The Brewers have apparently given some thought to considering relocation, per a report from Molly Beck of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. At issue is the club’s lease on American Family Field, with negotiations over a new funding package for improvements yet to reach an agreement, as detailed by reports from Tom Daykin of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. Beck’s report indicates the club could start looking for a new home this fall if a deal isn’t in place by then.
American Family Field is owned by a public agency called the Southeast Wisconsin Professional Baseball District, who leases the stadium to the Brewers. The current lease runs through 2030 and requires the agency to pay for improvements present in at least 75% of all other MLB stadiums. The district must also replace or repair infrastructure items consistent with the replacement items of the top 25% of all MLB parks.
Wisconsin Governor Tony Evers, a Democrat, proposed a $290 billion spending package earlier in the year as part of a deal that would get the Brewers to sign an extension keeping them in Milwaukee through 2043. When combined with interest and the $70MM that the district already has on hand, this would have eventually led to $448MM in spending.
That deal was scrapped by Republican lawmakers, who control the legislature. They have been negotiating a separate deal, the full details of which have not been released, though they want local governments to contribute. Local officials don’t seem to be on board, noting that they are facing challenges just covering basic services like police, sanitation and parks. Back in May, the Milwaukee County Board voted 17-0 to support a resolution calling for no county funding on American Family Field improvements. That was signed by Milwaukee County Executive David Crowley in June, though Crowley has reportedly expressed a willingness more recently to find a way to free up local revenue that could be used for stadium renovations. A financing package from the Legislature would also need to pass in the Senate. “We hope to have a finalized proposal in the near future,” said Assembly Speaker Robin Vos. “We do not want the (Brewers) to leave, nor do we think they will.”
Major League Baseball Commissioner Rob Manfred visited Milwaukee in May and cited the Oakland Athletics, who are in the process of moving to Las Vegas, as a cautionary tale for the Brewers. He said that Oakland government officials “made some unfortunate decisions not to maintain the ballpark in the way that it needed to be maintained” and stressed the importance of officials getting a deal in place for the Brewers.
As mentioned, the current lease runs through 2030, meaning that a deal doesn’t need to be completed immediately. However, moving a franchise from one city to another is a process that takes years to explore and implement, so the club would have to proactively start considering the details of such plans if they thought it was a real possibility. The A’s began pursuing relocation in May of 2021, a process that is still playing out over two years later.
The fact that the Brewers have some willingness to consider relocation plans in the future doesn’t mean they are highly plausible to come together, however. Professional sports franchises often dangle the threat of relocation as a way to try to spur urgency from government officials in funding negotiations. It’s quite rare for a relocation plan to actually come to fruition, despite the impending move of the A’s to Vegas. Since the Washington Senators became the Texas Rangers in 1971, there has only been one instance of an MLB club moving, which was the Montreal Expos becoming the Washington Nationals in 2004.
There are various cities that have been suggested as potential future homes for MLB teams, such as Nashville, Portland and Salt Lake City. The league would eventually like to expand from 30 to 32 teams, but Manfred has repeatedly said that the A’s and Rays have to resolve their respective stadium situations before expansion will be on the table. The A’s moving to Vegas isn’t a done deal but seems quite far along in the process. The Rays don’t have a deal firmly in place either but seem to be making progress towards a resolution for a new stadium. That situation would theoretically become more complicated if the Brewers don’t get a deal in place in the near future. There’s also at least some uncertainty around the Orioles given the standoff in their lease negotiations.
The situation in Milwaukee is less pressing, with a few extra years on the lease. The Orioles lease expires at the end of this year, the Athletics’ lease on their current stadium runs through 2024 while the Rays have a lease that goes through 2027. With the Brewers having a deal in place through 2030, they have more time to figure out a plan to stay in Milwaukee. For now, it seems the expectation of everyone involved is that the club will stay. The Brewers want “Major League Baseball to remain in Wisconsin for the next generation and beyond,” says Rick Schlesinger, president of business operations for the team. Manfred said in May that he thinks “the Brewers are interested in a long-term relationship and an extension of the lease that’ll keep them here.” The possibility of relocation would vanish as soon as a new deal is in place, but it will likely only become more real as time passes without one.
James Midway
Ah yes the tug of war between the government and billionaires, with the only losers being the fans.
I always get a laugh when Portland is brought up as a city to move to.
BuddyBoy
Portland shouldn’t get a ML team. The politics aren’t going to allow a brand new stadium and they would be a lower revenue market as well
mgomrjsurf
Orlando?
getrealgone2
Florida isn’t a baseball state
BaseballisLife
Tampa owns the Orlando market.
TheMan 3
“ Florida is not a baseball state “
Maybe someone should tell all of the spring training Gratefruit teams and the minor league teams playing there
Seamaholic
That’s just because of weather. The two Florida teams have always drawn nothing and had negligible TV ratings as well. Statement is absolutely correct.
BaseballisLife
Florida is a great baseball state. There has been a horrible owner who stole hundreds of millions from taxpayers on a ballpark in the ghetto and another team with a terrible stadium in a terrible location.
Build a ballpark that is actually in Tampa and the Rays will draw fans. Their attendance is up 5k a game this season. About 30%.
Not sure what to do about the Marlins. 1st they had the scheister and then the Yankee. Unless Sherman can put a competitive team on the field for a few consecutive seasons its going to be hard to win back the community.
Because of the lease on the ballpark the Marlins are going to be there a long time, so we will have the chance to see if they eventually draw fans for a winning team.
alwaysgo4two
Glad that you said it. They also laughed when Tampa got the Lightning 3 years ago. Now they’re one of the NHLs best drawing. Good stadium, good location and a committed owner.
Bart Harley Jarvis
@ TheMan 3,
I got this. Florida is a great Spring Training and MiLB state. I’m here to help!
Pete_Rose_was_Framed
Not a MLB state. Plenty of minor league teams that play great baseball and you don’t have to remortgage your house to go. Went and saw the Daytona Tortuga’s play. Ticket was I think 17 dollars for the “expensive”seats and it was a Belly Buster day where you got all the pizza, burgers, hot dogs and popcorn you could stuff in your face. Contrast that with 50 dollar a seat tickets for the Rays, 25 for parking, 10 dollar beers, and 5 dollar hot dogs. Is Minor league baseball as good, probably not, but the players WANT to be there and not just for the money. Plus, watching the Tortuga’s, I’ve seen quite a few of the good to great players the Reds have on their roster now when they were just starting out
ChuckyNJ
Miami tends to support front-runners and celebrities. They’ll come out to see Lionel Messi play soccer, but they won’t turn out for the Marlins.
Jake1972
San Antonio or Austin.
Actually a team could be placed in San Marcos between Austin and San Antonio and it would work.
Ham Fighter
Montreal Brewers!
Ham Fighter
That no one goes too
SFBay314
Since when do play spring training in August?
Endar Malkovich
Teams by state:
California – 5
Texas, new York, ohio, Missouri, Illinois, Florida, PA – 2
Minor league teams by state:
Florida – 12
North Carolina – 11
California & Texas – 8
States that produced the most mlb players in 2021:
1091 players who played at least 1 game in mlb in 2021
California – 238 players or 21.8% of all players in 2021
Florida – 113 players or 10.4% of all players in 2021
Why would anyone say Florida is not a baseball state? Only California (the most populas state) has more influence than Florida. Florida is the 2nd most influential state in baseball.
SFBay314
Florida also has the most baseball fans in the month of February. Doesn’t mean it’s good for the regular season.
holycow16
Orlando airport is garbage.
TheMan 3
apparently you can’t understand the written language, SFBay314
No one said anything about spring training being played in August
EasternLeagueVeteran
Correction: the Montreal Molsons.
its_happening
Tampa would be more successful getting off the St Pete’s island in the middle of nowhere. Move into downtown Tampa and the Rays would be fine.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Round Rock and San Antonio already have baseball teams. A whole bunch in Tx.
Lanidrac
Building a new stadium didn’t help the Marlins, and it wouldn’t help the Rays much either.
As long as the richest residents don’t live there during most of baseball season (the Snowbirds), while a large chunk of the remaining population are retirees on fixed incomes, MLB just does not work in Florida outside of Spring Training and the World Baseball Classic.
Lanidrac
The Snowbirds actually do live there during most of hockey (and football and basketball) season. Not so for most of baseball season.
websoulsurfer
Tampa is different from St Pete. It would help. They would draw in Tampa proper.
bostonbob
That would only work with the Rays relocating
bostonbob
Holy cow, you are wrong. A new terminal opened this year with two more coming. Totally changed
BaseballisLife
Relocating to Tampa.
joseg
You can move the team to the rich area deal with traffic and backup during the season make sure to build public transportation for the poor to get there
Citizen1
Illinois has 3 teams – cubs sox and cardinals fans southwest of Chicago. Nj the Mets or Yankees. Oregon probably mariners fans.
The idea was to put mlb season baseball in Florida after notable spring training in the late 80s, early 90s. Mlb season attendance is not there in fl,
BaseballisLife
Have you been to the Marlins ballpark in the middle of Little Havana? Not exactly the area you want to be walking in at night.
Rather go to Comiskey or whatever its called now for a night game. At least its easy to get to on public transportation. Just catch the Red Line and it takes you right there.
P N Protocol
I’d say that light rail between the two cities is necessary. Take off from, say the area of The Forum in NE SA, or a few miles north.
The other end – leave from Ben White and I-35 area. Nothing else. The rail would be exclusively to travel to the stadium or to the other city.
Come on, Elon. Make it happen.
its_happening
Location, location, location. Tampa has the a horrible location. You do not know, nor should you use one city to presume the other will end up the very same. Apples and oranges.
BaseballisLife
Portland is a much larger market than Milwaukee. They already have a site approved and financial backing to privately fund building the ballpark.
Ann Porkins
I like how craft beers and veggie dogs are in the same SJW rant as managers wearing drag lol. And that “everyone would win the World Series” jab seems to lack self awareness.
I’m in my 30’s and when I was in Little League it wasn’t us players demanding for participation trophies — it was our parents. Unless you’re claiming that SJWs are primarily baby boomers, maybe you’re just listing a bunch of things that you don’t like, understand, and/or are scared of as Portland’s theoretical SJW demands.
If there was any credence to your fears of “wokeness” altering MLB baseball, wouldn’t we be seeing some of this in San Francisco? Instead, the Giants participate in all the same Memorial Day/July 4th/Veteran’s Day “support the troops” and “wear red, white, and blue” festivities that the other 29 teams celebrate. They unblinkingly sing God Bless America during all the same events as the rest of the league. The most “progressive” things that come to mind are the Giants being an early adopter of wearing Pride Day hats a few years ago, and Gabe Kapler kneeled once on a holiday (can’t recall which) and immediately backtracked.
