Negotiations on a new contract extension between Xander Bogaerts and the Red Sox didn’t result in a deal prior to Opening Day, and at the time, Bogaerts implied that the opener was an unofficial deadline. “I’ve got a season coming up in front of me and I don’t want to put any of our teammates in that type of distraction,” Bogaerts said. “They don’t deserve it. We had time to get something done. It didn’t work out.”
Now, Bogaerts has left the door slightly open for more talks during the season, telling The Boston Globe’s Peter Abraham that “I don’t know how this would work. But if they talk to [agent Scott Boras] behind closed doors and it’s something that’s fair, he can come to me. We’ll see how that goes.”
Most players set Opening Day as the endpoint for any contract negotiations, echoing Bogaerts’ point that once games begin, the focus is solely on baseball. (Even in Bogaerts’ proposed scenario, he would himself seemingly have no role in active talks.) Most extensions that are announced during the season tend to be announced perhaps within the first few weeks, indicating that the two sides had things mostly finalized aside from a few small details.
That said, it isn’t uncommon for extensions to be struck during the season. 2021 alone saw multiple deals finalized well into the year, including extensions involving the Red Sox (their two-year pact with Matt Barnes) and another Boras Corporation client (Jonathan Schoop, who inked a new deal to stay with the Tigers). However, all of those extensions were for significantly shorter terms and for less money than what Bogaerts is undoubtedly looking for in a new contract.
Bogaerts is already under contract via a prior six-year, $120MM extension signed in April 2019. The shortstop can opt out of that deal after the season, leaving behind the $60MM he is guaranteed between 2023-25 plus a $20MM vesting option for 2026. There is little doubt that Bogaerts will indeed opt out and hit the open market, as entering his age-30 season, the three-time All-Star could triple the $60MM he’d be leaving on the table in Boston given how this past offseason raised the bar for shortstop contracts.
With the larger shortstop market in mind, perhaps the key point in Bogaerts’ quote is “something that’s fair.” Reports have suggested that the Red Sox made a curiously low offer to Bogaerts’ camp, with the team proposing to extend the term by just one guaranteed year — Bogaerts would earn around $30MM for the 2026 season, and still be paid $20MM for each of the next three seasons. Boston’s proposal apparently didn’t get a response from Bogaerts and his reps, and one friend of Bogaerts described the offer as “a slap in the face.”
It could be that the Red Sox were simply starting low as a negotiating tactic, and as Abraham notes, team president Sam Kennedy and chief baseball officer Chaim Bloom have said that the Sox want to retain both Bogaerts and Rafael Devers (who is a free agent after the 2023 season). That said, the Red Sox also signed Trevor Story to a big six-year, $140MM free agent deal, and the team has one of the game’s top shortstop prospects in Marcelo Mayer. Between Story, Mayer, and the lowball offer, it would seem like the Sox are already preparing themselves for life beyond Bogaerts, unless he happened to take that below-market extension.
While Boras has a reputation for pushing his clients towards free agency, several high-profile Boras Corporation clients have indeed signed extensions over the years — even Bogaerts himself re-upped with the Sox entering his final year under team control. Of those deals, however, Stephen Strasburg’s 2016 extension with the Nationals is the only big-money, multi-year pact signed in-season, and Strasburg and the Nats were much closer in talks than Bogaerts and the Sox seem to be at this point.
With Bogaerts this close to the open market, it would seem like the Red Sox would have to (if anything) overpay to prevent him from opting out. The other factor involved is Boston’s mediocre start to the 2022 season, as with only a 13-21 record thus far, there has already been whispers that Bogaerts could be a deadline trade chip rather than a future cornerstone. If the Red Sox continue to struggle and lean towards becoming deadline sellers, it could be that the Sox might take the approach of revisiting extension talks with Bogaerts around the All-Star break, and if a deal can’t be struck, the team would then focus on trading him.
I hope they can come to terms but Im not holding my breath. It really seems like the FO doesnt have a lot of desire to keep him on at a much higher salary, and if they dont, I think that really hampers their ability to get Devers long term going into next season.
Fever Pitch Guy
If Bloom truly wanted to keep Xander, he would have made serious offers to him prior to last offseason. Because everybody knew the shortstop free agent superclass would cause Xander’s price to go up.
And if that wasn’t enough of a clue, signing Story should have been. There’s no chance Bloom will invest $320M combined for just the middle infield.
And if THAT wasn’t enough of a clue, then putting out a 4-year $90M offer to Xander was basically waving goodbye to him. Making lowball offers that they know the player will reject is just a devious way to make the fanbase believe the team wanted the player back. It’s for show, nothing more.
