2:29pm: MLB.com’s Alden Gonzalez hears that the Angels aren’t seriously involved in the market for Heyward at this point (or for any top outfielder, for that matter), though he does add that said stance can change quickly (Twitter link).
1:31pm: ESPN’s Jayson Stark hears that Heyward isn’t looking for a 10-year deal in the $200MM range as has oft been speculated, but rather something more like eight or nine years at $24MM per season (Twitter link).
1:17pm: The Angels are also among the finalists for Heyward, reports Morosi (via Twitter).
11:37am: Cardinals GM John Mozeliak said he hasn’t been given any sort of indication as to the timing of a Heyward decision, tweets Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch.
10:00am: Alex Pavlovic of CSN Bay Area tweets that the Giants checked in with Heyward but never got to the point of making an offer. There’s a sense in Nashville that Heyward will come off the board today, Pavlovic adds.
9:34am: Talks between Jason Heyward and interested parties are beginning to progress, according to Jon Morosi and Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports report (Twitter link). The Cubs and Cardinals are among the finalists, per the report, but there are other yet-unnamed clubs in the mix for Heyward’s services.
Heyward’s name has come up most frequently in connection to the Cardinals and Cubs as of late, though he’s also been linked to the Angels and Giants in various reports, as each club could use a left-handed corner bat. The Giants, in particular, were said to prefer Heyward to some of the other bats on the market at present due to his glovework, though it remains to be seen if they’ll be among the top bidders in the end.
Heyward is a perfect fit for the Cubs, he gets 9/195.
My guess is Cards 7/180
per thr Chicago Cubs Den blog:
“It should be noted that Heyward’s reps have reportedly left the Winter Meetings already, so we may not hear anything today on a decision. The Cardinals FO have also left the meetings and say they have no indication of when Heyward will make a decision.”
He’d cost more than that per year. Plus, he’s not a perfect fit. The Cubs don’t need more offense, they need, they need power pitching that misses bats in that small ballpark of theirs.
Sure, his defense could help. But they’ll end up putting him in center where he’s below average.
Yeah, I was actually more encouraged by the conversation the Cubs had with Denard Span..
How do you know he’s below average in center? Last year down the stretch and in the postseason the cardinals used him in center actually and they obviously wouldn’t have done that if he was below average
His advanced statistics in center are not good. It’s a limited sample, sure, but even the eye test tells you he’s a corner outfielder.
75.5 UZR/150 for CF in 2015 are not good? As you pointed out limited sample but Hayward would simply be a huge defensive asset anywhere in the outfield.
Cubs will play on Hayward and if they get outbid look for them to go after Fowler again.
Would not be surprised if they inquired about KK from the Rays.
Cubs have the prospects to pry him away.
Heyward is not a perfect fit? He greatly improves the outfield defense which was one of the goals this offseason and he has a nice OBP which will be nice in front of all the guys who swing and miss.
Heyward is worth the money. Last year he played to well above the value that he is supposed to be receiving in free agency.
They’d be tying up a ton of salary when there are much cheaper CF options available. You generally don’t sign guys to $200m contracts to force them to move positions. Potential of disaster is WAY too high. Plus, the biggest negative on Heyward is that so much of his value is tied to defense, and defense declines first as guys age. Stick him in CF and it declines even faster.
he only greatly improves the outfield defense playing a corner, in center hes probably roughly the equivalent of fowler. he offers more contact and better baserunning than fowler however, with the added benefit of being able to play a great RF assuming they trade soler for someone like corrasco.
Small ball park?? Wrigley actually has the deepest right and left field lines, and overall is bigger than many stadiums including Busch. If the cubs don’t sign Heyward hopefully they drive up the cost like when Theo was in Boston.
True they, like almost every club, can always use more pitching. As for Wrigley being a small park, it is not really the bandbox everyone seems to think it is. It is still the longest park down the lines of any mlb stadium. That 12 foot brick wall is at least four feet higher than those parks that allow homers to be robbed by leaping players. And while the old girl gives up some homers, ten parks gave up more last year. Also in terms of total runs scored, Wrigley tended to be more a pitchers park than a hitters one.
Interesting stats here : http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/parkfactor
Honestly, Cubs’ pitching last year was phenomenal. They had among the top SP ERA in all of baseball.
