As he closes in on his 30th birthday and the start of his tenth season of action in the big leagues, Chris Sale (through his reps at Jet Sports Management) is engaged in at least some level of discussion with the Red Sox regarding an extension. The upcoming season is the final year of control under the deal Sale originally signed with the White Sox, adding some impetus to discussions.
It’s a fascinating situation to consider, owing to a variety of considerations. From a narrative perspective, the club’s whiff on Jon Lester years ago provides obvious fodder for comparisons. And an otherwise quiet winter from the defending World Series champs also makes for an intriguing backdrop.
The really interesting part, though, is the valuation itself. Starting pitchers have found a fair bit of success at prying monster deals from clubs entering a walk year. Clayton Kershaw’s original extension (seven years, $215MM plus opt-out) is the largest, but Stephen Strasburg’s recent $175MM deal also makes for a notable recent data point. Both of those pitchers were more youthful than Sale, but Justin Verlander’s second extension (which added five years and $140MM to his existing deal) was signed at a comparable age point (and two seasons in advance of his free agency).
That’s not to say that any of those particular deals really looks to be a perfect comp for Sale. Rather, they go to show that Sale can and should be looking for a contract that values his would-be free agent seasons at their anticipated market value.
On the other hand, there’s also no small amount of risk to be priced in here. That was the case with those other contracts, to be sure, but in this case the team will no doubt be particularly wary. After all, Sale missed five starts last year with still-mysterious shoulder issues. Though he’s said not to have exhibited structural problems, he showed some potentially worrisome velocity changes (with a correspondingly wandering release point) last year.
Both the team and Sale himself surely know quite a bit more than we do about his health. Certainly, his overall track record is one of excellent durability. While Sale’s funky delivery and big velocity readings have long led to predictions of physical ailments, he averaged 30 starts and 205 frames annually from 2012 through 2017.
Whatever the health risk may be relative to other pitchers, there’s little denying that Sale’s recent performance track record is quite free of red flags. All told, Sale has a 2.89 ERA in nearly 1500 career MLB innings and currently sits as the all-time leader in K/9 and K/BB ratio.
Importantly, too, he was in top form last year. Sale was deployed judiciously in the 2018 postseason but did record 24 strikeouts in 15 1/3 frames. Before that, he handled 158 regular-season innings, over which he allowed just 37 earned runs on 102 hits and 34 walks while racking up a whopping 237 strikeouts. When you smooth out the ups and downs in the radar readings, Sale threw harder overall last year than he ever has as a starter (95.7 mph average four-seamer). He also generated more swinging strikes than ever before (15.8%).
Those facts seem to distinguish Sale from Kershaw, who recently provided another notable contractual point to consider. The Dodger star’s new deal was hammered out in a near-open-market scenario, in the window before he had to decide whether to opt out of the final two years and $65MM of the aforementioned contract. The sides came up with a rather unique arrangement: three years, $93MM, with $12MM in total incentives that are achievable in full if Kershaw is at full health throughout the deal. Kershaw turns 31 in March, just before his new deal begins, so that contract covers almost the exact same age period as Sale’s next contract will. Not unlike Sale, Kershaw missed a few outings last year but still generated impressive results. Unlike Sale, Kershaw has exhibited more significant and long-lasting concerns in terms of his stuff and peripherals. The Dodger stalwart averaged 162 innings annually in the three seasons preceding his deal, with a series of back issues limiting his availability, tamping down his velocity, and reducing him from the game’s best pitcher to “merely” one of its best.
In the Kershaw scenario, it seems fair to say that the Dodgers mostly took a health discount by limiting the length of the commitment and including a hefty, easily achievable, but health-dependent incentives structure. It’s the kind of contract we might have expected, in the not-so-distant past, for an outstanding pitcher of an older age. That Kershaw took it at a relatively youthful stage is testament both to the level of concern with his long-term outlook and perhaps also the newfound market commitment of many teams to avoid obligating payroll space too far into the future (particularly for players in their mid-30s).
It seems easy to say that Sale won’t need to settle for the Kershaw deal to get something done. The latter has had the more impressive overall career, but his recent red flags are impossible to ignore. Still, it’s an interesting general scenario to contemplate when imagining what a deal could look like.