MLB and the 30 teams are owned and operated by the very wealthy, no matter what city a team plays in. They make token gestures towards diversity and inclusivity so that they don’t offend any potential customer, not because they have some sinister agenda one way of the other. They’re in it to make money and watch their franchise values rise each year — and that happens with selling patriotic hats on July 4th, pride hats in June, pink hats on Mothers Day, Star Wars hats to collect a Disney paycheck, and whatever else makes them more money.
C Yards Jeff
“Right wingers”. I’ve heard and read of it. Not sure what it means.
“Left wingers”. Can’t say I’ve heard or read of it. But if there’s a “right” one, wouldn’t that imply there’s a “left” one as well?
hiflew
There is not going to be any relocation market that happens that won’t be a lower revenue market. Because if it was a high revenue market, there would already be a team there.
Lanidrac
That’s misleading, as MLB hasn’t expanded for 25 years. In that time, potential markets such as Portland, Austin/San Antonio, and Charlotte have outgrown MLB’s current smallest markets. There’s also Montreal, which remains a decent-sized market despite having previously given up on the Expos.
rocky7
YOu’re being kind…..Portland offers nothing except remembrances of BLM, riots, drugs on the street, and assaults on police……
TheMan 3
Never been to Portland rocky7 I see
When a person gets all of his information from a propaganda network, it’s easy to stereotype based on what they think
rocky7
Oh, our Liberal just checked in….guess you’re one who doesn’t believe their eyes…..don’t need to be political but saying that what happened in Portland didn’t is asinine!
And by the way, I have been to Portland when it was nice to visit pal……it isn’t anymore……
Buuba ho tep
Man 3 keep up the good posts
Bart Harley Jarvis
@rocky7,
You forgot to mention another stupid talking point of the poorly educated ‘conservative’ right – meth poop. I’m here to help!
BaseballisLife
Why a laugh? Portland has an approved site, financing lined up to privately fund building a stadium, and 5k people that put down a deposit for season tickets for a team that doesn’t exist yet.
rocky7
Just let us know when the next “summer of love” happens right out side of this wonderful site for baseball you say………
TheMan 3
I’d rather deal with “ a summer of love “ than a Trump rally in some sh.*t hole red state
TurnOffTheTV
That’s why you are an idiot Theman3.
TheMan 3
Maybe I’m an idiot to you, TurnOffTheTV but I’m a retired well educated professional who doesn’t use insults to make my point
You on the other hand does
If you can’t have a rational discussion without revealing your immaturity, you can mute me for future reference
deepseamonster32
St Louis is always near the top of the highest per capita murder rate in the country. Should we move the Cardinals out of there?
You people don’t know squat about Portland’s ability to support a baseball team if all you can do is regurgitate this banal anti-Portland drivel.
Let’s judge your small town based on its meth infested trailer park
TurnOffTheTV
Your comment I replied to contradicts your latest response. In any factual debate i would destroy you. I bet we can’t even agree on facts though so a debate is impossible.
Lanidrac
St. Louis’s murder rate is misleading, due to how the City separated from the County well over a century ago and has been forbidden from annexing any land since then. If you compare by Metro Area, St. Louis’s crime rates still aren’t that good but are a lot better than comparing just the City.
Still, I agree that crime rates don’t matter that much for people attending a 3 hour game downtown among several other thousand people doing the same thing. Detroit is also know for high crime rates, and they have teams in every major pro league..
Bart Harley Jarvis
@TurnOffTheTV,
Punctuation, please! Your supposed ability to destroy in a debate is significantly diminished by a lack of proper punctuation. Please step up your game or you’ll come off as a product of a red state education system.
websoulsurfer
The St Louis metro area is also #1 in violent crime in the nation.
TheMan 3
try me TurnofftheTV
mpguy
Where is the financing lined up for the stadium? Most, if not all, of it will have to be from private sources. Taxpayers and the Portland city council have made it pretty clear that they’re not putting anything more than some infrastructure money into it.
And where is the “approved site?” Lloyd Center property? RedTail golf course? Terminal 2? All I’ve seen are proposals, and there’s a long way to go with any of those.
Despite what fools whose perceptions of Portland come from Fox Not-A-News-Channel think, there’s nothing wrong with Portland as a potential MLB site. The weather during the baseball season is certainly not a problem. But there are some big hurdles that will have to be cleared — like a solid commitment to a stadium and some hefty percentage of local ownership that probably won’t include Phil Knight.
BaseballisLife
They have huge $$$ investors including Ciara and Russell Wilson.
Craig Cheek said in an interview on 1080 in Portland that they had $1.1 billion committed to build a ballpark and could quickly gather investors to make up difference to develop Lloyd Center Mall.
Mayor Ted Wheeler publicly supported allowing the group to develop the Lloyd Center Mall. There is a great article on June 29th about it in the Oregonian. oregonlive.com/portland/2023/06/portland-mayor-bac…
In May they took out an option on the Lloyd Center Mall from the KKR Real Estate Trust the current owners and in June did the same for the Red Tail Golf Course from the city of Portland. Lloyd Center Mall has been the site the group has been targeting until the city offered the land at the Red Tail Golf Course to them in late June. The group made a $30 million offer to the city on the Red Tail land just in case the purchase of the Lloyd Center Mall property does not go through.
They have commitments from investors, a site secured with a purchase option, a secondary site secured with an option to buy and a purchase offer on the table, the Mayor and city council leaders backing their proposal to the point they are willing to use public money for more than $200 million in infrastructure improvements, and local ownership including Cheek and others.
They are expected to send a letter of intent to MLB by the end of the year.
John Canzano had a great article on his website about it the progress that is being made.
mpguy
Including the expansion fee, it’s going to take at least $3.5 billion to purchase a franchise. If Cheek and the other investors (mostly minor investors like Russ and Ciara) had that kind of money, it would have been apparent long ago. He’s the founder of the Portland Diamond Project, which has always been long on hope and short on resources. $1.1 billion won’t even get the stadium done.
Nobody has “secured” anything in terms of a site. There are problems with every site they’ve looked at. They will have to purchase additional land around Lloyd Center to make the field configuration work.
The golf course site isn’t within the city limits. Portland wanting to commit $200 million for infrastructure isn’t a done deal, and would probably end up being referred to a vote of Portland residents. The city doesn’t control the land around the course, because it’s not within the city limits. Both the city of Beaverton and Metro would have to sign off on that. Not to mention that ODOT would have something to say about the traffic impacts on Highway 217 and Scholls Ferry Road.
I’d love to see a team in Portland. But there are miles to go before any of the key elements necessary to firm up a proposal to MLB are in place.
websoulsurfer
I may be wrong, but after talking to Craig last week, I think he was talking only about the stadium in terms of the investors lined up, not the ownership group for the team. They are separate issues. I will be in PDX next week and will ask him about that.
The franchise fee is expected to be between $1 and $2 billion, but no one really knows how much because MLB has not said anything. It’s all speculation at this point.
Russell Wilson and his wife Ciara have committed $250 million to the project. For me that is a lot of money. I guess in this case it’s about 10% of the total of ballpark and franchise fee.
The proposed ballpark has a 14.5 acre footprint including the plaza and the Lloyd Center Mall property is 50 acres. Why would they need to buy surrounding land to build the ballpark?
The city of Portland owns the Red Tail Golf Course which is in Beaverton. Please don’t believe me. Look it up or read the article in the Oregonian.
Seamaholic
Government IS the fans. Or at least represents them. Government is not some separate entity from the people it governs and who vote for it.
BaseballisLife
With gerrymandering that is just not true. Wisconsin is among the worst. 56% of people voted Democrat in the last election and 67% of the legislature is GOP. They have districts that are not even contiguous.
When you can’t win the will of the people with your policies, quash it with cheating seems to be the idea in Wisconsin.
That will change soon as a lawsuit working its way through to the State Supreme Court will force a redrawing of the districts prior to the 2024 elections.
TheMan 3
State Supreme Court that has a Democratic Majority no less, the first time in over a decade
TGH31
Call me politically naive but it would make sense that the reps maps (I am sure gerrymandering exists) are based more on region vs vote? I could see how the majority voting of the state (since the majority of democrat voting wins are situated in Dane/Milwaukee/Kenosha/Racine counties) are democratic based on population but the majority of the counties in the state are republican. If I am not mistaken Oneida, a few FIB counties up north, and a 2 college town counties swing liberal but it’s a small amount of counties in the state.. Don’t necessarily understand it all but I am amazed at the difference in views/way of life across the state.
BaseballisLife
Do some research. Wisconsin has so badly gerrymandered their districts that many are not contiguous even though their state constitution requires they be contiguous.
mpguy
So … you don’t think that an urban vote should be worth as much as a rural vote? Yes, Dems are often packed into cities — and that’s where a majority of the PEOPLE live. There’s no way to defend arranging state Rep or state Senate seats that favor a minority of the population in rural counties just because there;’s lots of land there. Dirt doesn’t get a vote. People do.
TheMan 3
I’d rather give benefits to migrants just starting out in this country because they bring trades that the Dotard’s party can’t do
All they do is gripe about what other people get yet are the first to hold their hands out for freebies
It’s called Hypocrisy
MuleorAstroMule
You guys don’t even argue the point because you know it’s true.
rondon
We want a team in Nashville. But we wouldn’t want it with the stink of Manfred’s veiled threat still hanging in the air. Besides, we’ll still be broke form the new Titan’s stadium.
prov356
Baseball is coming here to Nashville. It’s just a matter of time and which team.
mlbmusiccity.com/
It has nothing to do with the new proposed Titans stadium.
BaseballisLife
Can’t wait. Nashville is such a great city.
rondon
No doubt it’s coming. But to say it has “nothing to do with the new proposed Titan’s stadium” is ridiculously clueless. Everything about it has to do with timing. It’ll be several years before it materializes and it won’t happen til the Titan’s deal is done.
prov356
Rondon – No need for personal attacks.
I pay close attention to the “MLB to Nashville” project. No where anywhere does anyone in the process of either endeavor correlate the timing of MLB coming to Nashville with a new Titans stadium. Please post the reference in case I missed it.
If you can’t, then your comments are merely conjecture.
BaseballisLife
Like Portland, Nashville has private funding lined up to build a ballpark and land purchased.
rondon
I’m not sure how that was a personal attack but it wasn’t meant to be. What I do know, after living in Nashville for 35 years, is the aversion the public has to funding private endeavors with taxpayer dollars.. The new Titan’s stadium will most likely happen, but not without a lot of contentiousness and the always mysterious municipal bonds. These are the same taxpayers that shot down a light rail plan to reduce increasingly bad road congestion not too long ago. because of the cost- and that wasn’t to benefit some billionaire ownership group.
