The Pirates sent Jameson Taillon to the Yankees this morning, making him the second starting pitcher the Bucs have moved this offseason (after Joe Musgrove). In addition to Musgrove and Taillon, Pittsburgh sent first baseman Josh Bell to the Nationals earlier this winter.
Today’s trade could mark the end of Pittsburgh’s teardown of the MLB roster for this offseason. General manager Ben Cherington told reporters (including Rob Biertempfel of the Athletic) that the Pirates’ front office will now “likely shift our energy back toward adding to the team,” although he cautioned they’ll “definitely keep the phone on” if rival teams call on their remaining big leaguers. Specifically, picking up a veteran starter is now a priority, Cherington said.
Presumably, that’d be a lower-cost addition. The Pirates perennially run one of the league’s lowest payrolls, and there’s no reason to expect any high-impact acquisitions at the start of a rebuild. Free agency offers a plethora of experienced starters coming off down or injury-plagued seasons. The opportunity to claim a regular rotation spot in a pitcher-friendly home park could appeal to any number of rebound candidates.
Cherington also noted that Miguel Yajure could compete for a rotation spot at some point in 2021 (via Biertempfel). Part of the four-player return for Taillon, the 22-year-old had an MLB cameo out of the Yankees’ bullpen last season.
He’s done a great job since taking over as GM. This team finally has direction. The current state of the org is much better than it was two years ago when there was zero direction and no farm system. They finally are willing to tear it down and rebuild and it’s a breath of fresh air to finally be getting back notable prospects instead of trades like the Gerrit Cole one. Pirates have one of the most improved farm systems in baseball. I really think this team could start seeing signs of life by 2022, maybe be a .500 team, make a wild card run in 2022 and potentailly the divsion and improve from there. Lots of young talent and a lot to be excited about imo.
He’s doing the best he can with both hands tied behind his back payroll-wise.
What’s it matter whether or not the payroll is below $50 million right now or not? The Pirates are going to lose a lot of games with or without a good payroll. They’ll start adding to it when we start seeing guys like Cruz, Bolton, Peguero, Martin, Gonzales, Thomas, Swaggerty and eventually Priester, Malone, Mlodzinski and the other notable prospects we got in the Taillon and Musgrove trades.
From 2015-2016, the Pirates had a payroll above $100 million and over $90 million in 2018. The problem was that Neal Huntington spent a good chunk of it on mediocer or borderline replacement level players like John Jaso, Daniel Hudson, Ivan Nova, Juan Nicasio, Ryan Vogelsong, Jon Niese, Wade LeBlanc, Neftali Feliz and so on.
It matters that MLB is allowing people to own MLB teams who have absolutely no intention of putting money into the on-field product.
Nutting was willing to put money into the product in 2015-2018. It all has to do where you spend the money. $100 million can look a lot different from team to team. In 2017, the Pirates had a similar opening day payroll to the Rockies and spent much more than the Diamondbacks. Difference was that the Pirates put their money toward John Jaso, Daniel Hudson, Jordy Mercer, Wade LeBlanc, Juan Nicasio and David Freese.
While that all might be true, the fans suffer because of cheap owners. If we really want fair equal competition we need teams to spend and put the best teams on the field. Gotta suck to be a pirates fan right now
@Tatsumaki — As a White Sox fan, despite the team not spending money and losing 89+ games each year from 2017-2019, I didn’t think it sucked. All of the prospects and an apparent plan for a solid window of contention after a few years of development had me more engaged than ever.
To be fair, I was hoping for a bit more improvement by 2019 and maybe wished that they had started spending some of the money they had saved by cutting payroll by then, but overall the rebuild years have been just fine for many fans. (I’m sure there are others who absolutely hated the 95-loss 2017 and 100-loss 2018 seasons, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time.)
If you just admitted that what he said is true, wouldn’t the problem be bad gms or overpriced mediocre players?
They didn’t augment this team wisely after 2015. That, plus poor coaching (pitching) and some underperforming and suspended stars, doomed us.
It’s better to have a team with direction than to have one stuck in purgatory. At least their fans finally have something to look forward to.
It also matters that player salaries have escalated so that 5-6 teams are all that can afford top free agents.
You’ll have equal competition when you have a more balanced financial situation.
It matters because MLB implements rules requiring how much money they spend.