How’s it look for players who hit free agency under more favorable circumstances? The approach long has been to chase the biggest and lengthiest deal on the open market. David Price ($217MM) and Max Scherzer ($210MM) were each a bit younger when they secured their seven-year mega-deals — both turned 31 during the first seasons of their new contracts — than Sale will be when he hits the open market. Zack Greinke, the only other pitcher to top $200MM, turned 32 just before reaching free agency, so he was a fair bit older. He got six years and $206.5MM, easily setting a Major League record (which he still holds) with an average annual value north of $34MM.
There’s little question that Sale could position himself for massive earnings in the 2019-20 offseason with a performance that mirrors his 2018 in quality and his prior career in durability. Sale could be joined by some big names on the open market, but he almost surely possesses the greatest earning upside of any possible free-agent starter. Price’s total guarantee and Greinke’s AAV marks both seem theoretically achievable, though it’s arguable whether that kind of coin will still be available in today’s market. Even if we could accurately gauge Sale’s true earning ceiling, which would depend upon quite a few market factors, reaching it represents only one of several conceivable scenarios. With something less than full health, or declines in velocity and/or effectiveness, Sale’s earning power would obviously begin to slide.
So, where might we anticipate the price tag landing in extension talks? Sale will earn $15MM in 2019 regardless of any new deal, so we’ll consider only the future seasons. Presumably, the Red Sox will look for some kind of discount (in salary, years, or both) to account for the health uncertainty — both that of any pitcher separated from free agency by a full season and whatever added questions come with Sale. Might the Boston organization seek to cabin the length of the contract? Or would it be amenable to a lengthier deal that spreads the guarantee over a longer span, thus reducing the annual luxury tax hit? And what about Sale’s own preferences?
Supposing the Sox are willing to go to Greinke levels on the AAV but not on the term, it’s possible to imagine a five-year extension in the range of $175MM. That figure would also match the recent Strasburg deal, albeit over a shorter duration (his was for seven years) — arguably a fair result for a more accomplished and consistent, but also less youthful starter. But is that really the most sensible approach? Perhaps the team would rather stretch things out, even if it means committing to additional seasons. Adding six years at $190MM would not greatly expand the Red Sox’ overall commitment. For one thing, it’s reasonable to anticipate that Sale will still be a useful-enough pitcher at the end of that deal to warrant his salary. There’s a risk he won’t be, certainly, but there’s also real upside (see, e.g., Verlander) as well as the promise of continued inflation driving down the effective price.
Interestingly, the club’s luxury tax situation also increases the value of spreading the AAV. Let’s do a bit of math to see how this looks. Sale’s original extension, signed before the 2013 season, will have paid him a total of $59MM over seven seasons, but option years are treated as one-off seasons for purposes of the competitive balance tax calculation. That means that Sale’s hit to the Sox’ books this year will be his current salary of $15MM. Modifying his forward-looking contract rights, though, would change that number by adding the new years and dollars and then re-running the AAV. As MLBTR’s Steve Adams examined recently with regard to a hypothetical re-signing of Craig Kimbrel, any new money added to the Boston luxury ledger is going to be taxed at a hefty rate. A new deal for Sale would not only trigger a drop in draft placement but would also mean a big tax bill increase. You can find the details there; for our purposes, since a new deal would certainly be of sufficient magnitude to push the club into the top tax bracket, the Red Sox would pay 75 cents for every additional dollar of AAV they take on. And that’s just for the 2019 season. If the organization continues to exceed the luxury line, it’ll keep getting hit with bills — every one of which will be impacted by Sale’s AAV.
It’s not hard to see how adding a season or even two at a relatively lesser salary might begin to make sense, particularly when one includes the concept of the time-value of money. Here are a few scenarios to kick around (all dollars in millions):
Extension Years | Extension Money | Extension AAV | Cumulative AAV | 2019 Tax Increase |
5 | $150 | $30.00 | $27.50 | $7.83 |
5 | $175 | $35.00 | $31.67 | $10.96 |
6 | $160 | $26.67 | $25.00 | $5.96 |
6 | $180 | $30.00 | $27.86 | $8.10 |
6 | $192 | $32.00 | $29.57 | $9.39 |
6 | $207 | $34.42 | $31.64 | $10.94 |
7 | $175 | $25.00 | $23.75 | $5.02 |
7 | $200 | $28.57 | $26.88 | $7.37 |
7 | $217 | $31.00 | $29.00 | $8.96 |
These are, of course, largely random price points (some of which connect to contract comps noted above, others of which are simply round numbers). But they serve to show how much cash the Red Sox could in theory be forced to take on right now if they really want to avoid paying Sale past his mid-30s. That hit, as noted already, would potentially be repeated in future seasons in which the club nears or passes the luxury line. Those considerations may well factor into the organization’s approach, whatever level of health-related discount is deemed necessary to make a contract appealing.
