The latest rumblings from FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal (video link)…
- Impending free agent right-hander Andrew Cashner told Rosenthal that he hasn’t discussed a new deal with the Rangers and expects to test free agency in the offseason. Cashner also expressed confidence that his production this season should lead to plenty of interest on the open market. The 30-year-old owns an excellent 3.19 ERA and a solid 48.1 percent groundball rate through 146 2/3 innings, though he ranks second last among starters in strikeouts per nine innings (4.79) and third from the bottom in swinging-strike percentage (5.7). While Cashner has been a mixed bag this year, he had a worse 2016 between San Diego and Miami but still landed a $10MM guarantee in the offseason.
- It’s a safe bet that the Giants will exercise left-hander Matt Moore’s $9MM option for 2018 and retain his $10MM option for 2018 in the offseason, says Rosenthal. Although the 28-year-old Moore has recorded the NL’s highest ERA (5.31) through 162 2/3 innings this season, the Giants would rather bet on a bounce-back 2018 at a reasonable cost than subtract from their pitching depth. Buying Moore out would cost the Giants $1MM next year and $750K in 2019.
- Reds manager Bryan Price will return next season, but his future beyond then is in question, per Rosenthal, who adds that the club could cut the cord if it doesn’t make legitimate progress in 2018. The Reds have gone just 269-359 in three-plus years under Price and are currently one loss away from guaranteeing their fourth straight sub-.500 season during his reign. There hasn’t been much pressure on Price to this point, though, given Cincinnati’s rebuilding status and its lack of pitching.
Cashner will probably get good $$ but limited years and should negotiate a new deal with Texas given this year and it being his home state. Expecting him to test the market but ultimately just use others to as leverage.
Strange there is never any discussion of a QO for Cashner. He is 31, commanded 1/$10m off a bad year. Off a good year he could command more AAV than that on a multi-year deal. If so, a QO would make sense. It will be considered by the team at the very least, weird it’s never mentioned on here.
This year a QO will be worth >$18M. Doubt the Rangers, or anyone else, will pay Cashner anywhere near that amount. Have you looked at his career numbers? He’s a guy who will at best throw 160-180 innings with a WHIP above 1.3. That’s not worth $18M yet. And that’s the best case. Look at his career numbers for the worst case. He’ll do well to get $18M for two years. Guess we’ll see.
MacPhail/Klentak will probably offer Cashner a one year deal for $20 million.
They flushed $56 million down the toilet this year in Philly.
They basically have to QO him. Otherwise there was no point in not trading him.
Have you noticed that most teams do something other than what you think they “have to” do?
Have you noticed that I also know how to downvote other people’s comments?
And they do have to QO him. Padres were faced with the same issue two years ago with Ian Kennedy (who is worse than Cashner). Had to QO him because they didn’t trade him. And it worked out pretty well for both the Padres and Kennedy.
Not when he accepts that QO
Better than letting him go for nothing when they could have gotten something for him and their season was already over
Perhaps he wasn’t traded, because there was little to no interest. Not every pending FA gets traded. Not every pending FA that doesn’t get traded will get a qualifying offer. Texas may choose to negotiate a lesser contract.
Little to no interest in a starter with an ERA south of 3.5? I don’t believe that for one second. And trading Cashner wouldn’t have barred the Rangers from negotiating a contract with him.
Baseball is a sport where you can’t just look at one statistic. Although his ERA has been solid his xFIP has been 5.15 his SIERA is 5.39. His groundball rate is higher due to him throwing 14% more sinkers than last year but his velocity on his sinker is down 1 MPH. Surprisingly his sinker has actually improved this year according to pitch values per 100 innings, so to say he’s merely gotten lucky this year might not be the entire truth, albeit he’s pitched 2 more games on the road this year than at home which also probably helped him. So he’s not getting a QO and my guess is he’ll get something like a 1 year 14mil offer by like the Orioles towards the beginning of spring.
