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Francisco Liriano

Week in Review

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Another week in the history books! Here’s a look back from July 13-19:

  • The Phillies acquired Joe Blanton from the A’s for a package of three minor leaguers: Adrian Cardenas, Josh Outman, and Matthew Spencer. Cardenas and Outman were the Phils’ #2 and #4 prospects. Personally, that seems like a lot to bring a pitcher who’s already struggling to a much smaller park. Blanton is a much better pitcher than he’s showed this season, however.
  • Francisco Rodriguez will test the free-agent market this offseason. I don’t think anyone would be surprised to see K-Rod sign a record-setting contract for a reliever.
  • The Yankees signed Richie Sexson.
  • Francisco Liriano – or at least his agent – is not pleased that the Twins still have him in AAA. The Twins won’t blame Liriano for the investigation. Upsetting a player who’s that young and that talented seems like a bad idea to me…
  • The Padres traded Tony Clark to the Diamondbacks for minor leaguer Evan Scribner. The D’Backs have looked like they can use all the help they can get lately.
  • A.J. Burnett likes Toronto and doesn’t want to be traded. My advice: Don’t talk to Chicago reporters anymore, A.J.
  • Tim updated the third base and second base markets.
  • Erik Bedard’s injury looks like it will keep him in Seattle. And if you don’t believe me yet, here’s another one for you.
  • The Twins balked at Seattle’s asking price for Adrian Beltre. And considering they asked for one of Scott Baker, Nick Blackburn, Glen Perkins, or Kevin Slowey as well as other minor league prospects, can you blame them?

Twins Won’t Fault Liriano

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Here’s a quick update on Liriano-gate.

Phil Miller of the twin cities Pioneer Press reports the Twins won’t hold Francisco Liriano accountable for his agent’s request to investigate the team’s handling of the southpaw. Liriano had expressed frustration over his extended stay in the minors.

Francisco Liriano Frustrated

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Ken Rosenthal spoke to Francisco Liriano’s agent, Greg Genske.  The 24 year-old lefty is frustrated that he’s still at Triple A, and Genske has contacted the Players’ Association about filing a grievance.  The union will investigate.  Liriano is now dominating in the minors.

Rosenthal says Liriano’s arbitration year has already been pushed back by his time in the minors.  Twins GM Bill Smith denies any shady money-saving tactics, saying "our starters are all doing the job."

Most likely, the Twins would be an improved team by replacing Livan Hernandez in the rotation with Liriano.  But this isn’t the first time the Twins have chosen veteran mediocrity or worse over promising young players.

Liriano Promotion Could Affect Arbitration

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Francisco Liriano is pitching in his first major league game in 19 months today, and Twins fans have to be excited by that prospect.

However, as pointed out by Joe Christensen of The Star-Tribune, had the Twins waited longer to promote Liriano from the AAA Rochester Red Wings (where his service time clock was on hold), the lefty wouldn’t reach the three-year arbitration benchmark until after the 2009 season.

As it stands now, with two years and 32 days of service, Liriano will see his salary move beyond the $1MM mark at the end of this season.

Posted by Matt Birt

Odds And Ends: Cabrera, Bay, Liriano, Clement, Dotel

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Lots to go over this morning, so this might not be the last bullet point list you see.

  • The Angels and Marlins are progressing in talks for Miguel Cabrera. It’s believed that the Angels are willing to deal players like Reggie Willits, Howie Kendrick, and Jeff Mathis, but the sticking point here is the inclusion of Nick Adenhart. If the Angels want Cabrera, I would have to think Adenhart would be a part of any deal.
  • Pirates GM Neal Huntington says that he is not actively shopping any of his players. However, he acknowledges that if he hears an offer, he’ll have to consider it. Some of his team’s asking prices are "outrageous," he says. This includes players like Jason Bay and Jack Wilson. But the Pirates may choose in the end to dish Bay, since their strength, if any, is the outfield, and Bay is slated to make $13.25 million over the next two years. That might not seem like a lot, but it’s costly when you’re working with a paltry $50 million budget. Surely Huntington would love to deal Wilson, though he denies it. He might have trouble finding a partner on that one.
  • Though the Twins deny it, any Johan Santana deal might be dependent on the status of Francisco Liriano. The 24-year-old "hasn’t had a single setback" in his recovery from ligament replacement surgery last October. He’s completed his rehab program, and might pitch in the Dominican this winter. He’s expected to be ready in February fo Spring Training.
  • Add the Pirates to the list of teams interested in Matt Clement. It now spans the Rockies, Diamondbacks, Royals, Padres, and Blue Jays in addition to the Bucs. However, with their payroll cap, Clement might not be feasible.
  • The Tigers remain interested in closer Octavio Dotel. There is no word on whether the team has offered him a contract.

