The Blue Jays have one of the best starters (Marcus Stroman) and one of the best relievers (Ken Giles) available on this summer’s trade market, and TSN’s Scott Mitchell tweets that teams have been expressing interest in acquiring both in the same package. Both the Twins and the Yankees have reached out to Toronto to express interest in a single trade to net both pitchers, per Mitchell, who cautions that the organization’s preference may be to maximize the return by orchestrating separate trades.
Minnesota’s interest in Giles (and relief help in general) has already been reported. But for all the help the Twins could use in the ’pen, the rotation is also a potential area of focus. The wheels have come off the Martin Perez project of late, as the lefty has been hammered for a 5.37 ERA with 7.7 K/9, 4.0 BB/9, 0.85 HR/9 and a 54.6 percent grounder rate across his past 10 starts. And while Michael Pineda has improved in recent weeks as he distances himself from 2017 Tommy John surgery, he also figures to have his workload more carefully managed late in the season.
The Yankees are a similarly logical landing spot for Stroman. Luis Severino has yet to pitch this season due to multiple injuries, while each of James Paxton, Domingo German and CC Sabathia has spent time on the injured list. Left-hander J.A. Happ has struggled as well (5.02 ERA, 5.35 FIP in 89 12/3 innings) — unable to replicate a quartet of strong seasons from 2015-18.
Stroman recently had a bit of a health scare, exiting his last outing against the Royals due to a pectoral cramp. His final start prior to the All-Star break was skipped, but Stroman isn’t expected to miss time beyond that. If the issue is as minor as it appears to be, Stroman’s value wouldn’t be likely to take a hit. It seems quite likely that Stroman will be wearing a new uniform come Aug. 1, although Atkins danced around the matter without addressing the likelihood of a deal in a recent meeting with the Toronto media (link via Shi Davidi of Sportsnet):
I would say this: Marcus has put himself in an incredible position throughout his career, not just over the last four months. He has been durable. He has performed at an exceptionally high rate. He’s been one of the better pitchers in baseball over the last three years and because of that he is in a great position for his future with the Toronto Blue Jays and there are 29 other teams that are thinking the same way, that they would love to have someone that has been durable and has been productive. We’ll see. With another year of control for us, that’s attractive to us, that’s extremely attractive to other teams, as well. He’s put himself in a remarkable spot and earned all of that respect.
As for Giles, he may appear to be somewhat of a luxury for a deep Yankees relief corps, but it’s also true that the ’pen hasn’t been as dominant as many might have expected. Aroldis Chapman and Tommy Kahnle have thrived, and Chad Green looks reborn since a brief demotion to Triple-A in late April. Adam Ottavino has a sub-2.00 ERA but 6.1 BB/9 mark. Zack Britton’s bat-missing ability still hasn’t returned, as his 6.3 K/9 mark isn’t much higher than his 4.9 BB/9. Jonathan Holder had to be optioned to the minors after struggling to keep his ERA under 7.00. Dellin Betances, like Severino, hasn’t pitched in 2019.
Either Stroman or Giles on his own would have a fairly notable asking price, so adding both at once may very well teeter on exorbitant. The Jays seem likely to move both, though, and they’re also expected to gauge interest in Justin Smoak, Freddy Galvis, Aaron Sanchez, Eric Sogard, Daniel Hudson and other veterans as their rebuilding efforts continue.
I wonder what that looks like. Frazier, Deivi, Florial +lower tier prospects for Giles and Stroman? I guess that depends how highly each FO thinks of Frazier.
I’d say another decent arm and that would be a very fair deal
Blue Jays do not need any more OFs unless they play CF. Too many corner OFs and they need to unload some.
Deivi, Abreu, Luis Gil, Harold Cortijo, maybe 1 more. Yanks can keep their #1 prospect in Florial.
Position is less important than value. The Jays would have little trouble flipping Florial for someone they need…
If Florial continues to be overmatched by Single-A pitching they will certainly have trouble flipping him. Starting pitching is the primary and secondary positions of focus for Toronto.
Florial…..Another highly touted prospect for the Yankees that will net them something more than he is worth…. Frazier is a MLB player and will be a good one… he should be required in any deal with Yankees period…… Heck if the Blue Jays make the deal to get him, they could flip Teoscar Hernandez or Grichuk to create a spot for him.
Did you say Grichuk? You have my attention….
Unfortunately, Grichuk’s not going anywhere after he just inked an extension.
Yeah dump Frazier, he’s a liability in the outfield, so they’re hiding him in triple A so he’ll have some trade value. Haven’t the fans seen this before?
Still not sure of that extension
Florial and Frazier are massively overrated as prospects. The Yankees farm at this point is middle third. Other teams have much better to offer.
I love the way people always claim Yankee prospects are overrated.Judge wasn’t rated top twenty.Neither was Sanchez. Andujarwas ratedin the 60s. How’d they do, Severino wasn’t rated that highly either and Jordan Montgomery was not even rated Then there was Domingo German. None of these guys were rated real high so I don’t understand why everybody claims Yankee prospects are overhyped. If anything Yankee prospects are underrated.First half of the season the Yankees .played 600 ball with mainly their “overrated” farm system.I see everyone bad mouthing Clint Frazier. He only hit 11 hrs and had 34 ribbys with a 262 ba over 53 games. That projects to a 33 hr 102 rbi year. What a bum. You can help his defense but that kind of offense is not regularly available. Over the winter somebody made over 300 million who is a terrible defensive outfielder and he won’t put up better numbers then that. If you guys don’t think other teams would want Frazier you are just delusional.As an example Michael Chavis is an atrocious fielder.There is not a team in baseball that wouldn’t take him
Well stated and so true.
If starting pitching is the primary and secondary focus for Toronto, then why would they ever trade Stroman when pitching is so sought after across the league.
Do you read what you write?
Because they are looking for SP prospects that meet their window. Stroman has one year of control left and doesn’t line up with their projected competitive window.
Florial is still younger and has value to a team that wants a shot to correct him. How old is Frazier? 25? Yankees Fans who think Frazier has value is like Giants Fans who think Mac Williamson has value. Who is Mac Williamson? Exactly.
Exactly what JB said. Trade Stroman now to get pitchers, hopefully hit on 2 of them but expect 1.
Are you new, Rocky7? Seriously, put some thought into this.
Because he’s a headcase.
Rocky7 – You have never seen a rebuilding team trade an established starter for younger starters they can control for more years when they hope to contend. It happens all of the time. Do your research and think before write.
@TrimReaper Deivi is their #1 prospect at this point and I can’t see the Yanks letting him go for less than a top of the line starter with years of control.. I don’t Stroman would classify as being “top of the line” and I say that with respect.
