The latest in outfielder rumors…
- The Blue Jays have offered Dexter Fowler a deal in the neighborhood of four years and $60MM, FanRag Sports’ Jon Heyman reports. This falls short of the $18MM in average annual value that Fowler and his representatives are seeking, though it isn’t such an insurmountable gap that it would rule the Jays out of the running for the free agent outfielder. The Cardinals continue to be interested in Fowler, Heyman notes, while the Giants and Nationals have also been linked to him in past reports and several other teams are speculative matches for Fowler in all three outfield positions.
- Royals outfielder Jarrod Dyson is another Cardinals target, FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal reports (via Twitter). Dyson has the benefit of coming at a much lower financial or trade cost than Fowler or Royals teammate Lorenzo Cain, plus he would be a good fit for a St. Louis team that has defensive upgrades as a stated offseason goal.
- The Royals like Jorge Soler, 670 The Score’s Bruce Levine tweets. Rated as one of the game’s best prospects just two years ago, Soler has shown only a few glimpses of his potential at the MLB level and doesn’t have a clear path to regular playing time within the very crowded Cubs outfield. The Cubs shopped Soler last offseason, and Levine speculates that a deal could be worked out involving K.C. closer Wade Davis, as Chicago is one of several teams interested in Davis.
- There is some speculation that the Phillies would be open to trading Odubel Herrera, MLB.com’s T.R. Sullivan tweets. It would surely take quite a bit to make a deal happen, as Herrera has gone from Rule 5 pick to an everyday contributor for Philadelphia who has hit .291/.353/.419 and 23 homers over his two big league seasons.
- With the Angels looking for a fourth outfielder who preferably hits from the left side of the plate, Jeff Fletcher of the Orange County Register speculates that Ben Revere could be a good fit. Revere had a brutal 2016 season and was non-tendered by the Nationals, but Fletcher notes that he has been an Angels target in the past and could be a potential bounce-back candidate.
Get it done Theo. It would suck to see soler leave but if it get the cubs Davis and maybe one other pitcher for strengthen their bullpen. Pull the trigger now.
Soler Happ and one other prospect for Davis and Ventura.
Davis is a free agent
Davis is NOT a free agent.
You’re thinking of Holland.
Id prefer not to give up happ or jimenez for 1 year of roster control like we did for Chapman. The well is drying at the farm and will get only get worse with success.
I don’t think the Cubs are going to land a big time starter in 2017. That’s only going to happen if the aces go down like the 2016 mets.
Why give up prospects when they can sign Jensen for just money
Because Jansen would cost a pick and a lot of money.
You had a good thing going until you included Ventura. But if they really do want to package Davis and Cain it’s going to be an even bigger package.
If not Ventura then Herrera. Davis won’t cost more than 2 players. It would be 4 for 2 deal if it was Herrera. And honestly I don’t know any other relievers on kc. I know kc won’t give up both Davis and Herrera. They are basically starting from scratch if they trade any of those 5 or 6 FA after 2017
That may get Davis but not Ventura too
Ventura is a negative presence. He tries to fight someone every other start. Cubs don’t want him.
I’d rather see a package for Archer and Colome than Davis and Ventura.
snewbanks31 – agreed. Mentioned this in another thread as well. Archer and Colome or even Odorizzi and Colome. Gotta have some love for the home state Odorizzi.
No thank you to Ventura. He would be a massive black spot on a team with a great clubhouse culture.
Agreed. I want no part of Ventura
It shouldn’t hurt Cubs fans at all to lose Soler, especially if you’re getting someone extremely useful to the team, like Davis. Soler doesn’t even have a spot on the Cubs.
No one is disputing that. This dude just proposed his hypothetical trade of Soler, Happ, AND another prospect for Davis and Ventura. And then another guy said something about Herrera and Davis. Royals fans of course are saying that is too lopsided in favor of the Cubs, but IMO the Cubs don’t need any of these players. Ventura first and foremost is a cancer and he sucks, so…. no. Davis was on the DL twice for flexor strains and elbow soreness….. GIANT red flags. Herrera….. would just be a luxury addition. Cubs already have solid pieces in their bullpen. They just need to add supporting pieces. If my fellow Cub fans REALLY want Davis, why not just sign Holland? Not only can he be had for a 2 year deal with an AAV of $7M, tops. But he has just as much upside as Davis. He’s coming off Tommy John surgery where all signs are pointing to Davis soon NEEDING Tommy John surgery. If I’m going to gamble on an injury risk player I’m going to take the cheaper of the two and that hands down is Holland. They could then add bounce back candidate Drew Storen via free agency as well and he too shouldn’t cost too much. IMO in terms of what it will cost and the players past performances, Holland and Storen aren’t much worse, if worse, than the likes of Davis and Herrera. From 2011-2015 Storen had a 2.91 ERA, 3.06 FIP, 1,10 WHIP, 8.7 K/9, and 2.4 BB/9. Herrera over the last 5 years (same length as Storen’s sample pre-2016) has posted a 2.57 ERA, 2.96 FIP, 1.12 WHIP, 9.1 K/9, and 2.7 BB/9. So yeah, I’d say Storen has the potential to be as good as Herrera and he won’t cost us any prospects.
