TODAY: According to The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal, Judge didn’t ask for an extension longer than eight years (or nine years, counting the 2022 season). The Yankees’ offer to Judge also didn’t include any deferred money.
APRIL 8, 3:23pm: Jon Heyman of the New York Post hears from multiple sources that Judge had sought an offer of nine to ten years with an average annual value of $36MM. Heyman cautions that a person close to Judge contested those numbers. Max Scherzer ($43.333MM AAV over three years with the Mets) is the only player in history with an AAV north of $36MM, with Mike Trout’s $36MM annual salary the largest for a position player.
Over a ten-year span, a $36MM AAV would match Trout’s $360MM guarantee. Trout’s deal has the largest present day value in MLB history, although Mookie Betts (who received $365MM in total guarantees but with deferrals that reduced its present value) topped that mark in raw dollars. The Yankees never seemed likely to go to that kind of offer, particularly since a deal buying out nine free agent seasons would take Judge through his age-39 campaign. Heyman adds that the Yankees were willing to include one or more opt-out possibilities for the star outfielder.
10:17am: Yankees GM Brian Cashman told reporters there will be no extension with Aaron Judge today, hours before the slugger’s self-imposed Opening Day deadline. In a rare disclosure, Cashman detailed that the Yankees offered a seven-year, $213.5MM extension beginning in 2023, representing a $30.5MM average annual value.
That AAV would have ranked 17th in baseball history. Notably, the Yankees were willing to extend Judge through age 37, the same as recent contracts for Corey Seager, Freddie Freeman, Marcus Semien, and Francisco Lindor, despite Judge’s injury history.
Cashman sounds like he’d like to avoid an arbitration hearing for Judge’s 2022 salary, which Lindsey Adler of The Athletic believes would happen in June. Beyond that, the two sides will engage after the season. Of the 24 arbitration eligible players currently headed toward a midseason hearing to determine their 2022 salary, Judge’s $5MM gap with the Yankees ($17MM vs. $22MM) represents the largest.
Cashman’s comments come less than two hours before the Yankees open their season against the Red Sox, Judge’s deadline for a a contract extension as he enters his walk year.
Judge has missed significant portions of three of the last five seasons due to injury. Seager, at least, had a notable injury history of his own, but his deal was struck on the open market in advance of his age-28 season. Judge will play in 2023 at age 31. Offering to sign Judge through age 37 is a significant gesture by the Yankees. The AAV, while perhaps not elite, isn’t unreasonably light and could be considered a tradeoff for the club including a seventh year.
If Judge reaches the open market, he could be joined in a 2022-23 free agent class again strong at the shortstop position. The outfield market doesn’t project to be too impressive beyond Judge, with other names including Joey Gallo, Mitch Haniger, Brandon Nimmo, and Kiké Hernandez.
Judge is set to bat second in the Yankees’ Opening Day lineup in today’s game against Nathan Eovaldi and the Red Sox, which begins at 12:05pm central time.
Getting antsy, even though this contract is already done.
Your “parody” account is increasingly stupid by the day. No, the talks aren’t done. Namely because Hal S. has to justify being cheap while keeping tickets overpriced.
@fair-critic- regardless of your comments, the contract is done. I say so, that’s who. Your entitled to your own opinion of course.
No contract!
Looks like @Captain Judge99 will have to change his handle once the Mets make Judge their RF.
Hey Books. I will never play for the Mets. No worries.
If the contract was already done, an extension would’ve been announced.
@goastros123- why is that, because you say so?
@Captain Judge99 – how do we know this contract is already done? Because you say so?
Goastros! Looks like we’re bound by the same fates, my friend. Correa & Judge must’ve consulted each other, huh? Ooof, this isn’t going to be fun, but in this instance I believe the Yanks were fair & presented a legitimate offer in years / $ to Judge. He’s making a mistake, & I think he will have a FA much more like Correa than Seager.
Yes indeed, Clipper. The Yankees made a fair offer, and if he rejects it, that’s his right. This makes me applaud players like Kershaw for choosing to stay instead of leaving. I’d like to see more great players live up to “I want to stay”.
Yes, true & look at Jose Ramirez. That’s a guy who really wanted to stay, without a doubt. Judge wanted to get paid, which is fine, but don’t say otherwise, it’s unbecoming.
If Yankees can’t extend Judge the Giants could use a right handed power bat. Wait – won’t happen – Zaidi doesn’t do $100,000+ million dollar contracts.
It’s done?
“$240 million-ish over seven or eight years.” ———– That is EXACTLY what I’ve been saying for the past six months, and I said maybe one or two option years to make it *potentially* a $300M contract.
Of course I got mocked for saying $240M guaranteed …. “he’s not worth nearly that much blah blah blah”.
I wouldn’t be doing the “I told ya so” if certain people weren’t so arrogant in accusing me of being wrong. LOL
Wow, we’re all really impressed buddy. Want a cookie?
hmmmm
He ain’t worth it. His injuries will only get worse as he ages
FPG: Yeah, man, honestly that’s a bit steep to me & Judge is one of the top players in the game right now. I had him pegged at about $220-$230M & 6-7 years, or in that neighborhood.
He could very well regret not taking this. Even if he could make $20M more on the market, is it worth the risk when he’s guaranteed almost a quarter-billion dollars? I respect his choice, but I think it’s a mistake for him to pass on this.
No kidding… bodies like that break down by 32 or 33 and he’s already rickety as hell.
I think Judge is a fool for not taking that deal. I can’t believe they offered 7 years…
$32 million a year for that IL list repeater? Wow no wonder they haven’t won in 13 years. Nobody and I mean NOBODY would pay him that kind of $$$. Meeting of 2 fools there. Cashman for offering and Judge not accepting. Nobody outside of NY thinks he is worth that.
With his injury history and age . 30.5AAV over 7 seems like a very fair deal – a ton more risk turning this down vs the increase he would have IF he has another full productive season. Upside would be 7 @ 230-240 downside 4 yrs at 110 or so.
Yea if he misses more then 20 or 25 games with injury, he could regret not taking this. Unless his numbers are unreal
What kind of body breaks down at 32 or 33?
jonny5 – Nah, I just want a bitter moron who insisted I was about $100M over to show himself by responding with a pathetic juvenile cheapshot.
Want a to-go bag for that vinegar and water?
Clip – So you basically had the same projection that I did, except I had him at 8 years including 2022.
You really think he’s that much of an injury risk? The wrist fracture was just an unfortunate HBP, the rib fracture and collapsed lung were from his poor decision to dive awkwardly in the outfield. I’m guessing he learned from it.
Don’t get me wrong, as a Sox fan I’d love to see him sign with a non-divisional rival.
FPG: No, sorry, I didn’t mean to imply he was a high injury risk; just that based on his history, it’s certainly plausible that injuries can occur at any time. Especially with those weird injuries like the HBPs that have nothing to do with your own body breaking down.
I’m a huge Judge fan – the player, the disposition, the leader. I think market reflection should’ve set his* expectations a bit lower, & that the total = 8/$230M, including this year, is a whole lot to leave behind for a team you allegedly want to stay with for your career – especially at 30…
I’d love a cookie, thank you, but we all know, eventually, the cookie crumbles
Who am I to Judge?
Too much Mt Dew?
Lots of projection within that comment. Didn’t mean to trigger you, how about a Snickers instead?
@BigJohnliljohn. They guy turns 2b into 1b on D. Even injured he had 98 rbis
Clip – I agree, $230M should have done it for someone who wanted to stay put.
He’ll get 10/275 in free agency from a desperate team out west. Lower AAV but more years with more cash, give him an opt out at 5 years.
Will he be on the field at 39/40? Prob no different than Pujols now at that point in the future, but balky knees and shoulders instead of feet. I can see a Cano or Pujols deal in free agency for Judge if he puts together 140 games plus at his current level of production.
Can’t fault the Yankees, that’s a good deal on the table and they know his medical more than we.
The Yankees always try to get hometown discounts from their homegrown talent yet they’re more than willing to overpay free agents.
They haggled with Jeter and Pettite every year but shelled out the money for ARod and Clemens.
Baseball bodies very often begin to breakdown at about 31. It’s a huge part of decline.
Move on. Trade him for a nice prospect package & use your trillions to sign FA’s to shorter-term contracts.
@kcmark – how is $214M over 7 years a hometown discount? Keep in mind that Judge turns 30 this month, so the Yankees would be paying him $30.5K (on average) for his age 31-37 seasons. They would probably get (3), maybe (4) seasons out of him worth $30M/ea. He already strikes out a lot and that will get worse with age. He also has a history of breaking down during the season and requiring multiple trips to the IL; at best that will continue but will most likely increase over time. Lastly, once he slows down (speed wise), he’ll go from a plus defender to an average defender. I’m sure his deal would be front loaded too; something like: $40M (years 1-2), $30M (years 3-5) and $22M (years 6-7). I don’t see how this is asking for a hometown discount. You just don’t pay a player of his stature past his age 37 year at such a high rate. This offer is more than fair by NY and I highly doubt any team will offer him more during free agency. We shall see I guess…
Wonder what would happen if they traded for Soto. Doubt they would offer nearly as much.
This kind.
$230MM isn’t ‘cheap’ in this or any other world. I don’t usually have sympathy for MFY, but before the Aaron Judge Internet Clown Show begins in earnest among the Aaron Judge Clown Club, this is a guy who has been saying that he wanted to be a ‘Yankee for Life’, when it’s obviously more important that he’s the ‘Highest Paid Whatever Until the Next Guy’; who has a hard time playing a full season; who’s now in his 30’s; and who couldn’t even bother to get vaccinated when it was a requirement to play in NYC or Toronto.
If I’m Cashman I look forward to seeing this guy’s back. And I don’t say this because it makes life easier for the Sox if Judge leaves NYC. Guy’s a Clown.
That’s Judge choice to compromise his body or not with a “vaccine” that has proven useless.
“A vaccine that has proven useless”. Tell me that education wasn’t a feature of your youth without saying that directly.
Perhaps you’ll have time to amuse us with an explanation of your scientific background and tell us about the ‘study’ that concluded Moderna or Pfizer would ‘compromise’ “Judge” body.
Over 90% of Covid deaths were unvaccinated. Yeah, “proven useless”. What a joke.
Everyone that gets it now has this statement, “I’m thankful for the vaccine that I only have mild symptoms.” Weird that plenty of other people haven’t gotten it and haven’t been vaccinated. The vaccine is useless, especially if you already had covid. The facts are changing since poll numbers are dipping.
Wow, what an illogical smorgasbord.
Getting the vaccine and having mild symptoms? You do know that the virus mutated, right? The vaccine didn’t protect totally against the variants, but did help, unlike not being vaccinated.
“Weird that plenty of other people haven’t gotten it and haven’t been vaccinated.”
