9:30AM: The 2025 season marked the final year of Shelton’s contract as manager, Noah Hiles of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette reports. The terms of the extension Shelton signed in April 2023 weren’t made public, though the 2023 season was known to be the final year of the four-year contract Shelton initially signed when he was first hired as skipper.
Hiles didn’t mention whether or not any club options were attached to Shelton’s deal beyond 2025, so it seems as though Shelton may have been in a true lame-duck situation heading into this season. This only adds to the perception that Shelton’s managerial tenure was on thin ice, and Hiles noted that it became increasingly clear during the season that Shelton would be replaced. “Numerous members within the Pirates organization, including a few within the clubhouse, privately acknowledged as much to the Post-Gazette in the days leading up to his dismissal,” Hiles writes.
8:45AM: The Pirates’ managerial change naturally drew most of the headlines on Thursday, but in addition to letting go of Derek Shelton, the Bucs also moved on from another member of the coaching staff. The New York Post’s Jon Heyman reports that Pittsburgh parted ways with Radley Haddad, who had been a game-planning and strategy coach with the team since November 2021.
Haddad (who turns 35 tomorrow) is a former minor league player in the Yankees organization who wrapped up his playing career following the 2016 season. He then moved into a new role as the Yankees’ big league bullpen catcher, as well as a coaching assistant. Haddad worked in that capacity until he was hired away by the Pirates following the 2021 campaign.
Between Haddad’s departure and Don Kelly’s promotion from bench coach to manager, the Pirates now have two openings to fill on the staff. It isn’t known if any other coaching changes may yet be in the offing, as the Bucs continue to figure out how to adjust on the fly amidst a disappointing season. Kelly’s managerial debut was at least a success, as the Buccos’ 3-2 win over the Braves last night ended Pittsburgh’s seven-game losing streak, though the club still has only a dismal 13-26 record.
Larger-scale changes don’t appear to be coming at least in the near future, as Pirates owner Robert Nutting told Jason Mackey of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette that GM Ben Cherington and president Travis Williams aren’t going anywhere for the time being. “I think if we make a broad, real restructure of the organization midseason, right now, we will not improve the team for 2025. I don’t think that makes us better,” Nutting said. “I’m not willing to give up on what we expected, which involves a significantly better performance than you’ve seen. I believe we can get to that. I don’t think that blowing everything up 38 games into the year is gonna help us do that. I think that would be distracting. I think that would get us off track. My focus has to be on getting this fixed and getting it fixed as fast as we can.”
Left unsaid was the possibility that Nutting might explore a wider “restructure” down the road if the Pirates don’t start playing better baseball. Cherington was hired in November 2019 to oversee a major rebuilding process that has brought some premium talent onto the roster, yet the Bucs haven’t delivered a single winning season in Cherington’s five-plus years in charge of baseball operations.
The situation has left the Pittsburgh fanbase openly dismayed and it is clear that both Nutting and Cherington share in those frustrations. Cherington took his share of the blame when speaking with reporters (including Kevin Gorman of the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review) on Thursday, acknowledging that “I’m more responsible than anyone” for the Pirates’ struggles.
“Certainly not lost on me that my part of that accountability, if I had done my job perfectly for five years, might not be meeting with you today,” Cherington said. “That’s certainly possible. I own that completely. This is not all on Shelty. And I believe that it became clear to me that this was a choice, however difficult, that we needed to make. I certainly feel accountable going forward.”
Cherington also reiterated that he feels he is still the person to be leading the front office going forward. Likewise, Nutting defended his own continued ownership of the franchise, stating that he feels the team can and will win again under his stewardship, and feels he can elevate the Pirates’ place in the sport as a whole.
“Given all of the challenges broadly in baseball, there’s been a lot of discussion of the economic disparity in the game. We’re never going to use that as an excuse. Never have. Never will. But I think I’m particularly well positioned right now to be able to help influence change in the economics of the game,” Nutting said. “Having been around for 20 years, having gone to owners’ meetings for longer than that, having a very strong relationship with the commissioner’s office, I believe that I’m uniquely well positioned to have a louder voice for Pittsburgh as we’re heading into the next [collective bargaining agreement]. I want to make sure that we don’t lose that position. I don’t think a new owner in Pittsburgh would have the same standing or ability to advocate for the kind of changes that we need.”