Understood. This was said out of the idea Giles and Stroman are a package. Someone else suggested Florial and Deivi and I don’t see it. Has to be one or the other, and the Jays have needs at pitching way before OF.
Simply laugh at anyone who would put Garcia in a package for Giles and Stroman. Uhhh, not happening .lol Well said.
Someone above said Clint Frazier was overrated? How exactly is a kid who’s already proving he can produce on the ML level , and even in a injury plaqued season last yr, managed to just about combine for 400obp between minors and Bronx.
Frazier is a ML ready OFer with lighting quick bat , power, and his defense isn’t nearly as bad as It was during that RF stretch in the Bronx. Frazier was on pace for a pretty big season had he stayed in Bronx this yr and is only 24. Yeah he’s overrated..smh
Many of those corner outfielders are unplayable for one reason or another. At best their bench bat quality so whether they are traded or not they won’t be a factor in trades. Oh and Florial actually IS a CF.
At this point we aren’t sure if Florial can make it to AA given how behind his hitting has been.
Unfortunately Grichuk has RF since he signed an extension. Gurriel has LF sewn up for now. Yes, CF is open. They are playing Teoscar who has struggled with the bat. Then they have Biggio, Alford, McKinney, Drury.
Point is, the pitching in the farm is bare. The Jays need arms. OF is not a priority. Therefore, pitching is the target and pitching is the factor. Us Jays fans know our system needs better than anyone.
We all have access to the same information so I dont see any value in appealing to being a Jays fan.
The Cubs built a winner off of developing bats and the Braves did it off pitching and it was still the bats that have come through first though with pitching you have to be more patient.
Doing both might simply not be possible. It seems you either trade for bats or you trade for gloves.
Then clearly you aren’t looking in the right direction. The Jays need starting pitching. After that, it’s starting pitching.
Lol yeah ok
Probably have to add Clarke Schmidt to the package and add some lower tier throw ins.
I could see see the Yankees wanting to part with Loaisiga over Gil for sure and possibly Schmidt. He’s nearly 25 and has yet to throw more than 80 innings in a season. My best guess is he winds up in the bullpen. All the tools to be a great reliever though so perhaps not. Not suggesting in this package just as a note overall.
You serious Clark?
The yankees aren’t trading florial or deivi for stroman lol.
Ok so they’re out of the running.
It’s going to require a haul in this market for Giles and Stroman. I believe my package is pretty fair value. To be honest with you I don’t see how the Yankees don’t win the World Series if they make that deal. Giles,Betances, Green, Ottavino, Britton and Chapman is an insane bullpen. They wouldn’t need more than 4 innings a night from their rotation. That’d certainly be a tough team to beat.
I could see florial in the trade for both guys, but they aren’t trading their #1 pitching prospect for a little over 1 .5ish years of stroman. Deivi could be a #1 type of starter.
Florial would be selling low, he’s struggled, but that could also be a combination of things. FSL is a pitchers league, and secondly the injury, he performed great this spring until the injury, perhaps last year it took him till the spring to be ready…. and now another injury, you can’t sell low or write of florial without another full poor year next year, he has TOO MUCH talent.
The NYY ate going to the WS even if they make no deals, relax.
Please stop overhyping Garcia and Florial. Many scouts feel Garcia is destined for the BP, and Florial can’t stay healthy, and when healthy has shown nothing.
How is making a statement based off of industry reports “over hyping”. I swear, the Yankee prospect must be the only hyped prospects in the sport. The fact that they’ve produced several all-stars in the last few years gives me reason to be very confident that barring injury he is a legit “prospect”. Not saying he’ll be the next great pitcher but at least worthy of his perceived value.
It’s overhyping because these guys do not have too prospect pedigrees. There is not some multi-year industry consensus about these two being amazing prospects ever since they were signed/drafted. Florial was in the system for a while before he was ever on any Top 100 list. Same with this new pitcher. These guys may be on Top 100 lists now but that does not mean they are blue chip prospects.
Regular fans don’t like the Yanks, so they make their scouting opinion bias against Yankee’s prospects. Yanks are not trading Frazier, Garcia and Florial for Stroman. These same people said Sonny Gray sucked and today he is an all star
how do you overhype Garcia when he is currently ranked the 25th best prospect in all of baseball???
If you believe with those relievers the Yankee starters wouldn’t have to go more then four innings a night you are delusional. That would mean every 5 games they would have to get 25 innings out of there relievers.How would there six relievers manage that.Especially since most of those guys don’t go much more then 1 inning at a time.. Also you start overusing those guys and their effectiveness would decrease quite a bit, Truthfully while the Yankee relievers have been good recently they’ve been showing signs of overwork. The Yankees need one starting pitcher who goes deep into the game far more then they need a Giles. They get that long starter they don’t need another reliever. Also the truth is Giles doesn’t add as nuch to the haul as you might think.Last year Kelvin Herrera who was unhittable at the time went to Washington in June and all KC got baxk was the Nats number 10 prospect and 2 low level players
Meh. it’s not what you want. It’s what others want. The Yanks really don’t have any negotiating pull. They are at the mercy of other teams. If they had multiple prospects performing well then they might, but that’s not the case. The Yanks are in a worst case scenario comes leverage wise.
U see every Yanks prospect talked about in the best light. The other parties don’t see it that way. There’s plenty of other teams that could blow the Yankees away and offer more. So, the Yankees could be the Braves and overvalue their prospects or pay the price.
Kdonato do you like to make things up? Not real sure where you got top 25 for Garcia, in fact, he isn’t even in MLB’s top 100.
Would you trade their #1 pitching prospect for a World Series?
You mean Scherzer right?Because if you think Stroman Giles guarantee the Yankees anything please tell me who your drug dealer is because you must be smoking some really good stuff
They’re gonna have to trade somebody and they’re not gonna all be fringe prospects. There’s a good chance one or both of them is packaged for Stroman or Giles or both.
lol if you think the yankees move deivi for anything less than Max Scherzer. Hes probably untouchable.
Then consider New York out of the running.
Good luck getting a better pitching prospect for him. It won’t happen
Oh no the Blue Jays won’t get to trade two good pitchers to the Yankees… how disappointing for Blue Jays fans
Good don’t want Stroman. He sucked last year and is over hyped and too small. He is Sonny Gray in NY
And you guys don’t want Bumgarner because he sucks too and Clint Frazier is the next Mickey Mantle. Tell me again about how the Yankees have the best prospects and they don’t need anyone.
And that’s why the Yankees are going to the postseason with a big ? one through four in their rotation then. He’s obviously not off the table for anything less than Scherzer.