Well obviously those people weren’t exposed to the virus. That’s like saying lots of people that don’t wear their seatbelts haven’t died in a car accident. Yeah, because they haven’t been in one. But how do those people do when they do get in one?
“The vaccine is useless, especially if you already had covid.”
That is patently untrue. Believing you’re immune once infected is like believing you’re immune from the common cold because you had one. Covid is a virus, that continues to mutate, similar to the common cold. The first person to die from the omicron variant was an unvaccinated man from Houston who had previously had Covid.
The numbers don’t lie. When the overwhelming majority of people that died were unvaccinated, any attempt to skew the numbers is completely unconvincing. Facts matter.
The numbers actually did lie – a lot. CDC just changed last week the death count for children with it. Dying with covid shouldn’t be included with dying from covid.
Don’t get me wrong, covid sucked, but it was made 10000x worse because of our government and media.
You can nit-pick specific numbers all you want to try to manipulate them to suit your preconceived ideas. It still doesn’t change the facts.
Tell me exactly how big a difference the numbers were, between dying of Covid, and dying with Covid. And, there’s a lack of common sense to believe that having Covid wasn’t a contributing factor when a child died with another problem. A Child might have died from something different, but maybe Covid pushed them over the top. It certainly didn’t help them in any way.
Your insistence to ignore the basic fact, that the chances of dying of Covid was enormously greater if unvaccinated, speaks volumes.
Character-wise, the only thing I had an issue with Judge was his playing NY, NY while leaving Fenway during the 2018 postseason. Otherwise he’s got a squeaky-clean image IMO.
Stay indoors
Tad – It’s nice to see someone actually fight misinformation with logic and cold hard facts. Whoever raised you, raised you right.
The internet was great for the freedom of information, but unfortunately it also gives morons an endless echo chamber. What a double-edged sword
In no way could you say Hal or the Yankees are cheap. The team surrounded themselves with stupid contracts when Judge was cheap and now can’t afford to keep him.
Can’t afford to keep him? How could you even make such a ridiculous statement, when they just made quite a substantial offer to him? C’mon now…
Fair-critic, you may need to define parody for Captain99. He’s not the sharpest knife in the drawer…
You might need to count how many championships the Sting Rays have? Oh that’s right none. Lol
I honk they were stupid offering 7 yrs at that rate.. a player always hurt and crazy to have him on a long contract to age 37,. He should have signed that immediately
Uncle Steve already has a Mets uniform ready and a contract with what Judge wants ..He will be a New York Met
Yeah he will fit in quite well with the Mets! Right in line with all the other guys that’ll be on th IL every year! That would be the last place someone with injury history would wanna go to lol!
Wow. That seemed like a very fair deal considering his age and injury history.
It is a very fair offer. Watch him get hurt, miss two or three months this season and then he won’t get nearly the same $$$.
Or he hits 60 homers and increases his value?
Or he gets hurt and plays 60 games and decreases his value to the point where he has to take a one year “make good” contract.
The sentiment around the game itself was that it was a very fair offer on the Yankees’ part.
Judge should’ve took the $$$. Doubtful the Yankees offer much more. With a bunch of large contracts already that’s probably a fair piece of Hal’s pie for the Judge.
I agree Judge should have taken the $213.5M offer. I don’t know how someone turns down that kind of money. I guess he is already set for life.
Judge turned down 7 years – 213M, equaling 30M a season until he is 37. He isn’t the first New yorker this year to make a huge mistake. Conforto I believe was also offered 7 years – 140M and he too turned it down and now he can’t find a job based off his bench statistics in 2021. When greed enters the picture and players believe they are worth twice what is offered, they usually end up with nothing when they get hurt and careers come to an end.
Have another drink. Yanks need to say goodbye. He will get hurt. Strike out a million times and be another loser Stanton.
This deal would be done if the Yankees didnt have that albatross – Stanton’s contract – sitting on their payroll
@Bucsfan0004- That has nothing to do with it. That makes no sense. My contract is finished. I’m staying.
I think he’s implying that the Yanks would have more $$ available and would be willing to give him what he wants if they didn’t have the Stanton future commitments
@mcmillankmm- I know what he’s implying, and it has nothing to do with my contract. Trust me.
The Yankees received $30 million from the Marlins after Stanton opted into his contract last year for the years 2021-2027 (seven years, $218 million). Factor in that $30 million, and it’s actually a seven-year, $188 million contract, bringing it to a $26.86 million AAV.. He’s worth that.
You’re not Aaron Judge, clown.
Bucsfan, Stanton’s contract is far from an “albatross”. So far he’s earning it and his lux tax hit is only $22 million. I think Hal can afford it.
Joe as usual you are right! 22 million for Stanton is not an “albatross” contract. Just got to pray he stays healthy, but that is true of all contracts.
With the buyout when he’s 38, Stanton’s contract comes out to $22.7M per season, or $4.9M more than your estimate over seven years.
Whether or not it’s an albatross depends on Hal’s attitude towards paying all that money for a DH and part-time outfielder who likely will be relegated entirely to DHing in the last years of the contract.
With George, it wouldn’t matter. Hal is not his dad.
He’s an oft-injured 32yr old who is a DH only. Using your numbers, its 7/188 remaining. That’s an albatross, my friend. Judge would be signed if Stanton weren’t around, who is not only sucking up money, but clogging the DH position Judge could transition to as he gets older.
This is the Yankees, not the Pirates. They can afford it.
Stanton is not a DH only guy either. His offense even improves when he’s in the field.
@ bucsfan LOL what an original and well-informed take on Stanton’s contract. Sure, there’s 2 other guys on the roster making more than him by AAV, but as usual it’s all Stanton’s fault when the Yankees don’t spend what you expect them to.
bucsfan0004:
I couldn’t disagree more. The idea that the Yanks would have made a larger offer to Judge, were Stanton’s contract not on the books, is absurd.
FOs don’t work that way. Cashman’s offer is what he thinks Judge’s value is; what he thinks works for both team and player, not what’s left over after paying Stanton and the rest.
Cashman is not going to offer significantly less than what other teams would, were Judge a FA. What would be the point of even making an offer were that the case?
MLB is not some mom and pop store that actually does work that way, and either can or can’t afford a raise to an employee. The Yankees can afford to offer whatever it takes, but Cashman is not going to overpay.
No, John, it’s not all Stanton’s fault. It’s not his fault at all. Loria gave him that huge contract and Cashman assumed it. And there’s only one guy on the roster with a higher AAV, Gerrit Cole. Cashman got played by Boras, bidding against himself for Cole.
Not at the 10-360 he wants..
Stanton’s contract isn’t going to get them to make an even bigger mistake..
The Yankees are cheeeep.
They pay Stanton 24 million a year…albatross contract??? Ass Clown
It’s like they didn’t even think about that or when they signed Cole’s stupid contract.
As good as Judge has been, he has some injury history and will be 30 by the end of the month. How many good years do they really think they’re buying in a 7-8 year extension?
@flamingbagofpoop- Big deal, I’m 30 years old in a month. I’m staying with the Yankees for the rest of my career.
Aging curves do show that’s a big deal…
Shut up
That’s exactly where my thoughts were leading. Not only will this potential contract carry Judge into his age 37 season, we’re talking about a hitter who, although he is immensely talented, has only stayed healthy enough to complete more than 150 games once in a 6-year MLB career. Folks describe Stanton’s contract as an albatross due to his health history and age and he was able to complete three seasons of 150 games or more before the age Judge is now.. What does that make a potential 6- or 7-year deal for Judge?
Seven or eight years is a lot for a 30 year old, but the Yankees have no choice but to get this done. Of course I thought the same for Freeman and the Braves and you see where that ended up.
“Yes, please do.”
-all the other teams
@ham77- it’s already done. No worries.
You’ve done a masterful job of making a moron out of yourself. Congratulations, you have won the “internets” for today.
It’s true. If they let Judge walk all the Yankee fans will riot and become Mets fans.
This one won’t. FYI.
@Ducky- your heart is in the right place my friend. I’m not surprised. Your a lst class person and fan.
I’m right there with you Ducky…
At Buckin, this site has completely shut me down on my conservative views I hate to ask for help but this is pathetic
Help me if you can
John Rocker, things will have to get a lot worse than that for me to become a Mets fan. I’ve gotten over worse. George let Mr. October get away and he actually helped bring titles to the Bronx.
If I wasn’t a Yankee fan, I wouldn’t watch any baseball. This is a notion Brian Cashman has recently introduced as an option, however.
@Ducky- well thank god your a Yankee fan. We can’t lose the best. How much longer do you really expect Cashman to be the GM? Although fans should be a lot happier today.
I know I’m in the minority of Yankees fans on this one but other than letting Semien get away I like the moves Cashman has made. Time will tell on it all and we’ll see what happens at the trade deadline.
Cash will be the GM as long as he keeps putting playoff loot in Hal’s bank account & he is able to bob & weave in three year cycles with the CBT.
Unfortunately, to get him out of there, we will need to experience a few seasons of failure. Which doesn’t much appeal to me either.
Joe: I agree with you in that most moves Cashman actually makes are good moves –
My problem is all the moves he doesn’t make.
I’m of the opinion that they should consider fielding offers for Judge this year, if no extension is reached. If they’re going to lose him, knowing they aren’t going to give him what he needs, maximize his value for the future of the team. Having him there the last year, losing him for nothing, & making the fan base mad in the offseason because you don’t spend money under the auspices of offering it to Judge (again) is just a bad plan, imo.
I could get on board with that Clipper though the return would have to be big. Although I don’t see anyone beating the offer Cashman made. Judge might wind up costing himself if he wants to play hardball on the contract.
Personally, I believe his value to be higher, more in the $35M range, but I also have him at 6 years so it evens out.
Nonetheless, regardless of those details, I think this is a bad choice on Judge’s part because of what he’s leaving on the table, and how quickly he could lose it.
Exactly
If Yanks don’t do it, Dodgers or Giants will!!
No they are too smart.. Giants don’t like long term commitments and Dodgers don’t either with a few exceptions.. that’s why Seager is in Texas
Judge is a tough contract to predict. I’m assuming shorter years for higher AAV given his injury history
@Milwaukee-2208- your assumption is incorrect.
The Yankees have offered 7 years at 30.5 million per for a total of 213.5 million.
“what Judge is willing to accept is “not in the same galaxy” as Judge.”
It seems we’ve gone beyond our galaxy and entered the multiverse.
@gbs42- another crazy comment. That’s untrue. Smh
Thanks
It’s going to be a ton of money, it’s likely to be an overpay, and, just maybe, if Judge can average, say, 120 games a year, the Yankees won’t care. A lot of fans outside of New York like to mock Judge, and I concede he’s probably overrated because he plays for the Yankees, But he has a lifetime OPS+ of 150, and averages more than 1 WAR per 100 PAs. He’s also surprisingly good in the field….it’s deceptive because he’s so big.
