If you’ve been even loosely following things for the past couple of years, the notion that the Indians will trade star shortstop Francisco Lindor this offseason should come as no surprise. Still, it’s nevertheless of some note to see USA Today’s Bob Nightengale tweet that Cleveland has informed other clubs of their intent to trade Lindor before Opening Day.
This is hardly the first such indication of the concept. We’ve discussed the possibility here at MLBTR numerous times in the past couple years — most recently two weeks ago when Connor Byrne ran through potential offseason trade partners who could take on Lindor for his final year of club control before free agency next year. The Athletic’s Zack Meisel also took a look at the possible market for Lindor last week, consulting with his colleagues who cover many prospective trade partners for the Indians.
The eventual trade of Lindor will serve as the inevitable culmination of a saga that began two years ago when, asked about the possibility of a Lindor extension, Indians owner Paul Dolan ominously told fans to simply “enjoy him.” Cleveland has long been a low-payroll organization, though the club ramped up payroll after its 2016 World Series run, even signing Edwin Encarnacion to a three-year, $60MM contract that winter.
Since that time — particularly over the past two offseasons — it’s been a steady march to reduce spending and return payroll to normal levels. Encarnacion was traded two years into that deal, while All-Star outfielder Michael Brantley was allowed to leave as a free agent without the club risking a qualifying offer. Cleveland has traded Trevor Bauer, Corey Kluber and Mike Clevinger as well and neglected to spend to address a lackluster outfield group in the post-Brantley era, instead focusing on hopeful bargain-bin additions.
All of those payroll-paring efforts came prior to the onset of the Covid-19 pandemic that left all 30 MLB clubs without gate revenue for the 2020 season. The Indians themselves raised one of the most substantial red flags regarding the economic turmoil throughout the game when they placed All-Star closer Brad Hand on waivers in an effort to avoid paying a $1MM buyout on a $10MM club option they did not intend to exercise. To the Indians’ credit, the negative framing of that move here at MLBTR was proven to be a bit misplaced when Hand went unclaimed and Cleveland was forced to pay the buyout anyhow.
That said, the decision not to retain Hand, coupled with all of the team’s recent market dealings, paints a clear picture of an organization that feels it necessary to further slash payroll — even at a time when the roster possesses enough talent to contend in the American League Central.
Jason Martinez of Roster Resource/FanGraphs projects that the Indians will have a roughly $72MM payroll for the 2021 season, but that figure includes the $19.5MM salary which MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz projects Lindor to earn. Trading Lindor and potentially non-tendering some members of their arbitration class would put the Indians down into the $50MM range, pending any smaller-scale offseason additions.
It’s worth noting, of course, that Lindor’s trade value is likely at an all-time low. Beyond the fact that he has merely one year of club control remaining, he’s also coming off a poor season at a time when many rival clubs will simply balk at taking on a near-$20MM salary.
Lindor, 27 next week, turned in a pedestrian .258/.335/.415 slash (100 wRC+) with eight homers and six steals in this year’s shortened slate of games. It’s only a sample of 266 plate appearances, and Lindor registered a combined .278/.342/.514 output (121 wRC+) in the 2017-19 seasons combined, playing all-world defense at shortstop and averaging 34 homers and 21 steals per year along the way.
That track record should still fuel demand for his services, but with the benefit of hindsight, many fans will suggest the Indians waited a year too long to move him, given the inevitable nature of his trade candidacy. In addition to Dolan’s “enjoy him” line, it’s crucial to add that Lindor turned down an extension offer reported to be in the neighborhood of $100MM prior to the 2017 season, when he had just over a year of Major League service time. A long-term union between the two sides has never been seen as likely, and the primary question now is one of where — not whether — he’ll be traded.
Lindor himself has acknowledged the possibility of being traded this winter while simultaneously rejecting the notion that the team “can’t afford” to sign him. Asked by Meisel on Oct. 1 if Cleveland should be able to meet his asking price on a contract, Lindor replied: “Of course. It’s a billion-dollar team. Of course.”
Asked later in the interview about his expectations for the game’s economy over the next year in the wake of 2020 revenue losses, Lindor rhetorically answered: “Did you see MLB just signed a $3 billion contract?” The contract referenced by Lindor is the reported seven-year, $3.7 billion deal with Turner Sports to continue broadcasting half of the postseason’s games. Back in 2018, MLB also agreed to a seven-year, $5.1 billion rights deal with FOX for the World Series and the other half of postseason media rights in that same 2022-28 span.
To the Padres
Indians and Padres always trade with each other.
And Padres always lose those trades
Who can afford this guy for the future?? He previously stated he felt like he deserved a 300m contract. A team would be taking a big chance by trading away star prospects who are major league ready for just one year of Lindor.
If Cleveland would accept major league players with one year left on their contracts in exchange that could be different.
Cardinals trade—— Carlos Martinez, plus Prospects
Who could afford Betts? Or Machado?
Look at what the Indians got back for one year of an expensive Kluber. Not much. Factor in they just dumped Hand for nothing and even tried to get out of the one million buyout, and a bag of baseballs might be enticing to them. Their major motivation will be to dump the contract, and few teams will be looking to add $20mm in a potential covid season.
Why would the Indians want Martinez? That scenario makes no sense at all.
Anyway you slice it makes no sense. He has no room in their rotation, and well they just DFAd a closer who was a hell of a lot better. I truly believe the Cards would be in on Lindor, but Martinez is basically stuck in STL.
Cleveland received 6 years of a young fireballer reliever named Emmanuel Clase. Cleveland’s bullpen lacked power pitchers. Clase and James Karinchak will form a power back end of the bullpen for several years. Texas received one inning of Corey Kluber for $17.5M.
Actually @koamalu, if you looked around the league last year at the big-market teams that theoretically could afford Betts, there was only one who actually could without putting themselves in luxury tax hell for the next 5+ years. I’ll give you one guess which team it was.
Actually, if you looked around the league last year at the big-market teams that theoretically could afford Betts, there was only one who actually could without putting themselves in luxury tax hell for the next 5+ years. I’ll give you one guess which team it was.
Won’t be the Padres. They are going to cautious about payroll as well and the bullpen needs help this off season.
They should have claimed Hand
Pullben. And SP. And OF… My Pads have some *holes*
The Padres don’t need Lindor with Tatis at SS.
Why will they be limited in spending? The Padres will have nearly $100 million in additional revenue in 2021 between their part of the new national TV contracts and the escalator clause in the local TV contract.
A solid LF and two relievers and they are one of the favorites for a playoff spot again in 2021.
If there are no games to televise, they won’t get that money! Covid is still here.
The Phillies needs a shortstop. Didi Gregorius is a free agent. However, they do have have Scott Kingery that could play shortstop, but Lindor can Improve the Phillies lineup.
I wish the Phillies had the assets to make a move for Lindor but they don’t.
they do, but it would have to i include Howard, Stott, plus. the real issue is paying him going forward. we don’t need another expensive hitter.
Exactly and all moving someone like Howard does is create another hole too. This is gonna be a very disappointing offseason for the Phillies. Middleton can talk the talk but that’s about it.
They wouldn’t have to move Howard or Stott. CLE has depth at pitching and 3B/SS. They will have Nolan Jones their #1 prospect at 3B, and Jose Ramirez can still play SS (he just hasn’t b/c of Lindor. They need OF help and a 2B. They can still contend so they will want major league ready talent that is inexpensive. We would have to move Haseley, either Segura(and $) or Kingery, Moniak, Medina, and maybe 1 more mid level guy like Gamboa/Muzziottti. And we are probably over paying at that point.
The Phillies needs a shortstop.
1-They have Segura, who they can plug into SS.
2-They need money for JTR, and desperately needed BP help.
Oh, I forgot about Segura. Well, it’s the way you want to see the lineup. Lindor is an excellent player. The Phillies tried the last two years to sign Realmuto to an extension, but it was possible. Yes, they definitely need bullpen help.
JTR is awesome, but teams don’t usually come out ahead signing catchers his age to long term contracts. Outside of Molina, most catchers in the last twenty years have hit a huge wall at age 30 or just a little over. Even the ones who moved to another position haven’t done well.
If I am Philly, I keep it to three year max. I think JTR will want more, but maybe not.
They didnt make the playoffs w/ JT, having him and a few bullpen arms won’t fix things. They need better defense at SS and Segura and Kingery are below average there. They need top/middle of the order bats who are LH/SW, and Lindor is the PERFECT fit for the Phillies. More important that signing JT(who I love, but he’s a 30 year old C, he’s got about 3 years left of elite status, then he’s gonna be a 1B or DH). How much do you wanna give him? Marchan is a better defensive C. Knapp hit very well last year and both of those can hit from the left side. Acquiring Lindor, then signing a few players like C. Morton, C. Hamels, to 1 year deals, M. Brantley, to a 2-3 year deal, and bullpen guys like Liam Hendriks, Sean Doolittle,Keone Kela, and maybe Brad Hand would do us much better than spending 200M on JT.
I think the Phillies absoutely have the assets to send CLE. They can send Segura, Phils paying 1/2 his $ remaining, F. Morales, Moniak, Medina,& J. Ortiz/S.Muzzotti……..just make sure we sign Lindor Long term before making the deal final!
Worst idea ever
tatis is there at short they dont need him
Never trading with the Indians again. Not like the Padres need a shortstop anyway.
I believe the Padres have a decent infield if my mind serves me correct. Don’t think they need Lindor. Correct me if I’m wrong but I think Padres infield is pretty dang good.
They have a better than decent IF; What they have a is a very sketchy OF -Myers will or will not be good next year – Grisham is solid at CF but LF is a big Q. And dont’ get me started about pitching…
I’ve mentioned this before in this thread, but I feel compelled to hammer the point home, Unless you have no holes at all, you won’t be trading for Lindor.
The Mets’ fans want him, even though they have a decent alternative in Gimenez, and have no catcher and maybe no pitching.
The Phillies have Segura as an alternative, have no catcher, a weakish rotation, and absolutely no BP.
