Major League Baseball announced on Monday that beginning in the 2018 season, teams will be limited to six non-pitching-change mound visits per nine-inning game. In extra-inning games, teams will receive one additional non-pitching-change mound visit per inning.
Major League Baseball will also reduce between-innings down time to 2:05 during locally televised regular season games, 2:25 during nationally televised regular season games and 2:55 during tiebreaker and postseason contests. There will be no pitch clock implemented for the 2018 season.
Under the new rules, mound visits are defined as: “a manager or coach trip to the mound to meet with the pitcher” and “a player leaving his position to confer with the pitcher, including a pitcher leaving the mound to confer with another player … regardless of where the visit occurs or the length of the visit.”
In addition to visits that result in a pitching change, there are notable exceptions to the mound visit rules as well. Communication between players and pitchers which “occur between batters in the normal course of play and do not require either the position player(s) or the pitcher to relocate” are still permitted, as are visits from position players to clean their spikes in rainy conditions, injury-related visits and visits following the announcement of an offensive substitution.
Once all six visits have been used, catchers may appeal to the umpires to make an additional mound visit in the instance of a cross-up between signs. Cross-up visits prior to the limit being reached will still count against the six-visit limit.
Punishment for violation of these rules will be subject to commissioner discretion: “Players who consistently or flagrantly violate the time limits will be subject to progressive discipline for just cause by the Office of the Commissioner pursuant to Article XI(C) of the Basic Agreement.”
The instant replay system is also changing in 2018. Teams’ video review rooms will now receive “direct slow motion camera angles” for the 2018 season, and phone lines “connecting the video review rooms and the dugout” will be installed and monitored so that they are not used for the purposes of sign stealing.
“I am pleased that we were able to reach an understanding with the Players Association to take concrete steps to address pace of play with the cooperation of players,” said Rob Manfred in announcing the changes. “My strong preference is to continue to have ongoing dialogue with players on this topic to find mutually acceptable solutions.”
Did MLB and owners get the approval of Lavar Ball first?
Only the doyuers and angels apply
Long overdue.
BS… This is gonna confuse games and quite honestly, it is the essence of baseball.
Umps should be able to give warnings on unreasonable delays, and maybe expel managers for non-compliance? dunno. but to limit x time visits per game is against baseball DNA.
Don’t agree….have you ever sat and watched a Cardinals game for example and watched a mound visit for every batter between the catcher and pitcher?
Warnings on”unreasonable delays” …..how would you define that without total confusion and difference between umpire crews just like strike zone differences would wreck the rule.
Baseball DNA is based on Baseball in 2018, not in the 1860″s.
Umps give warning on delays now. Umps tell managers to end their mound visit. Umps tell batters to get in the box. So I’m not really sure what you are talking about.
I think Rocky is referring to potential inconsistencies. If something is left up to interpretation – in this case, the Umpire’s discretion – there is likely to be issues.
Cubs fan huh?
limited visits to the mound shouldn’t really confuse the games
It also won’t save much time. The average mound visit is 28 seconds and there are currently an average of 8 per game according to MLB. It will save less than a minute.
It’s about pace of play not time of game. When it’s 2-2 with a runner on second and the pitcher takes 30 seconds to get back on the rubber, looks at the catcher for 5 seconds then the catcher calls time and runs out to the mound it’s pretty infuriating
So what will 2 less mound visits, visits that now will have no time limit like they did in 2017, do to change the pace of play?
Interviews with pitchers about this issue have been enlightening. They have said they will simply have to step off the rubber and then get a new set of signs. The length of games and pace of play will not be better. It will be worse as pitchers step off the rubber in those situations and then step back on to get their signs. We have all seen pitchers shake off signs multiple times before the catcher goes to the mound to clear things up. Now the pitcher will just step off the rubber multiple times and restart the process of getting his signs. Why not just have the catcher shorten the process by going out and saying these are the signs?
Manfred needs to throw his fine tooth comb away and leave baseball alone, I hope more umps get hit by fastballs because of cross ups so the MLB can see how stupid this rule is
Anybody know what the old limits to down time between innings were?
About 4-5 mins
But in reality the game used to be done in 2 hours before the whole tv thing took place
Games also didn’t have artificial lighting for 60 years so there was an incentive to get games done quickly..
There wasn’t one. There was just rules on intentional delay of game, and limits on the commercial breaks themselves…but to my knowledge there was no specific rule that assigned a specific time limit to play resuming.
There were rules on how long the between-inning break was. Put in in 2015 and now shortened.
The 2015 pace of play rules were 2:25 for a local telecast and 2:45 for a national. That clock started “immediately after the third out is recorded.” This also applies to pitching changes in the middle of an inning. The starting pitcher must be ready to make the pitch and the batter must be in the batter’s box ready to hit when the clock reaches zero.
They took 20 seconds off. Works out to 5:20 or 5:40 for a nine-inning game with no in-game pitching changes.
That clock on pitching changes started when the new pitcher took the mound for their warmup pitches. The average from the time the manager or coach visits the mound to remove the pitcher to the time the first pitch is thrown to a batter is 3:20 according to MLB.
Actually, the clock on pitching changes starts when the relief pitcher coming in from the bullpen crosses the warning track or the foul line for parks with bullpens on the side (think Wrigley up to a couple years back).