Lol at you people who think Deivi Garcia is untouchable. He’s not even ranked in MLB’s top 100 prospects, and he’s only an overall 50 grade prospect. He could get moved to a 55 I guess, but that’s still far from untouchable.
Deivi is probably close to a 55 but he’s
Going to be the cost of doing business here. The Twins have prospects to move. If this is the package the Yankees want they’ll have to outbid Minnesota and I’m sure a few others. Gil is also a good pitching prospect and perhaps they package him and Loaisiga/Schmidt together instead if they really do love Deivi. But it’s going to have to hurt to make this one happen. Can’t see anyway around that.
Sorry i disagree, not for 1.5 years of stroman where he was horrible last year.
You’re also getting Giles who is a top 3-5 reliever in baseball this year. It’s just not going to come cheap. Or if cash thinks it will it’ll go to Minnesota. He isn’t getting D-rob and Frazier this year. it’s going to be a little bit more expensive.
1.5yrs of Giles (ultimately a relief pitcher who can’t really add more than 2.0 WAR) probably isn’t netting a top 100 prospect as he’ll see a raise to $9M+ after this season without being nearly as much of a QO candidate.
1.5yrs of Stroman is going to cost more even though he’s also no great bargain next year as his arbitration salary is going to be more like $11-12M, but he has more potential WAR production and he’s a potential QO candidate.
Depends on what the Blue Jays are looking for in terms of prospects. Do the Blue Jays want a couple of high end prospects, a mix or a lottery of lower ceiling but more MLB ready guys?
My guess is 2 guys in the team’s top 10 (at least 1 in MLB top 100), along with another top 20, and a couple lottery tickets.
Martras you told me, “Nick Castellanos will absolutely net a top 100 prospect.” Do you forget saying that or what? Because you can’t then turn around and tell me Ken Giles won’t net a top 100 prospect. There’s a serious player valuation issue you need to take care of if you truly believe that’s the case. Giles has considerably more value than Castellanos. On his own I believe he’d net a top 100 prospect. 1.5 years of control over an elite reliever is very valuable. If you don’t believe Giles will net that much, that’s also fine, but you’re not going to tell me Castellanos will and Giles won’t.
Giles has WAY less value right now than Castellanos had. You don’t understand player values. Giles is a relief pitcher. Even Aroldis Chapman didn’t command a top 100 prospect from the Yankees when the Reds traded him.
Stroman has more value than Castellanos. It’ll take a top 100, maybe another pick near a teams’ top 10 and a throw in.
Martras that comment you made was 2 weeks ago. Giles had more value than Castellanos two weeks ago. He has more value than him now. You did not make that comment 3 years ago….I hope you don’t truly believe that because that is not the case. And I’m sure someone else will roast you for that Chapman comment. I’ll leave them that opportunity, it’s just too easy.
Everyone knows mlb.com is the worst at judging talent. BA and fangraphs is much better.
At this point the Yankees have 2 prospects in the Top 100. As a Jays fan, I don’t want either guy. For Stroman and Giles, Deivi Garcia has to be there.
So yes, no Top 100 guy (at this time). Garcia probably should be ranked.
Chapman had just shot a gun in his garage after a fight with his wife.. Chapman was traded for like 30 cents on the dollar because of it.
Castellanos cannot play defence better than a mascot. He’s a DH. Giles is one of the best relievers in the sport. Try again.
Chapman once cleared of his suspension also returned a top 5 prospect in all of baseball. I think both of those examples of trades were complete outliers btw. Just a very poor example to use if you wanted to illustrate why Giles wasn’t worth a top prospect.
Aroldis Chapman was also in the middle of an assault charge and reds just wanted to get rid of him so ur point is invalid
Have you looked st mid season rankings? Too 25 Deivi! He ain’t going no where.
I don’t care who “roasts” me, but you’re right about Castellanos. I was out in left field about his contract. At $10M for this season, he just wasn’t going to bring nearly as much.
You were both wrong about Castellanos and you were partially right. He needs to get over it. I blew the doors off his argument a day or two ago. He won’t let it go. Avila also miscalculated Castellanos and he’ll probably do the same with Boyd, Greene and Jimenez.
Deivi Garcia is ranked number 25 in baseball prospectus the midseason ratings but good point
Trimmy bud your argument was complete garbage. All you did was rag on about how top prospects bust. You never quantified why Nick Castellanos was worth the prospect. You bad mouthed a couple top prospects. There was no part of Nick Castellanos is worth a top 100 prospect that was factually accurate. You’re now tripling down on bullshi… He’s not. Trey Mancini MIGHT net a top 100 prospect and he has 3 years of control. No one on Earth trades that for him. Your argument was garbage and you sincerely meant it when you said it. So I don’t know what to tell ya.
“You were both wrong about Castellanos”
No, Trim you were wrong. He’s not worth the prospect. I said he wasn’t. He won’t be dealt for one in 3 weeks. He is not worth one. What happens in 3 weeks when he’s dealt for a couple prospects in the 15-20 range in a system? You were still right?
Here’s your direct quote on Castellanos. You tried to back it up later and claim it was “theoreticAl” which was still a complete garbage argument.
“You’re suggesting Nick Castellanos would be worth a top 100 prospect. That’s preposterous.”
If a team is not prepared to deal the 99th ranked prospect in baseball for Nick Castellanos then that GM shouldn’t be employed. Are you kidding me JBigz? Castellanos is not worth 1 (ONE) Top 100 prospect?
Hate to break it to you; yes he is worth a top 100 prospect. If Detroit asked for just 1 player between 90-100 in the rankings you do the deal.
Martras literally said the exact same thing you did that he was worth a top 100 prospect. The only difference is he claimed not to know his contract, which gives him a bit of an excuse for that ridiculous comment. You have none.
Listing flaws of a couple top prospects doesn’t “blow the doors off an argument.” That was why you’re one of the biggest clowns on here. You never provide one piece of factual data to back up a claim. You just spout off opinions with no historical reference point or numbers to back it up. You win the argument in your head without actually presenting any facts. You’ll throw an insult in and then say something like “baseball isn’t played on a computer” because you’ve failed to accept or present any facts to back up the claim you’ve pulled straight out of your ass.
Wow….someone is enraged! Like I said previously, get over it. You have some serious problems.
Whether I am right or not (and I was right, and still am), you seriously need to relax. It should not take you 3 (THREE) angry messages to make a moot point. In fact, you have no point except trying to back something that has not and may not happen.