Teams are not going to spend money and prospects to upgrade 2 WAR, and then ignore other gaping hole.s
Padres starting pitching was 3rd best in ERA in baseball. They have great young arms coming like Patino, Morejon, Weathers and Gore. The only starter over 30 this season, Garrett Richards, is gone in FA.
Their bullpen is a whole different story. Yates and Rosenthal are both FA. They need a closer and another solid setup arm.
I believe you are wrong. You are talking about a generational talent with Lindor. We are not speaking of Iglesius here.
FredMcGriff for the HOF
Since no one has proposed a Yankees trade yet…. Dominquez/Schmidt/Garcia for Lindor.
Yankees won’t trade Dominquez for one year of Lindor unless Yankee coaching and scouting has soured on him.
Yankees (or any team) will trade next to nothing to get Lindor. Who wants to pay good prospects and also pay $19.5MM in a Covid world for a one year rental and a chance to drop a QO if they don’t trade him first ?
If Lindor is the last piece ? Maybe, but tell me the team that Lindor is the last missing piece ? The Yankees missing piece is pitching. They send down to the alt site or bench more hitting than most teams have available, they need pitching…
Lol throw in Judge and Frazier and your future dog named spot.
Along the lines of Cronenworth, Patino and another prospect for Lindor.
Lindor slides over to second.
With Preller at the helm, you never know.
Towinagain hitting the pipe. Hell of a drug there buddy. Padres are a cheap franchise historically and are trying to get rid of will myers deal and you think they will trade a cost controlled assets for 20 million for 1 year? That is beyond idiotic, by all means I hope it happens though because then padres won’t be able to resign lindor in free agency. Preller is bold he isn’t dumb.
“Preller is bold he isn’t dumb.”
I think in that scenario, Tatis Jr. would slide over I would think. Lindor is the better Defensive SS. (of the 2).
1. No rental is getting a package that strong
2. Lindor isn’t moving off shortstop for anybody.
Lindor slides over to second.
Trading for a GG SS, so you can play him out of position?
Wouldn’t do either of those strait up. I dont think the indians are a top 100 prospect
Oh joy more depletion of tge farm system for a rental that doesn’t make them better than the Dodgers. Andrew Friedman likes this idea.
? Is Tatis no longer there?
Think if gore is included they could have anyone.
God I hope Preller doesn’t trade him
Where would they play him?
I wonder if Atlanta isn’t a better fit, ASSUMING…
1) he WOULD slide to 3rd
2) he COULD perform the same sliding to 3rd
3) the Indians are realistic on the ask for a guy with 1 yr control on an excessive for economic conditions deal coming off a down year.
They’ve paid draft compensation on 1 yr deals. They have young arms that need help in spades if Cleveland would take one as a piece.
Randy Red Sox
Lindor- Zzzzzzz !!
Sounds like the kids all watched Space Jam
London played down his value like a good disgruntled player would, should have a good bounce back year where ever he ends up.
Where would you put Tatis?
Why would SD trade for him? They have Tatis and Machado on the left side and Cronenworth at 2B.
I think the Phillies are the perfect fit for him.
If they don’t sign Bauer, I could see the Angels Karting with Adell to bring in Lindor.
Not for 1 year
What if it was Lindor and another piece, say Carrasco or MacKenzie? Adell and something else?
i don’t think the Angles are close enough to part with Adell for a rental, especially if they *don’t* get Bauer
Adell plus other prospects for Lindor plus young controllable starting pitcher, yes I can see it happening
Not happening. Halo’s playing it cheap. They have Fletcher at SS.
The Angels would not consider trading Adell for LIndor.
The Indians would take less than a second to accept that deal.
Angels need pitching before anything else.
I’d say angels would do upton plus adell for lindor in a heart beat. Angels have pujols 35 million coming off next season in addition to uptons 25 million and could extend lindor a 10/300 million contract. A core of lindor, rendon and trout is absolutely nasty.
Couple issues @Tatsumaki
1. Upton has a full NTC
2. Indians are trading Lindor to cut payroll so adding Upton makes no sense
3. No one is trading for Lindor just so they can try to extend him
Absolutely right on 1 and 2 and probably right on 3.
I know people think Upton is done, I don’t.
He was hurt in 2019, you can throw at that year. He struggled incredibly to start 220, but finished up 303/398/605 from Aug 28th and on.
He’s a hard man to gauge. He may be done, be may not be. He’s turns 34 next Aug. It’s not like he’s 36 going on 37.
@remove If angels retain salary in second year why not? The reason indians are shedding lindor isn’t because they can’t pay him it’s because they won’t be extending him past this season. Upton makes 50 million over the next 2 years if angels eat say 10-15 million of that deal to facilitate trade and it nets indians adell why not? People are saying lindor won’t fetch much so my thought process is add adel to take upton. Indians would be get young star plus the potential all star in upton for 17 million per year. Idk where they would get a better deal for lindor.
They are trading him because they want to cut payroll. No one thinks Lindor is signing an extension. An acquiring team is trading for him because they want to win now. Like the Cubs when they traded for Aroldis Chapman or the Dodgers when they traded for Manny Machado.
What part of “no trade clause” causes you such confusion?
Upton signed his deal to get a NTC because wife and kids are in PHX. He’s not going to Cleveland.
@geokaplan so no team as ever asked a player to waive there no trade clause? Sit down.
Difference is Upton has publicly stated that he wants to stay close to PHX and that was why he got the NTC. So YOU sit down.
Yep, you really aren’t interest in facts, logic, maybe personal hygiene.
Upton came to the Angels in a trade from the Tigers, with a contract paying him $22M+ per year through 2021, a limited NTC, and an opt out for 2018, which he exercised.
He re-signed with the Angels, taking much less in 2018-20, and adding an extra year with a balloon salary ($28M) for 2022, *and* a full NTC. He has stated publicly that the knowledge he would be playing close to home for the rest of his career was the reason to stay in SoCal.
This isn’t some hypothesis, it’s a statement of fact. He isn’t taking a big payday to move to Cleveland, Toronto, or anywhere else you want to rosterbate him (that $28M in ‘22 is a good indication there aren’t many shiny objects to dangle before him and persuade him to move). He holds the cards. He is with the Angels through 2022.
Why would he refuse Cleveland. Such a beautiful city. Shining mansion on the, er, lake
Are you dense? He’s not leaving the proximity to his kid to please your proposal
That’s the reason. Doesn’t matter if it was NY Clev TB or anyone else. It’s not hard
I mean no offense. But, this might be the most ridiculous proposal I have ever seen,
Why would Cleveland not want the future star that is Justin Upton?
Do you really think 10/300 will be enough? I don’t
If he has a 2020 year in 2021 he’s not getting 30M with 4 star SS also on the market
stan lee the manly
Man I would love him on the Cardinals with DeJong over to either third or second depending on Edman. His personality and clubhouse presence (not to mention his offense) would be a big boost for what has been a flat team at times.
Wonder if cards could trade cmart and half or 2/3rds of fowler to free up some money to trade for Lindor. The cards gave alot of money coming off next year. Lindor at short and dejong at third would be awesome. Wonder if cleveland would take someone like ponce de leon and ehleuris Montero and the cards take the whole 19.5 of lindors contract. A decent cost controlled starter and an up and coming 3b for 19.5 lindor for just 1 year sounds fair
Actually I could see the m making a play for hi.He cloud mice to center and franny take shortstops. Dan Dan imagine that lineup top two bottom
Nvm this is worst idea ever
no offense man, but you’re comments dont make any sense
Who would you offer for him? Along with the positioning of Bichette/Biggio?
Jays have lots of prospects to offer. Could also offer one of Gurriel or Hernandez with Biggio moving to the outfield to replace them
Full salary to Jays, McGuire and Fisher to Cleveland. Sounds weak but the market is going to be tight this year because owners had no gate. Toronto is corporate so gate doesn’t matter to Rogers bottom line.
Gurriel for Lindor would be a disaster. You upgrade the infield defense, but the offense doesn’t improve since they have similar bats. You’ve lost 4 years of Gurriel in order to pay Lindor way more for 1 year than you’d be paying Gurriel for 4. You get a slightly better team in 2021 in exchange for a much worse team in 2022-2024.
Toronto doesnt need a MIF
Toronto needs a 3B. Acquiring Lindor moves Bo to 2B and Biggio to 3B. So yes, Lindor is in-play for the Blue Jays. Indians want an OF and the Jays can provide that too.
Who would you offer WereAllJust… for Lindor? OF and prospects?
Trades that require two young players to switch positions might have a history of -0-.
Rhymo if Cleveland wants prospects in plural then the OF is Grichuk.
Otherwise it’s Teoscar and another player. Then go right after Springer.
The Indians are not taking Grichuk back in any trade due to his contract.
The Indians will be paying that money and more to fill other positions on the field. Do not think they won’t take on that contract. Lindor is poised to pull in over $20-mil and they’d save over $10-mil plus they fill a void in the OF. To say the Indians can’t take on Grichuk’s contract is absurd.
At only 1 season left for Lindor the pickings will be slim. Not taking on “some” salary means Cleveland should rebuild since the return will not be an immediate impact at the major league level.
Kmac, no. Jays need to go after Arenado.
Is Cleveland still trying to contend without him? I’d say so given the pitching they have and an MVP candidate in the middle of the order. I can’t see a scenario where it’s not Gurriel as Cleveland’s main ask. I’d be really hesitant to do that. Yankees and Mets might have enough affordable major league pieces for it.
Yes, the Indians are still planning to contend with their outstanding, controllable, starting pitching . Yes, the Indians biggest need is a controllable MLB outfielder. Yes, Guirrel could be someone that Cleveland might ask for as part of a Lindor trade.
No chance. Plus Gurriel probably makes too much money for Cleveland to handle since Grichuk’s contract is “too much”. Indians continue to step backward. Time to give up the dream. Rebuild or spend. Doing neither keeps them in 3rd place and out of contention.
