Ryan Dempster allowed three earned runs on five hits in six innings against the Pirates today, striking out six. Trade talk continues to surround the 35-year-old right-hander, who would prefer to be dealt to the Dodgers than the Braves. Here’s the latest on Dempster, with the most recent notes up top:
- The Cubs have told teams interested in Dempster they'd grant a window to negotiate an extension, tweets Tim Brown of Yahoo Sports.
- The possibility of a trade exists, but the Cubs are frustrated by their lack of leverage, Morosi tweets. Chicago still hopes Dempster changes his mind about Atlanta, tweets Olney.
- The Cubs now plan to keep Dempster and make him a qualifying offer after the season, ESPN.com's Buster Olney tweets. Doing so would allow the Cubs to collect a compensatory draft pick in 2013.
- The Dodgers have Zack Greinke and Josh Johnson on their list in case they don't trade for Dempster, Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports tweets.
- Braves GM Frank Wren said on 680-AM The Fan in Atlanta that he's "moving on" from Dempster. "I think it's very highly unlikely," Wren said (via ESPNChicago.com). Once the Braves heard Dempster would prefer to play for the Dodgers, they moved on. Wren said the Braves continue pursuing starting pitchers.
- The Dodgers have the upper hand in talks with the Cubs, Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com tweets.
- The Dodgers are feeling increasingly confident that they can work out a deal for Dempster, ESPN.com's Buster Olney tweets. The Cubs don't have many alternatives given Dempster's interest in playing for L.A. and his no-trade protection.
- A trade between the Dodgers and Cubs still seems “realistic,” Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports tweets.
- The Dodgers still intend to add a starting pitcher, Scott Miller of CBSSports.com tweets.
And again i say,
Zack Greinke. Get it done Wren!
Man, talk about lost opportunity…Cubs will be lucky to get a pair of mid-level prospects from the Dodgers at this point.
Since mid-level Dodger prospects are on the same level as low-level “Any Other Team” prospects, I think the Cubs are smart to get the draft pick. And Dempster just became a pariah in Chicago because of all this.
Taking a wild guess, I’d say that the “cut off my nose to spite my face” approach probably doesn’t have much coin in the Cubs’ front office.
Cubs saying they’re going to keep him is a ploy to get him to the braves.
Dempster is having a terrific year, and is possibly 1 out of 5 most underrated pitchers in the NL. This would be the year to grab him before his numbers slowly decline. Having successful bullpen experience should make him tempting for more teams.
This is why I can’t stand the way no-trade clauses currently work. I’m fine with a player having trade protection, either in the form of monetary compensation or an absolute block to a select group of teams, but the whole “maybe he’ll waive it maybe he won’t” thing is really a mess. There needs to be some system where a player has to approve or deny teams sufficiently early in a season so teams like the Cubs and Braves can actually negotiate.
In this instance, Dempster has completely ruined the Cubs’ bargaining position by flip-flopping so much. If the Cubs had never had a deal with Atlanta (because Dempster veto’d them back in May or something), then they’d be able to strike a better deal with the Dodgers, potentially.
Also, if the Cubs let Dempster start tonight against the Pirates then they’re complete fools.
If you’re the Dodgers why do you offer the Cubs anything other some scrub minor leaguer?
Because they wont take them and you want the player.
There are other pitchers out there. Why overpay for this one that the current team has no leverage with?
In order for the Cubs to get anything for him via a comp pick in the draft they’ll have to offer him arb and frankly I don’t think they will because I think they’re afraid he’d take it and win. At his age, even with the season he is having this year, he’s not going to get a very long term deal on the open market (two maybe three years). He might be more inclined to take the one year deal to stay in Chicago (he has a young child with a rare health condition that probably might benefit from the stability).
Dempster is not ending his tenure in Chicago very gracefully.
He ought to have provided the Cubs with a list of all the teams he was ruling out before the trade talks began, rather than waiting for them to strike a great deal with Atlanta before deciding (and doing so publicly!) that he wasn’t feeling that destination.
Dempster has put his thinking on public display for no reason, and in doing so has decimated the Cubs’ leverage and left them in no position to demand a good return from Los Angeles.
He did offer them a list of teams and Atlanta was one of them.
wow. that is a punch in the face then.