If a lengthier, more spread-out deal might make greater sense for the ballclub, what about Sale? As my colleague Steve Adams reminded me, the southpaw hinted recently that he could go looking to set new high-water marks of some kind. As Sale put it: “You want to do right by the guys who are coming next year, two years, 10 years down the road because you kind of set the bar and the next guy who comes along either gets to that bar or sets it a little more.”
If he intends to raise the bar in an extension scenario, one full season removed from the open market, there’s no realistic way he’s going to top the line set by Price. Breaking the overall guarantee record (seven years, $217MM) would almost certainly mean pitching in 2019 before negotiating his next contract. On the other hand, Sale could take aim at Greinke’s AAV mark. In that case, though, it’s awfully tough to see the Red Sox making a commitment past five additional seasons (if they’re willing to make such a deal in the first place).
Perhaps Sale’s bar-raising sentiments shouldn’t be taken too literally. He no doubt appreciates that an extension situation necessarily involves other considerations (and lacks competitive bidding). A hurler of his age reaching the $200MM mark in new money, say, would represent a notable achievement even if it came with a relatively less-impressive AAV and didn’t really set any recognizable records. In terms of maximizing his own career earnings (without taking the risk of first pitching another season), there’s not a whole lot of downside to going for the biggest total guarantee possible at this stage, even if it effectively means taking a cheaper valuation for the last season or two of the new contract. Even if Sale were to hit the open market on the upswing in his later years — as may well occur next winter for Verlander — the additional earning ceiling at that point would be fairly limited, at least in terms of contract length.
If there’s a deal to be made here, then, the sweet spot could actually be on a longer term than might be anticipated at first glance. As the foregoing discussion shows, though, there’s also quite a lot for both sides to think about — and quite a lot we don’t know. The major wild card, perhaps, is the sides’ respective levels of concern with Sale’s shoulder. It’ll be fascinating to see how things proceed if Sale and the Red Sox end up making a concerted effort over the coming weeks to work out a deal.
Photo courtesy of USA Today Sports Images.
xabial
200-300M, hopefully the latter.
He has to break the guarantee record (7 years, $217M)
But it’s Chris Sale.
User 4245925809
Realize ur a troll.. Possibly pay attention to what a player says with regards to a topic before blabbering in a topic sometimes?
Sale has stated numerous times he wants to remain in Boston and is workable to some type of discount. How much that is is up for grabs, but i doubt 300m, as u wrote is a discount.
Please.. Please find some fantasy board to post on and leave this one for good.
clepto
excellent comment sir!
xabial
Cross-IP (banned) 3rdStrikelooking w/ clepto.
The irony, you always criticize my writing style yet can’t change yours, clepto.
petfoodfella
Eh, just bc you don’t like him, doesn’t mean he needs to leave. He’s actually decent on baseball talk.
It’s you trolls who have such a sissy hissy fit over what he posts and continue to make a spectacle about it.
Move on and act like an adult. Talk baseball, not insults.
TheSilentService
If you actually listen to what Chris Sale has said, he’s talked about setting up the next group of players. And how I interpret that, is he will not be taking a “home team” discount.
It’s gonna take some serious money to sign Sale, and with Henry coming out and saying they seriously messed up the Lester negotiations, and also talk about Sale, I think they will resign him for 5 years at 33 mil AAV, with some vesting options to take it out to 7 years.
User 4245925809
He’s talked about not setting new records is how i interpreted it and yes.. I also figured on a little less than Price and around 30-32m over 5-6 seasons, but considering he’s 1 of the best in the business? I consider that a discount. Wouldn’t you?
Have a feeling Boston will also if/when they can ink him to a deal at the Price AAV, or close to it.
deweybelongsinthehall
Even at that money the Sox would be smart to see how he pitches in the fall. His second half history leaves a lot of questions and their priority has to be Betts. My guess is they may try to coincide a dual opt out with the new CBA so both sides can reassess. With Price still on the books, they have to be careful. Three players eating up $100m per {Betts. Price and Sale) is a lot of risk for 2021. Add in hefty contracts for Bettinendi and Boegarts and you question whether ownership was being honest or gaming the situation when they say they can’t keep everyone. Yankees and other big market clubs will face similar issues leaving the door open for the Padres and other small market clubs to swoop in unless the luxury tax set up changes on the next CBA.