The same timing rules apply. Last warm-up at 25 seconds Both pitcher and batter must be ready to go when the clock hits zero.
Having umpires call the entire strike zone instead of their own would do the trick. Automated balls and strikes would do better yet.
if they did that then the league would have to admit that they only use half the strike zone. I rarely see top third of the strike zone called as a strike.
there waste study done that showed the auto zone calling programs are wrong a decent amount.
I can’t recall the numbers off hand, but I want to say some of them were off around 15 percent of the time
Isn’t that still an improvement over some guys though…
And how often are actual umpires wrong? I’d guess they are easily worse than the machines.
Do you really mean, how often do the fans assume the umpires are wrong?
Yes that’s the real question.
The current computer zone that is always on the screen these days is such a distraction. Most fans can tell if something is close to a strike without that little animation up there. I think that animation is why so many people are complaining about the strike zone more because fans believe it is 100% accurate, which it isn’t. Most don’t calculate the height of a player and adjust the zone accordingly, and a strike is defined as where the ball CROSSES the plate, not where it ends up in the catcher’s mitt.
Automation would allow pitchers to throw fewer pitches, reducing the need to change pitchers so frequently.
It is available….try X-Box. Baseball is played by humans, lets leave it that way.
You also have to consider that for most players baseball is a long endeavor, starting as a kid in Little League on up. How many LL teams can afford automated, American Legion, High school and even independent leagues. Play all your life with the human factor…finally make it and get signed and the zone changes.
no one is saying baseball shouldn’t be played by humans. Having an automated strike zone would increase accuracy but therr would still be home plate umpire for calls at the plate. This eventual change would only happen at the highest level, wouldn’t change anything for little league. If they make the show, it’s like getting a reward with accurate strike calls and I think everyone would be ok, they wouldn’t say no I don’t want those millions of dollars because now I have to play with an accurate artificial umpire.
Joe Kerr…..My intention was to type played and officiated by humans but I was distracted by phone calls. Tech can be great…at times…..so where do we end it?
The tech exists to have sensors in a first baseman’s glove and the bag. It could detect if the runner beats the throw. It exists for a ball to be tracked and sensors in the foul lines and pole…..we could eliminate that possible error too. We aren’t that far from tech that could help OF’ers to track a ball better…get a better route…should we go there as well? Were should we draw the line of tech making a human game perfect?
if there is technology to make the game called correctly so the players can play and have the actual outcomes called, I’m all for it. I don’t even understand why some people are ok with having wrong calls made when we have the tech to make sure they are called correctly. games including in the playoffs have been decided by bad calls and wins have gone to the wrong teams bc of them, on what planet is that ok?
On what planet? This one were the dominate species is human and humans err. We are not perfect and neither are the games we play.
Also better make sure whatever system used in secure and stand alone. I am not being factious or making a joke….there are plenty of hackers who would love to try and rig the game for there team or just for kicks.
Have a great day…I’m done as the conversation will become circular.
It’s quite a leap to jump from using technology to assist Umpire’s in making the correct call, to using technology for assisting players in-game.
The strike zone is meant to be a black and white thing – it’s either a strike, or it’s not. Technology has merit in determining whether the right call is made or not.
Implying that this is some kind of gateway towards allowing fielders to use technology in game to track balls etc is a massive reach.
so when we have the ability to be perfect or a lot closer, we shouldn’t? Yeah, why try to improve things and be correct more often, that makes no sense. It’s not taking anything away from the players and the umps would be right more often, why is this a problem?
I suppose you think automakers shouldn’t try to improve safety in newer vehicles and roads shouldn’t be filled in when a lot hole happens either. just leave everything as is with errors
Please follow your own thought. We are talking about a game (the greatest game ever, but still a game), not life or death. The human aspect is part of what makes baseball the greatest game. And as much as that bothers some on here, the umpires are part of the human aspect. Cats right, if anyone wants a “perfect” game, they can play video games. And yes, my team has been screwed by umpires as well. Just like every other team.
Wtf is wrong with you people not wanting the correct calls? I give up, idiots win.
Joe, I am sorry you are a sore loser. Is there anything we can do for you? We can call your mom, and she could bring you a change of diapers. The fact that you immediately went to name calling tells me you are the one with low mental capacity. Anyway, buck up little camper. We still love you.
Except the zone isn’t getting changed, it’s just being more accurately called… If umpires call the game the way it’s supposed to be called, not much would be changing…
I dub the “The Sanchez Rule”
Call it the Willson Contreras rule
right, because no one else does it
Not many do it as much as he does.
I think there’s medicine out there somewhere for your booty if it’s hurting.
Good God man. If a Cubs player ran over some kids at a school crossing you’d say those damn kids were blocking his view of the road.
Limiting the mound visits by catchers is one pace of play thing that I am okay with. You’ve got advanced scouting reports on every hitter, catchers shouldn’t need to go to the mound 4 times per inning to discuss pitch sequences.
Plus managers are throwing signals. It’s not like the pitching staff has to memorize every scouting report.
In 2017 catchers and coaches visited the mound an average of 8 times per game. This cuts that down to 6. At an average of 28 seconds per mound visit, that makes the game 56 seconds shorter on average. So excited that the game will be less boring because of that immense time savings.