Pirates fans can understandably take some skepticism in Nutting’s remarks, and Mackey indeed expressed something of a counterpoint to Nutting’s interview in a follow-up column. The owner has been frequently criticized for a lack of spending since he bought the team in 2007. The Pirates have ranked in the bottom five in Opening Day payrolls in all but three seasons of Nutting’s ownership, and the payroll high-water mark remains the Bucs’ $99.9MM payroll at the start of the 2016 season (which ranked 20th out of 30 teams). As much as Nutting feels his team is at a financial disadvantage against baseball’s bigger markets, the Pirates’ resistance against even moderate spending is an obvious impediment to their desire to become more competitive.
In a bit of on-field news from Friday, the Pirates placed infielder Enmanuel Valdez on the 10-day injured list due to left shoulder inflammation, and recalled infielder/outfielder Ji Hwan Bae from Triple-A in the corresponding move. A timeline wasn’t given for Valdez, or whether or not he is expected to miss any time beyond the minimum 10 days.
Acquired in a trade with the Red Sox in December, Valdez has hit .209/.294/.363 over 102 plate appearances for the Buccos this season. Valdez had primarily been a middle infielder with the Sox, but his 26 appearances at first base for the Pirates represent a marked change in his usage, as Valdez’s previous experience at the position consisted of just nine minor league games during his time in the Boston and Houston farm systems.
Since intended first baseman Spencer Horwitz has yet to play this season, the Pirates turned to Endy Rodriguez at first base, and then looked at Valdez as a further backup plan once Rodriguez also hit the 10-day IL. Rodriguez is still a ways away from returning from a right finger laceration, so Jared Triolo and Matt Gorski now stand as the top first-base options in the interim. Horwitz has started a Triple-A rehab assignment and might be a week or so away from his 2025 debut, though Valdez’s injury will leave the Pirates even thinner at the position in the short term.
Not going to improve the team in 2025 with a GM that hasn’t proven he can improve it over the past 5 seasons. Not like a switch is going to suddenly flip. He should be fired for his poor spending of what little FA money he’s had the last 5 years. If it was not for Skenes I’m not sure either Shelton or BC would have survived the off season
Hard for Cherington to prove anything since he took over since Winter 2019. I don’t disagree with firing him to try for different results but it’s likely not to change with a new GM.
2020 | 30th | $23.7 Million |
2021 | 30th | $45.2 Million |
2022 | 28th | $55.8 Million |
2023 | 27th | $73.3 Million |
2024 | 29th | $86.4 Million |
2025 | 26th | $86.5 Million |
Wow, these are comically low
2020 though should be multiplied by 2 2/3 to equate to a full season
30th in spending
Cherington’s free agent signings have been horrendous except for Cutch who was signed by Nutting and not Ben and Chapman last year
His player development has yet to produce a major league caliber player and except for drafting Skenes and other pitchers, Cherington has been a failure
Not sure how much is on Cherington, granted not a fan, but also realistic of the situation with current ownership. They spend equally low on player development, analytics and all the other departments successful teams have invested heavily in over the past 5+years.
How do you know that?
Cherington is terrible and needed fired. But other than keeping Shelton, signing Pham and not playing Canario he has been above average at everything except developing hitters. He should be destroyed on those things but free agents trades were better than average.
Anderson Quintana Hedges Santana Perez Hill all traded at deadline so obviously weren’t horrendous signings.
Nutting doesn’t want to spend on free agents, but he could at least do what Cleveland and Tampa have done and spend on improving the player development aspect. He’s gotta spend there if he expects to see the farm produce MLB players.
How do you know that?
Cherington just has not hired good instructors.
I won’t argue that, but the issue is that he’s spent on FA year after year and has missed horrendously. I’m not expecting a Soto but he should be competent enough to allocate the FA funds he has into viable MLB players. Couple that with poor development or no development of drafted talent and it’s a recipe for consistent failure at all levels.
Simply put, he may not have 100mil to spend on FA but what he has spent on has not worked.
I couldn’t agree more.
Most of his trades have been busts too.
Where are the players from the Josh Bell trade?
No longer in baseball.
He did obtain Cruz, Bednar and Endy but each have not been exactly superstars either.
Endy has yet to prove he can hit major league pitching.
Ortiz for Horowitz who was only supposed to be out 8-9 weeks, he’s been out close to 3 months
Last thing you should trade for is a hitter with a CHRONIC wrist issue
Correction: Cruz was acquired by Huntington.
And Ortiz may not even be the best pitcher he gave up for Horowitz. Arizona gave up less to get All-Star Josh Naylor!
