SS hitter to give 7 years and 25m a year to. He hit okay and his obp wasn’t great. he strikes out a ton and doesn’t walk enough. he’s just a really good defender. are you going to spend 25M a year for hoping to get 3-4 more wins a year?
@MJ- Murphy is the better player. 3/53 for Murphy’s free agent years is a better deal than the contract Swanson signed. Fit is a different issue but they must be set on trying out Grissom.
“And people not realize getting traded into a new league and the division with the best pitching in baseball might impact his performance”
This proves my point. Why are we going out and extending these guys who very well be out of their depth to post numbers similar to what they were able to do in Oakland.
Then by comparison you let the guys PROVEN to be able to handle the division with the best pitching walk away.
This right here is exactly what I’m talking about. So while the rest of you are spending the next 3-5 years trying to understand why the Braves got worse when you could have sworn they were getting better remember I had the answer long before it all went south on the field.
2022 was our last real WS contending roster and sadly they went cold at the wrong time. From here on out it’s gonna be tough sledding to even make the playoffs.
I agree that the Braves should have paid Freeman “whatever it took” and kept the prospects. The rest of your take is bad and you should feel bad.
Although arguably, not trading Shea eliminates the need for the Murphy trade…
A lot of quality MLB players were never regarded as top prospects. It works the other way around as well. Some highly regarded prospects never turn out like expected.
man these are completely emotional based, nonsensical arguments MJ.
They have a premier catcher a 3 year extension for a reasonable dollar figure, in a world where FA is handing out 10 year deals to good not great players.
you are a pessimistic Mets fab. go support the Mets.
we don’t know if Shea is going to turn out to be as good as Murphy. and Shea is only 3 years younger than Murphy. we saved the time it would have taken to figure out Shea anyways.
exactly. this is a massive underpayment for Murphy. top catchers who can hit and are top defensive catchers are extremely difficult to find. the only other one is in Philadelphia and the cards had one in molina. premium defensive and catchers that can hit are expensive and we just saved a ton.
MJ- so what you’re saying is, that had the braves waited through the arb years that Murphy will only want a 3 year deal at 18m per? And because he’s generous will throw in an option year with NO buyout?
Part of what makes the extension so good is you’re buying ONLY the best years there. You get the late 20s, the first 3 years of the 30s, and you’re done. No investment in the declining years just to get a guy to sign.
And THAT makes it that much better of a deal. Unless you know of a productive guy who is 30 years old and asks for a 3 year extension at that point? We can debate will he suddenly turn into a dud in one year and that’s fair to at least argue about, but the term and years, using out arb so you only have to take the peak FA the guy has??? That’s a tough one to win.
This Jays fan will gladly take AA back. The best move Alex has ever made was knowing precisely when to leave Toronto. It hurt watching him go and it hurts watching him wheel and deal while we turn Teoscar into relief pitchers and sign 4th OFs to be our everyday CF
Calling a team with a $200mm payroll cheap, should only come from a Mets fan. Atlanta, a publicly held compamy, has its books open for your examination.
Arguably the amount of errors saved and gold glove defensive plays at first bring Olson a little closer to Freeman than most people think.
Indeed, he’s way cheaper and provides slightly above league average offense at a vastly more important defensive position.
I gotta disagree. Your main complaint is giving up “Prospects” (players that haven’t thrown a single pitch or had a single at bat in the big Leagues) prospects are never a for sure thing.
And it’s not like they gave up good prospects for bad ready to go players, they traded for guys that can help them win right now… a power hitting 1st baseman and a good defensive/hitting catcher that are both in the prime of their careers.
And I’d say they did great with the prospects that they kept over the last several years.. Acuna – Strider – Grissom – Harris – etc. that’s the way the game works if you want to win.. you keep some you trade some, you sign some and you let some walk. They have a great team and they just won a WS not that long ago
Fried will be traded next off season actually surprised it wasn’t this offseason
He has made it known he grew up a Dodger fan & is a West Coast kid. I
I think when it’s all said snd done Anderson becomes the next Kyle Wright with that demotion last year and learns how to throw strikes consistently and Soroka proves his health and they step in for Fried & Morton after next year.
Fried will then be moved either at the deadline or next offseason for some young players to replenish the farm.
Reassess when you’re off your period, bro!
He’s that now. See where he’s at from 32-35 when you’re paying him $18 mill. How is that an underpayment? Is he going to be worth $25 mill for his mid 30s? Unless you’re Pudge, but he was largely a bat only player later into his run with the Chisox
@MJ Pache isn’t good, Langeliers ceiling is Murphy.. and when’s the last time a pitcher the Braves traded away been good since Wainwright? So yes the Olson deal was a steal for the 30hr gold glove 1B to replace Freeman and to sign him under market value.. and what they gave up for Murphy wasn’t anything great either.. we saw Muller get rocked in the MLB just like those other so called prospects they waited too long to trade and got nothing for Touisant comes to mind ..
Bigmetsh8ter
You obviously understand nothing about pitching whatsoever.
“Strider – choked in Philly. Hopefully gets better from it.”
“Choked”…
This is the biggest garbage take from 2022. Strider hadn’t pitched in almost a month, his velocity was down by about 6mph.
Now I wonder why that would be, yet here you are saying he “choked”..
None of the thr prospects that the Braves have traded away have panned out. The Braves know what they are doing. When they are willing to trade a prospect, it’s because they likely see a low ceiling with the player.
The Braves had a bad farm before all the trades, mainly because their top guys had already graduated to the majors. The only prospect imo that looks like he could be a good MLB regular is Langaliers but he didn’t exactly light the league on fire his first year either.
Langaliers has little chance of ever being as good as Murphy.
What an awful take. You sound like a spoiled, petulant child.
MJ – With all due respect this has to be the most pessimistic take on the Braves moves. I’m not even a Braves fan but seems like the Braves are one of the smartest organizations in the game. You’re buying out great players in their prime years and often have reasonable club options at the end. I’m not sure how the sky is falling when you have 8 all star level players all in their prime and all locked up for 5+ years. That seems extremely saavy, and much smarter than throwing $300M contracts at 30 year olds.
@MJ: “You can’t win a WS with an automatic out in your lineup.” Martin Maldonado and the Houston Astros said to tell you hello.
@NashvilleJeff Agreed. The greatest teams in baseball history routinely had at least a couple of duds in their lineup. 1939 Yankees, 1927 Yankees. The 2001 Mariners won 116 with 4 mainstays with OPS+ around 90. … The 2022 Dodgers won 111 games with three guys who were well below average.
I see this every offseason. Fans screaming because their teams have a hole somewhere in the lineup—as if teams didn’t have to make tradeoffs. This year for Yankee fans it’s LF, as if you can buy an AS at every position and your GM is a bum if he doesn’t.
@Smacky: Thanks for posting your cringeworthy character analysis of Swanson and Freeman. Harris II mentioned in interviews that Swanson’s nickname in the clubhouse was “The Sheriff.” An “introvert who just wants to be left alone” doesn’t earn that moniker. Your baseless accusation against FF is predicated on some garbage clickbait you read. You’re not qualified to provide insight into player’s personalities/character and you have no personal knowledge of any of them. Btw, there are several other pitchers in the NL West who challenge your claim that “the only good pitchers not in LA were Rodon and Darvish.” Webb w/SF, Gallen w/Arizona, Musgrove and Snell w/SD are a few you “overlooked.”
@ryno: Langeliers is also a Boras client. He wouldn’t have bought into AA’s “pay out arb years and buy a couple of FA years at under market prices” process. Boras takes his clients into free agency.
MJ you just don’t have a clue. Murphy is one of the top five catchers in baseball, and the Braves did a great job of locking him up at reasonable cost. Getting the younger Olson to replace Freeman was another shrewd move.
@Jeff That is a fair point, but it’s different when your automatic out is in LF
@mj This is a parody, right?
If it’s not a parody he’s the greatest soap opera actress ever.
Sir, this is a Wendy’s…
So many holes that they, along with the Astros, have one of the two best rosters in all of MLB.
That’s simply not true.
It’s not 2021 any more bro. Thinking the Braves have one of the best rosters alongside the Astros is the biggest cope I’ve ever seen.
This team is refusing to address one problem after another
Corner OF
SS
DH
All big holes in our lineup for 2023. Last year it was just corner OF (and 2B by way of injury).
Next year add #1 starter to the list. You guys want to sit here with this let me wait and see with Fried approach. I seriously think you just not be paying attention if you think he’s getting extended this late in the game. There’s no more arb years to buy out. An extension is basically full price, meaning it’s too late because they’re too cheap.
End of story.
Your argument goes from
1) The organization spends too much money on overrated players
to
2) The organization is too cheap
Then you go on an existential rant while making a broad conclusion about the state of the franchise and attack AA.
