In a lengthy piece for The Athletic, Evan Drellich profiles Bruce Meyer, who is the MLBPA’s senior director of collective bargaining and legal. Meyer was hired in 2018, after many players were reportedly dissatisfied with the current Collective Bargaining Agreement, which was ratified in 2016. The piece notes that Meyer will meet with league representative Dan Halem near Dallas this week for some final negotiations before the CBA expires at 11:59 ET on December 1, which is this Wednesday. It’s been widely reported that, without a deal at that time, the league is expected to implement a lockout and transaction freeze, to be maintained until a new deal is reached.
As to exactly what points will be negotiated, both sides are understandably being cagey about revealing their positions, though the piece does have a few hints. “We want to find ways to get players compensated at an earlier stage of their careers when the teams are valuing them the most,” Meyer says. “And we want to preserve the fundamental principles of a market system.” This sentiment was echoed by star free agent and Players Association executive subcommittee member Max Scherzer, who was quoted in the article. “Unless this CBA completely addresses the competition (issues) and younger players getting paid, that’s the only way I’m going to put my name on it,” Scherzer said.
There is indeed a tremendous gap between the salaries of younger players and veterans. Until players reaches three years’ service time, they have no ability to negotiate their salary, with their clubs allowed to pay them around the league minimum, which is currently under $600K. After three years, a player can start earning raises through the arbitration system, but is still usually paid well below what they could garner on the open market. (Some players will reach Super Two status each year, reaching arbitration early.) Only after accruing six years’ service time does a player earn the right for free agency and the ability to maximize their earning potential. If the players want that system to change, it could come in many forms, such as a higher minimum salary or a reduction in the amount of service time needed for either arbitration or free agency.
However, there does seem to be some awareness that the players won’t be able to get everything that they want this winter. Free agent righty Collin McHugh, who previously served on the subcommittee, framed it thusly. “We’re not gonna change the game completely for players in one CBA,” McHugh said. But that shouldn’t be taken as a sign that the players will just roll over in negotiations. When asked about the possibility of a lockout, Meyer had this to say. “I think players understand why it’s a possibility and the reasons for it, and what it will entail. At the end of the day, it’s about what players are willing to fight and sacrifice for. I think players understand that.” Lefty Andrew Miller, another member of the subcommittee, also chimed in about the potential lockout. “If we’re truly serious about making changes, improving the game and improving the position of players, it’s an unfortunate reality of the system. But we are absolutely prepared for it.”
One thing hanging over these negotiations, beyond the usual tensions between athletes and owners, is the lingering resentment over the pandemic-shortened 2020 season. Commissioner Rob Manfred doesn’t seem to think it’s a big deal, based on his comments in the article. “I’ve been in charge of labor in this industry since 1998,” Manfred said. “Every single time, I have found a way, we have found a way, to make an agreement and keep the game on the field. One sort of mid-term negotiation in the middle of a crisis of a pandemic — I just don’t put that much weight on it.” The players, however, may not see it quite the same way. “Rob and the commissioner’s office kind of held the season hostage for a minute when everybody was ready to play,” says McHugh. The union filed a grievance over this 2020 season back in May, and it seems the bitterness over that might still carry on into this winter.
Hope they don’t strike. Will be really bad for the game
There will probably be a lockout, not a strike.
Worse than a lockout? Only reason that there would be a strike is if the owners renege on negotiations. Can’t be a strike until there is a season.
The players should get what they want. The owners got Billions of dollars other TV contracts and now it’s time that they should give up some of it to the players
But will the fans get anything out of all this bickering?
The best younger players on the field more earlier in their careers.
Not practical for every player on a team to be paid the outrageous salaries. It would cause small market teams to fold.
I think we found Rob Manfred’s account.
Every team in baseball had over $250 million in revenue in 2021. That revenue will go up in 2022 and beyond. Until every team has a payroll over $125 million and the average is over $200 million then salaries can continue to go up and the teams still make a profit.
What a ridiculous way to think about this. Keep paying players more and more and more money. Heck pay them 50m a year. 100m a year. “They deserve their share” – NO, the owners deserve to make as much profit as they can like ANY business does. Their risk, their reward. Ya their already billionaires but that’s why they own the teams.
I think we found Max Sherzer’s account
why do the owners “deserve” to keep making more money and not the players? u know the ones that have to work out all year be in the media spotlight and perform for 162games. while some owners are only owners cuz daddy owned the tea.
Because they own the business not the players. Cry me a river for any player who can’t “get by” on millions and millions per year.
Oh please. There is no risk in owning an MLB franchise. Not only would MLB never allow a team to fold because of the impact it would have on the league overall, but the demand for major pro sports franchises outstrips supply to an extreme level. As soon as an owner feels they aren’t profiting enough there are always buyers lined up ready to write checks for billions. It’s not a normal business at all.
Okay what’s your point? Owners don’t deserve to make a profit? Players of a game who already are paid excessive salaries should make even more money instead of the owner making a larger profit?
Your mentality only drives the prices of tickets, merchandise and food etc higher and higher making it unaffordable for fans. Congratulations.