You want a victory? Take it. You need one. You need it more than me. You need a lot of things. But you might want to take a break from this site because your health is much more important than whether or not inept Avila deals Castellanos for a struggling, undeserving Top 100 prospect. Give it a rest kid.
Thats just a silly comment
Cash isn’t trading Frazier for a rental, much less his top pitching and hitting prospects. Maybe Florial+ is something he’d consider.
Good thing either aren’t rentals then
I’d trade Frazier for Stroman all day. The front office hates Frazier, you have Hicks and the two monsters for the foreseeable future. There is no place for Frazier on this team. I never thought guy I’d say this in april, but just keep Gardner another year and go get a pitcher for Frazier. I’d prefer Bumgartner, but would take Stroman.
AndI’m a fan of the empire, with the opposite opinion of the accused Yankees fan. I’m not usually a buy players guy, but these great trades, waiver claims, & AAAA players thrived. The front office should be going all in this year. The team has earned it
no offense but Bumgartner over stroman is a bad choice.
stroman generates a lot of ground ball contact. he fits yankee stadium esp w that short porch in right.
bumgartner would get blown up in yankee stadium by AL hitters given his downswing in velocity and uptick in hard hit rate.
Frazier can play every day next year.
Bumgarner’s velocity is basically what it has always been. He was never a flame thrower. Classic Bumgarner sat on 93-94. He sits at 92-93 10 years after his debut. The problem with Bum is he has been in the NL West for 10 years. Even Kershaw has a 3.50 ERA this year. I’ve watched enough Giants games to tell you he is basically a 3.50 pitcher. You could point to several plays this year where the ruling on the field was BS and his ERA sky rocketed to sub 4. A change of league would help him.
Saw your explanation for Madbums drop and it’s laughable.First of all Kershaw coming off of an injury has a 3.09 era not a 3,50 era.Secondly I can see no reason why pitching in the same division would effect your era.The teams he is facing now have nothing in common with the teams he was facing even 3 years ago.Also the NL West outside of the Dodgers have been week hitting teams and should help not hurt his era. Madbum has had several major injuries and has pitched for a long time throwing a lot of innings. Thats what has effected his era.You also talk about his fastball as if losing a mile or two is no big deal. When you only throw in the low to mid 90s a mile or two is a big deal.And please don’t talk about missed plays every pitcher in the league can talk about missed plays. Last year the Mets were the worst fielding team in baseball.Degrom didn’t see his era go up a run a game. This pitcher is not the same pitcher who threw the Giants to the WS period
I was wrong. Kershaw’s era was 3.23 prior to his last start. Everything else still holds true.
what rental? Yanks would control both.
1.5 for both isn’t a rental but it not much more.
Not only are they not rentals you’d have a legit chance at extending Stroman. Or, QO Stroman and receive a pick for him. The plethora of bullpen arms also allows the Yankees to explore an offseason trade, parting with one of their bullpen arms.
You must be an Evil Empire fan.
And you must be a Yankee hater!
Stroman for Frazier. Straight up. NO PITCHING PROSPECTS. If they want Holder go ahead.
It’s a fair trade.
Yeah, Jays should actually throw in Giles, Vlad Jr., Biggio, and probably Gurriel just to even things up for the almighty Frazier.
Pass no thx, I’ll deal Florial straight up for Stroman at best and that’s pushing it. I can’t stand Stroman. He is not an Ace people. He is at best a 3. I like German better then him!
Thats a haul. Dont see the yanks paying nearly that much.
Huge over pay. Frazier and Florial or Deivi and I don’t see them trading Deivi. I could see something like Frazier, Losaiga and Contreras or Nelson/Whitlock
Frazier can’t play defence, Florial can’t hit and Deivi’s small. Try again
Are you on crack?
I would say no thx as a Yankee fan
Deivi Garcia is more valuable alone to me then Stroman who I cannot seem to separate from Sonny Gray comp! On top of that you want Florial and Frazier? That’s a no deal as a Yankee fan. Cash please pass on Stroman, he will be booed out if NY like Gray was!
Maybe if the throw in German.
I’m going to die laughing when the Jays trade Stroman and Giles, separately or together, and get a few decent, not top, prospects. This post recommendation will not age well.
I think that would be what it takes. Love to see them unload Stanton (wishful thinking)
To say the “wheels have fallen off” Martin Perez is a bit unfair.
7-4 scoreless through 6, chased in the 7th.
6-27 gave up 2 through 7
6-20 gave up 3 in the 1st (only one of which was hard hit) then worked through 5
His FB velos dropped in a couple starts (6-16/6-21) but have rebounded in the last 2 starts back to the mid 90’s. Current season velo is good for the 3rd highest for a LHSP behind only Snell and Paxton and good for 21st overall all SPs with at least 70 IP.
Great, so long as the manager knows exactly when his pitcher is about to throw some meatballs and get punished for it. If only Baldelli had a time machine, Perez would be unstoppable.
The bottom line is the scouting reports on Perez’s offerings have been adjusted and teams have caught up to him. The velocity means Perez probably isn’t unplayable anymore (like most people thought he was before this year), but that doesn’t mean he’s a guy the Twins want in the rotation come playoff time.
lol he is in the top 5% in the MLB in hard hit % and exit velocity allowed. Not saying he is a Cy Young candidate, but the “wheels falling off” is inaccurate.
Homers like you will always be around cherry picking stats with desperation, right?
Hard hit % and exit velocity allowed are two major stats scouts and GM’s focus in on. Hardly cherry picking. Perez has been really solid for the Twins, started hot, cooled off, and is warming up again.
Hey, doesn’t hurt to ask right? Lol
Offer Kiriloff, Romero, and Nick Gordon.
Kirilloff is off limits.
If the Twins are wanting a package of Stroman and Giles then Kirilloff is certainly not off limits. Otherwise the Jays just separate them and get more of a return.
Well, if the Blue Jays were willing to trade Stroman and Giles together for Kirilloff on his own, I’m sure the Twins would consider it if the Blue Jays paid the salaries. My guess is the Blue Jays don’t want one egg in their basket.
See, this is where I think the narrative of getting more value by separating them fails. Highly likely the Twins wouldn’t trade Kirilloff for either of those two on an individual basis. However, lump them together and perhaps they would (plus one or more lower level prospects). If the desire is to get an elite ranked prospect then you get more in combining them than separate.
Put another way, “more” needs defining between quantity and quality.
It would Kiriloff and some secondary pieces I’m sure but I’d love it
Kirilloff on his own is worth more than Storman and Giles, dude. Stroman and Giles are controlled for 1.5yrs, but their value is minimized by their contracts.
This isn’t a typical 1.5 year arrangement we see in MLB today where the player was previously locked up to a team friendly contract controlling their arbitration years.