Let’s be real here. AA is obviously an insightful human that recognizes that signing players to extensions before they become too expensive is the way to go. Though Riley and Olson have been mistakes, the others are fine and we will see how they do in a few years.
As for the lacking parts on the Braves, DH and LF are the easiest holes to fill in free agency. Fried isn’t even a free agent until after 2024. And you have several starters locked up for several years apart from Morton. There is plenty of time to find an ace until then.
As an aside, I believe your energy and thoughts are better served elsewhere on the Internet where you attacking people for making financial decisions without understanding their inner calculus can be actually productive. Try YouTube or Instagram for clout-chasing.
So the team has only 3 weak spots? That’s pretty dang good for any team. Let’s start with DH. d’Arnaud will now be splitting time at DH, not bad. Ozuna could very well bounce back somewhat considering his hard contact rate and exit velocity were still top notch. That’s not a bad DH combo by any stretch of the imagination. Next, LF. That spot looks the worst right now but Rosario is also due a bounce back. He’ll have a normal off-season and should be past all of his issues. He had been a very consistent player before last yr so at this point, we can’t assume last yr is the player he is moving forward. Short stop shouldn’t be an issue offensively but the defense is the question. Arcia and Grissom have the bat to replace Dansby. Washington says Grissom has what it takes to play SS and play it well. Who are we to question him considering how great the Braves infield has been? They also have the option of putting Arcia in left against lefties to platoon with Rosario. Those weakness are issues most teams would love to have.
exactly. 2021 is not here anymore. Freddie is gone. Murphy is literally the 2nd best defensive catcher in all of baseball and his hitting will get better. we just signed him for a super deal. we got him for less than the Phillies paid their catcher. let the past go. we have a hole in left field potentially. ss is fine. Washington is a stud with working with the kids on their defense. he will work with the kid to handle ss well. we already know he hits well. just his defense isn’t as good as swanson.
You can both be too cheap and spend too much on overrated players
These aren’t mutually exclusive statements.
The amount spent on an overrated player can be less than what should have been paid to a fully competent player.
It’s very tiring always correcting the low IQ comments on here. If you need to put 30 minutes of thought before hitting the post button please do us all a favor and make the effort.
I’m don’t even going to bother reading the rest of that diatribe. You haven’t earned it by thinking spending too much on overrated players means it’s not possible for them to simultaneously be cheap.
They’ve basically overpaid for an inferior product because the higher quality product was too expensive. It’s like paying $5k on an old used car that breaks down constantly vs. finding the funds to pay for a perfectly good $15k car that runs fine. You might as well have set the $5k on fire because you’re not getting anything for it. But hey… you saved $10k in the end!!!
Of course they aren’t. However, they have made a few deals that have overspent, while making several more that have been extremely cheap. Therefore, in this scenario, they are mutually exclusive. Your argument falls apart.
As for your strange assumption, I will simply assume that you are just an abrasive person and need to spend your energy elsewhere.
Instead of attacking others for their incorrect opinions, try being introspective and looking at yours for a change.
Fried isn’t a free agent until 2025.
… I thought they won 101 games last year but I guess not.
Simply an inaccurate analogy.
Freeman is 5 years older than Olson.
Both are depreciating assets. Freeman will depreciate quicker.
Freeman is a better player now, but in a year, maybe two, that will be the opposite.
Are you on the team or do you work for them? You used “our”.
I love how much sleep you are losing by posting these ridiculous comments.
Or like you saying other people have low IQ lol
No, in your scenario, finding that extra $10k is an option that is not available in most realities. Atlanta, whether you like it or not, has a budget. If the budget is $5k, that’s what they have to spend. That extra $10k doesn’t magically appear. You’ve said your piece, and lacking the ability to answer those who don’t agree with you, have now resorted to name calling. Saying the same thing multiple times does not make it any more legitimate. Since you feel you are above every one, please don’t waste any more time on us. Its beneath you.
@MJ
The Braves are projected by Fangraphs to win the most games in baseball in 2023 and have the second highest odds to win the World Series. The Braves are still a great team and positioned to be a World Series contender for the foreseeable future. Just admit you have no clue or you’re a troll, whichever one is true.
You know less about the car market than you do about the player market, let me know where I can get a brand new car for $15K.
Let me know does this car come with windshield wipers & door handles.
Your a tool and your take makes no sense.
AA’s philosophy is to pay earlier to buy out the Arb years & in order to do that players take a little less on the back end in order to secure a bigger payday early.
Swanson & Freddie over played their hands. Freddie had his offer in hand all winter & AA chose to call his bluff and secure a 1B for a contending club who if he didn’t & Freddie left & Olsen went elsewhere woulda really hurt
I am a huge Swanson fan but if you think he is a $25 million player you are nuts now is he a $20-$22 million I could see that. But you see all these extensions do you not think AA offered him one at some point ?
He clearly heard the rumblings how Acuna & Albies got robbed blah blah blah and he wanted to hit the market so he got his wish & went to the highest bidder.
That’s a tired take as a fan you invest so much time & money into a team you have the right to say we & us
@MJ: Most MLB teams use the DH spot to rest position players. Very few designate the majority of DH ab’s to a single player. The Braves definitely spread DH ab’s around.
@DTD: “Arcia and Grissom have the bat to replace Dansby” is wishful thinking. at best.
@ryno: “Murphy is literally the 2nd best defensive catcher in all of baseball.” More like he’s in the top five. Realmuto, Will Smith, Adley Rutschman, are all ranked higher defensively than Murphy. Better hitters too.
@AU: “Just admit you have no clue or you’re a troll, whichever one is true.” You know that both of those can be—and in this case are—true. MJ has made these types of cringeworthy arguments for years on the site.
Since 2020 only Realmuto is the C with a higher fWAR than Murphy, I believe . Adley should be higher going forward and you could think that going into his prime into a more offensive home field, a better lineup Murphy will become better than average. I think your arb numbers are skewed, but even going with it, the lack of high-end C depth will create overpays for catchers, or at least more than the 17.6M AAV in 2026, especially when Realmuto at 30 y/o was getting 23.1M AAV in 2021.
I don’t know why you have such a pessimistic view of a team that just won their division this year, and the World Series a year before. The NL east will be a tough fight between all 3 teams, for sure, but the Braves have just a good a chance as the Mets or Phillies. Your statement that they’re horribly run baffles me, most teams dream of having a cost controlled core like Atlanta. Freeman leaving sucked, for sure, but as far as Swanson leaving goes, the dude was overrated IMO. They probably feel like Grissom can be a fine SS. And I don’t know why you’re already predicting Fried to leave, there’s no reason to think that right now.
The Braves have never been picked to finish better than 3rd in the division in any of the last 5 seasons. They’ve won the division each of those seasons. At some point don’t you have to at least ponder that they’re better than everyone else?
No reason to think Fried will leave? Have you not been paying attention?
If he’s not extended by now he’s as good as gone. AA won’t extend him in a contract year.
It’s over, kiss Fried goodbye after this year. Another hole that the Braves will claim they can’t fill with a frontline starter.
By my count after 2023 we will have glaring holes at:
Ace starting pitcher
Corner outfield
Shortstop
DH (thanks to giving away Contreras)
Fried is controllable for 2 more seasons.
Fried has two years left on his contract not one I believe
OH NO! HENNY PENNY THE SKY IS FALLING!!!
By your count after ’23, you’re still wrong. Fried is there through ’24. They have approximately 45 mil coming off the books after ’23. They have said they’ll go over the luxury tax for the right player. There’s a long way to go before the season starts and AA is well known for making trades throughout the season. They aren’t cheap, they spend smart, the sky isn’t falling.
@Smacky ESPN preseason 2022 had the Braves as #3 in all of baseball, highest among any of the NL East teams
espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/33647294/2022-mlb-season-p…
@Smacky, ESPN preseason 2021 had the Braves as #4 in all of Baseball, higher than any other team in the NL east
espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31142014/2021-mlb-season-p…
@Smacky ESPN preseason 2020 had the Braves ranked 6th in all of MLB, higher than any other team in the NL East
@Smacky ESPN preseason 2019 rankings had the Braves ranked 8th in all of MLB, highest among NL east teams
espn.com/mlb/story/_/page/powerrankings032719/mlb-…
@Smacky, you would need to go all the way back to 2018 to find a season the Braves weren’t picked to be the best in the NL East (it was the Nationals in 2018)
I agree with you on everything but Max Fried is 100% leaving for probably the Angels if I were to guess. No way AA extending Fried for the money he is gonna want into his 30’s too in FA. Fried staying would be about as shocking as the Braves landing Othani for me next offseason.
@Mj: You can’t count.