I stand corrected on Cruz, but this isn’t about Arizona, it’s about the poor leadership of Ben Cherington’s role as GM of the Pirates
TJ-What almost all posters do not realize is that Nutting will spend $20-30M more as necessary but only if his GM produces a good team and they are managed properly.He wants a competitive team in the first place before he commits to that spending increase.
Otherwise he thinks that is throwing good money after bad and what is the reason if they will barely then compete for a 500 season.
That additional amount is probably half as much as he makes on the team per year not including team value appreciation.
In the contracts giiven to Hayes, Reynolds and Keller, are probably perfect examples of throwing good money after bad.
Nutting doesn’t want anything like that again which could also explain the he won’t increase payroll if these players aren’t performing.
Maybe not so much Keller, yet he’s not the same pitcher he was when he signed that contract
Nutting has always been pretty good about giving fair deals to existing players to extend them.
Willie Shoemaker said that once you sleep in silk pajamas it is never quite same as in competitiveness.
To some extent unless one is a hard driven competitive player there is quite often a letdown in performance.
We saw it with Francisco Liriano in 2016.
These big contracts work out when the player is young and driven like Cutch and Marte were.
But I doubt that ownership and upper management are pleased with the results of the three players that you mention.
YBC
Exactly
after their 10 game losing streak after last season’s trade deadline, Shelton should not have been brought back for 2025
That wasn’t the only season the pirates melted down under Shelton.
I am aware that this team has melted down under Shelton’s leadership prior to last season but that 10 game losing streak should have been the writing on the wall to not bring him back this year
The fact that they have had numerous meltdowns before is a testament to how badly Shelton managed the team
Sale the team
The only relevant questions in regards to the Bucko’s are: Where does Skenes end up & who will fleece them for him?
They will package him with Hayes for salary relief and get a sun bleached dog turd back
Skenes isn’t going anywhere this year or next season
What little fans who go to home games would revolt against Nutting making matters worse
Even Cutch is untouchable and he’s the oldest player on the team
If they can find takers for Hayes and Keller, even for low level prospects, I see them getting traded as salary dumps
Could probably trade Skenes to Baltimore for a stockpile of their prospects… Basallo, Mayo, and more, and a current player or two like Kjerstad. Both teams suck and are going nowhere without different roster construction
“Having been around for 20 years, having gone to owners’ meetings for longer than that, having a very strong relationship with the commissioner’s office, I believe that I’m uniquely well positioned to have a louder voice for Pittsburgh as we’re heading into the next [collective bargaining agreement]. “
Translation. “I’m going to cry for a salary cap.”
Exactly!
His answer to his lack of spending is to make all the other teams spend less.
Moronic and childish solution to an obvious one that is stop pocketing all of the surplus you get FROM those big teams spending more.
Pitt fans need to full court press at games with signs the need for him to go.
The fans have been doing that at every game this season
Nutting is the worst kind of liar there is. He believes his own bullsh**.
Davis? Sucks
Endy? Mostly sucks.
Peguero? Buried behind schmucks
Hayes? Underperforms his ability
etc etc
After enduring a David Chadd lead garbage development system for almost 20 years with the Tigers as a fan, let me tell you the big difference has been shaking out all of the old and bringing in somebody who knows what they’re doing from a development standpoint. Between the top to bottom revamp of the Hitting Philosophy and bringing in Chris Fetter from University of Michigan for the pitchers, it’s been night and day and now we have the #1 prospect group in MLB and are logjammed w top 100 guys all over the diamond in thr minors let alone the 26-13 record in the bigs.
I understand it feels like that Nutting is going to go right until Bob sells the team, but Mr. Illitch’s cheapskate son hasn’t spent much so far either here. You cant fix the owner, but don’t be The Rockies and just keep doing stupid stuff because you’re stupid. Change the development organization there.
Tiger talent coming up is unbelievable. Where are they going to play all these young guys when there is already a young player at their position. Tigers understand how to develope these young guys. You notice they aren’t rushing players like Max Clark to the majors but some other teams would already have him up. Swim or sink attitude is not happening in Detroit. Tigers are looking like they could be a dominate team for the next decade. Player development is the key to their success.
1 player over 812 ops. None 900 or above. Looks like they have plenty of room and no one is blocked.
Nutting plan is not to spend money and improve the team, it’s to complain to the commissioner and bring all the teams in MLB down to their level.
The Commissioner of baseball works for the owners, he’s their go to guy in everything baseball
And this commissioner only cares about the big market teams not those small market players that complain they are losing money
If they were truly losing money, those franchises would be on the block for sale
It’s called revenue sharing. So…. no, he’s not losing money. He’s making money. Even without making an attempt to field a competitive team. That’s the problem. Owners like him are the problem. Not the Dodgers and teams actually trying to win. Everyone should be trying to win. If owners don’t make an attempt to win there should be rules that force the owners to sell.