Horace Fury
If Sale pitches well in the first half, trade him at the deadline. Get a couple of good young arms from a NL contender (like ATL) who thinks Sale might carry them farther. Then forget about him. I read so much wishing and hoping that the Sox could hold on to all the players verging on FA this year and next–can’t be done! Stiffen your spines, boys. Holt is the likeliest retainee.
rocky7
Its always about the money.
Youve got some fantasy as usual about the Boston sports athlete taking discounts to desparately stay in a Red Sox uniform.
deweybelongsinthehall
Rocky7, Sale himself has sent mixed signals. He can be as good a number 1 as there is but would the Sox in 2020 be better off with Eovaldi AND Kelly or simply Sale? Just an example teams have to decide on. Not only annual salary but also the contracted years. Perhaps dual options $25M x 7 years with $10m buyout options each of the last three years. Meaning if Boston opts out after year 4 it was worth $110m total but if he opts out, $90m. Yes the player pays to opt out! With his stamina and/or injury history, he’s simply not a $30m per year player to me.
bostonbob
JohnSilver agreed but, as he recently stated he wanted to do right for the upcoming players as his predecessors did for him. Although, I do worry about his shoulder issues.
Fever Pitch Guy
Bottom line, Sale has yet to show he can pitch an entire season without experiencing a significant decline toward the end. His super-thin build is a concern, as is his delivery. I am fairly certain his All-Star Game performance was a factor in his injury. He threw harder in that game than he had in what, 8 years? And his issues began shortly after the all-star break. It seems like the exact same thing that happened to Pedro when he pitched in the ’99 All-Star game.
My thing is if they are going to continue to baby him with 5-6 inning outings and 5-6 missed starts a year, then he isn’t worthy of a record-setting contract. If I had to choose between re-signing Sale, or re-signing Mookie and Xander …. I’d keep Mookie and Xander. I honestly don’t see how they can sign all three to big longterm deals.
User 4245925809
Sale has touched 99-100 a few times in the early summer the last couple of seasons. It wasn’t just the AS game.
Believe the Sox FO wants him to dial it back some in general with the belief he doesn’t need to throw 96+ regardless and I’m in that crowd also. His slider. The FB is good enough at 93-95mph.
xabial
Don’t respond to that comment John
Fever Pitch Guy was responding to my post
See how that works, john?
Excellent comment btw FeverPitch, imo top-3 unbiased non-bandwagon Bosox fan here imo
Begamin
+xabial
You are officially out of consideration for MLBTR comeback player of the year. You got like a -10 WAR for 2019 and its still only February. Your MPH on your fastball is still declining too…
In all seriousness, john can reply to who he likes since Fever Pitch Guy posted a public comment. Its not an exclusive interaction between you and him just because he replied to you. Besides, at least john actually talked baseball.
xabial
Obviously he can, it’s a free country.
I thought was hypocritical of John to tell me never to to post again, then respond to reply made to me. Begamin lol
I’ll try to win MVP of mlbtr, long way to go!
xXabial
Great post Beg….X where’s your twin mate? bball1600…oh you gotta log in first
Fever Pitch Guy
I just looked it up again. Sale threw 100.7 MPH in the All-Star Game, the fastest pitch he’s thrown since 2010. I just don’t think it’s a coincidence that he began having issues immediately after that game. It was the exact same injury Pedro had after he overthrew in the ’99 All-Star Game.
deweybelongsinthehall
He should be paid if he has an ASG bonus clause but a sale should NEVER again pitch in it. He’s better off resting those days each season.
Bernie's Dander
You have it right, Fever Pitch. The money committed to Price makes it VERY difficult to keep more than one of Sale, Xander and Betts. I’m not sure paying $60m+/year to Price and Sale does much for them anyway. Sale is amazing. He’s a future HOF. But I don’t think he has 5 elite years left. We’ve seen the best of him. I don’t expect him to fall off a cliff in terms of performance, but I do expect him to make fewer starts and pitch fewer innings. For that reason, I don’t see a good reason to pay $30m+ for him. If they can trade Price somehow, it would make more sense.
deweybelongsinthehall
SorryvBernie but to me the current Sale is great but unless he figures out how to pitch successfully after July, he’s not a HOF pitcher in my view. If he makes it, it will be because of Sabermetrics and the voters misuse of modern statistical tools.