The Cubs are likely just driving up the price. A cheaper more prototypical CF/leadoff guy would make more sense. You have to be excited if your a Cubs fan either way. Imagine what a lineup with Heyward might look like.
Zorbrist
Heyward
Bryant
Rizzo
Schwarber
Soler
Montero
Pitcher
Russell
Cubs way to drive up the price for the Cardinals.. and it will probably work.
Depends. Perhaps neither team signs him and he goes elsewhere. Regardless of where he lands, I think the team will be disappointed in health/production over the contract.
He’s gonna go to Anaheim.
Let him go to Anaheim. You already have one albatross of a contract from a Cardinal, may as well add another. Btw how is CJ Wilson working out?
And for 24 million per year, I would be ok with that.
Dewitt is finally ready to spend. Hope its not on Heyward. Noooo way he is worth 20 mil a year !!!!
Dodgers? Yankees? Giants? Angels?
Just what the Dohyers need…another OF
I don’t see the Angels crossing the $189m threshold…
Angels won’t need to cross that line. If they sign Heyward they’ll just dump Wilson on someone for no return. Don’t need him anyway.
Hayward has been the Angels number 1 target this off season.
This would be huge if the Cubs can sign him
Cubs vs Cards in offseason. Popcorn and a ringside seat, please. Or the Dodgers do a stealth deal like the Cubs for Zobrist.
If the Cards don’t get Heyward, it’s a huge failure for the organization.
Failure. Embarrassment. All of the above…
Not for DeWitt and Mo they get to go cheap. Big TV deal keep the cash and make believe they tried. The Cubs did do it. They will be headed to the NLCS. And WS. They want to win. DeWitt and Mo have the big sluggers Moss and Adams maybe 15 HRs between them. Wow
I totally agree with you Tom!! As long as they sell 3 million tickets a year, they don’t care about anything else. They truly do not care about players team loyalty and they certainly have no loyalty to their players as to their past service. Jon Jay is an example of that!!’
Trades happen in baseball Cletis it’s the nature of the beast. Jay sucks, they made a good trade get over it.
Yes Sir Cards Lefty. I apologize. I didn’t realize that Jay sucked.
Cards Lefty….. I am so sorry! I apologize. I didn’t realize that Jay sucks.
Oh I’m so sorry …Cards Lefty…I sorry and I apologize!! I didn’t realize Jay sucks. My bad.
Wow, Cletis is really taking the Jay trade hard. Three replies 15 minutes apart saying the same thing?
Jay was the 5th OF. Jay was not startable in the Cardinals lineup. Jay needed to be taken away from Mike Matheny (just like Craig). Jay was not worth his salary this year.
You don’t pay for past service… you pay for service now. Do you still want to pay Albert $240/10? Even right now at his production level?
No.
Not really.. they will pay Hewyard what they think is fair and probably a little more considering other teams are in on J-Hey. Its not a failure if the Card dont resign him. They will just use that money elsewhere.
They have stated that they will not use the money elsewhere – it will be lost. This is why I am in favor of paying Heyward whatever it takes to get him to sign. There is no alternative. This is their last move of the offseason. If he walks, they only use internal options.
What? No alternative? Are you serious??? Theres Cespedes, Upton, and Alex Gordon which all have much better offensive numbers (which we need the most) than J-Hey. Even Gordon is a multi gold glove winner. There are plenty alternatives other that Jason Big Money Heyward.
I agree. I think the Cards would be better off with Cespedes, or with Gordon plus some money for a better 1B.
they didn’t sign pujols and never looked back
Someone on mlb network says he has a 12 year offer in Europe.
Nah, he’ll pull a Carmelo and choose to go after a shorter contract and a championship in New York.
I offered him $1m, 35 year deal to drive bus, with a team option for a 36th year.
I heard 15/310
From Real Madrid? I hear they need a good corner outfielder to play behind Cristiano Ronaldo.
JHay is a must sign for the Cards. Piscotty and Grichuk are unproven bats.
Disagree. Team would be better off signing Gordon for much less money and fewer years, and using the savings either on another pitcher or a better 1B.
Finally. S*** or get off the pot Heyward. If it comes down to dollars, he picks Cubs ( or mystery team). I’ll just be glad it’s over with. Sign somebody Moz…while there’s still impactful FA’s to be had.