Ventura….. is that guy even relevant anymore? Anyone who’d trade for him is a fool. Nothing about Ventura is impressive.
Well said
No way do they give up Happ in a package for a couple of relievers. If they trade any top prospects of theirs it will be/better be for starting pitching. Not a couple of dudes who 1) have injury concerns, and 2) throw a maximum of 65-70 innings/season. I’d give ’em Soler and Candelario for Davis. If they don’t like they can keep on sucking. No sweat of the front office’s sack. Here’s the thing. The Royals CAN’T afford Davis past 2017. The Cubs…. DON’T have to trade for him. Why cave into their will. It’s not like the Cubs don’t have a few solid pieces already in their pen. IMO they don’t have to trade for anyone. Sign Holland, Storen, and one of Logan/Blevins/Dunn and this pen it perfectly fine.
CL Rondon/Holland
SU Holland/Rondon
RP Strop
RP Edwards
RP Storen
RP Grimm
LHRP Blevin/Logan/Dunn
LHRP Zastryzny/Duensing
Holland can be had for 2 years and $14M roughly. If he returns to his old self he’s better than Davis. Sign Storen to a 1-2 year deal. He’s coming off a bad year and looking to rebuild his value. I think Storen can be had on a 1-year $6M deal and that is being generous, a 2-year $10M deal if they go the multi-year route. Blevins and Dunn should be the cheaper of the 3 left handers with Dunn being the cheapest. I think you can land Blevins to a 2-3 year deal worth About $4-5M annually. Dunn can be had on a 2-year deal for about $8M. Logan, despite owning the worst career numbers of the 3, is coming off a contract that paid him an AAV of $5.5M. I’m doubting he’ll want to take a pay cut. He does have the “I’ve been pitching in Colorado” excuse, but that’s a weak excuse and doesn’t explain his bad numbers early in his career with the wSox and Braves. If he can be had for 2-3 years and $4-4.5M AAV I’d say sign him or Blevins.
Adding Blevins/Logan, Storen, and Holland will cost a 2017 total of $22M. Or just above what adding one of Chapman or Jansen would cost you. That bullpen roster mention above is pretty d**n good IMO. With Wood’s $6+M salary leaving, Fowler’s $8M salary leaving, Trevor Cahill’s $4.25M leaving, Ross’ $2.5M retiring, and opting out of Hammel saves them $10M…… That’s about $30+M coming off the books. With the addition of Jay and Duensing already they’ve added $10M between them. Add the ≈$20-22M these pitchers would cost and their payroll is no larger than it was last year. Cubs Opening day bullpen in 2016 had left handers Wood and Clayton Richard. My hypothetical 2017 Cubs have Blevins/Boone and Zastryzny/Duensing. I’d say that’s about a draw. But the rest of my hypothetical 2017 bullpen is much better than 2016’s opening day pen of Rondon, Strop, Grimm, Cahill, Warren, and Ramirez. Holland+Storen+Edwards >>> Cahill+Warren+Ramirez.
And if the Cubs were to trade, say Soler, Baez, Jimenez, and Candelario to TB I think that would nab them Archer. That’s 2 young, controllable major leaguers with a ton of promise and one of them is coming off an NLCS MVP performance. Jimenez is a top prospect in the league, and Candelario is one of the better 3B prospects in the game but is forever blocked by Bryant. That would move Montgomery to the pen for 2017. and Zastryzny can go back to starting in Iowa. Zobrist becomes the everyday 2Bman again until Happ is ready which shouldn’t be too much longer (late 2017 if he rakes and their is an injury on the ML team, otherwise sometime 2018). Losing Baez in that proposed deal is the only thing that stings a little. But again, their immediate replacement is a more than capable Zobrist and the future replacement is Happ who is looking like yet another superstar. Jimenez will be missed, but the Cubs have ample OFers at the ML level already not to mention solid OF prospects in Zagunis, Dewees, Wilson, Martinez, and Hanneman.