Bernie's Dander
Dewey, they DEFINITELY need to figure out how to keep Sale healthy in the 2nd half, but I think he’s basically already in the HOF as “best of his era”(along with Verlander, Scherzer & Kershaw). In Sale’s first 7 full seasons as a starter, he’s finished top-6 in Cy Young voting every single time. He’s also led the league in just about every important category along the way.
camdenyards46
A pitcher is not getting 300 million anytime soon
fmj
no more than 5 years
pasha2k
I am so worried the RedSox will do what they did to Lester n let Sale leave. They need to sign him n solidify the pitchers, including Porcello, who was n is, a valuable starter. My BIG worry is they don’t sign Sale. They need to do right by the guy, he deserves it!!!!! PAY HIM!!!!
ffrhb14Sox
Im worried they will sign Sale and miss out on Betts or Benintendi or Bogaerts or even Bradley or Devers. Already have a ton invested in the rotation for Price, Eovaldi and ERod will get bigger arb cash. Another monster contract for SP makes retaining the offense less likely. LetSale walk.
User 4245925809
Can use some logic on that one. 4y and Price/Eovaldi off the books. 4y before Benni a FA and 5 before Devers, if he continues to show improvement and I’m not in the camp of signing JBJ anyway for anything beyond what he’s making (8-10m) or much more, so he’s a pass.
That leaves the big guys the FO has to worry about right away as Sale/betts and Bogaerts. Myself? Thinking boras has already overpriced bogaerts as it is and he’s going to hit the market without an overpay before next winter and Mookie it seems wants to go 1y at a time.
If there is going to be any extension amongst that trio for market to less? It’s going to be with Sale this year, not that wouldn’t like seeing a deal done with Mookie right away.
I see Bogaerts holding out and it not entirely him, but Boras looking for more dollars. There was an article read earlier yesterday… Masslive.. Globe.. Forget which mentioned 7/185m. Man was that idea scary.
Bernie's Dander
If Bogaerts puts up a monster season he might be more deserving of that 7/185 level. But, as of now, that is simply ridiculous. I think he’s as good as gone, regardless. The Six don’t tend to play well with Boras.
ffrhb14Sox
Fair enough but those guys start earning arb money which these days goes up quickly. With Sale getting a monster number and Betts a monster number you’ll have to save in other places. That would limit any chance to try to extend those guys before free agency. I think JBJ wont get overwhelming offers and is worth keeping at about what he gets now. Id even take Porcello back at around $20M if you want to keep most of the rotation for the next 3 years. Bogaerts could become too expensive but Boras price hasnt hit lately so he may have to come down and be worth keeping. I just think a Sale contract becomes a hinderance (like Prices) we don’t need for a guy getting older that already is just exceptional for 2/3 to 3/4 of a season.
gomerhodge71
Lester wanted out. Who listens to one offer, has a hissy fit and refuses to negotiate after that, then sells his house in the area? I firmly believe Theo had talked with Lester the previous spring, encouraging him to play it out and take the Cubs’ offer. That whole episode just reeked of collusion. And Lester never once indicated he wanted to remain in Boston.
Bernie's Dander
No, Gomer. They lowballed Lester so badly that it was ridiculous. They weren’t even competitive with what they offered. They severely undervalued him and blew it. Then they were forced to overpay Price to offset the Lester loss. It’s just one of many reasons why Cherington was terrible.
deweybelongsinthehall
The mistake the Sox made in my view was they completely misread the market and Master’s value. They expected he’d come back to them at whatever top price they wanted to pay. It cost them big time with the huge back end of the Price contract looming. Price was great in 2018 but if not for His contract, the team would be in better position to keep those they wanted to keep. Don’t discount what JDM did last year. He in my view was the team MVP the way he changed the club both in the batting order and off the field. I’m dreaming but hope they find a way to keep him in Boston.
KF
Anytime you add “too” between two commas it’s always unnecessary. In every piece you write.
Jeff Todd
It’s probably not the most elegant thing to do, but this isn’t high art and I don’t have an editor. In particular, upon reflection, I wish I hadn’t done it twice in such a similar manner. When I changed the second instance, though, I felt compelled to add the word “also” later in the sentence, so I’m not sure I can agree that “, too,” is without function.
Chicks Dig the Longball
He is right though.
Jeff Todd
So it’s simply unacceptable to utilize “too” in this manner? Why, exactly?
What if I had written: “Interestingly, also, …”? Or “Also, interestingly, …”? Same beef? Is this about overusing commas? Substituting “too” for “also”? General word vomit?
I am always open to changing my writing style (such as it is), but I would like to understand the basis for this apparent rule.