Well they could be eyeing Stephen Strasburg next year.
The Orioles indicate they are in the mix too!
if it’s between Chris Davis or Jason Heyward for the next 8+ years can you learn to love the latter?
Probably the most overrated player I have ever seen as a free agent.I don’t care how good your defense is.If you hit only 13 HR’s and drive in 70 RBI’s you are not an elite player.Who would you rather have in your outfield?Heyward or Manny Ramirez?
Cause RBI is a stat scouts use? Do you look at pitcher wins as well?
Don’t bother paying attention to things like BA, OBP, SB’s, and defense……this guy must think Altuve sucks since he only hit 15 HR’s with 66 RBI’s.
So since a ton of Heyward’s value is tied to his defense, if he plays on a team with mostly ground ball pitchers does he lose like half his value?
He gets only 1.7 chances per game in RF as it is now. A team with ground ball pitchers might decrease that on average by a point or two, but it wouldn’t skew his metrics largely as the highly weighted situations come with runners in scoring position and players are pushing it to right field anyway.
What might largely change the weight of Heyward’s calculated dWAR would be a move like the Cubs have been speculated to make by converting Heyward to CF.
I don’t buy that speculation for two reasons… 1) is that. like you said, so much of his value is tied to his GG defense in RF. Playing him in CF would somewhat negate his biggest strength… 2) I always thought the Cubs saw two ways to improve their ‘playoff rotation’ (top 4 pitchers) for next year. They could have signed Price or Greinke to a $32 mil AAV or they could sign Heyward to a $20-22 mil AAV and then use Jorge Soler as a trade chip to bring in a young, cc pitcher. Option B has always made the most sense to me.
Shhhh…. we know all your secret usernames John Mozeliak.
This may shock you, but the answer is Heyward. Heyward has more WAR through his age-25 season and already has more 6+ WAR seasons than Manny had in his entire career.
Are you using WAR to point out that Heyward is a better player?
Are you using HR’s and RBI’s to determine a player’s status as “elite” or not?
You’re the one using HR and RBI to say he’s a bad player. How are those stats any better?
According to WAR – and WAR only – Kiermaier’s 2015 was better than all but three (3) of Ken Griffey Jr’s seasons.
Kiermaier’s derived 162WL of .525 in his age 24/25 seasons is identical to Junior’s age 24/25 seasons.
If WAR is siloed in these arguments, do we coin flip between Kiermaier and Junior?
KK WAR was 5.5
Griffey’s top-5 WAR figures: 9.7, 9.0, 6.9, 6.8, 6.6 — all of which coincide with the years he graded out best defensively. And that’s the part of WAR that makes sense – it actually values defense. Because we live in a fantasy sports world – and because the eye test only shows results – we typically devalue defense as fans.
You’re using the wrong version of WAR for comparing historical seasons. If you need help understanding this, please ask someone.
In the context of historical comparison, Kiermaier’s WAR was 7.3.
I think it’s cute that there are still people who think this way in baseball. You’re becoming fewer and farther between, but I still think it’s fun when one of pops up.
Also, to answer your question, there are a few years where Manny’s bat was good good and his defense was only moderately atrocious that I would pick him, but in general, I would definitely take Heyward’s skill set.
you’re lying to yourself if you would take Heyward over Manny
Not really. Manny was one of the worst defensive players ever, which, even though it’s not as flashy, matters. He’s still a borderline Hall of Famer, and there were certainly years where I would take his production over Heyward’s but as a general rule,I’d rather Heyward.
Career .312/.411/.585 (154 OPS+) hitter with 555 home runs — say Manny is one of the best hitters in history and a first ballot shoo-in. Only his connection to PEDs would keep him out.
I’d much rather have Heyward in the outfield. Any sane person would. And any sane person would rather have Manny in the batters’ box. But that wasn’t the question. The question was about the outfield.
Agreed. I’m a lifetime Brave’s fan and this guy is not worth more than 10 million a year.
Totally agree!! This guy is 6’6″ and hits with a wet newspaper!! We need a middle of the order bat which Heyward is certainly not! But idiot fans think it’s smart to give a defensive right fielder at that who can occasionally steal a base a franchise crippling 200 mil contract for the next 10 years?? We ain’t the Yankees or Dodgers!! Put Piscoty in RF you get same or better production for free! you wanna throw away 200 mil dollars give it to Davis at least you’ll get 40-50 bombs and drive in 90-100 rbis!