Most of all of the projections systems, Baseball Prospectus etc all pick the Braves to not come in 1st. I understand what espn may say, but the analytical and ‘better’ sights have not picked the Braves to win the division since like 13′ I think.
You’re an obvious Mets troll. Your team will never be anything and will always be the laughing stock of MLB LOLmets
I’m not sure who you are responding to @littlesteviejanowsly, but if it’s me, I’m a Dodger fan, and all I posted was actual ESPN projections in response to Smacky claiming that the Braves had NEVER been picked to finish higher than 3rd in their division in the past 5 years. If responding with fact and links to prove the fact cause you to call someone a troll, then the problem is you.
I could take issue with any number of aspects here, but…
By definition, Sean Murphy isn’t just an average hitter. He posted a 122 wrc+ last season, and has a 116 wrc+ in his career. Dude put up 5.1 fwar last year. He’s quite a good player, and this is another very solid extension for a team doing a lot of it. Few organizations can claim to have as secure and high-ceiling of a core as the Braves, and I’m not even a fan whatsoever.
Wrc of 116 yet he’s a .236 hitter.
You can sit there and say the wrc means he should be better but at the end of the day he doesn’t get the results and that’s what counts.
Wrc is a formula that’s meant to predict, and predictions can be wrong.
I’m not against advanced metrics by any means but at the same time to be overly reliant on them and ignore the foundational numbers of a player is equally misinformed.
Wrc is only 1 number and so far he’s underperformed what his wrc says he should be doing from a production standpoint.
Instead of looking at that and going “ok well then it MUST get better”…. Maybe stop and ask “why hasn’t it already gotten better?”
It could be there’s just something off about it. 116 career wrc hitter but also a .236 avg hitter with 12-15 HRs a year. You got two styles of numbers that don’t line up and only one of them counts for actual game production.
I know it’s incomprehensible for many of you to fathom, but it could be his wrc is misleading and his track record seems to indicate the wrc is more misleading than his actual production to this point.
He gets on base, has great plate discipline, and has decent power.
Really not that difficult to understand.
Wrc is park adjusted I believe. Oakland’s home stadium suppresses batting average due to the huge amount of foul territory that is playable. Simply looking at his .236 ba does not come close to telling the whole story.
wRC+ isn’t predictive. It’s an analysis that takes ballpark and other external factors to weigh how good a player’s performance has been on an overall basis without being dinged for factors out of their control. A 116 wRC+ doesn’t predict that he should be 16% better than league average going forward, it states that he’s been 16% better than league average at creating runs for his team’s offense.
You don’t understand how to properly evaluate player performance, and that is entirely okay. Wrc+ is merely one metric. It’s a nice all-encompassing one that shows his entire offensive profile relative to the league average. Thus he was 20% better than the league average hitter last season. But I get the sense anything beyond batting average and home runs is a little too much for ya.
I agree. People look way too much into these made up Brian Kenny stats instead of looking at the ones that matter for evaluating a player.
Are you going for the world record for the most embarrassing, low IQ takes in a single comment thread, MJ?
Because you’re killing it right now.
Batting averages are down across the league, so Matt’s 116 wrc and low batting average are not incompatible.
I haven’t watched other teams much, but Matt seemed to hit into the shift more than any other Brave. He will be one of the biggest beneficiaries of the shift ban.
Much better hitter outside of Oakland. 15 million a year is a bargain.
Average hitter lmao ok bud
I will give you that losing Freeman is a huge hit. That whole situation is kind of crazy, but losing Swanson isn’t too big of a deal. He has had 1 full season of OPS+ over 100, and it was his walk year. Everything else was 60 game 2o20 or under 100 OPS+ for someone who is supposed to be on the same tier as Trea Turner or Carlos Correa, those numbers aren’t great.
Catcher is an even harder position, so getting any offensive output from that position is good, especially when they are that good defensively. A Catcher like this is compared to someone like Yadier Molina or Buster Posey. Buying out some arbitration and signing him for that money for PRIME years is a steal even if he doesn’t hit at the same clip. Having a catcher that is top 3 in framing is great for a pitching staff, once he plays more games and gets more experience this guy has the tools to be a stud, buying him for 6yrs/75m is a good deal.
The Braves are being smart. Why should they sign Swanson to that big contract when the Mets are gonna dominate the East with the Phillies behind them for the next 2-3 years. Be smart take the wild card and anything can happen in the playoffs. The Braves still have a solid young core and will still be contenders with most of them still in their prime when the Mets and Phillies start to show their age and decline. Remember when the Braves got Fried from the Padres he came over with a recently reconstructed arm. It seems to be a common thread that pitchers who get a TJ often get another in their 30s. It might be a smart idea to let him walk if he expects a David Price contract. The Cubs will regret giving Swanson that deal. The Braves will look smart for avoiding it. You can’t get upset when teams don’t see their current players as worth the contracts they are being offered by other teams. Even the Dodgers let Seager go and the Yankees let Cano walk. They are the richest clubs in MLB. If the deal isn’t right it’s not right.
I stopped reading when I saw your name
I can’t tell if this is a parody account or not.
Braves sign Murphy for 100 mil less the Swanson got from the cubs . Also a real Braves fan will always go watch the Braves in tv or at truist park regardless of how the Braves are playing . Being a playoff team only made ticket prices go up .
What the hell are you smoking? Olson did a damn good job in his first year as a Brave. He had pretty big shoes to fill and he did so. Now without the shadow of Freeman looming overhead, he’ll take off. He had 34 homeruns and 103 RBIs for Christ sake and you think he was a mistake. GTFO of here with that nonsense. You need to lay off the pipe and go to bed. Seriously what are you thinking?
This MJ guy is trolling right? Stopped reading after he said the braves are horribly ran lmao. Ok buddy.
MJ: Don’t agree with this at all.
First, Murphy is a top four catcher in baseball, and at a prime age. His performance at the same age matches Realmuto. Murphys contract, if viewed as you described, is far more affordable than Realmutos $24 mil per season thru age 34.
Lack of a good farm system presently doesn’t mean much when Atlanta is set at 1B-2B-3B-C-OF-OF for at least six years.
Three years is an eternity in MLB, and the Braves…who have obviously been a contender for the last five years…look to be at that level long past another three years.
Are the Braves a wealthy franchise? Yes.
But they are a very well run wealthy franchise.
This organization executes a great plan. I just wish they would change their name to the Indigenous Peoples or First Citizens.
Several Native American groups have stated that the issue isn’t the name. It’s the representation of indigenous people including the “screaming Indian” logo, the Tomahawk chop and various forms of cultural appropriation.
I have definitely heard the most outrage about the chop. But I personally know several Native Americans who find the current team name offensive. Even if Native Americans are divided on the issue, there is no reason to keep this outdated name, logo and chant. They should come up with a plan to change in the next few years. That being said, it is a really well run organization. They should be smart enough to turn their future name change into an advantage.
Yea Cleveland and Washington both screwed up royally with their name changes. Never liked the idea of the name changes and what was done or not done was straight up disappointing and generic.
I am of Nordic ancestry and find the use of “Vikings” imagery offensive. The Minnesota Football Club needs to change their name and logo to placate me.
I’m a distant relative of Blackbeard and I find Pittsburgh Pirates to be offensive. I even shaved my beard off so no one would make the connection…
Gives us scallywags a bad rep…
The braves have the permission of the northern band of the cherokee nation to use the name. Their principal chief attends braves games.
Dynasty in the making. Mets can spend 1 billion they aren’t beating the braves franchise is ran like a well oiled machine.
wow
Are we seeing other teams emulate the AA approach to rapid extensions?? Maybe not so much…he’s starting to get a little trigger happy with these…some will inevitably backfire…cost/benefit analysis can be hard to forecast with such small sample sizes like with Harris and Strider, what if they are One and Done’s??
I think the idea is you look at the aggregate of these deals. It’s inevitable that one or more won’t be worth their contract but in 2025 you say, “Were Murphy, Olsen, Albies, Riley, Acuna, Harris and Strider worth the combined $96M they made?”.
If 4 of the 7 play at a star level, then you’re getting value.
You have to keep in mind the new ROY rules too.. The main reason they jumped out and extended Strider and Harris are because each were being granted a year of service time for t a top 3 finish. The Braves couldn’t afford to allow those guys to walk only getting 4 more years out of them.
You need to reread the CBA. They wouldn’t get an extra year, just full credit for one year even though Harris was brought up in May. Strider was on the team on opening day, so his status wasn’t affected anyway.
Never saw that coming…
How do the Braves keep getting away with this
@Sherlock with two arb years to buy out, what do you think would have been an appropriate total?
Because living costs in Georgia are so much lower than many parts of the country a much MUCH higher standard of living costs less.
The guys like who they’re playing with, know they’re in the mix to make the playoffs in any given year, have a winning tradition and good team morale.