Your take on “anyone in the process” apparently doesn’t include the public, who are most definitely part of the process. I would add that my original comment was about Manfred’s less than subtle threat of the Brewers leaving Milwaukee for a better deal somewhere else. That means the public picking up a bigger tab in the new city. If any team came in here under those circumstances on the heels of a billion dollar plus football stadium, it is not a reach to say there would be public blowback.
I have to add that I met Dave Dombrowski at the beginning of the process and public perception and approval was front and center in the plan.
prov356
No worries Rondon. If I remember right, the light rail plan was a tax dollar grab that would have done nothing to decrease the growing traffic issues in Nashville. That’s why it wasn’t popular with the public. I think a baseball stadium, if mostly private funds build it, would be a different story.
websoulsurfer
Nashville would be a good home for a baseball team. They have both the sports fans and the corporate backers to make it work.
I would think that IF Fisher moves the A’s, and that is still a big if, that Portland, Nashville, and the East Bay area would be the front runners for the 2 expansion teams MLB will add with the next CBA.
sangroazul
Bingo!!
garth16iorg
Go back to Russia.
KingZeke8
And taxpayers, don’t forget the taxpayers
For Love of the Game
Jaysfan, you fell for Darragh’s bias. The Milwaukee County Board of Supervisors, almost all Democrats, voted it down as well.
BaseballisLife
Why would Milwaukee County vote to spend money on a stadium that the state agreed to maintain and upgrade and while the county is seeing shortfalls in revenue and would have to cut essential services to fund any money being given to the billionaire owner of the Brewers?
greg7274
Because the restaurants, hotels, and shopping outside the stadium are in their county.
Those bring in revenue to the county through sales tax and tourism fees.
Those same businesses also employ county residents who then spend earnings and are charged county sales tax as well.
BaseballisLife
You missed the point. The STATE is responsible for the lease, not the county.
The county will bring in no more tax revenue or sales tax if they take money away from essential services like police, fire, roads, and education to give to a billionaire than if the keep that money for essential services.
Tourism makes up such a tiny portion of attendance at games according to MLB funded studies that its not even worth considering.
greg7274
I think you just like arguing.
My point stands… they have a mutual interest in a team occupying the stadium. Your question was asking why the county would help finance it when it wasn’t their contractual obligation. THAT is why they would do that.
Stadium occupancy also raises property values in that area, leading to higher property taxes, meaning even more revenue for the county.
Having a county government that doesn’t prioritize that is how you wind up with situations like Oakland.
Also, you don’t have to be a “tourist” to be charged a tourism fee by a city or county.. Sometimes they are called “entertainment” taxes or fees.
BaseballisLife
It’s not their agreement to uphold and they are running a deficit.
You are trying to say that they should stop providing essential services like police, fire, roads, and education so they can give money to a billionaire when the Governor of the state has already approved state money to be spent.
You should look into taxes in and around the ballpark in Milwaukee.
The county will make no more money between now and 2030 when the lease is up by spending money they do not have. Not one single penny. They will continue to receive all the same tax revenue.
greg7274
I am not saying they “should” do anything.
I am simply offering a reason WHY they MIGHT WANT to do that. If you can’t comprehend how that is different from demanding what the should do… then I cant help you..
I’m also not “looking into” anything. I have two family members currently elected to county government positions in our metro area with three teams in the five major sports leagues.
I know exactly how this works.
Maybe Milwaukee is different?… I truly don’t care.
It seems you do care, maybe you should run for your county board?
Good luck.
BaseballisLife
You haven’t presented a reason why yet.
Milwaukee County would not get any additional revenue from spending taxpayer dollars that they would not get without spending money.
Milwaukee County is running a deficit.
Spending money on the ballpark would mean taking money away from essential services.
Do your family members serve on the Milwaukee County board? Then you DO need to do some research into the taxes THERE.
That way you could speak from actual knowledge of the taxes THERE, not where you live.
In my 30s I served 2 terms in the Connecticut legislature. I know how it works from personal experience.
But thanks for pointing out that you don’t and haven’t served your community either.
gbp4ever
State never agreed to maintain and upgrade it. Stadium is owned by the 5 counties around MKE they are the ones who agreed to maintain and upgrade it as they own the stadium not the state.
BaseballisLife
You might want to read the article and the lease. Its public record. In it the state of Wisconsin agreed to guarantee the funds to the stadium authority that actually owns the stadium
Lanidrac
No, the SWBPD is responsible for the lease. It’s right there in the second paragraph. Why should the government at any level have to pay anything to maintain the stadium when it’s not and never has been their responsibility?!
BaseballisLife
Lets see if I can make this easy enough for even you to understand. The state of Wisonsin built the ballpark with taxpayer dollars and then transferred it to another government agency,
the SWBPD.
Read the lease. Its public record. The state guaranteed the terms of the lease meaning they are responsible for paying for those upgrades and maintenance if the stadium district cannot or does not. Because the 0.1% sales tax increase that funded the building of the ballpark and any needed maintenance and upgrades expired in 2020 the district does not have the funds to pay for it. That means the responsibility falls to the state. Governor Tommy Thompson signed off on the terms. If you don’t like them, blame him.
If the state does not uphold their end, the Brewers can leave in 2030.
Lanidrac
Ah, so the SWBPD is a government entity that only owns the stadium lease. Why didn’t the article just say that in the first place?! MLBTR misled us by implying it was a business corporation that’s part of the private ownership group.
Well, that means the government was foolish enough to accept such a stupid deal. Why the heck would they buy the stadium lease and the responsibility for maintenance in the first place?!
BaseballisLife
So you are not capable of understanding. I get it now.
Bart Harley Jarvis
@Playa,
And don’t forget us Legals Democrats too!
Bart Harley Jarvis
@gart,
Nyet, comrade, nyet!
TheMan 3
Try reading the entire Constitution outside of the 2nd Amendment
States have no authority to invoice the Federal Government for services they provided without permission
No doubt you’re a Trumpet voter
He said it perfectly
“ I love the poorly educated “
chickensrogee
Trump 2024. Suck on it. Get me my meth you elitist.
Brew88
MLB has built more outfield walls in recent years than Trump built border walls
TheMan 3
and MLB didn’t say Mexico would pay for those walls
Captain-Judge99
Manhattan?
websoulsurfer
The Long Island Brewers?
Hurricane Sandy
I happened to like both of the aforementioned statements, as they are both true. There’s no need for us to be fighting each other, we should just be fighting bad ideas and not care who the messenger is as long as they are sane, not a criminal, or interested in turning the US into an Authoritarian country (asking a lot I know).
The majority of voters in this country might be registered as one party or the other, but most likely vote independently, according to which ever party is currently trying to take it too far. It’s just funny when you realize how many people there are out there who honestly believe that most Americans agree wholeheartedly with these parties and their stupid philosophies and even stupider group of diehards.
deepseamonster32
@HurricaneSandy,
actually the majority of independents vote reliably for one party or the other. In fact, many independents are far right voters who think the GOP is a bunch of RINOs, or far left voters who think the Democrats are a bunch of right-wingers. But they vote reliably anyway cuz obviously the other party is run by fascists and/or Marxists
Hurricane Sandy
Yet I find that during major elections they usually come together to make the most rational decision. I know most people would disagree with me, but that’s the way I see it. The loud people are always letting their opinions be known, but I believe the silent majority of people in the United States just want to prevent the country from becoming totally right-leaning towards fascism, or totally left-leaning towards communism. We all come from households that usually lean one way or the other but most people I think are aware of maintaining somewhat of an equilibrium that doesn’t totally empower the kooks. I for one come from a democratic household, but have been voting for a lot of Republicans recently, because I don’t think that Democrats are doing things that most people even remotely would think to do, or care about, but you look at the other side and how they’ve all convinced themselves somehow that everyone loves and pines for the days of Trump, meanwhile, every election in the last two years proves otherwise. Those of us that are in the middle just need to stay strong and keep the country afloat so that these knuckleheads don’t ruin it.
Hurricane Sandy
The most important voting bloc in this country is that middle ground that winds up swaying every election one way or the other.
Captain-Judge99
Manhasset?
Captain-Judge99
Montauk?
Wolf Hoffmann
Democrats don’t know how many genders there are. Do you really expect normal people to consider anything you say? Nice try commie.
Wolf Hoffmann
Did you type this while wearing your Hot Topic Che Guevara shirt?
TheMan 3
At least I don’t wear a Tin Foil Hat
Edster3
Yes, and what really stinks is our “wonderful” owner of the Brewers it seems has been planning for this all along. We’ve had some of the absolute worst signings, moves, and decisions over the last few years. A pathetic payroll. I’m so fed up with the EXCUSES, we’re a small market team, boo hoo, whaah. The Bucks decided to SPEND MONEY to MAKE MONEY, and POOF! A CHAMPIONSHIP! Huh, go figure. If this cheap owner would have opened his wallet more and his mouth less, this team could have far more support. I’ve been a Brewers fan my entire life. I remember going to games at Milwaukee County Stadium back in the mid to late 70’s and early to mid 80’s. Those are some of the most amazing memories of my life. After games we could wait outside for the Players to come out for autographs. Robin Yount, Paul Molitor, Gorman Thomas, Ben Oglive, Moose Haas, Cecil Cooper, and my favorite Mike Caldwell. It was something special! Now? ???????
Josh 27
When it’s for billionaires it is economic development, when it’s for the rest of us, it’s a handout. Let the owners pay for it.
chound
While I agree with the premise, let owners pay for stdiums, I laugh at the ignorance of the rest of the take. Go get a job from the handout class.
TheMan 3
Any franchise pay’s rent for use of their stadiums unless it’s owned by the team owners
Lanidrac
Yes, and the ones who own the lease are the ones responsible for maintenance, not the government.
rmullig2
Wisconsin Governor Tony Evers, a Democrat, proposed a $290 billion spending package earlier in the year as part of a deal that would get the Brewers to sign an extension keeping them in Milwaukee through 2043.
Are the seats going to be made of solid gold?
all in the suit that you wear
Good catch. Just googled and the entire Wisconsin state budget is $20.3 billion for FY 2023.
barkinghumans77
I’m assuming the spending package included a lot of things, Brewers stadium funding was just part of it.
Ted
No, it should be million and it refers specifically to a Brewers spending deal. $290 billion doesn’t even make sense in the context of the whole state over a decade.
Armaments216
The Brewers are built on arms and defense. The Governor’s just trying to keep up with the Pentagon budget.
Bart Harley Jarvis
@rmulli,
I believe the plan is for gold toilets seats only in the Presidential Suite. Bigly!