Chicks Dig the Longball
Any time you can take out a word and the sentence would still make sense, you should. A good article says the most information in the least amount of words. Excess words that serve no purpose defeat that idea.
Also, I’ll add that I don’t care about your writing. I skim read these articles for the important info. Still just wanted to point out that KF is correct.
Jeff Todd
Agree, generally, that it’s preferable to be concise. We are also talking about literally one word in a 2k+ word post. I have no doubt I could have and should have trimmed quite a bit. In a different setting — if I wrote just one or two posts a day, or was writing a book — I’m sure I’d have done just that.
But I don’t think that’s what this is really about. I took this to be a grammatical or stylistic rule of sorts. No?
dan-9
I second this completely. Not to pick on Jeff, who isn’t alone in this among the writers here, but the overuse of pointless adverbs weakens the writing on this site. For instance, why say “interestingly” at all? What could that possibly add to the strength of the writing? Isn’t it up to the reader to determine which part of a story is interesting or not? If a piece of information were decidedly uninteresting, why would you bother mentioning it at all?
Not trying to be a jerk or petty, because I do enjoy this site and the service it provides, but it could really use an editor. Right now it feels like the writers here are unsure whether to go for straight newspaper-style factual reporting or more assertive Fangraphs-like analysis. And the end result is a weird, ineffectual mishmash of both, as though we’re getting the most timid analysis of all time, loaded with useless weasel words like “certainly”, “of course”, or the aforementioned “interestingly”.
And I realize this rant makes me a crazy person and nobody else in the world is as bothered by it as I am, so take this with as big a grain of salt as you would like.
LADreamin
Are you gonna pay the editor’s salary? No? Kindly have a seat then and enjoy the writing as it comes. Or don’t, no one cares. But asking Tim to employ another person because the writing style just doesn’t quite do it for you is pretentious at best, fiscally irresponsible at worst.
Jeff Todd
Well, this post was obviously on the analytical side. A typical news post is quite different. I’m not sure if the mishmash you perceive is within individual posts or on the site as a whole — ?
Regardless, I don’t believe the analysis I offered here is any different in terms of timidity from what you’d see at Fangraphs. I have little doubt I’m on the conservative side, but I don’t recall reading much at FG that stakes bold, clear claims that particular players ARE WORTH x y or z. To their credit, IMO.
Jeff Todd
More broadly, to those who are attentive consumers not just of the substance, but also the style of the words here and elsewhere …
I imagine most of you write a fair bit in your own work or scholarly pursuits. I would guess that you understand what it feels like to conceive of and write a draft of something and then to hone it into a piece you are proud of, in substance and style, through some kind of editorial process (whether or not a formal one).
Now imagine, instead, that you are pumping out written work in real-time, while editing and publishing that and other work, and reviewing other stories and keeping an eye on the news wire. (Also your kids are probably screaming in the background. At least mine are.) The product of that process will necessarily be different than that of another, even slightly more refined process.
And that’s okay. Different functions.
All that being said, I can do better. I focus first on ensuring that I’m conveying the information in a clear and accurate manner, even if it makes for stilted writing. But that’s not to say I can’t tighten things up and do a better job stylistically.
KCJ
Jeff, please don’t concern yourself with the opinion of the grammar police. You do a fantastic job and I am thrilled to be able to read your articles FOR FREE. It’s apparent that some of these people just have way too much time on their hands and/or feel the need correct others on minor, insignificant things in order to make themselves feel intellectually superior. They must be a lot of fun to live with! I’m really curious as to how they would respond to having someone looking over their shoulder and criticizing every little mistake that they make. I appreciate what you do, Jeff!
KCJ
@Chicks dig the long ball….
Chicks DO NOT dig the grammar police
Fever Pitch Guy
Jeff I think it is a very good article. Most of us understand sports writing is not about perfect punctuation. Keep up the good work.
Jeff Todd
Glad you enjoyed it, thanks.
Truly, I do not mind having my writing questioned. My above comments were intended sincerely. I would like to know more about the issue they have raised.
Connorsoxfan
I’m part of the skimming for important info crowd, I didn’t even notice that as I read it, and I couldn’t tell you why or if it’s wrong. I appreciate that you take the team to hear people out and look for ways to improve your writing though.
Mendoza Line 215
I think that the writing is fine.
I do not think that some commenters realize that you guys are on a time crunch and want to get these articles written ASAP.Self editing is probably minimized as a result
When that is deemed so important written perfection is most rare.
These articles are entertaining and that is the most important reason for reading them on this site.