I’ve been looking for this list. Where did he say this?
It’s only been “reported”
But do you honestly believe Theo & Jed would try to move Dempster while not knowing where he’d like to go.
So, everyone is up in arms over a list nobody knows about. What if this whole trade was sparked from Braves side and the Cubs just thought it was too good to pass up and try to get Dempster to take a trade to a team he doesn’t really want to go unless it’s a last resort.
he had atlanta as his 2nd place to be traded to, he is being very selfish, especially when he is said I want the Cubs to get something good in return for me, now were going to get less
OK, I’ll ask this again. Please link to me that has Ryan saying this? Everything I’ve read comes from reporters who *BELIEVE* Atlanta is high on his list or that he would accept a trade. I have yet to see anything that confirms that ATL is #2 or even gives a list of teams he’d take a trade to. It’s all been pure speculation on reporters so far.
Would Theo, during the most important trade deadline in years for the Cubs, waste time working a deal with a team not on Dempster’s list? Think very carefully about that.
There’s a difference between reporting on what sources say and “pure speculation”. Just because a reporter doesn’t have a physical copy of a list signed by Ryan Dempster ranking the teams he’d prefer to go to doesn’t mean there wasn’t an agreement.
And, then, of course, there’s this statement from Frank Wren:
In his case, from my understanding – and I’m only getting it second hand from the Cubs – they had a meeting with him a couple weeks ago and laid it out, and the primary two suitors were us and the Dodgers. And he had positive things to say about both, and he had a slight preference to the Dodgers because of Ted Lilly. He and Ted Lilly are best of friends and he’d like to go play with his friend. And I think there were also some personal issues that suited better for him. And as it went down, from my understanding, the Cubs informed him in the last week that the Dodgers weren’t really as aggressive as we were and they thought the deal was going to go with us.
There’s no way that the Cubs, while staying in touch with Dempster throughout the process, would have made a deal with the Braves without fully believing that Dempster was fine with it. And, when you consider that the Cubs had been exploring things first with Dempster’s first choice (the Dodgers) you have to think they told him that the Dodgers deal wouldn’t work out, and they were moving onto the Braves. At that point, if Dempster had changed his mind and solely wanted to go to the Braves, he should have said something.
Now, again, according to you that’s pure speculation, and I don’t have any documentation. But you have to admit it’s the most logical scenario, unless you believe the Cubs front office is just completely incompetent and foolish.
But, even ignoring all of that, surely you realize that he’d expressed an openness to the Braves in the past.
Use logic, please. Theo is not going to waste time with a team Dempster didn’t approve of.
If this deal was sparked by the Braves do you really think Jed/Theo would just shoot it down because Dempster didn’t say no to Atlanta? No GM would ever do that. They would try to work out the best deal they can get then go to Dempster with an offer.
in fact atlanta was #2 on the list. Demp is really acting the tool at this point.
Link to this list please. Any press statement that says he would approve a trade to Atlanta. Thanks.
It has been all over this site
A list that who compiled? MLBTradeRumors list of likely trade destinations that may not be accurate or did it come from Desmpster or his Agent?
I cannot find a direct link but have heard in on espn radio and 680 the fan in Atlanta.. It will pop up somewhere for you
So you heard from a sports talk radio not from Dempster/Agent or Theo/Jed? Then it’s pure speculation from the host of that sports talk radio. Nothing is concrete here. It’s all been assumptions on rumors on what has happened.
Frank Wren from today’s Chicago Sun Times article titled, “Braves GM explains how Ryan Dempster trade fell apart”
“…they had a meeting with him a couple weeks ago and laid it out, and the primary two suitors were us and the Dodgers. And he had positive things to say about both…the Cubs informed him in the last week that the Dodgers weren’t really as aggressive as we were and they thought the deal was going to go with us. I think he was given a heads up along the way.”
I’ve been told that the sky is blue, but I’ve never seen a press release from the sky saying that it is, in fact, blue. Wow…how could I have been so blind all these years?
I guess his view is “they’re about to trade me, why should I show any loyalty to a team I’m not going to be on tomorrow?”
As disappointed as I am that he scuttled the Atlanta trade, I can’t really argue with his logic. Business and all that. This is one of the reasons I was never a big fan of the concept of a 10-and-5 player to begin with.