Lol what risk?
The owners are the ones that took on the risk of buying and owning a team. The players are more than welcome to go start their own teams or league. Look at it this way. Let’s say there was an owner of a pencil company. Who’s going to make more money? The owner who took on the risk of buying/starting and running a company? Or the one making the pencil, who is easily replaceable?
So which is it America? So many people complain about workers wanting 15$/hr despite the corporation and CEO are raking in hundreds of millions. Yet we feel sorry for players making 2 or 3 million that want 5. So baseball makes a ton of revenue. It shouldn’t have to share every dollar. I thought you guys hated communism. The owners make the investment and take the biggest risks. They should pull in the majority of profits. I understand the owner is rich and chances are he isn’t going to buy all the players you want him to. But this share all the revenue is BS.
Yes, indeed it is exactly like your pencil company comparison, except literally the complete opposite. MLB’s appeal is based on the fact that it has the best baseball players alive playing in it. Without the players the product is not at all the same. They are anything but easily replaceable. Meanwhile, the owners are completely replaceable. Major pro sports franchises are not normal investments, they are trophy acquisitions for which the demand greatly outstrips the supply. Any owner who wants to sell immediately has others lining up for the right to write a check for billions.
Quit applying basic concepts of economics 101 to this. There is NO risk if you buy into a monopoly that pretty much eliminates all competition and guarantees you millions in profits.
It just is NOT the same and MLB baseball would never EVER be used to explain free-market “risk’ and the ‘entrepreneurial spirit’ to a group of Econ 101 students. The concept is simply NOT relevant to this issue.
Jmac70, so if you owned a business & each team is a business, your employees should get paid more when you make money & lose income salary when the business loses money. And as it is now, a player almost always gets a raise each year. Each year can you add thousands more $ of salary. MLB Player get paid too much now. You could live well when the 1st player is @ $600k with a pension. And don’t tell me “their time to earn is short”, so save some. Too many players wearing gold & diamonds in a game. MLB gets paid the best of the major 4 US sports.
All professional sports teams should be owned by the city they are in. Screw owners of monopolies.
That’s a great idea, I would love to go to a game in SF and deal with needles and human waste in the stadium, let’s not forget defund security at the stadium.
You know revenue isn’t profit, right? There are a lot more expenses than payroll that you aren’t accounting for.
The value of the A’s has increased $1 billion since being purchased in 2005, yet they cry poverty to the fans to justify inadequate payrolls. Setting a payroll floor and removing some aspects of the indentured servitude the players are subjected to is not going to bankrupt the teams nor materially increase prices for fans.
Except MLB players are highly skilled and not easily replaced. Any able bodied human can make a pencil.
And profit is apart from increased equity when team goes up in value.
Owners must be kind of stupid and bad businessmen if they need artificial restraints on player salaries.
Vbcbpt — why do you think owners would lower ticket prices, etc., if player salaries were lowered?
Won’t they still charge a price making them the maximum amount of profit?
Oh great, let the government own it! lmao.
The qualifying offer this year is 18.4 million – for playing a game for ONE year. Give your head a shake. Salaries are out of control.
What are you talking about? The revenue for the game was $12.3 billion and it is going up. That is an average of $410 million per team. Until the average payroll is over $200 million then the players are not getting enough money.
I’m saying getting paid 18.4 million to play baseball for a year is a ton of money and nobody in their right mind should complain about it. The owners deserve to make a profit and players are way overpaid already. That’s what I’m talking about.
Doesn’t matter what the revenue is. QO is $18,400,000.00. Come on.
QOs are only given to great players and great players generate a lot of money for their teams. If I brought in $50 mil in revenues to a franchise I’d be pissed if I only got paid $18.4 million. Seems strange to believe owners should be rewarded the excess revenue because “$18.4 mil is a lot of money to play baseball.”
Ya it’s Capitalism at it’s best. Don’t like it move to Russia.
It’s not capital “C” Capitalism at all. The owners have rigged the system repeatedly in anti-competitive ways.
Except no one is going to shell out any money to watch you and me play. The players are not overpaid. They provide a service millions of people spend billions of dollars to see. They get that kind of salary so the billionaire owner can keep his asset worth billions.
Most businesses largest expense is their employees. Their wages, insurance, benefits etc. For normal businesses its not uncommon for the cost of employing people to eat up 75 to 80 percent of revenue. I doubt the players get more than half in baseball. They are not overpaid. People need to stop comparing it to what they do and what they make. You’re not good enough to get the QO. Most of the population of the world isn’t either. Yes you bust your ass to make enough to get by. Maybe you’re even someone fortunate enough, and frankly, frugal enough, to live comfortably. But you know what? There’s hundreds of thousands, perhaps even millions, of people that can do what you do. There are only 1200 MLB players at any given time.
-out in left field
Revenue is not profit. Revenue is gross! Other bills gotta be paid, lol.
Yet to see a “Going out of business” sign on any mlb ballpark so they must be doing ok.
Bryce1344, not true, look at Oakland, Tampa, Miami, Arizona. They live off of taxes paid by other teams. Oakland and Tampa can’t get a good field to play on and those team make the playoff.
