The Marlins’ rotation has a collection of young hurlers with plenty to like. It’s not a group chock full of certainty, but the unit performed reasonably last season and comes with varying degrees of future upside. Four of the team’s starters came up in trade rumors over the offseason, but the Fish elected to hold onto all of them.
Taking a look at the options on hand, a common thread emerges. Most of the Marlins’ hurlers were acquired via trade. Of the club’s projected rotation at Roster Resource, only José Ureña was signed as an amateur. To some extent, that’s expected for an organization that has spent a good portion of the past two decades selling off pieces for future assets. For the most part, though, the club’s starters came over as relatively unheralded trade pieces. Whether because of quality scouting, player development or a mere string of good luck, the Fish have turned a few under-the-radar prospects into decent MLB starters.
Staff leader Sandy Alcantara came over from the Cardinals in the Marcell Ozuna trade. He and Magneuris Sierra co-headlined that deal, but Alcantara’s early career results dwarf those of his outfield counterpart. The 24-year-old has a 3.83 ERA in 239.2 innings. His strikeout and walk numbers are unimpressive, but Alcantara has done well at avoiding hard contact. He’s miscast as a staff ace, but he alone would’ve been a solid return for two years of Ozuna (more on that in a bit).
Caleb Smith and Pablo López were further off the radar at the time of their respective acquisitions. Smith, a former fourteenth-round pick who never ranked among the Yankees’ top thirty prospects at Baseball America, was acquired alongside first baseman Garrett Cooper for pitching prospect Mike King and international bonus pool space in 2017. Smith had performed well in the high minors in the New York system, but it’s doubtful anyone would have foreseen him posting a 25.9% strikeout rate and 12.3% swinging strike rate in his first 249.1 MLB innings. Unlike Alcantara, Smith gives up a lot of authoritative contact, but his swing-and-miss stuff is no doubt intriguing.
López, meanwhile, was a low-level flier acquired from Seattle in 2017 as part of a package for David Phelps. Injuries limited Phelps to just ten appearances as a Mariner, while López looks to be a solid long-term rotation piece in Miami. He throws a ton of strikes, induces a fair amount of grounders, and ran a serviceable 20.3% strikeout rate last season.
Jordan Yamamoto was the fourth piece in the four-player package acquired from the Brewers for Christian Yelich. That deal turned sour quickly, but Yamamoto had a decent fifteen start cameo in 2019. His long-term future’s still up in the air, but he’s an interesting arm to have in the mix. Prospects Nick Neidert and Robert Dugger were acquired from the Mariners for Dee Gordon and are near-ready rotation depth pieces.
The best under-the-radar starter the Marlins have acquired in the last few years is the one they’ve since traded away. Zac Gallen was the third piece of the Ozuna package, but his stock has skyrocketed since. After combining for a 2.93 ERA in 245.1 Triple-A innings, Gallen had a strong seven start MLB debut in Miami. The Marlins flipped him to the D-Backs for shortstop prospect Jazz Chisholm, Baseball America’s #88 overall prospect, last July. However one feels about the Gallen-Chisholm swap, it’s clear the right-hander was a fantastic get as the tertiary piece from St. Louis.
It’s been less than smooth sailing for the Marlins in a number of ways in recent years. But the Miami organization has picked up a few notable starting pitchers from elsewhere along the way. Whether some or all of these young arms will form the core of the Marlins’ next contending club or themselves wind up on the move for future assets remains to be seen.
Gallen will be better than all of them
Are you Xabials burner?
Genuinely curious.
That’s a name is haven’t heard in a long time…
I’d forgotten about Xabial, wonder what happened to that guy
I don’t.
possibly the Rona?
Obi wan? Seriously though, I kinda miss him.
i have the app with notifications on. makes it easy to respond quickly.
His stuff is average and he doesn’t throw hard. He could have a great career and he was great last season. Smith got hurt and had a bad second half, if he can fix that he showed he is twice the pitcher Gallen is. Lopez also had a stretch where he was fantastic. Gallen is better than Yamamoto for sure. Sixto, Cabrera , Garret , Alcantara,Lopez, Smith, and Neidert all have the potential to be better than Gallen. And if Jazz can come up and do half of what he’s capable of then it’s a great trade. Personally I wish they found a way to keep him and give away something else for Jazz but oh well.