I agree that Dempster really messed us up, but it could be due to other reasons. I wish with everything in me that he would have accepted the trade, but what if Theo and Jed wanted to make some last minute offers to other teams, and the trade talks went cold. Or ATL wanted Demp to sign an extension for sure after this year, and he doesn’t want to do that. Lastly, maybe it’s due to the fact that he saw the Brave historic meltdown last year to end the season. Any of these reasons are viable options, and are realistic. But man, do I wish we would have got Delgado.
If I were the Cubs, I would trade Garza for Zach Lee and Demp can sit at home in October.
Zach Lee wouldn’t be nearly enough for Garza. Its not enough for Dempster at this point after being offered Delgado.
Duplicate entry
You overlook Garza’s numbers, which are far from spectacular, and also that he’s under team control for only one more year — AKA, a glorified rental. Lee is a solid pitching prospect, a first rounder at the very start of his career. What the Braves offered for Dempster isn’t relevant since that deal is not happening.
Lee is is struggling and may be out of the top 100 prospects at this point. Garza is younger and has one more year of control rather than being a rental he would at least get a team a comp pick if he walks after 2013. Even before the Dempster offer, I would have said Lee is not enough for Garza. LA’s system is one of the worst in the league, I will go elsewhere thank you. For sure we would at least get Delgado for Garza still, which I would rather have than Lee.
Cubs, Dodgers Discussing Garza For Zach Lee Swap
By Ben Nicholson-Smith [July 23, 2012 at 2:07pm CST]
The Cubs and Dodgers are discussing a trade that would send right-hander Matt Garza to Los Angeles for a package of players including highly-regarded pitching prospect Zach Lee, Jim Bowden of ESPN.com and MLB Network reports (on Twitter).
Discussing, but there will be better offers than the dodgers are able to even capable of offering. If Demp doesn’t want to go to Atlanta for Delgado, I’d rather have Delgado for Garza than Lee for Garza, which Atlanta would likely be willing to offer. There have also been about 10 other teams discussing Garza. Discussions mean nothing. heres the discussion. Will you take Lee for Garza, no, ok, discussion over.
Keyword, package. 4 players including one who is ML player.
So glad Dempster loves playing the hammer. He did a great job. We lost a great prospect in Delgado that could have helped the Cubs for years to come. Dempster forgets that it was the Cubs who gave him an opportunity to start again, of which, allowed him to make the big bucks. As if he was ever “the nail” with the Cubs. I am anxiously awaiting him bombing tonight against the Pirates so he can play “the hammer” some more.
“Playing the hammer” was a veiled hint that he was going to be a major tool.
Why didn’t he just say from the beginning that he only would accept a trade to the Dodgers? If that was his thinking all along, what he’s doing right now is a slap in the face to management and Cub fans, alike. At this point, I wouldn’t shed one tear if he pitches tonight vs the Pirates and blows out his arm.
Pretty much exactly this. If there hadn’t been all that mess with the Braves, the Cubs wouldn’t be at a weak bargaining position. They could still be “threatening” the Dodgers with “other teams.”
The game starts in just over 1 hour
First off, you would shed a tear, being that the Cubs would almost 100%
not offer him the 12mil at the end of the season in an attempt at a
bonus draft pick. Second, you feel that Dempster choosing where he
wants to go fairly nullifies ALL the good things he has done for this
organization and city?
While I can appreciate he wants to do right by his family, there is no disguising the fact that he is, effectively, jerking the organization around. Yes, he has done good things, but they have been very good to him, as well. He was pretty much rescued from the scrap heap when they gave him his opportunity, and they rewarded him with a multi-million dollar contract after only one year of being in the starting rotation. I’d say it’s a two-way street, as far as which side has done more for the other. And I do stand corrected on it being a day game, rather than tonight.
I’m merely commenting on wishing him poor future. Blowing out his arm hurts both parties and is quite rash.
Not wishing him anything bad but, as I said, wouldn’t be broken up at all if karma bit him in the behind, either.
How is he jerking the organization around? He has earned the right to turn down the trade if he so feels. If you had 2 job offers, one might benefit someone else more than you, while the other option benefits you and your family more, don’t you choose the 2nd option? Or at least explore that option until the door is closed?
