The Yankees are asking for “high-end Major League talent” in exchange for Sonny Gray, George A. King III of the New York Post hears from an official on a team interested in acquiring the right-hander. This isn’t the first time we’ve heard of the Yankees’ steep asking price for Gray, though as King notes, it may be a while before a trade emerges unless the club is willing to lower its demands. One can’t blame the Yankees for aiming high, and there’s certainly enough interest in Gray that the team can shop around, though the Yankees may not have quite enough leverage to make such a big ask. Intriguing peripherals notwithstanding, Gray did have a 4.90 ERA last season, and he has become even more of an expendable piece now that the Yankees are on the verge of re-signing J.A. Happ. With Happ, Luis Severino, James Paxton, Masahiro Tanaka, and C.C. Sabathia all in the fold, there isn’t even any room for Gray in New York’s rotation if the club hangs onto him until Opening Day.
More on the ever-developing pitching market…
- The Nationals were considering Lance Lynn for their rotation, Chelsea Janes of the Washington Post reports (via Twitter), but they weren’t willing to give the veteran righty the three-year guarantee Lynn seems to have found from the Rangers. Lynn would have filled the rotation spot left open now that Tanner Roark has been dealt to the Reds, though with Lynn off the board, Washington will keep looking at other veteran arms.
- The Twins weren’t one of the teams interested in Charlie Morton, according to 1500 ESPN’s Darren Wolfson (Twitter link). Minnesota is known to be on the lookout for pitching, though the Twins have thus far been more focused on position player additions (i.e. Jonathan Schoop and C.J. Cron) than new arms. The Astros, Rangers, and Rays were the only teams known to be looking at the veteran right-hander, who agreed to a two-year, $30MM guarantee with Tampa Bay yesterday. One would imagine more teams beyond just that trio checked in on Morton, given the righty’s impressive numbers over the last two seasons.
- Veteran southpaw Craig Breslow is considering retirement, and has been talking with the Red Sox and other teams about non-playing jobs, NBC Sports Boston’s Evan Drellich writes. The 38-year-old Breslow pitched in the Blue Jays’ minor league system in 2018, and wasn’t able to crack the big league roster in order to add a 13th Major League season to his resume. Breslow has long been seen as a candidate to move into a front office, managerial, or coaching role once he decided to hang up his spikes, and he is exploring all options as he considers whether or not to move onto this next stage or to continue pitching.
The Yankees are crazy
This is the job of a GM. Set your sights high and go down the ladder till you find a deal.
Yeah but its a bad idea to begin the process by declaring you are 100% going to move a guy, gray in this case. Weakens the leverage if you admit you have no interest in keeping the player.
Not really. Every team announces their wants, needs, and surpluses at the GM Meetings to one another.
It’s how the cards found out that Goldy would become available.
On the other hand, the Yankees have made no secret that they feel no need to have Gray on the team, plus they don’t have much of a spot in the rotation for him just now. From the Yankees point of view, Gray is probably considered half useless, as his home splits last year were, of course, horrible. From Gray’s point of view, if the Yankees keep him, how much heart can you put into it when you’re very aware the team doesn’t want you?
That trade was done before the winter meetings, so no, that is not how the cards found out about goldy.
He specifically referred to the GM meetings that were Nov 6-8. Mozeliak said in the press conference announcing the trade that he became aware Goldy was available at the GM meetings. So yes it is when the Cards found out about Goldy.
Even if it is a bad idea, that’s not really relevant to the point being argued here. Admitting you want to trade someone isn’t necessarily a good idea, but setting your sights high still is.
He said the GM meetings which are held in November not the winter meetings which are in December. Try to keep up.
Yea but there is a difference in announcing someone is available and announcing he is being moved no matter what.
Goldy was traded after the GM meetings so it stands to reason Goldy was made available at the GM meetings then traded after. I do not see the relevance of the trade being before the winter meetings. How does that change anything
Let them hold him. I’m not sure what’s up between Cashman and Gray, but Cashman is untypically vocal about him. That leads me to believe he is perfectly fine letting this play out. There are several months left for a deal. He also is smart enough to know that the winter meetings and various trades over the offseason create needs with teams. Hes wise to let some of these teams miss out on the FA pitching. Cincinnati has stated publicly, “We’ll get the pitching”….if they whiff on Kuechel they might feel Gray is their best option.