The fact the management is proactive and shows real interest in the players even early on as a show of faith doesn’t hurt either.
Because they buy out arbitration years. There’s some risk involved bc if these players don’t pan out, they are stuck with them long-term and for a decent chunk of $. However, they are signing talent and paying them for what they are hoping they going to do and many teams are still waiting until free agency and paying players for what they’ve already done.
Getting away with it? Maybe not the best wording as they aren’t doing anything wrong or dirty.
Aren’t getting away with anything. They are willing to give guys enough guaranteed money to not want to roll the dice on staying healthy and productive.
For Murphy as with Olson, it’s clear that the Braves had discussed the extensions with the players and their agents in advance. If they didn’t have the framework for an extension already in place, Atlanta wouldn’t have made these trades.
12 Mill a year for a top catcher. Heck yeah. Good job AA.
3 of those are arb years… totally changes the AAV calculus
15 Mill for a good defensive catcher that also has some pop is still a bargain.
Great move.
AA does it again.
yessssss
AA is playing chess while everyone else is playing checkers.
That’s good…unless you’re at a checkers tournament.
True story RobM.
Yes. Which may indeed be the case.
Or a baseball game
By extending a catcher with 3 years of control? A catcher who gets value from framing? When robot umps are on the way? It’s a totally unnecessary move
rols1026;
Pitch framing is the dumbest, nonsensical, and worthless baseball statistic I’ve ever seen.
The catcher is easily the most important position on a MLB team. What he does partnering with the pitchers, calling and running a game, and blocking balls in the dirt turns teams seasons around.
If he hits, that’s a bonus.
Sean Murphy does all those things at an upper level.
Well your opinion is not only irrelevant but just factually wrong. Framing is the most important part of being a catcher. By far. Like it’s not even close. Why do you think Austin hedges, who can’t hit his own weight, got $5 mil? Murphy gets tons of value from pitch framing and that will be gone the second robot umps are introduced. And then at that same time guys like William Contreras will gain tons of value. Anthopolous is living in like 2015 lol
rols1026;
LOL
Did you play any ball?
We’ve had retired pro catchers on here that said the same thing as me about the framing stat.
Austin Hedges got his money (and his current contract) because he works with pitchers so well, calls games and blocks balls in the dirt so the pitcher can throw hard breaking pitches in a critical situation even with a baserunner on 3B in a close game. He’s in Pittsburgh to help bring along their young pitchers.
Umpires have different strike zones depending on how they set up behind the catcher. He’ll give or take strikes depending. Both teams catchers get credit for that in a game. Professional hitters know when the ump has a large, small, high, low, right side, left side strike zone – and they make adjustments….because making adjustments is what pro baseball players do.
Dude I’m not even gonna waste my time responding to someone who’s just gonna ignore reality…. I’m pretty sure you’re just trolling cause there’s no way you actually believe any of that. Or you haven’t done a single second of research. Either way you’ve embarrassed yourself lol
@Samuel: I agree 100% with your take on pitch framing. It’s a useless value component when evaluating a catcher.
What it is though, is something that should have been used, to get BAD UMPIRES OUT of baseball.
How is framing useless lol it’s literally used by teams?? You guys are so clueless lol why do you think sites like Fangraphs literally changed their WAR model to include it? Bunch of clueless amateurs on this site smh
You’re just wrong about this. Pitch framing is easily the most important and valuable part of being a catcher. It’s statically proven.
And we are at least 4 or 5 years from having robot umps, see next CBA as the most likely timeline.
Contreras would probably have cost less over that term.
LOL. Yes, a DH will cost less. A top-5 catcher, however, would not. Contreras will not be a top-5 catcher.
Contreras is a better overall player then Murphy. Braves fans would have agreed with this assessment two months ago but are now caught up on the Murphy hype train.
Contreras is a better offensive player and he improved a lot as a receiver, but he just isn’t ever gonna be the complete catcher that Langeliers or Murphy are.
If he continues to improve and makes me eat my words, I would be genuinely happy for him. He’s a great guy and we wish him the best. NGL, it hurt to give him up, he’s got a great future in the MLB, but more as a hitter than a defensive player
You must not have been watching the same games as I watched. Contreras is weak defensively.
@SoCalBrave, would you care for some Grey Poupon to go along with those words? LOL
Stop yourself Run. I’ve watched way too many Cubs games to know that this whole “he can’t catch” talk is just nonsense. So he doesn’t frame well, yeah ok. But he has a strong and accurate arm and he is a leader. He has tons of energy and enthusiasm for the game of baseball. How he calls a game & how he handles a staff is something that truly none of us know unless we’re on the inside, which most of us are not.
I was talking about William whom Sean was traded for, but now I see he meant Willson.
The how come he only threw out 14% of base runners last year with a great arm? The gloves or arms got that matter aren’t even close between the 2
I’m not sure Contreras will be a catcher in a few years…much less 7
That’s funny. 24 years old and has elite tools. The only reason he DH so much this year was because e Braves had two all star catchers.
Not great defensively and his hitting stats don’t look sustainable.
Contreras was traded because the Braves think he will be a DH. He doesn’t have the defensive chops to be an MLB catcher (pitch framing, throwing out runners, etc). And as a DH he is way, way less valuable, hence the trade for Murphy.
He is barely a catcher now. Defense matters.
Guys, I think we need to start addressing them as W. Contreras and W. Contreras, to avoid confusion.
Lol excellent
Great signing and another bargain.
Cheaper than I expected
Great signing!
I find it hard to believe that even the A’s couldn’t afford that contract
Every team can afford this contract and every other one that’s ever been given out.
They can, but the owner sucks
Braves have a young controllable team for almost forever.
This is a perennial contender in the biggest spending division in baseball now.
Hard to not like AA. Think they’re going to need to do something about SS. The lineup is good enough to not need much of a bat but they are sorely missing a glove.
Other than that—-man, this team looks so strong even 4 years down the line. Rare to see that combination.
It will be interesting to see if Vaughn improves on defense over the next few years. Most players get to do that in the minors for a while
fivepoundbass;
The Braves have the best infield coach in MLB over the past 60 years.
Watch what happens.
Honest question to you folks who have watched Vaughn Grissom: is his defense shown to be that shaky?
@Dogbone:
I attribute some of Grissom’s defensive shakiness to moving to 2B at the MLB level after never having played at the position before. He may never be a great SS, but he’s definitely more comfortable there, and won’t have conflicts with the right fielder.
Forever comes sooner than you’d expect, but yes, they’re set up nicely for the next four to five years.
1 of those “3 rival teams” checking in on Correa is definitely ATL on a creative short-term deal or with an opt-out to prove his durability, get him back to playing playoff baseball and prove he is worth $300M. ATL was talking to him about this when he bit on MIN last year WITH Swanson…it’s still on the table now without Swanson and a SS need.
The Braves made it to the World Series in 1999 with a combination of Walt Weiss, Ozzie Guillen, and Jose Hernandez at SS. Arcia and Grissom can’t be any worse than that group. I could see them bringing in a Jose Iglesias or Elvis Andrus as insurance though
@RSox: Good points. They’re already over the first threshold, so bringing in Iglesias or Andrus is no big deal.
Braves doing it better than Anyone.
HOW?!?! They can’t keep doing this lol
He’s getting 15 per year after the arbitration years are up. Willson Contreras is making a little over 17. Doesn’t seem out of sorts to me
Wilson Contreras is older and a much worse pitch framer. Murphy is already more valuable than Contreras. He should have gotten $25M+ for his free agent years, not $15M.
Easy to keep doing this. Much cheaper and smarter than paying more money for 35 and 40 year olds in free agency.
Great deal for ATL.
Great deal for both. He’s set for life and is with an organization that’s willing to spend money and treat it’s players well.
Another great job of placing money on the table for a players grandchildren. Hard to walk away from more money than you can spend.
I like your perspective here hinerism. We’re so desensitized to the hundreds of millions thrown around in professional sports, that we forget that, for most of us, just getting $10 million once in a lump is enough to change our families lives forever.
Not to mention, the balls to offer it to from an organizational stand poin, the guy has yet to take a swing in your uniform and you’re saying we want you here for 6 more years anyway.
Also from AA perspective, the pressure of not signing it. What then? You’re saying a championship level team just traded their farm for you and you don’t want to sign an extension? What kind of message does that send to your locker room? And if you say no, what does that say to other teams? This guy only cares about getting paid not winning
It’s quite the gameplan AA has here, it’s risky but a lot of these guys are supposed to All star talent and they’re also all definitely tradable worst comes to worst
Great deal for Atlanta.
But let’s not discount this is guaranteed generational wealth for Murphy.
And he’s a catcher, a class of players prone to injury and decline.