Wish the Cards would. Big splash my butt.
Remember we got the big sluggers Moss and Adams. We don’t need offense. Go to play offs and puke
I’d rather have Heyward.
I’d much rather have Heyward in the outfield. If your question said “batters’ box”, I’d say Manny Ramírez.
Am I the only Cub fan that doesn’t want Heyward? If we sign him then you are 100% saying goodbye to arietta in 2 years – no way are the cubs going to have 3 $23M to $25yr players on its roster. Yes he is good – yes he would help but I much prefer using the money to extend Arietta
I’m a fan and I like Heyward for the Cubs, but not at 200 MM. Way too much money to spend on great defense and little power. He might blossom and I am intrigued, but not intrigued enough to spend 200 mil.
I’m not sure that’s true. Once that TV deal is made they will have plenty to spend. 25m isn’t what it used to be. Not to mention most of the cubs young talent isn’t even arb eligible for another 5 or 6 years.
If you think most of the Cubs young talent isn’t arb eligible for 5-6 years….well then you must talking about their minor league players…..The Cubs don’t have a single player on their current 40 player roster who isn’t arb eligible within the next 3-4 years. The Cubs also have 2 separate TV deals and can’t pursue a huge one like LA and PHI until both expire…..after the 2019 season.
I was talking about the next wave of players as well as not actually checking the clocks. When we’re talking about 10 year contracts, 3-4 years isn’t far away, and you can spend some of that money before you actually get it as long as you have the assets, which I’m sure the cubs do. Point about 25m still stands though. In four years you’ll probably see #3 starters making 25m.
I’m right there with you. No interest in paying 200 mil, or so, to an outfielder who’s not Bryce Harper.
I’d rather take my chances with Denard Span/Rajai Davis combo on a lesser deal, or let Baez go out there, and move forward. I like that Theo hasn’t broke the bank with his acquisitions so far. While I know it’s not my money, by signing Heyward, how many of the other kids are we going to lose eventually when it comes time for them to get paid?
You wouldn’t pay Trout 200 million?
$198.9 million, and not a soggy hot dog more.
I just threw one name out there, saying that Heyward is good, but not in Bryce’s territory, and not worth 200 mil, if that’s what he’s seeking.
Bryce Harper is going to get at least 400m if he continues at any sort of similar pace
I just threw one name out there, saying that Heyward is good, but not in Bryce’s territory, and not worth 200 mil, if that’s what he’s seeking. Trout is obviously a stud as well.
Sign Kris Bryant to an extension now. It might sound farfetched but Julio Urias might still be playing baseball during the year the first player breaks $1 Billion.
Well that’s fun… but Harper is set to hit FA at 25-years old with numbers that will be on par with Alex Rodriguez…. Remember when ARod got 10-years/$252 mil from the Rangers? Not only did his contract double what even the elite players were getting at that time, but in the 15 years since, it’s still the largest free agent contract ever handed out.. Why? Because ARod was that unique a free agent, a 5-tool player with a massive resume of success who reached free agency at a young enough age where his very best years were clearly still ahead of him.
Harper is no different. He’ll approach $400 million if he hits free agency in a few years.
Harper, if he even becomes a FA, would net a $350-$400m deal. You read that right.
Heyward is getting his $200, and that’s the low end.
Harper and Trout are not 200 million dollar players. They are 300 million dollar players. The baseball economy is changing.
I’m thinking that they are also thinking ahead.
The only true impact full player next year in FA is Stephen Strasburg.
http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/free-agents/2017/
Look at the list above and you’ll know what I’m talking about.
Better spend now because there won’t be guys to spend on next year.
I agree. Spending money on Heyward doesn’t fill a need. Top of the order guy who can run down balls in center likely costs less than Heyward. Denard Span or even Raj Davis would do.
Contract loading/structure makes this less of an issue. Plus, budget by 2018-2020 will be very different. Extend Bryant, Rizzo, Russell, etc. in stages over that time to help both sides and having Arrieta, Lester, Heyward all on the rolls is very feasible.