Giles is going to give a team about 1.5-2.0 WAR over whomever they’re already trotting out for the MLB minimum over his contract at a cost of about $12M. That’s not a huge bargain. 1.5-2.0 WAR for $12M. He’s also not a good QO candidate.
Stroman is in the same spot, really. He’ll give a team about 3.0 WAR over some scrub in the rotation at a cost of $14M. Again, not a huge bargain. 3.0 WAR for $14M.
Blue Jays fans are looking at Giles and Stroman in a vacuum and not the expense of the player contracts. It would be different if Stroman and Giles were locked up at a team friendly salary.
Why would you trade two MLB caliber arms for only one prospect? That make zero sense unless this a continued salary dump and not, in fact, a so called “rebuild”…
When you’re talking Kirilloff, you’re talking about maybe the best pure hitting prospect not named vlad Jr. Would Toronto trade Jr for a number 3 and a bullpen arm for 1.5 yrs control? No. If Alex goes in a trade, its for a Degrom, Sale, Scherzer type arm. He is 21, has raked at EVERY level despite missing a year of development for TJ surgery. He has a current scout value of 60 and a FV that says perennial all star. He isn’t gonna ever be included for those Jays players.
I think we all know there really isnt any prospect that is off limits. What we really mean is “I want to be blown away if that player is traded” and I don’t blame mell for feeling that way.
Prospects as highly regarded as Kirilloff you want to see being used in a trade package for an ace type pitcher that has 2 or 3 years of control like the package that landed the Red Sox Sale.
If I were a Twins fan I don’t know how thrilled I would be if we used THAT kind of coin to get Stroman for God only knows WHAT sort of production next year if 2018 is Stroman’s floor.
The Pirates aren’t (shouldn’t be, at least) going to be in on Stroman or Giles, but I was wondering if they had another decent reliever they could get in a package with Aaron Sanchez. Then I saw the name Daniel Hudson. Definitely not him.
Sanchez seems like an interesting bet to make, especially with Taillon’s situation.
What would it take to get him?
Something you wouldn’t want to give up. The only way they move him is if a team pays as though he’s actually been good in recent years. He’s more than likely returning next year and either finally bouncing back or headed to FA as Matt Harvey 2.0.
Sounds about right.
Will Craig is way too much for Sanchez, that’s why I was hoping they had a reliever worth trading for, as Craig is expendable.
If they didn’t already have Kela, I’d say they should ask about Giles, but…for what he’d cost, better to just cross their fingers on Kela.
Good question. I really don’t know. Sanchez’ value dropping considerably.
JT Brubaker? Maybe 1 more player? Seriously, this one is difficult. I’d rather see the Jays hold on Sanchez.
Ivan Nova for cash considerations, it is, then.
What am I missing with Britton? The Yankees brought in several inferior options in the split against their number 1 opponent. He has been wild at times, but ultimately a mid 2 era for usually the 8th inning is acceptable, although not lights out. People, Yankees included, are making too much out of this.
I would not trade Garcia.
That mentality equals no World Series.
no it equals not trading your best prospect for 1.5 years of control when you have enough talent to get it done without him and because they won’t get a better pitcher. I doubt the twins trade Graterol for him
“because they won’t get a better pitcher” The Braves, Astros, Dodgers Rays, have better pitching prospects to offer, and that’s just to name a few.
….and if the better pitcher is ready to compete and contribute at the big league level, this entire story is null and void. Bring him up and let him save the Yanks season.
The truth is, they don’t have that guy at this very moment.
It’s frustrating seeing these other Yankees fans come off like this. You’re right nobody inside the Yankees organization is gonna put them over the hump. This way of thinking is the reason why Boston has had so many parades lately.
Save the Yanks season? They have the best record in the AL, duh.
That’s nice. That means they don’t need anyone, right? How many times has the best record in baseball won the World Series since expansion?
The Yankees aren’t trading Garcia for a number 3 pitcher and luxury bullpen arm. If that loses them the trade, which is possible, then its the right move by Cashman. Toronto fans have a pipe dream if they think they’re getting top 50 prospects for Stroman or Giles. Possibly if they’re combined in a trade, you’ll get ONE top prospect and some lottery picks. Stroman and Giles are not the only and not the best pitchers available. They could trade other prospects for Shane Greene or Felipe Vazquez and they could acquire Boyd. Stroman is a good pitcher but he is not a difference maker.
Deivi Garcia is not a Top 50 prospect (yet) nor is he a Top 3 prospect in the Yankees organization (yet). But, that’s perfectly fine. Jays will call Atlanta, Yankees will settle for Cashner and a loss in the ALCS on cue.
The fact that you think Stroman is going to put a team over the hump is absurd. Overvaluing him like crazy.
You’re right. Nobody can get this Yankees team over the hump. Here I thought they could legitimately win the World Series. Thanks for talking me out of that!
Yea, any playoff team can legitimately win the World Series. Marcus Stroman isn’t very likely to be the difference maker unless you’re thinking that he’s Justin Verlander or Nathan Eovaldi.
JA Happ was a better pitcher last year than Stroman is this year and got a much smaller return than anyone in this thread is hoping to get for Stroman. Rental or not, when you’re not talking about a top tier pitcher, you can’t expect top tier prospects.
Stroman has an average whip, decent ERA, average to below average FIP. He is not going to get you a monster return.
What monster return? Nobody should imply the Yankees have great prospects to trade, outside of Garcia. The Yankees cannot compete with at least 6 playoff contenders and what they have in their farm systems.
Blue Jays will bungle all trades.. History proves it.
Alex Kirlloff or bust
Forget these guys, go with Bartolo Colón.
If I’m the Jays, unless I’m extremely overwhelmed with an offer, I am not trading both Stroman and Giles in the same deal. Stroman could probably get you Frazier and Deivi alone, by adding Giles to that trade, you probably won’t maximize your return.
I’d trade one of them a couple weeks before the deadline, and trade the other right at the deadline.
Exactly why do the Jays want Frazier again? A defensively-challenged OF is not what the Jays need nor are looking for. Jays brass have said over and over that MLB-ready pitching is a priority, and they’re in a position where they’re not in a rush to just sell either Stroman or Giles to the Yankees for their scraps. Lots of other teams will have competitive offers for one or both.
As mentioned above, I’m sure the Jays will be very okay with holding onto Stroman and/or Giles and either extending them or hitting them with a QO at the end of next year if a suitable offer doesn’t emerge.
What you said GB85.