So again, why exactly do the Cubs have to cough up top prospects to land KC relievers? Save the prospects for potentially an Archer or Odorizzi deal with TB. Soler+Happ+another prospect I better be getting something more than 65 innings coming back. If Wade Davis is worth THAT much in a deal why the hell aren’t the Cubs shopping Rondon in a package for a SP like Archer. As a closer his numbers are right up their with the likes of Davis, Chapman, Jansen, etc. In 2014-2015 he had a 2.03 ERA, 1.03 WHIP, 9 K/9, and 2 BB/9 rates. Before getting demoted out of the closers role this last year and before battling a naggin forearm injury that led to a DL stint he had about a 1.90 ERA, 0.80 WHIP, and similar K and BB rates. Pre-Chapman deal his save % was 87% compared to Jansen’s 88%. In fact, over the last 3 years the ONLY major thing that separates Jansen from Rondon is their K-rate. Jansen Ks about 4 more batters/inning. I didn’t know strikeouts made someone THAT much more valuable than a similar pitcher in every aspect except Ks. Yet Cub fans (and Maddon’s dumb a**) are so da** impatient when it comes to Rondon. I don’t get it.
They traded a better prospect than Happ for half a season of an elite reliever. What makes you think they wouldn’t trade Happ for at least a full season of one?
Happ isn’t going anywhere in 2017. It’s gonna take our pitching to hit the absolute shi*ter for happ or jimenez to get traded.
Rondon and Strop aren’t both hurt to start the 2017 season and they have access to the free agent market now.
Well, according to all the sources that I’ve seen, they don’t want to spend what it’ll cost for one of the top relievers. And they clearly aren’t convinced that Rondon and Stop are enough, or they wouldn’t be looking at Davis, especially when they know the prospect cost of elite relievers. Saying there’s “no way” they’d trade Happ for a couple relievers is a huge stretch IMO when they’ve already traded more for less.
And trading for Chapman, at least IMO was a mistake. Chapman in the regular season wasn’t much more effective as the closer than Rondon was. And in the postseason Chapman SUUUUUCCCCKKKKKEEEEEDDDD!!!!! ONLY saving grace of the Chapman deal is that eventually Rondon did get injured which would’ve sucked had they not had Chapman….. but then again, who knows. Maybe we’d be talking about our hot new closer now in Carl Edwards had they not got Chapman and when Rondon went down. We’ll never know. How much better would this offseason be if we had Torres to wheel and deal for a SP like Archer? I can’t really complain about the Chapman deal though. All they really gave up that’s worthwhile is Torres. Warren was a bum here, and McKinney has not developed into the OFer they thought he’d be. I never heard of that Crawford kid they gave up. Still. At the time I wasn’t too much of a fan of the Chapman deal, and today I’m really not a fan of the Chapman deal. Chapman almost COST the Cubs the world series….. not “lock it down” like he was advertised to do. I think he had like 3 blown saves to 4 saves in the postseason to go with his 3.50 ERA. Awful. Especially for supposedly one of the best in the game. I wasn’t impressed with him in his tenure here. Guy was a complete bum if there were guys on the bases or if he had to pitch more than an inning. If that’s an “elite” closer you can have him at the $20M AAV or whatever ridiculous money some team is going to throw at him despite him almost costing his team the world series and having a BAAAD postseason. Can’t believe that didn’t kill his value across the league.
While I don’t disagree that he wasn’t great in the playoffs, you have to wonder how much of that should be put on him and how much should be put on Maddon. Maddon SEVERELY overused him.
Holland is sitting pretty on the market right now and IMO he is Davis’ equal. He also can be had for a TWO year deal for about $7M AAV as opposed to Davis and his 1 year $10M salary. Again, Davis was battling elbow soreness and flexor strains in his right elbow last year to the point he did 2 DL stints. I’d rather gamble on the guy coming OFF the DL than the one possibly headed TOWARD the DL.
If the Chapman deal taught Hoyer and Theo anything is that “elite” closers are overrated. Chapman suck balls in the postseason and da** near cost them the World Series. As for giving up a “ton” for Chapman. Coughing up Torres was painful. It was the main reason I didn’t like the trade back in July. But still, that was pretty much the only piece they gave up that will be missed. I still think they might have given up too much for Montgomery. We shall see what Vogelbach does with the Mariners next year. My sphincter is clenched. Then again, after sucking for about 2 weeks after the deal Montgomery calmed down and was actually pretty good. With an offseason of Bosio sprinkling his black magic dust on him hopefully he turns into another prodigy like Hendricks and Arrieta after Bosio worked his magic with them. So if Montgomery does turn into this solid SP I guess that trade would’ve worked out too. But Warren, Torres, McKinney, and some dude named Rashad Crawford (I still think that was just some random dude they picked up off the street. I never heard of him and I follow their system fairly closely) for Chapman, while it a huge personnel swing, the only piece that will be missed and is missed is Torres. McKinney looks like he’ll never develop into the hype he carried with him when he came over with Russell. He’s been pretty mediocre at best in the minors. Crawford is just a random dude, I’m sure of it. Warren is just another reliever….. one who sucked when here.