A signing at this price.length point might be a big mistake, but this is a very talented guy. Two things can be true at the same time.
Well put. I think it wasn’t generous offer though by the Yankees, especially for injury prone player. But they realize his value to the franchise. And it will extend into his 37 or 38 year old period. I don’t know how much more he wants.
If he want much more than that ,and it handcuffs their ability to make other moves ,it would not be a wise move on their part. Of course is the Yankees and they can afford to pay anything that is required but we know that they worshiped the precious luxury tax and That won’t change as long as Hal is in charge
@mike156- a ton of money? What’s a ton of money to you? I’m overrated now? Whatever.
Who the f are u poorly impersonating & why?
Change your handle – troller .
I hope Owners step up. Judge will get his $30M for a 6 yr deal and play 4 1/2 yrs healthy at best.
What does your comment even mean? The Yankees offered him 7 years at $30.5M per year. So some other team is going to offer $30M per year over 6 years? Wait… what?
Give the man his money. Can’t live through a full season of this storyline.
Might be more interesting than the club Cash has assembled. We ended as a 92 win team. We are a 92 win projection team to begin the year.
Don’t even get me started on how he “fixed” the 19th “best” offense of ’21, by swapping out guys like Wade for Gonzalez. He must be fighting fire with fire or something. Throwing crappier bats at a crappy offense. I remain unconvinced as to it’s efficacy.
@Ducky- a tough off-season for sure. Your boy Cash will finally do something right today. Do you have my jersey? If so please wear it today. Getting ready to go to batting practice. Ttyl my friend.
I will have the game on the radio in the truck.
I have decided I’d prefer a few late swats at some snow geese as opposed to dedicating some actual time watching Cashman’s Ball of Crap offense. Hope Judge stays. His extension certainly wasn’t enough to hijack our off-season like the excuse being bandied about. But: whatever. Not reaching a deal would seem par for the course.
Last jersey I bought was a Roy White throwback.
@Ducky- a Roy White jersey? Lol. Treat yourself to my jersey, your a hard working guy that deserves it. You definitely would look good in it. The radio in the truck? That’s cool. No mlb package this year, no firestick? Your a loyal fan though. I definitely respect that.
I have MLB & Sling.
What I don’t have is any excitement for this particular ballclub. I’ll be up by Roger Maris’ hometown though. Maybe I will finally go to the museum this time.
This squad is dullsville, man.
I can’t find any other way to say it. Perhaps they will eventually spark my fancy. As of now, they look like a real yawner to me.
Why not Horace Clark?
Start a Go Fund Me
DUCKY!!!WE HAVE A WINNER!!!DFB! GREAT COMMENT.
The Yanks are now the most boring team in the AL East, a not insignificant achievement in a division with the Orioles. Will Judge sign? Who cares? And this “deadline” nonsense is such fake news.
Yup.
Cedric Mullins is far more exciting than anybody on our roster, serious. The Judge extension was a nice bit of sleight of hand. Another top notch job by the NYY Spin Machine.
All those posts in re how we couldn’t spend any more money that would actually see us field a better team because funds were “set aside” for Judge. Laughable, man.
I truly loath being “right” in this instance.
Well, I’ve a bit of a drive on the docket. I will be with you guys via radio waves.
Go Yanks, etc etc.
Ducky, we could see this coming, unfortunately. Frankly, I’m not surprised they couldn’t get it done. I thought they may be able to, but the strategy of waiting until the very last days to present their offer is a strategy borne of failure.
Also, re: the money-savings & the fact they couldn’t spend…they completely tanked several offseasons to get under the CBT, only to tank another over…$213M over 7 years? Are you kidding me?
Now, I don’t mind the fact, per se, they don’t want to overpay Judge in money or years – I’m actually okay with that as long as their being reasonable. But to set these expectations about needing to save all this money to give the fact of the franchise only to come through with an expected offer is…stupid.
This is going to bite them in more than one way. They are ruining the longstanding reputation of the Yankees in both performance & willingness to win. Players are not going to want to come to NY like they do now. That allure Cashman has used to his advantage with guys wanting to “be a Yankee” is gone, officially.
That said, $30M/year @ 7 years is a reasonable offer, but completely inexcusable for bailing on all their other needs – I thought they may go to $225 or so, but, it makes sense that they won’t spend any more on Judge than the AAV on everyone else because that’s the new Yankees.
Really can’t imagine how absolutely everyone didn’t see this *exact thing coming*. I just can’t. So obvious.
More, “well we tried” malarkey. I am no longer fooled by all that.
I would say it seems they did have money set aside for him. The contract they offered seems quite fair to me?
ducky , I’m not surprised honestly. Now they have even less of an excuse for why they didn’t significantly upgrade this team. But as I thought all along, ducky that really had nothing to do with Judge, it just has to do with Hal’s continued worship of the luxury tax.
And honestly even if they exceeded the threshold what would it cost them ,an extra couple million dollars anyway, that’s pocket change to Hal. It’s just the principle of the thing that causes him to want to stay under the luxury tax, not the actual dollar amount, which is absurd
The offense is very good and just underperformed last season. Plenty of 20 HR bats stop complaining.
“Complaining” & pointing out the obvious are two entirely different things. We finished 19th in scoring. Cash has done absolutely nothing to address that. In fact, he may very well have made things – in those regards – worse.
However: I am merely using – ya know – stats to see that. Perhaps all they need is some “rah-rah Yankees” stuff. I tend to disagree on that, though.
Yup
@yanksallday- who says I don’t already have my $? No worries.
Judge getting $30-$35 mil a year is crazy, all of these prices for all of these players is f***ing ridiculous to play a sport. But Judge has been hurt 2 years in a row and they’ll never get rid of Stentons contract, so that’s $60 mil a year between the 2 of them to play RF and DH.
@jvent- I’ve been hurt 2 years in a row now? Trollers! I’m one of the best players in the game. Now I can’t get paid? Smh
jvent, this is just where sports are these days. Aaron Rodgers is getting $50M per year in a sport with 1/10 the number of games, NBA players are topping $40M per season.
MLB is an $11B dollar industry. If the players don’t get paid, the money stays with the owners, so I’m happy to see the top players get top dollar.
@gbs42- thank you. Is it still too late to get that $50 million a year since me and Rodgers have the same lst name?
If you’re gonna try this, you need to actually make the posts funny, not just spam stupid comments. This is the prattling of a 6th grader.
Let him go
@machurucuto- not happening.
Yankees will trade him to the Red Sox for cash and then it will become the reverse curse of the Bambino..
@Old York- bite your tongue! Trade me to Boston? I hope your kidding. The Red Sox don’t have that kind of cash.
Straight up for Devers.
Red Sox traded Mookie that “by far” is a better player
@machurucuto- maybe? But Mookie had enough in Boston. They tried to pay him, but it obviously wasn’t enough.
Yankees should trade this guy
@machurucuto- trade me for who? Not happening.
Your comments are annoying and childish.
Just pay him – he is the face of the franchise. It’s like Mickey Mantle – could you see HIM in a Met uniform?
@chuck123- never going to wear a Mets uniform. Your making my stomach feel sick now. Maybe a San Francisco Giants jersey one day? Just kidding man!
Please don’t compare Aaron Judge to Micky Mantle.
I recall seeing an interview Mantle did from the 80’s(?) on Letterman when he found out a player had just been paid over a million dollars on a contract – he was asked if he would return for that and said, of course, “If George paid me a million dollars to play baseball I would go back tomorrow” or something similar.
I know we can’t compare then to now, money is different, market is different, profits are different, etc; but, turning down this much guaranteed money in hopes you get even $40M more just seems like such a bad plan as a baseball player in the wrong side of 30. And that’s not including his injury history which should make him more self-aware, not less. This is not even money you have to invest or spend wisely, like the icons of the past that had to work post-career. This is forever life-changing money. He will be in his 30’s & retire as one of the wealthiest people in the country. And to say no is…..yikes.
The major factor with a player like Judge is the added financial value that he brings the Yankees. His jerseys are annually one of the best sellers in all of MLB. If he can stay healthy and above average for 4-5 years I’d call a 7 year contract a win.
Pretty sure teams split licensed apparel sales
Kyak- thanks if you really feel that way you should be happy by the end of the day then.
Error in Judgement and the Yankees deserve each other. But they won’t pay him more than Foreign Substance Man, who came through big in the Wild Card game. Because they are more deserving of a name like Cardinals, Blue Jays, Orioles. Cheap cheap cheap. I’m sure they will sign him today and make a big whoopdeedoo about it, blow hard organization that they are.
Otherwise, happy Friday, finally good weather for baseball. Smart move cancelling yesterday’s game well ahead of time, yesterday’s storm was nasty. So the Yankees can do something right after all. But they need to get over themselves.
Because the Mets might be better? That almost never happens. But it might this year. Ruh roh.
Well, keep hoping for it, the mets may field a better squad than us someday. As I am a typical Yankee fan, I could give af about your little team. Thankfully, I was raised right (Yanks, G-Men, Rangers), so I don’t have some weird complex about another ballclub.
But, yeah. Happy Friday, hope your well, regards to Mrs Hazee, etc etc.
Oh. Yeah. BTW, this ain’t the year either.
Probably not based on past performance.
Oh, you.
Just go ahead & ditch that “probably.”
If Judge is getting an offer of $28M/yr, he should just take it, especially if it’s long-term. He’s good when he’s healthy, but how often is that? And Miggy and Trout are prime examples of what often happens to aging sluggers.
Mike Trout is 30. Is that “aging” now?
Sorry, I honestly don’t know where my head was. Was seriously thinking Pujols. This is what I get for going without coffee.
They’d be better off using that money to resurrect George. Maybe the Spankmees would become good again.
Cashman don’t have the guts to trade this guy and Hal don’t want to pay the guy. He’ll become a free agent. So he better have a good season if he wants to ged paid as a FA
Yup, the stupidest comment of the day by far. Not surprised at all coming from the source. (Books)
I find this ironic, considering you’re not replying to anyone, but posting an original comment yourself. And it’s “considering the source.” Everything comes from a source, pretty much by definition.
It’s only 7 am PDT. I’ve got plenty of time to say something more stupider.
This is all Anthony Rizzo’s fault.
Money aside for just a moment, there are just some players whose “value” supersedes the solitary money aspect. Of course most if not all of these contracts are overpayed …that’s a given.
To me it’s more about the length of the contracts. Injuries are , seemingly, more prevalent than ever. In the case of Judge that is probably the only risk factor in him. He is simply a great , all around player in every aspect of the game. Offensively and defensively. Plus there is that extra “ value” quotient . He IS today’s Derek Jeter in what he means to the team and ALSO the box office.
That being said a lengthy contract ( whatever that means ) might have me holding my breath, only because of that injury concern. And he is soon to be 30.