But the risk the Yankees run is that people say…screw that…get Gio Gonzalez on the phone…he wont cost anything but money.
Could even deal him during ST when some pitcher inevitably goes down.
Or just release him. There’s no financial obligations. They can non-tender. They won’t because something is better than nothing.
The non-tender date has passed. If they waive him, they get nothing for him. The mid-level prospect the Yankees are likely to get is better than letting him walk.
Much better logic than the pirates.
Oh No can’t pay Gerrit Cole 8million… Hurry up and dump him to the Astros for nothing!!!
Oh No the fans stopped showing cuz we dumped everyone they liked…
Hurry up and make a PR move by overpaying for Chris Archer.
Oh no Archer is absolutely terrible and fans still aren’t showing up!!!
Hurry up and trade Ivan Nova’s contract for literally anything. We must save money..
And beat goes on….
I don’t think Cole was traded to save money. I think they simply knew they couldn’t retain him after 2019 when he’s a FA and felt it was to trade him with 2 years left of optimum value. He’s a Boras guy and they aren’t contenders so why not?
Agreed. The only reason other teams have interest in Gray is because they expect they can get him for pennies on the dollar and hope he can bounce back. If teams can’t get him for lower tier prospects teams will walk away. And yes I know you ask for the moon and then settle, but asking for top prospects for Gray at this point is going past the moon. It’s like asking for Jupiter…
For one season of Gray control…you’re not going to get any more return than what he can be flipped for at the deadline..
Them wanting a high end mlb talent means that most teams will need to go to a 3rd club like Cleveland to facilitate a Kluber or Bauer deal.
i feel like theyre asking high because gray has good stats away from yankee stadium
When a below .500 pitcher like Nathan Eovaldi can achieve a 4 year almost $18million dollar a year contract after 20 something innings of fame wrapped around a 4.0 + something ERA year you think the Yankees are crazy?
I give no fox
What does a free agent signing have to do with the yankees absurd asking price? Did you just want to take a jab at the Red Sox with this completely irrelevant info about Eovaldi? You want to talk about crazy, how about Lynn’s deal with the Rangers! It’s 2018, why are you still using wins and era as your measuring stick for a quality pitcher. Do you measure a hitters ability based on RBI and average too?
I think his point is that the pitching market is crazy so the Yanks shouldn’t just ship Gray off for nothing, especially with 2 yrs of relatively cheap control.
We get it, you like sabermetrics. There is no need to belittle others for their ways. Some people like stats that have been around longer than 10 years. No one is asking you to like or use those stats. Just stop being so pretentious and judgmental and maybe people might start listening to you.
He was traded thata way.
Gray has 1 year of control.
Gray has one year of control and not at a cheap rate considering his production this past season.
Except eavoldi was great last year and Gray wasn’t so the analogy is not a good one. Gray may be a victim of the AL East but nobody knows that, he has regressed since 2015 and if he could get shelled at the Collosium which is apparently a pitchers part that Khris Davis has no problem launching it out of then that should be warning signs.
Gray has low value right now.
They are very comparable as to the career achievements of both pitchers I mentioned.
Oh, I see, you are a sabermetrics guy/gal that doesn’t go by their eyes but by the made up statistics that can explain every move of the modern day ballplayer and make a .210 hitter into a HOF candidate.
I give no fox
I don’t think they are too dissimilar. I would agree that they are probably in the same tier. I wasn’t arguing their abilities. My question was why you felt the need to take a jab at the Red Sox and eovaldi when they had nothing to do with the article. I am curious how his signing has any possible relation to the Yankees asking for an elite prospect. Eovaldis contract isn’t otherworldly. So, if you want to say that Gray offers a surplus of value because of his one year of limited earning potential, that could be a debate. But even still, his one year of control at about 2/3 his worth wouldn’t netAnd then to justify your jab you bring in a stat like won/loss record, which is not entirely in a pitchers control. I am not a Red Sox fan,
I give no fox
Got cut off. 2/3 his worth shouldn’t net an elite prospect. Wins do not equal good pitchers, just like saves don’t make you a good closer and RBI don’t make you a good hitter. Those are glory stats that have more to do with opportunity than ability. They are the bicep muscle of baseball stats. You can hate analytics all you want, but I’d rather use more thorough information than my eyes. I’m not a scout, nor am I a professional baseball player. There are little things that can happen that the average fan won’t notice but can get picked up with advanced stats.