Gurriel makes 50% of Grichuk.
There’s an internet full of this information to prevent foolish statements like that from happening!
*don’t think you were serious with the Gurriel making too much comment, but bang for buck, Gurriel has value, Grichuk doesn’t. so it seemed like a bozo type comment*
Gurriel may make ‘too much’ for Cleveland if there are alternative offers involving young talent like A.Gimenez or K.Ruiz in play.
MLB ready pre-arb talent gets them thinking. Every time seemingly.
Franmil, Clase, Naylor.
There’s a certain type of contract that this team seems to value as their trade centerpieces.
With one of the better pitching rotations in the league, this Cleveland team will still be special as long as they use the Lindor money to fill their other 3-4 holes.
If teams are offering Grichuk, M Carpenter, Inciarte level players, I’d expect to see Cleveland gamble on a rookie heavy lineup and wait to find those money savings midseason when the return might be more to their liking.
Admitting I could be wrong.
But I see your ‘no chance’ and raise it to a ‘medium chance’.
Getting a Gurriel type return wouldn’t be doing neither. Gurriel is locked up for just over $13m for 3 more seasons for a good established major leaguer. Even Teoscar Hernandez in year 1 of arbitration will make more than Gurriel this year and that will climb to untenable for Cleveland maybe even in year 2 if they can’t extend him. Grichuk is owed more guaranteed money than Lindor and there’s really no excess value provided on that contract. Gurriel is already what Cleveland wants. Ready to help a team stay in contention now while knowing exactly what to budget for him (and it’s not much). The only way I’d consider it from Toronto’s side is if there was also permission to work out a Lindor extension pre-trade. Even then, only because I somewhat buy into the notion that Toronto is a hard sell to many free agents.
You missed the point Filthy.
The point is Cleveland fans and the organization say they can’t take on salary, which is only true to an extent. With Gurriel, overall value of his contract would be considered a nice get for the Indians due to control. But crying poor would suggest Gurriel easily fits Cleveland’s criteria and Grichuk doesn’t? That’s bullcrap.
Also, Cleveland wants an OF capable of playing good D. Gurriel? Nope. Grichuk? Yep. It’ll cost them. That’s the breaks. Indian fans are asking for the world for 1 season of Lindor coming off an “off year”. Sorry, no such luck.
Hold up here. Grichuk has graded very poorly in center, and below average in right field. While Gurriel was nominated for a gold glove in left field this season and is still improving in left. Grichuk has almost minus value considering his defense is poor and his offense is not good either. Gurriel is solid defensively and a better bat
Whatever grading system you use is a myth. First, because Grichuk grades well in RF so wherever you are getting your stats from you can block that on your computer.
Gurriel is an awful route runner, much worse than Grichuk, and the many uncalled errors helps his rating. Gurriel has a plus arm in LF. That is about it. Grichuk can play all 3 OF positions and despite what you say he plays more than passable CF.
To say Gurriel is solid defensively tells me you forgot to watch the games in 2020 and 2019.
The point is spin. I’ll hit the spinner. Foul it off at least.
Why suggest that the Cleveland fans are all like minded. You must have seen the varying levels of reason shown by their fanbase in this thread alone?
Cleveland has tried to trade Lindor for awhile now, because they know he intends to test free agency. Nobody has offered enough yet. They say they mean it this time though. Look out.
Many teams will be crying poor. That makes Gurriel much more valuable than Grichuk. His Gold Glove nomination as well. Bad routes not so costly. Some fantastic recoveries on plenty of those routes come to mind nearly as much as his great arm.
Both have some great hot streaks with the bat. I think most would take Gurriel to hit better over the next 3 years? Grichuk would probably contend for a GG if he played LF. The difference in talent isn’t drastic to me, but mainly, that extra $15+m ($5m per year) is the biggest factor following this short fanless season.
Neither is pre-arb, so Cleveland probably passes unless literally no other teams make an offer.
Rangers could use a splash, still looking for that first title, and just saw the playoffs played in their new stadium without them. Ouch. Sam Huff and Leodys Taveras both got tastes in 2020. Perfect fit for what Cleveland tends to go for. Pre-arb and ready to go. .
Crying poor, running an efficient operation, same thing really.
I missed many points there too I’m sure. .
Can’t understand what makes you so adamant teams will value a 60 game season over the previous 5 years of Lindor’s career?
Try toning it down a bit. Are you missing the Christmas music or something? Don’t worry, the season is upon us. The soundtrack of free agency!
I could see the Yankees making a play for Lindor if the Indians like the prospects they offer for him. They could put Lindor at short and move Gleyber back to second and the cost for next year would be comparable to what they would likely have to pay DJ to keep him but they would get younger and have a chance to resign Lindor long term.
They don’t have to trade for Lindor to have a chance to sign him buddy
Can’t sign him if he’s traded to another team and they extend him. It’s the most likely scenario for any team trading the kind of haul it’s going to require to deal for him so if the Yankees want him they’re going to have to go get him now as I don’t think he makes it to the market next year.
Matt Klentak and J.T. Realmuto say hi.
How is that the most likely scenario? What in Lindor’s personality or anything that he has said indicates that he won’t make it to the market? And teams trade valuable assets for players and then don’t extend them all the time. Yankees with Chapman, Dodgers with Machado, Phillies with Realmuto, etc.
Chapman is a moot point because he came right back.
@DarkSide830 Chapman is the perfect example of a team trading “that kind of haul” for a player and then not extending him. Especially when he went right back to the Yankees.
then you mean Cubs right, because NYY really didnt deal that much or value for him if im correct. they actually gained betwee. acquiring him and trading him.
@DarkSide830 yes I did mean to say the Cubs. My bad.
Not much value? Yankees got Gleyber in the Chapman deal.
@koz16 exactly. @dirtbagfreitas says that teams don’t trade those kind of hauls for players they aren’t going to extend. The Cubs did. The Dodgers did. The Phillies did.
He is not skipping FA.
Mookie says hi.
My guess is the team who trades for Lindor will end up signing him.
My guess is you’re wrong.
With the current state of the Yankees’ rotation, they won’t trade young pitching in Garcia or Schmidt for a year of Lindor.
@Lowe: Not including Garcia or Schmidt would be fine with the Indians.. the Indians are deep and talented w/r to their pitching and pitching prospects.. ..making their inclusion less important.. The Indians would be looking for a more ready now OF’er (Red Thunder?) and a catcher that can actually catch..
Anyone like that in the NYY system?..
What? Perez is a Gold Glove catch….hitting is his problem
Dolan is a billionaire far from cash strapped team.
Lux and Gonsolin for Lindor.
I think that package is more than I would want to pay. Lux and someone less than Gonsolin but I still can’t see the Dodgers doing it. I’m pretty sure the Dodgers can resign Turner to a team friendly deal so no real point in trading a talented package for a player that would only be moderately better than Turner. Besides, after Seagers world series performance I would think Dodger fans are happy to let Seager keep SS.
As a Dodger fan, I would love to see that deal. Turner is 36 years old and to say moderately better is crazy! Turner is only worth keeping if the NL keeps the DH.
Moderately better than Turner? I am a dodger fan, and im curious as to where you all get this from?
Lindor is a true baseball talent. Most likely a future hall of famer.
I can’t see the Dodgers not doing that trade. Dynasty!
Lux and Gonsolin for Lindor.
Seager is about 99.9% certain to start at SS after his WS performance.
I think the fans’ plan was to slide Seager to third and plug Lindor in at short (assuming they can’t/don’t resign Turner). I’d rather they resign Turner for two years at a reasonable price, keep Seager at short and go with Lux & their many utility players at second.
Lindor goes to 2b and Turner signed to two year deal..
That would be my advise as well. I think they could get Turner for 2/20.
Lindor is not going to 2nd. Seager is not moving to 3rd or 2nd. On their walk years it’s just not happening. This is trying to play fantasy baseball that in no way deals with being realistic.
As a dodger fan, I’d rather see LA send Ruiz and Gonsolin.
Cleveland could use a catcher who can hit.
If NL goes to DH Dodgers will want to keep both Ruiz and Smith.
LA would be getting robbed.
You clearly are drunk
Why? What’s wrong with Seager at SS, and either bringing back Turner for a year, Lux @ 2nd. Or wait til next deadline or offseason when Lindor, Correa, Baez, etc are all FA”s?
Mets for sure, have money and can give up a cheap ss. Add he and Realmuto and Mets can get 2nd
This doesn’t make any sense. Don’t they want to win in 2021?
Of course they do, but the Dolans are more concerned about money. If I remember correctly, the team was operating at a loss for a while, even when they went to the World Series, and the pandemic made things far worse.
Can you post a link or something where you read the Indians operated at a loss when they went to the world series?
Replacing Lindor’s production will cost way more than whatever he makes in 2021
They did alright without Lindor producing much in 2020. A great rotation makes up for a lot of holes.
Indians are hosed without Lindor. With Clevinger you could at least make an argument (probably not a good one) that his production could be replaced in house. You can’t say the same with Lindor.
And you obviously did not look at his overall career numbers.
They don’t care if they are a WC team now. The pitching will keep them competitive
They are slashing money hard
How long till they pretend Ramirez is too expensive?
Jim – answer is no. Anyone thinking Cleveland can contend is in-denial. They want an OF and SS for 1 year out of Lindor. Then turn around and say “Cleveland can’t take on any money.”
Good luck with that. If they were smart they’d deal Lindor to the Mets for one of their stud SS and another player, then sign Springer (they won’t. Too cheap). There is no good scenario for the Indians without spending a tiny bit of money.
They were on pace last year for 94.5 wins, with Lindor contributing a pro forma 2.2 WAR. They’ve averaged 95 wins over the past 5 years. How is it possible that they won’t be contenders?
Because they have absolutely no one to replace Lindor with in 2021. Gabriel Arias (acquired from SD in the Clevinger trade and Rule 5 eligible this offseason) will be good, but probably not until 2022 at the earliest and he’s still no Francisco Lindor.