Monkey’s Uncle
As a Pirate fan I’m supposed to hate the Brewers. But they are a well-run team with a great fan base. In no way should they even consider leaving Milwaukee
DimTillard
God, I’m sorry A’s fans. If the Brewers leave Milwaukee I’m never watching another game again. Obviously this is just a threat right now but it’s painful to read regardless.
Seamaholic
Why can’t you be happy for Vegas fans, and the fans in the city where the Brewers go? Oakland will get a minor league team soon enough, which is about what it can support.
Mitchell Page
A minor league team for Oakland is the best option . That way I can get rid of most those trolls in Oakland .
deepseamonster32
There aren’t going to be Vegas fans. It was about the 10th best option if the A’s wanted to move. Smallest market in MLB by miles
SoCalHardBall
Vegas doesnt want the A’s in their current state. New owners would be ideal. Because the tax payers will have to chip in to build a billionaires castle, and then said billionaire will become a slum lord and have a $35mm payroll. New stadium, same garbage product on the field. There needs to be a salary floor, especially for teams that are moving to a new city.
GASoxFan
You don’t make a salary ‘floor’…. what you do is set an astronomical rent for the stadium. Say, $150m per season. Then, you say the team gets a credit, dollar for dollar, of up to 80% of its player payroll against the rent due each season.
So, you spend $150m on player payroll, you pay $30m in rent. If you spend $50m on player payroll, you spend $110m in rent.
Then the community either gets a better product, or, money to provide better services. Either way there is finally a return on the infrastructure costs
Foxtrot Unicorn Charlie Kilo
Nice idea but wouldn’t work.
Owners have no incentive to agree to such terms.
There’s only so many mlb nfl nba teams. One city says no others step in to give them better deals.
Long as owners can find alternate sites and get the deal that benefits them your proposal wouldn’t work. Nice in theory though.
Lefty_Orioles_Fan
How can this be?
With the Kielbasa races and the Beer Man mascot going down the slide
SMH
What kind of sorcery is this?
Maybe a trade with Baltimore
We get the Brewers and the Orioles get Milwaukee
Kind of a weird trade, but John Angelos is always looking for new talent
PS What would Bob Eucker do?
DobyFan
The Orioles returning home to Milwaukee after a 125 year absence does have a nice symmetry to it.
brewcat
The Orioles were already once the Brewers.
barkinghumans77
Orioles were the StL Browns
DimTillard
and the Brewers prior to that
JimOToole
Check your team’s history, Lefty. The Orioles started in Milwaukee as the Brewers in 1889. They played in the Western League through 1894 until the American League was born — in Milwaukee — in 1900. After playing two seasons in the AL, the team moved to St. Louis as the Browns. It moved to Baltimore in 1954, one year after Milwaukee acquired its second major league team, the Braves, in a move from Boston.
thickiedon
*Uecker
Lefty_Orioles_Fan
Hahaha I knew it looked wrong.
Plus Uecker is in that Bobble Head commercial for the Mlb
The Brew Crew need to stay
websoulsurfer
He would tell you to spell his name right. He is sitting in the front row after all.
firstbleed
You can have the team but you will never get Uecker!!!!! Living Legend in these parts.
dclivejazz
The O’s better get crackin’ if they want to beat others to the punch.
Slider_withcheese
Good. It’s better for the game of baseball. No opposing player will miss flying into Milwaukee for a series and the current Brewers are rejoicing they may finally get to leave that dump. If it weren’t for its proximity to Chicago, no one would even know that Milwaukee even exists.
SharksFan91
@Slider_withcheese
Much like your proximity to looking like a human and walking on two legs lets people know that there’s a brain somewhere in there.
Dreg
Move them to Green Bay…always seems to work out right?
Right?
ChuckyNJ
Dumb Sports Fan Alert!
deepseamonster32
I can’t see the state spending $290 billion on the Brewers. They wouldn’t be able to afford public education in Wisconsin for the next 3,000 years
lesterdnightfly
Then that would make a total of 3,200 years.
User 2079935927
I knew somebody would misinterpet the $290billion spending package. It’s PART of the $290B spending package.
Comprehension is a struggle for deepseaminster32
deepseamonster32
no, I’m right. That number only makes sense for California, or maybe over 2 years for Texas.
BlueSkies_LA
The Brewers and the A’s situations don’t seem very analogous. No amount of renovation and maintenance can make the Oakland Coliseum a good place to play baseball.
ellisburks
Taxpayers should not be paying for stadiums for billionaires. The taxpayer always gets hosed, the billionaires always make the money.
TheMan 3
If it wasn’t in their lease agreement I would agree, and while the taxpayer really doesn’t have a say in this, the revenue for local economies is far too profitable to let the Brewers leave Milwaukee
Hotels and restaurants thrive during the baseball season
Seamaholic
Taxpayers rarely get hosed. Stadiums lead to increased economic activity which leads to increased tax collection. Whether each individual deal is slightly good or bad for taxpayers is a case by case thing (and carefully calculated and negotiated by very smart municipal finance specialists). But don’t fall for the faux populist knee jerk reaction that partially publicly funded stadiums are “gifts” to team owners. In fact it’s often the case that privately funded stadiums (and factories, and headquarters) are the worse deal for taxpayers, since they always come with sweetheart tax deals.
BaseballisLife
They never create economic activity. The relocate it from elsewhere in the local area.
Study after study after study show that ballparks create no new economic activity.
The people that live in the city and county surrounding the stadium and that pay for the team do not magically start making more money just because the stadium is built.
Those fans just take money they would have spent elsewhere and spend it at the ballpark and in the area surrounding the ballpark.
Add in the increased taxes paid to inflated prices you pay at every ballpark and the people are less well off in most cases. For many of us that is ok. We are willing to take away from other areas of our life for our entertainment. That does not mean putting the ballpark in added to our pockets economically.
TheMan 3
That’s horse hockey, BaseballisLife
Maybe not for cities in small market teams where attendance is very small but with every major sporting organization’s local areas financially benefit from fans
BaseballisLife
Can you show a single study not funded by the team or MLB that showed ANYTHING other than what I said?
I will make it easy. That study doesn’t exist. Every independent study says exactly what I said.
Ballparks do benefit the area directly surrounding them but do so to the detriment of other areas in the county/region they are built in.
Stadiums do not create enough out of state tourism to even register. A MLB funded study in 2019 showed that the largest out of state tourism any team received was the Red Sox at 3%. No other team surpassed 2%. Most were less than 1%.
GASoxFan
Baseballislife:
How was the percentage defined?
If you claim it was percentage of attendance, I’m doubtful.
So many tickets are sold and resold to non-local residents, at best they could seek who the team identified the original ticket as being sold to which has no correlation to who attends the games.
3% of 40,000 is 1200 fans. At 2% you’re talking 800. For a 20,000 attendance night, that 2% is 400 people.
I find it inconceivable to expect, just from attending ball games, that in a sellout crowd only 800 or less fans are from out of state, at least so many games and venues I’ve been to.
Now, looking at it from another perspective, does a chamber of commerce calculate total tourism revenue per year, and, compare it to what the baseball team brings in? Well, again, it doesn’t add up as the person who hits the ballpark, many rent hotel rooms, buy gasoline and snacks, hit a resturaunt or bar, all things that add revenue. It’s not just the cost of the ticket and stadium food.
As with most things, the truth is somewhere in between. Many ‘independent’ studies are seeking to disprove the ‘pro-stadium’ studies. Dig deep enough on the funding, who the staffers are so on so forth. There’s always an agenda.
At the end of the day, I’m sure if you looked at many municipalities, common sense says they come ahead. Who wants to go visit Baltimore for…. Baltimore? Remove the sports teams, and, a LOT less people go there or spend money. You could say the same for dozens of other sports cities.
Big cities live, and die, based on discretionary spending these days. Gone are the days where everyone had factories and made durable goods, now it’s services based. They aren’t raising crops. They aren’t making appliances. It’s a services based economy.
And the more times a single dollar changes hands, the more tax revenue it generates.
Bart Harley Jarvis
@BaseballisLife,
Thank you for delivering the cold, hard facts. All anyone has to do is google “economic impact of publicly funded sports stadiums”, and you’ll see dozens of studies and articles from business and academic sources. Stadiums are funded with public dollars because of our love for our local teams and owner’s threats of relocation, plain and simple.
BaseballisLife
Its where the tickets were purchased from.
ONLY the area directly surrounding the stadium comes out ahead. Everywhere else in the region sees a drop in tax revenue and money spent in hospitality businesses.
The people in the region that attend games don’t magically make more money just because a stadium is built so money is taken away from m other things they would normally do with that money. That means tax revenue from other parts of the region are just transferred to the ballpark district. They don’t increase for the state or region.
There hasn’t been a single independent study that has shown an incident where tax revenue has increased overall for the region.
marcfrombrooklyn
Back when NYC was negotiating to renew the lease for the Billie Jean King National Tennis Center, it was noted that every US Open brought in more tax revenue and economic activity each year than the Mets and Yankees brought in when they made it to the World Series against each other in 2000. Local sports teams just compete with other local recreation and leisure activities. Publicly-funded funded and subsidized stadiums, including supposedly “privately-funded” stadiums that get the land through eminent domain, have below-market rate land leases,pay little to no taxes because of massive tax breaks, and/or get to finance their “private” ballparks with tax-free municipal bonds, all are just welfare for billionaires. It’s a racket that only benefits the franchise owners.
stymeedone
@baseball life
Mr. I started a wondrous transformation in Detroit. When Comerica Park was first built, the area around it was not one that most would have felt safe walking through. Now the area is called The District Detroit. Ford Field brought the Lions back to the city, built right next to Comerica, which helps to provide year round traffic to the area. A short block away, they then built Little Ceasar’s Arena for the Red Wings, and Pistons, plus concerts. He restored the Fox Theatre. The family made a donation to Wayne State University, adding a new business school, named after the late patriarch of the Illitch’s. The area that used to be delapitated, empty houses is now filled with nice townhouses, apartments, office buildings with lower level restaurants and bars, and newly paved roads.
Downtown Detroit now has a reason for people to visit. They are pulling people from the suburbs that would not be spending there otherwise. Pontiac, the former home of the Lions and Pistons, is too far away to say it caused detriment to those areas, as it is not the same customer. Most will still spend their entertainment dollars in their neighborhoods. It was not a venue people living in the southern suburbs could easily get to, which the District Detroit becomes an option for. While I am sure the Illitch family has benefited, the City of Detroit is finally seeing a Renaissance, which has been long awaited, and is an exception to your studies.
marcfrombrooklyn
I’d recommend checking out some of economist Andrew Zimbalist’s work, particularly May the Best Team Win: Baseball Economics and Public Policy (2003). He does a pretty good job explaining why investment in sports stadiums is bad economics.