Nah, the Fish are on pace towards having the best rotation in baseball. 2022 World Series here we come
Yamamota is gonna have a long and productive career.
While I agree that Alcantara isn’t really an ace yet, I believe he’s close. Give him another full season and he’ll be scary good.
His advanced stats say absolutely otherwise.
Go to Fangraphs and read about him. They say he could very well be an ace. He can throw his fastball 6 different ways and gets great spin on breaking balls. He has talent he hasn’t tapped in to yet.
On the contrary, the advanced stats indicate that with some continued adjustment Alcantara will become a legit top of the rotation starter
advanced stats are like the “facts” that political figures like to use. they can be bent to prove any point one wants them to. but in seeing Alcantara’s playing i would certainly agree that he’s on track for stardom.
Should of kept gallen.
Imagine if marlins kept Paddack castillo Williams
Sadly some of these pitchers will be traded in next 3 years.
Or should’ve….pardon the grammar correction. Our world might be a little better if people stop using “of” incorrectly in place of a contraction for “have.”
Yeah. Correct grammar is gonna be the cure to the corona virus, end world hunger, stop wars, stop human trafficking, and create a utopian society.
I’m sure you can find better use of your time than typing out comments simply to address grammatical errors. Did using “of” instead of “have” make it unreadable? No? Cool.
Correct grammar has a couple places where it is expected, legal documents, research findings and articles, pretty much anything involving academia. Short hand (incorrect grammar) has places like texting, comment sections, social media posts, etc.
So space O F is shorthand for ‘ V E?
No? Cool.
He was just pointing out the fact that you aren’t bright. There’s no need to defend yourself with a three paragraph diatribe that has nothing to do with baseball.
what you have just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
Thanks guests.
FYI. Policing grammar has absolutely nothing to do with baseball.
But you knew that, decided to ignore that, and proceeded to post another useless comment.
Brittle spirit.
The worst is ‘I seen’
Our world might be a little better…….?……just get outta here
Our world would be better if JD Candello knew baseball.
There. Better?
Than grammar policing …..Yeah ill take that…at least its direct and gives a perspective
A light correction where the person even says ‘pardon the grammar correction’ is not ‘grammar policing’. Maybe if the people being corrected weren’t so sensitive about their mistakes, things would be a little easier.
There. Better?
That’s not a sentence smart one. Try again. A sentence needs to have a noun and verb. There, is that better? Would have been correct.
It’s funny when idiots try to call others dumb then post something showing their own incompetence. Nicely done guest, really demonstrating your mastery of the English language by not forming a proper sentence.
Please, teach us more.
‘Our world might be a little better”? GTFO talking about sensitive posters rct……. Does that really fit into “light correction” in your eyes?
Only thing sensitive in this thread was Paddys little quest to be completely irrelevant while lauding himself and Now you jumping in with your “feelings” about “feelings”
this block looks like a firecracker lighting itself up. lol poor imbecile dog
Brittle spirits.
I felt paddy corrected in the gentlest way possible but people get defensive when they feel their intelligence is threatened.
I feel that grammar correctors are being pedantic most of the time. “Should of” is not one of those times
@john, I know what you mean. That reminded me of that Demetri Martin joke about how correcting grammar was a very effective way to ensure women would not have sex with him in high school.
Get a life, dude.
Paddack and Castillo were traded by the last regime. Paddack had one good minor season before the trade. Castillo it seemed like they were trying so hard to trade for some reason. Either way, the new regime shouldn’t have to hear comments like this.
Just wait until Sixto Sanchez and Edward Cabrera come up
If in 3 years the Marlins have two all-stars named Sixto and Jazz, baseball will be doing well.
Jazz won’t be a allstar.
@MetsFan22 Man you’re really persistent on being bearish on the Marlins lmao
You may misunderstand the “if,then,” structure.