The difference being that, if I knew I would only accept a job offer from one town, there is no reason I would keep that to myself and let people waste their time trying to place me somewhere else. Dempster either lied to the front office from the start, or kept it to himself until he was confronted with the possibility of going somewhere other than LA. Either way, it doesn’t speak well for the man.
Exactly. It’s a concept known as honor, and it seems as though Dempster has little to spare. A common problem in society today.
Part of being honorable is leaving another man alone to deal with his personal business. You would question a man for fulfilling his sworn and signed contract?
he has had 2 months to make it clear where he wants to go – to jack the team around at the last minute like this is really being a jerk.
If I am the Cubs, the Dodgers offer an attractive package or Dempster sits the rest of the year so we can see our younger pitchers. There is no sense for a last place team to pitch a 35 year old mediocre pitcher with a career 3 games under .500 record. Thanks for nothing, Dempster. I hope Theo rejects any junk from the Dodgers. I would give neither Dempster or the Dodgers something for nothing.
Actually the Cubs still have the upper hand as they could just keep him and then offer him arbitration after the season and assuming he rejects it collect a supp 1st round draft pick.
I think that he just wanted to beat the Pirates one more time.
Game is not tonight…. more like in 80 minutes
So Dempster likes to be a troll is how I read this.
Thanks you to the baseball gods that this trade did not happen. In saying that I feel bad for Cubs fans I hope you guys get Lee seriously!
Time to put Dempster in the Sammy Sosa column.
I never thought I’d see that happen.
The Dodgers have Zack Greinke and Josh Johnson on their list in case they don’t trade for Greinke, Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports tweets and he memant Ryan Dempster and other teams could fall out it and make more Starters available.
What is the deal with Felix Hernandez? Have the mariners ever said they would trade him? I’d love to see him with the braves
I could actually see King Felix as someone who the Braves could be targeting right now… Top of the rotation guy, under control through 2014, and the Braves usually end up trading for people that aren’t being linked to them (or even talked about much as a possibility to be traded).
Maybe it’s just wishful thinking… but I’d be ok with trading away multiple top prospects for someone like Felix over a 2 month rental
Jon Heyman sez: the odds of Dempster going to Atlanta are now 29:71.
It sounds like Demp wants to end his career with the cubs…he said if he was traded he would like to return to chicago…wut makes the cubs think he wont except the qualifying offer? Get wut u can or will probably be in this same position this time next year on this site…lol
Pretty sure after he is boo’d in Chicago for his remaining starts he will not want to come back. Plus he would be stupid not to leverage this year into a multi-year deal worth around the same per year as a qualifying offer.
Thanks a lot Ryan! We didn’t really need Delgado from the Braves or some “top” prospect from the Dodgers. (sarcasm on)
-Theo and Jed
Ryan Dempster earned his ten / five rights. It amazes me that people would criticize him for using the leverage that he has earned. The problem with this trade is that Dempster stated he wanted to be traded to the Dodgers because he wanted to play along side Ted Lilly. Dempster has earned the ability to dictate the location of where he will pitch next. The only problem I see is that Theo and Jed are not telling the truth about the situation. Dempster has been with the Cubs for nine years and he lives near Wrigley Field. He has a daughter that has a disability. He has been loyal to the Cubs and he gave them a hometown discount with the last contract he has signed. He has moved from the starting Rotation to the bullpen and then back to the starting rotation without complaining. He is the ultimate team player. Now, he have fans that either don’t appreciate Ryan Dempster or just don’t know what he as done for the organization!!
I know exactly what he has done for this organization and exactly what they have done for him and I think he’s just another uber selfish athlete who only cares about himself.
BTW, I live 4 doors down from him on Lakewood and know his family.
i dont think people are upset with him using his 10-5 rights, i think its the way he used it that has people upset. he changed his mind and didnt tell anybody until it was too late which left the cubs to have to make an impossible. He really put them in a tough spot unnecessarily.
The notion that he (or anyone) “earned” his 10-5 rights is totally begging the question. The only reason anyone says he “earned” them is because they’ve existed for a while so people have come to accept them as legitimate. So he earned them because… he earned them? There is nothing fundamental about being a 10-5 player that means you should have full no-trade protection. it’s just something the MLBPA negotiated, so some of this “well he earned it” rhetoric needs to stop.