No doubt it will hurt, but there are low-wage SS’s around. Guys like Iglesias, Villar, and Galvis can supply a professional SS at low wages.
If Lindor was his usual 5 WAR player, and they replaced him with -0-, I’d agree that would presumably lower the Indians expected wins to 90, which is still competitive. But even if all they did was to trade him for Gimenez, how much would they lose over the 2020 version of Lindor?
There is no way the Indians trade Lindor and make their team better in 2021. People said the same thing about Betts last year and look at how trading him worked out for Boston. Only way trading Lindor makes sense is if Cleveland wants to tank in 2021 (and if that’s what they want to do then that’s completely fine). But trading your face of the franchise never helps in the short term.
3rd place while playing the poor NL Central and AL Central. They will have a hard time with the AL East sans Lindor. What they showed in the playoffs is what they are; medium fish in a small pond.
If the Red Sox had close to the type of pitching that they have in Cleveland, they would have done a lot better without Betts in my opinion.
The offense wasn’t the problem for them.
But it’s a huge problem for Cleveland. Lot of possible ways to improve, even without Lindor.
Is Gorman ready yet?
Can Naylor show some more of what he showed in the playoffs?
Can Mercado do something?
Might not be likely but certainly not impossible.
Rays improved after trade away Longoria.
Never and no way are poor word choices. The unexpected sometimes happens in the world of sports.
3rd in AL Central was tied for 4th in the AL for 2020.
And NL Central had 4 playoff teams.
7 playoff teams from the centrals is good.
Not a single one advancing past WC is not so good.
Four years since the mighty Central-Central World Series days.
Past 10 years, 7 Central teams, 8 West, and only 5 East representatives in the World Series.
Quite a coin flip.
East hasn’t been mighty since the Yankees were good.
(*they’ve been good for past 25 years, but greatness and mighty East are concepts that gotta be fading from their memory*)
Just getting into the pond is better than nothing.
A lot of big fish near the pond, some other medium fish in the pond, various size fish that don’t even seem to know there’s a pond.
Oakland, Minnesota, Tampa Bay have been trying but the next team to perfect that Miami strategy might be Miami again.
Cleveland tried the KC strategy and it got them so so close.
Seems they’re gonna give the Miami strategy a shot.
They’re never going to get to try the NY/LA strategies but they do an excellent job with the turnover.
Until they go a year without developing a solid SP, it feels very difficult to count Cleveland out.
How do you know what they want? I do not have a clue of what Cleveland wants for Lindor.
Cleveland is going to want the best overall talent offered. I think this thread may be skewed bc La traded Verdugo, downs and a minor league catcher. They were likely the only team in baseball that could absorb Betts and Price contracts. Not saying Lindor is Betts, but all these offers seem to be on the low end.
Lindor to the Marlins for Trevor Rogers, Nick Neidhart, Jerar Encarnacion and Jose Devers. Indians get two solid mid rotation options, a power hitting outfield prospect and a solid long term utility type. Marlins get a superstar to help push for a postseason run in 2021.
I think it would need to include a bigger headliner and probably a hitter as the headliner.
Miami won’t pay that much in salary.
I think the jury is still out on what kind of payroll we can expect the Marlins to have. They’ve been rebuilding since new ownership took over so naturally would have a low payroll.
But this package isn’t getting it done. You really think you are going to get one of baseballs best shortstops for a prospect that hardly makes the Marlins top 10 in the organization and then two more prospects who aren’t even THAT good.
Rule of thumb; if the package doesn’t hurt your feelings a little, it isnt enough. Your package will probably have to include Bleday or maybe Chisholm and then a wild card like one of the prospects you included.
You’re out of your mind if you don’t think the Indians would take that deal. I’d be willing to bet my own wife that the Indians would take that if the Marlins offered it. Which they shouldn’t because it would be an idiotic thing to do. There are already concerns around the sport for the guys who are currently free agents. A lot of people don’t think any of those guys are going to get paid. For good reason: If you don’t know if you’ll have fans in the stands then you can’t go throwing money at players. No team in their right frame of mind is going to pay a guy 20 million for one year while also giving up top prospects under the current conditions. We’ve already seen the last few years teams absolutely refusing to include top prospects for one year rentals. They have significantly less reason to do it now when it involves 20 million and everyone is shedding salary. I would not be shocked or amazed if the Indians ended up having to release him to be completely honest. So yeah, I think if the Marlins offered that then the Indians GM would probably drop off Lindor at the damn airport himself.
“I would not be shocked or amazed if the Indians ended up having to release him to be completely honest.”
Why would Cleveland, with their outstanding, controllable starting pitching with depth trade Lindor for a package lead by two mid to bottom rotation arms? The Indians are not going to release him. I can’t believe the number of bizarre comments made on here and on twitter.
Yeah, you’re right. They didn’t literally just release one of the best relievers in all of baseball over half the amount of money Lindor is owed because they couldn’t afford to pay it and had no other legitimate choice. Come on man. I get fans being naive all the time, but owners don’t care about winning championships. They wanna make money. Winning rings is just a byproduct of that. And I think people like yourself are going to get a harsh lesson of that reality in this market when the Indians get a package of low end garbage for Lindor because they have zero leverage and the entire baseball world knows this.
Fairly certain teams being good = more revenue. More fans in seats per game. More media coverage. Possibly more games with playoffs. An exciting environment for the next year with anticipation, etc.
Very possible playoffs or possible world series could offset an expensive player year
You’re absolutely right. But that’s exactly my point. Current fans in the seats = None. Teams can’t establish a budget and therefore spend money if they don’t know if they’ll have fans in the seats next year. Reports say most teams lost over 100 million each due to lack of fans. That’s an entire years of budget for most teams and they still don’t know if they’ll have fans in the ballparks next year. Which is why I don’t think you’ll see most teams make moves until well after December when they have some clarity on that front. So Indians might be in trouble in this case. I hope they get a ton for Lindor, I really do. But basic economics and reasoning here says that they won’t. Why offer top prospects when the only choice Indians have is to either trade him or cut him? They literally can’t afford to keep him next year.
Yeah, its not like they just waived Hand or something.
There are other Brad Hand’s on the market.
There are no other Francisco Lindor’s on the market.
Didi Gregorius, Marcus Semien, Ha-Seong Kim don’t move the needle as much as Lindor.
Hendriks, Rosenthal etc likely sucked any trade value Hand may have had at this time. Treinen, Petit, Soria, Mcgee etc. Missed window. Hindsight says they should’ve traded Hand when they traded Clevinger. Playoff race though, that’s a tricky one.
A team on a budget is probably going to go cheap in the bullpen before anywhere else. Clase should be back and Karinchak is probably ready to close. I don’t follow them closely enough to know off hand, and doesn’t seem important enough to check right now, but I’d expect a bit of logjam in the rotation will beef up the bullpen options if Bieber/Carrasco/Plesac/Civale/Mckenzie can stick as a starting unit. Much like the Dodgers have done with May/Urias, Cleveland should be able to internally fill their pitching staff for a while still.
A few months of Machado still got the Orioles a return. A couple months of injured Donaldson even got the Jays a minor return. Cutting Lindor to save $20 million isn’t urgent. They can trade him midseason and save $10mill, and non-tender/trade Carrasco, Hedges, Deshields, Naguin, Wittgren if they’re penny pinching like that. Cut Lindor isn’t the only option to save money. Easiest path for sure.
Why not just wait another year and not surrender prospects to get him? Would make more sense to just wait the extra year so you don’t have to give up any prospects.
Lindor isn’t putting the Marlins into the playoffs and he isn’t staying with them. Why would the Marlins make a play for him for the price tag he’s going to cost in prospects?
Marlins need to stay the course with the rebuild. If they want to make a play for him in free agency, that’s different, but that isn’t likely either. They’re more likely to save their money to sign Brian Anderson long term, and eventually their pitchers.
Also, considering the lack of certainty with their catching and Alfaro’s development, I wouldn’t go to sleep on the Marlins trying to bring JT Realmuto back. We forget that the only reason we traded him was because he refused to sign the mega extension we offered him, and forced our hand. They haven’t spent that money or the money from moving Yelich on anyone else. We also clear the contract for Chen finally. That money will be spent at some point. I doubt it’ll be on Lindor, but I could see on someone else like a Realmuto reunion.
I see Lindor and Trevor Bauer going to the Mets.
Also when looking at the Indians young lineup please don’t be surprised to see a Ramirez blockbuster trade. He is the most desirable chip in baseball with a 3 year 33 million dollar contract!
Cleveland is not trading Jose Ramirez.
To the Cardinals
I think the Indians will regret not trading Lindor last off season. I understand they believe they could win on 2020 but the market was much stronger for him last year.
they will regret trading him period. with all the money they saved on Clev, Kluber, and Bauer they should be able to sign Lindor. dumping Lindor could be what makes the fanbase nevet forgive them. he’s a huge fan draw and that’s not easy to replace.
Cleveland was 22nd in attendance in 2019. They went to the WS in 2016, and drew less than 1.6M. They have no fanbase.
Joe you are spot on here. When you win and you can’t fill the stadium that’s a pretty strong indication you don’t have a big fan base. Wouldn’t call myself a fan but I like the Indians and if I were a fan I’d be pretty thankful to have a front office that knows how to turn over the roster constantly to remain competitive. It’s extremely difficult to trade away your top talent and get the right prospects into your system and groom them to take their place. They don’t want to move Lindor but they have to. I don’t know why it’s not clear to some fans that the Indians are a small market baseball team and need to operate as such. They aren’t quite TB small market but small market all the same. Sinking 30m a year into any one player with perhaps the exception of Trout or Betts is a bad allocation of assets. You shed the last year of arbitration(which is a substantial figure even if it’s one year)and get a nice haul of young talent. Again, not because you want to but because you have to
Lindor is (was) a fan draw. However, he has NO intention in staying with the team. True team fans root for the team year in & year out. Players, mgr’s, FO’s come & go. Every once in a while, you’re going to find a player & team be able to work with each other for their MUTUAL benefit for the players entire career. Unfortunately, that’s not very common anymore but it does happen.