Well if no QO for Cashner why didn’t the Rangers trade him? They clearly have no intention of contending this year since they traded Darvish so Cashner, also a pending free agent, has no value to them. Trading Cashner would not have barred the Rangers from re-signing him (which they apparently have interest in doing)
how has price lost almost 100 more games than he has won and keeps a job. A high school player would do better. Hire Bronson!
W/L% is not a good yardstick for a manager. The best manager ever is not going to win without the players. HOFer Connie Mack lost 217 more games than he won. There are many managers in the HOF that lost more games than they won.
“There are many managers in the HOF that lost more games than they won.”
Actually there are only two HoF managers with losing records, Mack and Bucky Harriss. Can’t tell with Rube Foster as we don’t have sufficient records from the Negro Leagues. But the other twenty HoF managers all have winning records, albeit barely in some cases. W/L% may not be a fair yardstick for managers but it’s clearly one that HoF voters employ.
You have actually made the case that Mack was overrated as a manager, compiled his career numbers while he owned the team and couldn’t be fired, and doesn’t belong anywhere near the HoF.
Okay, I’ll concede that I over spoke. What mislead me is that a lot of HoFers with losing records as a manager are in the Hall,, but as players. What I should have said is a some of the HoF managers, like Casey Stengel, don’t have particularly good W/L records. I expect both Jim Leyland and Bruce Bochy to go in, and neither of them has a particularly good W/L %.
Fair enough. Your original point, that W/L% isn’t a great way to judge managers is sound. But using the HoF as a standard doesn’t help the argument as their voters have, until very recently, mostly used those very buttheadedly ‘old fashioned baseball’ stats as W/L%, total wins, all star selections, MVP/Cy Young votes, etc. that your criticism undermines.
I was surprised by how many HoF managers have seemingly unimpressive W/L records. Winning, yes, but not the overall numbers one might expect. It appears that most of even the best managers had several years of mediocrity to counterbalance those seasons for which they are remembered and honored.
Read a book a couple of years ago about Stengel’s pre Yankees days as a manager. Described in detail the moves he made to improve each ball club during his tenure. Never won anything because he didn’t have the horses but he already knew how to manage. Yet when he was with the Yankees he was accused of being a pushbutton manager who only won because of the talent. Stengel’s overall numbers were also brought down by several historically awful years as manager of the then newborn Mets.
Only the clueless SF Giants would exercise a 9 mill option on a pitcher with the highest ERA in the NL. There’s no organization in MLB right now that wastes more money on trash than the Giants. It’s not even debatable
They bet on history. Moore was great down the stretch last year, and was at least average to above average in the previous year.
That’s why the Giants have been in the position they’ve been the past 3 seasons. They flush shekels down the toilet on players no other team wants. So you reward a player who has the HIGHEST ERA in the NL THIS YEAR, because he was “good down the stretch” last year? Lol. That makes sense. Whatever you say Bobby Evans
They are also betting on the present. Moore has a 4.20 ERA in the 2nd half and 3.18 in his last 5 starts. They are betting they get more of what they are seeing now.
It’s not a smart bet
Maybe they should sign Barry Zito for 7 years instead.
That comment itself proves you know nothing about baseball. It’s not even debatable lol!!
Please enlighten us with your insight, genius
Your saying “it’s not even debatable” doesn’t make it so. How about you post some specific examples. Name some player’s contracts, that exceed what other teams have done, that are a waste of money on, as you pejoratively state, “trash” players. Without some examples to back up your assertion, the matter is not only debatable, but clearly refutable.
You’re* 🙂
Well, gee, IDK…signing Mark Melancon to a ridiculous contract (who’s been up and down his whole career) that’ll end when he’s in his mid-late thirties. Putting all your chips into the Hunter Pence basket who’s a sabermetrician’s nightmare. Johnny Cueto, Denard Span, Shark, ..all three they splurged on when they already showed decline. So yeah, that all coincides with their current record. Not to mention the lack of importance they put into drafting and acquiring young talent. The Giants are a joke. In no way will they be able to compete with AZ, COL & LA in the next several years due to the dumb decision making up top
3 championships in 5 years. Nuff said
True. But what about the next ten yrs when you’re finishing 10-20 games behind the D-Backs and Dodgers?