….my thought ( which means nothing)…. Is 5/$175m. That’s an AAV of $35m per. AND if I am Aaron Judge, I will be 34 when this contract expires (instead of 37 on an 8-yr contract, let’s say…..) and if he proved to stay “ healthy” at that point…..guess what, he’s in line for another contract of 3-4 yrs at least for an AAV of at least $25m
Any thoughts guys….and that includes you too Captain Judge…lol
@ yankee766766;
Aaron Judge is not Derek Jeter. He’s not Mickey Mantle. He’s not Joe DiMaggio. He’s not Lou Gerhig or Babe Ruth.
If he was playing for another team and he wanted the kind of money he’s asking for, you Yankee fans would be on here ridiculing how overrated he is.
I’ve been a Yankee fan for literally decades and I could not agree with you more. If they don’t sign Judge to an extension it wouldn’t bother me one bit. This dude is a great ball player but he’s hurt so much. He’s the poster boy for oblique strains and leg issues. I would have traded him last year if it was up to me when they could have gotten something for him. Let some other team give him seven or eight years and let them deal with the injuries. Although I highly doubt any team in baseball would be so willing except maybe the Mets or as they both stink of desperation.
If the teams can afford it, they’re not overpaid. I’d love to rip out all the spending restrictions on prospects and ditch the draft system. I’m betting you’d see a lot more money spread out among young players and less on guys on the wrong end of the aging curve.
Perfect.
Yanks weren’t going to spend any more due to “needing money” for the Judge extension. Then they low-ball him.
Question: If a deal *doesn’t* get done, wtf happened to the money set aside?
Answer: ends up in Hal’s pocket.
The standard “money in Hal’s pocket” comments are getting old. I hope you realize the Yankees are spending upwards of $230 million for a team only a few predict will even make it to the World Series and you want them to spend more.
There comes a time when even rich teams become worse off by spending too much money across many players.
Also, the money doesn’t go in Hal’s pocket since he is only owns a part of the team.
Fair enough.
I don’t make them too often.
So. Maybe *you* can tell me then. Where’s that money? Should lead to some type of increased expenditure shouldn’t it? After all, that was the “impediment” re spending any more. You see, you can’t have this one both ways.
Low-Ball?
Didn’t get the job done.
Call it whatever you want. Cash’s insistence on “winning” all of his transactions, is more accurate though lengthier.
I have spit the Hal/Cash Kool aid on the floor of my truck. There is absolutely no way this off-season has been nothing short of a huge letdown. We didn’t get better. The supposed reason for not improving was the Judge extension. Which didn’t happen.
No possible way to view this all as not being a total clown show.
Wow, Ducky. Even though I’m nowhere near being a Yankee fan, it pains me to see so discouraged.
That said, I have to disagree with the “low-ball” thinking. Given his age, I think the offer was close to what Judge’s value is. I think the belief that the offer has anything to do with what the other players are making is incorrect. The offer was what Cashman assessed Judge’s value to be; or close to what he might get on the open market.
It seems pointless to me for Cashman to make a low-ball offer. Why make an offer that he, and Judge, both know is less than true value? I think Cashman actually thought Judge would accept it.
Brian Cashman has no idea who I am.
But, we have a deal nonetheless. As long as he brings back a better club than the one we ended the year with, I’m good.
He didn’t keep his end of the bargain this year though. We finished ’21 with 92 wins. According to projections we are a 92 win ballclub. That pisses me off so much, @tad. Especially in light of the argument that extending Judge was the reason for such a lackluster off-season.
You’re right though. @Byron is too.
That really isn’t a low-ball offer. But it is another example of Cash misreading the market again. Been a lot of that lately, man.
I was pretty excited about this off-season. I think every move Cashman made was good. Sure, he got outfoxed a bit by Falvey & Levine. In general, however, every thing he did was good. But: we just simply did not do enough.
This was a very important winter for us.
No, it wasn’t a failure or whatever. But it was incredibly underwhelming. Quite a bit of movement, yet no tangible improvement was made.
Some shotgun therapy & an extra inning win over the sox has me back on track. Looks like it’s going to come down to how well Cash can navigate the deadline.
(I do realize it’s a bit unseemly to be griping so much about a 92 win ballclub with an 87% chance of making the playoffs. However, I’m good with it.)
Ducky, there are two sides to this that make it difficult to discern the “appropriate” offer. For instance, in terms of performance overall, say fWAR, Judge is 3rd in MLB since 2017 – that’s right #3 in production. When you look at the 10+ players that are paid more than Judge’s offer, yes it is in fact a low-ball offer.
Yet, by the same token, looking at the deal, apart from the outliers like Seager, Scherzer, & Lindor, because those contracts are insane, yeah, it’s pretty fair.
Nonetheless, the problem circles back to Cashman. Even if they offered $250M or $275M & Judhe turned it down, they’ve done nothing to prepare for this inevitability. They e simply put all their eggs in this basket.
Consider this, however. It’s intentional. They knew this was coming. Hal has one goal. To get substantially below the CBT so he gets away from crossing over the threshold altogether. That’s the long-term plan. Not winning, not the roster of 2025, not their future franchise guys – the CBT & being able to avoid crossing it altogether, which will be the new, new mandate/excuse after ‘23-‘24 roster clearing. Mark my words, man.
Apparently some big-market organizations are emulating some facets out of the Tampa Bay Rays’ playbook. First it was all the shifts. Then followed the Opener. Now, it’s trying to make more profit. Stuart would be proud!
Wow your really gifted! You and your low budget team! Must be trolling Sunday?
Stay in school!
I would not go more than 6 years at his age and more than 200 million. They will pay Judge 30 mill per season. Judge is my favorite Yankee but they also need to be smart. Having 3 contracts bog down your cap is never a good thing. Cole and Stanton with Judge locked down until mid to late 30s could be a recipe for failure.
If they offer Judge a 7th year do it based on reaching team and player incentives to activate the 7th season. If Judge refuses and is looking for longer term such as 8 years I hate saying this but I would definitely consider dealing him in the off season or if the Yanks for some reason are not in the playoff hunt during the trade deadline. The return would be astronomical.
Correction, he will be a free agent after this season so they would have to deal him by the deadline and than the return may not be close to what they would have gotten if he was dealt sooner. Never happening in Yankee land. Not how they operate.
Well, they traded Chapman to the Cubs and got Gleyber Torres then brought Chapman back in free agency. Of course the Yanks would only do that if they were basically out of the race which I highly doubt they will be.
This article is comparing the offer to A-Rod’s outrageous contract which even Yankee fans admit was an albatross.
Eeeee Gads.
He deserves every penny. When you watch the Yankees your glued to Judges at bats. I know injuries gotten in the way but he’s a beast when healthy. He puts fans in the stands cant imagine them getting rid of the judge champers in right field lol.
Why would cashman speak to the press if a deal wasn’t done ?
If there was a done deal, they’d schedule a joint press conference with the player and team.
Judge is playing today though and has to prep for it. If anything the conference for a extension could be done at another time
More than a fair offer. If it’s not enough. sometimes you just have to make the decision to move on.
Yup.
No problem. Things happen. I am looking forward to seeing how Cash & Hal reinvest that money into our roster. After all, the Judge extension is why we had to back off on spending. Now that that’s scuttled we must have some available funds.
Right?
Issue is they can’t reinvest until after this season. Obviously, there’s still a chance they’ll cut a deal, but the deal can’t be at any cost. We’ll see what Cashman has to say in about a half hour.
Don’t I know it, Rob.
Cash pulled off a pretty nice bait & switch though. & it could have had mild ramifications this season on our CBT total. Which will never be addressed.
That money’ll just disappear. & – it would appear – only old Fent’ll be wondering about it.
I don’t believe it would impact the CBT this year as the offer was a seven year extension on top of whatever they agreed to this year. So So the Yankees offer was minimum of 8-$230.5M if $17M this year, 8-$234.5M if $21M this year.
I of course want the Yankees to bring back Judge, but it’s difficult to assess without knowing what Judge wants. Clearly, $230M+ wasn’t enough.
They will use the excuse of saving the same money next offseason to present to Judge ostensibly, until he turns it down & it’s too late to sign anyone else they need, thus keeping the same money again. It’s the savings excuse that keeps on giving.
I’m starting to believe that their entire 5-year spending plan revolves around which personnel they can say they’re saving money for, the “savings excuse plan,” only to keep it if/when that player doesn’t accept. Whereas other teams are actually targeting players to…ya know, acquire.
What an overpayment.
Most overrated hitter in baseball
Toronto
TampaBay
Yankees
No World Series or soup for you.
Tampa
Boston
Toronto
In all fairness, the Yankees have been doing a sort of a rebuild the past few years as they try to get in line with some form of normalcy in regards to how they structure a team and pay their players. It’s clear to anyone that looks.
But when Yankee fans see the writing on the wall……they think it’s a forgery.
@BirdBelter- nice wishful thinking. Good luck with your assumption and prediction.
@AMATO- your the most overrated fan in baseball.
Well, isn’t that just adorable. He still hasn’t figured it out.
You’re the most overrated fan you know!
Despite his performance, injury concerns makes this offer by Cashman more than reasonable IMO. Don’t know how many years they’re offering, but 32M over 7 years equals 224M and their latest offer is more than that, so if he really wants to be a Yankee he should sign this deal.
Too many distractions
Pretty ridiculous to call a press conference just to say you didn’t sign a player
The Yankees would call a press conference just to announce what the players are having for lunch and the media would eat it up (lol) seriously though the most over hyped team in sports
Surprised Judge wouldn’t take this offer. What club offers him this in free agency next year?
Judge for Devers, straight up. Win win for both teams.
Nah, the Spanks have Volpe and the other kid coming, two HOF locks. Devers wouldn’t have anywhere to play.
What are you smoking? I want some.
Just not sure how much meat he could possibly think is left on that bone.
True story man. He should know better, but it tells me that he only wants to be a Yankee if he gets paid the most amount of money – which doesn’t really mean he wants to be a Yankee, it means he wants to be a logo that gets paid the most. That’s not a judgment, it’s just a statement of fact. He’s saying all the right things though; the guy is a true professional, no doubt, but I will be shocked if he’s a NYY beyond this year.
Judge is a dummy for not taking that extension offer.
That offer is more than fair. I think Judge is going to be surprised at the offers he receives in free agency. I don’t see any team going much beyond that offer – if at all – for an oft-injured player entering his age-31 season.
I like Judge, but Cashman should trade him immediately so they can get some talent in return before he leaves.
If we had any shot at the division (I have many doubts, personally) this train wreck of a situation will derail those chances even more as the season progresses. Trading him for top-tier prospects or controllable talent is not unreasonable, especially since Hal desires so strongly to be the Rays anyway.
I feel that’s a pretty fair offer. I’m sure some team will offer higher in FA, but if he has an injury plagued year he may regret not taking that.