They missed on trading Kluber, Bauer and Lindor bc they were winning. It was not a mistake by any means, They had winning teams with a window of contention,
Crazy Prediciton: Cardinals finally make a move for a bat. DeJong to second to compensate for Wong’s departure. Probably won’t happen, but it’d be a good fit in my eyes.
Finally? Didn’t they trade and sign Goldschmidt? Didn’t they have a deal in place for Stanton that he declined? In my opinion we are becoming a spoiled fan base. Has the FO made some bad signings the past 3-4 years? Yes. But they continue to draft and develop and remain competitive. I’ll go on record as being a fan of the signing of Fowler at the time. He was mashing and played solid defense and at the time the Cardinals were very flawed on defense. It hasn’t worked out boohoo. Carpenter while flawed in some areas had been killing the ball and had an eye at the plate that would rival any umpire in baseball. He fell off when he was entering his prime age. Cecil was an overpay but a solid lefty who just collapsed. Baseball is so unpredictable from year to year. You can make all the right moves and have it blow up in your face. If I’m disappointed in anything with the Cardinals of late it’s seeing them trade the wrong guys from their system. Someone on the lower level isn’t evaluating the talent in the minors properly. I do think the Cards need at least one more big bat but I wouldn’t say finally.
The problem with the Indians is they’re always in contention for the playoffs, but ownership will neither commit to going all in, nor commit to a rebuild to add mountains of talent. It’s one or two trades of top guys every year, raise up the talent they get in those trades, and keep on the same pace as prior years. I hope they do commit to a rebuild. Trading Bieber, J-Ram, and Lindor could stock them for a terrific run a few years from now.
That is always an issue for small market teams. But for the most part, Cleveland hasn’t missed any of the talent that left.
Just as a discussion point, starting with the 2016 WS, I think the only player they’d like to have kept, even in retrospect, would be Brantley. Certainly not Kluber or Allen, probably not Miller. Maybe Bauer, but they got a good haul for him, and still don’t lack SPs. And I’d guess that they are really happy with how the Clevinger deal worked out.
Adames and Nate Lowe for Lindor, PLEASE. Wander will be ready for SS in 2022
Wander being ready doesn’t mean you give away other players. Adames has exactly the same WAR as Lindor has over the past two years. But he has 4 years left, while Lindor has only one, and Lindor is $20M more expensive.
so you think adames and lindor are the same player?
For the same salary, and the same years of control, I would take Lindor.
If I had to pay another $22M for Lindor, I would take Adames, and then add Springer with the $22M.
If I had a choice between 4 years of Adames or one year of Lindor, I would take four years of Adames.
It is straight forward math, imo.
consulting with his colleagues who cover many prospective trade partners for the Indians.
The problem with these columns, and trade columns in general, is that they make it sound like there is a more robust market than there really is.
The first issue is that a lot of teams have SS’s. A lot not as good, but not so much better that an acquiring team would surrender prospects AND salary for the upgrade. That’s maybe 16 teams.
Then you have to add in another 5 teams that simply are not competitive, and certainly aren’t trading for a one-year upgrade.
Add to that 2 teams that have good prospects at SS, that will likely want to see develop, two teams that lack the payroll, and one team with a mediocre SS, but that is under contract.
That’s 26 teams that won’t be trading for Lindor. The market just isn’t there. I think the realistic market is just Cincy and the Yankees. And Didi and Simmons are still are still out there.
Even last year, with Betts being the second best player in BB, there were probably only two teams really interested.
Padres, Braves and Dodgers were all interested in Mookie. Possibly others.
Braves were a fit, but I don’t remember many rumors. Their play for Ozuna made a lot more sense.
I would love to see Lindor in a Braves uniform so I would to see the Braves get Carlos Carrasco Francisco Lindor Cal Quantrill and Josh Naylor for
Touki Toussaint Sean Newcomb Dansby Swanson and Ender Inciarte
ncbravesfan95, Why would Cleveland do that? There is not one Brave player in this trade that is better than the Indians in this trade proposal.
Only two teams being interested in Mookie as a free agent is ludicrous
It is not ridiculous. It is entirely logical.
1-Automatically take off all the non-contenders (11)
2-Take off all the contenders that are small market teams (6).
3-Take off the RS & NYY (2).
4-Take off the teams with poor farm systems (2).
Now you are down to 9 teams. Atlanta & Houston don’t generally trade highly-ranked prospects. Philly already had Harper. The NYMs had OFs, and specifically RFs. The Reds had already signed Castellanos & Akiyama.
It isn’t easy to find targets for a $30M player with one year remaining. 30 teams would love to have him. The number of teams where he is a good fit are extremely low.
I agree with most of your points. However, you have a potential 6 war player here. This is not Adames, Lindor is not Iglesious. He is a potential hall of famer.
I wonder to whom though? I saw a really good proposal above of Lindor to the Rays for Adames and Nate Lowe. I would add Honeywell to that deal just as a “lottery” piece, but I like that trade if the Rays want to pony that up.
Trading controlled assets for expensive rentals is not how the Rays operate. Regardless of the fact that they are legitimate contenders.
Two games away from their 1st World Series title means it would be in the Rays best interest to look at Lindor. Additionally they have the #1 prospect who happens to be a SS waiting to take over after Lindor leaves if they were to get him.
Adames, a bullpen arm and an OF not named Arozarena might get it done. If not, replace the bullpen arm for a young prospect arm.
Adames, Renfroe, and N. Lowe
They were two games away from the WS because Adames was really good for them.
Don’t put Adames in the same league as Lindor. It’s wrong, unfair and a little insulting. Lindor works on a higher level than Adames.
Adames had a higher WAR last year.
Adames had an identical WAR over the past two seasons.
The point isn’t so much to say that Adames is as good, but if TB is giving up four years of Adames, for one year of Lindor, then the case has to be made that Lindor is much, much better than Adames. If they both have an identical WAR over the past two years, then I’d need some compelling evidence to make that trade.
Or, even forgetting the service time, which we can’t, if Lindor costs $22M next year, then the monetary alternative is Adames + Springer. I see no way suggest Lindor is worth as much as Adames + Springer.
You’re flat out wrong about WAR. Are you just pulling stuff out of your ass?
Fact check (Fangraphs): Adames’ WAR in 2019 = 2.8 Adames WAR in 2020 = 1.5
Lindor WAR in 2019 = 4.4, Lindor WAR in 2020 1.7…
I should have said that my source was Baseball Reference, and not FG. They are generally close, so i am surprised they are that far apart. The offense is close enough, but FG gives Lindor a significant edge in fielding.
I can’t argue that point either way. FG says they have 13 & 14 DRS over the past two years. The fielding Bible for 2020 ranks Lindor #6 and Adames #8.
You can interpret this anyway you want,but I’d be ver surprised if the next four year’s worth of WAR for Adames is not significantly higher than Lindor’s will be next year.
Wander Franco takes over at SS in 2022. That’s the whole point. Cash in a title now (2021), the future takes over. Lindor is the superior SS. You helped proved that. Franco is supposed to be the superior SS of the future. There is your answer.
What leads you to believe that the Rays would make such a deal? In fact, they are the team that trades a player to maximize the return putting them in the position they are in.
If Rays don’t get a big bat then I see them disappearing again.
Why a trade to angels makes sense.
1. Clear need at short stop so they don’t need to move fletcher over.
2. Have multiple outfield prospects to deal to a team like indians.
3. Have cap space to extend lindor after this season.
They could do either of these trades for lindor
Indians recieve: Justin upton, jo adell
Angels recieve: Fransisco lindor
Angels could retain some of uptons contract next year once pujols deal is off books. Only 2 years remaining. Upton could be the stability indians haven’t had since Brantley left. Upton has all star upside and if angels are paying some of the contract even if he underperforms he’s there for only 2 more seasons at a reduced rate. Then they get adell who’s projected to be the next big thing outfielder at only 22 years old.
Indians recieve: jordyn Adams, Livan Soto, Taylor ward
Angels recieve: fransisco lindor
This route they get young outfielder and 2 young prospects at premium positions in deal. Adams has huge upside still raw and a ways away and soto has the potential to hit for average will great glove and arm.
No chance the Indians take on Upton’s contract.
I’ll say it again, Upton has a NTC, Indians aren’t taking a bad contract back for Lindor as it defeats the purpose of trading him and having the cap space to sign him is a reason against trading for Lindor, not for it.
They need everyday outfielders not fringe 4th outfielders. If angels retain some salary it’s possible. Also don’t think lindor get adell by himself so essentially indians are buying out uptons contract to take adell who’s cheap and cost controlled. Bottomline indians get potential 2 all stars for lindor who’s leaving after 1 more season.
But how does that solve the issue of payroll being too high? (Which is why they are trading Lindor in the first place)
They are trading him because they can’t afford to resign him to extension. Don’t want to spend 300 million +
No one thinks he’s signing an extension. You could just as easily say the Angels shouldn’t trade for him because he’s a FA in one year and they can probably afford to sign him then. Having Lindor and Adell will always beat having just Lindor.
Personally think marsh is better, not as high on adell personally.
There is no way Upton waives his No Trade Contact to move to Cleveland.
There is no way the Indians would take on his salary. And Adell will not be included in a trade that only nets a player for one year.
Did you notice how you sold hard on Upton but not Adell? Funny, right? Yes, the Indians need a regular outfielder but right now, Upton looks like a 4th outfielder himself who is way to expensive. With or without the NTC, I can’t see the Indians doing this.
The second package just lacks the star power you needed that Adell gave you. It’s just that Upton dragged down the value of Adell.
And yet, the Angels will still lose when their need is pitching!
“Some” of Upton’s contract?
I get why Angels fans want to move Upton, but it’s not happening.