The Phillies wasted $56 million this year on Jeremy Hellickson, Michael Saunders, Clay Buchholz, Howie Kendrick and Pat Neshek when they were rebuilding. That has to stand out in MLB history.
Picking up Moore’s option is a no-brainer. Letting him go, with the stuff he has, and the flashes of brilliance, though few and far between, would be stupid. He’s had 11 starts where he’s gone at least 6 innings, and given up only 2 or fewer ERs. The ERA reflects the fact that when he’s bad, he’s very bad.
It’s only $9m, and his value is at a low point and can only go up, There would be plenty of teams willing to take a chance on him thinking they could fix what’s wrong. There’s more to be gained by picking up the option then there is to lose. And there’s a lot to lose by not picking it up, and have him bounce back.
Matt Moore is a bum
That’s the in-depth insight that we come here for. Thanks.
Yeah, he’s a durable lefty with great stuff and eats a lot of innings at 28 yo for $9 mil. tad2b13 pretty much said it; you don’t want to just drop a pitcher like that, particularly if you’re a large market team. Too much upside in talent and contract, I believe.
You don’t seem to get that’s why the Giants are in the predicament they’re in. They hang on to average players, most of whom are well past their peak. Sorry, but shelling out 9 mill for an “innings eater” with the highest ERA in the NL is not a smart investment. Also, over the course of his career, he hasn’t exactly been durable
If the Giants think he’s worth 1 WAR, its a break even move.
To comment on all facets
– Best fits for Cashner: Baltimore, Kansas City, the Mets or Cincy. I’d guess 2/$24m. He’s at the very least a solid innings eater.
– $9m for a starter is a bargain. Giants would be stupid not to exercise the option considering with any improvement, he could be traded for prospects.
– The record isnt why Bryan Price is bad- it’s because the Reds are deep into a rebuild and almost none of their prospects have shown any promise. While a lot of that could be put on the FO, Price just doesnt seem to get through to these kids
I agree with all,of this, but mostly the Price analysis. He’s in a rebuild, so he wasn’t going to rack up wins. Progress in Cincy comes in the form of player development. There’s been plenty of development among the hitters. We will end the season the five guys with 25+ homers, etc. but the pitchers have made zero progress. Price has had three years to figure out how to work with young pitchers and he hasn’t done it yet. With this contract extension, he’s not being held accountable for his struggles.
The Ranger has no pitching at all. Cash had a lucky season this year. Rangers GM John Daniels needs to keep Cash on the team. Cash also reminds me of Colby Lewis a really good work horse.
Here’s what the Giants offseason will look like: Lure Aubrey Huff out of retirement and sign him to a 5 yr/80 mill contract. Resign Matt Cain to a 6 yr/80 mill contract. Announce Hunter Pence and Pablo Sandoval will be starting at their respective positions on opening day 2018. Sign Bartolo Colon to 2 years and bring back Tim Lincecum on a major league deal. Oh, and announce the “slugging Denard Span” will be batting cleanup in 2018. Not far fetched lol
Sounds legit. Recipe for success right there. Anything to avoid a complete rebuild.
Is Barry Zito available as well?
No, it’s not (just) far fetched; it’s ridiculous beyond description.
He’s kidding
Sarcasm
And if they’re going to sign a FA, Cashner could be added for just 3 years, $50M. Unfortunately Bryan Price is staying in CIN, but at some point next year he’ll be fired, so there is hope.
No one does more to get fired than Bobby Evans..I can’t believe I’m even reading the possibility of resigning this waste of space..While we’re wasting money, let’s bring back Cain too. Love what he did up till 2013. He’s a liability now though. Organizational overhaul top to bottom. Not just the players..