I see
Braves are either gonna look like the smartest team ever or end up with a flaming hot pile of crap if this goes sideways somehow
He is one of the best defensive C in baseball going into his prime, which creates a very high floor. He already hits for average on a bad team in a pitchers park – no reason to think he couldn’t be above avg offensively in a hitters park in a better lineup. There is risk, but take that along with a huge lack of C depth over the next few years and you can see that this is not that risky.
.250 is hitting for average?
For a catcher, I will take that any day.
Per OPS+, Murphy has been better than Swanson 3 of the last 4 years. No one looks at AVG. Put him in ATL’s lineup and not striking out at 30-35% and you’re going to be better than average.
3 of the last four years? He barely played in year 1&2. Did you really use 53 & 116 abs to compare him to a full time player? I love how Brave fans start saying how bad a player really was after they leave but was a stud before he left.
True, but you could also take Murphy’s 2022 OPS+ being better (120 OPS+ vs. Swanson’s 115 OPS+ – even with Murphy’s 2022 .250 AVG that some are snubbing). So in Swanson’s so-called breakout year, Murphy’s OPS+ was still better than Swanson’s – in a much worse OAK lineup.
If you’ve followed me, I’ve never loved Swanson. Loved his gamemanship and both from Marietta, but his hitting and fielding have been incredibly inconsistent over the years (2022 OAA almost 3x higher than previous career-high). He’s a great face for a rebuild, but AA priced him accordingly.
A high floor if robot umps aren’t introduced… which they will be. He had 3 years of control doing this now makes zero sense
Cost certainty/control while also buying out at least three free agents (4 if the option is exercised). Makes perfect sense
No it doesn’t. How about actually make him play out the 3 years of control he had to prove his worth. Instead we trade our starting DH and solid back up catcher for a catcher just so he can get a raise? The team is not better after the trade. They were better before hand. The Braves are no longer a championship caliber team and we can thank AA for that. He has turned us into a Midwest team. High payroll with no real players to account for the payroll. They believe in Grissom so much, he got serious under value out of Contreras. He practically gave him away. There should have been no need to include a 3rd team(who got like 7 players) while the Braves got 1. What a sad joke that all of the thick fans think is a win. Sure as all get out aren’t spending like they want to be a top 5 payroll.
And we have no left fielder either. This deal makes no sense. There was no need for it. Contreras must have told AA he wouldn’t sign an extension so he gave him away for less than peanuts.
Technically they have 4 with Ozuna, Rosario, Sam Hilliard, and Jordan Luplow
There is more to catching than pitch framing, which is quite subjective.
Sorry, but d’Arnaud should not be the starting C getting a bulk of the starts, when you have an open DH slot. He’s more effective at the plate, and though he’s gotten better, he’s not anywhere near Murphy defense (pop times, arm, etc.). D’Arnaud is about to be 34 y/o in 02/23 and has had injury issues his whole career. His value in his bat, Murphy is an upgrade to d’Arnaud by keeping him healthy and in the lineup (and presumably Ozuna out of it).
This is cheap! He probably would get around 20 million in arb, but the free agent years at only 15 million and the team option make this a great deal! Consider the free agent inflation, and this may be half of what free agent catchers like him get.
I really hope John Fisher, owner of the A’s, received truckload of gorilla in his billion dollar mansion for Christmas. What an unbelievably cheap, disgusting, no good excuse for a MLB owner in the history of ever. So depressed to be an A’s fan. 6/67 for a catcher in his prime is a BARGAIN, unless you’re the A’s owner
He invests in his art collection and donating to right wing politicians rather than in his baseball and soccer teams
You just gave me two more reasons to hate him. Thanks. Hope a heavy chandelier drops from the ceiling of his mansion and onto his greedy, disgusting, worthless pathetic dumb face
Geoff
Empathy and kindness are the attraction of the left. If you surrender to hate, you will be overcome by the dark side.
Next year Braves will give Ohtani a smoking deal. 30m 15 years
With AA negotiating he might just take it
In a reverse universe, maybe.
Do they have dirt on every player they sign or something? The deals are almost always shockingly low.
dshires4: No, some players are more than willing to sign for MULTI-GENERATIONAL WEALTH at a very young age (early-mid 20’s) while others are looking to make (& spend) as much as they can.
Don’t know why everyone thinks this is a bargain? He was slated to make a little more then 3 million this year. He probably wouldn’t have come close to the 12m aav before he was eligible for free agency. The Braves really signed him for 3 years and around 18 aav in age 31-34 seasons. By that time mlb will have an automated strike zone and his value decreases.
18 would still be a bargain. Salaries are only going up and pitch framing is only one small part of catching.
Best response here. Everyone else is overreacting like crazy. Way too much hype in these comments. This deal makes no sense
I am kind of watching for this to become a giant dumpster fire that burns for years! I meam you can’t extend everyone and it end up good for the team.
Squint and imagine how this could all go bad. Harris II is a one-hit wonder who wrecked the league and then never was good again. Strider becomes Trevor Rogers in year two and settles in as a #4 starter.
Acuña never gets to be good again and is only a 3 WAR player each season. Riley and Olson eventually starts to struggle due to high strikeouts, and Murphy regresses offensively to being an all glove catcher.
Their gamble requires these players to all produce excess value to justify their contracts because there’s virtually no wiggle room in their budge to hunt free agents or keep psying breakouts.
Not really.
These deals are mostly below market rates because they were made with years of control. Even if Acuna is a 3 WAR player—he’s eminently tradeable on his contract.
So are Albies and Harris. Olson and Riley would be the only potential boat anchors.(which is not to suggest they are but they’re the only 2 deals with the real possibility of a total albatross)
There’s some risk now that these players have less of an incentive to receive large pay raises via performance but I think the culture will solve that issue. A lot of young guys that want to win together and can push each other.
This is really how you want a baseball team to be set up for a long competitive window.
I literally just gave you an example for Strider that happened in 2021 and 2022 with Rogers in Miami.
I gave you an example for Michael Harris II in Dustin Ackley. Just to be clear, while young, Michael Harris also has a lot of swing and miss in his game, more than Ackley did in the beginning and Dustin Ackley was a much more highly touted prospect than Harris. Ackley posted a 3.7 WAR in 2011 at 23 years old, 2.6 WAR in 2012 at 24 years old and finished his career with 1.4 from 2013 until he retired four years later for a career WAR of 7.7 over 6 seasons.
These deals are market rate, there is no discount and when Strider signed we established this by comparing a best case scenario of him producing like Corbin Burnes or Max Fried, both of whom will get less than $50M over their pre-arb years. Strider is getting paid through his arb years as if he will be Corbin Burnes or Max Fried and then get a $25M free agent year tacked on.
If Strider matches Corbin Burnes effectiveness for his whole contract, he would’ve made $50M during his arb years as proven by Burnes and Fried. His free agent contract would then include approximately $35M/year as opposed to the $25M year he just got, don’t believe me? Carlos Rodon a 6 WAR pitcher, who is the same age as Strider would be during what would’ve been his first free agent season, got $27M/year. So $35M is pretty generous estimation for Strider.
We’ll assume he continues to dominate and they pickup his option, then they save another $13M. So, BEST CASE, the Braves saved $23M, right? But wait, they also artificially increased their cap total in 2023 and 2024, So Strider makes $1M in both years, but the team takes a “CAP HIT” of $12.5M. It is hard to imagine them not incurring $23M in penalties for exceeding the luxury cap.
So BEST CASE, they break even if his career path has him on his way to the Hall of Fame at 30 years old. Anything less than multiple All-Star games, gold gloves, and Cy Youngs will make it an upside down contract. If he regresses, then they have to keep paying him and another guy to pitch in the rotation while he goes to the bullpen or checks the bench for splinters.
The Harris extension was early but he has a strong floor unlike Ackley. His speed and D make him a likely starter even with a decline in the bat. He was also barely 21 last year so there’s reason to believe he can improve those things. not a lot of minor league seasoning for him.
You make good points and the Braves are definitely risking things here. Pre-arb deals have tons of value. I’m saying if things don’t go out as well with Strider and it ends up being a “bad extension” it’s probably still a moveable one if he ends up being more of a #3 because FA prices are what they are.
Free agents are really costly. I would rather gamble on 2 guys with the same potential and hope one of them pans out and the other is above average than gamble on 1 guy with the same money and hope he is better than the other two combined (wins above average or something qualitative like it).
It’s a safer bet than free agency. I mean, if you want to talk about a roster that has potential to go wrong in a bad, bad, way – it’s the NL team in New York.
The Mets have zero chance of going wrong… they have the richest owner and zero long term contracts outside of Lindor…. Almost no guaranteed money after 2024… What are you even talking about lol
I’m more encouraged by the Mets farm and their recent drafting and talent evaluation. Being able to spend is fun, but having core homegrown talent is the key to be able to do that and still win.