Don’t overvalue your pitchers though, KC fans. Davis is a big red flag with those elbow issues in 2016. He is also expensive and only under control for 1 year. He also doesn’t even remotely have the resume Chapman does. I wouldn’t expect much more than Soler in an offer, and I REALLY hope Hoyer and Theo don’t bust their load and offer a stupid package for him. Soler and Zagunis is as good a deal I’d give you. Don’t want it, welcome to Chicago Greg Holland. No sweat off our balls.
Cubs got their ring with Chapman so it was worth it. Expecting long term success the Cubs have to preserve the farm. So Happ isn’t going anywhere. Also Wade Davis ain’t aroldis chapman.
3.45 ERA with 4 saves and 3 blown saves in the playoffs and almost lost game 7 of the World Series by having a HR hit off him by Rajai friggin Davis a dude who hits maybe 3-5 HRs all year. Yeah, I stand by the he SSSSSUUUUCCCKKKEEEEDDD statement. Unless of course you think a save conversion percentage of 57% is “awesome.” Buy a clue because you clearly don’t have one.
They don’t win it without chapman
I know. Chapman almost blew it in the playoffs. Davis locked it down in the playoffs. So whatever you gave up for Chapman, plan on that and more for Davis
And won the WS
Can’t count on rondon( battle elbow and forearm problems at the end of the year) or holland coming back from Tj with way diminished stuff
Happ only gets traded in a Quintana deal, and that’s very unlikely. Candalerio and Soler are most likely trade chips IMO.
The cubs need a closer. I like carl Edwards,just not enough to trust him to begin the season. Trading soler and some mid level prospects would be a great move for davis.
It would be a shame to see the Royals get a package headlined by Soler. His prospect value has fallen so far. If he is simply part of the package, that’s fine. They better be able to get more for one of the best relief pitchers in recent history.
You have to keep in mind that Davis is only signed for 1 more year while Soler is signed through 2020.
As a Cubs fan, I’m assuming you saw what they gave up for half a year of Aroldis Chapman… Soler has significantly less value than that. If he headlined a package for Davis, that’d be a horrible move for KC.
I saw what they gave up. 4 players went back but really only 2 are any good. Warren was awful for the cubs. 98% of cubs fans have no clue who rashard Crawford is.
And neither of those players were the best player going back… Torres was/is much more valuable than Soler at this point in their careers.
Thank you. Davis is a better pitcher IMO than Chapman. Cubs would be getting a full season of him, versus half a season they got from Chappy. It should be a better prospect deal heading to KC than just Soler.
We did see what they gave up for Chapman. Do you see Chapman’s and Davis’ resumes? Davis doesn’t even come close to Chapman. Also, Chapman didn’t battle ELBOW soreness and FLEXOR STRAINS IN HIS ELBOW which led to 2 DL stints in 2016. He’s also not left handed.
If the Cubs want an injury concern pitcher with a high ceiling why waste time with the Royals and Davis and just sign Holland who has just as high a ceiling as Davis. Not only will he be cheaper monetarily but will cost exactly 0 players in a trade….. because he is a FA ripe for the picking. Signing Holland and bounce back candidate Drew Storen makes me more excited than adding Wade Davis. If Holland and Storen pitch like their old selves they blow Davis out of the water. Couple them with the likes of Rondon, Strop, Edwards, and Grimm and that’s a solid bullpen. Add a veteran lefty in either Logan, Dunn, or Blevins to pair off with young left Zastryzny and this pen is pretty stacked. Would rather see Soler in a package to TB for Archer or Odorizzi.
