Johan Santana Rumors
UPDATE, 12-3-07 at 12:02am: Not only will Johan veto any midseason deal, he’ll veto any deal to a team other than the Yankees or Red Sox.
UPDATE, 12-2-07 at 8:30pm: Hank weighs in, reiterating the deadline. He says the third player actually isn’t the sticking point. Thanks Hank!
UPDATE, 12-2-07 at 7:30pm: The Yanks’ deadline on their offer, which no one is taking seriously, is for end of day Monday. Brian Cashman has given Bill Smith a list of possibilities for the third player in the deal.
UPDATE, 12-2-07 at 6:15pm: Ken Rosenthal says Santana told the Twins he won’t waive his no-trade clause during the season. It’s now or never. The packages the Yankees and Red Sox are offering are definitely better than two draft picks, especially since there’s no guarantee one of them will be a first-round pick. I’d be surprised if he’s not moved this week.
UPDATE, 12-2-07 at 1:30pm: Buster Olney is reporting that the Sox will include Ellsbury in their offer, but pull Lester out of it. Basically the Twins can have one or the other. Olney doesn’t say whether Buchholz/Ellsbury is possible, but I imagine it’s not. The Twins are expected to choose an offer from Boston or New York soon.
FROM 12-2-07 at 8:45am:
When we left off last night, the Twins and Yankees were still haggling over the third player in a Johan Santana trade. The Twins wanted Alan Horne or Austin Jackson, according to Jon Heyman. Now comes word from Tyler Kepner that those two are considered untouchable in the deal by the Yanks. Dellin Betances, Ian Kennedy, and Jose Tabata round out the five that they will not include as the third player.
It’s said that the Yankees will turn to Dan Haren if they don’t reach an agreement with the Twins today or tomorrow. The Twins still like Jacoby Ellsbury more than Phil Hughes, so they’re trying to get the Red Sox to replace Coco Crisp with him in their offer.
Odds and Ends: Burke, Nathan, Adam Miller
Here we go, another collection of random rumors.
- Chris Burke is definitely getting traded. Though Burke was the 10th overall pick in 2001, he’ll be 28 in March and sports a career line of .249/.319/.377.
- Joe Nathan is in Nashville, and seemed amused by the closer vacancies in San Francisco and Milwaukee.
- The Royals have $25MM to burn, and whether or not it makes sense they’re damn well going to spend it.
- The Indians refused to trade Adam Miller for Delmon Young. Paul Hoynes suggests the Tribe tried to push Cliff Lee for Young instead but Lee was too expensive for the Rays. The Indians have a few extra starters and a backup catcher capable of full-time duty in Kelly Shoppach. They’re reluctant to make a deal on both fronts.
- Lew Ford is closing in on a deal with the Hanshin Tigers.
- Johan Santana WHIFF Profile courtesy of friend of MLBTR Tom Koch-Weser.
Johan Santana Rumors
UPDATE, 12-1-07 at 10:30pm: Yanks and Twins are haggling over the third guy – Twins want Horne or Austin Jackson per Jon Heyman. The Yanks are apparently holding out on that front, trying to retain some dignity. Peter Abraham says the Yanks will also slap a deadline on their offer and then turn their attention to Dan Haren.
Concurrently, the Red Sox will only give up Ellsbury if they get more than Santana back. How about making this thing a real blockbuster, getting Joe Nathan involved? Imagine a 7-8-9 combo of Gagne-Nathan-Papelbon (if Gagne were to accept arb). Peter Abraham is saying the Sox aren’t serious though.
UPDATE, 12-1-07 at 5pm: Ken Rosenthal says the Twins are asking for shortstop Alberto Gonzalez or starter Alan Horne as the third player from the Yankees. Doesn’t sound like Hughes + Kennedy is any kind of possibility. The Yankees cracked and put Hughes in…unless the Red Sox crack and put Ellsbury in it seems like Santana will end up in the Bronx.