Judge is insane to turn down $230 million guaranteed. He’s 30 years old with a lengthy injury history. Is he represented by Boras?
Surprisingly, he’s not represented by Boras
Better call Refsnyder.
Might as well call Saul at that point. He probably knows a guy who knows a guy who’s better than Refsnyder.
Another miss by Cashman….so now after he has an MVP year how much is it going to cost to sign him? This franchise keeps slipping further and further towards mediocrity the further we get away from George and his influence. Such a shame that Hank wasn’t healthy enough to take control of this team. No wonder why Hal wasn’t the first choice.
Hank was a moron. He’s the one who gave A-Rod that 10-year, $275 million deal. Hal’s biggest issue is not firing Cashman. He’s been in charge for almost 25 years! Time for a new perspective, Hal!
You really think this is all on Cashman? Does he control the budget?
No, this is clearly Hal. Cashman is second, but only operates this way because of Hal’s direction. Cashman has had several misses though, in his own right.
Please Al Avila…..put away your checkbook! We don’t need another big guy with bad knees taking up valuable salary cap space in a few years.
This is 100% on Judge. He really better pray he’s not hurt again this season.
He’s coming off as a combination of greedy and a phony in that I don’t think he’s a New York guy. I think he really wants to be back in Cali.
If he leaves I am feeling like oh well, don’t let the door hit you on the ass on your way out West.
“He’s coming off as a combination of greedy and a phony in that I don’t think he’s a New York guy.”
I thought greedy and phony was the working definition for a New York guy.
I do wonder if he’s eyeing the Dodgers too. That was the first though that crossed my mind. I know he loves the Yankees, but he just saw Freeman return home & LAD is a stacked team that pays.
I’m really surprised he turned that down. It was a generous offer and for a good amount of years
And to the incoming who will say cashman is screening up this offer is the opposite of that. Anyone who says otherwise is just full of Yankee hatred
He’s not worth $30 million a season!
Judge is 3rd in WAR since 2017. Only Trout and Betts are better. That’s pretty good.
If he has another good year, what will a soon-to-be 31 year old get next offseason? Definitely not over $250m but certainly not under $210m. They should have given him ~$235m and named him captain at the same time.
Don’t speak facts, people hate that. Plus he makes a ton of revenue for the team off the field too
And if he gets hurt again? It’s almost like those ifs can work both ways…
Can’t wait till Juan Soto becomes a New York Yankee.
It’s a great offer but just slightly on the low side. I think them “forcing” $17M on him for this year was stupid. GIve him $25M for this year, then let the extension go from there.
Now we can cue the “let’s trade for Soto” thread lol Who would Yankee fans rather have, Judge or Soto?
It’s a fair extension offer. No one is forcing anything. That’s the whole point of arbitration which the players’ union deems is a fair process. Even if the Yankees give him $25M, there is still no guarantee of an extension happening. These are two separate issues.
I know they said there will be no negotiations, but they need to negotiate for his 2022 salary still. Nonzero chance they announce an extension in advance of the arbitration hearing. The arbitration hearing date is set, but Cashman refused to reveal the actual date, perhaps enabling both sides to continue talking without the media being aware of the actual deadline.
First up, the arbitration numbers are wrong, if it hasn’t been updated yet. Judge has asked for $21MM not $22MM.
Judge is saying all the right words as a way to diffuse controversy, but it doesn’t sound as if he’s looking for any compromise. No problem with that. This is a business. Maybe he simply wants to test free agency. I’m curious if his agent ever gave the Yankees a number. If not, that would indicate his intentions all along have been to become a free agent. There’s a price where the Yankees should walk away, and a $230MM offer for eight years feels quite generous. He’ll be a 31-year-old for the first year of his next contract. Length of contract would be a greater concern to me than the AAV.
I’d immediately trade him for some potential long-term upside and sign Conforto for a third of that price. Yes, I’m aware Conforto is not as good. But Judge can barely stay on the field as it is and there’s no way I’d give more more than that offer in years or dollars. I do think they might actually trade him though before the year is over.
The only way I can see them trading him is if they fall out of contention. I don’t expect that, especially with the additional Wild Cards, but if they do, then it could be possible. It’s not really the Yankees MO though. Think of Cano. They never traded him, and despite a generous seven year offer, I don’t believe they really wanted him to come back. If they do let him leave, it will be painful for a couple years, but like the Cano situation, it will probably be clear they made the correct choice. The difference though is the Yankees didn’t really want Cano back. They do Judge.
Can barely stay on the field??? I think you are confusing him with somebody else. He played 148 games last year and would have played more, if not for covid. Yes, he has had injuries, but he certainly is not Ellsbury.
And one of his injuries was due to being hit by a pitch
A couple of his injuries were not even indicative of health, including breaking his wrist getting hit by a pitch. He’s not in the Cal Ripken class for health, but he’s also not in the Jacoby Ellsbury class for injuries.
Good, because I hate the Yankees. Bad, because I love baseball. They should have been able to work this out. But the bean counters are going to count beans. And so you have it.
Oh Great, the Dodgers just found their trade deadline rental target
If anyone thinks this isn’t a great offer or if it’s low they are nuts
Yeah, it was a fair offer, Judge values his market higher, rightfully so, but man, $213M is a whole lot of money to pass up on just for a little bit more. That seems like a bad plan to me, personally. It’s not going to make a difference in his life to get that extra, but he could lose a lot more than that.
Yankees fans should be happy Judge turned down that deal. There’s no way a deal of that magnitude and length will be anything but an albatross by the last few years.
I’m surprised he turned the deal down. I don’t see any team besides the Angels being on the hook with that albatross
It’s on Judge then, fair offer by the Yankees.
It may be that the front office is planning on waiting to see if he stays healthy for an entire season before upping the offer. I can’t say I blame them. If Judge gets hurt, he and his agent lose the bet. If he stays healthy, they win, because there’s going to be a bidding war in the offseason.
George would’ve paid him already because he “puts fannies in the seats,” to use his terminology. Really, who else on this team would fans pay to see? DJ? Torres? Stanton? Gallo? Cole every fifth day?
Judge is the one who rejected the offer. What is waiting to see if he remains healthy going to accomplish? Even if he is MVP this season, the offer the Yankees made is still more than generous
Uncle Steve to the rescue.
He’s not on the level of Trout or any of those other names, He’s not a Harper, or a Mookie etc… he’s not going to get much more then 230-240 million. He might get more from a national league team now that they have the DH. He’s has 1 healthy year and he’s on his way out of being a “kid” he’s about to be an older player that can’t stay healthy.
This is one of those time where both sides might feel serious regrets. Judge might (might) get more on the open market next year….or he might be injured this year and get less. The Yankees might regret his leaving–he’s really popular, or might secretly be relieved.
Judge is so overrated. What’s been offered is an overpay as it is, all things considered.
Think again, 3rd in WAR since 2017 is NOT considered overrated.
Don’t need to think again. I said “all things considered.” You’re comparing apples to oranges. How many of the other players (using WAR as a benchmark) are 6’7 and play corner outfield? A man that size and frame will not last passed the reported 7 years he’s been offered. They need to take that money and run.
I know it’s just one example but Winfield was 6’6” and he aged well.
So Judge is overrated based on his age and height, and not based on his on field production? Interesting and very unusual take when rating a player.
Age and body type are very important factors actually
Not to mention playing in his age 30 season.
This is one of the first extension offers I’ve seen a player not accept and think, “Well, that’s stupid.” I get when he’s healthy he’s perennial MVP material, but given his injury history, this is a great deal to take. I STILL can never get over the fact that a human being actually has the ability to turn down over $30 million a year, EVERY YEAR, over a 7 year span. Crazy.
How about Bezos and Musk? They make BILLIONS each year. It’s only money.
It’s only money, lol. Yea, they’re crazy too. Even worse. Only people who make enough money to never have to worry about it say things like that.
It does seem like this comes down to a difference of about $5M per season and either Cashman has a mandate from Hal or Cashman has a policy now of whatever a guy’s top market value is, offer him $5M less per season.
So DJ’s market was close to $20M? Offer him $15M.
Etc.
And I think they took this tactic with Judge. Judge simply asked the Yankees to match the market values of guys like Rendon, Lindor, Seager, Correa, etc. and the Yankees asked him to give them a $5M per year discount.
I’m on Judge’s side. The Yankees should and should have just paid him. Them saving that $5M per season wouldn’t make a difference for them as an organization, but him earning that extra $5M per season makes a huge difference for setting and maintaining a value standard for players of his calibre and simply matching his market value.
Stupid.
Is that using bWAR? Fangraphs has José Ramírez as 3rd.
Bad move for Judge
hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
240 million, 280 million 300 million when you get to those kind of numbers it doesn’t matter..it’s not about the money it’s ego driven
Yeah, that’s also why it’s a mistake, imho, for him to leave $213, albeit an underpayment per market value, in the table. That could very easily evaporate.
I understand Judge’s position, I just personally don’t agree with the decision. But there’s nothing wrong with him having confidence in his own ability & market, he just may find out his confidence isn’t supported by next year’s market, a la Correa.
What a miserable year it would be betting $230,000,000 on my health during a pandemic that’s killed millions & knowing I could literally get zero with a single injury or that a new variant or even a war could shut down the sport.
I think I’d bank the 230,000,000 and just play lotto.
This offer was more than fair. I’m surprised Cashman even offered 7 years. If Judge thinks he’s going to get a significant more amount in free agency I highly doubt it. He’s injury-prone and will be almost 31 after the season.
I don’t see any team offering more than 8 years 250mm and even that’s a stretch. Who would even offer him that deal? The Angels? He’ll wind up wasting his career like Trout and never be in the playoffs every season
Unless he has a bad injury, he will at least approximate it, and likely beat it. There’s very little risk on his side.
Offered 200m dollars and still crying poverty. Let him walk after the season. I think it’s probably better he declined the offer. It’s going to be an albatross for any team that signs him
@Yanks2
Please post the link where he was crying poverty.
I think this is a huge stupid gamble on his part but that’s his decision to make but I haven’t heard any whining from him that he can’t afford to eat.
He’s not crying poverty, just doing what he thinks is best for him and his family. Betting on himself to have a big year, which he usually does and probably will.
Seam: I think historically you’re correct, but Correa is finding out the reality of FA is all but a guarantee… Judge is older, similar injury history, & similar performance. Much better character, no doubt, but still, no guarantee, man.
It’s almost a quarter-billion dollars guaranteed! That’s…a lot of risk to let play out for the next year.
True Clip.it may backfire on him.
@seamaholic 2
You state he may get close to that or maybe a little more but there’s little risk.
There is a huge risk
He could get injured
He could hit Like Bellinger.
They only logic to taking such a gamble would be for a massive increase from someone else but I just don’t see that being likely
He’s not gonna hit like Bellinger. The injury risk is real though. He’s betting on himself to stay healthy, essentially. Maybe too he wants out of NY. Hard to say. But if you actually pencil it out the chances he has another serious injury are pretty small.