Joe Pawlikowski is co-author of River Ave. Blues.

Kemp/Kershaw for Santana

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Well it’s what I call an "official possibility" now.  In his ESPN.com chat yesterday afternoon, Jonah Keri of Page 2 confirmed the Johan Santana for Matt Kemp and Clayton Kershaw rumor that’s been generating a lot of buzz here at MLBTR.  Let’s discuss, shall we? 

Kemp and Kershaw both have 6 years before they reach free agency.  Santana has 1.  There’s the obvious red flag right there, Dodgers fans.  But if Los Angeles GM Ned Colletti wants to win now, and he usually does, Santana could be the golden ticket.  I shudder to think of how dominant Santana could be not only in the NL but also in Dodgers Stadium.

If you’re the Twins, and you know you can’t afford Santana, I think this is a no-brainer.   Especially if (big if) you think you have Francisco Liriano returning to form.

The question remains:  Is an ace like Johan what the Dodgers need to win?  I’m not so sure.  They’re rotation has been solidified by the emergence of Chad Billingsley.  With a scrapheap lineup of Gonzo, Nomar, and Pierre, Matt Kemp could become their best hitter as early as… tonight.

 

Posted By: Nat Boyle

Trade History: The Pierzynski Deal

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November 14th, 2003.  A day that will forever haunt Giants fans.  On that day, Brian Sabean dealt Boof Bonser, Francisco Liriano, and Joe Nathan to the Twins for A.J. Pierzynski and cash.  A year later, the Giants would release Pierzynski.  Bonser may become a tolerable fifth starter in the bigs, while Liriano and Nathan are among the very best starters and closers in baseball, respectively.

Hindsight is 20/20, right?  It’s easy to rip on Sabean several years later.  But was this like the Austin Kearns trade, where Wayne Krivsky was derided from the get-go?  Or did the Pierzynski deal seem OK at the time?  Let’s view this in context.

The 2003 San Francisco Giants used a combination of Benito Santiago and Yorvit Torrealba at catcher.  The result was a batting line of .270/.320/.412.  The average NL catcher hit .260/.328/.404 in ’03, so Santiago/Torrealba was tolerable.  The club won 100 games and the NL West.  However, they lost in the Division Series to the Marlins, who would of course go on to win the World Series.

The Giants traded for Pierzynski in November of ’03, and Torrealba would remain with the Giants in ’04 as his backup.  Santiago signed with the Royals that winter for two years and $4.3MM.  He would turn 39 before the season began.  Santiago popped up in the BALCO case in March of ’04 but seemed unfazed.  A broken hand from a hit-by-pitch knocked him out in late June, and he didn’t play for the Royals again.

Pierzynski was coming off a .312/.360/.464 season for the Twins, his best ever at age 26.  He was the sixth-best hitting catcher in the game in 2003.  His salary was due to rise several million dollars in arbitration and Joe Mauer was ready to go, so Terry Ryan explored his trade opportunities.  A deal to the Cubs for Andy Sisco was mentioned, and the Padres expressed interest too.  Ultimately A.J. became a Giant and slumped to .272/.318/.410, an offensive line that ranked 18th among backstops.

Brett Tomko called Pierzynski a "cancer" in May of ’04, calling for Yorvit Torrealba to take over.  The Giants still considered a multiyear deal after the season, but then decided to go with Mike Matheny and let A.J. go.