UPDATE, 12-1-07 at 3:30pm: La Velle E. Neal III has a Santana update for us. He says the Yanks are offering Hughes, Cabrera, and Ian Kennedy right now. If that’s for real, I think the Twins should accept. However, Neal’s assertion runs contrary to Jon Heyman’s take – he says the third player will not be Kennedy, Alan Horne, or Jose Tabata.
Meanwhile it sounds like the Red Sox are still pushing Coco Crisp over Jacoby Ellsbury. Neal adds that the Mets might re-consider their stance on Jose Reyes, and that the Twins would prefer to ship Santana over to the NL.
UPDATE, 12-1-07 at noon: Buster Olney says the Yanks’ upgraded offer is now on the table, but the Twins will meet with the Red Sox this afternoon to see if they can get Theo Epstein to include both Ellsbury and Buchholz.
UPDATE, 11-30-07 at 10pm: It’s been decided: the Yanks will put Hughes in their offer. John Harper and Bill Madden feel that it was Brian Cashman who needed convincing. Cabrera remains in the package, which will be rounded out by an additional pitching prospect. This collection of youngsters apparently puts the Yankees in the lead for Santana.
UPDATE, 11-30-07 at 6pm: The Yankees’ front office has been debating whether to surrender Phil Hughes in a trade for Santana. Buster Olney reports that they’re leaning toward doing it. Melky Cabrera and one other prospect would be sent over as well. The Yankees, as well as the Red Sox, are hedging their bets by talking to Billy Beane about Dan Haren at the same time.
UPDATE, 11-30-07 at 11:25am: David Andriesen says the Mariners are not serious players on Santana. However, Geoff Baker says the Ms have inquired but not made an offer for him. However Baker talked to a friend of Santana’s who indicated the ace wouldn’t be jazzed signing a contract extension with a West Coast team. U.S.S. Mariner recommends against a Santana acquisition.
FROM 11-30-07 at 8:45am:
I think it’s time for a new Johan Santana thread. We’ll start today with a Peter Gammons report today on Mike & Mike In The Morning. This comes from a trusted MLBTR reader.
Gammons favors the Yankees in the Santana derby, because he feels that Hank Steinbrenner could overrule Brian Cashman and include Phil Hughes in the deal. Some feel that the Red Sox are just trying to pump up the price and would then turn to the A’s to get Dan Haren. Getting Haren instead of Santana may have the added benefit of not pissing off Josh Beckett about his salary.
Rosenthal’s Latest: Peavy, Guillen, Barrett
Ken Rosenthal checks in with another fine rumor-filled column.
- Johan Santana doesn’t seem a great fit for the Angels, partly because he’ll be very expensive and the Halos actually do have a payroll limit.
- Jake Peavy knows he’d have to take a discount to stay in San Diego…but even a $15MM per year type deal would be unprecedented for them. He’s under the Padres’ control through ’09.
- Rosenthal’s sources are divided on whether the Mets will go after Jose Guillen. Such a scenario is possible if Lastings Milledge and/or Carlos Gomez are dealt. It’s said that the Mets are still very interested in Livan Hernandez.
- Chase Headley is very popular. Rosenthal confirms Scott Miller’s rumored offer of Xavier Nady and Nate McLouth for him, not that the Padres would consider it. Otherwise the Red Sox are asking for him for Coco Crisp.
- The Padres will probably offer arbitration to both Mike Cameron and Michael Barrett. That brings the risk that Barrett accepts, which wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world.
- We already knew the Padres and Rays were in on Geoff Jenkins; add the Phils to the mix. The Cubs, Giants, Rangers, and Royals have also been linked to him.
Red Sox Leading For Santana?
UPDATE, 11-29-07 at 10:30pm: The Yankees’ offer stands at Ian Kennedy, Melky Cabrera, and maybe Jose Tabata. Phil Hughes is a big upgrade over Kennedy, and the Twins are insisting on him. Meanwhile the Red Sox are still pushing Coco Crisp while the Twins are holding out for Jacoby Ellsbury. If one of the teams cracks on Hughes or Ellsbury this thing might get done.
