TODAY: Bieber will be shut down from throwing for the next two weeks, MLB.com’s Mandy Bell writes, and will be evaluated on a week-to-week basis. The good news is that Bieber won’t need surgery, as determined following a consultation today with Dr. Keith Meister.
JULY 15: Bieber has been placed on the 15-day injured list due to right elbow inflammatino, with the Guardians calling up righty Michael Kelly from Triple-A in the corresponding move.
JULY 14: Guardians starter Shane Bieber is going for an MRI on his forearm/elbow area, skipper Terry Francona told reporters (including Mandy Bell of MLB.com and Zack Meisel of the Athletic). While he hasn’t been placed on the injured list, he won’t make Monday’s start as scheduled.
Obviously, the seriousness of the issue isn’t yet clear. Francona suggested that Bieber has pitched through some forearm discomfort for a few weeks. That the club wasn’t concerned enough to send him for imaging before today and hasn’t immediately placed him on the IL could suggest they’re not overly concerned.
If imaging reveals anything that’d send Bieber to the IL, it could have serious ramifications for both the playoff picture and the trade market. Cleveland enters the unofficial second half leading the Twins by half a game in the AL Central. Potentially subtracting a pitcher who carries a 3.77 ERA through 117 innings would obviously be a hit to the roster.
Bieber has also been frequently speculated upon as a possible trade candidate. Cleveland has a number of young pitchers — headlined by Tanner Bibee, Logan Allen and Gavin Williams — who look like quality rotation pieces. A trade of Bieber or (to a lesser extent) Aaron Civale might allow Cleveland to land immediate help for a below-average offense while backfilling the lost innings with a younger pitcher. Bibee and Williams are in the MLB rotation. Allen was recently optioned but seems likely to be recalled with Bieber’s start being skipped.
The 2020 AL Cy Young winner is making just over $10MM this season. He is eligible for arbitration once more before first hitting the free agent market over the 2024-25 offseason.
So much for all those trade rumors.
Hopefully his injury isn’t serious.
If it is, there’s a Tommy repair man only a phone call away.
1on1 trade for Miguel Andujar is still on though.
If Cleveland accepts your proposal, hang up the phone immediately. Remember when everyone thought they were nuts for trading a broken down Corey Kluber to the rangers for reliever Clase and a 4th OF a few years ago?
Man my thought exactly he was likely the best trade chip out there aside from the unicorn. Collages, minor and major leagues have see this epidemic the TJ has become. They have to stop teaching guy to throw with 95%+ of there power every pitch 170+ innings a year. The 100 pitch mark everyone seems to adhere by is ludicrous. The league as a whole need to implement so grass roots ideals for preventive measures at least started and the junior highschool. In no other sport is 1 injury so prevalent and can be seen coming just by the “forearm strain” or “elbow discomfort”. Hockey, football and basketball doesn’t have that 1 super common. It would have to be the MCL/acl in these 3 sports but 2 are contact and 1 involved constant running and jumping. Excluding concussions of course
If you dictated that via your microphone on your cell phone, it didn’t come out well.
He did one better. He used ChatGBT.
Better yet, Murphy used the Team America version of ChatGPT.
Grammar police have concluded alcohol was involved.
Spiders were soooo hoping to add this to the recently list of pitchers they dumped at the exact right moment
Wondered why he wasn’t starting the first game back.
Gee, and here I was told his problems related to a shoulder surgery
from a few years ago.
Yikes.
Ruh-roh.
TJ surgery incoming!
But first an MRI, you know, just for giggles!
They should have dealt him when the dealing was good, in the offseason.
Cleveland normally is pretty good at trading injured pitchers, literally just weeks before they break down. Like you say, they probably should’ve moved Bieber “in the off-season”, when his value was pretty high.
The Mets probably can get more for Carrasco now.
Prospect cost for Giolito just went up.
3 of a teams top 15 prospects but the White Sox will screw it up.
Sox are going on a run and Gio is staying put. When they get to 4.5 games out Hahn will be a buyer. Rick Hahn has this on lockdown, no white flag 2:)
Just took 2 of 3 from the best team in baseball. It is going to happen slick rick is going to be a buyer at the deadline!!
Gio’s still a rental. It will take 1 prospect and a lotto ticket or two. The bar to clear is a late 1st round pick, the comp for giving a Q.O. That’s what every team knows, so the price is constant. Lorenzen, and E-Rod have similar pricing.
Speaking of which, when will MLB get off the dime and start allowing trades of draft picks? It would make more trades possible, especially midseason trades.
But Draft would have to be in Offseason or at Tradedeadline.
Thats a fair point. But I dont see backing it up 2-3 more weeks as an insurmountable obstacle. The draft would be a lot more interesting if teams could move picks for picks, or picks for players.
I hear you and it would make sense most years. But supply is exceptionally low (very few #2 starters available) this year and demand is high. Taking the other high level starter out of the market will simply make Giolito more valuable.
They have been saying it’s a “seller’s market” pretty much ever since the added wildcard slots haha, it basically never works out that way. Some teams will get close to the deadline and blink at the thought of getting nothing for their rentals. on top of that there are still two weeks until the deadline, plenty of time for the Ange… I mean other teams to fall out of the race.