A potential rotation of Sanchez, Cabrera, Hancock/Lacy, Alcantara, and Yamamoto/Rogers/Garrett? Subscribed
I can see Cabrera being the closer. He is advancing in the minors but the secondary stuff is inconsistent. They tacked his FB to an 80. They say the very least he will be a dominant deliver. Sanchez will lead the pack with Alcantara. I believe in Braxton Garret ( who is throwing harder than before TJ and has a fantastic curve). Then behind those three you potentially have Cabrera, Rogers, Yamamoto, Neidert, Dugger, Smith, Lopez. It’s very promising. Honestly I have no idea who Hancock is.
Hancock/Lacy are the top pitching prospects in the Draft.
IMO Gallen will be a stud. Even if any of the above pan out, the Marlins being the Marlins will trade them as soon as they are contention. The only deal I remember that they got more then a bag of balls was Beckett for HanRam and even that is sort of a wash with Beckett winning a WS in Boston and HanRam going to LA for Evoladi who did nothing with them. Just a poorly run team no matter who is in charge. And this comes from a fan of the dumpster fire known as the NY Mets.
This is new ownership. The Marlins organization is not sentient. It is run by people, different people than were there when the deals you mentioned happened. Jeter and co have done pretty well so far, aside from the Yelich deal.
the organization represents the collective of it’s members. it may not be sentient but it represents several sentient individuals.
Yes, that is my point DarkSide. These sentient individuals are not the sentient individuals who did those deals. It is just a way to create a narrative. Why not bring up the 1919 White Sox when trying to make a point about how dishonest Lucas Giolito is? (that is a madeup example, I have no reason to believe Giolito is dishonest). It might make for interesting reading but the two have very little in common besides a common organization.
@johnrealtime, your use of sentient reminds me that sometimes a false dichotomy bears truth and seems unfortunately too true on the interwebs. One reads an article(or unfortunately for the reader-just the headline), and either has an quick, somewhat thoughtless retort or reflects a bit and replies with a nuanced observation. True Detective S1 summed that up perfectly….Marty Hart or Rust Cole?
Very true, though I like to think that MLBTR commentors are a bit better with that than most sports fans.
I haven’t seen True Detective so I don’t get the reference, unfortunately.
“It’s been less than smooth sailing for the Marlins in a number of ways in recent years.”
Harsh but fair.
I’ll say it’s before it’s said yes they won it all in 97 and 04. And the Mets haven’t won since 86. They lost 108 in 98 and we’re a game above .500 in 05.
And Loria completely won the battle of which owner is a shadier billionaire.
03, not 04. 2004 the Boston Red Sox won the World Series. But thanks.
I predict that three years from now people will be predicting the Marlins will be good in three years.
If you look only at Alcantara’s numbers, he might not look like an ace, but he will be. If you actually watch him pitch you see his stuff has the potential to be ace level. He throws hard and has a ton of movement.
Mets rotation is better
Waaay better.
Shampoo is better!
Yeah. Matz, Porcello and Wacha are crazy dangerous.
Ummm… For 3-4-5, they’re serviceable. If deGrom keeps being deGrom and Stroman plays at gold glove level while keeping the ball on the ground, they should be good.
Gold level?
Doesn’t the Mets infield defense stink? So keeping the ball on the ground might not be so helpful for Stroman after all. Porcello will give you innings, but also a 5.52 ERA. That’s a number for a very bad #5 starter. Wacha waited all off-season to be offered a contract. $3 million 1 year because the Mets were desperate is not what a quality starter gets. Mats gives you decent numbers, for a #5 starter, but the Mets have him at #3!!
Wacha signed in early December lol so I don’t really know what you’re talking about there and Matz has pitched to a 4.00 ERA in his career. It’s really semantics but he’s better than a number 5.
Matz last year: 4.21-ERA 1.34-WHIP 160.1-IP 153-K
Lucchesi last year: 4.18-ERA 1.22-WHIP 163.2-IP 158-K
Congratulations Mets! Your #3 starter is a little worse than the San Diego Padres #5 starter. Is that something to brag about?