Oh no. They traded away all these average players with expiring contracts for multiple top 20 prospects. Gonna suck for pirate fans having a team with a top farm system and winning all these games for a decade. Sucks even more that they won’t pay 30 somethings hundreds of millions for the twilight of their career. Terrible. Feel so bad.
You’ll never have “equal competition” due to the drastic differences in market size, as well as varying degrees of wealth between the owners. They could attempt to implement more financial limiters on the teams capable of juggernaut payrolls, but those limiters operate in a more regressive manner since they usually tend to benefit owners more than the players. Also, if they want to attempt to “equalize” team’s spending powers, then they need to do away with competitive balance picks. We already have revenue sharing that operates similiar to welfare in a sense that the bottom teams are essentially collecting a check from the top earning teams. Its not the yankees or cubs fault if Rays and the A’s decide to utilize that revenue sharing money in a manner that isn’t directly tied to purchasing free agents and immediately effecting their major league team. Some teams throw a lot of that money back into player development, and some owners of small market teams put that money back into their pockets.
Yes dpsmith, so punish the big market teams because the small markets don’t want to spend money. That’s a baseless claim that it would be more equal. NFL isn’t, even though that’s the crown jewel example. No, a “more balanced” financial situation relies on the players to accept money within a specific framework. You cannot regulate that and they will never allow you to. That’s the component everyone fails to acknowledge.
Small market teams have too many advantages as it is. It has clearly shown the past several seasons with few exceptions, and that’s why you will see a change in the CBT next contract.
he slashed payroll agter a 95 win season…. im a life long pirate fan and yes payroll this year doesnt matter but Nutting is hands down the worst owner in MLB
you got mid level { AT BEST} prospects from the Yankees. They FLEECED the Pirates in that deal.
Fleeced is a strong word. Jameson comes with some questions. The Pirates aren’t going to be anywhere near competitive for the next two years, though. If just one of those prospects hits, it’s a good deal for the Pirates. If two hit, I think the Pirates come out winners. Not that the Yankees lose, either. Two sides can both win a trade, which are really the best deals.
This year will be brutal for Pirates fans, but they’re in a better spot today for moving forward.
A Yankees fan complaining about the unfairness of MLB’s financial model favoring small market teams. That’s frickin hilarious.
Although I’m a firm believer payroll flexibility is far less important to success than a team’s ability to draft/develop talent, there’s no denying payroll flexibility affords teams like the Yankees to cover up mistakes ppl
Mhlcfrrggg
Stop already with the money stuff ! That’s the old days wise up ! Building with a strong farm.
Very short sided comment. Money is a big part of the problem and why there is ZERO competetive balance.
Draft well. Scout well. Use international signings wisely. Make wise trades with good timing. More than money…
Signed,
TB Rays fan
I don’t believe the competitive balance act any longer.
Here is the last ten WS matchups:
Giants – Rangers
Cardinals – Rangers
Giants – Tigers
Red Sox – Cardinals
Giants – Royals
Royals – Mets
Cubs – Indians
Astros -Dodgers
Red Sox – Dodgers
Nationals — Astros
Dodgers – Rays
Lots of different teams playing – Some in not very big markets. Some teams are notorious for small payrolls – Rays, Indians, Royals will never be considered large market teams. The Giants had nowhere near the biggest payroll in any of their wins. Notice there is not a Yankee team in there at all.
Payroll restraints are meaningless during a tear down. Now if he’s not allowed to use these payroll savings in a few years when they are in a window of contention to supplement the roster, then fans will have a reason to complain.
He got Joe Musgrove for Cole who you guys then flipped for a decent package of young talent from the Padres so I wouldn’t say it’s a complete loss. Also, all the Astros ended up getting from Cole was a comp pick (which turned into Alex Santos).
Agreed, he has a great track record at identifying young talent. It finally seems like the organization has a plan both long and short term. 2022 is a bit soon for me, to start competing, but I like your optimism.
Pirates opening day roster: Who are these F**king guys ?
Unnecessary comment
That’s a very meta comment.
It’s actually quite funny considering he’s actually right, im a huge pirate fan and will barely know half these guys. Plus it’s a quote from the best baseball movie ever.
This guy here is dead.
then cross him off the list
They will win 58 games this year. Thank God there will be no fans
Honest question: is there a different feel to winning 68 games versus 58? Bad is bad, and those extra 10 wins are really no more than Pyrrhic victories because they end up hurting your draft position.