I see two options.
Tampering and he knows he’ll get more because it was already promised.
Vaccine math – An inability to recognize which number is bigger when it exceeds 10.
You should pencil it out..
He doesn’t have to hit like Bellinger or have a serious injury to keep some team from offering a 31 year old, 7 foot, baseball player over 200 million dollars.
He probably has to stay healthy, have his best season and be in the running for MVP.
If he was offered 3/100 and said no to bet on himself I think you could make that argument but not when you get over 200.
I understand Judge betting on himself, but how much more than the $30.5M per can he realistically expect? Does anyone truly believe He’ll get the 9-10 years and $36M per?
This is the part that gets me here. I’m all for players holding out if they think they can secure a lot more money or that they have little risk of losing potential money, but in this case I just don’t see it. The risk/reward is not there for me.
I’ll assume that Judge’s camp has a better reading on his free agent market than I do, since that’s their job…but I really just don’t see anyone giving him an offer that’s THAT much better than this to risk it. Additionally, it’s a very real concern that if he has injury issues, even small ones or under performance, that he could find himself really regretting this.
Assuming the offer is true, I am not sure how $235M over 8 years (7/$213.5M new money plus $21.5M for this year) doesn’t get it done unless Judge is looking for a 10 year deal or an AAV closer to $35M. In light of the Ramirez and Freeman deals, I’m a bit surprised he would not have gone for this offer.
Judge = Comforto2.0
Judge should look at himself in Comforto’s mirror
Fair offer from the Yankees, Judge probably wants an 8-10 year deal. Probably 10.
How does judge not take that?
Greedy and fragile guy on his 30’s rejects 200+M for playing baseball. Simply unbelievable
Curious who would offer more than that. I guess all it takes is one. I still believe he signs an extension before the arbitration hearing.
I could envision that, but Hal has a strong tendency to dig in with money, as you well know. I have a feeling they’re not close, otherwise Yankees don’t go public with the amount. That’s a public appeal to let the fan base know it was a legit offer. It’s also an object lesson in their stupid reasoning for not spending elsewhere and claiming they were saving for a Judge extension.
I just don’t see the upside for Judge. He’s likely not getting more years and the AAV seems very reasonable. He gets injured or has a down year he could be forced to take a significantly worse contract.
I agree with you. I see this as a really bad decision by Judge, but it’s easy for me to say too. Nonetheless, he’s playing a dangerous game ‘ imo, this shows he doesn’t just want to be a Yankee, he wants to be the highest paid (we all knew that, but his lip service was convincing to a degree).
Me too. For all the reasons already noted here. Honestly how much does he think he can get, with his injury history and age and everything else. The Yankees have a history of sticking to the bottom line, so he may actually end up walking and getting less money and for shorter term. And honestly, how much does the guy need? Every player now has to feel like they’re getting more than everybody else even numbers by a dollar, it’s an ego thing too unfortunately.
And like I said before, he’s not exactly indispensable, they haven’t exactly won anything with him so there’s that
7 years at $213 mil doesn’t seem bad. Judge turning it down maybe something he regrets if he misses any significant time. Look at the deal George Springer got from Toronto at what will be the same age as Judge next season, far less money than anyone thought he would get.
For the Yankees, any Judge extension overlaps with the remainder of Stanton’s contract and that creates a situation similar to what the Angels just went through with Pujols/Upton paying big money for multiple DH’s
Good luck.
Silly decision to turn down that extension. As a 30 year-old player with a legitimate injury history, what is he looking for? Sure seems like NY offered him a generous contract. Is he looking for more AAV or a longer term? I’m not sure any other team is going to be willing to beat this offer.
Better hope he stays healthy this season. That’s a very good deal for Judge
Rizzo might be traded. Going public that he talked to Judge and told him there is no Loyalty in Baseball may have sealed his Doom.
You are coming to a team and telling the Best Player to Play Hard-Ball over an Extension…Really?
You’re telling him that there is No Loyalty by referencing F. Freeman and the Braves?
If you feel this way Rizzo, why are you here?
Rizzo is probably a little bitter he turned down double the money and years from the Cubs. Wrong guy to take advice from on a contract.
@BLIN7Y
What part of that is wrong? They are members of a union and just came through a bitter lockout.
His advice is 100% true.
This is a BUSINESS run by billionaires.
I think the point is loyalty goes both ways. To the owners players are employees to the teams and like in any job how long you last and how far you go depends on you. For the players, they are mercenaries and go where the next highest dollar is. Lots of people do that in the working world as well, it is not exclusive to Baseball or pro sports in general. There is no “loyalty” on either side, just business arrangements. If you want loyalty get a dog
If Rizzo’s point is that money talks then Judge must be deaf to have not heard the 213 million voices whispering in his ear.
Conversely, Rizzo and Kris Bryant are probably the last two players anyone should be taking contract advice from
Blin7y & RSox: When I read that I couldn’t believe it. I couldn’t believe he actually gave Judge that advice since it backfired on him; I can’t believe that he said it publicly, since he chose the Yankees out of childhood loyalty by his own admission; & I REALLY can’t believe Judge left a quarter-billion dollars(!) of guaranteed money on the table to get, what, even 15% more next winter in his best-case scenario? Or he ends up like Correa, or worse yet, Bryant, playing for a losing team as the star, making about $50M + less for a shorter AAV, thus ending his own career sooner.
Bad move on Judge’s part, imho. And yeah, Yankees don’t like when guys go public. That’s not the type of club leadership they look for because it creates more dissension on the team & gives the media more meat to chew on. That was not a smart play by Rizzo, imo.
You get what I wrote
Pretty generous offer for a guy who is 30/31, a big man and injury prone.
If he doesn’t accept that then let him walk.
Trade offers please!
If I was Cashman I’d quietly have him on the block today and take the best offer by July. No way the Yankees or anyone else are gonna even think about offering him even 6 years at this point. Judge will end up having to take a Correa type deal next winter, but time is not on his side. Are his expectations still going to be what they are when he’s 32 or 33?
Judge could now become trade bait at the trade deadline, especially if arbitration doesn’t go well.
We paid 320 Million for a pitcher who can’t keep the ball in the ballpark. Kept Glyber Torres, only to use him as a bench piece. Signed Marwin Gonzalez for God knows what reason. And don’t forget we have a “China Doll” in center field.
I was raised a Yankee fan and have followed the Yankees 53 years. This owner/GM combination is the DOGGIE DOO!
Assuming Judge has a healthy and productive 2022.. what is the best case scenario for his next contract? It is difficult to imagine him getting a deal that is considerably better than that offer.
Maybe it isn’t the contract and he just wants to get out of NY so he can grow some sideburns.
Conforto alert! Don’t think anyone’s interested in paying him more than $30 million for the next 7 years. No one’s obliged to make it up to him for earning less than he was worth early in his career. If you ask me, the Yankees were very generous and it’s really foolish for him to leave this money on the table. Yankees will probably wind up giving him more I guess, but they’ll be bidding against themselves IMO.
greed – Judge
@Ducky – I would really like to hear your FULL take on this team and what Hal and Cashman have turned the team into.
Every Yankee in the locker room took the field today deflated. Yes, they played because they are professionals but you can’t tell me team morale didn’t take a hit. As I watch the game, the Yankees are flat. Throws around the infield are not crisp. I don’t see how the Judge outcome isn’t a factor today and for the rest of the year.
It’s Judge’s world and he will splash the pot whenever the eff he pleases.
A point of reference for those who think Judge is being greedy.
Since 2017, Corey Seager was worth 15.2 fWAR valued at $121.6M.
Since 2017, Judge was worth 24.5 fWAR valued at $195.8M.
Seager is 2 years and 1 day younger. He just signed a 10-year contract worth $325M with an AAV of $32.5M.
Sure, it’s crazy to turn down what Judge was offered, relatively speaking. But baseball salaries are crazy.
Fink Ployd:
I can see why you compared those 2, the dollars, but it’s not a great comparison. One is an excellent fielding RF, and the other is a below average defender at SS, 2 years different in age..
If you compare him to a good fielding SS maybe Story, only 1 year younger, is better. fWAR for Story is 21.6, which compares closer to Judge’s 24.3.
Story’s AAV is $23.3M and Judge rejected an AAV of $30.5M.
The Yankees’ offer seems more than fair.
And which one do you think Judge’s agent cited to the Yankees?
Yeah, Cashman is totally clueless to what Story and Freeman signed for. There’s not a FO in baseball that would be swayed by such an obviously bad comparison.
Story’s fWAR since 2017 is 18.5, not 21.6.
Freeman might be a better comp, as his fWAR since 2017 is 21.3; still 3.2 lower than Judge’s, and he’s two years older, but first base is closer to right field than shortstop is on the defensive spectrum.
And you’re sort of arguing against your point when you say Seager is a worse fielder than Story–since Seager’s bat got him a massive contract while Story settled for 43% of Seager’s contract despite Story’s better glove.
None of these are ideal comps. Both Freeman and Story played over 100 more games than Judge since 2017, and Judge played 93 more games than Seager. Given that WAR is cumulative, the fact that Judge’s WAR is higher than Freeman’s and Story’s, despite his being on the field so much less, speaks in favor of his value when he is healthy.
His agent obviously wouldn’t make comps with the lesser contracts; and clearly he didn’t or he’d have taken the Yankees’ offer and run like a thief.
Given that Judge is paying his agent to advise him, I assume he was counseled to reject the Yankees’ offer. I don’t think Aaron was being greedy; I think his agent must’ve stuck to the highest comp in this offseason and did his client a disservice in the process.
The Yankees’ offer was, as you say, more than fair. In fact, given the risk factor, it was generous. As I said elsewhere in this thread, I think he needs a new agent. But I can understand how his agent arrived at his inflated valuation — I don’t agree with it, but I think I understand it. I’m sure he also promoted the idea of Judge’s worth to the Yankees as the face of the franchise, a fan favorite, etc. But he should’ve taken the money.
Maybe his agent was greedy, hoping for a massive score from his percentage; or maybe he’s just not a very good agent. But, unless Aaron really doesn’t want to be a Yankee anymore (which is possible), he was ill-advised to reject the offer, IMO.
You’re wrong about Story’s fWAR, it is 21.6 for the same number of years as Judge. See for yourself:
fangraphs.com/players/trevor-story/12564/stats?pos…
As to Seager, I’m not arguing against myself. His contract is an outlier. That was an overpay, and not an insignificant one. My guess is that TEX had to overpay to get Seager to sign with them. It was $20M more than MLBTR predicted.
He’s the worst comp of all since his contract is out of line with not only Story and Freeman, but almost all the 2021 FAs. Since Seager is a better hitter than Story, the Rangers must feel that Seager’s bat will compensate for the glove, which accounts for part of that 43% difference, but as a fan of defense, I disagree.