We get it your mad u didn’t get to play in the MLB
Wrong. I wouldn’t want to. I just think its an unequal way of thinking that one type of business can make as much money as they can without scrutiny but another (MLB owner) should be limited.
Your rational sounds communist not capitalist.
It’s not up to you to decide if a player is overpaid or not. You don’t set value, the market does, and the market says they are not overpaid. I can sit here and say you’re overpaid for whatever you do, but it’s not up to me to decide that, it’s up to your employer.
Ryan. You right. You know who allow these babies to make so much. The fools that pay to go to games, but MLB TV packages. So fools cause the increases. I in s fla and even the Marlins, who always have an empty stadium cost too much for 1 game.
vbcbpt – You make so many erroneous points, but responding to all of them would take far too much time and energy. BQuickly:
Players are not overpaid. No one is forcing owners to sign them.
Owners absolutely do not want a capitalist game. Antitrust exemption, the draft, maximums on signing bonuses, six years before free agency – none of those are free- market setups.
Ah yes, let’s make this a capitalistic enterprise by mandating most of the league be paid near the minimum!
Really, you are trying to say the players are not overpaid? I would bet the majority of people would disagree with you. They are not just overpaid, they are GROSSLY overpaid. Put that in your pipe and smoke it buddy.
It’s a $10B+ industry, and while players’ salaries (generally) are increasing, they’re are getting less and less of the growing pie. The opinion of “the majority of people” doesn’t make it true that they’re overpaid.
Freezing wages is communist. Giving tax breaks and monopoly protections is it free market. The only ones under market regulations are players. Owners are two classes of large market spenders and small market cheap skates. MLB needs a hard cap and a minimum floor. Not unlike the NFL. That would’ve good for the fans. Not gonna happen though. Too many owners squeezing out profits like the creep in Pittsburg on the back of the fans and richer teams. MLB needs total free market driven overhaul. It’s a priveledge to own a team. In so many ways a public trust and it’s a priveledge to work in the game.
So are ticket prices. A weekend game for a family of four isn’t cheap!
You act like the players aren’t getting paid. There are things to address in regards to service time and payroll floors for competitiveness but neither side is hurting.
The owners of Wal-Mart and Staples have billions. So, by your philosophy, their cashiers should make $250,000 a year because “that’s what they want”? Entitlement is destroying the world.
No, a cashier shouldn’t make 250,000. They are a dime a dozen and Walmart can grab any idiot off the street to do the job. If MLB started grabbing guys off the street to play it would crumble. They need elite talent to support their business model. Walmart does not.
If I’m representing the MLBPA, I would demand that MLB either fully disclose the finances of the teams or both ownership profits and player salaries should be made fully confidential. Nobody but nobody can explain why player salaries are made public but team profits are kept secret, but we can sure see the affect. Many fans believe that ownership is being victimized by overcompensated players. I gotta wonder if they come to the ballpark to watch the owners own. It seems to be the part of the game they love most.
Muck Fob Ranfred
I would say muck Tony Clark. It’s on him that ol Fob took the MLBPA to the cleaners last CBA.
Why not both?
Not just Clark, but team reps elected because of popularity contests instead of those better suited for negotiations. How else would salad chef’s be in clubhouse’s over important items the players could have insisted upon in ’16? They have people who have no clue what they are doing. No wonder ownership directs control of negotiations.
Marvin Miller would be disgusted with the current MLBPA. I read the article in the Athletic and hopefully this new guy knows what he’s doing.
Marvin Miller was disgusted when Congress insisted Fehr allow very weak drug testing.
Who cares what Miller would have thought?
The Owners want a lock out at the LEAST intrusive time possible. The Players will strike at the MOST intrusive time possible.
Without a CBA in place, we should all hope for a lockout. Otherwise the season is in jeopardy.
Meyer is one of the best labor negotiators in the US. He knows what he is doing and that is why the MLBPA hired him.
@Halo, interesting take, but I think you’re right. We’re way better having a lockout now while the sides negotiate than a strike later. A lockout will just increase the pressure to get a new CBA worked out and hopefully no later than about February 1st or so
I agree there Halofan. Ownership has -0- reason to allow a season to start, then be the bad guy when union will inevitably make an announcement of being at an impasse in negotiations, saying other side refuses to bargain in good faith at the worst time possible (probably June-July) and it will look much worse towards the game itself.
I’m generally pro ownership (biz in general), but want to see bargaining in good faith, which is why want decent negotiators on both sides asking for realistic goals, as in not everything pro small market teams which we have been seeing last 2 CBA’s and union looking out for MiLB kids perhaps and their own pension system.
MLB should be looking out for its own interests, but the MLBPA should not be looking out for theirs. If this is your definition of good faith then maybe you can see why we have such a huge problem.
Bluesky… I’m thinking myself a large percentage of the owners are in favor of finding ways to increase the cap, or do away with it altogether, it’s a certain half dozen (maybe a few more) that are the problem in that regard.