UPDATE, 11-29-07 at 8pm: Despite what Jon Heyman said, the Boston Globe’s Nick Cafardo seems to think the Red Sox are still in the lead for Santana. It would be the package named below by Olney. Nothing is done yet, as Santana’s agent hasn’t been approached about an extension. Meanwhile Cafardo indicates that the Yankees may part with Robinson Cano after all. One other note: Peter Gammons suggests that the Sox would have to redo Josh Beckett’s reasonable deal if they acquire Santana and give him $20MM+.
UPDATE, 11-29-07 at 2:50pm: Buster Olney suggests the same package as Walters from the Red Sox, except with Michael Bowden rather than Masterson. However the fourth player is still undetermined. He also notes that the Yankees are simultaneously talking to the Twins.
UPDATE, 11-29-07 at 1pm: The Boston Herald has a bit more. Basically the Red Sox are only willing to include one of Ellsbury/Buchholz/Lester, while the Twins want two from that group.
FROM 11-29-07 at 8:30am:
Shooter Charley Walters is back with a new column of rumors and whatnot. Remember, Walters was the one saying the Garza for Delmon rumor wouldn’t die.
- Despite the exclusion of Jacoby Ellsbury, Walters says the Red Sox have the lead in the Johan Santana sweepstakes. The package would be Coco Crisp, Jed Lowrie, Jon Lester, and Justin Masterson. Not a bad haul. I was thinking Lowrie might become a target of the Twins.
- The following clubs are interested in Carlos Silva: Tigers, Mets, Phillies, and Royals. None of those teams are new.
- The amount of cash each club is getting this year for online media properties like MLB.com sites: $25MM. And don’t forget the Twins get about $20MM in revenue sharing. Maybe that’s why they have interest in Aaron Rowand.
Heyman’s Latest: Santana, Haren, Estrada
Jon Heyman checks in with a couple of notable points.
- Heyman sets odds for Johan Santana, going with the Yankees and then Red Sox. I’ll let you click through for the rest.
- While we’d recently heard from Ken Rosenthal that the A’s had cooled on certain young Mets, perhaps Omar Minaya and Billy Beane can still work something out. Heyman indicates that Beane still covets Lastings Milledge and Mike Pelfrey. He also likes Kevin Mulvey, Carlos Gomez, and Fernando Martinez. So maybe Keith Law was right today in his chat – the Mets can pull off a deal with the A’s despite popular belief.
- The Mets are shopping Johnny Estrada, but it’s not known who’s on the receiving end of those calls. Along with Estrada, the Mets aren’t jazzed about Bengie Molina. Though he has been discussed.
Stark’s Latest: Edmonds, Pierre, Guillen, Santana
ESPN’s Jayson Stark always cranks out a bunch of new rumors when he writes a column. This week is no exception.
- Jose Reyes: going nowhere.
- Probably since they hope to include him in a Johan Santana deal, the Red Sox won’t trade Coco Crisp until that situation is resolved. The Rangers liked Crisp, but are considering interesting alternatives: Rocco Baldelli, Jim Edmonds, and Juan Pierre. If only Ned Colletti could get someone to take his Pierre contract. Then he could sign another one almost equally as bad. Then he could trade Aaron Rowand a year from now and repeat the process.
- The Braves also liked Crisp, so they’ll move on for now. Stark speculates a stopgap like Dave Roberts could work.
- More speculation: Andruw Jones as a darkhorse signing for the Royals. I guess that would push David DeJesus out of center field.
- Is there an unmentioned Mystery Team in on Johan Santana? Stark’s sources suggest the Mariners, but those guys must not read Jon Heyman’s column. I’ll go with the Reds as my guess on the Mystery Team, if there is one.
- Speaking of guesses, Stark surmises that the Padres and Mets could be interested in Jose Guillen, aside from the Royals.