After seeing how Story has been performing, one wonders if they may explore this as a realistic option. Although, they may take the NYY route of waiting for unproven prospects too (Marcelo Mayer). Alternative option would be to pivot to a familiar face in Iglesias next season, while awaiting Mayer, who is performing smashingly in Col.
I think they hedged their bets with Story since Mayer isnt gonna sniff the majors for 2-3 more years unless he tears through the minors like a wildfire. More likely scenario is they let Bogey go, shift Story to SS and call up Jeter Downs or Nick Yorke for 2nd in the next year. Either way, Im not a fan. Xander really should finish his career in Boston.
B-strong – “ …..finish his career in Boston”. Let me add “as a third base man or left fielder”.
I would like Bogaerts bat to stay in Boston, but his glove needs to change positions.
Should he wear it on his right hand?
Wow, do you have a problem reading or strictly with compression? You missed it. Lol
Can anyone tell me why there’s such a rush to get an extension done? He’s in what looks to be year 3 of a six year contract. Why don’t the Red Sox just ride it out and see where things are a few years from now.
Opt-out after this year. From the article, “ The shortstop can opt out of that deal after the season, leaving behind the $60MM ”
Thanks for pointing that out. I skimmed the article and somehow missed that was looking at the details on baseball reference. Seeing he is a Boras client so no surprise the opt out is there haha.
Yep, and I believe he’s already confirmed publicly he’s opting out, if I recall correctly. Like you said, as a successful Boras player, there’s no way he’s staying locked in to a contract.
Nor should he. When players add opt-outs, it is often because they sign for slightly less or slightly shorter. I’m hoping he extends, but this is one guy I will be rooting hard for, no matter where he goes.
Assuming it is not with the EE, but even then, I wouldn’t root against him.
I’m waiting for the article that says Boston wants to talk extension. Until then, this is just Bogaerts not getting the message that no team, including his current one, views him as a SS going forward. He is not getting SS money. He is already getting 2B money. Castallanos money sounds right for him. 5/$100-120MM
Funny they don’t mention him officially opting out yet. Lets give references when we make such bold comments especially with a Yankee moniker.
He is not getting SS money.
Nor should he. But he should get 3B money. It was an overpay, imo, but Bryant got $182M/7.
IMO, both sides could do a lot worse than replicating Story’s contract, plus adding a few quid as an acknowledgement that Bogaerts is a true RS player.
Bogaerts has been to the ‘tournament and been on tournament winners’ and that’s what contenders are looking for. Would Bogaerts change positions?? I don’t know? I do know he’s a team first player. I like that.
Devers and Bogaerts appear to be’ big brother little brother.’ To me Devers should be a 1 B or DH. Is Story a better SS than Bogaerts? I don’t know but if he is find a trade partner like the Angels or Padres and make that deal NOW.
Tampa is Tampa–there’s no other franchise like them. When they traded Longoria, the Face of the Franchise, I was shocked. To me that was the beginning of the turnaround. Pitching has been the name of the game and they have stayed focused building that position. Wander is a great talent..
A couple of years ago the Ray’s average was 14,552. The Red Sox average attendance is about 28,000 plus NESN. They can afford to play at the Dodgers & Yanks salary levels; they are choosing at this time to see if being frugal financially works. What does the ‘Nation’ think is the Q.
Bryant has position flexibility and is at least average defensively. None of us knows if XB is willing to even move off SS, which is a deal breaker in itself.
Everyone but you knows Story is the better SS. If XB was that true team player, he would have changed positions now. But he wants to get SS money, which is why the team is willing to suffer his play out of respect for his previous years of service. Doesn’t sound very “team player” at all.
KD-17: “Funny they don’t mention him officially opting out yet. Lets give references when we make such bold comments especially with a Yankee moniker.”
Well, he can’t opt-out yet, so that’s a silly point you make. He has to wait until season’s end. Nonetheless, you’re assertion is that I’m making hyperbolic statements because I’m a Yankees fan? Wow, you must not pay attention….at all. Did you read the article where they quoted him saying Boston’s offer for extension was a “slap in the face.” Or that he’s a Boras client? Or that he’s leaving only $60M on the table for the opt-out? The guy has top-tier offensive seasons. He’s not staying in Boston on a discount, imo. Why would he?
I don’t mind being accused of being biased towards the Yankees (although I’m more critical on them than most), but your perception of your own team is…..slightly off-base.
I’d say Bogaerts has more flexibility since he can play 3rd or SS, while Bryant can play 3rd and LF. That said, if Bogaerts insists on staying at SS, that could be a non-starter for us, but would also limit the amount of suitors he would have. But I don’t expect he would insist on that.
I don’t mind being accused of being biased towards the Yankees
Honestly, if I want an unbiased opinion about the RS, I’d ask a Yankee fan. They know the same amount about the RS as the do the NYY. And RS fans are either too pro-RS, or absolutely hate the RS.