It’s not the regular season games that are the problem, it’s the 4 hour playoff games. Contreras takes about 8 trips to the mound every two innings. Pitchers don’t want the catchers coming out all the time anyway, it disrupts their rhythm
Have you heard many pitchers say that? What they will say is they want the signs clear as quickly as possible. With all the changes to signs needed because of the high tech sign stealing going on, signs are changed often. A catcher visit to the mound may be the quickest way to do that. We will find out in 2018.
Instead of taking extra time for replays, MLB should just play a lot of games per season to eliminate the impact of a bad call or luck. 160-something would be my suggestion.
Except, we still have playoff spits decide by few enough games that it makes a difference.
Anyone know the last day you can trade for someone who is an pending free agent and still be able to attach a qo to them ?
Once the regular season starts, the QO is voided by a trade.
I was thinking that but wasn’t sure
Thanks Tim
Yep, this.
The QO is voided on draft day in June.
draft day or the day after
Hate all these catchers visits.
With teams stealing signs—with a greater assistance by technology—sometimes the visits are necessary.
What you need to do is hook op the pitcher catcher and manager. We have the technology, why don’t we?
I agree, just like in football with the coach and QB.
So then we have a catcher talking to the pitcher with the batter 2 feet away? LOL. That’s going to work great.
Well, commissioner, my strong preference is for you to stop messing with the greatest sport ever.
Bud Selig did enough damage, already.
I couldn’t agree more.
Most baseball fans are 55+. Baseball is in huge trouble. If you are a younger baseball fan, then great. You are in the minority.
Please explain as your statement is heavily opinionated. Revenue is up, attendance is up, tv ratings are up. Im 40 and everybody i know around my age loves baseball …
It’s not complex. Kids are not getting into baseball. They think it’s boring. They don’t stick around long enough to find out it’s not.
It is also harder and more expensive for city kids to play. There are basketball courts all over cities and all you need is one guy with a ball. Football…one football and some open park land. Baseball…each kid needs a glove or at least half do and be willing to share, multiple bats and if it’s anything like when I played sandlot games as a kid…several balls as they will get lost. Fewer diamonds or anything passable in cities now. The other sports are easier.
Hi, I’m 17 and Baseball is the only sport I really care about (besides hockey when my hometown team is competitive). I don’t want a pitch clock, but limiting mound visits to about 1 per inning is alright in my book. The biggest issue is indeed the commercial break length but what are ya gonna do, they gotta make TV revenue somehow and they just shortened it a bit. This should speed up the game quite a bit but not beyond reason and it probably won’t significantly change game outcomes, unlike a pitch clock.
Young people have short attention spans. Baseball is like chess requires thinking.
Basketball is only number 1 bc it’s fast and requires no thinking
Football they only play about 12 mins a game
It’s only the Yankees and Red Sox games that are excruciatingly long, the other games are fine. If you want high speed go watch the NBA or NHL.
Google “youth baseball crisis”
Average age of an MLB fan 55, NFL 50, NBA 42. Google average age of fans of sports. PGA golf has the oldest and MLS has the youngest at 40.
I have a great idea on how to speed up games
I disagree. Participation in our local rec ball league has skyrocketed since my son began playing 5 years ago. We went from having only a few travel ball teams across 8U-12U in our area to now having 3-4 travel teams in each age group. Surrounding towns and counties are also experiencing tremendous growth.
Two new indoor BP facilities have opened. There’s no practice time available once the season starts because all of the fields are needed for games. Travel tournaments across the southeast are packed as well. Many tournaments are already full, even with complexes that have 20+ fields.
The one thing choking off youth baseball growth is most of the money available is diverted to inner city / urban baseball and despite all that money urban baseball growth has been minimal. Lots of clinics, lots of new equipment and fields, but low participation.
There were 6.5 million juvenile (ages 4-17) amateur players in the US in 2017. That is 480,000 less than its peak in the 1980’s and it has grown each of the past 8 years.
Amateur participation by juveniles is up and has been going up for 8 years. For MLB TV revenue and viewership is up, streaming of live games is skyrocketing, and overall revenue is up. I can’t find anything you said that is backed up by what is actually happening. I appreciate your opinion, but the facts tell a different story.
One more thing – rec ball participation is so high in this area that travel teams are finding it hard to find practice fields. The priority in our area is rec ball participation and the county charges absurd fees to travel teams for the few weekend hours that fields are available.
Those stats are for attendance at live events. Advertise on broadcasts for those events and you will find that the demographics are much different. Advertise on streaming of those events and you will find they are not even close.
That’s your local area…
A May, 2106 study asked people “Are you a fan of professional baseball or not?” “Yes, a fan” “Somewhat a fan” and “Not a fan” were the choices.
“Yes, I’m a fan” was given as an answer by 34% of 18-34 year-olds, 32% of 35-54 year-olds and 25% of age 55+. “Yes, I’m a fan” or “somewhat a fan” by 59% of 18-34, 55% of 35-54, and 51% of 55+.
Baseball has the highest revenue in its history and its trending up the past decade. While the audience at live games is 55, the audience on streaming is much, much younger. MLBAM gave me an average age of 31 for streaming when I asked for demographics for advertising purposes. Younger fans are just watching in different ways. You want to change the demographics at live games? Take your kids to the games. If you are 55, take your kids AND grandkids to the games.