Bonser was ranked 29th on Baseball America’s 2002 Top Prospects list, right behind Jake Peavy.  A year later Rich Harden would earn the 29th spot, and Ervin Santana got the honors in ’04.  Bonser never made another list.  In ’03, he posted a 4.00 ERA in 135 Double A innings at age 21.  Bonser now projects as a fifth starter with the Twins.

Liriano was ranked 83rd on BA’s 2003 list, ahead of Taylor Buchholz and Wily Mo Pena but behind bums like Ben Kozlowski, Chris Gruler, Kris Honel, and Josh Karp.  Liriano was outranked on the list by teammates Jesse Foppert (4th), Jerome Williams (50th), Kurt Ainsworth (64th), and Todd Linden (82nd).  Shoulder injuries limited Liriano to just nine innings in 2003.  It was clear he had potential, but Liriano was anything but a lock.  Just another in a long line of hard-throwing pitching prospects.

Joe Nathan never made an appearance on a Baseball America top prospects list.  Drafted in 1995 in the sixth round, Nathan reached the Majors at age 24 in 1999.  He made 14 starts for the Giants and had ugly marks in home runs allowed, free passes, and strikeout rate.  Many teams approached Sabean about Nathan in the winter of ’99-’00, but he was regarded as untouchable. 

Nathan started working on a changeup in 2000 while making 15 starts for the Giants.  His numbers were even worse, as walks increased.  He spent time on the DL with shoulder tightness that summer, but Dusty Baker made sure to get him right back out there ASAP.  His shoulder caused a second DL stint in July.  Surgery was considered, but Nathan ultimately took a cortisone shot and resumed pitching.  The injury recurred a third time, causing Nathan to sit out the playoffs.  Way to go, Dusty!  Nathan had shoulder surgery in October of that year.

His velocity down to the mid-80s in ’01, Nathan toiled in Triple A until June before earning a demotion to Double A.  Things improved a bit before the end of the season, and he was in the low 90s by the spring of ’02.  He pitched poorly that year in Triple A but got a September call-up anyway.

In the spring of ’03, Nathan finally gave up starting and managed to earn a job with the Giants as a setup man for Tim Worrell out of spring training.  He started the season with a 22 inning scoreless inning streak.  After winning 12 games and posting a 2.96 ERA in 79 innings in his first season as a reliever, he became a major component of the Pierzynski trade.

At the time, here’s how I think each player was evaluated:

Liriano: interesting raw prospect with major injury concerns
Bonser: impressive young starting pitching prospect whose stock fell a bit in ’03
Nathan: converted starter coming off his best season; history of shoulder problems
Pierzynski: one of the game’s best-hitting catchers entering his prime with several seasons before free agency

Pierzynski was a coveted young backstop, and Sabean really only gave up one bona fide Major Leaguer to get him.  Back in November of 2003, this looked like a deal that would benefit both teams.  Liriano and Nathan could’ve easily been lost to the injury abyss and we wouldn’t be talking about this.

Trade History: The Pierzynski Deal

By | at

November 14th, 2003.  A day that will forever haunt Giants fans.  On that day, Brian Sabean dealt Boof Bonser, Francisco Liriano, and Joe Nathan to the Twins for A.J. Pierzynski and cash.  A year later, the Giants would release Pierzynski.  Bonser may become a tolerable fifth starter in the bigs, while Liriano and Nathan are among the very best starters and closers in baseball, respectively.

Hindsight is 20/20, right?  It's easy to rip on Sabean several years later.  But was this like the Austin Kearns trade, where Wayne Krivsky was derided from the get-go?  Or did the Pierzynski deal seem OK at the time?  Let's view this in context.

The 2003 San Francisco Giants used a combination of Benito Santiago and Yorvit Torrealba at catcher.  The result was a batting line of .270/.320/.412.  The average NL catcher hit .260/.328/.404 in '03, so Santiago/Torrealba was tolerable.  The club won 100 games and the NL West.  However, they lost in the Division Series to the Marlins, who would of course go on to win the World Series.