And I’d bet I am a lot more unbiased about the NYY than most NYY fans, for the same reason.
Fever Pitch Guy
stymee – What amount do you consider “SS money”?
Because Story is a shortstop who got $140M guaranteed, and Marcus Semien is a shortstop who got $175M guaranteed, and Xander will no doubt blow by both those amounts with his next contract.
If you’re talking Seager money, then yeah I agree.
Fever Pitch Guy
stymee – Xander did switch to 3B years ago, it did not go well. You’ve gotta be careful with that sort of thing as some players who try to field a new position wind up having a big drop in their offensive production because of the switch.
He has an opt out after this year and he’s going to exercise it
He has an opt out after this season and barring an injury he will assuredly opt out of the final 3 years and $60 million.
Makes sense that he would use this to leverage an extension. Red Sox have the ability to get a deal done.
nh_55 – Bogey and Boras took the $20MM a year deal from DD because of the opt out. The price was below market value so the team bought Bogey for 3 years under his value. It was a win-win for both sides. If Bogey wasn’t good Boston was protected and if he was Bogey could make a significant jump in his pay after three years of being paid under his worth. It’s still a win-win because we got Bogey and he performed far above his $20MM price tag.
Now the decision is renew for more (something more representative of his contributions in the future) or simply walk away when Bogey opts out. Frankly, ANY normal big market team wouldn’t let go of such a precious player but since their most recent mistakes suggest this team doesn’t use sound logic in their decision making based on their Mookie mistake, it seems very likely he will opt out without a fair offer from Boston.
That will be TWO homegrown all-stars being thrown away under the Bloom regime. That counteracts the DD regime where he brought in Price, Sale and JD. Too bad Cora was manager otherwise I believe all three acquisitions would have been highly successful. Bench coaches that screw up elite pitchers should never become managers!!!!
Losing Bogey pushes the next championship much farther in the future. It’s been over 2 years since Mookie got pushed out and we are NOWHERE near another championship we are closer to Baltimore. If Bogey goes and anyone else, the chance of a championship this decade will disappear unless Bloom gets the boot and a REAL GM gets hired. One with experience in big markets and a history of success not failure which will be Bloom’s legacy.
Bogaerts got a raise above arbitration amounts early and a guarantee and protection in case of injury or decline. Hardly underpaid. A 2B who can play ave defense and hit is worth about $20-25MM per, max. Let him walk and spend the money on pitching.
Mookie wanted to leave. He wanted California and that’s the only place he was going .
Fever Pitch Guy
Jaa – That’s totally wrong, Mookie wanted bank. He would have played in Cincinnati if they had offered him what he wanted.
And he didn’t “choose” to go to the Dodgers, the Red Sox decided that was the best deal they could get (granted, what they got in return hasn’t worked out very well thus far).
Did you read the piece? He has an opt out so the deal will end after this season.
No just skimmed it. It was late. Was a faux pas on my part. Only looked at baseball reference for his contract and that didn’t show his opt out.
fffbbb: Did you read a single comment in the tread, other than nh55’s, before you commented? Youre the 4th reply explaining it.
Pot Calling Kettle.
Give him whatever he wants because many of us don’t care about squeezing every drop of possible “surplus value” out of every possible roster spot at every level of the organization. Bogaerts was more than fair to the team the first time around and fans should not expect him to demand well above market value this time around. I would just give him a blank check and he can do whatever he wants with it. He has done everything that has been asked of him in this organization for more than ten years, from performance to leadership to media relations to a steadying hand for other young star players. That is worth something. Not to mention that his performance is perhaps less than recognized by the general public. Potential free agent acquisitions and amateur signings, and current major and minor leaguers can and will take note of how the Red Sox choose to proceed. If there’s a Red Sox Way, Xander has always checked every box. The Red Sox should seize the opportunity to set a high bar and reward it accordingly. They risk losing the clubhouse and fan base if they choose not to meet that bar, and he is not trying to extort the team as they hit this crossroads. Give him a blank check, trust him, and see what happens, you might just like it.
Guys like Bloom don’t care about any of that. He seems focused on trying to prove to everyone how clever he is yet his performance so far has been mostly abysmal. If he is intent on letting Bogarts go for whatever reason, fine (not that I care either way). But don’t massively insult the guy with a one year $30M extension. Instead of just staying quiet, why publicly spit in the guy’s face.
He’s another victim of the MLB love affair with the Rays system. He (and apparently 85% of all GMs) think they can apply the Rays version of Money Ball to their own franchise and put a winner on the field – FAIL. NY tried the same thing, and when they do, it fails.
That, and they actually thought Cora was good….