I give no fox
So I didn’t say anything about advanced stats, but yes I do like them. They offer more information than just opportunistic stats like wins. I don’t know why you are so salty, but I’m sorry for offending you. The point was that the commentor took a baseless jab at the redsox, coz clearly they are a Yankees fan, and it was irrelevant to the article. And then backed it up with a stat that doesn’t prove anything. Yes, I judged them for using a comment section to unnecessarily push an anti Red Sox narrative. Not because I am a fan, but because I felt the need to call them out like you are doing to me. For the record, not a Sox or yanks fan
He was traded thata way.
Red sox did give up jalen beeks to acquire eovaldi. An intriguing prospect but certainly not a top tier guy.
Gray on a one year deal just is not going to net the Yankees all that great of a return.
Gray to a team that would take a chance on his reclaiming value equal to prior his Yankee career makes sense. That team might then look to flip him at the trade deadline to a contender…this happens all the time these days, whether intentionally or not.
Still, even the weakest teams looking for bargains aren’t overpaying exclusively based on a hope for reclaiming value and trade deadline flipping. If that’s where all of his value lies just now, it does seem unlikely that Gray will bring much of a return. At that point, the Yankees are just as well off keeping him and hoping for that reclaimed value and flipability*.
*A potentially useful word around here!!
Worse comes to worse, they could use him as a valuable swing man. Guy who can make emergency starts now and then, yet come out of the pen and throw 2-3 innings a couple of times every week.
Teams have kind of forgotten about those kinds the last few years and they are still as valuable as once were. imagine Gray’s velocity would gain a tick or 2 also just going 2-3 innings at a time as well.
Wouldn’t like to see someone like Gray coming in if (for instance) Sabathia is getting hammered early in a game rather than a parade of 1IP relievers, then a tired pen for days?
He’d be better than decent swingmen Boston has in Brian Johnson and Hector Velazquez and they are better than average. Just think all is not shot out *if* they hang onto him and use him in a different manner in 2019.
Sonny Gray and Greg Bird to San Fran for Madison Bumgarner.
Madbum needs to stay in the NL so he can hit
And a lot more!
I’m not a giants fan by no means but Hahahahaha
Switch Florial with Bird and you got a deal.
He was traded thata way.
Seems a little light. Buster posey and joey bart should head back to ny too. Sf covers all poseys contract.
Giants should probably toss in Will Smith too. Either that or take Ellsbury.
Gray isn’t worth a dime
And an iPhone X isn’t worth a $1000, but here we are.
His numbers show he’s a 2SP on the road. Just can’t hack the huge spotlight of a big market team.
Or the short porch in right in Yankee stadium
Exactly. More to do with NY being a bandbox than anything.
That’s the whole crux of the issue, though. You want top prospects for a ‘2p’ that isn’t a 2p when a big game is going on. He’s a wuss on the mound when playing in the big games against the big teams. Do you want to toss your best prospects for one year of a reclamation project that might not pan out? I’d laugh Cashman off the phone.
Check his numbers away from Yankee Stadium!
Ok here’s a dime and Kirby Yates
Sonny Gray and Greg Bird to SF for MadBum.
We heard you the first time
You mean you read it.
Sonny Bird and Grey Gray for Bumison Gadmarner.
Either way you can stop.
Bird & Gray for MadBum
I’m a government man.
Drugs can kill you. You may want to check into rehab and save your life and save us from your drug induced stupid thoughts.
you seem distraught.
Twins need everything to break right or that is going to be one ugly offense.
They might have the most variability of any team in the majors next year. They could be pretty good or an absolute train wreck with very little in between.
I think they get a bad rap for 18 after the surprising 17. They only went backwards by 7 wins. And that obviously had a lot to do with injury’s and what not. If Santana plays the whole year at his normal level and Buxton and Sano aren’t injured and contribute anything we could very easily having a different conversation about that team. I don’t think they are as bad as everyone talks.
Gray has not had anything close to a solid season since 2015, why would anyone give up anything of proven value for him??? Yankees are becoming as delusional as their fans with these ideas.
Check his numbers away from Yankees stadium. That is what the GM is selling.