I guess KC fans just took 2016 off and completely missed the worrisome injuries Davis faced all year that lead to 2 DL stints and saw him lose velocity on all his pitches. Maybe they were still hungover from their 2015 season to notice he is a giant red flag. They also seem pretty unaware that by no means does Davis have the resume Chapman has. The Chapman deal was essentially quantity for quality (supposed quality in Chapman…. I wasn’t blown away by him). Warren…. mediocre reliever. McKinney….. looking like a failed prospect. Crawford…… still think he is some bum they found on the street outside, had/have no clue who he is. Torres is the only guy of any serious value they gave up for Chapman. That’s it. Soler has way more value than outsiders are giving him credit for. The ONLY time he was given an OF job on a full time status was his debut season……. in which he raked. Ever since that season though he has been splitting time and also battling injuries. It is no secret he’s had injury issues. Those could potentially be solved though if he becomes primarily a DH. If that cures what ails him he most definitely has the potential to be a .270-.275 hitter with a .350 OBP and belt 25+ HRs in a full season. In 682 ML ABs he owns a .258 BA, .328 OBP, .762 OPS, 27 HRs, 98 RBIs and 87 Rs scored. Again, if he stays healthy he’s better offensively than any current OFer or DH they currently own. In fact, Soler’s CURRENT numbers aren’t too far off Alex Gordon’s numbers…… or Lorenzo Cain’s for that matter. Gordon is a career .264 hitter with a .345 OBP and .775 OPS. Cain is an injury prone player as well and has a .287 BA, .337 OBP, and .753 OPS. So don’t give me this BS Soler is garbage. If he’s garbage what does that say about your current state of affairs in the OF. Again though, Soler will likely be your DH with Morales gone. A full season of Soler is likely going to be better than what Gordon or Cain puts up assuming being a DH keeps Soler healthy for a majority of the season if not the whole season
Cain and Gordon were injured and out for significant amount of time last season.
Thing is though, you know what you are getting in Davis for one year but soler is an unknown and may not pan out and will be on the hook for him through 2020
the cubs could trade for Britton if he was availble but the cubs don’t have pitching in their system. Daivs seems like a good fit for them or Greg Holland
Yeah, the Cubs will be getting a guy who has lost 1 mph on all his pitches and had 2 DL stints in 2016 with elbow issues. Great. But hey, at least we’ll be responsible for the entire $10M he’s owed….. AND we give up a top prospect (if Royal fans had their way) for all this too….. whoopee. *note HEAVY sarcasm*
He’s got about 30/100 in roughly a season of at-bats. His development has been a little unfair as he hasn’t even played a single full season. He’s incredibly young with 4 CHEAP years still. At the very least, for a relief pitcher who you’re about to lose to free agency, it’s a good return.
You’re pointing out his biggest red flag… Not sure that helps your argument…
Depends how you look at it. A prospect is just that- a prospect. Soler has at least shown glimpses of greatness at the big league level.
And he’s shown that he can’t stay healthy for a full season. I’d much rather have a highly touted prospect like Torres, and I’d be willing to bet that the majority of teams feel the same way. With the way the market for elite relievers has been the last 2 years, they’d be silly to settle for Soler. I guess they could at least make a nice hashtag though? #SettleForSoler
lol, difference is Royals don’t have money, might trade several core players as is, he doesn’t throw 104 mph, and Davis isn’t a lefty and hasn’t been a full time closer for more than 3/4 of a single season. Not to mention he’s 31 already. As amazing as he’s been, his velocity has taken just a small dip and he has one year left on his contract. While Andrew Miller is a fair comp., Miller also has disgusting strikeout totals to sell himself. Not saying they can’t or won’t get a Torres type prospect, but there are enough factors to make a package of Soler and a couple of mid prospects a fair trade.
If they “don’t have money,” why would they be more interested in Soler’s 20ish+ mil over the next 4 years instead of a prospect with significantly more, cheaper control? Also, Soler has the option to opt into arbitration like Abreu did if I’m not mistaken, which will make him even more expensive if he does well. They can get better quality elsewhere if the Cubs don’t want to give up a top prospect.
And you Royals fans are ignoring Davis’ giant red flags of 2 DL stints in 2016 with elbow issues and that he lost 1 MPH on every pitch he throws. If the Cubs want an injury risk player why not sign Holland. I hope Hoyer and Theo are on my same wavelength. I’d much rather gamble with a cheaper injury risk than the more expensive one.
And the Cubs can get as good of quality in free agency. You Royal fans seem to think the Cubs are desperate for relief help. There are plenty of solid relievers on the market. Holland has just as high a ceiling as Davis does and is coming OFF an injury whereas it looks like Davis is headed toward a major injury. All the signs are there….. elbow soreness….. elbow flexor strains…… lost velocity on all his pitches. No thanks. Really hope Hoyer stands his ground and says Soler straight up or we’ll just sign Holland…… in fact I hope they just sign Holland. Royals need to trade Davis more than the Cubs need to acquire him.