The Cardinals talk big about a big splash then oops we got beat out. Stop misleading the fans that support you. If you screw this up I hope you get dumped at the turnstiles. The Cubs really trying to win. You have been just showing up to the play offs then puke.
Puke? Short memory?
Who has been to 4 World Series since 04 and won 2 of them? Won their division the last 3 years? Been a NLCS fixture year in, year out? Ain’t the Cubs……
Angles come on pull the trigger!!
The “Evil Empire” strikes back!
Maybe he’s going to make a Lebron style announcement
I wish the Cubs could pry Carlos Gomez from the Astros.
The contending Astros won’t give up elite production.
He seems like a head case. Guy has been traded a lot. I’d rather roll the dice on CarGo, provided we don’t break the bank with prospects.
Not sure why they’re so quick to want to deal Soler, unless his early injury issues are scaring the, or maybe he’s just the guy they’re most willing to deal .
He’s been traded once?
Twice. Johan Santana deal also. Still not a lot though.
Three times actually. Mets-Twins, Twins-Brewers, Brewers-Astros. Not sure of that’s an indictment on his character (maybe it’s more about his talent), bit he does get moved quite a bit
I thought he meant Heyward. The formatting on who it was in response to was messed up.
you don’t have to pry. just pay up. Gomez can be had for sure.
It would be nice to have him back in STL just not sure how much power he would gain over the next few years as he does have a long swing and has a hole inside. but if we don’t get him I hope we can land Upton/cespedes for their boom sticks which we need badly POWER boys POWER. Might as well trade for Carlos Gonzalez too send them Grichuck, Adams, Gonzalez, and Reyes too and hell anyone else they want within reason. BTW F the SCRUBS
Sabermetrics went from a tool to get these players cheap to a tool to get these players overpaid. Heyward has value yes but not 200 million dollar value.
Agreed.. If Ozzie Smith was a free agent at 26 in today’s market would he be looking at a 400MM contract? I know it’s trendy to bash RBIs and home runs these days but you still need to score runs to win games.
No thanks walk away breath Cub fans save a dollar or two million .go for Span stick to are own plan Theo did good on Warren,Zobiest,
I have a feeling the only reason the Cubs are pushing for Heyward is to screw the Cardinals and make them up their price to a ridiculous amount, the Cubs dont need him. In fact, the Cardinals dont need him either.
Cards don’t need Heyward. The guy is a 6 hole hitter with no pop. This offense needs somebody that can be a middle of the order bat. Go get CarGo and let the Cubs or whoever have the guy for 10 years.
Agreed. Pretty simple. I’m betting Moz is playing it cool as I’m certain STL Mgmt has this mindset.
Definetly don’t see cardinals going 20+ mil per year on heyward. He’s average offensively. Yes his defense if great but he’s only involved in an average of about 2 plays per game in rf. 200 mil for him is just too much. Piscotty in rf for a full season is the smarter move for them. As for Cubs he don’t fit either unless they trade soler because heyward is not a long term solution for cf.
He’s been nearly 20% better than average offensively over his career. That’s not “average”.
I believe Heyward will be a bust…not because he becomes a bad player, but because it sounds like he is getting a superstar contract and he isnt a superstar player. He is really good relative to most OF and especially compared to this free-agent group, but that doesnt make him a superstar. Jason Bay was kinda like that insofar as he never produced like a bigtime player but got a bigtime contract bc he was at the top of that years FA class. (The comparison ends there.)
Im not an StL or ATL fan but i never got the sense Heyward was a huge impact player: he appeared to be a big defensive asset with typical offensive skills for an OF. It will be interesting to see where he ends up and how he performs relative to the contract.
Agreed. Heyward is a very good player, but not one that I would feel comfortable signing to a 7+ year contract that is nearly a lock to backfire
Agree. This reminds me of Jayson Werth. As for the Angels getting their feet wet with this guy, no one is worth more than Trout on that team.
If Cubs do manage to get Heyward —and they will if they truly want to— then I can’t imagine they keep Schwarber _and_ Soler. I’d look for them to pursue a pitcher via trade.
How about Soler, Hammel and Edwards Jr. / Underwood for Carrasco? I’m higher on him than Tyson Ross, for sure. Something about that windup just screams command issues to me.