Very low chance of all the met prospects being busts. Alvarez in only 12 ab showed a compact, powerful swing, and was getting into a little groove w a HR and 2b his last couple games. Baty showed a good bat too. Their defense not so much.
Their babips were around 150 as opposed to Harris’ 361. Expect regression w him this year btw. Anyway, between Alvarez baty parada ramirez Williams Tidwell vientos mauricio Allan, even if just 2-3 of them pan out, that will make an impact. It’s more likely 2-3 of them will than all of them won’t.
Only thing I saw of note out of Alvarez is that he had some epic bat tosses. Thank god for the nets that protect the fans. Dude’s in the dug-out all had on batting helmets when he was at bat.
What are the odds of all that happening or even more than 1. Acuna contract is a bargain even for a 3 war player.
17m a year isn’t a bargain for a 3 war player.
Yeah, actually it is. Think the current valuation of 1 WAR is $8.5M so 3 WAR is $25.5M. $17m is a bargain. And we know Acuna is more of a 5+ WAR player when healthy.
@Pachoo If anyone can show that war wins actually equal wins, and all of those theoretical dollar values that they are worth actually get paid out, I would love to see that information.
They are officially a tax payer
And all the whining about Liberty Media being cheap can now mercifully end.
Braves fans better hope these players are as good as the brass they think they are. They are going be around for a long time if they suck.
we can still trade them lol with cost friendly deals
Besides Albies , who is on a cost friendly deal now?
Almost everyone on the team with a long term contract? Like literally everyone of them besides Strider and Olson.
I guess you don’t know the value of pre arbitration and arbitration values of players.
Seriously first class organization. Top down. And best team in NL EAST
It is clearly run the best run organization in the NL East, but the players on Atlanta, New York and Philadelphia are quite evenly matched now.
The Braves extending their good young players for cheap reminds of the Breaking Bad meme where Jesse says “He can’t keep getting away with this”. Atlanta must be a great place to play
dude wtf we cant even compete why cant the cubs do this 🙁
We could extend Hoerner in that mold. No one else on the team where I would be ready to do that.
I agree Manny. And they better get Hoerner extended, sooner the better, and yes, I say that knowing he’s still a couple years away from free agency.
I meant like 5 years ago, we could’ve extended the cre of swarbomb, wilsonn, Javier swing baez and brizzo
Why would Murphy sign such a low contract?
Guaranteed set for life money no matter what happens. Would you turn it down and hope you stay healthy and elite for 3 years so you could get 20 million instead of 15?
Saw that coming. Actually took longer than I thought it would and was for almost exactly what I thought it’d be. Man they work quick.
Mass Producing These Instant Mid Budget Extensions.
Excellent extension. All his prime years at 15 million. Can’t do it much better than Atlanta. Mets will need to keep spending to keep up. Braves set up for the rest of this decade.
I would bet on Alvarez’s future more then Murphy’s by a long shot. The Mets will have more value over the next 6 years behind the plate then the Braves.
Bold move. Most if not all gms would go with the proven years of track record.
Mets6986
We do not even know if Alvarez will end up as a big league catcher. His ceiling is much higher than Murphy but his floor is much lower.
You could poll one baseball scouts and you would get different opinions as to the ranking among Alvarez, Cartaya and Moreno. Murphy is a known quantity. Realmuto and Smith are the only better catchers in the Nl.
The Braves had two better catchers then Murphy last year. Everyone can say Contreras was bad behind the plate but he was critical to a 101 win team and it was his first full season in the mlb. He didn’t catch more because Darnaud was the best catcher in the nl last year. Murphy’s sabremetrics we’re overvalued because he was in a horrible team. He is not the third best catcher in baseball.
Agree that Alvarez’s bat looks like it will end up way ahead of Murphy’s, but I don’t think his defense will ever be close. And hitting wise, Parada could end up better than both. But who knows with prospects – some can never translate the skills to success at the MLB level.
Lol that’s hilarious. Look at the build. You notice who the best catcher is year in and year out right? Realmuto…. Murphy has an athletic build just like him and is 2nd to only him in all aspects of being a catcher. Alvarez is 2 cheeseburgers from being Volgelbach.
Let’s revisit this comment in two years. He may not need to catch to provide big value with that bat. There’s a reason he’s a top 5 prospect.
Not with Alvarez being bad defensively and apparently a poor pitch framer. I’d bet on Murphy being more valuable than Alvarez over their careers. How long can Alvarez even remain a catcher with poor defense and pitch handling?
He’s not even rated as a poor catcher. Degrom and Scherzer both said he was very good behind the plate. I’ll trust the two best pitchers in the last ten years about how good of a catcher he is. Meanwhile at his age Murphy was no were near the majors.
“Mets will need to keep spending to keep up. Braves set up for the rest of this decade.”
Braves have one of the worst farm systems in the league. If even a couple of these extensions go south, who are they bringing in to fix things? The rest of this decade is a very long time.
They still have good prospects. Some look like keepers with plenty others for trades. More prospects every year. They don’t need top 5 picks to find talent. Impressive how good they are. Definitely set for the rest of this decade.
They had the 29th ranked farm system before they traded a couple away. They don’t have good looking prospects. They will be battling to make the playoffs this year. The Mets, Padres and Cardinals will win their divisions. The Phillies, Dodgers and Brewers will be the wild card.
They were and still are better than 29. Better find a new prospect evaluation source. They will be in the playoffs as well.
According to my wife, some of them are very good looking.
I just double checked. Fangraphs has them last. Mlb and sport illustrated has them 27th. SI has them 28. Next time I’ll say 27th to give you the benefit of doubt. This was before they traded their top and eight prospect.
Then that trumps the rankings… case closed
Fangraphs had Pache as a 60 and Waters as a 55. Strider Grissom 45 Harris 50. Yeah they are awesome. I will have to keep doing my own evaluations until some outlet can get remotely close to my level.
Braves still put over $620M into contracts with these recent contracts (Olson, Riley, Murphy, Harris, Strider, Morton). Even though the AAVs on some look great now, they’re still spending their fair share.
And the Braves have one of the top talent 25 or under in the majors because their top minor guys graduated. Compare the talent of players 25 and under in the Mets organization compared to the Braves. The Braves blow the Mets out of the water. What 25 or under talent do the Mets even have on their roster? Alvarez and a blocked Baty?
The Braves have Acuna, Albies, Riley, Harris, Grissom, Strider, Anderson, Elders, and Soroka. And Wright is only 26.
What 35 or under talent do the Mets have?
How is Baty blocked? He is an outfielder/3b. Soroka hasn’t pitched in two years. Strider has two pitches and will get caught up with, Acuna has a bum knee and wasn’t that good last year, albies missed most of the year with multiple injuries. Elder is a back of the rotation pitcher. Grissom had a good couple of weeks and reality will set in. The Mets have ten prospects before you would get to a Braves prospect. You made the point of the Braves mistake by bringing up all their young players that already have major injury problems.
Braves have a lot of young talent, no doubt, but to count Elder is a stretch.
Soroka we don’t even know if he’ll ever be a real contributor again, Anderson was awful last year.. Even Grissom, we just don’t know enough yet. The others, no debate there.
Mets have a big pipeline coming, which is why their farm system is ranked higher. Of course, not all of Alvarez, Baty, Parada, Ramirez, Vientos, Mauricio, Tidwell, Williams, Allan will be stars, but I think several of them will make significant MLB impact. Like I said, let’s talk in two years and see.
Hell, I’ll take Peterson over Anderson, Elder or even Soroka at this point.
(1) Contracts go up each year, so even if the player seems like an overpay this yr, it might turn out cheaper in the long run.
(2) We’re handing out long-term contracts to guys who are (A) Not yet in their prime (B) Or just entering their prime.
(3) GM’s from competitive teams have to go WIN NOW mode when you have see the window open. If some of these contracts don’t work out, then what the heck else were the Braves gonna do but suffer in mediocrity??
Only thing I wonder is if they resign freeman and keep langeliers would that have been a better outcome then the world we live in.
Keep Contreras, keep all the other prospects to trade for something else and you have less money tied up over the next 8 years than Olson and Murphy which could have gone to Swanson.
Pache would’ve had 0 value if you held onto him any longer. Dude could never hit and it’s only gotten worse.
But that’ll be the trade off to follow. Freeman Langeliers/Contreras + the other specs v. Olson/Murph
Freeman wanted too much money. He needed the Braves to educate him on what he was actually worth. He wouldn’t have signed until spring training. Too much distraction and Braves needed to find a 1b. Murphy will likely be better than Langeliers.
Freeman wanted too much money? I guess you missed when he signed with LA for less than people expected? Clueless comment
When the Braves pivoted, Freddie’s market evaporated.