But if you do take your kids and/or grandkids to a game, get seats in the family section. I want to be able to drink a beer and swear where I sit.
Average age of fans covers all sources of how people view the games via Live,Streaming,and Cable. This is done by ESPN among other sources for one being George Will. Love the game if you will but don’t ignore the facts or try to skew them to fit your opinion. Why in the world does the commissioner want to do this if things are so great for the future. It has been said and written..the more the boomers die off the more MLB falls further behind.
LOL. OK, you got it. We don’t have a major league team here in North Carolina, but when we go up to Baltimore or down to Miami we usually sit in the OF because its cheaper to take grandkids too. I make about 80 minor league games in NC and around here a year and take the grandkids to 20-25 games. You can sit behind home plate at a minor league game for cheaper than OF bleachers for a major league game.
The demographics for attendance at live MLB games is around 55 years of age. For TV broadcasts it’s 42 and for streaming it is 31. I advertise on MLB broadcasts for 4 teams, in 3 different ballparks, and on streaming. They will provide you with all the data if you call and say you want to give them money. I always get the facts because it’s my money on the line.
I used to advertise on TV and in stadium for Panthers games too, but didn’t get the results I get from baseball.
That the commissioner is making changes that will have no effect on game times is ludicrous. Young or old people will not flock to games that are 56 seconds shorter because of 2 less mound visits per game or 5 minutes shorter because they show 1 less commercial between innings. Get real. People want to see more ACTION in the games and the trends to more strike outs, walks and home runs, things that most people on these boards applaud, are actually what is making the games longer and more boring. See my post below if you want to see changes that will actually have an affect on game length and on the action during games.
One thing to note about TV ratings. When you compare national telecasts, baseball ratings are down considerably. But if you look at each team’s local ratings, they are very good. In most of the MLB’s markets, the local team’s broadcast on the regional sports network are the highest rated shows on cable every week.
It isn’t that baseball isn’t as popular, it’s just that most fans only watch their local team. Fans of the Mariners don’t want to watch a game between Cleveland and Toronto, just to name random teams (not meaning offense to fans of any of those team or the teams themselves).
Yea all the sports experts and the commissioner’s office are just dead wrong..lofl
What time period would you like MLB to be frozen at? 1961 before expansion began? 1967 before the mound was lowered? 1968 before playoffs were introduced? 1972 before the DH was introduced? 1998 before some more expansions and extra playoffs? 201? when the wild card game was instituted? 19?? when the gloves were first introduced, and then got larger and larger and larger until it’s just silly what they wear? Exactly where you like the mighty institution of MLB to remain frozen in a mythical moment of perfect a-history?
I say go back to when the batters got to call the pitch and location and the pitcher had to throw it there.
Great reply. Thanks!
Haaaah!!! Great post, I would super-rec if I could.
Pedro Baez and his ilk will continue to deliver roughly two pitches every three minutes. Set….hold……step off…rinse….repeat……as TV viewers change the channel.
We need a pitch clock.
I’m fine with a pitch clock but only for Baez lol, like it’ll only be implemented when he comes in to pitch
Make it simple
Ball
Pedro Baez averages 31 seconds per pitch and he is an anomaly. Even he throws a pitch every 22 seconds with no one on base.
The average time per pitch with no one on base is already at the 20 second mark. Why make changes that will not save any time?
Less commercial time? I’m all in!
Ok—so the way I am reading it is that an individual (Willson Contreras, example) is subject to discipline if he habitually makes his 14 visits to the mound during the game. After six or amount approved visits there is no penalty to a team during the game (a called ball, etc). At least here, there is no verbiage to cover batters out of the box or visits by the third base coach to the batter during the game.
Here’s a way to speed thing up—have a fifth ump on site to handle the review immediately from the press box or somewhere else inside the stadium and not have to call it into New York.
Calling to New York takes the same amount of time as calling someone in the stadium because it’s instantaneous. All the umpire crews get rotated through the replay center during the season.
Where more replay time is wasted is the Manager waiting to check after every close play.
Exactly. The decision to challenge should almost be instantaneous.
That’s what bugs me. Challenge it or don’t. You shouldn’t get to review whether or not you want to review it.
Especially with the ridiculous pop up slide reviews that clearly aren’t why we have video review.
Yes–and to my point of having a “5th” umpire doing replay inside the stadium, they can already be reviewing the play while a decision to review can be made. I know we are splitting hairs, but the ump on site can be a handful of clicks ahead of New York in the process. As a fan at home, there are numerous times that I have hit the DVR and rewound for a second/third look before the manager makes a decision. The umpire on site can also be doing this.
It doesn’t necessarily have to be someone on site. Just someone that is actually watching the game and can anticipate a review being needed. So that when the umpire actually puts on the headset the replay official can say “I’ve already watched it five times and the call is right/wrong.”
I can agree with that. Since I don’t know the exact protocol in New York, I don’t know that they don’t have designates for every game, but I can imagine two or three calls coming in at the same time. As long as there is someone to pull the trigger and can anticipate the need (we as fans know, so they should, too) I agree that that person can be anywhere, not necessarily 100 feet away.
If the manager has time to have someone look at a replay to decide if he wants to challenge, surely there can be a replay official that also uses that time to look at replays in anticipation of a challenge.