Actually, more likely to be a Fisher plan to escape a dying city. And fairly sensible.
apparently you have no clue about this city or its population
Cluelessness abounds
Fisher is completely incompetent and not qualified to own and operate a MLB team.
Guys like Fisher should be forced to sell an MLB team.
Instead, the Old Boys Network will keep guys like Fisher, Nutting and others afloat when they should have been forced to sell long ago.
Big money and the union rule baseball.
Anyone who says otherwise is a big market fan or has their head up their.
I wonder if Pirate fans understand that they have an Oakland situation on their hands. Haven’t drawn 2 million in a decade and 68th large city in the US. Run the owner out of town if you want, but he may take the team elsewhere in the process.
The Bucs are contractually obligated to remain in Pittsburgh until 2030
It was part of the agreement to construct PNC Park using taxpayer dollars
Pirates aren’t going anywhere. MLB wants to expand. Only teams that will move are ones without a stadium. That certainly isn’t Pittsburgh. Field a 90 win team over 2m attendance easy.
If there’s a city that wants a team and does not want to wait until the next round of expansion, what’s to stop them from putting a plan in place to build a stadium and make a pitch to the pirates to move in 2030?
So blame the fans for a team leaving? Why would fans show up when the team hasn’t made the playoffs in a decade or shows any aspirations to make the playoffs?
If I lived in Pittsburgh I’d be glad if they left. That way that scumbag Nutting doesn’t ask for taxpayer funded stadium upgrades or something.
I have been a Pirate fan since 1966, was once a season ticket holder for 30 years.
I attended the game when Clemente got his 3000th career hit, watched Stargell hit a homer over the right field roof at Forbes Field ( only Babe Ruth accomplished this), attended AS games at 3 Rivers Stadium and PNC Park, enjoyed their winning and experienced their losing seasons.
There’s die hard fans who root for this team no matter who the owner is
Correction. According to the Society for American Baseball Research, ten players have hit home runs over Forbes Field right field roof. Babe Ruth hit his last home run of his career over the roof
“ 1] The ten players who homered over the roof were Ruth, Beard, Mickey Mantle, Wally Moon, Bob Skinner (2); Eddie Matthews (2): Jerry Lynch; Rusty Staub; Willie McCovey (2); and Willie Stargell (7)”. . The footnote is from an article about Beard.
If I didn’t know any better, I would swear that you’re really Dream GM in disguise, Skeptical
@theman, because you play fast and loose with facts and I correct your “facts”? Ok, Donald.
it’s unfair to compare me to that pathological liar and my original point was that I had attended hundreds of meaningful games as a Pirate fan over the course of my life
I wasn’t disputing your point of attending games. I was only correcting your error about who has hit home runs over the roof at Forbes Field. For that, you unfairly compare me to dream who is only a dream GM in his own mind.. refrain from insults and I will to.
fair enough
Well said..dream or AI is a narcissistic egomaniac clown. A nightmare in his own mind.
I’m liking Kelly so far. Just wish he would have Cruz and Reynolds batting lower.
And now Bubba is rated the second best prospect in baseball. With him ready to be called up and maybe Barco. You have a devasting starting rotation.
That is what they said about Jones last year.
Bubba is only going four innings so they probably want him getting six in in AAA before he comes up.
Barco needs to prove himself in AAA.
Yea they said Jones will be ready possibly after the all star game
Dooper- Many fans are long term and remember when the Pirates were actually a good team,winning three WS in two decades.
True fans are fans of the one team that they have always rooted for,usually starting when they were young.
Nobody is blaming the fans for losing.
As bad as the Pirates have been since last year’s trade deadline it is a wonder that anyone shows up.
I’m saying OP is suggesting the pirates moving like Oakland relates to the fans not attending games. The team hasn’t given them a reason to attend. And the franchise can’t keep hoping nostalgia keeps them afloat. Those pirate teams and ownership aren’t the current.
PNC is a beautiful park where as Oakland Coliseum was a dump and had the worst concessions in all MLB/AAA/AA/little leagues
The A’s problems were created by like Selig, Manfred, Fisher and the Giants. See the movie “Major League”.
A’s had local SF Bay Area offers from well funded potential New Ownership groups seeking to buy the A’s and build them a brand new stadium in the Bay Area with private financing.