Finding a way to significantly increase the cap should be (to me) the union’s chief priority and if I was one of around 2/3 of the owners? I’d be putting a lot of pressure on the Tampa/Oakland’s of the league to get on board or bring in a uhaul.
The top teams are for a cap. Hal Steinbrenner was on the committee that introduced the lowering of the luxury tax and he voted in favor of lowering. He just wants to keep as much as he can for himself and the cap gives him the excuse.
Dude drives me nukcing futs.
I hope they don’t strike also, but I also know it’s a two way street, if you want to get younger players money, then you need to also address all the multi year contracts that end up being over pay!
I agree and was thinking the same thing. If you start giving young players the ability to earn the outrageous contracts the “veteran” players are getting these days where will all the money come from to field a team – especially in smaller markets. It just doesn’t add up to anything practical.
If the veterans on the committee Eg. Sherzer are so determined for the young players to be able to earn tens of millions of dollars early on in their careers then the Sherzers of MLB should be ready/willing to reduce their often inflated and insane contracts.
There won’t be any sympathy from the public (ticket buyers) if players don’t come to an agreement. The average Joe cannot relate to the ridiculous money the players are already making and a strike that cancels games will be a disaster for MLB.
I’m sure I will be crucified for this comment but stand by it.
What industry pays out of most for starting players. Mlbpa want this. I say keep them hungry for earning and no more getting paid what they used to preform. They’re on a contract, so the indentured servitude analogy is Bs. No one is forcing them to sign with an mlb team or they will become serfs like the rest of the population.
Because players get screwed early in their careers, I couldn’t care less about how the owners get screwed with multi-year contracts.
There should be a luxury tax, There should be a floor. There should be a way for older players to get to free agency sooner. There should be a way to prevent service time manipulation.
No side is 100% right or wrong.
Dare I say it – there should be a CAP!!!
The players will not agree to a ceiling. Thus, no floor. What about all the bonus money that is now paid? It’s increased big time over the years and many times is not recouped. Same thing with the international and posted signings. Owners have risk but they need to truly show the union their books and then have a percentage based system like football. Can’t be exactly the same because there are no minor leagues in the NFL and that league already shares a lot of their revenues. it’s easier also because baseball is more regional. Perhaps look to the NBA as well for ideas.
Most multi-year contracts turn out well for the team. Over 50%. Even the ones that don’t end up that way, almost always are way in favor of the team early in the deal.
Right now the players are getting about 35% of revenue coming into the game. Without the current MLB players there is no game. No one is paying to see scabs. The TV contracts are not guaranteed if the MLBPA member players are not on the field. Everyone loses if the owners don’t start paying the players a fair share of the revenue. That means increasing salaries and paying players more money earlier in their careers.
Ridiculous. Players will not indefinitely strike. Most will be logical and realize being paid 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30 MILLION dollars a year to play a game is a LOT of money. Sure pay players more earlier in their careers and pay vets less. You can’t have your cake and eat it too.
No one will get “everything they want”. It’s a negotiation. I think it’s likely we will have a lock out.
players union should tell owners, you lock us out, we won’t negotiate
Should the Owners say to the players, if you strike, we will not negotiate?
That’s ridiculous, halofan. The owners make more than the top players do, easily, each and every season. We watch for the players, not the owners. More money should be in the hands of the actual performers than individuals who are already wealthy. We need more franchises like the Packers, ran by the people with a Board of Directors.
The Players will strike and ruin the season. The Owners lockout is the only way to preserve the season.
That’s just a fact. You are advocating for absurd seasons. Like 1981 and 1994.
Every clear thinking fan should prefer a lockout to a strike.
The players deserve to make a good living. $5-10M a year for example is an unbelievable amount of money – outrageous in itself. The owners, like owners of any Company, take the risks and pay the expenses and deserve to make as much money as they do PROVIDED players and staff are treated fairly and AGAIN millions of dollars a year is definitely being fair.
I don’t understand how it’s okay for a restaurant or a clothier business to be able to make as a big a profit as they can (while paying their staff considerably less proportionally than pro sports) but it’s unfathomable for a MLB owner to do the same.
Players crying over the millions and millions they make. Just read a few of the articles posted on this site on how much money players make in their careers – fringe players even making tens of millions of dollars over 10-20 year career. Give me a break, it’s out of control. I for one stand with the owners not the greedy players. $300 million dollars for 10 years etc. Bolgona.
That is not happening. In the NFL bylaws that is illegal. The Packers are an exception because they were grandfathered in. I also know that if you get that in any sport, you will get even more politics then ever before. You can expect to see Gender, racial and even sexual preference quotas on front offices. Do not believe me? We already know that California has bans on government employees traveling to certain states. No thank you.
So just because waiters and child slaves are treated worse by their bosses means that owners should let their minor leaguers starve and be forced to work multiple jobs to afford to eat?
There is no real difference. Both a Lock out and a Strike are work stoppages, and neither gets resolved without compromise. Being the side that initiated the stoppage may offer some leverage depending on the calendar (Lock out early to maximize stoppage length hitting players hardest in the wallet, strike late to threaten the high revenue playoffs where most of the TV money is made), but it doesn’t change the resolution process.