GASoxFan
Stymeedone-
I think I more or less understand the argument baseballislife is trying to make: tourism dollars are a zero sum game within a defined economic radius. He asserts that if you have x number of people they will always spend y number of dollars, and, you can’t increase that bucket of y dollars budgeted for entertainment/tourism, only change where they get used.
I tend to differ, I think what people spend their money on, and where, can be more fluid. I may spend less money to an online retailer who is in the form of a large entity, say, an Amazon or Summit Racing, neither of which have a local presence or invest locally. If a ball club is around, I will reallocate my budget, blowing less money on race car parts or bullets going shooting, and, instead pump money into local teams.
That is the fallacy – economists assume a household makes budgets like the government with allocation and always spend the same on each category regardless of variation on offerings. The truth is, someone may spend more money on disposable goods that don’t support the local economy instead of entertainment options which would, or vice versa, depending on what is in the area.
When I pay Amazon, or Summit, that money is gone from this economic zone and doesnt return. When I pay a team, or a gas station, or a resturaunt, it pays a local worker, local distributors, etc etc who then each spends some portion of that money to local businesses, keeping money in circulation locally. This also gives a basis to support the existence of locally owned, operated, located, and/or run businesses.
The fact that the studies rely upon initial ticket sales, which then undergo massive changes of ownership via stubhub and its ilk, are enough to cause a high enough degree of error in the tourism calculations as to make the studies fatally flawed and near worthless in most aspects.
BaseballisLife
It helped the area immediately surrounding Detroit-Wayne County Stadium but added not one single dollar to tax revenue in the greater Detroit area or the state of Michigan.
It simply transferred those dollars from other areas to the ballpark district.
Its not a question. Its the reality of every single stadium built.
The people in the greater Detroit area did not suddenly and magically see an increase in their earnings just because a stadium was built. The money they spend is what tax revenue comes from. They are just spending that money in a different area.
If the ballpark had been built in Pontiac instead of downtown Detroit the total tax revenue in the greater Detroit area would not have changed one bit. The only thing that would have changed is the location where the same dollars were spent. Same dollars. Same overall tax revenue.
Its the same story with every single stadium. The tax revenue generated in the ballpark district goes up and it goes down in other areas in the region and the overall tax revenue in the region remains the same.
Again it’s not something that can be argued. Its what has happened every single time.
That is why public money should never be spent on ballparks. The only entity that benefits is the ownership of the team that will play in that ballpark.
BaseballisLife
The point is those households have a finite number of dollars to spend and more than 80% of a households spending outside of housing is spent in their community. That includes entertainment and hospitality related spending.
As a partner in an accounting firm for nearly 40 years I can tell you that with some certainty because we handled the finances of tens of thousands of households over the decades.
That may not have been the case with our highest income clients, but it certainly was for the majority.
BaseballisLife
MLB funded and cited the study. You can be absolutely sure that they took into account ticket sales by StubHub and other major resellers.
GASoxFan
Baseballislife-
That is an outdated assumption and data set.
1) I’m curious about the socioeconomic groups that retained an accounting firm regarding their finances. A very VERY low percentage of households do this, except for taxes where a majority still file themselves, which, do not delve into tracking where your average household spends its non-housing budget.
2) with the meteoric rise of online shopping, the amount of household spending that goes to its local merchants is at an all-time low here in the US – just look at the revenue statements for Amazon and other online retailers, and, the corresponding vacancies in commercial retail space like shopping malls. Look further at the bankruptcies of retail chains, and, those fighting to borderline stay afloat.
People aren’t shopping local like they used to, and a large percentage of discretionary spending flows through internet commerce which is why there has been a push by local entities to tax e-commerce, and, the IRS to gain access to reporting on electronic payments (PayPal, etc)
BaseballisLife
You don’t go out to eat on Amazon or buy your groceries or gasoline.
The numbers have changed since the 80s but not since 2021 when I retired. If you would like I can ask my partners in the firm what the current numbers are. I’m retired but still a partner in the firm. I can do that and get back to you next week. That way you don’t Jane to guess like you are now.
GASoxFan
Actually, you would be surprised.
Amazon bought whole foods to increase its last-mile delivery footprint for food products.
There are dozens of large scale online meal delivery services that go far beyond the Omaha steaks types of old, and now include things like blue apron, healthy roots, and multitudes more. The share of households who no longer go to a local grocery store to shop is steadily increasing.
People order pet foods and products online from Amazon, chewy, and others.
Walmart.com, target.com, costco and sams club, and other online marketplaces do not ship most products from local stores, but rather out of centralized distribution .
The degree to which people participate in those programs shifts among location and demographics, both age and income.
But, the basic points remain –
1) studies that rely on initial ticket purchasers addresses have no correlation to predicting the final attendee/user of said tickets after the resale market takes hold. Just look at the numbers of tickets listed for sale, and sold, on stubhub and similar sites.
2) people can and will shift spending categories for their disposable funds based upon opportunities. Removing one opportunity doesn’t mean they spend on an alternative in the same category for discretionary items, which is to say, entertainment funds can go to other luxury or hobby expenses, switch to savings, or possibly switch to other entertainment spending.
I spent far far more on baseball games when I lived 30 minutes from the stadium, when I kept season tickets to the braves in addition to doing roughly 21 fenway games a season.
Since bloom, I stopped attending fenway games in person. After moving almost 5 hours away from truist ballpark I no longer kept my season tickets.
None of that expenditure has been shifted to other dining or live entertainment. All of it has been shifted to buying NOS auto parts online from all over the country to store for future projects.
Why? No local entertainment options exist that have similar enticement. That’s why it’s a fallacy to expect people to keep spending the same money they would on live professional sports should the access disappear. People will spend on what is in their greatest interest, for their greatest enjoyment, when it is discretionary spending.
websoulsurfer
GA you are one person and not representative of society. People do transfer the money they would spend locally to baseball because they HAVE TO. Their income is not limitless and they DO have a budget. If they spend money on taking their family to a ballgame, they CAN’T spend that money elsewhere. Not sure why you are trying to argue that is not true.
GASoxFan
Websoul – you’re making my argument in reverse.
What I’m saying is that it is a fallacy to claim that any money NOT spent on a baseball game will automatically be spent locally.
It may get spent outside the region the baseball game would’ve been held in, or, it may go to savings and not be spent at all.
Point is, there’s no requirement that money must be spent locally at all, on a baseball game or otherwise.
BaseballisLife
Lots of gobbledygook and nothing that changed the fact that stadiums in no way benefit the region they are located in, just the immediate neighborhood.
That you don’t understand is typical unfortunately. No sense in trying to explain since you simply are not willing to listen to facts.
I would bet your opinions of baseball are just as full of circular logic. So sadly you will meet the mute.
SharksFan91
@ellisburks
You know their business plan. Privatize the profits and socialize the losses. Or “trickle down” aka p*ssed on economics!
DCartrow
Nashville! The Homebrewers!
websoulsurfer
The Stars. I already bought a jersey.
bpskelly
There’s no chance the Brewers are leaving town. And my guess is, ownership isn’t going to build a new stadium, so at this point it’s really how many dollars are going into repairing and maintaining the stadium from the public coffers.
Cleon Jones
Does the roof still work?
Rsox
Possible expansion, multiple teams “considering” relocation and not enough truly viable places to go. Vegas is taken. Texas will probably get a third team at some point. Nashville, Charlotte, Portland (don’t see that one any time soon), Montreal, Salt Lake City. Seems like a lot of musical chairs happening in MLB
Seamaholic
Portland and Nashville are by far the farthest along and ready. They could break ground tomorrow. Both would be goldmines.
This one belongs to the Reds
Yet people say the game is healthy when folks in several cities think they have to move. Right.
websoulsurfer
I am not so sure Vegas is taken. It’s been 2 months since the legislature approved the $380 million for the team and Fisher has not applied to MLB to move the team yet.
That is because he hasn’t yet been able to get a loan to build the ballpark. The Nevada Independent said that the Nevada Legislature had some conditions including getting financing from a highly rated lending institution and that he present that within 90 days in order to get the money from the state. That deadline is coming up fast. We will see what happens.
A'sfaninLondonUK
@websoulsurfer
Without wasting too much of your time, I have to agree. I can’t see how John Fisher can raise the revenue/loans. I don’t understand how downsizing your market will attract investment. My 1990s average Economics degree suggests the same. As an A’s fan, English & living in London, I will not go to Las Vegas. I’ve been there and found watching adults in a playground, tiresome.
Obviously I’m one person in a large market, but the A’s in Vegas would become an away team in there own stadium.
Apologies for the drivel,
Peter in London
kylelohse
And there it is. The party of contrarianism. Doesn’t matter what it is but if a Democrat says it you have to be against it. Even when it comes to things that help everyone like healthcare, education, and voting rights. Many Republicans would happily eat s**t if it meant a Democrat had to smell their breath.
j_butte
Everybody wants the Truist Park setup and I can’t blame them. It’s great.
martras
American Family Field, like most major stadiums, is owned by the state, not the team playing there. Honestly, Wisconsin’s governments entered into an agreement with the Brewers as to ongoing maintenance and upgrades to keep the ballpark safe, viable and competitive for an MLB team.
The Brewers are requesting the state honor its commitments and the state is saying “no.” There will not be another Oakland Athletics in MLB where a team tries for 20 years to get a new stadium. The Brewers will leave, and MLB will expedite the departure process.
Honor your commitment or watch the Brewers leave. That simple.
BaseballisLife
The Governor has apparently already agreed to honor the commitments. As the article says, the Republicans in the legislature are blocking honoring those commitments.
martras
If only the governor was a king there wouldn’t still be a problem or an article talking about the problem.
User 2079935927
It’s good to be the King
BaseballisLife
See my post about the problem with gerrymandering in Wisconsin. The majority of voters voted for Democrats but because of gerrymandering the GOP controls the legislature.
Also, a Republican governor approved the lease that the Republican legislature now refuses to honor.
martras
Republicans, Democrats, Governor, Legislature, Prime Minister, Emperor, King…. the Brewers and MLB do not care. I’m not a Sconnie, the Brewers are not my team and I couldn’t care less about Wisconsin politics or who will be blamed when/if the Brewers leave.
Either the money gets put towards the Southeast Wisconsin Professional Baseball Park District (who owns the stadium) so it can make the repairs and improvements or the money doesn’t. If the district isn’t funded, Wisconsin will be in violation of their lease and the Brewers will begin the process of searching for a new home, which won’t be hard.
I’m sure it will be really great to win online arguments about which political party cost your state the “Nashville Honky-Tonks” or whatever name… formerly Milwaukee Brewers, but that still makes baseball fans in Wisconsin and Milwaukee losers. Even if you win online arguments about which political party is at fault, you still don’t have a baseball team, and Milwaukee would be way, way, wayyyyyy down the list of future cities for MLB. Guess you could always root for the Chicago White Sox, lol.