Indeed. I don’t know why some teams think they can just replicate what the Rays have done by hiring one of their front office guys.
I’d say what Friedman has done in LA (combining big mkt spending with the Rays emphasis on player dev and drafting) should be the model for larger mkt organizations like Boston.
And you are 100% correct. LAD should be *the* model for the big markets, especially since they’ve shown they can grow & develop talent while keeping competitive teams on the field. Now, they also spend without worry, which the Yankees should also be doing, without worry.
Cap & Crunch
Many forget LAD has made many blunders of their own –
Fried’s big moves upon arrival was inking 2 absurd guys in Scott Kazmir and Brandon McCarthy to some pretty good coin
There was the albatross Pollock contract where they bid against themselves , refusal to pay for the pen Frieds first 3~4 yrs when we needed it most, then the Bauer catastrophe
One thing I can say is he does seem to learn from his mistakes and if you asked him Id bet ya he’d tell ya he’s still getting better today. I appreciate that and for other big market teams transitioning Id probably just say expect some bumps in the road with the learning curve
Hindsight, man. None of those deals you’ve mentioned where mega-deals like Mookie’s and they didn’t handcuff the franchise. Bauer, at the time, was market rate. And I feel he’s handled that colossal fallout really well. Kershaw to a one-year and landing an icon like Freeman was really good work.
Cap: Makes sense, but I think the emphasis is much more on the prospect development aspect in LA’s case, especially as a big-market team, & blending it with their stars. Granted, I’m not really sure it’s saved them that much compared with the Yankees.
In all honesty, depending on how the Yankees fair over the next three seasons, we may be talking about big markets modeling after Cashman! I never thought I’d say that. Time will tell.
Because just like music, movies and many other things it’s a sheep mentality of trying to copy what others did to be successful. Nobody can think for themself anymore, too damn lazy and dumb.
I think you have to give Bloom time. The “Rays” method isn’t meant to produce immediate results, it’s a slow burn upward and then hopefully long term , sustained success follows, but it’s bound to take a few years to really kick in.
Great take, Clipper, FSF, & RHS – refreshing to read honest perspectives on the Sox. The Bloom era in a word? Irritating.
Cosmo: I believe you’re right; however, I don’t think it’s ultimately effective. The Rays model is limited & applicable to the Rays. Perhaps a few select franchises. But the new Mets, the Yankees, RSox, LAD, etc, don’t have the franchise design for that model to be successful, especially as a perennial WS contender.
Its development is realized in the concept that a team with [more] access to talent can use its evaluation process to maximize the percentage of good fruit, which then churns that talent out, before it fails or gets too expensive, in trade for more talent to add to its system, having a compound effect. However, this is not without sacrifice –
The aforementioned teams do not have the access or the systems in place to gather, maximize (in number), & turn over the young, inexpensive talent, particularly in the volume necessary for it to be effective for an entire roster.
I could be wrong, but I’ve seen the Yankees try and try again. They fail and fail again. It’s for the very same reasons. They don’t have the same number of opportunities to get it right. They don’t have the access, they don’t have the availability, they don’t have the roster room, & they don’t have the volume to move at the pre-arb -to-arb stages for compounding the talent to make it successful and build a roster from it. So, it ends up like spending your paycheck on one lottery ticket and hoping to win, imo. That’s just my perspective and it could be way off base though. You’re a very smart guy and I respect your opinion a lot, bro.
NY tried the same thing, and when they do, it fails.
I disagree. When Cashman finally pivoted to creating a minor league system, the NYY were very much improved. The NYY had a 4-year average of 85 wins. Now they are back to the old days of the Core Four, and winning 90+ every year.
I think what you are seeing is the Friedman version of the TB system. Continuing development, coupled with cap+ spending. He inherited talent, but 90 wins is a bad season for them.
I would point out that the Yankees had a bottom 4 system some years back and in one weekend in 2017 they bought nearly half of all the foreign amateur free agents available in the top 50 placing them in the top 5 systems within a year. In 2018 they repeated by buying the top 4 of 12 in the world. They don’t NEED moneyball. They have been buying a minor league system consistently since 2016. The low picks in the draft each year to the Yankees is a chance to add a possible cherry on top, and maybe some caramel.
it’s a sheep mentality of trying to copy what others did to be successful.
Yes and no. You certainly don’t want to be trailing others as the data evolves.
But you certainly want to replicate best practices from other companies. All things being equal, you will only have the best idea one out of thirty times. If you can make that 2 or 3 out of 30, you’re probably doing well. But you can copy ideas from 29 other competitors.
And why would Bloom follow the Rays method 100% when he’s got twice the payroll to work with. This is year 3 Bloom has one year left.
