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« More Prior Details | Main | Mets Still Like Jon Lieber »
Darin Erstad Signs With Astros
Minor signing tonight, as the Astros inked Darin Erstad to a one-year deal. It's a one-year, $1MM deal plus incentives.
Erstad has become a popular stathead target but as long as the Astros don't give him hundreds of at-bats, does it really matter?
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Michael Bourn to Washington for Paul Lo Duca.
Posted by: scootie puff jr. | December 28, 2007 at 12:13 AM
What the hell...?
Posted by: jatorres | December 28, 2007 at 12:32 AM
The Nats need outfielders, the Astros need aging former allstars that were good like 5 years ago. Its a perfect match.
Posted by: scootie puff jr. | December 28, 2007 at 12:42 AM
Erstad isn't even worth a roster spot. The Astros probably would've been better off reaching into a hat of promising Rule 5 names and drawing one out at random with the roster spot than signing Erstad.
Posted by: DentalPlan | December 28, 2007 at 05:28 AM
Now the White Sox will have to trade for him ; )
Posted by: ballyb11 | December 28, 2007 at 08:18 AM
Erstad likely replaces Orlando Palmeiro's LH pinch hit role off the bench. With age, Palmeiro had become dreadful. Erstad will be an improvement, and is a more versatile defensive replacement than Palmeiro. As long as the Astros keep Erstad from facing left handed pitchers, he will be OK.
Posted by: CJ | December 28, 2007 at 08:31 AM
Erstad is certainly worth a roster spot.... particularly at that price. He's a Gold-Glove OF and 1B, and while he's had trouble staying healthy and on the field, he's a nice piece for a team learning how to win. There is value in having a team leader from a former World Series winner around the clubhouse.
Posted by: DrewB | December 28, 2007 at 09:57 AM
Erstad's splits vs. righties over the last 3 years are pretty good and Cruz Jr.'s splits vs. lefties over the last 3 years are pretty good. They should make a relatively cheap and productive combo for 4th/5th OF that can put together a reasonably product platoon if Pence, Lee, or Bourn are injured.
Cheap, decent signing. Better bet to help the Astros than Abercrombie.
Posted by: mymrbig | December 28, 2007 at 10:23 AM
He is definately a target of the statheads, but then again, that is what happens when your OPS over the last 3 seasons is .675.... Yes, you read that correctly, .675!
But that isn't even my biggest problem with him; my biggest problem is the fact that he gets praised for being gritty and gutty and a "football player playing baseball". He was a PUNTER at Nebraska. A PUNTER!!!
Posted by: DonCoburleone | December 28, 2007 at 10:31 AM
Once again, my hometown team gets bashed for making a move. Better than staying pat with the current underachieving losers they have.
Posted by: ciscoinHOUSTON | December 28, 2007 at 10:43 AM
Your problem with Erstad is the praise others have heaped on him? And that's his fault because.....?
His history as a punter not withstanding, Erstad plays a gritty & gutty brand of baseball... often to his own detriment. His propensity to sacrifice his own body and dive for balls in the outfield contributed to his many trips on the DL, and excellerated the decline of his career.
When the Angels moved him to 1B to try to keep him from hurting himself, he responded with a Gold Glove... becoming the only player in the history of the game to win a GG in the Outfield and the Infield.
Erstad is a winner, and at $1m, he's a good addition to an underachieving team that could use a kick in the butt.
Posted by: DrewB | December 28, 2007 at 10:54 AM
I can't believe that this is getting that much attention. If he is there just to pitch hit, basically taking Orlando Palmeiro's place, then this is not a bad signing. He's clearly an upgrade over Palmeiro. O hit .235 against righties last season. Erstad hit .283....
I can't see what the big deal is. No one's expecting Erstad to do anything major.
Posted by: Darin | December 28, 2007 at 10:57 AM
Why do you hate the Astros so much? I read your comments everyday, and you are most negative to the astros. Give some credit, who has a better lineup in the NL central. And dont say the cubs!
Posted by: The one and only | December 28, 2007 at 01:32 PM
The Brewers have a better lineup than the Astros anchored around Fielder, Braun, and an underrated Hart. The Cubs and Reds may have better lineups as well. SS, and 1B on the Reds, is the only spot the Astros have a definite advantage on those two teams. And all three of them have better pitching staffs.
The Erstad signing isn't awful if he's kept as a bench player, but if they stretch him out for more they're going to be disappointed. If he can even stay healthy, that is.