Please keep up the good work.
xabial
You, Toddfather are the pride of MLBTR.
I’ve had the pleasure of reading your work throughout the years. “Too” that!
JustOnePitch
@Jeff. I’m not an English expert, but I’ll offer what might be the problem. When writing “Importantly, too, he …” the too is modifying importantly, not the verb. Therefore, a coma is not needed after importantly. It would also be proper to use important the adjective, rather than importantly the adverb. “Important too, is that he…” would be the proper way to use too. You could also write, “Importantly, he…too.” This is how you would modify the verb. If there’s an English expert out there, I would like to know if this is correct. Thanks
Jeff Todd
I don’t know.
This discusses the concept of “sentence adverbs,” which I think covers the usage in this post. theeditorsblog.net/2016/02/21/a-tale-of-adverbs-an…
I believe the commas surrounding “too” are mostly a style choice. Perhaps I made the wrong one — to create a pause, at the cost of more punctuation — but I don’t see why it was incorrect, strictly speaking.
Also relevant (Relevant, too, ???) is that there are subtle differences in meaning. “Important too …” implies something like “hey this secondary thing is also important.” My construction suggests somewhat that the point being made is important standing on its own, or above and beyond whatever was said before.
I don’t know, I mostly write by feel and try to make sure I convey information accurately!
Joe Kerr
I, for one, do not, under any circumstances, see a problem, with adding in a few extra commas.
,,, then again I sucked at English, much better in math
JustOnePitch
@ Jeff. You got me! I think both pauses seem fine in your “relevant” sentence. Maybe the sentence that caused all the hoopla was awkward, because it used importantly instead of important. I’m not even sure I needed a comma before because, in my last sentence, or after either because, in this sentence?? After reading through the link, I don’t think there’s any rule against using both commas. I would like to know if there’s a technically correct sentence structure too!
Ejemp2006
Jeff Todd, you have the English for greatness! Love your baseball writing stylings too, a lot, so don’t worry.
petfoodfella
Get out of here with this crap. This isn’t Honors English. Talk baseball, not no damn commas and too’s
Joe Kerr
Amen
JustOnePitch
@ KF. You’re aware that your second sentence doesn’t make much sense, right? I’m here for thoughts on baseball, not writing critiques. If you’re going to point your grammar finger, please start with pointing it at yourself and please do it on a different website!
KCJ
KF –
You know what else is “always unnecessary”? Grammar police on a baseball website.
The Ranger Fan
Sale and cole are free at years end, Would love to see either join the Rangers next season and lead the team as our ace.
holecamels35
Nice photo of Sale there. I feel like he’s missing a cig in his mouth and a leather jacket.
bkwalker510
it definitely is ripe for one of those memes
Aaron Sapoznik
All that would look even better with a cut up White Sox throwback uni over his shoulder.
slider32
Sale could be a big risk moving forward!
Aaron Sapoznik
As Bob Dylan wrote back in 1963, “The Times They Are A-Changin”.
Nonetheless, good luck to Chris Sale in his extension talks or future free agency.
pinkerton
Do not give this man a throwback jersey
LADreamin
Whoever does, make sure you hide the scissors!
aj_54
Y’all got any more of them pixels
Priggs89
He deserves more than Greinke, but who knows with the market the way it is right now. I’d be very surprised if he got less than Strasburg. Best pitcher in baseball IMO.
coldbeer
4 years, $150 million with 2 vesting options at $30m and then 25m (age 36 year). That’s my guess!!!
Swinging Friars
How many prospects will it take Boston? My madman Preller is always interested if you guys aren’t!
Buddy “Bud” Hull
Hey Jeff, the thumbnail for this article on the main page has a fantastic choice of Chris Sale picture next to it. I have nothing more to add aside from that besides keep up the good work.
TheStevilEmpire2
Excellent article, Mr. Todd.
I think if the Red Sox are going to extend Sale, perhaps they should offer a contract that is a bit front loaded. My reasoning for this is that I believe it would help when They need the financial flexibility to re-sign Betts and the rest of the young core. I would think Sale would be open to this idea. He could still set the record for AAV early in the deal and help with long term flexibility in the future. I’m a Cardinal fan and I have a lot of respect for Sale, he’s probably my favorite pitcher not in a Cardinal uniform
saintchristafa
Loving this mister Krabs meme graphic
jorge78
It’s funny how they talk about setting the bar for future generations (it’s all about the children!) to justify their own greed. You want top dollar, just admit it: you want it for your own self…..
bobtillman
Excellent article. It’s all opinion so far, and Henry and company care less about costs than a lot of ownership groups. But they’ve shown a trend more toward protecting the offense than run prevention, and I think their sheckles go to Boegarts/Betts rather than to Sale.