At this time next year, the Jays will likely be in a similar spot to where the Padres are right now. They could surprise you and contend for a Wild Card spot, but are likely still another year away from truly competing. That being said, Deivi would be a great piece for them to get, and Frazier is a solid bat. Look at teams like the Astros and Cubs – they didn’t seek out specific positions for 2-4 years down the road, they acquired talent and if they had an abundance of talent in one spot, they either moved players around the diamond or traded them for other assets that they needed. Baseball is too unpredictable to say “we need pitching for two years from now,” especially when it comes to pitching. How did it turn out for the Mets when they stockpiled pitching prospects? The Jays will have boat loads of $ to spend in the coming seasons, and they can supplement their already set pieces with free agent signings and trades from surplus talent. Right now, the goal should be to acquire talent, not build out your 2021 roster in the minor leagues.
IOW sit on getting high-upside prospects in return for arms that are currently in high demand. The Shatkins way…
Well, teams aren’t going to hand over MLB ready pitching for Stroman. If a prospect is MLB ready, why would you trade him?
Because he’d be unproven for a pennant race. Especially compared to a guy who has been in a few and has excelled
The Yankee fans forget there were two teams mentioned in the article that were interested in both Strohman and Giles. The twins have some real good prospects and that’s just the Twins you have to believe other deep prospect teams like the Dodgers and Houston would get invoked as well. Toronto is going to get a nice haul for those two. My guess the haul is going to include a 55 pitcher.
Bruin1012 spot on. The Twins, Dodgers, Astros, and Rays could easily outbid the Yankees.
Just realize NY Pigs will never deal players their expansive R&D department has deemed as can’t miss. Instead they will offer you broken down players, guys with serious flaws that they have already concluded won’t make it. Ask the Orioles about the bag of s*** they got. In fact, look at the history of trades Splinter has made and show us one where the trade was either fair or the other team came out ahead..
That’s on the team the Yankees make the deal with. Grow up
I do think it also has to do with the fact that big market teams have always had their prospects overrated by the media. It’s better now than it ever was, but this has to partially be the case.
Other GMs cant figure that out? Im sure the common fan can be fooled by media hype but surely you’d have to think that anyone actually in the business would rely on their own scouting reports
I’m sure they do. I’m sure they also have pre-biased minds, at least a little bit, when they go watch a player for the first time who is so highly ranked. Like I said, I wouldn’t be surprised if this was partially the case.
Yanks fans seem convinced that all 29 other teams consider Frazier the best player of all time, and that they would be stupid not to want to trade all their best prospects and players for him. This thread is certainly proof.
@GB85 Why the freakin over dramatization? If the Yanks thought he was anywhere near a “greatest of all-time” (what does that even mean) then they wouldn’t have him in AAA waiting his time. But what he IS loons to be a legit mlb hitter who was a top 20 prospect BEFORE being traded who suffered injuries related to crashing into walls and turning his ankle on a slide. Grow up. Small sample size true, but a .283/.330/.513 with 11 homers in 53 games coming off of a injury plagued 2018 season gives reason to be optimistic of what he might be able to do with regular play.
Let’s have some middle ground. He’s not the next Babe Ruth but he’s shown reason to believe he’s not going to be a bust either. He still has 5 years of control and has potential to be a solid 25-30 hr hitter.
Not sure if you’re paying attention to the rest of the league lately, but just about everyone is on track to hit 25-30 hrs. I didn’t say he was the next Babe – I said Yanks fans certainly treat him like he is when any trade scenario is brought up. Frazier for Stroman? Not happening in this market and with his deficiencies. Grow up.
Of course, Stroman has no deficiencies. The years of control are a big player here. Only 1..5 for Stroman. GB85 need not lecture posters on growing up.
Can’t play the OF
Since when was Stroman called an ACE and was the anchor of the Blue Jays staff?
Did we miss something here…with moderate success this year, suddenly he becomes Superman as far as you posters are concerned.
He’s a moderately successful pitcher enjoying a better year than last, but still gives up too many homers, and also a hit an inning.
Not saying he doesn’t have value but lets not go over the top as far as exactly how good he is or might be…..his years of control don’t matter if he doesn’t pan out to be the player you thought you traded for.
He’s giving up .9 HR/9. That’s easily above average. Rocky you’re making yourself sound even more like a clown. You’ll be licking his balls if he’s a Yankee in a few weeks anyhow.
I remember when he was too good to trade for “a 4th or 5th starter like Gerritt Cole.”
No the trade was Andujar, Adams and Frazier and the Yanks laughed and said no! That was the deal! Pirates excepted a much worse return then what Yanks would offer which did not gave Miggy in it but Frazier and Adams.
You can’t reason with all these Yankee haters BBallz.
They have convenient memories and wonder why the Yankees compete EVERY YEAR for the playoffs…..Haven’t climbed the mountain since 2009, but have not finished last in the division twice and certainly don’t make ridiculous trades like most of these “experts” wonder why not!
Yankees need a SP more than the Jays need the Yankees. There are teams with better options to fill the short term and long term needs of the Blue Jays. If the Yankees want to lowball Toronto, fine. Give Atlanta or Tampa or Minnesota or Houston a call.
Once again, there is a reason the Yankees have cashed in 1 title from 2001 onward. Go all in or face ALCS elimination. Choice is yours Bronx.
Stop nobody is listening to you, keep Stroman.
Stroman will go somewhere else, Yankees will settle and lose. Rinse and repeat.
News flash, Stroman isn’t putting any team over the top to get into the world series. He’s a good pitcher. Maybe in Toronto where you’re not used to seeing good baseball, you think Stroman is a stud. He’s not.
Looked pretty good at the World Baseball Classic, pitching in front of the world.
News flash – Yankees need Stroman more than the Jays need the Yankees as a trade partner. Are you prepared to fall short again? And again? And again?
If Tanaka, Paxson, Severino and German are good enough then we can stop this rumor here and now.
Britton has a half year of control coming off an injury and having his far worst year as a player. It’s the orioles fault for waiting so long. If they had a better offer they would of took it instead of dealing with a division rival trust me
Agreed. They knew Drury and McKinney were low ceiling. Same with Clint Frazier. So sad that Shapiro and Atkins would even consider moving Stroman to the Yankees. The guy bleeds Toronto Blue and you’d tease him to your own divisional rival? Moronic. #FireShapkins
Shatkins will sit on this until it’s too late and-or one or both are injured and radically devalued.
Senseless post. Shatkins doesn’t control who gets hurt, and the deadline is three weeks away. What do you do, bubble-wrap them and sit them so they might avoid getting injured?