@mlb1225 — 2022 seems really optimistic to expect a .500 record. That’s a much faster track than any other recent successful rebuild e.g., Astros, Cubs, White Sox (hopefully). Even the best prospects/draft picks usually need some time after they reach the bigs to be consistently productive, and management typically doesn’t start adding good veteran free agents until the prospects have demonstrated their major league mettle.
One thing in the Pirates favor is that no other team in the NL Central looks to be especially good in 2022, and the Cubs and Reds could even enter new rebuilds themselves by then, in which case it would be more realistic for the Pirates to be able to break .500.
That’s what I see, they’ll be able to take advantage of a weak NL Central with the Cubs, Reds and Brewers all potentially in rebuilds as well by then. I agree that 2022 is pretty optimistic, but I don’t think it’s out of the question. The Pirates have been great developing hitting talent and I feel that the young players will at the very least, be good enough to win somewhere between 75-85 games.
The NL Central is a mess. If the pirates hit on their draft picks this year and next they will be back very quickly.
If I was a Pirates fan (I’m not), I’d be comfortable more now than in recent years regarding the direction the team is going. It’s a rebuild, but there’s a clear plan here and you have the right guy leading it. Cherington knows the minors and prospects, helping build the prospect pipeline that led to the Red Sox’s last championship. Heck, his wife Tyler is a baseball lifer, the daughter of a longtime professional scout, she even went through scouting school, and was an executive with Goldklang Group, which owns multiple minor league teams, including one with the Yankees. I wouldn’t be shocked if she even gave some intel on the players the Pirates acquired.
All four of the players acquired are interesting and legit prospects. The Yankees system is fairly deep in young arms, so being ranked in the mid-teens with the Yankees is not a negative. You just have to hope that the Pirates under Cherington will be better at developing pitchers. Good depth here . One of the pitchers — Yajure — is very polished and mature for his age and could definitely help the Pirates this year, if not right out of camp if they’re willing to endure some growing pains on the MLB level. Tallion wasn’t going to be part of the next Pirates team that will contend.
Try 2024, maybe 2023. Most of these players are below AA. There was no minor leagues last year. If he does his job developing and drafting they should be contenders the second half of the decade.
Teams can turn it around much faster than that these days,
You can’t turn it around that fast from the position that the Pirates are currently at. Realistically Hayes and Reynolds are the start of a core, but that’s about it and it takes like 3-5 years for the prospects to debut and perform.
Just think about the return from the Musgrove trade. Head is a stud but he’s 19, only played in Rookie ball, and probably won’t arrive until 2023 or 2024. Cruz is 20, at least he has some A ball experience, but he’s probably 2-3 years away. Endy Rodriguez is in the same boat as Head, only Rookie league time so far and he’s 20 so maybe 2023-2024. Cherington is also drafting and signing international FA to improve the system, but all those players are going to need just as long if not longer to develop.
I like the direction that they’re heading but just to be realistic about it the process takes 3+ years.
Cherington is excellent building the farm. I hope he does well in Pittsburg.
Well, the problem with thinking the Pirates have a good farm system is that even if these players do end up looking like real quality mlb caliber, they will be gone in another ‘tear down’ trade in 2023!
Pirates don’t have Josh Bell stars. They don’t sign Josh Bell stars. They don’t sign Trevor Bauer pitchers. They won’t spend. Super stars looking for big, long term deals want to play for winners. Heck, even the Marlins are at least trying to field a competitive team. When is the next time the Pirates even FLIRT with a .500 record, let alone a division win or even a wild card?
What a total mess. Though I love the returns that Cherington got for his last couple of trades. His team is primed for dominance in 2023-2025, similar to the Astros about a decade ago.
How can MLB let a guy like Bob Nutting own an actual baseball team? Anybody who has met him like me knows what I am saying.
MLB: force a sale to a guy lime Mark Cuban similar to that whole embarrassment that the NBA dealt with in Donald Sterling.
Again, Nutting gave NH a decent budget to work with in 2015-2018. He spent it on mediocer players that didn’t move the needle.
NH was a horrendous GM. Point: does he even have a job anywhere in baseball? BC is impressing me.
NH was a real hit or miss GM. When he made a good move, it was a really good move. When he made a bad move, it was really bad.
The Archer trade was his death knell. Even at the time it seemed a desperation move and big overpay.