Well, first of all, if those teams don’t have the “franchise design” then THAT is what they need to hire someone to correct. A winning formula works for anyone who applies it properly (until EVERYONE does it). Plus, the Yankees have been just about as successful as the Rays lately so…
Not many can make a $100mm mistake and remain in the same job to say they are still learning.
JoeBrady: Yes, I agree & didn’t intend to imply minor league systems were not important. But the money ball attempts failed miserably. They can’t create a full roster of analytics guys and cheap talent like the Rays. When they focus on that area, particularly with important positions, they fail because they don’t have the capability to do it.
That’s why I assert developmental blend with their greatest asset (money), is the way to go. They’ll never be the A’s or Rays, with a successful team of high-level performers at $150M. It won’t happen…ever. Cashman rebuilt their farm using their position of power, then used their power to rebuild their team, that’s why it worked.
So, in short, I believe we agree.
Cosmo: Yeah, I agree with you on that, but it circles back to one’s definition of success. Yankees are trying to build a Rays style team with the goal of a WS. Well, even the best team at doing that (the Rays) hasn’t won the WS this way. If a team is simply trying to eek out a playoff spot, sure. A’s & Rays mastered that formula. But, that’s not big-market success. I don’t view the Rays as successful. I don’t view the A’s as successful. The goal is to win – they don’t, plain and simple. But that only my perspective. Many disagree with that assessment.
If the Mets, with Cohen, end up cutting payroll and only earn a playoff spot, but get eliminated each year, without going to the WS, the fan base would not consider that a success. They would demand spending to overcome whatever hurdles exist, imho. That’s where the Yankees are, and have been, since 1994.
So, in short, I believe we agree.
To be honest, there might not be a Tampa “system” at all. Everyone wants to maximize their draft picks and international signings. And depending on whether you have money or not, some teams can hold onto their players through the end of their term; some not. But TB is not alone in trading their best players as they age.
If there is something that distinguishes TB from other teams, it might be the effort to better develop better players. While not quite universal, Cashman seems to have done a good job converting failed SPs into very good RPs.
With Bloom, I noticed that he spent a lot of time developing Houck. Houck was never close to a lock to be a pro. His BB9 ranged from 3.2 to 5.0, and it was only in 2021 that he got that number “down” to 3.0. He is almost 26, and still has only 112.2 career IPs.
To paraphrase Branch Rickey, I’d prefer to promote someone a year too late than a year to early.
Cap & Crunch
@Bleacher creature The deals were all horrible
All Im saying is Friedman inherited a great great team with a loaded farm and ability to spend 200+ every year and still stumbled over his shoes for awhile
It took him TIME to figure out the secret sauce, it wasn’t packed in his suitcase when he left Tampa …It will take Bloom time as well
This whole replication process is silly tho, as if you can just copy something and rise to the top
Its not that simple, lot of emotion being over spilled by Red Sox fans today….same can be said for Yankee fans preseason. Nature of the beast these days, the word patience doesn’t even exist anymore
Fever Pitch Guy
FSF – Great post!
I’m indifferent towards Scott Boras and feel Bogaerts should fire him if he really wants to get a new deal done soon.
Bogaerts with Boras made his last team friendly deal but he did it with a professional GM (DD) rather than a journeyman GM who is clueless. Boras won’t over-rule Bogaerts if he wants to stay in Boston but the deal needs to be worthy of his performances. Low-balling a top 3 SS is not a smart move by Bloom.
See there are more SS than 2 that have better skills than Bogey but Bogey consistently puts up the numbers and plays the full season. Yes, Tatis is better but he can’t stay on the field. His contract is a huge risk. Seager missed time as did many other upper tier SSs. Add the OPS+ values for the last three years and you;’ll find that Bogey, thanks to his consistency of play and not missing time to injury is better than nearly everyone, even those that have higher ceilings.
That’s why Bogey needs to be offered $32 to $35MM per year for 3 years ($100MM for 3 years) then lower the amount by $5MM for the next 3 years with an opt out for both sides after three years. If Mayer is ready and really good in 3 years then the team opts out. If he’s not advancing like he should, we cross our fingers Bogey accepts the $25MM a year in year 4 or we renegotiate another similar extension based on circumstances that exist in 3 years.
There is no guarantee Mayer will be at Bogey’s level, you can only hope and you can’t bank on hope.
I saw Boston Deal Nomar I do not think they care about loyalty to an OK SS.
Nomar was miserable and taking the team with him. It was ugly at the end.
Fever Pitch Guy
whyhayzee – Nomar wasn’t miserable, he just couldn’t stand the Boston media. Which in turn caused the Boston media to crap all over him.
Yea there were a thousand obvious reasons to shoot Nomar out of a cannon that year. Not really an example where “loyalty” applies.