By all accounts, 20 million over 4 years is nothing. I’m saying it’s not as if they have a ton of budget, therefore unlike the Yankees, they may have less options as a whole unit. There is also the factor that this is the off-season; contenders were more pressed at the deadline last year and willing to pay a king’s ransom (plus Cleveland gets an extra year from Miller). We can keep arguing for your enjoyment if you would like, but I’m only stating factors that are in play. Assuming LA doesn’t resign Jansen- LAD, WAS, and the Cubs are the only contenders with a vacancy at closer. Nationals have a handful of RP who put up good stats last year and look to be allocating prospects for Sale so let’s theoretically count them out. This leaves two landing spots for Davis, unless the Giants step in to try to bolster their bullpen further. Dodgers aren’t giving up DeLeon or Urias for him and the Cubs aren’t just going to give up their stud prospects each year for a rental reliever. Even if the Royals “deserve” more for Davis, they’re also kind of running out of suitors at the moment.
Well if we’re going to be saying what we’d RATHER have then I’d RATHER have Matt Strahm than elbow-issue Davis. Because I’d RATHER have Strahm this deal makes more sense. Soler for Strahm….. because I’d RATHER have him than Davis. #KClogic#KCL
And if the Cubs were in control, they could choose who they’d RATHER have in this situation, but they aren’t. They’re the ones going to KC for Davis, not the other way around. And judging by how the market for relievers has been over the last year plus, they aren’t the only ones. KC is in the driver seat. You don’t just get to tell them, “Here’s Soler. Now give us Davis.” If they don’t like the price, they’ll go elsewhere.
How are the Royals in control? They Cubs don’t need to add Davis. Whereas it’s no secret the Royals want to trade Davis because they can’t afford him beyond 2017. They’re the ones going to KC? Yeah, because when KC puts up a Yard Sale sign people are going to peruse around for a good deal. If one isn’t to be found they just go to the next house…… or go to craigslist, AKA free agency. KC is HARDLY in the driver seat. How bad do they want to trade Davis? No deal…. clearly not that bad then. Why do they seem anxious to dump him this offseason too BTW instead of riding him until the deadline when teams are more desperate? Could it possibly be because they aren’t blind like their fans are, and are worried about his elbow issues that plagued him pretty much all throughout the 2016 season off and on. Hate to break it to you but a pitcher who has lost velocity across the board on all his pitches and battled elbow flexor strains during the season……… that doesn’t exactly instill confidence. CERTAINLY doesn’t help his trade value, especially when there is a clone of him on the FA market who is also an injury concern in Holland….. who can be had for 2 years and $7M AAV…… cheaper than Davis. If the asking price is too dumb for the Cubs on Davis they can easily get the same value in Holland….. for less money and cost them 0 players. Why that isn’t their primary option is beyond me. Oh yeah, they’re garage sale shopping. Got to check out all the deals first before they pick up the solid deal on Craigslist in the form of Holland.
^
For a relief pitcher, that is one of the best in the big leagues over the past 4 seasons, Soler is not enough.
LEt’s calm down there. He’s been a relief pitcher for a whopping 3 years. Has to do a bit more than toss 160-180 innings before he is mentioned with the greats. Royals fans also seem to be dismissing the fact that Davis was on the DL not once but twice for arm issues last year. Flexor strains and elbow issues don’t exactly make a pitcher’s value shoot through the roof. In 2016 he lost about 1 mph on all his pitches. I wouldn’t cough up much more than Soler for him. Offer up Soler and, say, Pierce Johnson. Take it or leave it. Cubs don’t NEED Wade Davis, he’d just be a luxury……. if he’s healthy. Whereas the Royals would like to trade him now, especially if they have concerns over that elbow. His value might be as high as it will ever be if that elbow blows out early next year. Personally I hope the Cubs stay away. Not only is Holland available to be had for nothing other than money on the FA market, but his ceiling is just as high if not higher than Davis’ if he returns from injury without skipping a beat. IMO Holland and Davis are moving in two opposite directions. Davis is looking like he might be a TJ candidate sometime in 2017 while Holland is coming back from that surgery. Not only that Holland likely will be had for 2 years and $14M, or $7M AAV. Whereas Davis only has 1 year of control and costs $10M. Gimme Holland. If I am going to take a pitcher with injury concerns I’d prefer the cheaper of the two. I think most would.
Agree^^^. Soler would just have to be a piece. Dude doesn’t impress me at all.
Revere as the Halos 4th outfielder? So dude had an off year last year….. He would make a good everyday LF and lead off hitter for the Angels. He is only 28 and has been solid player except for last year.
A leadoff hitter should get on base.