The manager has 10 seconds to make a decision and he only has 3 challenges per game. 1 in the first 6 innnings and 2 in innings 7-9. There is no time savings there.
Not quite accurate. The manager has 10 seconds to indicate thinking about a challenge. He has 30 seconds to actually challenge.
It is my understanding that a manager has only 1 challenge per regular season game.
I posted the link. Go take a look. He has 10 seconds to challenge.
I’ll quote directly from MLB’s own “Major League Baseball Replay Review Regulations”.
“A Manager must notify an Umpire that the Club is contemplating challenging the play in less than ten (10) seconds after the conclusion of the play. If a Manager wishes to invoke his challenge he must do so within thirty (30) seconds after the conclusion of the play or prior to the commencement of the next play, whichever occurs first.”
He has ten seconds to say he’s thinking about issuing a challenge and thirty seconds to actually issue that challenge.
why not show the crew chief and the other umpire involed, or if crew chief made the call, the umpire with most tenure, watch the video and make a call. video shows for two minutes then goes off. stand it ir reverse it.
I don’t agree with the addition of players going to the mound—especially catchers—counting against visits. That’s all
Catchers going out multiple times per inning is the primary reason for the rule!
Managers are actually calling the majority of pitchers not the catchers any longer so why so many visits to the mound? Trying to figure out where their dinner reservation is?
Managers are not calling the majority of pitches. That is just false.
there go the dramatics of the game. coaches and managers were limited to two visits per pitcher anyway before making a pitching change.
This now limits it to six for the entire game and also includes when any player, including the catcher, goes to the mound.
We do not need a pitch clock, and the limits to mound visits will do overall more harm than good for the game. These changes are an overreach by the commissioner’s office to exert their own rules on the game that has THRIVED for over a hundred years. MLB needs to let the players play and if they really want to add young viewers to the game, LESS COMMERCIALS (Even less time than this article lays out). Don’t mess with baseball…. I had hoped that would be an obvious conclusion
I hope we don’t see nay 14+ inning games or we will be seeing position players pitching. A complete joke of an unnecessary rule.
How about we just have a play clock and each team bats until the clock runs out, it pauses for mound visits and pitching changes only. Similar to the HR derby. I mean if we’re going to try to constrain the game by time why don’t we just time the game instead of running on the inning system?
Get rid of the third out. That’ll speed the game up
LOL, IKR.
Why not just make it like rec league softball all counts start at 1-1. /sarc/
Introduce ties for the regular season, limiting games to 12 innings. I don’t know why this hasn’t been done yet.
because it’s stupid
Because nobody but you wants it.
because we’re not French and this isn’t soccer.
I’m opposed to ties in any sporting event — ties defeat the purpose of competition.
Ties help the players, though, preventing 17 inning disasters that increase the risk of injury when they typically have to play the next day. >12 inning games are uncommon, but it’s still something I would have thought the MLBPA would have gone for.
You really think the players want to play to a tie? Really?
How many 17 inning games are there? Not nearly enough that it’s a problem, that’s for sure.
But it fits perfectly with today’s “everybody gets a trophy” mentality 🙂
Classic Cubs fan. But really, ties are stupid
Lets say it’s late September. Your favorite team is tied for the division lead. Instead of taking the division, the game ends in a tie, and you get a wild card because you fall a half game. That would be the worst way for the regular season to end, and without ties, it can totally be prevented.
Limit warm up pitches on the mound to 3. They have this thing called a bullpen…
It’s a good idea in theory, but bullpen mounds are often not the same as the mound in the field of play. Also, with the number of pitcher injuries we already see, more rather than less warmups for pitchers might be the best way to go.
Pitchers have no limit on the number of warm up pitches they can take. But under these new rules they have to make their final warm up pitch with 25 seconds left on the 2:05 or 2:25 between inning break.
This is stupidity, I hate it already. My nephews play in a league were they put a limit of 1.5 hours of game time and then it ends. Maybe the Manfred will propose that next.
You serving any cheese with that wine/
You know what else, we should eliminate pitchers and use a tee like your nephews, too!
Don’t know how anyone can be against this. And just when we thought they’d never give up precious advertising dollars
God I hate Manfred. Let Willson go to the mound as many times as he damn well pleases. I am not part of the spoiled video game generation. Get an attention span people. And try learning the game better. It’ll give you something to think about during the down time. Like strategery.
Maybe Contreras should learn the game better so we don’t have to watch him go to the mound a dozen times a game.
Extra inning games aren’t the problem. 9 inning games taking 3 plus hours is what their issue is. I don’t know what kind of baseball fan stops watching a game part way through.
next CBA the players need to demand they remove Manfred,the last 3 collusion cases filed he has been involved in, and he is ruining the game
Heard the most eye opening statistic on MLB Network last week…
Half of the people who identify as baseball fans are 55 or older. Half.
Anyone wondering why Manfred is making these changes, there is your answer. Like it or not.
Yeah. looking around the stadium when I go, you do notice an older crowd on the seats. You have to pick up on the younger crowd to get the revenue to continue. If you keep losing the 2o somethings to early 3o somethings, you will have your fan base die out. The players union should be on board with trying to get the younger demographics interested in going to the games and watching on TV. If you have the fans die off and no younger one’s to replace them, revenue drops and when revenue drops, salaries will drop and it will not be collusion at fault.