MLB has come a long way down from Commissioner Kenesaw Mountain Landis who made it his mission to keep Major League Baseball and gambling as far apart as possible.
These days, MLB appears to be selling out the the gambling industry and badly wants to put an MLB team in Las Vegas to fully embrace the gambling industry and its potential revenues.
How far the once mighty have fallen.
The A’s saved the Giants from moving to TB early 90s, by giving them San Jose area to claim. Giants did NOT return the favor when A’s needed it to move to SJ.
Dah, it is not city size that matters but the size of the metro area. The Pittsburgh metro area is 28th just ahead of Las Vegas and Cincinnati.
Pirates put a winning team on field – they will draw, A’s had many winnings seasons they did NOT draw fans into park.
Those winning seasons only happened because Fisher could rely on Bob Melvin and Billy Beane to make them look great. Add-in the fact that since 2006, ever 3 seasons they had big offseason firesales.
The biggest reason that they needed to move was the worst stadium in MLB.
BS, They would have had a New Stadium long ago if incompetent Fisher Ownership had not messed things up.
Yes, I looked at the SMSA’s with an eye toward the 2030 projections, when the Pirates lease expires. Pittsburgh is projected to drop into the lower 30s, below places like Charlotte. Nashville, San Antonio, Austin and Orlando. More importantly, there’s going to be pressure from SMSAs that will seek a second MLB team (Atlanta and DFW, in particular). Expansion is likely to fill 2 slots, but franchises will be moving and St. Louis Pittsburgh, Cincinnati and the second Chicago team will be targeted.
lay off the sauce, regardless of what you think, the Pirates will never leave Pittsburgh
All it takes is
an owner who does not care about the history of the teamwhen the lease. is up in 2030.
From your name I guess we would have to ask you for suggestions on how it feels to lose a professional team (Colts, Bullets, Flames, Thrashers, ect.)
Tiny, little Pittsburgh has never lost a team
The Colts and Bullets left when I was in Baltimore. Only the Colts mattered to much of anyone and fans hounded Irsay to the point where he had little choice. I was at least somewhat connected to the Flames and Thrashers (knew people in the ownership group) and knew Atlanta was going to be a struggle. Zero hockey culture. No youth hockey to speak of.
These are businesses and I think all four moves were right for the investors in those businesses. If fans treat owners as their enemies the owners have the right to move. That’s the way of the world.
Bottom line, Atlanta took the Braves from Milwaukee, who took them from Boston and took the Hawks from St. Louis. Pittsburgh lost an original ABA franchise and Indianapolis kept theirs.
Sports franchises move. That’s reality and the cities that can best support each team in each sport should have them.
There’s a growing movement to locate a major sports franchise on the Northern edge of the Atlanta MSA. It’s likely to succeed in 20 years and the target is most likely a franchise move. So if my family stays in ATL, all is good.
Nutting and Reinsdorf are dinosaurs. The real world of MLB has passed them by. And that world is that really rich players and really rich agents and really rich owners will pay players full market value. If an owner doesn’t like this, he should sell and take his huge capital gains. To think the CBA is going to regress to Nutting and Reinsdorfs comfort zone is folly.
Nutting will be at the kids table. He’s a scumbag leech. He’s worse than Loria.
He can’t be worse than Fisher who is the worst owner in Pro Sports.
This is a perfect time to fire Andy Haines as well. The hitting philosophy, up and down the organization, needs an overhaul. They’re better at turning high pedigree hitting prospects into sub-Mendoza wash outs than any team in baseball.
Andy Haines was fired after last season ended
My bad. They should fire the new guy for good measure.
I agree
They aren’t any better this year and with a different hitting coach
Canario Valdez are much improved.
The funny thing is that the Pirates have 2 hitting coaches now.
neither one are doing much better than Haines did during his tenure as the hitting coach
Enmanuel Valdez’ low 29.3% hard-hit rate (FanGraphs) reflects missed opportunities at the plate. Despite a stellar 15.7% K% and 90.3% Z-Contact%, his 57.7% Z-Swing% shows he’s too passive on strikes, limiting hard contact. If Pittsburgh’s hitting coaches can boost his in-zone aggression, Valdez could revive their offense on a budget.
Shelton’s philosophy on hitting was for the batter to take as many pitches as possible to help wear down the starting pitchers earlier.
He tried to enumerate Moneyball despite not having the same talent.
Using the Moneyball technique, he also relied on analytics which is why their game coordinator was also fired.