Or maybe there’s enough fannies in the seats, and enough fans watching NESN and eating Fenway Franks, that they really are less concerned than you might think.
Fever Pitch Guy
If Price had opted out, Sale would have definitely been re-signed. However now I think Xander and Mookie are more of a priority because of their positions and young age. The Sox already have a solid threesome of Price-ERod-Evo, if Sale walks they wouldn’t have as hard a time finding a quality starting pitcher as they would a solid fielding great hitting shortstop or outfielder. There’s always plenty of starting pitchers available each year.
Intothemystic90
I’m sorry, but finding a top 5 pitcher like Sale is definitely NOT an easy thing to do. Sale is definitely harder to replace than Xander, in terms of replacing both with an equal level of talent, since Sale’s talent is much rarer than Xander’s. I also reject the notion that an aging Price/Erod (never even qualified for the ERA title) and Eovaldi (only one 200 inning season and limited effectiveness in said season) is a solid rotation. If Sale and Porcello walk and aren’t replaced with adequate talent replacements, their rotation goes from one of the best to below average.
reflect
Disappointed you didn’t call this “Making a Chris Sale”
Or maybe “a Chris Sale Sale”
Z-A 2
5 years w 6th yr option and 10M buyout at 27M base, with escalator incentives that max it out at 30-32M. Max contract value 170M min value 145M.
TheStevilEmpire2
I think that might be wishful thinking. David Price got over 30 MM AAV 3 years ago at the same age as Chris Sale is now. As impressive as David Price’s career has been, Sale’s career has been even better. Grienke is making 34 MM and Scherzer is going to make 42MM this season. I would say anything lower than 35 AAV would be undercutting himself.
JoeBrady
Price was a FA, not someone with one year left. And Price was one year younger on his first RS pitch than Sale will be on his. And Price was healthier than at the signing date.
IRT to Scherzer, you can’t cherry pick one year’s salary out of a 7-year contract. He got paid $210M/7, same as Price. And again, healthier.
having said that, as a RS fan, I am glad we extended him. But even with a healthy year, as a 32 year-old pitcher, I doubt he’d do much better next year.
bradthebluefish
Offer 5 years, $140MM and see what he says. Sale might take it consider his team-friendly signings in the past.
Guest617
im mostly here for the comment section. and will also agree mlb articles here tend to be long winded, erring on the side of annoyance.
SFGiantsGallore
Well what about Betts? Are there any concerns with his potential extension or new contract and the luxury tax threshold?
FrostyPucker
I keep getting this vibe from Betts that he either doesn’t want to be in Boston when free agency hits, or will go to the highest bidder. Wait… he’s a Boras client isn’t he?
Fever Pitch Guy
The Legacy Agency is Mookie’s agent.. And Mookie has already clashed twice with Sox management on contracts. In 2017 he wanted more than the $950K the Sox offered him, but he was still pre-arbitration so he was forced to accept the offer. In 2018 he took them to arbitration, which is never a good thing, and he won. So I think he wants to stay in Boston, be he ain’t gonna give no hometown discount.
Gene325
And why should Mookie give a hometown discount? The reality of the game is that business comes first, as it ought to. After all, this will be Mookie’s only window of opportunity to enter free agency at the peak of his ability, while still in in his late 20s. If he doesn’t cash in at that point it would be highly irresponsible on his part. That said, I naturally hope he and team management are able to structure something that will keep him in Boston.
JoeBrady
There are a couple of reason for a hometown discount.
1-Comfort-He’ll be worth ~ $400M. Would you move someplace just to increase your net worth by 5%? I wouldn’t.
2-Great environment. Same reason why some guys sign with NY, or refuse to sign with NY. I have no issue with money, but if I were Jason Bay, for example, do you want to spend the rest of your career at Shea Stadium? Teams like the RS and Yankees are always in the mix.
3-Path to the HOF. There is a marked advantage to playing in Fenway. And 15 years with one team looks better on your resume.
BryceMantle
I’m getting season tickets for 2010 if the Yankees sign Bryce and then Sale next offseason if Boston doesn’t destroy him like they did Kimbrel.
MafiaBass
Could they add an option year at $20 that increases to $35 if they do not reach an extension before 1/1/20?