HMMM….. Does he not get on base? Simple fact of the matter is, he does. Statistics don’t lie.
His career .320 obp would say otherwise
I think you might be looking at his career .342 SLG%….. not OBP
Well as it stands right now, Maybin is in Left. So yes, Revere is the 4th outfielder.
Revere is a better player than Maybin. So yes, Revere would be the LF. Well this is arguably the worst organization in the MLB, so who the hell knows.
Revere would be perfect for the angels, a good lead off hitter and has speed
Ben Revere stinks. Never walks. Worst OF arm in MLB. watched him in Philly. Couldn’t contribute on a bad team with no OF.
Love it! Come on over to the north side wade. We will lose soler which is fine and who else?
Davis is an injury concern. Had 2 DL stints last year with elbow flexor strains and as a result lost 1 MPH on all his pitches…….. Take back your welcome. haha
Only way I’d accept a deal for Davis is if it is for Soler straight up……. or Soler and a LOOOOWW level prospect. Like some 17 year old foreign kid they stole from the Dominican Republic or something.
4 yrs/$60MM sounds about right to me for Fowler. I think his ask of $18MM AAV is a bit high for a good – not great – player. He may get it, but I think it’s more than he’s worth.
The Phillies should trade Herrera, Franco, and Hernandez— all decent pieces, but not WS material. Young and controllable, they’d get nice returns for all 3
Your on drugs !
(Phils Phan) Gut the whole team huh? I can agree with Herrera and Hernadez, it’d take a lot to wrestle Franco away if I’m the GM. He had a down tick in his development, and it might makes sense to sell potentially “high” on his value, but I keep him mainly because They have potential replacements for the others, but not Franco. They also are runninhg into issues on the number of spots they have and who they can protect. Its starting to get dicey, roster spot wise.
Tac3, which Phillies players wouldn’t you shop (unless blown away of course).
If they could work out something including Hernandez, Herrera and parts for JD Martinez and Verlander…. that would be a great move for the Phils.
Duffy and Davis for soler and candelerio/zagunis? Both royals only one year contracts .
the cubs need a pitcher and a closer with multiple years of control left.
And you never know. Davis could sign a2 year extension. Duffy can walk.
Cubs should make a serious run at Jansen but I think he goes to the marlins. Davis would be good with them or Greg Holland.
There’s zero reason for Jansen to go to Miami. They are awful outside of Stanton who will likely walk after half his contract is up. I think there’s 2 year left til he can opt out.
they need to fill their rotation with the loss of Fernandez, their bullpen is not that bad actually, their line up is nice but they can’t put it together.
I can give you 80,000,000+ reasons…
That’s it. He wants to win. They wouldn’t get past the Nats. All he wants is money then by all means guarantee no playoffs the next 5 years. If he stays in L.A. or goes to the cubs or jankees or whatever. He’s gonna make the playoffs. Every year. He’s pretty damn greedy to want 80mil. Plus the Marlins would just trade him for garbage like the last 3 fire sales. They are just bad. Honestly. Both Florida teams need to defunct. Because the Marlins just got new stadium that has yet to sell out they won’t go anywhere. Its really sad that they can’t push 7k fans. When Jose Fernandez dies tragically they come out the woodwork and sudden fill the stadium.
I hope not. Jansen is too much $$$$. Cubs need to save up for player extensions and to buy some more pitching help not in the form of a reliever. Sign Holland, Storen, and one of Blevins/Dunn/Logan. Holland should be about $7M AAV, Storen $5-6M AAV, and on of the left handers should be about $4-5M AAV. That’s 3 quality to potentially awesome relievers (Storen and Holland good be elite if Holland picks up where he left off and Storen has a bounce back year reminiscent of his 2011-2015 numbers) for about….. $20M maybe less. EASILY affordable and the pen then looks like this:
CL: Rondon/Holland
SU Holland/Rondon
RP Strop
RP Edwards
RP Storen
RP Grimm
LHRP Blevins/Logan/Dunn
LHRP Zastryzny/Duensing
Solid bullpen top to bottom and better than 2016’s opening day pen IMO. Total players cost to acquire said bullpen, 0. With the subtraction of Fowler, Cahill, Wood, Hammel, and Ross’ money and adding Duensing and Jay’s added salaries, payroll-wise they are right where they were last year. Only increase in payroll will be the added money the arbitration players make.