Check his overall numbers. That is what other GM’s are buying. They’re only interested in getting him at a bargain price.
Any GM’s out there NOT trying to get anyone at a bargain price ?
It’s kinda what they try to do … all of them .
Priggs89 is so right. Cashman can ask for the stars, but I seriously doubt he gets anything close to that for one year of Gray for his cost. If Gray had this great value, they would keep him.
His 18 IP with a WHIP & ERA well under 1 in Camden Yard is driving that misleading stat. That could benefit the Orioles, but he’d probably have to pitch against their opponents.
He also only has one year of control left. I know he’s not a SP but Golddy is the same control situation and a much more valuable player and he got the cardinals 25-man scraps in return.
When a below .500 pitcher like Nathan Eovaldi can achieve a 4 year almost $18million dollar a year contract after 20 something innings of fame wrapped around a 4.0 + something ERA year you think the Yankees are delusional???
Its all about the marketing Bub!
That’s simply not true. In 2016 he pitched to a 3.55ERA. That’s better than Paxton this past season. In 2018, away from YS, his era was… you guessed… 3.63. He’s just 29. Can still pitch. Sure, the opposing teams will use his YS numbers to try to show he’s no good and get a better deal, but Cashman will use other numbers and analytics to show he’s better than he pitched at YS.
We’ll see what happens.
There has been a lot of interest in Gray cause the rest of baseball knows he isn’t worth anything today. They want to buy at his today value and are hoping he can catch lightning in a bottle if they get him. Plus Cashman overplayed his hand and said he wants rid of Gray. He is a cut candidate if they won’t take his value. No way can the Yanks take him to camp as a $10000000 bullpen piece. And his value is something around a teams number 25 to 50 prospect or another salary dump.
just curious – are you saying he is worthless based on his one year numbers at yankee stadium?
He was pretty bad in 2016 also! 2017 was ok, but nothing to get excited about.
dimitrios in la
Well yes but with disparaging remarks re Gray and a filled rotation and better options abounding Cashman has little leverage. (He also has a farm system that’s not as good as previously hyped.)
He has traded away a lot of that farm and top prospects left in the system graduated to the MLB. Its not the sane farm they had 3 years ago. Dont know how you claim it was overhyped when Judge, G. Sanchez. G. Torres, Andujar, Severino, Green, etc. have all come up recently and have done well.
It is still at least a top 15 farm since they actually use their international pool money
Not to mention signing Happ. No place for Gray on the Yankees roster and he is coming off a horrible year. Cashman won’t get “high-end Major League talent” for Gray. He might get a MLB utility guy or a 4th OF for Gray. (Pirela from the Padres?) He will probably settle for mid-level prospects for Gray. Or he will keep Gray and eat that money.
If Breslow’s interested in continuing to pitch, the Mets should invite him to spring training. He’s better than most of the bullpen arms they had last year and I’m sure SNY will have a position for him when he’s done.
Lol somebody better remind Brian Cashman what happened to those “operational Death Stars” in the Star Wars movies. Or maybe he knows how the Yankees are gonna end up?
If a teams intrigued in Gray but the Yankees actually want top talent coming back, they’ll just have to pass. Signing a guy like Fiers or Cahill provides a better floor for only money and then they could just sign Gray next year in free agency.
Lol good I hope that they’re stuck with Gray the Yankees always over value their players.
what team does not overestimate their players? are you saying all other teams underestimate and get ripped off? its business – you do your best to buy low and sell high.
Sonny Gray is a Head case that needs to pitch in a place that has No Pressure; do the Yankees think that nobody else knows this?
so, you are asking for “high-end Major League talent (a player they want)” for a player you dont want and need to move asap?
yes – for a player that other teams want. why in the world would anyone set there sights low on a business deal. wipe the hate for the team out of your eyes.
Gray has had over a 3.0WAR in past years,and 9 million is a 1WAR player in this market. Gray had a 1.6 WAR last year, which was a bad year. Tyler Glasnow was 1.8.Tyler Chadwood 0.2, and Vince Valasquez 1.5 last year. There were a lot of starters who pitched worse than Gray.
Love reading the comments above that Gray isn’t worth anything, etc, etc. These people have no idea how to run a functioning business (or maybe anything). Fans fail to see that a few things are happening.
1). The field of other available pitchers is clearing via trade or free agent signing thus raising Grays value (if ever so slightly).