Wacha got a $3 million, 1 year contract as a free agent. That is replacement player pay.
Damn it’s almost like losing your number two pitcher hurts your rotation. Who’d have thunk it? I agree their rotation isn’t good, you were just wrong in your other post on a couple of points.
The difference is that our 1-2 makes your 1-2 look like 5’s
And matz is our 4…. if Syndergaard isn’t hurt
The Mets #1 is the best pitcher in baseball without a doubt. The rest of the rotation is seriously lacking. Don’t blame me. Blame thorshair for comparing the Mets rotation to the Marlins.
Before you make bold statements you might want to look at the numbers.
Stroman(Mets #2): ERA-3.76 WHIP-1.29 BAA-.261
Davies(Padres #4): ERA-3.91 WHIP-1.30 BAA-.263
So the Mets #1 blows the Padres #1 away! Right. And the Mets #2 match up almost exactly….with the Padres #4. Which means the Padres #2 would absolutely blow the Mets #4 out of the water 11 times out of 10! Advantage-Padres.
Doesn’t look like your #2 makes our 1 and 2 look like 5’s after all, does it?
Damn you clearly trying make the Padres better than the Mets. Padres will lose at least 10 more games than Mets. Anyone who thinks Davies is the same as stroman is delusional.
A healthy Mets rotation blows the Padres rotation out of water
Care to show me any numbers to back up your assertion? Or is your opinion supposed to be enough? I have shown actual stats, and the stats confirm my assertions.
You’re the only person on the planet that would take the Padres rotation before the Mets
Numbers. Not opinions, numbers. They disagree with you.
DeGrom & Stroman… were they the lawyers that handled that settlement regarding ownership malfeasance?
Whoah, the Mets rotation is better?? Damn, that must’ve taken all two of your synapses clicking at once to come up with something so obvious. Too bad they’ll finish third in the division, hell they may even beat out the Phillies for fourth lol
And to think they donated Castillo
Marlins having a very promising SP’ing Staff with a farm on the brink of helping out.
Fish finally on the right path of long term contention & success for the first time ever.
Don’t let them get to in the postseason!! They’re automatic!
The Marlins are the poster team for contraction in MLB. They have very few hardcore fans, even fewer casual fans, and basically serve as a glorified AAAA fodder for the rest of the league. These guys may break out, but they will just get traded when they do so the Marlins can incubate more prospects in the majors. Sure they may win 80-90 games every so often and they even rode a couple of hot streaks into 2 arguably undeserved WS titles.
Good….GOOOOOOOOD! Let the hate flow through you….
Imagine believing that anyone cares about your projection
Two undeserved world series titles? What? Because both those rosters were awful…. definitely not filled with amazing players and definitely not future hall of famers. No way. In 03 having the best record in MLB in May and beyond the beating the Giants and Cubs…and in 97 beating the Giants and Braves then the Indians (only the cream of the crop that year) oh and in every home playoff game averaging 60k people.
The no fans in Miami thing is getting boring. I’m a native. When the team is good we go. Imagine the pain the fans went through 7 times watching them be gutted.
There are bigger things than baseball right now and I’m happy they aren’t playing but there was an excitement this year for Marlins baseball. Ever since Jeter and Co took over it’s been a small burn but it’s coming. Opening day tickets were high. They announce actual attendance (Loria on ticket sales when it was like 800 people there) the actual attendance has been climbing. People love the new logo. And when the team breaks out and everyone stays attendance will be fine. The new owners know it’s going to take time. They are very vocal about it. We are Miami. We have more than most cities with baseball can offer so you need to give them a reason to show up. The dolphins have been garbage and they can’t fill the stands with more fans than the opposing team at home. But when they are good we have a top 10 NFL attendance. Exactly the same with the heat. We are Fairweather for sure. No one denies that. Things are changing. The team isn’t going anywhere.
the league is never contracting in pleasent climes and certainly not because of the points you made.
Let alone that to get the stadium, Miami Dade county demanded MLB and the Marlins sign a 30 year agreement saying they would stay in Miami.