New manager Don Kelly doesn’t believe in that technique or using analytics to make the offense better
He’s hitting the ball better than ever. Leave him alone! Canario much improved as well. New hitting coach has done more than Haines ever did.
Except that this band of hitters are still being called out on strikes at a high rate
Atlanta starter has 5 strikeouts over the first 2 innings in this game.
Cruz and Frazier called out on strikes which adds to the team’s major league leading.
It’s worth repeating that they are supposed to be taught to protect the plate.
It will easily be yet another double digit strikeout performance by this lackluster offense
Players just aren’t good.
if the players aren’t good, how is the current hitting coach doing better than his predecessor?
You fired the guy that served the soup, but you didn’t fire the guy that prepared it.
mlb-It has always been a mystery to me as to whether the hitting philosophy was the hitting coach,Shelton or Cherington.
But Nutting is correct.Firing the GM during the season would be way too disruptive.
And Shelton should have been fired two years ago.
He is not a ML manager.
My guess is that Cherington will be gone after the season if they do not clearly improve after getting players back from the IL and having Kelly as manager.
From everything I read, the hitting philosophy was Shelton’s but with Cherington’s blessing
Then we will see if anything changes.
unless Shelton convinced BC this is the the right approach
Then Cherington should have fired himself at the same time that Shelton was fired.
Ben is a classic BSter. He talks a good game but never delivers. Yes, Nutting should have fired him when Shelton was told to hit the road.
People here think Cheringto responsible for the daily lineups
Except that I doubt Kelly would’ve agreed with become manager using the same tactics as Shelton did by allowing Cherington to influence his lineups
There should be input from the statistics personnel but it should not dictate to the manager.
More information is always better.
Donny Kelly Baby won his first game as manager last night. Their closer almost didn’t in the 9th, but the Buccos held on anyway.
DKB will be just fine and I bet he gets the gig full time after the season ends.
Ironically it wasn’t Bednar who almost blew the game, it was Santana
Congrats to Tigers fan-favorite Donny Baseball! No surprise Kelly’s managing career has begun.
Looks like Bubba will have to wait until Nutting can get the most years from him under arbitration.
I looked at the pitching roster and the Pirates may soon be in a real roster crunch once these guys get off the 60 day IL.
Rainey and Stratton will be the first to go but if the others on the IL get off before the trade deadline when their will be a mass exodus other position players will have to be cut.
This may be a reason not to add Chandler.
And it was also a reason not to bring Harrington up to take a roster spot.
Plenty of roster space. You could dump 10 guys and no one would ever notice. Lots of dead weight.
Frazier and Pham come to mind
Bring York and Suwinski back up to replace both
Suwinski needs to stay in AAA to give others a chance.
He is doing the same stupid things as last year.
What other pitchers would be waived?
DFA Wentz Nicolas if need be. Borucki Santana Bednar Ferguson Heaney should be traded and expect they will be if Cherington is still working hard. Holderman could should be traded. Keller could should be traded. Will be an exciting July if Cherington is doing his job. But no need to wait until then if you need roster spot. They could option someone down and dfa a position player. 9 guys that won’t be there in 2027. Many won’t be there for 2026.
They are losing their whole bullpen under your scenario and would finish worse than the equivalent 51 win team of 2020.
None of these guys are good enough under a one year contract to warrant upper level minor league players.
Any should be traded now such as Heaney if they are offered good minor league players for him.
Many will be gone at the trade deadline when teams know whether or not to push for the playoffs.
The worst thing that the Pirates could do is deplete themselves now instead of giving Kelly and the fans an honest effort at winning games for most of the remaining season.It would give hope for next year if they play well.
Before deadline anyone with less than 2 years remaining should be dealt if Pirates aren’t in contention. Cherington has done this so far so expect it unless he just stops working. They can call up prospects. Get reliever back in trade. Hit the waiver wire. Same way they got most these guys.
They can’t afford to keep Bednar. He pretty much has to go. Probably need to get rid of Keller or Reynolds unless they don’t plan on any free agents other than Cutch which is possible.
I think odds are Kelly is named manager going forward, but the second most likely scenario is Cherington/Nutting hire another first time manager willing to work for almost nothing, and once again they’ll get what they pay for.
I think Cherington is on a very short leash, and if the team doesn’t make a turnaround by the AS break, he will be history
By turnaround, I don’t mean in the playoff race, but instead offensively better than they are now
President of Baseball Operations, Travis Williams should also be worried about his job
Nutting has made a clean sweep before and will not hesitate to do it again if there is not clear positive improvement.