Yeh? Who WAS that GM who broke our 20 years of misery by getting us into playoffs 3 years in a row! He was Great up thru 2015. THEN and only then, did NH start to suck.
Playing a WC game isn’t the playoffs.
I like NH. Guy made 1 terrible trade. Should have been fired for that. Glad he is gone. But made like 20 clear win trades. Good scrap heap signings. Just drafted average at best but who knows since his team couldn’t develop players well.
Glad BC is here. Trades just as well if not better. 4 for 4 nailed it. Drafts will have to see but so far so good, should beat nh there. Free agents wait and see. He didn’t do well with that in past but no idea if that was his call or ownership. In pittsburgh I know it will be all him lol. Biggest thing is development. He has to be better than NH.
no he wasn’t great…. his draftchoices were moslty horrible…. Taillion, alvarez and Cole… also either 1 or 2… any gm could do that… he got luxky on Burnett and Liriano…. other than that most of his players (Cutch, Walker, Marte) were Littlefield draft choices or signings…
@YourDreamGM was the 1 bad deal the Bautista-Diaz deal?
No
Right ! Neil was a big problem. Clint well enough said. Blow hard !
“Primed for dominance”…wish I could pin this post. Who knows, things happen, but those returns are not overwhelming, good but not great. And not much of a foundation. Dominance in two years? Take a breath.
There’s other building blocks already in the farm system. Particularly loaded with 19-21 year old pitchers.
It seems that if a low end starter on a 1 year deal is needed, why not resign Archer for that as opposed to the previous engagement between the parties, this one would seems more plausible & a natural fit albeit temporary…
I like Archer, Hamels, Jester Felix. Anybody who is cheap.
By the way: Cherington basically traded Nathan Olvadi. And got three guys who look very high upside.
Am semi-impressed enough to buy tickets to the former Lexus Club, now called Yugo Club.
Yugo club, hahaha
These tear-downs are really hard on the fans. Cherington got a good return for his assets, but it starts with ownership, because each offloading of salary for prospects makes the next one that much more likely. The next CBA ought to address dumping in some way–it won’t, but it should. Maybe there’s a middle ground on this–a minimum spend (not gigantic) or a partial loss of revenue sharing.
I’m a fan of a team that did the rebuild, I didn’t have a problem with it. I enjoy watching baseball, so even if the team that I root for is bad, I can watch other teams still. It’s unrealistic to think that a team is going to be competitive all the time
Good that you had a positive experience. I still think deliberate dumping is a problem, particularly as it can impact the standings.
So you want teams that are going to be bad to carry a higher payroll just cuz? And then hope that might make those teams a little less bad so they don’t impact the standings? Sounds like a more balanced schedule would be a better solution to the problem you see.
OK, I’m good with a more balanced schedule, although it doesn’t completely compensate for a team who tanks midseason when there was imbalance during the first half of the season. I do think it’s problematic when a strength of schedule is substantially changed by a tanking team’s salary shedding
So if a team gets old or has injury issues or misses on some drafts/trades you are looking for teams and their fans to suffer non stop because your idea will not allow teams to do what they have done since the beginning of the pro game. Tear down and start over. ~20 teams are in the same boat as the Pirates. Only a third can spend as freely as they want.
No, I’m not saying that. I’m saying the CBA should have a (modest) floor. It doesn’t have to be $100M. And the loss of some revenue sharing wouldn’t be all revenue sharing. Let teams make any judgement they want, but, since many tear-downs have a primary economic component, make it a little less economically desirable.
So you want to tax the poor for being poor?
You can’t have a floor without a cap. All a floor would do would be to overprice the mediocre players while the better players would still be signed by the top 3rd,of the teams free agents now. That still would not fix anything and just make the lower pay more for the same players that they already are signing and not change a thing in competition.
I stopped watching the NBA years ago so this may have changed since then, but the NBA had a salary floor, it didn’t do much to improve competition. Each year you had 2 or maybe 3 teams per conference that had any real hope of winning.
It seems like maybe you just don’t like teams cutting payroll and are trying to find reasons to justify that opinion.
I’m really trying to be polite….recognizing that there are differences of opinion on this, but….you won’t have it, right? So, let’s do this instead, How about we just walk away from this particular argument?