- More rumblings that Vicente Padilla could be traded this winter. Funny quote about how Padilla doesn’t have baggage – he has luggage. In fact his luggage cannot be carried, rather it requires a mid-sized cart.
Abraham On Hawkins, Igawa, Santana
Peter Abraham of The Journal News checks in on his blog with a couple of new Yankees tidbits.
- The Yankees are considering LaTroy Hawkins, Ron Mahay, and a return of Luis Vizcaino among relief possibilities. Hawkins has the Tigers and Rockies after him. Mahay interests the Braves, Brewers, and Royals. Haven’t heard much about the Viz yet.
- Abraham says there is a market for Kei Igawa. The Yanks don’t have a rotation spot for him, but they are paying him through 2011. He’s signed cheaply since a large part of the expenditure was his posting fee. Other teams known to have shown interest in Igawa at one point: Padres, Orioles, Mariners, D’Backs, Dodgers, Mets, Cubs, Braves, Tigers, and Indians.
- Abraham does not think the Mets will surrender Jose Reyes, and therefore doesn’t think they can pull off a Johan Santana deal.
Can Mets Acquire An Ace?
We’ve discussed this before…it seems like the Mets don’t stack up with certain other clubs trying to acquire available frontline starting pitching. Ken Rosenthal definitely feels this way – Carlos Gomez is considered a blue-chipper but the others may not be.
Rosenthal notes that a package starting with Lastings Milledge and Aaron Heilman doesn’t do much for Billy Beane. The A’s don’t see Milledge as a long-term center field solution, and Heilman is a reliever. Mike Pelfrey and Phil Humber aren’t the top-shelf pitching prospects the A’s covet in return for Dan Haren or Joe Blanton. It seems as if the very best package the Mets can assemble might only be enough for Blanton.
The Mets are also after Johan Santana and Erik Bedard, but it’s the same story. Unless they create a huge hole by trading Jose Reyes, it doesn’t seem they can offer the best package. Though the Twins still want Reyes, Adam Rubin and Joel Sherman indicate that’s not an option.
Dipping into the free agent market for Hiroki Kuroda or Carlos Silva seems to make more sense. One option the Mets have been linked to in the past, Dontrelle Willis, may be off the market now.
Matt Garza Traded For Delmon Young In Blockbuster
UPDATE, 11-28-07 at 9pm: It’s now a done deal. The Twins substituted 21 year-old reliever Eduardo Morlan instead of Rincon.
UPDATE, 11-28-07 at 7:30pm: This thing hasn’t gone through yet because of concerns over Rincon’s elbow. The deal will either be finalized or killed by Thursday, according to Scott Miller. The trade has been in the works for a few days.
UPDATE, 11-28-07 at 4pm: Neal reports that the Twins have interest in Aaron Rowand, which is really surprising given his reported demands. I don’t see it. Neal adds that Craig Monroe may now be non-tendered and the Garza trade will not stop Bill Smith from shopping Johan Santana. By the way, talks for Coco Crisp persist.
FROM 11-28-07 at 2pm:
Wow! That rumor really didn’t die! La Velle E. Neal III says the Twins are close to a multiplayer deal. They’ll send Matt Garza, Jason Bartlett, and Juan Rincon to the Rays for Delmon Young, Brendan Harris, and Jason Pridie. I can’t remember any kind of young player blockbuster like this recently.
It’s exciting to see Bill Smith pull the trigger on a deal to get that possible elite slugger. Will he be more hesitant to trade Johan Santana now? Or maybe it doesn’t matter since he’d require an elite young hurler like Phil Hughes in return. Beyond Young, you also have to applaud Smith for getting Pridie, who immediately becomes the Twins’ center fielder of the future. The 24 year-old came back from injuries this year to rake in Triple A. Just like that, the Twins have an outfield.
Meanwhile the Rays suddenly have an awesome young trio fronting their rotation in Scott Kazmir, Jamie Shields, and Garza. Rincon’s ability is questionable at this point but he could be the setup man the Rays are craving.
I’ll give the advantage to the Twins but I like this deal for both teams.