Posted by: RobertR | December 28, 2007 at 03:05 PM
They should have Wandy Rodriguez pinch hit for him.
Posted by: plh903 | December 28, 2007 at 05:05 PM
It's awful because he's worse than replacement level at this point, and they just gave him a one year contract. It's fucking retarded.
Posted by: plh903 | December 28, 2007 at 06:37 PM
@ plh903
He's not the starting CF. If Bourn can't hack it, he might play a week or two, until they figure something else out. But I have a hard time thinking that he'll garner any legit playing time, so take a deep breath and put the gun down.
Plus, does anyone actually know what "replacement level" is for a PH / #5 OF ? I doubt plh903 actually does.
Posted by: Darin | December 28, 2007 at 08:28 PM
Erstad sucks. Gold Glove blah blah blah... yeah, it means as much as Bret Boone's does as this point. He isn't a winner anymore. He hasn't been good since 2000.
I like the argument he's better than Orlando Palmeiro, which just underscores how stupid it was to bother keeping that guy around.
Posted by: DentalPlan | December 28, 2007 at 09:15 PM
To the poster who said the Brewers have a better line up...so you're saying Fielder, Braun, and Hart are better than a Tejada, Bourne, Pence, Lee, Berkman lineup? I think our running game, versatility, and depth will prove to be something most teams cannot match up against.
Posted by: ciscoinHOUSTON | December 28, 2007 at 09:19 PM
Replacement level for a 5th outfielder? That's great.
Posted by: plh903 | December 28, 2007 at 09:38 PM
Braun and Fielder were over .100 points of OPS apiece ahead of the next best Astro. JJ Hardy will be closer to Tejada than that. And it was a team of 23 to 25 year olds outscoring the Astros by 78 runs. A full year of Braun, a healthy Weeks, and a bounceback from Hall, who has a pair of .800+ OPS seasons and it won't be close. Heck, it's not like they can't run either or they're one dimensional as Braun, Hart, and Weeks all have 20/20 potential.
Why don't we see if Bourn can actually cut it at the big leagues before he's even compared to good players. Same with Towles and Matsui outside of Colorado. The Astros have four rock solid sluggers (although 3 of them being in their 30s probably indicates the best is behind them), a thoroughly average third basemen in Wigginton, and some players with some question marks. They're in the NL central so the bar isn't that high, but good health and no disappointing offensive seasons is vital for them. Especially since they likely won't be able to make up for problems through trades during the season.
Posted by: RobertR | December 29, 2007 at 10:53 AM
Wow, I didn't realize the fans of other teams are so interested in how the Astros fill the 24th or 25th roster spot. All this babbling about "below replacement player"--who keeps replacment player metrics for the Lefthanded Pinch Hitter role? (And before you say, there shouldn't be such a role...every team has one.)
Erstad's .725 OPS and .341 OBP against RHP last year isn't bad for a bench player. I'll take that any day from the LH pinch hit specialist.
Posted by: CJ | December 30, 2007 at 12:53 PM
For what it's worth, no team in the NL central scored fewer runs than the astros in 2007.
Posted by: andromache | December 30, 2007 at 02:47 PM
Typical. The Astros do something minor; a small fill in the bench type acquistion, and we get some negative comments. No, there is no anti-Astro bias at all...please.
I think it's a good move. Lamb is gone, and Erstad could be a good sign to replace his presence as a pinch-hitter off the bench. It's a low base salary, too.
Posted by: aggieastro | December 30, 2007 at 05:52 PM
The signing is fine...not good, but fine. Please don't tout his outfield defense, that reputation was from when he could actually move...which he can't now.
And please, please don't say the astros went from worst to first offensively by getting Tejada and Bourne. Please don't. The Pirates scored more runs than them..yes, the pirates. They will probably be 4th in the central this year behind the Brewers, reds, and Cubs.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | December 31, 2007 at 10:02 AM
@Aduncaroo
Wow, the Pirates scored 1 whole run more than the Astros did last year...yes 1 run.
I'm not saying the Astros are the team to beat or that they have the best offense in the NL Central. But when they have been running Biggio, Ausmus, and Adam Everett out on a daily basis for the last 3 years, they should be expected to finish in the bottom half in runs scored. Throw in the mismanagement of having Ensberg and Lane play in 150 games combined last season, when there were much better options, and you can see where the whole 1 run you speak of is inconsequential.
The fact is the Astros have upgraded significantly at SS, 2b, 3b and catcher. They've added speed and will likely have 8 guys that are going to produce at least league average at each position, instead of only 5.