Players can’t strike until the season begins. There has to be negotiations before then.
Well under normal terms of collective bargaining, thats a violation of federal law and as such is terms to be brought before courts and the NLRB so Id not do that if I were them.
I am sure the Biden Administration is NOT going to go against California on that ( or most issues). By the way even the Trump Administration did not take on California on that issue.
That is not true. They can say if you lock us out we will not negotiate further. That is not against federal labor law.
owners are at fault for letting salaries get out of hand.
I am tired of the crocodile tears for the players. After his Diego performances for the Yankees Andrew Heaney getting $10m from the Dodgers is proof positive they are not exactly suffering.
do you cry for the owners? Asking for a friend.
cry for the ownrr3
Yeah, not like there’s other players out there not in Heaney’s situation, right?
Baseball is a monopoly of sorts. There are more and more billionaires who want to feed their ego by owning a professional sports team. So the value of franchises is skyrocketing and owners make more from increased equity value than merely net income. Teams are charging more and more to watch local sports in person and on cable tv. Players are also getting bigger salaries than in decades past. Thank goodness for mlb.tv where I can see most Cubs and Dodgers games except against local teams for just 100-150 a year. Yes younger players should make more money, but so too should school teachers, nurses and custodians. So this is a labor negotiation between the rich and the richy-rich and only the fans get screwed.
School teachers have tenure so even if they suck they cannot be fired ( that concept only applies in you guessed it professional sports where a Chris Davis can make millions for another decade despite not playing
Teachers don’t generate much revenue. MLB players on the other hand…
Not all school teachers get tenure. Many states don’t subscribe to that system
School teachers give students the tools to avoid welfare.
You never give me your money
You only give me your funny paper
And in the middle of negotiations
You break down
I never give you my number
I only give you my situation
And in the middle of investigation
I break down
Shake down
Break down
Your busted
Can Manfred be fired already the guy is an absolute joke. I think the league would be better served having a commissioner who wants the league to succeed it seems like he want to change stuff just because.
Manfred works for the owners. It’s his job to make sure the owners make money. Don’t think of him as some sort of neutral overlord, cuz he knows who signs his paycheck and certainly doesn’t think of himself that way.
I know it doesn’t work that way now. But the commissioner was supposed to be outside of the owners and players. He job was to serve the best interests of the game. So if that were the case now he would have forced the players and owners into an agreement already. Unfortunately since Faye Vincent was fired for wanting to move the Braves and Reds out of the National League West, the commissioner was Bud Selig one of the owners and now his pick to succeed him in Rob Manfred who doesn’t seem to care about the best interests of the game. Players and owners should collectively hire the commissioner then have to abide by his rules.
There should be a Czar of Baseball representing the institution itself, someone whose love for the game supersedes the economic interests of just the owners or just the players.
Much better to have a Faye Vincent than a Rob Manfraud.
The commissioner’s position has never worked that way. From the start he has could only be hired and fired by ownership, and the best interests of the game have always been defined as the best interests of team owners.
I always thought Jimmy Carter should have been commissioner of baseball. He would have been the best ever.
Congrats to the NFL and NBA on being the new active deans of labor peace, deservingly so for being leagues who actually put fans first
I do not agree. Why? The NFL barely averted a strike and the NBA with their politics have alienated a whole class of people.
It doesn’t matter if you agree. If there is a lockout, everything he said is true.
The NFL only succeeds in having labor peace because there is a culture in the sport (born of conservative politics) that screws the players and guarantees massive profits for the owners, and it’s gonna take a long time for the NFLPA to overcome it. Heck they haven’t even managed to guarantee contracts yet, and that in a sport where the average career is a few years. The NBA has solved their labor issues in the opposite way, by giving in entirely to the players and making it an entertaining vehicle but with absolutely no competitive parity, something between pro wrestling and a real sport.
MLB is neither of those things, and rightly so. So we have to endure these periodic ugly negotiating sessions. It will work out and will gradually work itself toward something fair. We’re not there yet (and the 2016 agreement was a setback).
You are absolutely correct ( especially about the NBA). I hear arguments against MLB teams and collusion ( and rightfully so), but players in the NBA do the same thing to create super teams like the Lakers and Warriors and not a peep is said by the media.same thing for tanking. I hear Scott Boras complaining about the Braves but the in the NFL and ( especially) the NBA the same thing happens ( and there it is more of a certainty because top draft picks are ready to step into the NFL and NBA but not MLB) but none of their teams were being criticized like the Braves were.
You must live in China if you think NBA puts the fans first. There’s a new viral video every week of players having fans ejected for hurting their feelings and don’t notice that a dozen teams are just used to circumvent the salary cap. Scherzer is fighting for younger guys to get paid meanwhile lebrons friends set up a system where 3 guys get max deals and 12guys get league minimum, good luck keeping that peaceful. Fans are not on the list of NBA priorities.
Exactly right. Lebron getting fans ejected from a game in Indiana is the latest example. Can you imagine Yankee fans getting ejected for booing in Fenway Park or vice versa? Neither can I and thank God for that.