2). The cost of pitching is around the highest it’s historically been.
3). Gray has the peripherals to suggest he will bounce back quite well with another team. This is not a case of trying to make someone something they are not, just returning to form. If everyone is right, myself included and Gray has a strong first half of the season he could be flipped for nice return. There could be that contending smaller budget team, rich on prospects who Gray works very well for.
While I do find it surprising it’s taking this long, I understand entirely why the Yanks are moving at such a slow pace with this. It’s in their best interest to pace the trade negotiations for Gray. So if the Yanks do a nice 1 for 1 swap with a high level prospect, who’s not to say the acquiring team can’t get that back two-fold in July if they flip him? Seems entirely plausible.
Really well thought out comment man…agree totally…the numbers are off the charts for pitching these days, especially when the pitcher is on the left side of 30.
And, with a couple of big guns off the shelf, the longer it takes the more his value goes up!
The nerve of a logical comment 🙂
you are saying that atlanta could ask for better return in a deal for teheran right? better number, younger and track record
I would agree that Teheran is more valuable than Gray at this point
However, this discussion was about Gray not being worth anything which especially in today’s game and everything being about peripherals is completely inaccurate
Lance Lynn got 3 and 30 Million
Eovaldi got 4 and 68 despite 2 TJ surgeries and a mediocre season other than a surge at the end
Sonny Gray is worth far more than people think as long as he is not in the bandbox called Yankee Stadium
I feel like the Nats are gonna swoop in on Gray
Definitely would add up after they dealt Roark
Gray to Reds for Gennet would be my guess from what I’m reading.I am one Yankee fan who doesn’t believe mgt.is going to spend for Machado.I believe Gray just didn’t have the mojo to pitch in the Bronx.
Seems like that would make sense, but they’re both trending in opposite directions. I would think Cincy would want to get more for SG.
If Gray gets you Scooter Gennett Cashman should be made king. Gennet is an all star second baseman and Gray is at this point a mediocre starter with some upside.. Gennet is earning 5.7mill Gray about 10. Your comment is the reason Yank fans like myself get abused in these forums
Gray is the kind of guy who will get traded to St. Louis and win 15 games there next year.
So ask High and if you get it great…if not hold onto him for insurance (away from Yankee stadium) because they have several starters that will hit the DL and the minors are thin for pitching.
Ok Las Vegas….it’s 6:42am
Get out there and amaze us with trades!
Cashman is posturing as he should. Let’s put aside homerism and hate for a second. Let’s look st things objectively. He’s seeking high-end and likely will settle for something under the radar that he’s already identified.
For those of you who say he has no value.
Lance Lynn just signed for 3/$30 mil by a team desperate for pitcging. Lynn with the 4.77 ERA. It was mentioned he had several 2 year offers. Why, because gms valued his peripherals. So if you have several teams offering 2 year deals and 1 a 3/$30 deal then why wouldn’t Gray and his estimated 1/$10 mil not be attractive?
Nationals just traded Tanner Roark and his near 5 ERA for a minor league relief pitcher that normally throws in the high 90s and just made his mlb debut.
Look at some of the buy low under the radar deals Casman has made recently:
JR Murphy a back up catcher for Aaron Hicks who’s become a top 5 CF.
Chanson Shreve and a minor league reliever for Luke Voit.
There are plenty of players that Casman may value more then their trade partners do. Thus, I would anticipate Cash not selling him for a prospect or mlb player he thinks won’t contribute to the mlb team. Teams are starving for pitching. They understand advanced analytics and it’s a relatively inexpensive risk. If he returns to previous success he can easily be flipped at the trade deadline to a smaller market contender.
I would like to see MLBTR remove the like and dislike option. It really undermines the enjoyment of talking baseball. Anything logical on here is met with great resistance and gets downvoted. It negatively impacts the optics of the site as well. I would love to know who those few are that consistently do this for no reason. Maybe just ban them since they’re not adding any value.
Good comment by the way.
Thank you. I appreciate your comment.
There was a guy who said the AL East and the Red Sox would eat Happ up. All I did was post his numbers vs the Sox the last 3 seasons and pointed out that Happ, in fact, has pitched in the AL East the last 4 years and it received 5 down votes. All I did was post his stats and made no other commentary. How do you down vote a fact? hahaha.