It’s not a one size fits all
Pirates tried competing from 2012 to 2020. They traded 1 player away and end d up the worst team in baseball. It wasn’t tanking. They were just that bad. So your solution for BC is to spend money? When the previous GM left him with a roster full of drek. Traded away 3 of the best prospects and left a weak farm.
System isn’t changing. But teams won’t tank as much. Rays Indians model is the next big thing. Astros Cubs takes too long and only has a time limit. New way you can be relevant every year.
Fire.sale.
All that said, the Pirates lineup isn’t as awful as it seems, this FA market is really volatile this year and there’s still plenty of players who might be desperate to play for the Pirates. Cherington really could turn around and get a decent CF, C, SS, a SP and a RP on the cheap and have them not looking in too bad a shape. There’s still plenty of options for them to upgrade, which they should.
I agree totally!
They don’t really need another catcher. Jacob Stallings is just fine as the starter. He was worth about 3.5 fWAR across 500 plate appearances in 2020. He’s fantastic defensvely and you can do a lot worse offensively. Shortstop and second base isn’t really a place of need either with middle infield capable players like Tucker, Evans, Gonzalez, Frazier, etc. Though I’d love to see them get some SP now after trading two of their biggest arms. Ovbisously, I don’t think they’ll get one of the higher tier SP, but an innings eater type starter, or younger arm looking for a rebound like Carlos Rodon or Mike Foltynewicz would be more than welcomed in my book.
Stallings is a backup catcher at best. They should just looking for a future catcher to develop.
They did when they got Endy Rodriguez in the Musgrove trade. Stallings isn’t bad. He’s collected 2.4 fWAR in his past 353 plate appearances and has been a top tier defenisve catcher. He also had a 93 wRC+, which compared to how catchers have hit recently, isn’t too bad.
Stallings is a starter, one of the better ones.
MLB1225 – you are either the Pirates GM in disguise, or the most optimistic pirates fan on the planet. I’m obviously a Reds fan, but I can not imagine how frustrated the majority of the Bucs nation has been since 1980. They have in all honesty been completely irrelevant to anyone outside of Pittsburgh. They certainly deserve better, and have no shot at a winning season until 2024 or longer.
I will admit these trades were necessary, and the returns for decent players have been good, but they are going to need a lot of luck to pull off a run of any sort if that payroll persists.
Maybe it’s because I’m young and haven’t been through like 30 years of losing seasons lol. But I don’t see how they won’t be at least at or around .500 in 2022 or 2023. If 2024 is when they reach the .500 mark, then something serisously went wrong, whether that be almost all of their top prospects completley flopped, they got injured for multiple years at a time, or worse. In 2021, they’ll get a full year of Hayes, Reynolds and Keller while also seeing Cody Bolton and Oneil Cruz make their debuts and could see Miguel Yajure, Will Crowe take over roles. Then in 2022, Hayes, Reynolds, Keller, Bolton and Cruz should eventually be joined by Mason Martin, Travis Swaggerty, Liover Peguero, Tahnaj Thomas. 2023 will probably be when we see two of their most talented prospects, Nick Gonzales and Quinn Priester. Now yes, prospects don’t come up and imediatley play like All-Stars, but even if they come up and don’t suck, I don’t see how they would meet .500 by 2024, especially if teams like the Reds, Cubs and Brewers are in a rebuild.
The Reds, Cubs, Cardinals and Brewers aren’t adding right now, but they certainly aren’t rebuilding at this point., All of these teams are light years ahead of the Pirates in terms of talent and that is saying something. The Pirates had a .317 win percentage in 2020, and .426 in 2019. Both were last place performances. All they have done in the past two year is cut. 2021 will be the worst of the worst for the pirates. 2022 might get them back to .400, It would be absolutely shocking if this team was .500 in 2023 without massive spending in free agency.
The one thing the Pirates had going for them in 2020 was that COVID didn’t really impact their budget as much as other teams because they didn’t have one, so we will see if they use that to their advantage over the next few years.
Mlb is lil too optimistic. Some of the guys mentioned won’t be here in 2022. Same with 2023, maybe end of 2023. But 2022 will be a young team. 2023 is the .500 year, maybe playoffs. 2024 to 2033 is good baseball teams.