I do agree that Judge needs a new agent. I wonder how much more than the $30.5M per year he expects to get. He may get slightly more eventually, but I think he’ll wind up with something much closer to what he was offered, than the 9-10 years at $36M that he wanted. Seems silly on his part if he truly wanted to be a Yankee for life.
Trevor Story, 2017-2021:
fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&…
18.5 fWAR
I agree with both of you, who I perceive as making the same point in different ways.
You cannot disagree that the market is what owners pay players; and Seager, a less productive player, was paid a whole lot more. That does, normally set the standard.
Yet, I do agree with the assessment that Seager & Lindor were products of aberrant contract agreements. Seager was an overreaction based on a stacked class with a ton of hype about interested big-market teams, while Lindor was Cohen’s first huge extension immediately after a trade. Both mistakes, imho.
I do agree that Judge’s value is the $36M mark based on his production, but considering his age and the movement trends in the FA market, I think this offer was very fair by the Yanks given the years/money. I really believe Judge is making a big mistake here.
It’s also evident Judge doesn’t want to be a Yankee for life, if not paid as the highest player. Contrast his statement / decision with Jose Ramirez’ with the Guardians. I’m not faulting Judge, but he’s not being genuine either.
I bet Yankee fans will be out buying D cell batteries now.
If Yankee Fans do, I sure wouldn’t want to be sitting in the Owner’s box.
You’re confusing Yankee fans with Phillies fans.
Trade him.
I don’t think it is a matter of greed, but it feels like Judge’s decision has more downside than upside. No comps are perfect, but Seager is getting $32.5 per, and many were surprised at that. And Freeman is getting $27M per. Seager is signed thru age 37 and Freeman signed thru age 37 as well.
The salary of $30.5 matches up well, and it would pay him thru age 37. Both these numbers sound about right. So my guess is that, if he repeats his 2021 season, the Cashman offer is about what he will get as a FA.
But if he gets hurt, then depending on the injury, he could get a lot less. Seems like he has a lot more to lose than to gain.
But that said, while I think Cashman’s numbers are about right, why is he publicizing it? All that does is to push Judge into a corner. If he now accepts, he comes off looking greedy and stupid. If he declines, it puts the Yankee clubhouse at risk.
My pure guess is that disclosing the offer is Hal’s idea, to get away from the reputation of being cheap.
Yeah, you go public with the number so that Judge can’t try to control the narrative. Just look at the people commenting on here about how the Yankees are cheap, blah blah blah. That’s exactly why you get in front of it by telling people what you offered.
I agree it has far more downside, Joe. I think Cashman may have done that because the season was starting today and everyone knew Judge’s deadline was up, so that would’ve been the focus of every interview from this point forward. I think it was better just to air what would’ve been put out there eventually anyway, especially in this case. It is what it is, now that narrative is dead, the questions are answered, Judge is going FA and they can play the season.
I actually agree with what Cashman did, although the fact there was selfish organizational motives doesn’t escape me – but it also doesn’t make the offer any less fair & equitable by the Yankees.
He is not about to say it, especially in that marketplace, but maybe he just doesn’t want to be there. It’s possible that it’s not about money at all.
Oh s!
Can someone explain why a team that’s supposedly so dominated by analytics “solved” their shortstop problem by acquiring IKF, who’s rated sub-par defensively at short by Statcast?
Publicly available defensive metrics are garbage. Teams have much better ones, and obviously the Yankees’ model scored IKF much more highly. Also, they got him for free in a trade that primarily involved someone else, and they used, or will use, the money they saved elsewhere.
So far, the returns aren’t good, judging from the eye test. He just booted another ball off Martinez’s bat that led to a two-run homer instead of a solo home run. He looked bad there yesterday, too. Lucky for him, the generous scorer gave Martinez a hit.
I’ll have to hope he’s just got the yips from playing in Yankee Stadium in his first games in pinstripes.
To be fair you can’t judge after one game
Two games — but no, you can’t.
easy peasy.he was inexpensive.and they are awaiting the savior Volpe.
Yes, they were saving money for Judge’s extension…whoops!
This is a mistake on Judge’s part. If I were the Yankees, I wouldnt of even offered anything over 150 million. Judge gets hurt way too much. With his age increasing, hes gonna get hurt even more. I think the Angels pick him up in free agency. They’re known for getting the worst contracts in the league (Pujols, Upton, Hamilton, Rendon, to an extent Trout)
Trade Judge for Trout.
I like where you’re going, but I don’t think I like where it ends up…
For a guy with such a history of injuries, passing this deal up seems kinda stupid. I think Aaron mis-Judged this offer! LOL Pun intended.
Way too expensive. I’d rather trade for or wait for Juan Soto to become a FA.
More than fair offer with that injury history. I think the two sides will work it out.
So let’s assume he’s not going to sign, Spankee fans; trade him now? What would you want? From the Guardians maybe. Or maybe the Giants.
Now what do ypou hoestly think you can get?
Adley Rutschman
Everyone.
Fair offer. Trade him for prospects NOW! Pick up a LH COF before the deadline. If Judge doesn’t sign with his new team, the Yankees can try again at the end of the season. Losing him for nothing or overpaying are both poor options.
Let him walk
Not signing this guy was the best off season move by Cashman
I always thought (and still do) that the Miguel Cabrera contract had to be the worst deal for a team that I’ve ever seen. The vast majority of that term covered his declining years and one injury after another. Had the Yanks agreed to Judge’s terms I think it would have ended much worse. If this guy has chronic injury issues in his 20s, what are his 30s gonna look like? The only GM I could see considering those terms is AJ Preller who is a hopeless spendaholic.
If Judge wants 10/360, let him leave. I don’t see any team giving him that regardless.
That’s just insane. His head is way too big if he thinks that even close to reasonable. Why? Why all that money just to make a point? And what point? I know he thinks he’s the best & it’s natural for him to feel that way, but did he not just watch what happened to Correa? Honestly, Lindor & Seager are complete flukes. Seager was the top of a stacked class in a sea of big market teams that needed him, so the Rangers guessed (incorrectly) that they needed to give that to him.
My biggest problem is Cashman’s statement at the presser though: they are going to try again in the offseason – that’s speak for, “We can’t spend because we are going to wait on Judge’s decision, burn another offseason, & when he goes to LAD, or wherever, we just say we tried.” Another excuse not to spend on upgrading the team while losing Judge’s bat.
right Clipper, saying”try” is code for Cashman signaling he’s giving up already. You don’t just “try” , you just go out and “ do” it. Of course I know it takes two to tango, as some here I’m sure will protest. But The Yankees have the financial resources to make it happen, just as they made the Cole contract happen. They can give him an offer He can’t refuse, to quote the godfather. But they can still do so on their terms.
You think the Mets would be too cheap to steal him from the Yankees for nothing?
He’s probably worth more to teams besides the Yankees because he’s one of the biggest draws in MLB.
We have to trade him to assure we don’t lose him for nothing.
Yeah, man, I think that’s a pretty common feeling. He should bring back some decent prospects or controllable MLB talent.
I hate to say this but trade him now! Don’t waste the chance and watch him sign on the west coast and receive nothing in return! The return for him right now would be huge, the longer they wait the return finishes. They can sign Conforto to play RF. I hate the fact that we may not have Judge but cmon, passing up on that contract and asking what it appears he’s asking is a clear sign he wants to test the market and thinks he may not be a Yankee! I would ask for a few top prospects and a starting pitcher that can help now.
Judge must be aiming to win MVP this year.
I wonder what his ask was?
I guess you can make a bet like that when you already have more money than you really NEED. How far apart can you really be …when you are already in the 1/4 Billion-dollar range?
The article says 9 to 10 years with an AAV of $36M.
As a Yankees fan I am a fan and like Aaron Judge a lot. I hope that the Yankees and Judge can come to a agreement. But, I don’t believe that Judge is comparable to Mike Trout, 1 of the greatest players in history or as great a player as Mookie Betts, 1 of the greatest players playing.
Heyman then reported a mystery team was involved
Mystery team! We’ve been HEYMANED
Yankees dodged a bullet (so far). He is just a bigger Ellsbury. Look at his stats. His 2017 was galactic ! After that he tried too hard to replicate the home runs and his walk rate and .OBP never came close to 2017 again. He also could not stay on the field all year any year until last year. He had months to rest during Covid and still appeared in less than half of the 2020 season. If you look at Ellsbury’s numbers, very similar, except that Ells had a good walk year and the Sox won the WS and the Yankees gave him Cano’s exact deal to be spiteful to Cano.
As a Yankees fan, I’m tired of watching the Rays beat us with 1/3 the payroll, and then we have to pay them rev share money and share the judge jersey sales with all teams. I’m tired of paying top dollar for the back 9 of a star’s career. I like judge but I’m staring at his stats and 2017 production is irreplaceable. The 30 year old (this month) Judge is not irreplaceable…
When I compare Judge to Ellsbury, I am looking at solid year then injured year. I am also looking at Ellsbury’s solid 2014 and then 6 more years that weren’t, including the last 2 when he didn’t play at all and because of that, I dread a long judge contract…
Damn! How could they think a person who plays a game for a career could possibly live on a measly $30m/yr.
Think of the children!!!!!
Judge is asking for a 10 yr/$360 million deal. This is his age 30 season, so its all downhill in terms of performance from here on out in his career.
If I am Cashman or Steinbrenner, would I want to buy 10 years of decline? Judge would be starting at a really good platform after his 2021 season with a 149 OPS+, so the 1st 5 years of that deal are still over league average. Since his bat is so good now, I would even give him the benefit of the doubt and say a 6th season where he is right about average is possible.
Would years 6-10 be worth $180 million when his bat is just league average or below?? What do you say Yankees fans?
Resounding, “NO!” on 10/$360.
Ya know, the Yanks could take a page out of the Braves’ manual here – trade Judge for a some really good prospects, then use a bunch of prospects to acquire Soto, then extend him with the money/years Judge wanted – boom, done! Fans are happy, Judge goes west or to the O’s, or wherever, & lives out his dream as the highest paid FA for one offseason (maybe).
Do the Yankees have the prospects, even after trading one year of Judge, to get Soto?
Obviously any serious offer for Soto would have to start with Volpe. That would be a hard pill to swallow after they didn’t sign one of the top FA SS this offseason to leave room for Volpe.
I would think it would also take at least 3 of the Yankees next 6 top prospects. Would that be enough?
IF the Yankees have the chance to flip Judge to get Soto in a 3 team trade, you do it. He is 23 years old and is already a superstar. I’d give up Dominguez and Volpe without a thought.
I think there’s zero chance that the Nat’s trade Soto, even for Judge, Volpe, and Dominquez.
Wow…your valuation of Soto is ridiculous given Judge, Volpe, and Dom. in a trade.