THAT SAID, going by what the Rays got for David Price with a year and a half of control back in 2014 (Smyly, Nick Franklin???, and Willy Adames???) Archer IMO shouldn’t cost much more than that and only more due to the 5 years of control he comes with. Archer is NO Price. So I say Soler, Baez, Jimenez, Cease, AND Candelario for Archer AND Colome. That’s 2 ML talents with high ceilings in Soler and Baez and 3…… THREE top prospects in Jimenez Cease and Candelario. Baez will be bittersweet to say goodbye to, but with Happ on the horizon and Zobrist as the immediate replacement at 2B…… they won’t really skip a beat. Jimenez will be tough to say goodbye to as well with all this recent press he’s received. Amazing he has gone from like the Cubs 13th best prospect to their #2 within 1 year and is a top 50 MLB prospect all of a sudden. Cubs have AMPLE major league OFers though and even MORE minor league OF prospects in Zagunis, Dewees, Wilson, Martines, and Hanneman. Candelario is a top 3B prospect in MLB who is Major League ready, but is forever blocked by Bryant. Rays IMMEDIATELY get a starting 2Bman in Baez, their DH of the future in Soler who can also spot start in the OF. With a Longoria trade eminent Candelrio is a possible replacement. Cease is a couple year away but is a promising pitcher. Jimenez is a future OFer who is about 1.5 years away. He’ll likely start 2017 at double A and sometime in 2018 will be ready assuming no hiccups. That’s FIVE players with serious potential and 4 of them will be on the Rays within 18 months. Also, the addition of Candelario allows them to trade Longoria for even more top prospects.
Archer AND Colome may be a lot to give up, but they get pretty much 3 major leaguers right off the bat in Soler, Baez, and Candelario. With Jimenez not far out and Cease only about 2-3 years out. If it’s not enough then I say remove Cease from the deal and swap Archer for Odorizzi. That’s Soler, Baez, Jimenez, and Candelario for Odorizzi and Colome. Likely won’t get an offer remotely close to that.
If either of these deals were to go through and the Cubs also sign Greg Holland and one of the 3 LHRP in Blevins, Dunn and Logan this team is stacked even more than last year.
Lineup
2B Zobrist
LF Schwarber
3B Bryant
1B Rizzo
C Contreras
SS Russell
RF Heyward
CF Almora
Bench
OF Jay
OF Szczur
IF La Stella
C Montero
Rotation
Lester
Arrieta
Archer/Odorizzi
Hendricks
Lackey
Bullpen
CL Colome
SU Holland
SU Rondon
RP Strop
RP Edwards
RP Grimm
LHRP Montgomery
LHRP Blevins/Dunn/Logan
Assuming Russell continues to improve and Heyward bounces back to his old .270 hitting .350+ OBP owning self that lineup is just nasty. The Bench is still strong. The rotation is just dripping with sexiness. And the bullpen is rock solid, ESPECIALLY if Holland returns to his old form. If that’s the case, Edwards, Strop, Rondon, Holland, and Colome is easily the deepest and nastiest bullpen in MLB. That’s 5 pitchers in their pen that would be closers or setup men on any other team. Repeat…… REPEAT!!!! Book it. hahaha……… I love my hypothetical world.
Encarnacian can’t get $20m but Fowler thinks he is worth 18?
Also, how would you rate the closers among Chapman, Jansen and W. Davis. I just can’t see anyone getting much more than Melancon, but I’ve been very wrong before.
Would you be comfortable giving a multi year deal with an AAV of $20M to a 34 year old player? Granted I think Fowler’s asking price is a bit much but at least he’s only 31 years old. A 4 year deal pretty much puts him at Encarnacion’s age. Fowler has proven he is a formidable lead off hitter with some pop in his bat and a little bit of speed. Not too many high quality lead off men around these days. Encarnacion is falling into DH-only territory too. He isn’t exactly a notable defender at 1B. He’s been about a -1.5 dWAR player per season for the last 6 years. While not terrible he is also only a .266 hitter with a .353 OBP for his career. Again, not terrible. But for $20M I’d want at least that OBP to be north of .375. Don’t even bring up Davis in Baltimore. That deal was dumb the minute pen hit paper. Davis was also entering his age 30 season….. not his age 34 season.
Sure, Davis for Soler sounds good. Then the Royals can trade Cain to the Cardinals for something like Luke Weaver.
For the Cubs some controllable pieces would be nicer. A trade centered around Sonny Gray and Sean Doolittle for Jorge Soler I like better. Gray is riskier but a good buy low canidate.
Yeah, and I’d like a trade centered around Davis to the Dodgers for Seager and Urias better. Doesn’t mean it’s going to happen.
Chris Carter possible fit for Cardinals? Platoon with Adams, and power on the bench! Where’s Mozeliak on this one? MO must GO!