Enjoy your day.
I gave you a down vote for worrying about “optics”.
Seattle believed Gray’s value is equal to the 2 scrub ‘throw-ins’ in the Paxton trade.
Sorry, Cashman. You don’t have Baseball America, BP, MLBPipeline or Fangraphs to pump up his value like they do with your prospects.
As they say in Miami, Que?
So are you insinuating that those publications lie about the Yankee’s prospects but are just truthful in their evaluations of every other teams prospects? is that what you’re saying?
Why don’t you tel lme how highly all those publications ranked Miguel Andujar last year.In the 60s and he was the rookie of the year of Amarican players.Yeah you’re right they really do hype Yankee players
Fangraphs had him as a 60 FV Prospect or about an average of about 3.9WAR from a 154 players. His actual WAR was 2.7. Looks like he was OVERRATED.
I don’t think this is particularly newsworthy. Cashman figures if Gray rights himself he will be the pitcher the Yankees thought they were trading for. How’s this different than the Blue Jays reportedly putting a high price on Stroman? T
He was traded thata way.
Teams arent gonna give up top tier talent to trade for 1 year if gray.
Doubtful the yankees extend him a qo next off season so any interested team can just wait 1 year and try to sign him then while keeping the prospect and draft picks since he most likely wont be qo.
Hold Gray until spring training. Someone is bound to get hurt and then his value will increase.
Also, I’m not ready to give up on Bird. He still has excellent potential and I think he is going to have a nice season in 2019. Not sold on Voit, at all.
Agree on Gray. Cashman is under no pressure at all to deal him. Let the teams who miss out on their target SPs come back to him. And as you said, all kinds of things happen in ST. Someone will need an arm eventually.
Wil Myers/Luis Torrens for Sonny Gray
Gray – High End Reliever to replace Robertson. . . Maybe one more light weight… Prospect
Sonny Gray, High End blah blah….Yawn.
To address some of the other comments, I don’t think anyone is saying Gray is worthless. But he’s a high risk proposition with only one year of control left. The team trying to trade him has said they won’t carry him on the opening day roster. I don’t see how you expect to get a major league player for that unless it’s a one-for-one (year of control) deal with a team that has a position of strength they can afford to lose a guy from. The only thing I could see is maybe a guy like Eric Thames from the Brewers or Jose Martinez if the Cardinals really sell low on him. Even then I don’t think Gray alone gets you that value.
High level talent for a dude who had an ERA near 5.and wet the bed in big games? How about a 12 pack of Miller light and some peanuts? seems fair
I got some pocket lint and a mint I found on the ground in a parking lot. That should get me Sonny Gray, right?
Yeah, no way am I giving away that lucky penny I found on the street.
Dang! That is a pretty formidable rotation the Yankees have.
Gray is a 1.5 to 3.5 WAR player who pitched well everywhere except in New York. At 9 million he is a bargain for one year. He is also healthy. He’s better option than pitchers like Cobb and Morton who got paid a lot and have had injury problems. 9 million is a 1WAR player in this market.
I’m a Yankees fan, but the fact that that they think they can get high end Major League talent for Sonny Gray and his 4.90 ERA, including 6.98 at Yankee Stadium, but somehow 3.17 on the road is laughable.
That’s the myth of cash for you. In all likelihood he will get a reliever or a mid range prospect with a 10% chance of setting foot on a AAAA club like the padres or orioles……
The myth of Cashman is based on selling Chapman for a boatload of prospectsf or a month and then signing him back. The myth of Cashman is based on giving up no one for Didi Gregorius. The myth of Cashman is based on giving up no one for Aaron Hicks . Ditto Luke Voit
While I don’t believe they’ll get high end talent for Gray I think the Yanks will do reasonably well.Paxton Happ Corbin Eovaldi and Morton are all off the board.Gray had good road splits last year is still young and a year away from being a good pitcher. If you don.t want to dump a load to Cleve who are the other better options
So the Yankees are stuck with Gray for another year. Brilliant.
How do you figure that?
I think the outlook for Gray in 2019 is up for debate. That being said you don’t give up that kind of prospect for unknown. He has potential which does have some value. I wouldn’t give up much knowing the team that once paid to acquire him has now been all over free agent starters and haven’t included them in their plans on a team with potential to win it all now