According to the trade evaluator I use Soto has a median trade vale of 224.7. Judge, Volpe, and Dominquez have a combined median trade value of 118.10. So it’s not just me.
118.10 is excellent value, just not nearly enough for Soto. Of course it wouldn’t be the first time a Yankee fan (not all), overvalued their own assets, while undervaluing the other teams.
That whole Soto to the Yankees idea came from Jim Bowden. No way it happens. Even if he’s worth it, the Yankees would be crazy to empty (not really an exaggeration) the farm for him.
The Yankees emptying the farm for Soto actually makes a ton of sense. Very few Yankee prospects ever pan out besides Judge. Yankees hold onto prospects for too long until they lose all their trade value. Frazier, Andujar, Chance Adams, etc. There’s also no real way to know if Jasson or Volpe are the real deal especially given how terribly the Yankees develop up-and-coming players.
I’d trade Judge, Dominguez, and Volpe for Soto in an instant. Someone else commented saying the Yankees have won nothing with Judge and I completely agree. No love lost if Judge goes in free agency. Soto is a better player and is younger and not injury-prone. Soto deserves a 10 year contract at 50mm annually.
Judge turning down the Yankees’ offer shows his true character as the deal was very fair. Judge is like Cano – money over everything else. Terrible
My thought was to trade Judge to whoever, take those players and add Volpe, Dominguez and other prospects for Soto. I don’t realistically think Judge, Volpe and Dominguez would net Soto.
Joe: Yeah, my comment was in jest, obviously, but it sure made me feel better to write it!
The ask on Soto would be huge, unless they wait another two years or so, which is still fine because he’s so young. But, honestly, do you see Hal ever paying that amount of money to Soto? I doubt it, especially once he gets completely away from the CBT in ‘23-‘24. He will likely never cross it again & treat it as a hard cap – same approach, lower his ceiling. By then the fanbase will be used to hearing about the CBT excuse, we will be used to just settling and watching the FAs go everywhere else, and like the Royals, we can be excited when prospects finally work out.
Problem is Judge doesn’t net the prospects necessary to get Soto.
I think Judge’s fate is tied to how good of a season Jasson Dominguez has. If Dominguez hits and climbs through the ranks quickly the Yankees let Judge walk. They could probably keep Gallo on a short term deal as a buffer til Dominguez is ready
love that idea Clipper, I wouldn’t mind Soto lol.
If they’re not gonna seriously sign him though, they better hurry before they lose any value he has left. As we’ve seen they have a tendency to wait too long on these matters
Don’t think the Yanks will empty the Farm for 3 years of Soto knowing they won’t extend him and will be in a bidding war for him. After Soto turned down the 13 yr $350million from the Nats, he already said that he and Boras decided that he would go year to year through the ARB process then head into Free Agency. No guarantee that they will get him in FA.
Doc: See, you get me, man. Lol. But, yeah, trading him is probably not a bad idea. Cashman already confirmed they’re going to resubmit an offer in the offseason for Judge though, so there goes next offseason too…
He’s another Stanton contract waiting to happen. And a total bust. He breaks a finger nail and he’s on the DL. He’s way too soft
He’s going to get the Freddy Freeman treatment. Get a lowball offer then end up signing with someone else.
Do you really consider $30.5M a year for 7 years, to a guy that’s 30 years old, a lowball offer? Freeman is just a year older and his AAV is $27M.
Plus, after factoring in the massive tax difference between California and Georgia Freeman’s deal is actually worth less than the Braves offered
Oops, My bad. Freeman is 2 years older.
No Yankee fan wants Judge to bolt. He will eventually get the $$ he wants
That money just might not be from the Yankees
Spot on
Yankee fans have no say in the matter. If Cashman can’t get Judge to sign for something close to what he think’s Judge’s value is, they’ll move on. They aren’t going to overpay, at least not by a lot, and $36M for 9 or 10 years is an overpay, and not a slight one.
This makes me think back to when Brian Dozier’s contract with the Twins was winding down, and he was bucking for a sizable extension. Fans took a dim view of the FO for not “paying the man”. Twins took a hard pass and ultimately looked like geniuses when Dozier’s numbers began cratering the very next year. Some of the best deals are the ones you don’t make.
Upon due consideration, I’ve concluded that Judge needs a new agent.
I’m not going to call Judge greedy. He’s paying Page Odle a percentage to advise him and negotiate for him. If anyone’s greedy, it’s Odle. Or he’s just regrettably unrealistic.
His client is a great player when he’s healthy, but he’s been icing his knees for years. This is what Aaron said about that in 2017:
“I’m a tall guy. I keep falling down on my knees! Two hundred and eight pounds going down on your knees is a little tough.”
If Aaron ends up on the IL again, no team is going to offer him what he turned down today.
I love the guy, but I don’t blame the Yankees at all for not offering more. They were taking a big gamble too, to offer what they did.
I dunno how Judge hooked up with Odle at PSI Sports Management, but their stable of clients is pretty small potatoes compared to the Who’s-Who of baseball managed by Boras. I’m afraid Judge might’ve made a bad call there.
I agree pink. I love the guy but he’s making a big mistake, And it was a reasonable offer, a life-changing amount. it’s a big gamble ,he can go down for the season at any time and then he’ll be worth very little. I would like the Yankees to keep him but if he leaves they’ll survive. They haven’t won anything with him so as the saying goes you know ,they could just as easily continue the trend without hin,unless things change in the front office in my opinion.
Yeah I wouldn’t call Judge greedy but him saying he wants to stay in NY is BS. He wants as much money as he can get and that’s just fine.
Totally agree Joe. Why not ask for the moon? But when he put a deadline on negotiating, it seemed like he wasn’t willing to bargain/compromise, which, as you say, makes it seem like it’s all about the money.
Not necessarily. He sort of has to go through the process. Otherwise he spends the rest of his time there being hated. So you ask for the moon, knowing they won’t agree to it and then move on at the end of the year. You would have to think he is eventually going to accept less than 10/360. All guesswork of course, but I’m thinking he might just want a change of scenery.
Apparently so Joe.He’s already made himself look bad with the whole vaccination thing.this is just adding insult to injury.
Personally I don’t care about the vaccine one way or another, but if it affects other people, and the team it is an issue. If you can’t play in Toronto for example for nine games it’s an issue.
Not only the 9 regular season games but imagine if they have to go to Toronto for the playoffs.
Ah yes, give in to peer pressure! This is 5th grade.
I guess I’m just being a “ snowflake” for not liking it, according to a commenter here lol.
judge is a moron for not taking that deal. No team will give him more than that and if he has a bad season or is injured, again, for a chunk of it that offer from cashman will be off the table.
Seems like this disconnect between the organization and the player could be easily be resolved to the satisfaction of both parties by taking it before a JUDGE !!
Judge is insane if he thinks he is getting $36M for 9-10 years. He’ll be three years older than some of the guys pulling 9-10 year deals.
Yeah, his baseline is what’s called a non-starter. That’s no extension interest, that’s not interest in the Yankees. That’s interest in being the highest paid player & staying in the league way past the point you’re so old nobody wants to see you walk on the field anymore, unless it’s for Old Timer’s Day. Frankly, that’s fine because it’s his choice, but don’t pretend otherwise. I hope Cashman & co. don’t meet that offer this offseason because I don’t think Judge will match it anyway. More AAV for less years? Okay that’s fine, but let him walk if he wants more.
Shockingly, I’m with the current Yankees regime, as inept as they are, on this one.
Clipper I’m with you. If Judge wants to walk let him ,Yankees will survive. They havent exactly won anything with him anyway. I would feel more comfortable offering him $35 million a year for six anyway. Remember the last few years of a Rod‘s contract they were excruciating to watch him ,he could barely limp onto the field, his hips were rebuilt and he could not play . Yankees uncharacteristically paid him off his last year to go away, he was so bad. This augers for another repeat of that fiasco.
Jose Ramirez took 5/124 for seasons 2024 thru 29. I would much rather have him than Judge for what the Yankees offered.
Agreed
Not only that but compare the two players’ statements with their actions: Both said they wanted to stay with their teams for life. Both said they wanted to get extensions done. Both teams reciprocated in sentiment.
One team made, arguably, a very undervalued offer. The second team, a very reasonable, market-based offer.
Given just those facts, which player would you have imagined would turn down their respective offer? Of course, Ramirez! That tells you which player was genuine and which player was simply trying to buy up air time with empty speak.
Can you believe Judge turned this down:
As per Heyman
The offer was $30.5M over 7 years on the extension, above both Mike Trout and Mookie Betts. Plus $19M this year. So that would make it $233M over 8>
Now it’s time for Judge to put up some MVP numbers this season and prove he’s worth that money. Then he can look for that big contract. .400/.600/.850
I rather trade him for trout and use the money yankees offered to pay trout contract. Circle of life. NJ Kid and LA kid why not?
Because the Angels would never do it.
Wow! Fans can’t complain. That was a more than fair offer if it’s an accurate report.
The ask is also so massively unrealistic I’d trade him. They’d get outbid on the open market and lose a star for nothing.
Judge is gambling on himself for no reason. Injury history plus his age, I don’t see a team paying him his ask. Look at what happened with Rizzo, KB, and Baez after they tried betting on themselves in FA after fair value extensions were offered. They signed for less in FA. Another example could be Conforto..
Don’t forget about Correa, probably the biggest red flag for Judge, given Correa’s production on both sides of the ball. Correa is also younger, even if more injury-prone. I think the feeling is pretty universal that Judge is going to look back on this and wonder what he was thinking … plus, 7 additional years puts him at 38, that’s really, really advanced for MLB, obviously. I don’t understand his thought process other than he feels he’s the top player in the game & deserves a directly proportional salary.
Very strange indeed, but Yankees fans can’t fault the Yankees for this specific offer in terms of years/money. But there’s a whole lot of ancillary/related stuff we can…….
If Judge can convince the Yankees to let Jeffry Loria and David Samson own the team for one year, Loria will give Judge a 20-year deal for $900 million, with a full no-trade clause, and a Bobby Bonilla clause. No physical will be taken. And the money will be deferred so that while Loria is the owner for the one year, Judge’s salary will be $1, but then the big money starts to kick in when the team is returned to the Steinbrenners.
“At the end of the year, I’ll be a free agent,” Judge said. “Get to talk to 30 teams. The Yankees will be one of those 30 teams.”
——-
Doesn’t sound like a man committed to being a Yankee for life.
“Everybody loves playing in New York!”
– some guy using logic from a time before every state in the country had a metropolitan city and before the invention of the internet.
Good luck with that. I’m sure they’ll be plenty of teams lining up to give a then 31 year old With an injury history to boot, a nine or 10 year contract
Yankees can survive without him.
I rather be a Pirates fan where they pay no one than be a Yankee fan and watch them pay everyone except the best player on the roster