Many of us CLE fans have seen Bieber’s lack of consistency across starts this year. In one start he is Cy Young caliber, and in the next he implodes in a given inning and doesn’t adjust. We can tell there’s something wrong with him, and now we’ll see exactly what that is.
Him and Quantrill both. Both times Quantrill had been placed on the IL I have thought “well, that at least explains it a little”
The rotation is a puzzle now. Presumably Logan Allen comes back for Quantrill’s spot. There’s not much left in AAA, where they’ve very recently signed a bunch of Atlantic League non-prospects to fill out innings. Your other choices are:
Joey Cantillo, excellent prospect who isn’t fully stretched out coming back from a major injury and probably shouldn’t be in the majors this season
Zach Plesac, who just spent a month in Rookie level ball reworking his mechanics. His first two starts back from that rework have yielded a total of 7 IP, 4 walks, 3 strikeouts, and 3 homers. Also not on the 40 man roster
Hunter Gaddis, who has been shelled at AAA despite pretty decent K numbers and velocity. In 10 games he’s got 36.2 IP, 29 earned runs, 17 walks, 37 Ks.
Chris Vallimont who they just claimed off waivers for the Orioles and nobody was sure if they’d make him a starter or reliever. He was DFA’d there because he hasn’t succeeded at the MLB level yet.
The oooooother option, and personally the one I’m cheering for, is simply making Xzavion Curry into a starter again. He would need to be ramped up somewhat, but he’s been simply stunning as a reliever this year and had been an excellent starter throughout his minor league career. I think if you had Vallimont or Gaddis on hand as a piggyback option for his first few starts as he builds up to the role, you could at least give him a fair shot.
The Guardians sending Logan Allen back to AAA May be a sign that they are serious about limiting the innings of their big three rookies (Allen, Bibee and Williams). We may be stuck with Civale, Morris, Curry and whomever they can bring in from AAA or in a trade. I would love to see Cantillo come up, but we have to worry about his innings, too.
Rich Hill is available. I would love James Paxton, but I worry about the asking price.
Rich Hill could be had for a lottery ticket. He’s eating innings like never before – 98 so far. He’ll give you innings and keep you in the game, so he’s a no-brainer.
You could probably have Konnor Pilkington back, he just got released from somewhere.
I always liked Pilkington. I would take him back on a AAA deal….not sure the Guards will, though. They don’t seem to listen to me.
I would argue that Curry hasn’t been ‘simply stunning’ as a reliever. His FIP is over 4 and he has one of the worst K rates in the league (in fact, no reliever with >45 innings has a lower K/9 than his ugly 5.8%).
I’m big on analytics, but I’m assuming you haven’t watched him pitch. Whether it’s sustainable is up for debate (and metrics like that are more about predicting future trends anyway), but to this point it’s not unreasonable to say he’s been impressive.
Look at a lot of guys with the Rays too (Poche, Chirinos, Fleming, etc). Most of them don’t have great strikeout rates and haven’t for a while. Curry at least has better K numbers in the minors so in a short sample size this year it’s easier to explain away.
This is always the argument of the guy WHO DOESN’T have analytics/data on their side. But, have you SEEN him! Edwards Deming said “without data, you’re just another person with an opinion.”
Yes, I have seen Jim pitch. He’s fine. His stats are fine. I’m sure that you want him to be amazing, and maybe he will be. But right now, he’s fine.
Many of us CLE fans have seen Bieber’s lack of consistency across starts this year.
=========================
I traded him from my roto team based on those stats. He went from 14.2 K9 to 12.5 to 8.9 to 7.3. That’s not a guarantee of an injury, but it is a big warning sign. It was like Clevinger going from a 4.57 K/W to a 1.91 before getting traded to SD.
This Sox fan hates to hear things like this. I hope he’s back very soon!!
Might be too late now to say I’m sorry
if he has TJ – the giants are gonna grab him and extend him. this has been the MO of grabbing and paying players to get healthy in order to get them on the other side of recovery.
> this has been the MO of
> grabbing and paying players
Disturbing.
You can’t trade a injured player tho I thought? Maybe I’m wrong or maybe it’s just players on the IL. So if he is kept off the IL is the only way. Can someone correct me if I’m wrong here
You can now. I’m not sure how long it’s been allowed. It came up in here yesterday in the articles about whom the Nats andthe Pirates could trade (mlbtraderumors.com/2023/07/nationals-trade-rumors-… and mlbtraderumors.com/2023/07/pirates-trade-rumors-de…) .I have read elsewhere that MLB has to approve, though I can’t say that for certain. Harrison Bader was on the IL when the Cards sent him to the Yanks a year ago. I got the impression that a player to be named later was included in the deal where the caliber of player would depend upon how much time Bader missed (he missed about six more weeks) but that could be my imagination.
Lol Indians
Careful, there could be no deGrom until 2025.