Posted by: Darin | December 31, 2007 at 11:01 AM
Matsui outside of Colorado has a good chance to be below average at 2B. His whole career is below average outside Colorado. Towles and Bourn have no guarantee of being even league average especially since rookies tend to go through periods of struggle. Wigginton is probably league average at best.
The Astros have improved their offense. But a lot of projecting the Astros as an elite offense is based on a truly optimistic scenario where nothing goes wrong. Go check the ZIPS projections at Baseball Think Factory and you'll basically find 5 Astros projected as league average or better. That's an unbiased and likely more realistic source.
What's more, Astros fans seem to think the other teams are sitting still. The Cubs added Fukudome. The Reds added Votto and Jay Bruce has a high upside and should at least replace the combined Hamilton/Hooper production. The Brewers get a full year of Braun, and their offensive core of 23 to 25 year olds should improve on a whole.
Posted by: RobertR | December 31, 2007 at 11:25 AM
@RobertR
Again, I'm not saying the Astros are the best offense in the NL Central.
But a few things, the ZIPS projection doesn't include Tejada and Matsui. I'm no Matsui fan, but he has a shot of being close to league average in that ballpark. I surely don't see him as an All Star candidate, but he's replacing an old slow Biggio, who dialed in a 71 OPS+ last season. Tejada should be good, not MVP worthy, but hopefully he'll have a decent rebound, and take advantage of having a better lineup around him.
Last if you are going to take away the lack of experience from Towles and Bourn, you'd have to at least give the same consideration to Votto and Bruce (though they are better hitters).
And there could be a learning curve for Fukedome. Hideki Matsui posted a 109 OPS+ his first season in the US, and then brought it up to the around the 130s the next 4 years.
Posted by: Darin | December 31, 2007 at 02:42 PM
Matsui's projection can be found at
http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/files/oracle/discussion/astros_signed_matsui/
He'll probably exceed that, but he has zero track record of hitting outside of Colorado. Park adjusted, he put up an 87 OPS+ last year which compares to an 82 OPS+ for his career. And he'll be 32 this year.
Tejada's projections are at http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/files/oracle/discussion/astros_acquired_tejada/
Those are good numbers and he'll probably exceed those coming to the NL. Still he's in his 30s and has been declining for awhile, so visions of 35 HRs from SS are probably just that.
Posted by: RobertR | December 31, 2007 at 03:48 PM
Darin,
No, you didn't say they would be the best, "theoneandonly" did.
The fact is that Matsui, Bourne, and Tejada might help, but they aren't going to make them the best in the Central. That mixed with what will probably be the worst rotation in the division is really going to hurt. I mean, Wandy is ok, but a #2? I think they will probably battle the Reds this year for 3rd, behind the Cubbies and Brewers. They are both more complete teams when looking at offense, defense, and pitching. Everybody has their weakness in the central though...so I'm not counting them out either.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | December 31, 2007 at 06:12 PM
All ya'll Astros haters need to get a life and realize we are the real deal! we have always competed constantly and had a bad year last year! Big deal Brewers have been in last place for as long as i can remember but ya give them the benefit of the doubt...that tells me how much ya know about baseball... quit the hating fools and realize we will tear some stuff up this year and you will see...the reason ya hate is because ya know we have good players and your team doesnt. The b/s stats ya come up with is all a bunch of bolony...once you play is a different ball game...everyone doubted the astros but yet we always make a push for the playoffs....if ya dont have anything good to say about the astros dont say anything at all...I respect all teams and players so please have the decency to give the astros some respect please! they are a team just like yours and everyone elses.... ssee ya in october@ peace out
Posted by: willy | December 31, 2007 at 10:50 PM
So I take it since you're relying on an argument based on team results from at least one ownership group and several management groups ago, you have no contemporary arguments.
The Brewers have issues, especially defensively, but there's really no reason not to expect a team that lead the league in home runs around a core of 23 - 25 year olds shouldn't have a formidible offense. The Astros, unless they do something about their starting rotation, needs to outscore the Cubs, Brewers, and Reds by a considerable margin to win the division. And even with their upgrades, there are no guarantees that they'll outscore any of those three, let alone by a large margin.
Posted by: RobertR | January 02, 2008 at 07:40 AM
The Astros surely have needs pitchingwise, but adding Darin Erstad to the bench doesn't nearly deserve the hate it received. I'm an Astros fan, but I don't think having Miguel Tejada is enough to compete.
Posted by: The Mitchell Report | January 05, 2008 at 02:52 PM