“and-or”…of course they don’t control who gets hurt
Let’s be realistic about a few things. a) Yanks have zero influence over how scouts and “experts” view Devi. b) Top 100 lists are forever changing. A guy may not be listed on ANY top 100 lists but appear in the top 100, 50, 20 before the end of the season. c) A player needs to be valued based upon their value not on their desperation. Stroman might be the best SP for the Yanks if acquired but that doesn’t mean he’s an ace,
If Yanks view him as an ace then they’ll pay accordingly. If he’s a #2 guy who’s simply better than what we have then they likely won’t seeing as how Devi has such upside and is a year away from perhaps joining the team. I just don’t see Stroman as a Chris Sale, Scherzer or BumG in his prime..
If the Yankees are not willing to give up a Top 100 (let’s just assume Garcia is in, even though he’s not), for Stroman and Giles then the Yankees can quit now and forget entering the playoffs. Either get serious or stop posing. No wonder Boston wins championships and New York falls short.
Top 25 on prospectus, number 66 on fangraphs. So the kid went from being on nobodies radar to racing through the lists this year and you’re cherrypicking MLB because it suits your argument. Cool. Maybe you’ll win a MLBtr comment argument with people who also have no idea what they’re talking about.
Prospectus and Fangraphs. Great. Fake professionals with a calculator.
Again, you’re Yanks are trying to compete with the rest of the playoff teams with better farm systems. Yours doesn’t compete. So if you want/need arms you will have to figure it out. In the meantime, I didn’t know there was an argument since you haven’t really come with anything worthwhile. You’re just another guy in-denial resorting in trying to come at me with some insults. Congrats. You proved you can’t win.
LOL Okay. I suppose we’ll see the haul of top prospects that the brilliant Toronto organization can pull from the teams with the best farms. Look forward to checking back in this thread after you get a 19 year old who hit 99mph 3 times but doesn’t have a second pitch.
Seen your same post 100 times if not more in the last few years. Just change the names of the retreads and prospects. Bet you loved Julian Merryweather. And just constant apologies for the dumpster fire in Toronto. Headed for a third consecutive 4th place finish with a losing record under Shapkins. This isn’t a rebuild, it’s a salary dump. How are Clayton Richard, Edwin Jackson, Clay Buchholz, Kingham and Law blocking’s roster spots if this is a rebuild? If you were rebuilding you’d be investing in your MLB level talent like Stroman and Giles… instead Shapkins are going to trade them for a bag of balls despite 1.5 years of team control.
Yanks are looking to win a World Series right now there should be no prospect off the table if they believe the players acquired can push them over the top to win the World Series.
Doesn’t mean you overpay if you think the guy you’re getting isn’t worth it.
This is a classic case of overvaluing prospects. They are just that prospects but the chance to win a World Series doesn’t come along very often. Rebuilding teams should value prospects much more highly then a team trying to win.
For the package of Stroman and Giles, the Jays should be asking for 2 top 50 near ready prospects plus a few high ceiling lottery tickets.
This package requires a haul even if Stroman is not an ace [but a three] and Giles can have emotional issues in high pressure situations. Both can exceptionally contribute to a playoff run.
The Jays need pitching and if Shaprio/Atkins have any brains, they will go to any club that has deep near ready pitching [Atlanta?]. They don’t need or want Frazier.
This is what I said above:
Deivi, Abreu, Luis Gil, Harold Cortijo, maybe 1 more. For Stroman AND Giles. It’s a risky proposal for the Yankees, but if they say no the Blue Jays call another team in-need of a SP and RP. Plenty contenders out there looking. The deal is not outrageous.
It’s not outrageous. But the Yankees don’t need Giles and could take that package to acquire a better starter than Stroman. They could get Bauer instead for what I’d guess would be Frazier, Deivi and some lottery picks. Whether the trade is good for Toronto is irrelevant, it’s whether Stroman and Giles are the best they could do with their prospects. They clearly are not.
I actually agree. The Yankees aren’t in the Top 5 teams the Jays should be dealing with. Atlanta, Tampa, Houston, Minnesota, Philly and a 6th in Los Angeles. They would be more suitable trade partners.
Agreed Jimmertee 100%. If they trade Stroman and Giles and their 1.5 years of team control for Clint Frazier instead of MLB ready arms with All-Star upside and high ceiling A or AA prospects that can grow with Pearson, then Shapiro and Atkins should be ridden out of town on the next bus. It will set the franchise back ten years.
It’s probably a moot point because I’m guessing they go in separate deals unless Toronto is blown away on a package deal.
Going to be expensive!
I was wondering when Twin Perez would turn into Ranger Perez…..
I just don’t think the Yankees farm team matches up with the Jays needs. Minnesota, Atlanta, San Diego, and Houston match up much better. If Stroman has to be traded, I would like to see him with a N L team that can use his athleticism, speed, and bat to greater effect than the Jays could. Atlanta makes the most sense to me if they are willing to trade a couple of their very deep starting prospect pool. Giles would make any team much better(maybe not Houston ;0). Could see him with the Twins for a nice package. Kirillof is off the table but a couple of the Twins top 15 pitchers could be interesting. I would love to see the Jays keep Giles, but, that probably won’t happen.
Bingo. If the Twins don’t want to part with Kirillof the Blue Jays should ask for Arraez. He rakes, he can play 3B or 2B (move Vlad to 1B or Biggio to OF). But the Jays need pitching, first and foremost. Atlanta has it. I’ll add Tampa to your list.
Deivi and Frazier for Stroman and Giles. Later move Smoak and Hernandez for what pitching they can receive …Jansen C, Tellez 1B, Biggio 2B, Bichette SS, Guerrero Jr. 3B, Gurriel Jr. LF, Grichuk CF, Frazier RF…some arms in the system are a couple of years out to the rotation, cap space clears up, grab that big arm in free agency in 2-3 years
Grichuk can’t play CF. He also signed a hefty extension.
Bichette hasn’t been able to play SS.
Vlad will have to move to 1B/DH eventually.
Only way I see Frazier in a deal with the Jays is if the Yankees take Grichuk or take back McKinney. They won’t, so take Frazier out of the deal.
Bichette’s been able to play SS at every level.
And Grichuk has been a scratch defender in Center field over his career (1900 innings at the position).
Re-check Bichette’s numbers at SS. If he’s a SS, Gurriel is a SS. Bichette’s defense at SS is a concern, and I know that for a fact.
The only thing Grichuk scratches is the dirt chasing strike 3. He is not fast enough and not good enough to play CF. Can’t play the angles properly. Your fangraphs won’t measure any of that because that’s intangible data.