I’d be happy with Carrasco as well. We need a centerfielder until Almora comes up. Cubs could pull a jerry jones with Deion . Take heyward so nobody else can have him . We need a heyward who is a singles hitter who gets on base as opposed to another swing and miss guy. He is basically a mark grace who plays outfield.
I agree, but I wouldn’t justify the monetary and yearly commitment to Heyward on his singles-hitting ability alone. If that were only the case, I’d be happy going after Span on a one-year, incentive-based deal with a club option for him as a stopgap until Almora arrives.
But this still leaves the question of Baez. We have an embarrassment of riches in middle-infield prospects, even having shipped Castro and cemented Russell as our everyday shortstop. I was less-than-stoked upon hearing the Baez-for-Cobb & McGee rumors.
Wow. Some ridiculous perspectives opinions here but I’m not surprised at all.
A few things:
1. Cubs are likely just trying to increase the price for the Cardinals with a slight chance of securing Heyward to create a package, now or in July, to get what they need = pitching. Is he a fit? Sure. Is he ideal? Not really at the price point as the have other future commitments and bigger gains to be had elsewhere. Does he make the Cubs better? Yes but not by as much as Lackey.
2. Cardinals are smart to not overpay. So if you think it’s a failure if the Cardinals don’t sign him, then I’m sorry you don’t understand baseball. Just because the Cardinals have money doesn’t mean you have to spend it to get ahead. There are no certainties in life. If you understand investing, you’ll understand this point. Sometimes you’re best of not spending and letting the market ride.
3. Heyward is not elite. He may have an elite season or two but he’s not Trout or Harper. No argument to be had here. Either team that signs him know this, fans still believe he *COULD* be elite. Sorry too late.
4. Heyward is a product of hype. His lackluster numbers have always been made up by his age, his size, his defense, other “metrics” which really don’t mean much, and the fact he was a Cardinal.
5. If you think Heyward is the missing piece to a championship in STL, boy are you wrong. The bread and butter is pitching and always will be. We have plenty of options that can do as much if not more than Heyward. Even at that, we may be riddled with injuries to our staff next year. Do not get your hopes up if they commit $200 mil to Heyward. He is not a game-changer.
I’m a realistic Cardinals fan. We need to do what we’ve done: rely on the pieces we have and make a move if we have gaps next July. Beyond that, it’s wishful thinking that Heyward spells out number 12 in STL. Wish it was the case but it’s not.
Kinda cry to think the Cubs would go after Heyward now that Blackmon is available. They have been in love with him for two years now.I feel they are just Increasing the price for the Cardinals. They can save money but probably lose soler in any deal.
Check out blackmon’s home and away splits… Awful away from coors.
He is not worth anywhere close to 190m. Please Mo WALK AWAY from Heyward. If you are gonna spend 180m sign Davis or Upton.
Agreed. I’d rather have Upton at this point since he will command a shorter contract. Flexibility > * —– just as NYY or LAA.
They will not spend the money anywhere else. It is all internal if not Heyward!
Heyward is not worth 190M, but Davis is?
Never mind that JHey was worth 2 more wins than Upton last year, or that he’s two years younger…
I did wish that the cubs would get JHey but after reading some rare insitefull comments here in this thread that have convinced me that Soler has more upside as a hitter and has less chances to make a defensive mistake because of his position. I would offer Fowler a 2 year offer with a team option for the 3rd year at 16 mil per year offer with an opt out clause after 1 year if he chooses to. That is just above the QO and it also gives him some small bit of security if he really liked it there I would have to consider it if I was him.
I think you mean insightful.
And Soler made a nice (non-)impact with his inflated BABIP, so I wonder what his line will look like after that comes down a bit.
I am a die hard Cardinals fan. I like Jason Heyward, but giving him over 20 million a year for more than 8 years would be absurd. I hear about WAR all the time and the move to discredit more traditional stats such as HR’s and RBI has reached a fevered pitch. The bottom line is power matters. The Cubs were a prime example of that last year. I would rather see the Cardinals trade for Gonzalez or Fielder. I would really like to see Mo make a call to Anaheim and see what they would want to get Albert back plus 8 to 10 million a year. This team needs pop. It is inconceivable to me that we are seriously contemplating handing Jason Heyward the richest contract in club history. How can we be sure that his defense will be leaps and bounds above an in house replacement such as Grichik or Piscotty or Pham for that matter. Heyward is good, but not elite. pointing to WAR as a justification just doesn’t win championships.