I can’t get my 11 year old son to watch a game with me. When I was a kid, my dad took me to a game that was played in 1:31 minutes. And I still remember the game. Messersmith against Longborg. Pinson hit a home run. Dave May made a great over the shoulder catch.
Games have to move at a faster pace or the game will pass up the next generation of fans.
Yeah, games changed with the advent of cable and local cable stations that starting televising the games. TV revenue helped boost the revenue but that revenue boost made the games run longer because the boost was made possible by advertising revenue,. Need the commercial breaks longer to push the games. MLB can’t shorten the tv breaks so they have to look to in game ways to shorten the time. Back in the 70’s and before, it was radio driven and cheaper to broadcast the games in that medium. Announcers would give sponsor plugs in between batters, etc to keep the game moving and shorter times between innings. Yeah, I remember a lot of games at 3 Rivers and Forbes Field prior to that,. I remember the scheduled double headers and you did not have much more time invested for 2 games back then as you do for 1 long nationally televised game now. The games moved along as there were no broadcast delays. If the radio station missed the start of an inning it was on them, not the teams or umpires. No waiting for the commercials to end.
We’re slowly starting to see traditional commercials be fazed out during sporting broadcasts. Those 30-second in-game ads and those splash ads that they do in place of traditional commercials. I can see that eventually becoming the wide spread norm to keep people tuned in.
To me (and maybe it’s just anecdotal on my part) is that it’s not just the extra commercials between innings. It’s the amount of time it actually takes the players to play the games that’s changed the most.
It’s not just mound visits, it’s also batters stepping out of the box after very pitch, more pitching changes, and all of the other things.
There are 18 half-innings in a normal baseball game, with 17 commercials breaks in between. Even if they are showing an additional 1 minute of commercials between innings, that only adds up to 17 additional minutes. The average game was about 2:24 in the late 70’s, and now it’s over 3 hours. That additional 36+ minutes is not coming from just an additional 1 minute of commercials between innings.
As Phillies fan I love Odubel Herrera and his enthusiasm. But he’s one of the biggest offenders in how much time he takes between pitches, It drives even some Phillies’ fans crazy.
There’s actually less commercial time (time away from the game running ads) between innings now than there was in the 80’s.
I thin we agree. That’s why I wrote “even if”.
Manfred is just deluding himself if he thinks the actual clock run time of the ball games is why kids aren’t paying attention anymore. If you don’t get why it’s cool throwing a curveball over for a called strike on a 2-0 count the majority of the baseball game seems completely pointless to the casual observer.
Please leave baseball alone before we’re left with a drowned out boring sport like football
When is the last time baseball has been left alone? Oh wait… Never.
what’s great about baseball is that it changes, nothing great stays the same. Every other sport is changing, and so does baseball, for the benefit of the fans
I’m surprised more people are not for this.
If teams can’t get a game plan ready with all the pre-game prep and SIX VISITS, then that is a horribly run team. Most of these visits have to do with switching signs. Hook up the pitcher catcher and manager electronically. The most prepared teams will have an advantage… That’s a good thing.
It seems like the majority that are against it are Cubs fans. I wonder why?
If it wasn’t their starting catcher feeling the need to go to the mound 400 times per game, I’m sure many would feel differently, even if they won’t admit it here.
I actually like these rules. For 95% of the games, nothing will change, but it does stop teams from purposely stalling a game, for example by having a catcher visit the mound 5 times during 1 at bat to get a reliever warmed up.
As long as there is no actual clock during the game (including a pitch clock), I’m happy.
O, and as a dutchman I will say this: We had the tie-break in our league and international events for years. It is very stupid and was seen as a typical european way to prohibit longer game times. This year the got rid of it… And now American baseball has taken note. The tie-break should stay out of all baseball leagues that take themselves seriously.
Am I reading this wrong or is there still not a limit on actual replay time? I shouldn’t have to stare at umpires trying to communicate with ghosts for 5 minutes. If the overturn isn’t obvious right away then let the call stand and move on.
There’s always been a two minute limit on replays, but there’s no limit for postseason games. The replay official can get that time extended if there were technical issues, if there’s more than one aspect of the play in review, or if the play involves one of baseball’s myriad obscure rules.
Pitcher to Catcher mound visits to go over signs when teams are constantly stealing them and they must be changed within games should not be considered a mound visit.
I’m much more in favor of the restrictions being placed on mound visits than the implementation of a pitch clock. I’m tired of seeing so many catcher visits to the mound especially with Willson Contreras of the Cubs who often does it multiple times in a single inning.
What’s funny is there has been a 20 second pitch clock for years. Either it’s not enforced or they took it off the books.. If they took it off the books, I’m not sure when.
The shorter time between innings is good. Stupid that they have so much time between innings. Used to not be like that before TV. I also like putting a limit on coach/player visits to the mound. Absolutely ridiculous to see the catcher go out to the mound to stall for the bullpen and then once he gets back behind the plate then the manager makes the pitching change. Also stupid to see the catcher make a mound visit, get back behind the plate and then make another mound visit without a pitch being thrown. WTF? What did they talk about during the first mound visit? Their favorite vacation spots?