Weren’t the nba locked on strike for over a year. Look up ticket prices pre and post strike in both leagues. $150 for a nosebleed seat after the negotiations in the NFL. Forget.that.
Hard for me to have sympathy for players. More money than they’ll ever need, first class travel, 5 star hotels, meals comp’d.
And, don’t forget, they did zero work to earn that money. They get randomly drafted into the league, some can play, some cannot. Don’t worry, you’ll get your call one day, you’ll show ’em how easy it is…
What’s your point? If working hard is the only barometer to justifying an athlete making 600k at minimum then I would like my 600k salary please. Thank you.
Fact is you CANNOT do what they do no matter how hard you work at it. There are about 1200 people in the world that can play at that level. If there are only 1200 in the world that can do your job and you are one of them, and your industry takes in $12+ billion per year in revenue, then you should be paid a whole lot more than $600k. In fact, with the average revenue in baseball being over $400 million per team, on a team of 26 men the average salary should be somewhere around $7.5 million per year to make it a 50/50 split of revenue between owners and players. Its $4.17 million now. That is a huge gap.
OK, let’s make this simple.
1200 men on the 40 man roster. 12,000,000,000 in revenue.
Give 50% of the revenue to players evenly. That’s 6,000,000,000. Split over 1200 guys each gets 2,500,000 per season.
MLBPA coverage taxes, insurance, pe signs, Healthcare, perks, meals, etc etc etc all out of their shares.
Because to split it fair that’s what scherzer and all the rest have to be willing to take. Does Max want to play for 2.5m?
I thought not. Equality seems great, until it doesn’t.
Well said.
Work as hard as you want. Fact is most people work really hard at things that don’t generate a fraction of the revenue that MLB players do. Why should they forfeit the excess over $600,000 just because you work hard?
You can make the same argument for the owners. There are only 2,700 billionaires on this planet. Revenue doesn’t equal profit. I’m not on the owners side, but some of these arguments make me scratch my head.
YOU pay for ballparks and infrastructure so billionaires can make more billions while players make about 35% of the revenue that does not exist without them being on the field.
You are sympathizing with billionaires instead of with the people that you actually want to watch play. Your sympathy is misplaced.
The last time you went to a movie that you really enjoyed did you then complain that the actors made too much money?
@BirdieMan is a jealous man.
I honestly feel that’s what a lot of this stuff comes down to. For either side.
MLBPA shouldn’t have made Tony Clark their rep, nor voted in favor an apparently unfair CBA.
who on here is going to cry crocodile tears for owners? Ill wait for the answers
I will feel more sympathy for someone who takes a chance and invests his or her money on an endeavor then I am for proven failures like Andrew Heaney.
Taxpayers build ballparks. Taxpayers pay for infrastructure that makes getting to that ballpark possible. TV and tickets pay for the salaries of everyone that working there. No team, regardless of its competitiveness or the market it plays in goes down in value. Because of guaranteed TV contracts not a single team lost money during COVID. They all had less profits, but not a single one was in the red as a business. So what chances do the owners take?
The PLAYERS take all the risks and they ARE the product you buy. You don’t pay to see Steinbrenner sit in the owners box and rake in billions. You pay to see the players.
The players take all the risk? Trevor Rosenthal signed a big money contract, never pitched an inning and will receive every penny of the money. He knew he wasn’t healthy when he signed that contract, but will never admit it.
Because buying into a basic monopoly with guaranteed profit is “taking a chance”. These owners are not some innovative entrepreneurs taking a “risk” on an innovative idea. These are billionaires buying another toy, some of them use that toy to line their own pockets (see Pirates owner) and some of them actually will pony up whatever they need to get the best players in baseball. Others bought a team because why not, they got so much scratch maybe they got bored buying their gold plated toilets and houses in 5 different states.
Whatever the reason any of them buy a team aside, NONE of these owners truly took a risk in buying a baseball team in this day and age. That’s a concept that is just silly in this context.
Lol these billionaires are mostly failures too and there is no risk in any of their ventures because of their lobbying and pay-to-play politics.
I don’t really know much about this. But what if new players go to arbitration after three seasons just once and go to free agency, after their fouth season? Or go to arbitration after two seasons twice (after second season and after their third) the same, go to free agency after their four season? Also, maybe raise the salary to 800k for rookies? IMHO.
Shortening the time before free agency is certainly one way to tackle the problem. But the issue there is it makes it brutally hard for small market teams — think the Rays and A’s — to be competitive. As soon as their young players become championship quality, they immediately have to let them go for money reasons. So you’d have to pair that kind of change with a huge increase in revenue sharing, so the small market guys can pay and retain their stars. But the big market teams hate that. In many ways the dispute is as much between big and small market teams as between teams and players.
Nailed it.
It would lead to more time in the minors to make sure players are more seasoned coming into mlb so no time is wasted
Why? Every team was over $250 million in revenue in 2021. Overall MLB averaged over $400 million per team in revenue. That will go up in 2022 and beyond. So explain why would it make it “brutally hard for small market teams.”