I could easily have the pirates around .500 Why though? They need more elite prospects. Need to finish last or close to it. But Reynolds could bounce back. JBJ I’m center. Pederson in right. Hayes Moran on corners. Frazier 2b. Newman if he hits. If not tuckers glove at short. Love Stallings. Sign a Hamels Felix Archer type. Bullpen will be just fine. They already have 3 under 4 era pitchers with my new defense. Even with just one new outfielder put olivia out there for glove. Again no point in winning.
Also need to factor in the upcoming #1 pick in the draft and assuredly another top 5 pick in the following draft into the contention timeline. Which makes 2024-2025 more realistic and more promising but also makes an early career extension for Ke’Bryan Hayes a bit more urgent.
Pirate fans need to stop crying at this point you look at the Astros rebuild and the Cubs rebuild and see what BC is trying to accomplish.
Different markets have to play the politics different ways. Pirates need a Tampa Bay style and to do that the minors gotta be strong
The only payroll the Pirates should be adding at this point is some bad contracts in order to get better prospects in trades.
Now I think Cherington will sign some buy low Free Agents that should be looking for opportunities to rebuild value for another run at free agency next year.
You get a chance at 3 years with top 5 picks and you actually have a chance at a decent 5 or so years of legit contention.
I understand you want sustainability and are spoiled with the Steelers success and wish that for your baseball team but bring your kids to the park and watch the young kids play and build something
Great post!
They restocked the farm, and they’re in a division where no one wants to win. I think they could be real good in 3-4 years.
Generally, it’s easier to move up in a Central division than an East or West due to the smaller markets. The keys are scouting, drafting, and player development. Those are the proven strengths of Cherington. Some people here are condemning Nutting, but from the looks of things, Cherington is orchestrating this rebuild the way he wants.
In the past, management was always at a crossroads. They didn’t know whether to rebuild or go for it. In the end they usually spent unwisely.
At least Cherington seems to have a plan and is going in a chosen direction. You have to commit to a process, one way or the other, and I think that’s where Huntington eventually fell short.
People wish they would spend some money just to spend money, but really there isn’t a point yet. Whenever these younger guys start coming up and taking over spots is when you splash some money at FA to fill in the gaps.
Great job on finally pulling the bandage off on mediocrity and going all in. This is the only way they can compete! Many people say they trade prospects after they develop but that only happened because they tried to get a mediocre team into the wild card to satisfy angry fans.
Get that number one pick again in 22 and possibly draft Green who is a Cutch clone. Then start the build!
It makes me laugh seeing all my “die hard” yinzer friends crying about breaking up the worst team in baseball. THey’ve been rebuilding forever, blah blah blah, must not know how baseball works. Yes the need to spend money at some point, yes they absolutely need to pick up value free agents if only just to trade them for more prospects, but let Ben work please.
Neal made some awful trades and had no idea how to develop young talent.. He’d let them sit in AAA until they’re 25 then give them a cup of coffee and trade them afterwards. Really no reason to play more than a half season in AAA if you’re a real prospect.
They can pick up two pen arms, a starter, and a decent 1B and still keep a low payroll.
It will be interesting how the Pittsburgh sports talk guys view this trade tomorrow. Everyone that I know is supporting what Cherington is doing.. The on air “experts”. Usually find fault with every Pirates.
Huntington’s worst move was not sticking to his announced rebuild plan after the 2017 season. With the team sitting at 56-52 at the 2018 trade deadline, he reversed gears and made the Archer trade in a bid to chase a wild card berth. A year later, they were 47-61 and headed back toward another rebuild. So, what does Huntington do? He tries to make up for Archer blunder by playing hardball with teams on offers for Vazquez. What eventually happened with Vazquez is immaterial because a rebuilding team doesn’t need a closer. Get a good deal and move on. He instead turned down reasonable offers because he was afraid of getting burned again. How’d that turn out, Neal?
With his flip-flopping, Huntington wound up making the Pirates worse than when his announced rebuild started. I can’t stand it when general managers change with the weather. If you have a big-picture plan, see it through until the end.
So Cole is making 38 mill this what’s the chance he makes more than the bucs opening day roster
Actually thought Adam Frazier Brault and Stratton would be moved before the season started
Those guys are all still controlled for multiple seasons and they’re not that expensive. Especially with the pitchers someone has to eat some innings, so they might as well keep them and see if they can improve their trade value this next year.
The way the rosters get churned over during these rebuilds they will probably eventually get moved, there’s just not a rush to do it.