Upton in heading into his age 33/34 season in 2021, with his last good season back in 2018. He’s owed $51M over the next two seasons. If the Angels paid down almost half, the Indians would still owe him $26M, or $13M average for a guy who may be done as an impact player. They’re not paying that.
There’s a scenario where the Indians might take Upton with half his remaining salary paid, but it will take more than Adell and $25M. Ignoring Upton’s NTC (why would he waive it to leave the Los Angeles for Cleveland?), the Angel’s best chance with Upton is to let him play and show 2019 and 2020 do not represent his true talent level. There is some chance that’s true. Only then does he become tradeable without paying down 2/3rds of the contract. That’s a mid-season or next offseason trade, and if he rebounds, the Angels simply keep him because, well, there is the NTC and they’re just as likely to keep him if he shows he’s good again.
If you’re trying to construct a salary dump deal, the Indians are not your team.
I believe it’s only one fan who is advocating trading Upton. And I don’t even know he’s an Angel fan.
What is with the visceral hate on this forum. Relax it’s just a concept an idea. Indians are more poised to compete than angels as currently constructed maybe winning would be more important to upton. Sorry for stepping out of the normal to create a potential trade I’ll be mindful going forward not everyone is capable of free thinking.
Ha.. Upton. Might as well throw in Pujols too.
lol Yes! I was thinking that cle may consider Upton and Hamilton contracts.
Mets match up so well with the Tribe. Get it done
To the Braves for Pache, we have Waters and AA loves 1 year deals. His $ replaces Ozuna $. Either he or Swanson to 3rd and Riley as 4th OF.
No thank you please, saying that as a Braves fan. One year of Lindor isn’t worth Pache. Or Waters. If he had 2 yrs left, then maybe. Moving a top prospect, shifting one of Swanson or Lindor to 3B, and then having to fill the 3B hole again next year minus a top OF prospect is a lot of running to get nowhere.
WTF are you high I would do Ender Touki Newcomb and Swanson for Lindor Carrasco Quantrill and Naylor. Platoon Naylor/Duvall in LF plug Carrasco into the starting rotation and Quantrill in to the bullpen
ncbravesfan 95. Why would Cleveland do your trade? Naylor more valuable than Inciarte. Carrasco and Quantrill more valuable than Touki and Newcomb. and Lindor is better than Swanson. No matter how many times you type this proposal, it makes no sense for the Indians.
I’d like to trade Camargo, Ender and Touki for Rafael Devers too if the other team couldn’t say no. Both teams have to be willing though, and they have to match up to an extent. Cleveland is going to want an OF. That’s going to be Pache or Waters. It’d probably take a strong 2nd piece then or something else, I don’t know. I just can’t see where Cleveland and Atlanta match, and why it makes sense for the Braves to give up a big package for a 1 yr rental that they’d have to pigeonhole someone into a different position for. Why not just get Bryant?
1- cleveland fans are going to be disappointed by the return.
2 – Mets should be all over this.
dave frost nhlpa
Lindor and Plasec for Andujar and Nelson.
All these other chump clubs can’t afford this.
So get out of the way.
Oh hey, I like smoking weed too.
Er, no. If you made that suggestion in a daze, then signed on the next morning to see a ludicrous suggestion like that, you would no longer like smoking weed.
As a diehard Yankee fan even I see this needs a bit more. I can see them going for Frazer, Andujar, and something else since the Indians want players they can put on the field today.
The question is should the Yankees do this? Are we better keeping Frazer and a pitcher such as Nelson? Perhaps Andujar can become a better outfielder. The issue is if the Yank give up these players they lose depth in the outfield when they have hurt players. Also, do the Yankees want a $300 million dollar Lindor when they have to think about Judge, Torres, bringing back DJ, and getting a starter or two. There are limits in other words. However, getting Lindor would mean they probably won’t resign DJ which would hurt the lineup.
I have seen fans of every team try to put together trade ideas for Lindor AND Plesac. That is not going to happen. Plesac is exactly the kind of player the Indians love and need: young, talented, cheap and with lots of control. He would cost a fortune in a trade. He is not a throw-in.
I am not a fan of the Yankees or Indians but I can see a trade happening there. Any trade would start with Clint Frazier. The Indians would not be interested in any 3B or DH types or any failed prospects or expensive or older players. They want a cheap, young OF who can hit. That is Clint Frazier. I can see a trade involving him and 1 prospect in the Yankees 4-10 range along with a flyer or 2 prospects in the 10-20 range. Possibly a little more if the Yankees get desperate.
I know Indians fans will want more and Yankees fans will want to pay less which is why I think this is what it will take.
Just like a Yankee fan. Thinking they can give a guy who couldn’t win back is 3B job and a middle reliever. For 2 studs. Please, You’re GM stuck with $270 mil of Stanton, will have to pay Judge soon. Need P big time. Please
Ducky Buckin Fent
Every team has fans that make the same type of ludicrous trade proposals.
But, scroll up. Yankee fans are letting him know this would never happen.
& I’m one more Yankee fan with a, “whoaa….c’mon, bro the Indians would never do that, bro”.
Sounds like a typical Mets fan….jealous and totally uninformed….you deserve your record!
There are ludicrous proposals up and down this thread from fans of all teams. Get your head on straight and be honest.
Lindor and Plesac for who? LMAO!
Cubs. Move Baez back to second.
We can eliminate the Braves from the list.
He is too expensive in money for them.
He is too expensive in prospects for them.
Why win the WS when you can keep hanging division titles?
You do realize only one team can win a World Series each year, and it isn’t easy? That’s not the only barometer of success.
When you go into every season calling yourselves contenders and then don’t address your flaws in the subsequent offseason….YES, that definitely plays a role in their fails. This team would have been in far better shape if they spend on pitching instead of relying on rookies and inconsistent vets.
What excuse do they have this offseason? Covid?
Get Bauer for 1 year to pair with Fried and Anderson. Fix third base instead of once again wishing Riley ever learns to hit. Sign Brantley.
Bring back Melacon and/or Greene.
The Braves simply don’t swim in those financial waters. The Braves have contended for 3 seasons and have not yet once went out and picked up any of the top 3 FA’s on the market. You already know the Braves aren’t going to go bet Bauer.
How does a so-called Braves fan forget about Soroka? He’s the best pitcher on the team.
The Braves got Donaldson and Ozuna in each of the last two off-seasons. Those were darned good FA signings. Why would you want a guy like Bauer who just his far-and-away career year for someone else? That would be a waste of resources. Good thing fans don’t make player personnel decisions. You sound like the Dodger fans who referred to Andrew Friedman as “Fraudman” because he didn’t trade Verdugo for Kluber. How did hanging onto Verdugo one more year turn out? As for the Braves, they are similar to the Dodgers in that they are set up to contend annually. I prefer that than these silly proposals concocted by beerbelly fans.
He’s gonna go to the Cards, book it
The Yankees don’t have the Balls to go all in for Lindor. Besides I doubt the Indians would take a package of Andujar, Sanchez, Florial, Voit, and two pitchers not named Garcia or Schmidt
Well, yeah, the Indians would do that deal. The Yankees don’t.
Ducky Buckin Fent
It’s actually an improvement over his, “Judge, Torres, & Sanchez for Lindor” take.
Cleveland values defense, especially at the catcher position. There is absolutely no chance that the Indians would have any interest in Gary Sanchez. Cleveland’s biggest need is OF help. Florial did not hit at high A in 2019 and is not mlb ready. Andujar has shown that he can not play outfield. Andujar is nothing more than a DH and the Indians are set at DH with Framil Reyes.
I just wish fans would look at the needs of the Indians before proposing their trades. It doesn’t take much to do that and it would make for a more interesting and worthwhile discussion.
Well, given all your posts, we can ascertain that at least us Yankee fans have “balls”! Which you possibly/probably don’t!
The Yankees are so far over these ridiculous multiple player deals for 1 guy……Cashman just doesn’t do that any longer especially for potentially 1 year of Lindor!
Blake Swihart and Rob Refsynder for Lindor
Get it done
Rock7, It takes nothing at all, but a waste of time for fans of any team to make ridiculous proposals that would never have a chance of happening. All of your usual proposals do not look at the needs of the Cleveland Indians. It is very obvious that the Indians would want no part of Gary Sanchez. It is very obvious that the Indians need OF help., It is very obvious that Miquel Andujar is not an outfielder. It is obvious the the Indians have a strong front office as they have been the winningest team in the AL since the start of 2013 on a small market budget. It is obvious that they are not going to trade for players that do not fit their needs and match their philosophies.
I am sorry that you can’t discuss baseball without your middle school comments. Grow up!
Mariners are the dark horse. Crawford/prospects to Cleveland for Lindor pending trade + extension. Ms have the #3 farm and are deep at all positions right now.
It is obvious the Baseball owners are screaming their broke with 2 loaves under their arms! 8.6 billion just for the playoff games, 9 Billions more for Streaming and regular season cable rights! Open your books instead of suppressing your income!
Love how you said, appropriately, “your income” because it is, well, theirs. They pay a lot more than just player salaries too. But I get your point, and I think with the right motivation it would happen. That motivation would be, ridding MLB of the luxury tax.
Should have traded him last year. They obviously weren’t going to re-sign him.
Typical. Lindor doesn’t understand finances and thinks he’s deserving of a percentage of revenue. Good luck bud. Should of taken that extension.
I think Lindor will be just fine when he hits free agency.
Lindor for Tatis done deal
Tatis is better now and controlled 3 years longer…
@Ducky I would still trade Judge. He’s way too injury prone and they are stuck with Stanton who’s the same type of player.
You really don’t think that trade proposal was intended as a joke?
Mets would be a great landing spot. They have the flexibility to take on 20 mil and sign him to an extension if they wanted to, even though I’m sure they want to move cautiously financially going forward but they got Rosario to spare, who is still cost controlled throw in Davis, zsapucki, vientos. I think that’s a solid package
The problem with your suggestion, and about half the suggestions in here, is that you are addressing a problem that doesn’t exist, and then ignoring other issues that do exist.