Im ok with this as long as they extend beer sales until the 9th inning. All this to save 2min, is going to cost me $20-40 and 5-10 minutes in line ….. lol
It’s about dead time. Men are on base… Mike Trout’s coming to the plate, it’s late in the game. And then it takes one to two minutes between pitches. You can go downstairs, grab a drink, come back and they still haven’t thrown the ball.
Because there is not sustained excitement, young fans are turning off.
Forgive me if someone has stated this already, but if you want to cut down on mound visits, implement a radio system like in football. Players can wear a small earpiece. Managers only have mics and can directly communicate with the entire defense at once, can call pitches verbally (eliminating the need for signs, which leads to most catcher visits). Players will hear the pitch call and can adjust their positioning accordingly. Managers can shift players around without the bench coach having to get on the top step of the dugout and wave his arms to get the left fielder’s attention. This can also be used on offense instead of traditional signs.
For the record, I’m old school and just want things left alone, but that’s just simply not going to happen. I think this idea would eliminate the need for most mound visits, speed up play, and still allow for the essential communication needed in a game without limitation.
I’m just happy that it’s no longer after 2 mound visits, they must pull the pitcher out of the game.
Ironically, the biggest thing they could to improve pace of play, increase action and cut the length of games would be to just call the strike zone as currently written in the rule book.
I get the sense this will lead to on field arguments that will end up actually increasing the average game time. To be fair, that should mitigate itself as the league adjusts, but I’m certain we’ll see plenty of game-extending squabbling over the exact definition of a visit and if one has been completed. Too much room for interpretation. It largely becomes yet another mode of umpire judgement.
Arguments are fun. This isn’t about length of game, it’s about pace of play.
Why are so many people missing that?
The talk has been about, to the minute, breaking down game times. So it is game time, to some extent. And arguments slow down pace of play anyway, so I’m not sure what you’re getting at.
Just put the baseball on a tee and let them hit. That will cut time down. and let them use ghost men on the base pads that way no more running around taking up time.
The commish has lost his mind.
That is all
That actually worked really well in the league I ran in my back yard.
They only count pitching changes as a mound trip when it’s mid-inning so 6 is plenty. AL fans will still get to enjoy their nightly late game parade of one-out relievers
I think this is going overboard for all games, but totally great way to get Red Sox and Yankees games avoiding being 5 hours long all the time.
The Yankees and Red Sox once were on ESPN, in the top of the 4th when my local game started, and in the bottom of the 5th when my local game ended.
which ever team scores first, the other team bats until they tie or go ahead, no matter how many outs it takes. after three outs, bases are cleared and game continues.
Can we get rid of instant replay on every single play that happens. Letting the manager spend five minutes deciding on if he’s going to challenge or not seems like a big waste of time to me
The manager has 10 seconds to decide if he is going to challenge. He only has 3 challenges per game with one in the first 6 innings and 2 in innings 7-9. A max of 30 seconds per game.
m.mlb.com/official_rules/replay_review
One challenge allowed per each REGULAR SEASON game …
Ever notice how people are making things up to support their opinion. They claim they are fans, but I’m not sure they are.
Giradi might have gotten fired because he let the replay time elapse. If people are baseball fans, they know exactly what I’m talking about.
m.mlb.com/official_rules/replay_review
Ten seconds to contemplate, 30 seconds to challenge. Also, only one challenge per regular season game. Or, more accurately, one unsuccessful challenge per regular season game.
None of that will help. Here are the real problems with pace of play.
P/PA
With the 3 true outcomes “revolution” and the hit it in the air philosophy today there are more strike outs, more walks, and more home runs because that is what teams and players are focusing on learning to do. Those types of at bats are boring even for the most ardent of fans because of the lack of balls in play. Those types of plate appearances also take significantly more pitches and more pitches take more time per plate appearance. The average game is 43 pitches longer than the average game 30 years ago. At 20 seconds per pitch that is a game that is 14.33 minutes longer with less action.
Pitchers per game
In 1987 the average game used 5 pitchers between the two teams. Today they use 9 and that number is creeping up. Each pitching change is an average of 3 minutes and 20 seconds including the visit to the mound by the manager or pitching coach and the time it takes to get the new pitcher to the mound, give them their warmup pitches and get the batter in the box. So 4 more pitchers is an additional 13 minutes per game.
Between those two things alone you have 27+ more minutes per game than we did in 1987.
Catcher and coach visits to the mound have averaged 28 seconds according to MLB. Limiting them to 6 from the average of 8 saves 56 seconds per game. Wooo Hoooo. That will surely make the game more exciting. Just like the 4.5 seconds on average per game we saved from intentional walks. Pitchers already average 20 seconds per pitch with no runners on base, so a 20-second pitch clock literally saves zero time so it makes sense that they didn’t implement that one. The changes they made will make no appreciable difference in the game and I would bet that it actually lengthens games because pitcher will just step off the rubber and ask the catcher to rotate through the signs more often.
“Pitchers already average 20 seconds per pitch with no runners on base, so a 20-second pitch clock literally saves zero time so it makes sense that they didn’t implement that one.”
I don’t think you understand how averages work.
Then explain. MLB said that pitchers average 20 seconds per pitch with no runners on base. If that is not what “average” is, then explain your position. Otherwise, you have added nothing to the conversation.
Pitch clocks are not in effect with runners on base in the minors and they were not proposing that they would be in the majors, so that would not impact the length of game.