Nutting lives in Wheeling WV and probably reads Pittsburgh newspapers.
He certainly knows the current situation of this team.
You’re right Mendoza, he will clean house if there’s not positive improvement
From hearing what Nutting said about Kelly and how effusive he was about being a Pittsburgher I think that it is his job to lose.
But bringing in Reaney today?
I hope that Cosmo(nee Buuba) was wrong when he said that Kelly is nothing more than a Shelton clone but he seemed like that today.
The first chance they get, Rainey should be DFA
I noticed that Kelly didn’t follow the Shelton rule of using Davis in lieu of Bart on Sunday games and then used Santana for all three of against Atlanta
Holderman only pitched Friday and not in the next two games
Pham’s defense is very solid but his offense is making the team worse especially with runners in scoring position
If I’m Cherington I make some bold trades today, tell Nutting to go f himself!!
yeah that’s a good idea, telling the owner where to get off at, especially if he wants to keep his job
Advanced Keyboard Warrior!
Bad news is your top 2 executives are lame ducks. Having people running your operation knowing they are going to be fired in 5 months is terrible business move.
Awful news is Nutting informed them they won’t be fired and will be running the team again in 2026!!!!!!!!
He is keeping Williams so that Cherington does not see the writing on the wall.
I do believe though that if they become a 500 team with this hitting group that Nutting will keep Cherington and Kelly.
Williams may be gone anyways.
I still think this would be the best time to hire a baseball man/president over Cherington if Nutting does keep him.
Travis Williams came from the Penguins and had no baseball experience before
He was hired, from my understanding, to promote baseball to the fans. If thats the case, like Cherington, he’s failed miserably
Pittsburgh is an amazing city. I’m not a resident or a Pirates fan, but diehard Steeler and Penguin fans deserve a great baseball team led by much better leaders. 20 years of failure is not a building block to success, no matter what he says.
Pirates are cheap, end of story doesn’t matter who manages them until they spend some money
At this point there is no excuse for management to not put a competitive team on the field even with the salary constraints that they have.
There are no constraints! It’s BS!! Mlb should step in today and make spend 30 million tomorrow!
He could do that but how many wins would it get?
Five?Ten?
Who would they sign,or should have?
They are looking like a 70 win team at this point.
It’s the owner. That’s it. Nothing will change until the owner changes. Same for about a third of teams in MLB
It’s been reported on national media that hadad was writing scripts for each game and inning for Shelton. It was all based on ANALytics. If this is true, then it’s a wonder Shelton was so dysfunctional as a manager.
That may have been true.And if it is,that is on Cherington,and explains why he continually says that it is his fault that they are so bad.
Pham .183 avg 0 hr 480 op 4m
Hays 357 1098 5m
Verdugo 267 681 1.5m
Grichuk 214 678 4m
Pillar 237 526 minor league deal
Canha 270 673 minor league deal
Tauchman 400 900 2m
These guys more expensive but nothing crazy but for Nutting they are.
Winker 239 739 7m
Kepler 240 752 10m
Going by memory on salary so may be off a bit.
Point is Cherington could have signed any of these outfielders and he choose the worse possible one.
Even more awful. He has Canario who is more valuable than any of these players and he doesn’t play him.
Canario is in the lineup again this afternoon, Pham not starting
How long before Pham is DFA?
Who knows with Cherington. Maybe Pham still sick. Hopefully they woke up and realized what they have in Canario.
Season likely over as far as playoffs. Unless you are extending Pham to have in 2026 he doesn’t need to be here. If Canario gets hurt you have Gorski Triolo Suwinski Gonzales Endy to play outfield. I guess Bae. Also Yorke Cook. Find out if these guys are keepers or dfa.
I don’t think anyone believes they have a chance at the playoffs but they definitely can reverse course and make the season interesting
Pham will be kept as long as Rowdy was last year because he was a free agent who was not free.
I can see them doing anything. Get an idea in their head they are going to trade him for a great prospect at deadline.
I have no idea but Rowdy was here until well into September. I don’t think that will happen. I can see Pham being gone in days or weeks. You would think they would want to see Canario Gorski Yorke Cook. How’s Pham going to take to bench roll? How’s he going to take to fans booing him? Cruz hurt might buy him some time. And I won’t put anything past the Pirates. They are capable of anything. Microscope is on them so maybe they will do something smart and the right thing. Canario Gorski need to play. Pham needs to go.
Frazier and his $1.2 million dollar contract needs to go too
Use Bae or Yorke at second until Gonzalez returns from the IL
Frazier is a good defender but his hitting isn’t and this team is in dire need of offense
Paul- In defense of Pham,he is a pretty good left fielder.