Shortstop is not a problem for the Mets. You have a highly-rated prospect in Gimenez, who performed fairly well last year.
And you have a pitching rotation that ranked 13th in the NL. They have DeGrom, then a sophomre in Peterson, who might be okay, then TJS returnee in Syndergaard, and then no one.
And you don’t have a catcher.
But you want to spend salary and prospects for an unnecessary upgrade at SS.
You have Shiny Object Syndrome (SOS).
agree but my thinking is gimenez shifting over to 2nd. increasing the defense overall is what need to do and Cano at 2nd is not getting it done, if we can upgrade the offence while we’re at it I say why not. not to mention if we could get him for less prospect wise than what we normally would in a regular season especially after a down year I’m all for it
Jays…Bauer and Lindor
Bauer and Arenado sounds so much better. Forget Lindor.
As a Red Sox fan, would love to see Frankie at SS and slide Boggy over to 2b.
Realistically. Mets, Yankees, Angels all make sense and have the coin to extend him. I can see Cohen making a huge splash this year. Trade for Lindor, plus sign Realmuto and Springer. Damn!
When did Cleveland move to Florida? They’re being as cheap as the Rays and Marlins.
Did you people not see what Red Sox got for Betts?
Some of these proposals are outrageous
Also, he’s not going to the Angels or the Padres.
Lindor at one year I think nets you something along these lines
Dodgers: May or Gonsolin and couple or maybe 3 lower level guys
Cardinals – MAYBE Carlson and Liberatore straight up but more likely one of the 2 and a few lower level guys
I like the Brewers, Blue Jays to try and get in on this deal
The Red Sox got rid of part of Price’s contract, a former top 25 prospect in Alex Verdugo, a top 50 prospect in Downs, and another prospect. I would love a Verdugo type player in a package for Lindor.
I’m a RS fan. My perspective was that, even though I wanted more, I’d have been fine with just getting back Verdugo in a trade. It wasn’t just the prospect status, but he had a 3.2bWAR in about half a season with LA. And he has continued that in 2020 with a ~ 5.5 WAR/650 in both 2019 and 2020.
Five years of that is really worth more than one year of any player.
Gonsolin maybe but not May. May is going to be elite.
If the interest to get an MLB ready catcher is of key value to Cleveland, then Ruiz could make a nice piece in a Dodger package. If not, Rios or Lux could also be solid pieces. Dodgers definitely have a lot of pieces to work with if they wanted to go that route.
Have been thinking about the Betts and Goldschmidt trades as comparisons.
The Covid fanless market factor is a huge wild card though.
Many, many, many Jays fans are getting in on the excitement around Lindor.
I’d personally rather see a run at Ha-Seong Kim the more I look at the FA market for infield depth. The option of adding to the offense without giving up talent has more appeal to my brain. My gut wants to see a splash.
One of the more reasonable comments that I’ve seen was a Cleveland fan mentioning they would be mostly in need of depth at C/OF. This does seem to make the Jays a potential fit. Previous comment from a different Cleveland fan was adamant they don’t need catching depth though.
Jansen was a GG candidate in 2019 that had a poor season in 2020 with a 2HR in 2 playoff game sendoff to avoid a completely sour season.
Or McGuire has some potential still, doubtful any trade value.
Kirk could make a solid pairing with Perez, but if Cleveland values defense, they’d likely want Jansen more.
Grichuk owed $31m over next 3 years, Gurriel owed $15m over next 3 and Teoscar is A1/A2/A3 and would likely earn closer to $30m if he hits the way a team trading for him would want him to hit.
Jansen/Teoscar plus a younger wild card prospect or some combination of a compensation round pick/international signing money if the Goldschmidt trade was a bit of a blueprint.
A poor man’s version of the Betts deal could include Roark going to Cleveland in exchange for an improved add-on portion of the deal.
Lindor was barely replacement level last year
He’s not getting Dustin May, Tony Gonsolin or any other mlb player with 5 years of control who’s worth a damn
I think Indians fans might be disappointed with the return. Remember, it’s only for one season, and who knows how long that season is going to be. Plus, Lindor is coming off a down “year”, and he’s expensive.
But will Indians fans be more disappointed if he walks into FA for nothing.
yes. yes we will
What about Lindor for Torres provided the Yankees can have 48 hours to sign Lindor?
Baseball doesn’t do those windows.
Yes they do. Most recently with Sonny Gray when he was traded to Cincinnati. Also R.A. Dickey when he went to Toronto and Adrian Gonzalez when he went to Boston.
Although if I’m the Yankees I’m keeping Torres and just going after Lindor in FA next year.
Reds maybe? Aquino, India and Garcia
Giving away to much for one year
Wildcard braves come out of no where, get this deal done lol…. I know, I got jokes! I’m here all week folks
If the Jays are going to part with their top prospects it should be for Arenado and absolutely not Lindor. And they must have an understanding he isn’t going to opt out after 2021.
Arenado fills a bigger need and Colorado is in the National League which alleviate the direct damage players going there could do to the Jays.
Look at the Donaldson trade as a comparable. Sure, the A’s were in the AL and Donaldson wasn’t as financially costly as Arenado but acquiring a top shelf third baseman got them over the hump into back to back ALCS.
There was a top shelf shortstop and LHP added as well. You could say the Jays need both PLUS that ace pitcher as well.
Arenado and a full year of Bauer gets them in the postseason if the core continues to grow. They could always had pieces at the deadline like they did before.
In the postseason and in the ALCS are not exciting anymore. World Series or bust!
Small need for Arenado. He’s hardly worth $35m a year playing in a hitter’s haven.
He hits worse than average on the road.
The glove translates but does the bat?
Much like Lemahieu, the value exists mainly because of the environment he is lucky enough to play in.
If Senzatela or Freeland are included then it starts to get tempting.
Big need for Bauer. Some Jays fans were not very nice to him in past ALCS meeting. I’ll be more shocked than when I found out Vernon Wells was traded.
Lot of good alternative arms available. Need to add 3 better than Roark options.
Lindor having minimal interest and valued as a rental might change things, but surveying the comments suggest there will be plenty of interest where I think he’ll bring a similar haul to what Goldschmidt received.
The return is not going to be very good, so they should keep him and try for another postseason with the star that all fans love and not going to be able to have one for a long time and have the QO, or a better offer than what they are going to get now at trade DL.
Unless they do get something that justifies the loose of the star in a contending year.
The return is going to be incredibly good.
Arenado > Lindor
Cardinals send Dejong, knizner, Carlos Martinez and $5m?
C’mon TradeRumors, do that cute little graphic where you put the Yankee uniform on Lindor! #12 is available, nobody will be offended and you’ll be ahead of the game.
Lindor for……. Schmidt, Frazier, Garcia and Wade (Or anyone else not named Jason Dominguez)?
Keep Wade.. he has no value… Both Schmidt and Garcia would be less than the Indians 12th pitching prospects with Garcia being especially useless.. Little guys like that don’t survive in MLB as starters.. The only way a deal like this would be considered would be if three fourths of the deal was a flip to someone else..
I am pretty sure the Orioles would welcome these two low quality pitchers onto their major league staff.. the Indians won’t..
Clint Frazier.. the Indians would welcome the return..
Otherwise..this is a lousy and typical yankee fanboy deal..
Different take – There’s no way the Yankees would offer that much for 1 year of Lindor. If Cleveland got that offer, I think they’d take it unless they were really negative on Garcia and/or Schmidt.
Tribe would rather not trade Lindor to an American league team unless they are overwhelmed and can’t say no.
Gson, you say for one year of Lindor that is a typical fanboy deal? Can you overvalue your underperforming team any more? Or, are you just happy slinging mud whilst your team does the same on the field and gets beat… every….single….year….
Plus, I bet you said the same for Cleveland’s other recent trade and if that’s their metric for trades… you’ll get a hotdog vendor and an autographed baseball from #28
NO! Not for 1 year of Lindor. I don’t care if Cleveland would require that much it’s not worth it. Yanks need Schmidt and Garcia, even Frazier. They don’t need Lindor. Just pay DJ.
They want Lindor. Although, I don’t think they should, they will, just like with Stanton. And that’s who I see them giving up, or some combination thereof.
They’re better off aggressively pursuing pitching and catching and acquiring a FA SS over the next two years. Gleyber isn’t a ss, as much as it pains me to say.
Trade him to the cardinals. Cards give up Nolan Gorman, Lane Thomas or Justin Williams and a lower level lottery ticket pitching prospect. Then slide Dejong to 3rd.
Someone please control Arte
Lindor to the Mets might fit. For some reason, the team isn’t thrilled with Rosario. He gets better every year and NY bashes him. They have one of their top prospects in the wings who can also play other positions.
Mets also (surprisingly) need arms and a true centerfielder. Mallex Smith is a nice roster add, but not he’s not a 600 at bat guy anymore unless he’s hitting 9th.
Lindor to the Mets might fit. For some reason, the team isn’t thrilled with Rosario. He gets better every year and NY bashes him. They have one of their top prospects in the wings who can also play other positions.
Actually, Rosario didn’t really get better every year, since he had an awful year last year.
And the fact that they already have two alternatives for SS, plus Cano, plus McNeil, plus Davis, who can all play the infield, makes Lindor a bad fit.
Just noticed the part in the article about the Indians having a $50 million payroll in 2021 after trading Lindor.
That is insane considering they get revenue sharing and every team will see an increase of $70 million in 2021 from new national TV deals.
There would be holes to fill!! Considering the pitching and JRam, I’d still expect they put about $20m to fill the rest of the holes. Though using cheap talent worked pretty well for the Rays and may tempt more teams to go that route.
So on top of the $50 million the article says they will have in payroll, they will have an $80-$100 million to spend to fill holes before you even get to having fans in the stands and that adds another $30 million even with the meager amount of fans the Indians draw each year.
To get Lindor its going to take a top 50, MLB ready prospect plus another top 100 prospect.
It’s going to take whatever the highest bidder says it’s going to take.