First, I agree with you post above about all of the additional time being taken by P/PA and pitching changes. It was very enlightening.
What I think Baines means about averages is that if the “average” pitch takes 20 seconds, then some are taking 10 and some are taking 30 – or more if the batter steps out of the box because the pitcher is taking too long.
A pitch clock, if adhered to, would cut the +20 second pitches and delays caused by batters stepping out, though we’d need .more data to see how much time that might actually save.
Edit: I am not in favor of a pitch clock, but I thought I’d elaborate on the “averages” point.
One at 10 seconds between pitches, one at 30 seconds between pitches = average of 20 seconds between pitches. Are you saying the average wouldn’t come down if a 20 second clock was applied?
Any of the pitchers that are above the 20 second limit would bring their times down, lowering the total average. Assuming the ones that are below that 20 second limit to begin with don’t increase their between pitch times.
If EVERY pitcher took 20 seconds between pitches, a 20 second clock would do nothing. If ANY pitchers are above 20 seconds, a 20 second pitch clock would lower times. Maybe not much, but it would come down.
That time is from when the pitcher toes the rubber until they start their pitching motion.
If we’re talking about the actual time a TV broadcast was away from a game between innings and showing ads, that was actually longer 30 years ago then it is now.
Games are longer now due to on-field actions. More pitching changes, more mound visits. Batters leaving the box to adjust the straps on the 15 different pads they are wearing. Mike “The Human Rain Delay” Hargrove was an anomaly when he played. Now it’s just about everybody. A smaller strike zone. Pitchers nibbling to try to get strikeouts resulting in a nine-pitch at-bat when they could get a ground out in three pitches. How many times during a game does the ground crew need to come out and groom the infield?
I always love when simple factual statements get “voted down” or “thumbs down.”
some people just have it in for others. they look for your comments and vote them down
If that’s the case, it’s likely some weasel Cub fan. Of course, you are a fan of Satan’s team, so I’m keeping my eyes on you, too.
Or maybe it’s not. It’s stupid troll hater comments like that that get thumbs down. I’m a Cubs fan I totally respect what you said before until you just made that other childish dumb comment.
You were going good until you posted that comment. @ pdxbrewer. Mostly it wasn’t because personally the rules effect everyone not just Cub fans or any other fans. Your 3rd comment was just plain stupid.
Did I say all Cubs fans are weasels? It’s interesting that you were immediately personally offending when I said “weasel Cub fan.”
I didn’t give you a thumbs down, but it has to be a factual statement and I highly doubt it is. Pitching charges and much more common and they get commercial breaks. Not to mention, prior to all the games being on TV, games were only on radio. That made less commercial time.
Um, games were on TV in the 80’s.
And I’ll concede the pitching change point. But I’m referring to the time between innings. There’s less commercial time between innings now than there was 30 years ago. And that’s the main thrust of these rules and this discussion and that is what I stated in my original post.
This stuff is a joke
Here’s an idea to save a couple of minutes every game. Stop singing “God Bless America.” The 2:05 between inning break clock doesn’t start until that is over.
Get rid of the useless 7th inning stretch while you’re at it. Completely pointless.
This is not about length of game, it’s about pace of play. There is a difference.
It’s like having a commercial break in the middle of a movie’s action scene. People are upset that there are ONLY 6 mound visits per nine innings? I mean really? Really?
No wonder 11 year old kids are not watching baseball games. When I was a kid, games were not televised, I listened to Scully and Enberg and everything was exciting. It was easy to love baseball. Today, everything is televised and if you are not into baseball, it’s hard to get into baseball.
There were an average of 8 mound visits per game in 2017. What exactly is this change doing to improve the pace of play?
In some games there were 12. I remember the 2009 playoffs where Jose Molina seemed to visit the mound after every hitter.
If people are crying about change this insignificant, I think they have issues. Six times is PLENTY…..
The average was 8 so if some games had 12, that means in some games there were 4. In some games in the playoffs, there were 4-5 per inning but then I don’t think these changes affect the post-season.
The point is, how will this improve the pace of play when the difference is less than a minute per game and only 2 mound visits per game? Who will notice that difference at all? If there is no noticeable difference, how will the change draw more fans to the game that want more action? If pitchers just step off the rubber and get a new set of signs 2 more times a game will that negate any difference this makes?
Well, I’m not going to have the catcher visit the mound three times during the most exciting part of the game. That’s a plus and couldn’t hurt.
Six mound visits? This isn’t going to change anything.
Easy. Create a new shift. Have the pitcher get set. All of the players are in a shift around him. They talk in that “shift,” the pitcher steps off, the player’s shift to their regular spots.
I don’t like this, but mostly because of the whole “appealing to the umpire” thing. So the catcher can just tell the umpire that their signals are crossed up and the batter is in danger every time they want a mound visit after 6? That’s just going to add confusion and chaos. If you really want to cut down on time and all that, why not limit the games to 7 innings and shorten the season? I am a life-long baseball fan, but even I would be okay with that.
Stop the game time tinkering already. The only positive thing about this is shortening of commercials. Things that would make baseball better.
FO personnel should shed their suits at the ballpark. At least let fans make believe it’s still a game.
Lose the DH and make everyone play a position. It’s a position that inept players gravitate to.