The move they made brought a World Series to Boston and proved they could win without him and his over-inflated self worth.
Jeter really made him look real bad when he crashed head first into the stands and Nomar was taking a day off during a key game.
That’s etched in my mind forever. There was Jeter coming out of the stands with his head bleeding. while Nomar was on the bench brooding.
That said, I also consider that day the dawn of the RS resurgence. Without that kind of obvious dichotomy, we might not have made the move. 4 WSC later, we owe it all to Jeter diving into the stands.
Orlando Cabrera turned out to be a God-send. Like the old saying says….they dropped a dime to pick up a quarter.
Bloom and Gloom. He dealt Mookie. He won’t have a problem dealing Xander or Devers. He’s in love with Tampa system of building the minors. Don’t be surprised if he deals Xander/JD/Eovaldi/even the slumping Kiké if he can get a decent return. The Tampa philosophy of being a sustainable winning team may work for the regular season—but how many WS have they won? Zero. Not impressed with his track record so far.
Ugh, another fan who thinks there’s regular season talent and then there’s playoff talent. As if they are two different things. Thinks this with no evidence, no understanding of stats, sample sizes, randomness. There is no such thing as a team that is great in the regular season yet not built to win in the post season. It’s an infantile myth based on a misunderstanding of statistics and an inability to understand the concept of randomness in numerical results.
… tell that to the Toronto Maple Leafs.
Cosmos2 – You are an infantile myth!!! There are far too many examples of teams that have this issue to list them all but lets start with the two most over-rated organizations in baseball – NYY and LAD.
Dodgers go from 1988 to 2020 (shortened season) to win a ring. Did they play well during the regular season? Yep. Made the playoffs most of the years? YEP Did they cash in during the post-season? NOPE. (infantile myth is making you look ridiculous at this point)
The NYY = Last won in 2009 so a 12 year drought so far. Do they make the playoffs nearly every year? YES. Do they win? NOPE
WHY DON’T THEY WIN?
Because some teams are great regular season teams due to their depth and financial flexibility but when put into short playoff series they don’t win due to a lack of clutch players and peak performers. That’s not a myth it’s a reality!!!
Tampa has been a yearly contender with the strongest pool of young talent despite no money and low draft picks. To say the least, they are bordering on miraculous every year. So many years in a row that at some point one has to tip their cap and acknowledge these aren’t miracles every year, this is by design. No World Series? How are they in the playoffs at all with a payroll for the whole franchise that is less then a few teams pitching staffs salaries?
Fever Pitch Guy
William – Low draft picks? Where were you from 2014-2017 when they didn’t even contend and won between 68-80 games each year? Not to mention all the supplemental picks they got from losing free agents.
In 2015 and 2016 they had the 13th pick
In 2017 they had the 4th and 31st picks
In 2018 they had the 16th, 31st and 32nd picks
Xander to the Angels and we’ll move Squid over to second. Our two AA prospect just made 3 starts combining four 15.2 shutout innings scattering 5 hits. Unlike past seasons we have prospect capital and a contender to upgrade for a run
Squid is fun to watch, isn’t he? Love that kid’s grind each day, & for a little guy, he makes some really cool plays. He was a spark plug for NY.
I think adding $10M to his next few seasons plus that $30M extra season would get it done, maybe? It’s an extra $60M. Turns 3 years/$60M into 4 years/$120M. Seems like that would get it done. Does he really think he’s getting something like 3 years/$100M three years from now if he plays out the $60M left on his current deal’s structure?
He’s not going to play out the next here years. The question isn’t what would he get three years from now; the question is what will he get after this season? It’ll almost certainly be more than $120mm; it won’t be as much as $360mm. I think ~8 years, $200mm might get it done, maybe a vesting option for years 9-10 based on games played.
Am I the only one that thinks that he and Devers are overrated.
Defensively? No, Offensively? Yes.
Devers is holding out for a contract that pays him in ice cream and doritos
What happened to the reports of him being done with boston?
Nobody reported that. Some commenters may have claimed it, but reporters were more circumspect.
What happened to the reports of him being done with boston?
That falls under the category of “writers make schitt up”. Even the purported $30M offer the RS made, was reported by a NYY reporter with no access to Bogaerts or the team.
He wants 35M and 10 years. He is just not that good. And now he’s causing a 2nd distraction by making another announcement.
Remember the good years and the Championships and close the door on your way out.
He didn’t “make an announcement.” He responded to a reporter’s question.
Don’t Bogaert that contract, my friend. It’s no Little Feat what you’ve accomplished so far.
He’s not a short stop long term
The Tampa Red Sox will screw this up – I have full faith. Expect a low-ball, public relations offer in the coming weeks. The Bloom Sox are a mess.