Canerio may turn out to be a hitter,but he scares me in the outfield.
I been impressed with Canario. He looks to be a average outfielder. I liked on a double he played the ball rolling off the wall perfect. He used his glove to block the sun. Well above average speed. Good arm.
when your team is near the bottom in scoring runs, Pham’s continued failure at the plate doesn’t help the team’s chances of winning
Change in Ownership(s) Needed!
MLB Commissioners Office and Ownership need to get more aggressive with Owners who refuse to spend money, conduct “fire sales” every 3-4 years and live off of MLB revenue sharing and TV revenues
Rays, Marlins, Twins, A’s White Sox, Angels Pirates, Rockies, etc.
are mismanaged franchises that are diluting the quality of major league baseball..
Whether it is incompetence, mismanagement and/or just milking the system for revenue sharing funds and national TV revenues,
the MLB, the players, the fans in those markets and the cities that have money, infrastructure, assets etc… “on the line” for their local teams deserve much better.
MLB needs a much better caliber Commissioner and reforms to its ownership agreements.
If Owners are not meeting certain high standards, then they should be forced to sell to a more competitive, better funded ownership group with the business acumen to produce a competitively successful and profitable team in all MLB markets.
And, Ben Cherrington should be on thin ice.
Even teams that don’t spend like big market teams seem to find talent on a regular basis and ways to win.
PIrates are finding some talent, but not enough for a breakthrough season and to throw open their window of contention for 5-10 years.
other than Skenes and Cruz, who are the latest talents they’ve found?
Maybe Bart too, but he’s also underperforming
Reynolds is mired in a 4-30 slump. It might be time to move him down in the order
as I think he’s pressing
Cutch draws enough walks that he should be in the lead off position
“Given all of the challenges broadly in baseball, there’s been a lot of discussion of the economic disparity in the game. We’re never going to use that as an excuse. Never have. Never will. “- Nutting
You just have!! Amazing how some people believe their own bs!
Another double digit strikeout performance by this team
Only 6 hits through 7 innings, including a double. Woopie!
An extra base hit. Almost cause for celebration
Greg Brown claiming that Triolo never bunted before in his career, highly suggests that this player development doesn’t bother to teach basic fundamentals
It’s sickening to watch
Bae knows how to bunt, he should have been used as a pinch hitter for Triolo
Different manager, same problems offensively
Man 3…did you really expect anything different. He’s a clone of the moron. Still has Cruz leading off. Reynolds 2 and a guy with 1 home run batting cleanup the last 2 games.
They just play sloppy baseball as this latest play just showed
Wild pitch scores a Braves runner and this team doesn’t have the offensive ability to tie or win the game in the bottom of the 11th
I hope I am wrong, but doubt it
Is there a rap against Nick Solar? He’s not on the forty man roster. He’s batting around .380 in AAA. Not a lot of power. Interested in what others know about him.
Never paid much attention to him. Looks like just a guy. 31 year old guy. A MLB player can hit AAA well. Who you want to risk losing to add him? Where’s he going to play? Bae is a obvious answer. Why do you want this old guy with no options though? Bae can at least pinch run like today. Get rid of Frazier for a guy who pretty much is Frazier? Guys just emergency depth pretty much. Someone else gets hurt he might get a look. Maybe with Cruz injury. Might take 1 more. Dunno.
Skeptical- I only know what I just googled.He has averaged 10 homers in 400 at bats in MLB and hit 252.
His current Ruthian numbers in AAA make me recall Jake Lamb’s start last year.
It says that he is a right fielder and the Pirates could use him there but as you are aware AAA numbers do not necessarily translate into MLB numbers.
He has obviously not impressed Cherington enough as they are playing Canerio now.Their roster is getting tight so they may not want to spend a roster spot on him as they probably do not see him as more than a utility man.
Thanks. Unfortunately, many of those who have impressed Cherington have not been impressive.
Chris Sale is pitching for the Braves this afternoon and should strike out at least a dozen Buc hitters because that’s the only thing this team does with any consistency
Paul enjoys small samples so this is for you buddy!
Canario batting .250 since April 25th
Amazing for Pirates and good for him.
i’m impressed with Canario so far but still unequally disappointed with Pham’s offense
He has one XBH this year, a double
And this team needs base runners and runs
I am also not impressed with Triolo’s lack of offense
Hard to believe that they don’t have anyone better for either player in the minors
Great player development, Ben!
NOT!