Why does everyone want the Cards to spend money so badly? They are an organization that has succeeded while spending their resources wisely and finding the best fit for their team. They feel/felt that Heyward and Price were players that fit and they are/were willing to throw some money at them, but they don’t need to unwisely overpay if they don’t want to. Also, it doesn’t mean they have to blow that money on the next guy down the list. Look how well overspending on free agents has worked for the Dodgers, Angels, and Yankees over the past few years. Big money on “the best free agents available” doesn’t guarantee a WS championship.
for the cards fans that don’t want to give out that sort of money, let’s remember that the cardinals just signed a TV deal worth in excess of 1 billion dollars. They have the money to sign heyward this year and go after arieta or strasburg in the following years, especially when holliday’s contract is up after next season.
The loser of this bidding war is whoever wins and has to pay Heyward MVP money for his good defense and decent offense.
Exactly. Hope the Angels just take him. Cards focus should be on 1 SP and a middle of the order bat. Not a guy who hits 6 but thinks he should be paid like a 3 hole.
Could you imagine an OF of Trout and Heyward? Scary good D.
well I’m glad Cards fans finally realized how overrated he was after playing for their team. Whoever signs him will realize too!
Sometimes it is best to get off your computer chair and stop looking at the dumb WAR stat.
Who said the Cardinals realized how overrated he was? Every sign says that the Cardinals will stay in this bidding war.
I said their fans.
Would not be upset if the Angels got Heyward to keep him off the Cubs but save the Cardinals money. You act like there’s a number one starter left, though. Cueto’s the only thing remotely close and I know that no Cardinals fan wants Johnny Cueto anywhere near our team.
What about Schwarber to White Sox for Quintana? Dump LaRoche any way possible and DH Schwarber
Cubs seem to be going after everyone. Call their bluffs and let them figure out how to make good with all the money they apparently have.
Wait, what? They didn’t have offers on all these players out at the same time.
no, i’m not looking for 10/200, i’m looking for 9/216
That is an insane salary for someone who hit .293 / .359 / .439 last season. Those are good numbers. Not great. Yet he wants to paid like a future HOF.
Hence why Atlanta traded him when they did. They knew he wanted to be paid like a 3-hole hitter and that is not what he is. At all. He’ll be the highest paid player the Cardinals have ever had but hey, he can bat 6th, roll over to the 2nd baseman every 4th AB and catch about 4 fly balls a game
just sign alex gordon
“MLB.com’s Alden Gonzalez hears that the Angels aren’t seriously involved in the market for Heyward at this point”
That exact phrase was said about Pujols and Hamilton too.
Doesn’t make much sense why either team is pursuing such an expensive outfielder. Both teams need pitching help as they both can put out a solid opening day rotation but no team in the league stays with 5 healthy starters all year and neither team has much starting pitching depth ready to go in the upper minors.
Cards have Piscotty and Grichuk all but locked in for the foreseeable future with enough help filling the OF this year to deal Jon Jay for a backup/utility infielder. Cubs and more specifically Maddon don’t really care about defining defensive positions (see Schwarber, Baez, Castro, Bryant all starting at multiple positions through the season last year). Both teams should be battling for Leake, Chen type quality mid rotation pieces for long term deals and spend the savings of not paying Heyward to back fill outfield and bench or bullpen spots
Card’s fans need to just chill out and calm down. Think about it, Card’s brass hasn’t done anything stupid yet. Didn’t overpay for a utility player [Zobrist], instead got Gyorko who put up really good numbers 2 years ago and who,, after being sent down to the minors for a stint last year, came back and put up really decent numbers afterwards. Smart move imo. And they sent Cruz’s butterfly bat to KC and got a decent backup for Molina. Another prudent move. Now we’ve retained Broxton who did a good job for us in 2015. And i’ll venture that we ain’t done yet. Be patient,. no telling what’s being discussed that ain’t being reported.
I don’t know the Nationals are coming on strong…We need to just go all out on him. We passed Price for this very reason, signed Lackey, got Zorb, we have the cash we can trade for a pitcher later. Go all out boys 200M at 10 years lets do it Theo and Tom. Just do it man!