Meh. He had no trade value anyways. Texas has so much dead weight in Semien, Pérez, and Heaney/Gray (somewhat) that another 37 million is hardly anything. I mean, ther are just going to blow it on another Martin Perez guy anyways. I don’t trust their free agent spending decisions. Semien had a good month or 2 offensively, and they give him 25 million to be IKF + 30 points in OPS plus. I just hate teams that have an astronomically high asking price who learn their lesson when this happens. I wouldn’t care as much about Gerrit Colle and his 36 MM getting injured as much. There isn’t a reason for ill-will there.
That quiets the trade talk
Hope it’s nothing serious and he is back healthy right after the deadline
Thats a shame, but its getting to the point where no pitcher is safe from TJS anymore, heck you have guys in the league getting it again after having it once before.
You speak the truth….
Most of these big league arms get destroyed in their teens by travel ball and incompetent high school coaches.
Hope he comes back from whatever this turns out to be healed and ready to pitch. So who moves up a notch on the arms for trade list?
Everyone listed after him.
Right on…thanks for the chuckle!
I’m glad you laughed and didn’t take offense.
I think the players who are seen as top of the line trade targets are now going to be even more expensive with one less option available. Assuming the injury makes Bieber unavailable.
Hem…no worries. I appreciate sarcasm. I know Giolito keeps getting mentioned as the top guy but was curious to find out the thoughts of my fellow sophisticants here.
I hope the Pads win out, but Snell and Hader could be the big fishies in the TDL pond.
Overrated. He’ll have a fine career but he is not the ACE people thought he would be.
He has had a pretty good career and is almost halfway in. You are speaking as if he is a 22 year-old prospect with no track record. A 131 career ERA+ is probably ace-like for most teams, one would think.
This deadbeat pitcher was trying to avoid Tommy John Surgery I see……he still might but The Surgery lurks around every corner for every pitcher. Not one is immune.
So, you hate guys for wanting to actually push through and help the team instead of getting TJS? Did you see deGrom crying during his press conference? Most guys are probably like that. What’s wrong with someone actually caring about their job?
How the f did you take that seriously? Where did the not taking their job seriously come from?
Sarcasm is really hard to identify on the internet.
Laughing out loud.
Guy’s washed up anyway. The Indians should have traded him earlier this year.
That’s what these racists get for trying to kick Indians out of Cleveland. I’m not sure how people want to deny the existence of a race.
@deGrom Texas Ranger
They’ll always be the Cleveland Indians to me. I’m not a fan but I really liked the team of the mid to late 90s. Team was built to win but just didn’t work out. Kenny Lofton was one of my favorite players and he was on fire from 1993 to 1997. That was peak Lofton.
@deGrom Go talk to some Native Americans on a reservation and ask them what they think about the Cleveland “Indians.” Hint: they don’t like it
RIP Trade Deadline
He’ll probably be ok pitch through it, get traded, and then will have to get TJ surgery once he’s on the new team.
For example from last year, Montas and Mahle….teams should appeoach with ultimate caution even if scans come back clean.
Agreed, exactly. Buyer beware as they say
100%
Not good for Cleveland if it’s TJ surgery. Maybe my Tigers have a better chance of winning the division than I thought. Not that any team in tbe Central is doing much to deserve a division title. At the very least Erod and Lorenzen will be in greater demand at the deadline if Bieber is out.
JUSTIN will replace him !!
The Cleveland Canadians! Anying is better than that awful name Guardians.
We don’t care about the name. Bean eaters, highlanders, browns, Yankees, red stockings…there are worse things
Spiders >>> Guardians imo
Blown out arm and a 3.77 ERA? Not bad Beibs
Oops
Waited too long to trade him. Cleveland really shot themselves in the foot.
Some teams waited too late to acquire too. Front offices do stupid things sometimes.
The same boomer managers that shut down pitchers like Strasburg in a critical postseason role only to lose and have him miss half of his career anyway?
Injuries are a crapshoot. Eventually we’re going to realize that pitch counts and limits have a minimal effect if at all.
Who said he’s on the way to getting TJ surgery? Aren’t ya’ll jumping the gun a wee bit?
They’ve known for weeks that in addition to his scary drop in velocity and peripherals this year that he also had forearm discomfort? And they let him just pitch through the most obvious TJ symptoms ever?
That’s either a lie and he didn’t tell them till just now, or they’re extremely incompetent and negligent.
“inflammatino” Is that Italian?
Yes.
That was the title of the etude Nero was playing on his violin.
Lessons in this is any team that signs a starter to a long term deal is making a bad decision. Pitchers aren’t worth it. I also think with the pitch clock we are going to see more injuries before the season is over. Bieber is really a #2-3 in a rotation. Wish him well though
The same can be said about drafting pitching, unless it’s the top guy by a lot. Leiter made sense; his aggressive AA assignment didn’t. Skenes was an elite prospect, but it made 0 sense to me to draft him there, when Pitt passed on a clear #1 in Leiter. I’d say the same about Rocker and Porter. Aiken, Bullington, Hochaver, Appel, and many other recent #1 picks illustrate that trend for draft guys. At least MLB Free agents have a longer track record of success and durability that can be significantly factored into the contract.
I have always said I would not give pitchers nore than a three year deal. But people called me crazy when they were throwing the big money around last winter.
Spaghetti, uh-oh