I would like to see Toronto offer Jansen something similar. 12 per year for 6 or 7 years has him probably retire a Jay.
Can we trade for AA instead ?
We had him. Good ol Canadian boy too. And Rogers thought Shapiro was the better choice.
Not slagging Shapiro or Atkins. They’ve done a heck of a job inheriting AAs mess (Tulo and Price plus Dickey trades killed the farm plus the oldest MLB team at the time)
But if we could trade AA for Atkins I’d do it in a heartbeat
Lol mess Atkins did nothing he could have traded Tulo but didn’t. They were also left with Vladdy. Both Shapiro and Atkins have won nothing. Both used car salesman. The current team is devoid of offense now and their prospect capital is actually bare.
@whinging I mean why me
1st, the offense is still going to be top 5
2nd, speaking of top 5. Go look at our top 5 prospects, 2 huge LH pitchers hitting 99 on radar guns as well as more up the middle prospects with big boom sticks
Heck even our 30th ranked prospect is an 80 in speed and 60 defense
Please know what you’re talking about before addressing me directly!! Thanks
Top 5 offense LOL Teo, Lgjr, and Tapia had 181 rbis the team total was 750s you think they are going to make that up with never stays healthy kk LOL keep dreaming.
The fact you’re referencing Tapia as a big part of the loss in the lineup automatically disqualifies you.
It is now 100% apparent youre a troll just looking for attention.
Sorry im not your father, run along and find a different place for attention
Why the hell would the Jays do that lol
I miss AA so much…. Signed, 90% of jays fans
He left your team in shambles dude…. Smh
Not really.
And when he came to the braves they were in shambles and look how they turned out
He was young. He admits he made mistakes, and he’s learned from them.
Braves have a plan and by george they stick to it. They will run with the Mets the next 5 years.
Some of the other pre-FA deals they did were robbery, but with Murphy having 3 more arb years, this feels like it probably works out to a 3/54 deal for his age 31-33 years, which, for a short track record catcher, is probably just normal market value at best for the Braves.
Seriously, just stop. Stop it.
Do something useful for once this off season.
With all the NYC pub I read about Francisco Álvarez, who actually thinks he’ll be a better all around catcher than Murphy over the next 6 years? Odds are the Mets will have yet another 1B/DH. Being a quality MLB catcher is difficult.
I’m strongly considering losing my mariners fandom of 36+ years. I appreciate the braves efforts very much. Fu Jerr trader Jerry. This is the braves making a mockery of you all.
I think Jerry is above average. I think AA is top 3-4.
So, the question that really needs to be asked. What is the GM going to do for the next 4-8 years? Seems his game plan is to get paid for the next several years without making any moves …because he won’t be able to at this pace.
On a serious note, and as a Mets fan, the moves that the Braves have been making have all been outstanding. The only one I’d question is the Freeman/Olson decision. The person Freeman is, the clubhouse, his hitting and lastly leadership on the field is the one thing that is hard to find or buy. Otherwise, this team will contend for quite some time.
padam;
Has it occurred to you that the money they offered Freeman will pay for both Olsen and Murphy? Additionally, they’re younger and going to get better while Freddie is going to head in the opposite direction soon.
@samuel – It also occurred to me that they won a ring with Freeman and not with Olson. Don’t think for one second you can replace Freeman, even with Olson and Murphy. His leadership is a difference maker, and his bat is still hot.
@padam
Joc Pederson’s attitude and leadership had more to do with the Braves winning the World Series than Freddie’s did. There’s a reason Freddie’s Braves never won squat except for the one year Joc Pederson was on the team. Braves won more games in 2022 than any year Freddie was on the team. Freddie’s Dodgers did no better in the playoffs than the Braves did with Olson. Freddie also struckout to end the Dodgers season while Olson was the Braves best hitter in the playoffs. Braves also were dealing with the flu going through their clubhouse which had a bad impact on their best starting pitcher. What was the Dodgers excuse for losing to the Padres in October?
Joc Peterson leadership? Never thought I’d hear that in the same sentence.
As for Freddie, the Dodgers had issues prior to his arrival. If anything, his bat along with Betts, Smith and Trea Turner kept them in it.
Yeah, Joc Pederson’s attitude and leadership to make the Braves believe they could do something that nobody on the team believed they could do until he showed up. “We are those MF’ers” was put on the ring for a reason. It’s why the decision to keep Eddie Rosario instead of Joc was such a head scratcher.
News flash bro Joc Pederson sucks. The fact that you’re here trying to claim that Pederson is the reason the Braves won a title is quite possibly the most hilarious thing I’ve read in a while. Are you Joc Pederson?
There’s a difference between being a great on field player and bring an attitude and leadership to the clubhouse. Also, Peterson didn’t suck in the time he played for the Braves. Braves don’t win the World Series without him.
Why couldn’t the Braves pay Fried?
Sucks so bad he’s get paid almost $20,000,000 this year. I wish I sucked that bad.
Inevitably one or more of these signings won’t pan out (Albies?) One or more may want out because tey feel underpaid (Acuna?)
He’ll have to upgrade the fringes constantly.
He’s gotta get the right ones signed next of he really wants to Coast (Fried, Harris) and a few younger SP signed to uber team friendly deals
It’s sunny in ATL but the rain clouds could come any moment. Enjoy it while it lasts
Harris is under contract. Fried is the only real question mark. Since he’s not under contract and he only has two years left, I expect the Braves to let him walk too. They only extend players on team-friendly contracts.
Fried will be a Met in two years.The Braves couldn’t pay him if they wanted too at this point.
Actually, they could pay him, but they’ll choose not to. Not the best use of resources.
Signing one of the top 5-10 pitchers is not a good use of resources? You can’t be serious.
The Braves aren’t going to give out any 8yr, $300M contracts.
Just 10 yr 220 mil contracts? Pitchers like him aren’t easily replaced.
I could be wrong, but I don’t believe AA has given out any long-term contracts to pitchers Max’s age. I wouldn’t mind if he does, but I won’t hold my breath. If Max goes to FA in two years, he’s as good as gone.
I know MLB is ultimately a business but how do the A’s have any fans? They ship out any player the moment they become successful. MLB should force them to sell the team but of course they never would. Also this seems like a huge overpay for money and years for what he is from the Braves
The A’s currently have a younger C that they feel will be even better than Murphy, which I believe they acquired from… Atlanta. This is a trade that had little to do with the A’s owner being cheap, in this case.
A’s invented moneyball. AA is writing the next chapter.
This is exactly what I was hoping either Chicago team would do this offseason. Trade for this exceptional and available young catcher to be their core backstop going forward and then lock him up with a contract extension. Even the freaking White Sox could have afforded this deal. For the Cubs it would have been a drop in their cash bucket.
What the WS couldn’t afford were the prospects needed to acquire him. Cupboard is bare.
The White Sox farm is not as “bare” as it was a few years ago after all their top prospects graduated to the MLB roster. Last I checked they have 2 prospects in the top-100 and a couple more who are knocking on the door.
When all the rumors surrounding a Sean Murphy trade surfaced, reports had also suggested the A’s might prioritize pre-arbitration MLB players over prospects, something the White Sox could have accommodated.
People trying to downplay the significance of this signing are haters. This is a great deal for the Braves.
As long as he produces, this is a great deal.
Acuña-8years/$100million ($12.5/yr)
Albies-7years/$35million ($5.0/yr)
Riley-10years/$212million ($21.2/yr)
Harris-8years/$72million ($9.0/yr)
Strider-6years/$75million ($12.5/yr)
Olson-8years/$168million ($21.0/yr)
Murphy-6 years/$73million ($12.17/yr)
Under $100mil/year.
Ridiculous.
You do realize those were the average salaries by years. That is not what they are getting paid this year or in the next couple years. Acuna himself is now 17 m a season.
Yes I realize that those are average salaries by years because I put the average salary per year. Lol
LOL so you do realize most are being paid more then their average now and it’s not less then 100m?
Luxury tax is base off AAV. The info he provided is very important as ATL will still have a low LT number years from now when they are actually paying over.
I can see the upside and the downside to what they are doing. They controlled all these guys for many years regardless of the extension. We won’t know if this is genius until 2025-2026 when all these guys were supposed to be gone.
Do these contracts have no trade clauses? Probably not. A lot can happen to an organization over 6, 7, 8, 10 yrs. For whatever reason, positive or negative, are these deals designed so to keep the player through the deal and/or maybe to just as easily trade him at some point within the term if there’s interest from other teams?
No. Atlanta doesn’t do not trade’s or opt outs
What happens to D’Arnuax? Does he go to the Angels for Max Stassi and prospects?
He transitions to their backup catcher, a la Flowers and Suzuki.