Ask yourself if it really makes sense to call Boston’s team “the Tampa Red Sox” when their payroll is over $240MM for this year. Is that cheap? If you don’t like the way it’s been spent, that’s one thing. Remember DD fondly all you want–they still can’t build a team the way they want because of DD’s financial excesses.
The haters never let facts interfere with their opinions.
The Red Sox are directly copying Tampa’s model – Tampa Red Sox. It’s not complicated. You should stop assuming people are misunderstanding remarkably obvious details. You’re condemning DD, who won a WS, in favor of the public relations nonsense about the rebuilt farm system. To each his own.
Hey! I actually read one of your comments!
I’d open the bidding with 8 years, $200mm, vesting options for years 9-10 based on number of games played. I’d go as high as $250, but I’d front-load the contract in any circumstance. Full no-trade clause.
That ensures Xander stays in Boston and is paid until he retires. It doesn’t hamstring the team as he ages out of playing. And if he can earn it with playing time, he’ll have some retirement years on the roster.
At his age you simply don’t give him 10yrs and 300 mil. He helped them win titles he played 10 years here already. Simply thank him and move on. The player you give that giant contract to is Devers at 25 his best years are here now and for the next 5-6.
Agreed. I’d say an offer of $125/5 or $140/6 would be plenty fair. If he doesn’t go for that, then let him test the market. Giving any more of a commitment of 5 or 6 years would be a major mistake.
The sox might be waiting it out to see if the ‘shift’ is outlawed and more nimble, acrobatic SS’s will be required to compensate for the loss of positioning advantages. Bat first SS’s embellished with defensive metrics might be the way of the dodo. This could be the last year of the mega SS deals.
Re the Rays, A;s and LA systems. Its not just the system, its the people running the system, the ability to make the adjustments etc.. that makes the difference. Its easy to get anyone to do a job. Its much more difficult to get anyone to do a great job.
He’ll wind up being the fall back choice in Chicago if the Cubs don’t sign Correa.
The wretched of the north really don’t care about good players! Can’t wait to see Bogaerts in the Bronx.
I think you have to wait until the trade deadline to decide what to do with Bogey.
There are a couple of problems with a long term Bogey extension the first is the Red Sox signed a superior defensive shortstop to a 6 year contract so Bogey is no longer going to be the shortstop.
The other problem is Devers and what you do with him. I would of said before, before the season, that you sign Bogey and let Devers go since before this season defensively he was a DH. His defense this season so far has been at worst average but probably a little better then that. I believe if Devers is a viable defensive third baseman he is the one you want to sign long term and you let Bogey walk especially if he wants a big mega contract. Devers footwork is much improved this season and he isn’t making those careless errors anymore if he can continue on that path he is the guy to invest in. He is going to command a big contract as he seems to be getting better and better every year at the dish and if the defense is going to be like this then he is a high end super star that can probably get that 10 year 300-350 contract. In order to get that contract in the offseason he has to show the defense is real for the entire season but he is the guy I would long term.
I think the signing of Story effectively ends the Bogey relationship unless bogey took a team friendly deal. I just don’t think Boston will and probably shouldn’t give a 200 million dollar contract to a 2nd baseman moving forward. I guess we will find out but I think Bogey is moving on it’s sad and Bogey has been nothing but a high quality individual but if you really look at it the signing of Story was the end of Bogey in Boston.
The one thing people are not talking about is what was Bloom hired by the owners to do? While there is no proof, one way or the other, the local media here believes that Bloom was hired to reduce the payroll in Boston (get below the CBT) and build up the farm system so they can have a sustainable pipeline of young, affordable talent rather than having to overbid on free agents to stay competitive. If that is indeed what the owners wanted then I feel like Bloom is delivering on that promise. The Red Sox farm system has vastly improved under Bloom and we’ll start seeing the fruits of that labor as soon as the 2nd half of this year, but 2023 will be a big transition year for the Sox. They will promote 4-5 players from the minors to the big leagues in 2023 and then another 4-5 players in 2024. Then they will be like able to re-assess and see what type of veteran free agents they need to sign in order to compete for a title. I feel like this was the goal of ownership all along. Bloom should get 5 full years to see this transition plan through. If the team is still a mess after 5 years then they will cut bait and try someone else, but I feel like John Henry & Co. is secretly happy with what Bloom has done to date and 2023/2024 will be the real measuring stick on how effective their transition plan worked.
I just hope we can get enough pitching talent through the pipeline.
I keep reading about the Tampa Bay method, exactly how many World Series have they won? That’s what I thought
FWIW, I don’t know why more players don’t follow Bogaerts lead. If I were a player, I’d talk with my agent, and decide on a number. and then let my agent handle it. if the press asked me about it, I would tell them his agent is handling it. The press will stop asking after a while.