The Giants traded for Pierzynski in November of '03, and Torrealba would remain with the Giants in '04 as his backup.  Santiago signed with the Royals that winter for two years and $4.3MM.  He would turn 39 before the season began.  Santiago popped up in the BALCO case in March of '04 but seemed unfazed.  A broken hand from a hit-by-pitch knocked him out in late June, and he didn't play for the Royals again.

Pierzynski was coming off a .312/.360/.464 season for the Twins, his best ever at age 26.  He was the sixth-best hitting catcher in the game in 2003.  His salary was due to rise several million dollars in arbitration and Joe Mauer was ready to go, so Terry Ryan explored his trade opportunities.  A deal to the Cubs for Andy Sisco was mentioned, and the Padres expressed interest too.  Ultimately A.J. became a Giant and slumped to .272/.318/.410, an offensive line that ranked 18th among backstops.

Brett Tomko called Pierzynski a "cancer" in May of '04, calling for Yorvit Torrealba to take over.  The Giants still considered a multiyear deal after the season, but then decided to go with Mike Matheny and let A.J. go.

Bonser was ranked 29th on Baseball America's 2002 Top Prospects list, right behind Jake Peavy.  A year later Rich Harden would earn the 29th spot, and Ervin Santana got the honors in '04.  Bonser never made another list.  In '03, he posted a 4.00 ERA in 135 Double A innings at age 21.  Bonser now projects as a fifth starter with the Twins.

Liriano was ranked 83rd on BA's 2003 list, ahead of Taylor Buchholz and Wily Mo Pena but behind bums like Ben Kozlowski, Chris Gruler, Kris Honel, and Josh Karp.  Liriano was outranked on the list by teammates Jesse Foppert (4th), Jerome Williams (50th), Kurt Ainsworth (64th), and Todd Linden (82nd).  Shoulder injuries limited Liriano to just nine innings in 2003.  It was clear he had potential, but Liriano was anything but a lock.  Just another in a long line of hard-throwing pitching prospects.

Joe Nathan never made an appearance on a Baseball America top prospects list.  Drafted in 1995 in the sixth round, Nathan reached the Majors at age 24 in 1999.  He made 14 starts for the Giants and had ugly marks in home runs allowed, free passes, and strikeout rate.  Many teams approached Sabean about Nathan in the winter of '99-'00, but he was regarded as untouchable. 

Nathan started working on a changeup in 2000 while making 15 starts for the Giants.  His numbers were even worse, as walks increased.  He spent time on the DL with shoulder tightness that summer, but Dusty Baker made sure to get him right back out there ASAP.  His shoulder caused a second DL stint in July.  Surgery was considered, but Nathan ultimately took a cortisone shot and resumed pitching.  The injury recurred a third time, causing Nathan to sit out the playoffs.  Way to go, Dusty!  Nathan had shoulder surgery in October of that year.

His velocity down to the mid-80s in '01, Nathan toiled in Triple A until June before earning a demotion to Double A.  Things improved a bit before the end of the season, and he was in the low 90s by the spring of '02.  He pitched poorly that year in Triple A but got a September call-up anyway.

In the spring of '03, Nathan finally gave up starting and managed to earn a job with the Giants as a setup man for Tim Worrell out of spring training.  He started the season with a 22 inning scoreless inning streak.  After winning 12 games and posting a 2.96 ERA in 79 innings in his first season as a reliever, he became a major component of the Pierzynski trade.

At the time, here's how I think each player was evaluated:

Liriano: interesting raw prospect with major injury concerns
Bonser: impressive young starting pitching prospect whose stock fell a bit in '03
Nathan: converted starter coming off his best season; history of shoulder problems
Pierzynski: one of the game's best-hitting catchers entering his prime with several seasons before free agency

Pierzynski was a coveted young backstop, and Sabean really only gave up one bona fide Major Leaguer to get him.  Back in November of 2003, this looked like a deal that would benefit both teams.  Liriano and Nathan could've easily been lost to the injury abyss and we wouldn't be talking about this.

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