That is what it has taken in previous years to get the top trade target that had 1 year of team control left. It will take a similar amount this season no matter what snarky comments you want to make.
Ain’t nothing snarky about the truth chief. We’ll see what gets offered but based on this article it doesn’t sound like the Indians are willing to just hold onto him if they don’t get what you are suggesting. If you know the other side isn’t going to walk away from the table, you are naturally not going to bring your best to the table.
You’re gonna be disappointed
He was horrible last year and is expensive. He’s not signing an extension unless you give him 300M. He’ll be lucky to get a single top 100 prospect
Yolk’s on you…
Laugh at Lindor in his first language at least.
Some adventurous GM is going to look into his performance prior to 2020 and decide he might be worth a chance.
If Wil Myers can find it again, there is hope for Lindor.
18 SS qualified last year, and Lindor barely outplayed 3 of them to sit middle of the pack in his only horrible season. That seems like 12 teams that wish their SS would give more ABs and 3 that wish theirs could improve to the horrible range. And 7 or 8 that wonder if they should try to buy low on this stud.
The Covid factor makes it tough to compare to previous years so you very well could have nailed it here.
Bold to come off so arrogant about it. .
One less ‘ha’ may have been the smarter call.
Mets are gonna try to win the offseason.
Lindor would be a good start.
Won’t cost them a top 100 prospect, but a former top 100 prospect still stings.
Make it 2 former top 100 and a current lotto prospect to convince Cleveland to include an expensive Carrasco or a boneheaded Plesac.
Gimenez + Smith + ?, or Rosario + Alonso + ? is very tempting if I’m a GM that is cutting payroll and trying to stay competitive..
A heee heeeee.
@Laughing@you. You are now in the lead for the dumbest post I’ve ever read. Not getting a single top 100 prospect you say? Well, while I’mlaughing@you I give you Yusniel Diaz for half a season of Machado. I give you Alex Verdugo for 1 yr of Betts(who was then extended prior to hitting FA). The Diamondbacks got Weaver and Kelly for Goldschmidt and his 1 yr of control. I don’t think that there has ever been a trade for a top player in MLB without including at least 1 top 100 prospect. Basically, you have no idea what you’re talking about.
To the White Sox. Injubs take Danny Mendick, Leury Garcia and a reliever to replace Hand.
Clearly, some here need a dose of reality. You’re not getting the best SS in the league for your castoffs. Think close to the Betts deal and the Indians aren’t looking to offload a contract burden(Price) with Lindor. Whoever trades for Lindor is also gaining an inside track to an extension or the QO for which they’ll either gain his services for another year or receive draft pick compensation. If you’re trade idea doesn’t give you pause then it’s not good enough.
To my fellow Indians fans. We’re not getting 4 mlb ready, top 100 prospects. I’m expecting a player like Frazier, Senzel, or Riley along with 2 prospects, one of which being highly rated.
Okay final offer for Lindor take it or leave it. Sanchez, Andujar, Voit, Estrada, and two pitching prospects not Garcia or Schmidt. The Yankees then need to sign McCann as catcher not JT. I also don’t know if DJ would even move to first base permanently. I personally love Wade speed off the bench that’s why Estrada is included as the SS to replace Lindor
Sorry forgot Yankees should be gold glove third baseman Ushela after Frazier
The Indians will leave it mlbnyyfan. The Indians would never roster Gary Sanchez. Cleveland values defense, especially at the catcher position. Andujar can’t play defense and is nothing more than a DH. Cleveland already has a solid DH in Framil Reyes. The Indians have some options for 1B and need an outfielder more.
You refuse to look at this from the Cleveland perspective. Why would they trade Lindor for players that they don’t need and would not roster?
Cleveland moved Victor and Santana out from behind the plate in the past. What if the Yankees threw in a whole lot of money?
Do Sanchez or Reyes seem like they could handle 1B?
Sanchez looked lost at the plate in 2020, still a pass I bet. Maybe getting catching off his mind would help him?
Cleveland has 1B options to try. Cleveland values defense. They are not going to put an inexperienced player at 1B. Besides,Sanchez’s bat also leaves a lot to be desired. Again, Cleveland will not want Gary Sanchez
Nope.. Cashman stands pat again. lol
Trading for Lindor doesn’t give them the inside track to anything!
It absolutely gives them the ability to negotiate an extension before any team can construct a FA offer. WTF are you talking about? It’s an inside track and I never insinuated that it’s a lock to extend him if you trade for him.
hockeyjoh hit the nail on the head. The Indians will not be interested in Sanchez due to his defensive inabilities that they so highly value. However, I cannot agree that Andujar has no defensive value at this time. From what I gather he is doing well in his LF efforts and looks to possibly be at least average.
If you had been paying attention you’d know that Lindor intends to test the open market.
I was able to watch two games where Andujar played LF. In the one game he committed a two base error on an easy ground ball single. In the other, he played an easy fly ball out into a triple. That is 2 games out of the 7 total games that he played in LF in 2020. He is not an outfielder and I have little faith that he can improve.
That is nothing but speculation on your part based on Lindor not accepting the offer Cleveland extended. If it were close to what he thought he could get then he would have signed. In this uncertain time, players better accept the first decent offer they get or they could be on the outside looking in.
@cdav45 Mookie Betts shows that the top of the top guys will still get paid, pandemic notwithstanding. Lindor will be fine.
I bet he gets traded to Miami, as an Indians fan I’m super bummed by this but not surprised either.
Ok here idea I know all knocked but here is idea for three team trade braves , Indians. And pirates
3b Austin Riley
1b Josh Naylor
14 prospect Lf Greyson Jenista
12 prospect of Micheal Hayes
11 Prospect Rp Freddy Tanorak
4 prospect C Bo Naylor
15 prospect LP Jose Cantillo
1b Josh Bell
Rp Luke Jackson
RF Gregoria Polanco
Lf Adam Duvall
Cf Ender Inciarte
21 C Alex Jackson
14 Patrick Weigal
Rp Carlson Fullmer
Rp Nick Burdi
Of Bradley Zimmer
So Joe Musgrove
SS Francisco Linder
Cleveland would absolutely have no interest in this. They are not going to take on 4 high priced, short term control players at a 2020 cost of over 34 million. Also, defense is a weakness for catcher Alex Jackson so he would not fit the type of catcher that the Indians would be interested in.
This is already the worst thread I have ever read for trade proposals. 25% want to give the Indians nic-naks, 25% want to give the Indians 2-3 top prospects, 25% want their team to acquire Lindor, and then move him to a different position, and 25% want to acquire him and move their SS to a different position.
I assumed that cjh815 is a Pirate’s fan since that would be a helluva deal for them. You just can’t fix it when it comes to these trade ideas.
Put down the pipe……NOW!!
1b Josh Bell
Rp Luke Jackson
RF Gregoria Polanco
Lf Adam Duvall
Cf Ender Inciarte
21 C Alex Jackson
14 Patrick Weigal
Just adding up the payroll, and it looks like you want the Indians to pick up ~ $36.7M in payroll, and the combined 2020 bWAR for that $36.7M is -2.7? And all they need to do is to give up a couple of prospects for the right to obtain the -2.7 WAR and $36.7M?
There is basically nothing whatsoever in this trade that benefits Cleveland. The trade value for each of the players you mentioned is likely -0- or lower. Except for the fact that Polanco and Inciarte are both locked into a contract, everyone on your list might be non-tendered.
Free Chris Antonetti! Fuck the Dolan family, now and forever.
This is a really tough situation for the Indians. If I were them, I would probably (at least privately) be regretting that I didn’t deal him last off-season. They had their good reasons for not going that route, but now find themselves in a situation where it is going to be almost impossible for them to get a lot for Lindor. Getting a “haul” is basically out of the question.
That’s because teams with a current hole at SS have other good FA options or could very legitimately decide (in this uncertain economic climate) that Lindor for one year is simply not worth the $20M he will cost. I think it’s highly unlikely that Lindor will sign an immediate extension. He’s given every indication that he wants to go through the FA process to maximize his value on the open market. One thought: Might teams also be hesitant to bring on a guy–a guy who actually didn’t handle the pressure last year very well–for just one year, with the fear that he might be a less than positive clubhouse presence?
So, I’m afraid that there will be VERY few potential trade partners. You only need one, but even that one or two/three is likely not going to deliver them a big haul. Maybe one top prospect OR one current good up-and-coming MLB-level player, and another 2-3 very young wildcard-type prospects…
Also, this situation has absolutely nothing to do with whether their owner, Paul Dolan, is or is not “cheap.”
Lindor is just doing what all MLB players are allowed and encouraged by their union to do: maximize their value on the open market. The choice to become a free agent is 100% in the control of the player and not in the control of the owner. Thus, Lindor has been looking forward to this situation for years. He knows that there is a potential big payday out there for him. For better or worse, it’s the system they all work in.
At least on this issue, the ever-present “Dolan is cheap” crowd seems to not know what they are talking about…
Not a clever name
Depending on the ask this could be an intriguing possibility for SF. The Dodgers having just won a WS and the Padres knocking on the door, the Giants may want to “appear” competitive to get folks back in the stands once Covid restrictions are lifted. If Crawford is traded to NY, a one year upgrade to Lindor giving an extra year to Marco Luciano might make sense. Depends on what they have to give up if anything and if the stats folks think the value of added fans is equal or greater to the amount of salary (likely all) they would have to take on from Luciano. I think it’s likely they spend the open payroll on pitching if at all, but this could be a great way to generate excitement among the fan base and the Giants have been known to make short term moves for this reason when it won’t get them to the postseason, such as Carlos Beltran.
Why would NY want Crawford?
Not a clever name
There’s a theory out there that is the case, like all off season rumors who knows how certain that is.
He grades well based on what? The old eye test? Fangraphs, baseball reference and baseball Savant aren’t high on him in right. And even worse in center. He’s just not that great a defensive player.
If Grichuk was a passable fielder in center I don’t think the Jays would have experimented with Hernandez in center field.