But Travis isn’t going to like that. He’s going to want to play more than twice a week. I think the Braves will have to move him. He’s too good to be just a backup.
D’Arnaud will get a bulk of the DH ABs that keeps him fresh/healthy longer that pads his stats going back into FA where the C market is so shallow he will get another nice AAV contract if not returning to ATL. Having 2 catchers will be a luxury with the DH, much like RBs in NFL.
The Braves don’t pay players to come back once they hit free agency.
I understand your logic and it’s sound, but the question is whether the player buys into it– and I’m not sure he does. He feels he’s a #1 and wasn’t happy about the trade in the first place– he’s not being extended, so they’re telling him how they see his value. This is why you might see him traded to a team like the Angels that could give you a quality backup catcher in return in Max Stassi and prospects. He then becomes the Angels #1 and mentor to their rookie catcher that is a ‘rookie of the year’ candidate.
Did everyone forget the first ATL person to hit up Murphy was D’Arnaud? AA talked to him first before the trade went through. If he didn’t accept the backup roll then AA would have kept Contreras and moved D’Arnaud. D’Arnaud is an injury risk. He’s great in the clubhouse but full time backstop is rough on a 34 year old with his injury history.
If he’s okay with it then there is no issue.
Good contract. I’m only surprised they waited this long to wrap him up.
Yeah, that 2 weeks from the trade was an eternity.
Compared to the Olson deal, it was.
Forced to donate 1 % ? Maybe that’s why they did not keep Freeman, because he would not ? The Braves will try to squeeze every last drop before the 6 years end.
The 1% is standard for Braves contracts. Freddie wouldn’t have given it a second thought.
I think this might be the best run organization in MLB. Time will tell but these all look great.
I just love watching my team become a AAAA sqaud for the Braves.
I love being a Braves fan.
Always a tough crowd at MLBTR.
Smart move.
The Sox should send Bloom to be an intern under Anthopolos. Braves are impressive.
The Braves should have just kept Contreras he’s younger, better, and much cheaper. Regardless this whole thing cracks me up because I remember during the trade deadline so many people were on here talking about how the Yankees were going to have to trade Volpe plus additional players to get Murphy then he gets moved for basically some microwaved prospects and in the end the Brewers get the best player in the deal in Contreras.
Contreras is a DH masquerading as a catcher. That is why the Braves traded him. He won’t be a MLB catcher for long.
I miss AA, stupid cheap Rogers.
One of the best things about the Braves is that none of these long term contract yield one penny to that glorified used car salesman who has managed to do more damage to the economic structure of baseball then even the most hideous of all owners. Boras and Steingrabber deserve each other with their salary Ponzi schemes and relegation of so many franchises to feeder teams for the elite franchises. Yes, the Braves are one of those elite franchises, and I don’t really root for them much at all, but I salute them today.
How do they keep getting these players longterm for so cheap? Very fishy
Because they are buying out cheap years and people are getting fooled by the aav. Murphy was only expected to make 3 m this year.
$3.9M. Instead, he’s getting $4M.
So we agree his actual contract value isn’t 12 m a year and it’s not really a discounted contract.
No, he’s being paid fairly relative to his projected Arbitration. He will be the next two years as well. After that, the Braves are getting a bargain.
Do you not understand how arbitration works in baseball? Lol. Murphy is getting $15M a year for his free agent years, which is an absurd bargain.
How much do you think catchers make? Realmuto is highest paid at 20m and Murphy isn’t realmuto.
No, he’s not Realmuto, but since 2020 only Realmuto has a higher fWAR than Murphy, fwiw. Will Contreras just got 17.5 AAV for ages 31-35 years with a club option for the same in his 36th year. If I were a betting man, I’d say Murphy will have a higher fWAR during his prime in a good ATL lineup than Willson Contreras (ages 31-35). And you need to account for inflation and overpays due to the lack of available high-end catcher option. Look at the next few years free agents and you’ll see that there’s not a lot that will be available, unless someone develops between now and then (very likely).
So in this scenario you showing that Murphy will be making a couple million under value. But it also doesnt show the Braves paying a couple million over value for the next couple years of arbitration years. I’m saying this contract isn’t a steal for player or team. It really is far market value for the stage of players career and what the Braves see his value at as a catcher.
You’re right – it’s fair market, but IMHO, the catching market over the next few years is barren that will cause overpays in the few top-level catching options that will make this deal look better as it gets older, even aside from inflation.
Wow very informative posts! SMH! To say Olson had a bad year is crazy. 34 bombs 100 RBI’s is a bad year? Listen folks, Matt Olson is NOT Freddie Freeman as a hitter accept it please. Braves sold high on Contreras, I liked the kid too, but with the new rules having a catcher that can control the running game and throw guys out is important. Murphy is a GGlover. The Dansby contract didn’t happen because he is NOT a 25 mil per player. He had a great walk year and most stats measures out side of 22 and maybe one other year were bullish on his defensive stats. People forget Swanson in 2016,17,18 and so on when fans were ready to run him out of ATL. We will see this year when he doesn’t have that same protection in the lineup how he fares.
William Contreras 2022 Caught Stealing 14% 36 SB 6 CS
2021 17SB 10CS 37%
Murphy
2022 42SB 19CS 31%
William has a whole lot of trouble throwing out runners, and now with just 2 pick offs allowed, and thankfully the shift is banned, the running game should feature a bit more. Murphy is only behind one catcher in throw over speed to 2nd, and that’s Realmuto. AA has, and is doing an excellent job. It’s sad to lose William, but that’s baseball.
You posted elite throw out numbers from 2021 and then say he has trouble. Most stolen bases are on the pitcher and not the catcher.
SBs are on both, but a catcher’s pop time and arm are the best weapon against SB threats. Runners in Yadi’s day weren’t paying attention to the pitcher as much as the catcher. SBs were a real problem the last 2 years, especially late in games with some of ATL RPs having an affinity for walking the first AB.
Liberty Media is doing some really interesting things here. By locking up, at real expense, a core of talent they are also putting a floor on performance that would be monetized. This team should make the playoffs each year, creating more revenue, etc,
Obviously he was guilted into donating to make an impression in his new city. Wouldn’t be surprised if that money is being funneled back into his pocket as appearance fees or he uses dry cleaning services and other fraudulent expense stipends
Obviously you have no clue what you’re talking about.
OR, he was simply paid 1% more than he otherwise would have been so that this doesn’t cost him anything.
He’s going to want some charitable donations for tax purposes anyway, so why not?
I wouldn’t be surprised that ATL agreed for a couple of million more if he agreed to make a donation. Note that this has been standard in many (not all) of ATL’s extensions and the foundation was important in doing the work the late Henry Aaron championed: mlb.com/braves/community/atlanta-braves-foundation
Like others have pointed out, it’s not necessarily a great extension considering the arb years remaining. However, as a Met fan, I am concerned that the Braves, by locking up their core, will remain an obstacle for the next 5 years.
As a Braves fan, I’m worried about the same thing with the Mets:)
Everyone’s talking about the arb years, but the closer a player gets to FA, the more of a risk in them not re-signing. Considering how shallow the catcher market is over the next few years (we’re seeing that already with backup catchers getting paid), they’re locking in a presumed top catcher’s price now through his prime years, avoiding to have to worry about the shallow C market.
Well, the Braves being the Braves.
I wonder when is Kim Ng is holding her next interview or making her next public appearance.
It’s hilarious how the Anthopoulos keeps trolling Steve Cohen.
I admire that the Braves are able to do this as often as they are, but they won’t all be slam dunk successes, so they know there’s some risk here. I used to be a big Albies guy, but let’s face it, last three seasons, he’s a 258-306-466, 104 ops+ player who’s missed more than half of two of those seasons. At $5M a year, that’s still good value, but it’s not like he’s a perennial MVP contender. Acuna is a monster talent, but can he get back to pre-injury levels? I would think so, but no guarantees. Can Harris and Strider sustain the levels of their rookie years? Maybe, maybe not. I know they’re all low risk with the dollar values, but point is they’re not all sure things. With the contracts to Riley, Harris, Strider, Murphy, Morton, they’ve put out just over $450M, so they’re investing big money too, just on lower cost, lower risk deals per player generally.
Acuna/albies deals will always be good. That was almost theft. Those players have already earned their entire contracts. The most recent deals are more market value with a chance to save some money if the players continue to play at a high level. There is a lot more risk to the last 4-5 they handed out.
I know what you’re saying. Albies has probably just earned the $35M, where Acuna hasn’t earned $100M yet, but should blow that away if healthy. Well, on second thought, maybe with this new players’ market, they have already earned them! Some of this offseason’s contracts are head scratchers.
This is a really undermarket contract. $15M a year (the pay during the last 4 years of this contract) for a 5 WAR catcher is insanely under market.