The Rays spent less than $100 million in salaries and won 100 games. The A’s spent $83 million to win 86 games. Both had lots of room to add salaries and still stay profitable.
Kind of helps when you get an additional high draft pick every year! Middle market teams are the ones without the biggest TV contracts or an extra pick.
Pro athletes: this 600k a year salary we are getting paid is ridiculous and we are being taken advantage of. Until we are paid fairly we will not sign off on a new CBA.
The average fan: all I’m asking is that you pay me an additional $1 an hour so that I can support my family.
Remind me again why we should feel bad for these players??
We shouldn’t feel bad for them. But we should support them in their attempt to gain a fair share of baseball profits, which now are flowing overwhelmingly to billionaire owners, whom we DEFINITELY should not feel bad for.
Pro sports are fundamentally different than the micro-economies we all participate in. MLB level players are a tiny group and the lack of supply of talent pushes prices up. The supply of plumbers and clerks and IT professionals is immeasurably higher, so prices are lower.
Are you one of only 1200 people in the world that can do your job or work in your industry? Is your industry making over $12 billion per year?
If so you deserve a raise.
People are quitting their jobs by the millions. If you have been to a restaurant lately you already know that. They are not willing to work for slave wages.
The players should have to work for less than half of the revenue that the league makes since there is no league without them. You won’t pay MLB prices to go see minor leaguers play and the TV networks won’t pay for televising those games.
Without the 1200 guys that are talented enough and have worked a lifetime to play at the level we call MLB, there is no game.
LOL Millions of dollars a year is what you call slave wages. Give your head a shake. 1 of 1200 people who can do the job lol. We shouldn’t have to mortgage the house to take the family to the ballpark – how about that notion.
Every time i read these type articles, I always think of Charles Finley. Make every player a free agent, every year.
Half the league would win 50 games a year and go bankrupt.
That would be terrible for the average, fringe and inexperienced Major Leaguers.
How dare a player have to make it on $600,000 a year. I hope they strike and no fans ever come back. I’m sick and tired of the greedy professional athlete. Kick rocks.
Players come and go. They are expendable. Owners own our favorite teams. They ARE our teams. I’m always rooting for my team and to me, that’s the owner. Especially as a fan of several small market teams.
The players are already getting paid more than enough. They should introduce max contracts for vets and increase the floor for younger players. I’m not a fan of messing with team control, but agree they should get paid a little more in non-arbitration years. Of course I’m also a fan of a salary cap (and floor) so…
I’m happy to read your post and 100% agree with everything you said.
No one gives a hoot about the owners.
And explain to me WHY the players are “paid enough”? the only true way to measure the “value” of the player is by a pure open market for the consumable service that player provides. And guess what no way to have that unless you advocate having competition for MLB.
Since the owners are protected 100% from any competition their profits are pretty much guaranteed. Therefore, the players are and should be well within their right to bargain for what they believe is fair. Then the two sides will hopefully work it out,
You got it exactly backwards. At any one time there are about 1200 people in the world that can play the game at that level. You won’t pay those prices or even watch games on TV if they fill it with scrubs. How do I know that? No one goes to college games and minor league games filled with guys that are not on the 40 man roster draw 1-2 k per game. There is no game without those 1200 players with irreplaceable MLB level skills.
The OWNERS are getting paid $12.3 billion this year by you and I. TV deals and ticket sales. WE pay that. Not the owners of the teams. WE pay for ballparks with our tax dollars. WE pay for the infrastructure needed to get fans and electricity and water to and from that ballpark. Not the owners.
$12.3 billion is $410 million per team. That means on average they can afford to pay the 26 guys on the roster $7.5 million each and STILL make a profit. Right now that average is $4.17 million. The PLAYERS are not earning enough. Not close.
There is far more money that goes into running a team than paying 26 players.
Exactly Cincyfan. Not to mention he has posted the same take over and over and over and over on this thread
-Outinleftfield
If those 1200 people were all in the same stadium and a terrorist blew it up and killed all 1200 players would MLB go bankrupt? No, of course not, the next tier of 1200 would come in and start right away. They would now be the best 1200 players in the world.
Everyone is replaceable!
Compensating players sooner is bad news for A’s fans. Means less success and earlier goodbye’s.
How can be balanced the young productive players who don’t get paid according to their production VS the old unproductive injured overpaid players ?
I always like the incentives bassi remuneration. Take 20-25% of the $210M lux tax that all teams have to give to the entire roster base on production ( like ( $44-50M) this year, but this figure changes up and down depending on revenue ).
Have the players to agree that 40 man roster spots are earned and not given in their FA contracts. Managers have to have the right to send any player down (at least one year) before loosing him for the minimum to other club. ( C. Davies, JP Crawford. P. Sandoval, B.Zito, A. Gonzales, Hamilton, etc, etc) Im not saying don’t paid their contracts, but 26 man spots have to be for the best players for the best show possible.
Finally someone else who gets it. Careful, Mr Perkins as you will be butchered for thinking this way by the likes of Jmac70, bryce1244 and outinleftfield
You feel like you were butchered? Maybe you need to stop shilling for billionaires.