Additionally, earning the right to do something does not place you beyond reproach with regard to HOW you do it. I have earned the right the drive a car, but that doesn’t mean I can drive like a maniac and be exempt from criticism. The fact of the matter is that Dempster mishandled the situation and greatly interfered with the ability of the Cubs to do business.
I agree to an extent. Though driving a car is a privilege. It can be taken away.
10-5 “rights” are also a privilege (if you have to earn it, it isn’t really a right?), which was kind of my point, I suppose.
the problem isn’t that he’s exercising his 10/5 rights, it’s that he came out and said that he would accept a trade to a contender, specifically mentioned both the Dodgers and Braves, and then when the Cubs and Braves spent the time to work out a deal, went back on his word. His antics wasted a lot of people’s time.
This could be a last ditch effort by Hoyer/Epstein to gain a little more leverage with the Dodgers. Dempster will get offered at least a 2 year contract worth more than the $12.5mil the Cubs will offer next year. So at the very least the Cubs will get a comp pick in next years draft to go with their early 1st round pick.
And apparently Morosi agrees..
Cubs ownership and Theo Epstein have to be pretty mad now.
I don’t see myself moving out of the way anymore when I see him on his bike going home.
The Dodgers have Zack Greinke and Josh Johnson on their list in case they don’t trade for Greinke, Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports tweets.
I guess if you can’t have Greinke.. get Greinke
And if you can’t get either one…
Dempster 😀
Seems like Dempster is envoking his 10/5 rights JUST because he has them. I’m not a Cub/Dodger/Brave fan so it doesn’t mean much to me. He is making himself look bad.
Disagree. He has earned the right to play where he wants. More to it than just the team and city. He has a family to think about too. In a vacuum it looks selfish, but we don’t know his reasoning.
He has the right to stay in Chicago, just like the FO has the right to keep him rather than be taken by LA.
And the Cubs have the right to use him as they see fit. If he’s not part of the 2013 plans he should not start another game for the Cubs.
Looks like Dempster’s plan is backfiring if the Cubs are going to keep him and give him the qualifying offer.
Great! Call his bluff!
I guess spending 2-3 months in Atlanta for a few million dollars would have been just too torturous for Dempster to have to go through.
This guy is another in a very long line of athletes that people should remember when teaching your kids about role models.
if he is still on the Cubs boo him, he deserves it, we kept him around all these years for a mediocre pitcher, he is a good clubhouse guy that doesn’t win you games and now all of sudden he is having a good year, a contract year, I hope he is booed by cub fans at the game today
The Cubs are hoping that Dempster changes his mind on the Atlanta deal
— quickly, of course, because ATL is looking elsewhere, too. So maybe a 3 Team deal with Garza or Maholm to Braves Dempster/Soriano to Dodgers?
I can repsect the guy because he has a sick kid and is from Vancouver so he wants to go the west coast if moved…….but, why was Atlanta his 2nd pick? Unless that was completey false. Of course, I doubt the Cubs would haver tried to trade him somewhere he didn’t want to go knowing he has 10/5 rights…now, they have lost their leverage. He should have told the Cubs he only wanted LA and kept on the down low. They could have used Atlanta as leverage without knowing they were never going to deal him to the Braves. Dempster has put the Cubs in a bad spot.
This isnt about loyalty this is about the Cubs overplaying their hand when they asked for Zach Lee in the first place. They scared off the only team they could deal to while they still had the appearance of leverage. Overall its a massive fail by Theo and Jed. Those of you who are blaming Dempster don’t have a clue of the significance of a no-trade clause. Blame your team for being sellers because they suck.
Then why did Dempster say he would go to Atlanta in the first place. Delgado is better than Lee, so I don’t think asking for Lee is overplaying their hand.
Theo and Jed are playing this perfectly. Dempster doesn’t want to go to Atlanta? That’s his choice. Make the Dodgers give up Lee or Webster. If they don’t want to, give the qualifying offer to Dempster. Does he really want to sign a one year deal and have to go through this again next year and possibly the year after? If not, Cubs get a comp pick and Dempster costs his new team a first rounder.