Agreed. If the Jays trade Stroman for Frazier then Shapkins should be fired with cause. The Jays need arms. If they can’t realize 3-4 MLB ready arms with upside for Stroman and Giles, then there is no point in trading them… try to extend them and actually invest in the team rebuild!
I don’t see Cashman getting Stroman, Bauer, Boyd, or Minor will be his main targets.
I’ve seen Giles perform under pressure – NOT. No way I would trade for that guy.
What ever team offers the best pitching in return.
Theo Epstein will trade Quintana for str8 man!
The Red Sox and Yankees should be contracted from the league. We only need 28 teams
With 33 year old Eric Sogard a Free Agent next season, Nick Gordon would be a nice trading chip in the Minnesota Twins securing a package deal Stroman and Giles. With Jorge Polanco and Luis Arraiz blocking Nick Gordon’s path at the MLB level, and Lewis Royce just a couple years behind him, it would be a GREAT OPPORTUNITY for Nick Gordon to prove his value at the MLB level. Stroman and Giles address the only two real weaknesses in the Twins making a run in 2019, and both would be back in 2020, when the Twins lose three of their starting rotation to Free Agency. Get ‘er Done, Twins Front Office!
Nick Gordon would have to be the third of fourth piece in any potential deal.
Agreed. At least two arms have to be in the deal. One of them being the Canadian kid Balazovic.
You clearly are clueless on shortstop Drs value ratings and rtot, nevermind Rawlings and sabr combined metric value system. Polanco is FAR from worst. At worst he is average this year.
Nick Gordon would be a Number 1 piece of a trade. It may take a 2 or 3 players, or even low 4 minor league player, to snag Stromon and Giles. (Remember Houston Giles?) Perhaps Gordon, Mejia, and the Canadian pitcher, Balazovic, should be enough! Add another A ball player, and Toronto is making out like bandits!
Balazovic has more value than Gordon (who’s value has significantly tapered off after 2017, but has rebounded some this year.
Balazovic, Gordon and a couple minor pieces should get a deal done.
That said, I’d rather not deal Gordon since neither Polanco or Arraez can play shortstop worth a lick. Polanco grades out as the worst or one of the worst starting shortstop in MLB. His arm is far too weak which forces him to rush leading to the terrible error rate. Polanco’s range should make him a valuable 2B, though.
Twins need a left-handed starter with major league postseason experience. Oh right that would be Madison Bumgarner!
Look at all the Yankees haters on this thread crying about how we overvalue players and how none of our guys are that good and blah blah blah.
Look, I’m a Yankees fan, Clint Frazier’s defense has sucked this year but his bat is absolutely the real thing. The kid can’t handle the bright lights and media scrutiny that comes with playing here, but that doesn’t make him garbage like some people are saying. He’s never seen enough playing time to learn how to drown out the boos and the media and just play baseball, but he’ll thrive with a full-time job in a less-publicized town where millions of people aren’t paying attention every night.
I’ve already resigned myself to the fact that Frazier is gone just about any trade Cashman could attempt to make, but there’s absolutely NO way I give up him AND Deivi for Stroman, who is a #2 at best and more likely a #3 once Severino returns. The only way both guys go in the same deal is for Scherzer or another legitimate ace, and anyone thinking Marcus Stroman is worth our #1 prospect is delusional.
Your #1 prospect is Florial. No Jays fan should want him.
Your #2 prospect is Loaisiga. No Jays fan should want him.
Your #3 prospect is Abreu. He isn’t the first guy the Jays should have on their list.
The Jays will have to deal at least 2 OFs to contemplate asking for Frazier. Otherwise they lose leverage if they do get Frazier down the road. Similar to signing Russell Martin and trying to trade Navarro a few years back.
So asking for the #4 prospect, Garcia, should not be a problem in a trade involving both Stroman and Giles.
The Yankees have acquired LHP J.A. Happ from the Toronto Blue Jays in exchange for INF Brandon Drury and OF Billy McKinney.
Sure, acquiring a good starter from Toronto will take top prospects! gtfo
JA Happ was a rental makes a big difference. You are comparing apples and oranges.
well said and on point…..
If the Jays trade for minor leaguer Frazier to add to low ceiling McKinney and Drury, Atkins will cement his reputation as one of the worst GMs in MLB. If they don’t get 3-4 MLB ready arms with All-Star upside to compensate for Giles and Stroman, who both have one more year of team control, then it’s nothing but a cost cutting exercise. If they can’t realize that kind of return, then it’s better to try to extend them both and invest in the Jays now.
Dammm…… This site is getting worst with the time…!!
I said at the beginning of the season they would deal Stroman, and none of it has to do with helping the team. The day Stroman criticized Shapiro and Atkins about their stripping the team of a veteran presence was the day his fate was sealed. This team is headed towards the worst record in franchise history and for only a solid reason Shapiro and Atkins have put a team of rookies on the field
Oh the signed lots of veteran pitchers Davis, Buchholtz, Norris. these three were done years ago. Shoemarker looked like a good deal but that didn’t last.
By the end of July Stroman, Smoak, and likely Galvis will be gone, I would have included Sanhez but his June was so terrible no one may want him. That basically leaves Thorton as the starter and I think he’ll be good but it takes time and Richards who falls into the Edwin Davis group.
This team on field payroll is 48 million . the lead the league in 25 catagories for poor performance and they have had the largest attendance decline of of any major league team. from last year to this year.
And still Rogers does nothing
Of the 192 SP (qualified) since 2014, Stroman is 45th in ERA, 31st in xFIP, and 37th in SIERA. This despite playing for a Jays team that was dead last in team defense in 2018 and 25th so far this year. So not an ace, granted, but arguably a strong #2 bordering on a marginal #1.
The idea that the Yankees want to add Giles is hysterical!! I guess one start in the playoffs will be 9 closers!! hahahaha Idiots. No championships in a decade and you still can’t figure out what doesn’t work!!
Adding Stroman is a big risk. The kid is very volatile so he may not be able to handle the boos or he may blow up and be the next above average SP that failed to make it in NY. That list is fairly long with guys like Pavano on it twice!! Simply put – Risky strategy!
Also, you have to wonder about Toronto’s front office. Helping an in division rival seems like such a bad idea for a young team that hopes to compete soon. I guess maybe they don’t have confidence that they will competitive in the next several years. It’s very disappointing. I like their nucleus of players and they still have more to graduate to the majors, plus they get Borucki back soon.
Toronto, if you are going to beef up your farm system, go to an inter-division or inter-league team. Lots of good prospects available. Hudson can replace Giles in a heartbeat. With Borucki back, loss of Stroman won’t hurt as much. You guys have a bright future! Add to it without hurting your chances of competing in your division.