SharksFan91
@martras
I’m betting several current MLB teams would love to move to a similar market like Milwaukee or the city itself. With its current stadium, built-in support, and history of home attendance numbers.
BaseballisLife
Cubs are closer to Milwaukee.
BaseballisLife
Exactly and the Republicans are blocking the effort to honor the commitment the state made to the team as part of the lease.
It doesn’t matter which party is blocking the effort to honor that commitment. In this case it just happens to be the Republicans.
martras
@SharksFan91 – You’d be losing that bet.
Brew88
Iowa needs a team
martras
They can barely support the Cedar Rapids Kernels. Triple Des Moines’ population and you’d they’d have some pull.
Brew88
if you built it they will come
BlueSkies_LA
Don’t get all corny on us.
JimOToole
The Triple-A Iowa Cubs are perfect for Des Moines. They recently gained a geographical rival when St. Paul received the Twins’ Triple-A team. It would help the Brewers’ situation if owner Mark Attanasio made plans to move his Triple-A team from Nashville to Madison. He could enlist his favorite stadium partner, Madison-based American Family Insurance, to build a ballpark in Wisconsin’s fastest-growing city, with its metro population of over 600,000.
Allen Adams
Oakland anyone?
mgomrjsurf
New Orleans? Sacramento? New Jersey? Memphis! OKC? Buffalo? Brooklyn? Columbus? Indiana? San Antonio? Dallas? Jacksonville? San Jose?
RunDMC
Don’t get why some keep suggesting FL, as if their already 2 proud franchises continue to play in front of ghosts like a Field of Dreams roadshow. And then there’s ole DeSantis trying his hardest to fit in with anyone that’ll take him.
Nashville, Charlotte, Portland all seem to be obvious choices, though I’d love to see another team in Brooklyn. They’d have to fight tooth-and-nail against dividing the #1 market, which won’t happen. I’d see Manfred consider Mexico City before Brooklyn, making Coors Field look like Forbes Field from the high-elevation. Imagine the uphill climb of luring free agents.
martras
Plenty of cities out there who’d want an MLB franchise and be able to support it. I’m a little surprised Oklahoma City rarely comes up in these conversations. They have a size for it.
DarkSide830
OKC is a great idea. After Nashville and Vegas I’d say they should be on the shortlist.
ChuckyNJ
To the majority of the US population, the Dodgers have always been in Los Angeles. The only people who can’t understand are retro freaks and New York-area tabloids.
martras
@DarkSide830 – Well Vegas is pretty well locked up at this point…
deepseamonster32
OKC is extremely small for baseball. And as a Sonics fan, I must point out that their only major franchise finished LAST in NBA attendance last season. bunch of bums
A'sfaninLondonUK
@RunDMC
Watched the Red Devils (Khris Davis was there at the time) in Mexico City last year in May. So hot that they didn’t sell bleacher seats. Great atmosphere, great fun but maybe 5,000 fans for a weekend day game. Even Manfred wouldn’t be mad enough to land MLB in Mexico…
RunDMC
Thank goodness. Just leave ’em with a random series with Cali teams to whet the appetite.
martras
@deepseamonster32 – OKC population = 687k, though the metro is pretty small at 1.4MM. Looking into the population density, you probably have a point. It’s weak.
Compare it with Kansas City (MCI), Milwaukee, and Minneapolis/St. Paul
City Population
OKC – 687k (620 sq/mi)
MCI – 509k (319 sq/mi)
MKE – 577k (97 sq/mi)
MSP – 732k (425k Minneapolis 57sq/mi, 307k 56sq/mi)
City Density
OKC – 1,123 per sq/mi (2,329 per sq/mi urban area)
MCI – 1,614 per sq/mi (2,345 per sq/mi urban area)
MKE – 6,001 per sq/mi
MSP – 7,161 per sq/mi combined
Metro Population
OKC – 1.4MM
MCI – 2.3 MM
MKE – 1.6MM
MSP – 3.9MM
Oklahoma City follows the pattern of western US cities with a huge land area and small population density despite impressive overall population numbers. Milwaukee’s pure population may be lower, but that’s only because the city itself is 6x smaller geographically. It’d be really tough for OKC to support a MLB team with those numbers. Even Kansas City has a substantially higher population density around the city itself and a dramatically higher population in the metro. Oklahoma City would also have to compete against the Texas Rangers, St. Louis Cardinals and even pull audience from the already tiny Kansas City Royals market.
This one belongs to the Reds
Do you know the way to San Jose?
Cleon Jones
Fargo ND needs some love, or Cheyenne Wy.They made a good movie about Fargo 20 years ago, what else is needed?
RunDMC
@Cleon Jones – As much as I’d love to buy a Fargo Yahs MLB hat — I’d think a city ranked 190th in metro population in the country probably isn’t banging on Manfred’s door until the league expanded to 100 teams. But, oh man, the marketing possibilities for that.
Cleon Jones
The Yah’s have it!
monroe_says
Great idea. Let’s conflate idiots on twitter with politicians who actually have power over of our lives.
deepseamonster32
Bring back the Pilots!!
Jack Buckley
Let’s hope the Brewers don’t move, always a fun team to watch and Craig Council is awesome
JimOToole
There is a potential bigger picture solution. The state, city, county and team need to come up with a master plan to develop some of the vast expanse of asphalt parking lots that surround the stadium. The stadium property sits squarely in the hub of activity in Milwaukee County; it’s surrounded by State Fair Park, Marquette University, downtown Milwaukee, a casino, the Harley-Davidson museum and the Summerfest grounds. A hotel/entertainment complex would fill a huge need for guest beds while leaving room for parking ramps and a tailgating lot. The suburb of Brookfield, with a 13.5 percent bed tax and more than a dozen motels, has been living off the lack of beds in Milwaukee County for decades.
leftykoufax
After all of the changes in MLB the last 20 years, heck who cares about tradition and the integrity of the game, let em become the Portland Brewers.
deepseamonster32
Portland Microbrewers
BlueSkies_LA
Excellent.
Cleon Jones
Portland Portlandians. Hot dogs and magic mushroom vendors walking the aisles. I might give that a try …..
the old ranger
Portland Putzes
BlueSkies_LA
🙁
goob
Dallas Dingdongs
Cleon Jones
Dallas Dildos…make for popular bobblehead nights.
Jesse Chavez enthusiast
Leave Milwaukee a 2nd time? smh
deepseamonster32
3rd time!
goob
Who else left, besides the Braves?
deepseamonster32
Milwaukee Brewers moved to St Louis to become the Browns in 1902.
Bonus fact: Both current Baltimore pro franchises were named Browns before moving to Baltimore.
goob
Thank you, deep. Love that bonus fact, what a strange coincidence.
BaseballisLife
John Fisher has been unable to get financing to fund building a ballpark in Las Vegas. They also have not yet applied to MLB to move.
In fact, when fires broke out at a steel facility in Oakland the A’s sued and Dave Kaval mentioned the possibility of moving to a site in the Oakland area that the team had already pulled out of negotiations for.
For some reason I don’t think that situation is quite as set in stone as people think it is.
goob
You’re right, it’s not set in stone. But to continue the metaphor, the concrete has been poured. I think the odds of it falling through at this point are very slim. Unfortunately.
BaseballisLife
Until Fisher gets a loan and one from a bank rated better than a BBB+, the concrete has not even been ordered let alone delivered and poured.
Considering he has only $340 million in assets outside of the A’s and Earthquakes and all of that is GAP stock that cannot be used as collateral for an equity loan without losing a controlling interest in GAP, getting a loan is not assured.
Because of what he has done to that franchise I would be happy to see him fail to get this move accomplished.
goob
Amen to that. It just looks to my eye like the fix is in – like the rest of the league is determined to help him get there (for whatever benighted reasons they harbor) – one way or another. I appreciate your detailed knowledge on the matter – it gives me a glimmer of hope that Fisher could yet be foiled. I’ll note though, that It’s difficult to imagine that the financial issues you’ve specified weren’t already anticipated and addressed, before things got as far along as they have.
deepseamonster32
Nashville seems determined on an expansion franchise. Charlotte, Portland, Salt Lake City are the next 3. Montreal is probably more fantasy. Then, what, San Antonio? Vancouver? Sacramento? Northern New Jersey?
Stop Giving Billionaires Money
I think you nailed it on the head. Probably replace New Jersey with Montreal as last on the list. My preference would be Honolulu.
stymeedone
Yes, I am sure tourists going to Honolulu will be planning time at the ballpark. There’s really nothing else to do there. Always felt the concessions was lacking a SPAM dog.
ChuckyNJ
The last time New Jersey had a referendum for a taxpayer-funded baseball park was 1987. That referendum went down in flames — and the opposition was greater the further away you got from the Meadowlands.
This one belongs to the Reds
I think expansion is a fantasy until there are some long needed changes.
Cleon Jones
Dont forget Butte Mt. Competition for Rockies.
soxfan4381
I think it’s ridiculous that all these franchises want taxpayer money to build or repair stadiums. This isn’t just a baseball thing either, the NFL that makes more money than all the other sports does the same thing. I love baseball but I have no interest in giving money to the NFL, MLB or NBA when they gross billions. The owners should agree to set aside revenue from the total pot that can go towards building or repairing stadiums.
RunDMC
Yes, but they want it because they routinely get it. You’ve got politicians that want the feather in the cap that luring a team to their district represents, not unlike the recent example of Cobb Co. pushing through the Braves move from metro-ATL in the middle of the night (via Tim Lee) that many complained lacked transparency, which Lee even apologized for before his death. However, he was confident it would soon pay-off…as it has considering The Battery has become the blueprint for all MLB teams to follow to substantial profitability, at the expense of Cobb Co taxpayers.- the 5th wealthiest GA county per ’22 Median Home Value & Wealth Index (Fulton is the wealthiest, the county the Braves left). It’s almost that this positive outlook almost seems to justify the shadiness with which it was conceived.
aragon
Your retirement benefits were created by the great Democrats.
TheMan 3
as was Social Security and Unemployment Benefits
Unions helped to create the middle class after WWII
This one belongs to the Reds
But Congress of both parties allowed once federally protected pensions to be taken away.
lesterdnightfly
Come back to Montreal !!! Payback for Bud Selig stealing the great ’94 Expos team away through his self-interest and tonedeaf mismanagement.
Stop Giving Billionaires Money
Rob Manfred: “Hey Milwaukee, nice baseball team you have there, be a real shame if something bad happened to it”
This commish and these sleazy owners are like gangsters from bad movies. They’re just shaking down tax payers for more money.
Cleon Jones
Free market economics at its best…..legalized extortion.