The braves were willing to over pay for dempster. I think thats why most cubs fans are upset. If they were just willing to trade a B level prospect(which is prolly what he worth) the fans wouldnt be so upset. As a braves fan im happy about it but understand why cub fans are upset
I don’t consider Delgado an over payment if he’s signed to an extension, which is how Frank Wren rolls. Delgado isn’t a phenom by any means.
Im not the kinda braves fan that over values the prospects or any player on the big league club. If it was up to me delgado would have been traded last year when his value was higher. Dempster is 35 and having a career year. No way he keeps it up. But if u give them delgado u have to give him and extension just to save face and hope it doesnt go all derek lowe on u. Hope wren has something up his sleeve. Some younger guy with some contract left
From a Braves fan, thank you so much Dempster for wanting to go to the Dodgers. Now the Braves can pursue a pitcher that is ten times better than you and younger than you his name is Zach Greinke.
Zack Greinke
One of the most classless moves I’ve ever seen by a Chicago Cub. I don’t see how this guy makes another start in Wrigley.
Explain how this is classless.
Because he renigged. He told the organization he was willing to be traded to the Braves and then he balked.
Does the rule still apply that we have to offer him arbitration to get a compensation pick/1st round exchange?
I believe so, yes. You have to offer him to get in return.
That sucks because then we run the risk of him accepting and overpaying for him again.
Theoretically, is it possible if the Cubs wanted to stick it to him, could they not place him on waivers after July 31st and then any team that picked him up would pay the rest of his salary for the remainder of the year forcing him to play anywhere? Or would his 10/5 rights immediately make him a free agent?
No, you’re right. If the Cubs put him on waivers and another team claims him, he’s their’s.
It wouldn’t be the smartest thing & they’d never do it, but I would just to spite him back. lol.
Yes and no. It is now defined as a ‘qualifying offer’, which is the average of the top 125 salaries in MLB ($12-$13 million) and is a one year deal if he accepts it. If he declines, the Cubs would receive a compensation pick after the first round. The team that signs him would have to forfeit their first round pick.
I still think he’d probably accept a lowball offer if he loves playing in Chicago that much. I just don’t want to see him back, but obviously, like any fan at this point want to see us get something for him & all the years we put up with this guy and his mediocre overpaid years.
I know I’m going to get a ridiculous amount of dislikes, but I don’t really care. Maybe it was because the Braves are not really a serious World Series contender. They were so bad down the stretch. Plus the owners of the team are really stingy, and are not likely to pay big for free agents. If I were choosing a team to make a WS run, the Braves would be one of the last options I select. Still, I would love to have Delgado right now.
third most runs scored in the NL, currently 2nd place in the best division in the NL, currently hold a wild card spot, with SP and bench being the only real weak points (and FW saying that if they can obtain a top of the rotation guy, they will quickly move to address the bench)…
with the addition of a top of the line starter (which I don’t believe Dempster is, so thankfully he nixed the deal), how can you not consider this team a true contender this year?
2011
You Cubs fans crying over this mess make me laugh, thank you. Dempster has earned his right to be choosy. 10/5 will do that. This is not Theo’s mess either. Blame the previous regime for this. For most 10/5 guys will want to pick where they go and dictate those terms as well. Dempster is doing what he feels is best for his family. I cannot find any fault in that at all. Much like why Lee did not want to go to L.A. Dempster is the opposite. For Lee it was the money (which is greed but his right to be greedy) and for Demp family. Stop blaming the player, blame the previous regime who should have moved him last season before 10/5 kicked in.
the issue went right over your head
Well he should have said it was his family in the first place, instead of telling everyone that if the Cubs were offered anything to improve them ( definitely Delgado) then he would accept a trade. In other words, a promise is a promise, he really gave the Cubs a good one.
This no trade clauses should be banned
I keep hearing this “Dempster’s gotta do what’s right for his family garbage”. Hello he’s a professional athlete that just has to move for 2 months from one place that isn’t close to his family to another place that isn’t going to affect how much he sees them during the season anyways.
His family is from British Columbia and if he was so concerned about being close to his family he would ask to be traded to Seattle which isn’t feasible because they’re sellers.
But you know what teams would be feasible…Oakland and San Fran are closer than LA. He could even want to go to the Angels as well.
Watch Dempster accept the qualifying offer from the cubs next year. That would be too funny.