Fever Pitch Guy
Joe – It’s the 2020’s, contracts are a lot more complicated than just looking for one amount. Read up on Story’s contract or Paxton’s contract, it will probably make your head spin.
“Did I say it right, Scott?”
“Just right, Xander.”
Hey Bloom, when are these illustrious rookies going to get here ? FYI Houck and Whitlock don’t count, one was drafted previously by the previous GM and the other was a Yankee Product. I love these GMs who say to see the process through. Bloom is on his 3rd year and traded one of our best home grown products who was actively involved in the community for a guy for Verdugo who is struggling big time this year and two prospects Downs and Wong. Please Please do not trade Boggaerts. He is our best player.
Hey Bloom, when are these illustrious rookies going to get here ? FYI Houck and Whitlock don’t count, one was drafted previously by the previous GM and the other was a Yankee Product. I love these GMs who say to see the process through. Bloom is on his 3rd year and traded one of our best home grown products who was actively involved in the community for a guy for Verdugo who is struggling big time this year and two prospects Downs and Wong. Please Please do not trade Bogaerts. He is our best player. I would fire Bloom with how bad this team is playing this year. This Bill James stuff works with a few players but not the whole team. Give me a Good GM
As a Yankee fan, I have to say that Bloom deserves credit for grabbing Whitlock when Cashman left him unprotected.
Fever Pitch Guy
Fink – It was a good move indeed, but it certainly helped that Boston had the 4th-worst record in MLB the prior year therefore only 3 other teams had to pass on Whitlock for Bloom to take him. This is an example of the little details that you won’t hear from others who worship at the Bloom altar.
For all we know, Bloom may have preferred one of the three players that were taken ahead of Whitlock.
Let’s get rid of guys who you know can play in Boston, i.e. Lester and Bogey and bring in guys you have no clue about like David Price and Story. Sometime I have no clue how these guys in the front office and ownership became millionaires.
The ownership has been brilliant. They’ve been the best team in BB since he took over. This is his 20th year of ownership. You should give Henry his due.
Fever Pitch Guy
mike – John Henry became a multi-billionaire as a commodities trader. He knows very little about baseball, nor does he need to. That’s why he hires others to be in charge of baseball operations. It’s only in rare situations where Henry will approve or reject specific player personnel decisions. If Bloom says Story is worth $140M, Henry has no choice but to believe him because Henry has far greater responsibilities to focus on. He sets the budget, that’s about it.
Buying a sports team doesn’t mean suddenly stopping what you’ve done your whole life that has made you a billionaire.
As for the hiring of Bloom, that was a reactional decision after Henry got ticked off about the 2019 season. No different then the overreaction to the 2011 season that led to the hiring of Bobby Valentine.
IRT Henry, mostly correct. For the most part, owners should only set the budget. But that said, saying that Henry “knows very little about baseball” was an unneeded gratuitous insult. I’d make a significant wager that there is not a single person in here that has any idea of what Henry’s knowledge level is.
IRT to the Bloom hiring being “reactional”, you don’t know that either. I had no problem with DD, but his process was unsustainable. It would be entirely logical to look at the LAD, TB, Houston, etc., as a process that one would want to emulate.
My guess is that 2019 was the result of Henry wanting to go all-in on B2B championships. We’ve been arguably the best team in BB since he took over, but a B2B really would’ve put us over the top. Once that failed, we had no minor league system to fall back on, and a very large payroll.
Fever Pitch Guy
Joe – I didn’t mean to upset you so much, but if you really think anyone becomes knowledgeable about a sport just because they buy a team then I’ve got a wonderful bridge to sell you.
And BTW every Red Sox fan knows the man most responsible for the championships in 2004-2013 was Lucky, with honorable mention to JH for blessing the sky-high payroll budgets.
If JH was willing to spend as much as the Dodgers have been recently, sure I’d be happy to emulate them.
You really should read up on the 2019 season and the reason for Dombrowski’s departure. Maybe you weren’t following baseball back then, but in a nutshell Cora treated ST like it was a vacation in Club Med and they started the season woefully unprepared. They began 6-13 in last place 8 1/2 games back.
No other team in MLB history followed up a 108+win championship season with a 84-win non-playoff season in which they finished 19 games out of first place. And it wasn’t even because of a fire sale, they kept most of the same players from the prior season.
The Cardinals would be stupid to sign Bogartz to a long term deal !!!
However—— the Cardinals do have depth enough to trade to rent him for the rest of the season!! DeJong would also be a good trade. (although I do hope DeJong finds his swing and is naked with the main team)
The Yankees are coming, the Yankees are coming…