If somebody wants to pay the price to get them they will be traded. Gotta read between the lines. BC told everyone his plan. Done trading but phone is still on. Aka nobody has offered me enough to trade anyone else but I still have guys available if they change their mind. The 40 man is full. Roster spots in the minors are full or close. No reason to trade anyone unless it’s for something good. Everyone left doesn’t have much value. They will go at deadline if performing.
It will be interesting how Shelton finalizes this team. It is obvious that Cherington needs more starting and bullpen arms, especially veterans, to by time for a couple pitching prospects to hopefully develop. Of course, that’s the same for the position players, especially at catcher and with Polanco. Need an OF or 2 and a veteran catcher.
I like their infield with Hayes at third and moving Moran to first against righties. Just need a vet first baseman to platoon him. I hope that Shelton will utilize Cole Tucker more and see a little more of Newman as well. Reynolds can fill in in left.
This is a start for Cherington and Shelton and I pray they do build it up more and be productive.
It’s been a while when you had the Bucs vying and let alone earn a playoff berth. I guess that was Van Slyke and Bonds.
This actually makes me want to start up OOTP 20 on the weekends with the Bucs!
An absolute joke of a franchise. They are NEVER competitive. Draft em. Get em to the show. Trade em(usually for a crappy return). Repeat. Cherington or whoever, it doesn’t matter when your ownership isn’t, and will never be committed to winning.
You could say this about any number of franchises. So why bother? Teams that could be competitive back in the day have a chance every decade or so for a short window of success and that’s it. The game belongs to the big boys. It’s now all about money. You want competition? Put 4 franchises in the NYC area, 2 in New England, more in California. Get out of Florida. Get out of Colorado. You don’t need franchises in new places, they will just lose. Stack franchises where all the money is and make them compete. Balance.
The reason why they don’t do that is because they would lose too many fans in all of the rest of the country and thereby lose the big money nationalTV dels because no one outside Boston, New York LA and Chicago outdoor watch. Then the gamewould really die.
They were a joke. They fielded nice teams 2012 to 2019. BC will do even better.
Pirates were one of the best teams in the majors between 2013-2015, can’t say they are never competitive. They missed the rebuild they have been planning and the process will take a little more time than expected but they’ll get back on track
Despite the fact the rebuild is just beginning, Cherington continues to impress with his returns for clearly flawed veterans. If that man can craft any kind of return at all for Polanco, he’s already in the lead for NL Executive of the Year. Bucs fans have to be optimistic for no other reason than it’s clear that Huntington can’t ever hope to hold Cherington’s jock.
Brault, Keller, Kuhl, Ponce for starting pitching now. Need at least 2 more unless they plan on going with opener’s to cover. In that case still need relievers as well. May still move Frazier, perhaps for prospect and salary dump pitcher. Have to do something to look like they are trying and not just rolling over. Lot of nice pieces falling into place but depth will be a big problem with starting pitchers. Love the trades so far, good future depth but cannot be at risk losing a hundred games. Trades have picked up some MLB players but will it be enough to draw fans?
Brubaker and crowe. I don’t think they are worried about fans. I see a few thousand allowed at the park. If there is full attendance then it will hurt them.
Sweet Bauer just posted on social media asking pirate fans why should he sign with Pittsburgh.
Hopefully they respond to him and tell him they can’t think of any reason either.
Pirates should sell and move to Las Vegas or maybe get a knowledgeable GM to manage like Tampa or Oakland does.
You do realize that they did fire,Huntington and hired Cherington November of 2019, don’t you? Smh………and…………smh some more………
#ContractThePirates
Of course it’s the end of their teardown for the offseason. There’s nobody left on the Pirates that other teams don’t know they can get on a minor league deal next offseason.
If they add Rocker/Lawler this year and Green next year the farm will be stacked.
A top 5 of Rocker/Lawler, Green, Gonzalez, Cruz, and Priester w/ Bolton, Thomas, Swaggerty, Rodriguez, Puegero, and Carmen will be a legit 10 or so.
Forgot to include Head as well.
Coming from a Red Sox fan, just give him patience Henry pulled the chord too soon on him and they won the title with his squad.
A Mets fan here living in PA, hoping the Cherrington is given the tools to complete the whole tear down and hopefully have the pirates contending in 2-3 seasons just like the astros did. Also at some point those owners are going to have to spend or sell the team, a competitive pirates team is really good for baseball.