Maybe you should move to Russia.
Skip the ad hominem attacks.
Theres a simple fix to all these problems. Players should be paid based on their performance during the season. Get rid of these long 12 year contracts. As an example, Soto had an amazing year so he should of earned around 40 million this year, Pujols had an awful season this year so he should of earned the minimum. Young players get paid this way and incentives older players to try harder
I really don’t think the majority of older players care about the rookies or else they wouldn’t insist on making these ridiculous contracts of 30 million a year or more in their declining years. Sure in most cases the player signing earned that money earlier in his contact but now like Miguel Cabrera is just wasted space on a roster and still getting that money. There needs to be more incentive laded contracts in MLB. Say the league minimum plus reasonable reachable incentives for second year players. Older declining stars should be signed to these kinds of contracts. That way if they didn’t max out their incentives they won’t be making the 30 million.
What is ridiculous about getting paid for what you did earlier in your contract? The TEAM chose to pay that amount because they knew that they would make out like bandits early in the deal and then pay for a few declining years at the back end. You don’t hear teams complaining about those deals. You only hear fans complaining.
I think we should all forget the 2020 season. I mean, the Dodgers won that year. Probably the biggest asterisk besides Astros since forever.
I hope the younger players get paid. I also don’t care for the “owners are businessmen” line of thinking. They won a bidding war to own a business that prints money.
Quite frankly, I wish all sports teams were local non profits like the Packers.
I explained this earlier. It cannot happen. The Packers were grandfathered ( They had the arrangement before modern NFL laws were created. If it did I can only imagine the politics involved. States and Cities enacting quotas such as Gender, racial and sexual preference requirements on a front office. No thank you.
Will Max Scherzer work for half? The top tier guys are getting overpaid because there is no competition from the players that are still under control. It is just supply and demand. We can pay the minor leaguers and pre free agent guys more. But the pie is only so big. The money will come from the players given free agent contracts.
Stepping back and looking at it from 5 miles high the biggest problem is that we have two sides trying to gain advantage in an increasingly unwieldy cluster *#$%. Using the current CBA as the starting point is ridiculous. Paying first year players $585K while paying over-the-hill players $5MM or $10MM or $20MM or more per year is crazy.
The logical and practical thing to do would be to scrap everything and start from the standpoint of growing the fan base, i.e. making affordable for a fans to fill the stadiums. Look at soccer (I hate soccer) in Europe – stadiums full of rabid fans. I would recommend the CBA mandate that a certain % of seats be family-friendly priced.
I would recommend that first year players earn $1MM, second year players $2MM, third year $3MM. Then FA after 3 years – no arbitration. BUT no new contract can be longer than 3 years for all players. Let the two sides negotiate the team salary cap and ‘luxury’ tax.
Then settle the other issues – post season, DH, etc.
I hate one size fits all approaches. You cannot treat Wander Franco like Nick Nelson or some other 25th man bottom feeder.
Replace arbitration with a straight six seasons of team control with a sliding scale based on performance. Add escalators for awards and all-star selections. The clock starts regardless of whether you debut in April or September, thus no service time manipulation. Teams can afford to provide housing for minor leaguers, especially at the lower levels. Keep the luxury tax threshold where it is and no salary floor. Forcing teams to hand out big money contracts doesn’t make better teams, it just makes bad ones more expensive
That is actually a good solution. Although I do think you need a floor so you do not see teams like the A’s tanking
Not really. From a GM perspective it is a nightmare. Depending on how many young players you have and terms, you go into the season with a widely variable budget. I don’t think it is really doable.
Performance-based compensation only works when good performance directly leads to increased profits – or if the compensation increase is not significant enough to impact the overall budget.
In a day and age when players are setting new records in arbitration every year i don’t really see how performance based bonuses is any different. Again you would be replacing the randomness of the current arbitration process with a structured pay scale
This is a terrible situation. Something has to be done to get younger players paid. In trade, I don’t want to see anymore 10 year contracts where the player will be 38 making 30 million and can’t run the bases. Maybe a max salary per age range?
Baseball is a monopoly. How about ten regular season games in free network tv rabbit ears for each team on their local region.
The players union is back baby!
Owners players and fans. I think someone needs to think about the fans . How much is too much when it comes to ticket prices the fans pay
How much is too much when the fans don’t pay it.
It really seems like it’s small market vs. big market teams vs. players here. There’s too much wrong with the sport from a financial and competitive standpoint to have a one size fits all answer.
One of the ideas l I liked was top draft picks going to the teams that just missed the playoffs and working backwards to the teams with the worst record, then the playoff clubs. Avoid the teams having sell offs rather than teams just having a bad year.
Give the owners one more Wild Card team per league and expand it to a three game series. Expand the divisional round to seven games. More teams, games, revenue.
Implementation of the universal DH.
Reduce service time required for FA by one year.
Allow teams to buy out one bad contract every five years and not let that hit your luxury tax threshold.
It doesn’t fix everything, but it’s at least a starting point.