BigGiantHead
Salt Lake City; Oklahoma City, Columbus
norcalguardiansfan
Columbus wouldn’t be a great place for an MLB team. It would be sandwiched between four other franchises (Detroit, Cincinnati, Cleveland and Pittsburgh) and the Columbus market is already depended upon for fans by both Cleveland and Cincinnati.
St. Lake and Oklahoma City aren’t big enough to support more than one major league franchise..
BaseballisLife
The Salt Lake area is a much larger media market than Las Vegas.
tangerinepony
Very laughable to think of Portland with an MLB team. If the brewers were to leave which is 50/50 after 2030 it be between Nashville and Charlotte
BaseballisLife
So laughable to see the 22nd largest market in the US get a team.
Charlotte is the 21st largest. Nashville is 27th. About the same size as Salt Lake City.
suntv
Portland – to close to Seattle. Salt Lake – the A’s/ Rox/ Zona are within a 5 hour drive. Charlotte & Nashville – to close to Hotlanta. Montreal- already proven failure.
mgomrjsurf
Same with San Jose,Orlando but has a Stadium in place that’s just used for Sp4ing Training/lots of Theme Parks ,Dallas to close to other cities.
Madison already has a a Baseball Team in Midwest League.
Brew88
Phoenix to SL City in 5 hours? 12 hours car, 5 hours perhaps in a Tubman 601
suntv
I’ve done it in 5 hours. granted, my brakes didn’t work the whole drive…..
BaseballisLife
You didn’t stop for gas and averaged 130 mph. Lololol.
suntv
Electric car – got hit by lightning so it kept us charged all the way
suntv
Mil-WALK-ee
norcalguardiansfan
I’m always surprised that San Antonio or Austin are not mentioned as a possible site for an MLB team. Growing markets of substantial size. Lots of money. They have supported baseball in the past. A business oriented tax structure. The stadium would probably have to be covered, so there is that….but those two are WAY better than Vegas or Portland for a team. And they only have one current major team – the Spurs. (although the Longhorns behave like a major league team.)
Foxtrot Unicorn Charlie Kilo
Two teams already. Houston and Arlington.
There’s other untapped markets for mlb- Oklahoma. North Carolina. Alabama. Nebraska.
norcalguardiansfan
There are about five million people combined between San Antonio and Austin. They are three and four hours from Houston and Dallas, respectively.
They only have one major sports team plus the university. It is silly to start any place else. That market blows those others out of the water.
Plus, North Carolina already has several sports teams, so it isn’t untapped. Oklahoma doesn’t have the population to support two teams. Alabama and Nebraska? Are you kidding me? Omaha? Birmingham? Nothing wrong with those cities but they aren’t near big enough. Baseball already has a small market problem.
Foxtrot Unicorn Charlie Kilo
San Antonio has 1.5 mill. Austin has 1 million. Idk how you got 5 million between those two cities. Maybe half of 5 mill which is 2.5 mill.
San Antonio has the Spurs
Dallas has the Cowboys
Houston has the Texans and Rockets and Astros
Arlington has the Rangers
Not to mention hockey teams which already is in austin
The state of Texas has plenty of professional sports teams already taking up space and money. Putting another baseball team which is less popular than NFL and NBA doesn’t make much sense. Youre assuming the market would support such a move. It wouldn’t. Texas has 8 professional sports teams. Adding another doesn’t make sense.
Best option would be look at states that have 1 or fewer professional sports teams. Or even 2 or less. Anything more than 7 isn’t the wisest decision cause then at best you split money taking it from other teams already in the state. Mlb won’t beat NFL and NBA and if you’re hoping placing a new team will attract fans away from the Rangers and Astros which people in austin and San Antonio already are isn’t smart to hope ppl will support the team and abandon teams they’ve rooted for who knows how long..
Foxtrot Unicorn Charlie Kilo
Sorry 10 professional sports teams. FC Dallas and Houston Dynamo are part of the MLS.
So that’s the
Texans and Cowboys in NFL
Mavericks Rockets Spurs in NBA
Rangers and Astros in MLB
Stars in NHL
Fc Dallas and Dynamo in MLS
And that doesn’t include minor league teams the state has for the MLB NHL and NBA.
Texas doesn’t make much sense.
norcalguardiansfan
There is a difference between city population and metro population. The metro population of the two cities combined (not that they are one market – they are not ) is about 5 million.
It doesn’t matter how many teams Texas has. Texas is so big that it can hold five million people who are underserved by professional sports even though the eastern part of the state has a bunch of teams.
The point is that people in the San Antonio/Austin area have to drive three hours at a minimum to see Major League Baseball. And there are a crap load of them.
Portland, Las Vegas, Charlotte, and Nashville in addition to the more off the wall suggestions on this thread have nowhere near as many underserved fans. Montreal is the one exception and it remains to be seen that Montreal is willing to support a MLB franchise.
San Antonio /Austin should be number one on MLB’s expansion list.
Foxtrot Unicorn Charlie Kilo
It does matter. Because there’s only so much $$$ to go around in Texas. You can’t change that.
You’re banking on mlb fans abandoning their current teams and supporting a new franchise that will rival their current teams. You’re also asking fans to spend more money than they already do on other sports teams to now spend on going to a new team that isn’t as good as the Astros and Rangers are currently and for the foreseeable future. I’m assuming fans don’t attend Rangers and Astros games currently but do attend other sports leagues to some degree.
There’s plenty of other untapped markets that don’t have the problems Texas does.
Too many sports teams
Too many minor league teams
Fans already having established connections.
Competing against successful mlb franchises currently.
Utah- 0 baseball connections
Nevada- 0 baseball connections
North Carolina- 0 baseball connections
Indiana- 0 baseball connections
Tennessee- 0 baseball connections
Oklahoma – 0 baseball connections
Kentucky- 0 teams
New Mexico- 0 teams
Louisiana – 0 mlb connections
norcalguardiansfan
Ok, I’m going to give this one more shot….
It doesn’t matter how many baseball franchises are in a state. What matters is how many people are in an area who want to watch baseball. California has, currently, five baseball teams because it is the most populous state in the country and people will pay for baseball.
The total number of professional franchises in a given area is very important too. They are competitive with one another for the dollars in a market. San Diego has only one major league sports team. That is why the Padres can behave like a major market team. They have the complete attention of almost all of the sports fans in their town.
Of course, the ferocity of a fanbase’s loyalty to a team is critical, too. That is why it doesn’t make sense to try to put another team in New York despite the fact that they city could support another team. (Leaving aside the reality that the NYC teams could block a new team). Yankee and Mets fans simply won’t defect.
Here are the metro market populations of the places you and others have mentioned plus San Antonio and Austin:
San Antonio 2.6 million – 1 sports franchise
Austin 2.4 – U of T
Charlotte 2.66 – 2 teams plus lots o’ NASCAR
Las Vegas 2.9 – 2 teams plus one on the way
St. Lake City 1.3 – 1 team
Birmingham 1.1 – U of Ala (not located there, but those people are nuts for the Tide)
Oklahoma City 1.4 – 1 team
Indianapolis 2.1 – 2 teams
New Orleans. 1.2 – 2 teams
Louisville 1.3 – 0 teams
Albuquerque .92 – 0 teams
Forgetting that people travel between San Antonio and Austin for the moment, those two cities are still the most underserved sports towns on this list.
I know those two cities aren’t one market – they are about an hour apart – but people in Austin do go to Spurs games. People in SA go to Longhorns games. The total potential fan base for a team in one of those cities is about 5 million people. As I said before, no other potential MLB market can touch that other than Montreal. It is an obvious place to put a team.
There is way, way more potential fan money in that area than any other area in the country.
Finally, it is silly to suggest that people in the SA/Austin area go to Dallas and Houston for games. I’m sure it happens, but that is a seriously long drive. It would be like saying, “why should we put a team in Charlotte? They can go to Atlanta.” Sure, that is doable, but fans will be much more interested in a local team and will pay for it.
There is no comparison. San Antonio and Austin are the best place to put a new MLB franchise.
And by the way, the A’s are nuts to move to Las Vegas. There is way too much competition for their potential fan’s’ entertainment dollars.
BaseballisLife
Portland, Charlotte, and Nashville are all bigger markets than either San Antonio or Austin.
Trying to combine them into one market is like trying to combine San Diego and Anaheim into one market. Or Sacramento and Oakland.
They are distinctly different markets.
BaseballisLife
New Mexico has the Albuquerque Isotopes, a AAA team. They play at a higher altitude than the Rockies. Probably not a good place for a MLB team.
North Carolina has minor league teams everywhere you go.
BaseballisLife
You do realize that population makes only a small difference to MLB in choosing where teams play, right?
Its all about media market size. You want a list based on media market size? Google Nielsen DMA ranking.
norcalguardiansfan
I live in Sacramento and I can tell you that many people drive to the Bay Area to to go games. It is silly to think that a team in one of those cities wouldn’t draw from the other. (I said several times that they aren’t one market).
If you think people don’t travel between markets to go to games, ask people in Cleveland or Cincinnati if they would go to a Buckeyes game.
Also, people in both markets will watch the games. That is a huge deal.
Finally, the markets you mentioned are larger, but not by much. Add the additional population in that part of Texas and it is clear that one of those cities would be a much preferable place to put a team.
norcalguardiansfan
Actually, this helps my point. People in both cities would certainly watch the games. Many people in Sacramento, where I live, certainly watch Giants and A’s games (or they used to when the team wasn’t shi@@ing on the fan base).
TV viewership makes a San Antonio/Austin team a stronger franchise.
BaseballisLife
Charlotte and Portland are subsantially larger media markets than either San Antonio or Austin.
If you want to include all population within 90 miles of either of those cities the difference in size is even bigger.
Sorry, neither San Antonio or Austin are even in the running for a team.
Foxtrot Unicorn Charlie Kilo
Introducing the Oklahoma City Lightning.
jonzin07
No way Portland
Brew88
The Portland Imperial Plate Appearances
StreakingBlue
Portland Rebels
BaseballisLife
Portland Rosebuds. It is the Rose City after all.
Just kidding. When they get their team I would guess they would return the Beavers name since the group looking to bring a team there bought the name.
DarkSide830
Y’all commenting really make everything politcial…
cubfanforever
Brewers are not leaving Milwaukee.
End of story.
stymeedone
(We all know that but gotta build the narrative.)
Tdat1979
MLB needs to contract not expand.
This one belongs to the Reds
When teams start going under, the MLBPA will be the first ones crying.
gotigers68
Brooklyn
Say Hey Now Kid
I wish the writer would leave parties out of this. Just tell us what each branch is doing and if we want to know parties, we can look it up.