So to get out of that, they would have to give the county 50% of the sale price at least. Or something like that.
In that case the city probably says “Can we help you pack?”
Porcello will be better out of Boston and he’s more of a 4-4.5 era guy. Wacha is a wild card and who knows what he’ll be. Matz will be Matz but who in Florida matches up with DeGrom and Stroman? Alcantara is a 3-4 guy and he’s slotted at 1? And behind him question marks. Potential is another way of saying that you haven’t done anything yet.
“Should’ve kept Gallen” should be a take reserved for if Gallen shows yearly success in the majors and if Jazz turns out to be a bust – two things that haven’t happened
Bro stop it with the logic.
if you have seen my posts on any article about Gallen you could see that ive been in this guy’s camp since i saw his name in the Ozuna trade. we’re not here to say “Trout shouldve gone 1st,” that doesnt need to be said. if what you say happens than it doesnt need to be said. Gallen didnt need to be a perennial contributor to be a piece to hold onto.
@DarkSide830 Believe me, when the Gallen/Jazz swap was announced I was pretty heated. I figured if the Marlins were gonna go after a shortstop they would’ve drafted some bats or waited until their window of contention to sign one. I saw Gallen as part of the future, but I also see where Jeter and Co. we’re thinking (seeing as the team already have plenty of quality pitching in the farm). Marlins luck tells me Gallen will become a perennial all star while Jazz becomes a middling bench player, but there’s still good reason to believe that he’ll could potentially turn into something great and make the trade worthwhile.
Jazz has done nothing but improve since becoming a Marlin. Also I think they just love his attitude. Kid loves to play. He makes people around him better. He plays fantastic defense at least. Now if he bats .250/.330.or something but has 25 HR and 20SB with his good defense most teams take that. And he could easily do that.
In the little bit of spring we got Jazz and JJ looked like they belonged already.
It’s a major gamble. Jazz was sold to us low. Gallen was sold high. It can go any way for the fish, a steal, a wash, or a flat out loss.
But this new regime not only wants to teach them to be winners but to have fun. The 03 Marlins won because they had fun. They didn’t know what pressure was. I can see this current clubhouse going that way.
Perfect rotation for the Mets to EAT.
as much as the Marlins need a lot of guys to take a step to have a good rotation this very year, its not like the Mets are too great either. Outside of DeGrom and Stroman you have a lot of mediocre pieces in Matz, Wacha, and Porcello, all guys whose best years are probably past for varied reasons. also very shaky depth there. Wacha will likely miss time, and who then? the great Seth Lugo can only hold the line as a starter for so long.
I agree. But if Wacha matz and Porcello could hold their own. The Mets should be fine. They have flipped their strengths and now are a better offensive team than pitching. I mean just look at the players in the lineup. That’s why if the Mets made the postseason before Thor got hurt they would have been very dangerous.
Marlins need to be relocated. They’ve never had 5000 fans since marlins stadium opened. The wbc doesnt count.
@Wrek305 Fish avg’d 10k fans a game in 2019z
Maybe you should be relocated.
They’ve never had 10k in marlins stadium in one game. Where the hell did you get an average of 10k fans a game because its false. Maybe 5k that that’s mostly the other teams fans
Never seen someone struggle this much reading attendance figures in my life
Most of those attendance numbers are wrong. They didn’t hit a million many times.
The accurate ones are any by the new Jeter led owners. They believe in transparency. They announce ONLY people actually in attendance. Loria and Co announced tickets sold and made. I know the guy who runs the parking in Dolphins stadium where they used to play. I would show up and he would pull out 200 tickets and ask where I want to sit and how many. They count all 200 of those tickets and that’s just him.
New regime counts only tickets scanned to enter. While it seems low, 800k and 10k per game is huge for the moment. And excitement is building back up. TV ratings last season were very high. New logo merch is selling like crazy. The time is coming soon. I trust the process. The Marlins only need 20k average to be a successful team with money to spend.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/FLA/attend.shtml
Where are you relocating to @wrek?