Historically, state legislatures don’t want to put money toward cities because most of the representatives are from rural areas. That’s been the case no matter which party is in control. I don’t even think it’s gerrymandering, I think it’s just geography.
BaseballisLife
The parties are relevant.
marcfrombrooklyn
Politics is always relevant to these discussions. It explains the dynamics the decision-making. It is partisan only to the extent that there is a partisan split, but it is always political. We’re going through it here in NY with the renewal of MSG’s lease with the city, a deal in which they pay no real estate taxes. Here’s it’s Dems on both sides of the issue, liberals vs. corporate Dems/Dems who get a lot of Dolan money.. Republicans are split as well between libertarian-leaning Rs and corporate Rs. Look at how much money the Dolans have been spending on this. They have a sweetheart deal, like most stadium and arena deals, and they don’t want to lose it.
BlueSkies_LA
The relevance of politics in this and practically everything these days is it allows people choose sides and decide who is right or wrong without having to think or know anything.
Franklin Souze
Let the degenerate gambling & gaming interests & maybe a nice chunk of support from the Saudis & the Private Equity rapers & pillagers AND the mass Media conglomerates carry the load. – Those entities will own and or control most pro & .college sports in five years anyway.
nosake
Too bad for Milwaukee. Hope they can make it work.
Macbeth
As a Milwaukee native who has moved on to a new city this would be awful for the city.
Separately if MLB wanted a team to move to a city it should be Nashville.
Edp007
Mexico City Tacos
stymeedone
@TOBTTReds
Agree with you there! If none of the above wins, both parties have to provide new candidates.
thejd44
Every time someone uses a quote from Rob Manfred about the A’s it’s journalistic malpractice to not point out that he’s completely lying. He never says a truthful word about that situation.
DanUgglasRing
They should never have let Fisher have his way with Vegas now we will see 20 owners holding taxpayers for ransom over the next five years. The product of Major League Baseball is incredible but the entity that is MLB is a parasite. Owners shouldn’t own teams on an investment basis, teams should be owned by those who intend to win baseball games IN THE CITY THE TEAM BELONGS TO and if that’s too much to ask maybe teams and owners should be forced to pay the same taxes as the rest of us.
PieroBr
How about Montreal as a potential destination? They at least deserve consideration and perhaps for an expansion franchise.
desertdawg
I know that the D’Backs have been looking into either putting millions into remodeling Chase Field or getting a new ballpark.
Slider_withcheese
Stay in Milwaukee and name the new place the Dahmer Dome. See if I care.
Cards78
Portland always makes me laugh. I do like Montreal though as a MLB city. That would be great.
BaseballisLife
Portland is a larger media market and has both a site secured and funding in hand to build a privately financed ballpark.
Quebec has been clear that no public funding will be spent on a new ballpark, even for infrastructure. They do have a site that Devemco owns that could be used for a ballpark if they can come up with private funding.
The biggest issue is that Montreal was never able to draw fans.
swissvale
Sad how some of you have such sad lives you have to leave over a dozen political comments on a baseball story – and you seem to have to comment on every single story on this site.
Then you’ll be the first to complain when MLTR stops allowing comments because it’s too much of a hassle.
its_happening
Public tax dollars. All for the good of keeping the team in Milwaukee or to receive large donations from Brewers ownership for the next election plus diehard sports fans supporting at the voting booth. No matter the position on the political spectrum it’s a loss for the taxpayer.
Karlander
The worst part was the underhanded and non transparent negotiations between the governors office and the Brewers on the huge amount of money to be provided/budgeted. The proposed deal was not covered in any public discussions or debates. The process was likely supported by lobbyists. Some claimed that members of the SWPBD were even kept in the dark over the negotiations and two members resigned since these events unfolded.
stymeedone
Too many things are classified as “mental illness.”. Not all of it is.
SharksFan91
As a lifelong Milwaukee Brewers fan, the question of moving the team is about two things. 1. Extortion 2. GREED!
Let’s add some facts here. The cost for a fan to attend a game at Miller Park is ranked 14th highest in MLB. The 2023 team payroll is the 20th highest (typically 14-18th) in MLB. The Miller Park (I refuse to call it the new name!) home attendance last year ranked 14th in MLB. Which is the typical ranking for the team. In 2021, home attendance was 10th in MLB! In 2019 home attendance was 7th with nearly 3 million butts in the seats. The team has had ONE WS appearance and only eight (yes, 8!!) playoff appearances in 50+ years. The team plays in a beautiful 22 year old stadium with a retractable roof. There are no longer any rain outs or snow games. Frankly, this team (and manager) are quite often lucky it’s in the NL Central Division. In other words, fans still support this typically mediocre team.
Yet, this team (owner) ALSO receives millions in welfare each season from the MLB “big market” teams.
So, only a fool would side with the owner(s) and blame the city, county, or state if the Brewer ownership was that greedy and stupid to leave Milwaukee.
I, like many others, am sick of this so-called “small market Milwaukee” charade! And yes, replacing the summer college team in Madison (The Mallards, typically 1st in home attendance by a wide margin) with a Brewer affiliate would be a great idea!
SharksFan91
MLB, NHL, NBA team owners and their ilk. The very same % of the population that is currently destroying college football and many other sports for the majority of the population.
Ezpkns34
From a sports fan, STOP giving teams hundreds of millions of dollars. Want to know why the team values Never decrease? Will give you half a billion guesses
Buuba ho tep
The brewers aren’t moving anywhere
Earl Hickey
The Brewers should move to Vancouver , British Columbia. Canada needs a second MLB Team
Ga
More free cash for a handful of rich guys. Why do taxpayers continue to allow this system of welfare for the rich? Pay another 500 mil to benefit a rich guy and still get blackmailed with threats of moving a team somewhere else? A never-ending cycle. If taxpayers are paying millions and even billions for stadiums and infrastructure for those stadiums (which includes free land for development, taking of private housing as occurred with Bush’s Rangers), why don’t the taxpayers OWN the whole team? Packers and countless soccer teams are taxpayer owned. No AH middlemen. O’s used to be owned by fans/taxpayers. If we are going to have socialism let’s have it for the fans/taxpayers and not a few of the worst humans on the planet.
Lanidrac
Why the heck is it up to the government in either Oakland or Milwaukee to fund stadium maintenance?! That’s the responsibility of the ownership, not taxpayer dollars! A new stadium is one thing, but unlike the A’s, the Brewers don’t need one yet
Ultimately, it was Fisher’s fault that the Oakland Colosseum became a dump, and as you stated in the very second paragraph, the SWBPD ownership is required to provide and pay for maintenance, not the City of Milwaukee! Good for the lawmakers to stand up this attempted fraud. If the SWBPD won’t follow through on their contract, someone needs to sue them!
BlueSkies_LA
Because both are publicly owned.
Lanidrac
You may be right about the SWBPD, as I don’t know what that is, but Fisher is a private businessman. It was his job to maintain the Colosseum, and he failed miserably.
BlueSkies_LA
It seems to be a special district. The Oakland Colosseum was jointly owned by the city and the county. Makes them the landlords. But as I said, the Colosseum’s defects as a place to play and watch baseball can’t be corrected with maintenance.
BaseballisLife
SWBPD is a GOVERNMENT AGENCY. The state of Wisconsin built the ballpark and agreed to guarantee the conditions of the lease the Brewers have been paying on before the stadium was transferred to SWBPD to ADMINISTER. It doesn’t belong to SWBPD because SWBPD is not a private business, its a government agency. If SWBPD cannot pay for upgrades and maintenence because the state negotiated a bad lease and the sales tax that paid the costs expired 3 years ago the legal requirement is for the state of Wisconsin to pay for those required upgrades and maintenance. That is what is in the contract, the lease, that the state of Wisconsin signed with the Brewers. I don’t understand why that is so hard for you to understand.
Karlander
You are wrong. The stadium is essentially and legally is owned by the SWBPD and, by relation, the State of Wisconsin.
BaseballisLife
SWBPD is a government agency.
Read. The. Lease.
Then go read the articles about it when it was built and the interviews with Gov. Tommy Thompson
Karlander
I have read it several times as well as have spoken to individuals who belong to the SWBPD. The SWBPD is the primary owner with the Brewers owning a minuscule stake. But the Brewers are not on the hook for renovations, repairs or improvements. The taxpayers are. The SWBPD was created by the State to be an ownership and management entity for the stadium and the budget moneys coming from the five county taxes and State allocated monies. By the way, considering their revenues, the Brewers pay a measley 1.2 million per year on the lease. About half the salary of one mediocre relief pitcher.
Bright Side
I’m opposed to taxpayer funding for sports stadiums.
Deadjoe
Going more international. I say Mexico city. They been trying for years and Latino players have been dominating why not bring it closer where they can enjoy and bring in more talent
ctbronx7
The race to Nashville is on!!
Who gets there first, Brewers, Orioles, Rays or Nationals?
And what becomes the next “hot location” after someone claims Nashville?
Karlander
Salt Lake City, Louisville, Charleston SC
BaseballisLife
If the A’s move, the Bay Area is at the top of the list.
Then Portland and Nashville.
Then likely Charlotte and Montreal.
Baltimore forfeits huge amounts of money if they move out of that market.
AlBundysFanClubPresident
Headline should read “Brewers using political scare tactics to out-politic the politicians into screwing taxpayers into footing the bill. Again.”
Citizen1
Any brewers fan in wi or Milwaukee who can provide insight? Doesn’t the city and state collect tax on ticket sales and employment revenue to provide the needed maintenance on the park and they are not doing the maintenance?
Pause the relocation arguments,
Karlander
The Brewers are owned by wealthy hedge fund managers that could finance upgrades to the stadium themselves. But why do so when you can stiff taxpayers ?
No one was expecting that the cost estimates for repairs would be half the cost of an entirely new ballpark. At the same time the Brewers owners whine every season they dont have the funds to sign any talented free agents. Many in the public in Wisconsin are fed up with their sense of entitlement when police, schools, homelessness, roads, job creation, are not properly funded in Southeastern Wisconsin.
And they are fed up members of government that worked behind the scenes in a non transparent manner to create a deal with the Brewers for the money. Until ofcourse the public got wind of it.
So now it’s the same old story. Another professional sports franchise trying to hold taxpayers hostage to get their big payout.
Karlander
There was a five county tax in Southeastern Wisconsin that lasted for 20 years and expired in 2020. It paid for most of the original construction and most of the repairs over that period. However the original contracts called for these taxes to expire after 20 years at which point the taxpayers would still be on the hook but through the State level controling agency, the SWBPD
Jason G
This is such garbage. Milwaukee is a great baseball town and thinking you’re going to do better elsewhere is idiotic. Manfred is such a joke.
Bauer? But I Hardly Know Her!
Ah, yes, the Salt Lake City Brewers. Makes sense.