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White Sox Miguel Tejada Update

Alright, I've got the goods on the current state of the White Sox's attempt to acquire Miguel Tejada.

Remember the unknown prospect I referred to in the Orioles' proposal?  Turns out the pitching prospect the Orioles wanted was either Lance Broadway or Brandon McCarthy.  Neither player was on the list agreed upon earlier, and the Sox scoffed at the idea of including Broadway or McCarthy.

Despite reports in both the Chicago Tribune and Chicago Sun-Times today, the deal is very much alive at this point.  Unfortunately, my source is more involved with the financial approval aspect of the deal (hence the statement that the Sox will take the payroll up to $105MM if necessary).  He's been cut off from personnel discussions, so this is probably the end of the line as far as the info goes. 

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Wow.... Lance Broadway. That would seem to be a bit of a dealbreaker, considering the Sox have already unloaded a couple good young pitchers in Haigwood and Gonzalez. A good qualifying offer by the Orioles, but we have to keep in mind that they are the ones with the squeaky wheel.

I agree; that is far too much for Kenny to give up, given what I have heard about what the Sox think of him. And certainly, the Sox aren't going to give up both McCarthy AND Contreras! I cannot imagine the Orioles thought the Sox would take that deal. Dave Kaplan on WGN tonight said according to his source, the Orioles definitely plan to move Tejada, and that Manny has told ESPN that the deal for him is definitely off. I don't know if there are other serious contenders for Tejada (I had heard Houston, but I don't know what their offer is). If the Sox offer is the best the Orioles can get, I bet they take it, with a lesser pitching prospect.

I agree; that is far too much for Kenny to give up, given what I have heard about what the Sox think of him. And certainly, the Sox aren't going to give up both McCarthy AND Contreras! I cannot imagine the Orioles thought the Sox would take that deal. Dave Kaplan on WGN tonight said according to his source, the Orioles definitely plan to move Tejada, and that Manny has told ESPN that the deal for him is definitely off. I don't know if there are other serious contenders for Tejada (I had heard Houston, but I don't know what their offer is). If the Sox offer is the best the Orioles can get, I bet they take it, with a lesser pitching prospect.

Conteras and Uribe and a middle prospect. Take it or leave it Orioles. You're the team that's desperate here.

Tejada isn't worth any more (and I don't think he's worth that much).

Stick to your guns, Kenny. No need to sweeten the pot this time.

I can't put my finger on it, but I just can't see why everyone loves Tejada as much as they do. He's good, but is he that good for chrissakes? Was Beltran as good as the hype? Seems like every offseason someone's stock spirals out of control. Shortstop is not a priority for the Sox. I think they need an outfielder. I believe they have over-valued Anderson Borchard-style.

if the Sox get Tejada.

As a Sox fan I dont want to see them include McCarthy or Broadway along with Contreras, Uribe and Sweeney. That is a whole lot to get for just 1 player in return even as good as Tejada is. I too have read the Manny stuff and I believe there was a chance the Tejada to the Red Sox deal was dead before Manny made his announcement. The thing I cant figure out with the Orioles is do they have a better offer on the table than the White Sox? Perhaps Rumor could answer that. To me it seems like the Sox offer is better than the Cubs (which is the only offer I know of for Tejada) Even without Broadway or McCarthy the Sox offer seems to beat the Cubs in that they are offering Contreras, Uribe, Sweeney who is a real good OF prospect and even if its a mid level pitching prospect that would still trump what was the Cubs last known offer of Prior, Hill and Patterson. Keep in mind too, it seems like Hendry is pretty much stuck on making the Orioles have to include Bedard along with Tejada. All reports I have read indicate the Cubs want another starter in return if they trade Prior or Zambrano. The Sox of course are just seeking Tejada and maybe money is the only thing I've heard. Rumor if you dont mind help me out, to your knowledge (and I know we dont know what the Tigers, Angels and whoever else may have offered) is the Sox offer the best on the table that the Orioles have right now?

I was wondering what happened to Chuck LaMar - he's obviously taken an advisory role with the O's. No way I make that deal for the White Sox. You're going to need some of those young pitchers to help hold down the payroll in future seasons.

Of course with Toronto's offseason, Baltimore's pretty hosed already for '06 - maybe they put up with a whiny Tejada and see if they can fleece someone next July?

Contreras, Uribe and Sweeney is overpaying if you ask me. Throwing in a pitcher is ridiculous. Contereras is a front line pitcher; Uribe is an above average SS and a defensive whiz. Sweeney is one of our top prospects. That's ridiculous to give up all of that. And for what? Tejada is not one of the best hitters in the league. He's a great hitter FOR A SHORTSTOP; well, every team has a hole, so we can keep ours at SS instead of paying the ridiculous price. Further, he has a serious attitude problem and the Orioles are itching to trade him. Pay a premium price? No way.

Based on all the information if the Sox are offerring the 2005 Contreras, Uribe, Sweeney and Woodson, it is the best offer known. If that's all that's coming then the O's could well bite on it or just wait some more.

Which Contreras will the O's get though? If he misses Guillen's ability to work with Latin players and its the Yankee version for a one year stint, not such a great deal for the O's. Also will they risk extending him or risk losing him to free agency? Will the Sox be willing to take on all the salary for Tejada??

I'm not sure I believe Kenny Williams statement that he won't try to trade for Tejada and wants to keep the 5 strong starters with McCarthy in reserve. He's got to be feeling a bit of his oats with the heroic offseason he is having. Then again Contreras was an absolute lock in the last months of 05 and does Kenny risk losing who I think was their late season ace? Maybey his best move now is to keep his powder dry.

Word is that the Orioles have received serious inquiries from both Sox teams, LAA, Cubs, Astros, and most recently, the Tigers. They seem to have plenty of options.

Rosenthal is reporting on Fox Sports that Ramirez's agent says his client did not say he didn't want to be traded and would be happy to play in Baltimore. Also the Phils and O's are talking Abreu and a pitcher for Tejada (3rd base) although Philly has no pitching to give.

I'm alreays leary with Williams and overpaying for certaint players. If there's one criticism of him, he seems to have an difficult time obtaining fair value for players:

-Rowand/Haigwood/Gonzalez for Thome?
-Hernandez/Young/Vizcaino/only 4 million for Vazquez?
-A quality reliever in Marte for Mackowiak ALONE?

I agree with Dr. Box. We're not in a desperate situation here. Anything more than Contreras/Uribe/Sweeney is ridiculous. Even that is steep unless Orioles thron in several million of the contract.

I'd still prefer a trade with the Dodgers or Houston. Who knows why both those clubs are sitting on their asses.

I agree with you, K-Man. Williams overpays for players. But he gets his mind set on a player and piles on, piles on. Someone said above Conteras and Uribe and Sweeney and Woodson? That's beyond belief. Now, that said, overpaying is better than letting prospects rot, which many teams do. And he has a good eye for talent and the recent trades have worked out (Garcia, Podsedik although he overpaid in both of those).

I agree, Williams gets fleeced, altough he knows how to fill neccessary holes. However, I think you are overrating both Contreras, and Uribe. Offense is more important than defense, and its not like Tejada is a huge downgrade, half of his errors are because of rediculous range. I know that Uribe rocks on D, but Miggy is pretty Damn good, and the offense (esp in Chi town) would be awesome. Contreras is in the last year of his contract and will be paid 9 mil. He overachieved and is not worth that much. In the end, if the last prospect isnt in your top 3, DO IT.

Here are the two absurd trades with the A's that are examples of unfair returns as referred to earlier-

How about Koch for Foulke and prospects.

Or Durham for a prospect that I still havn't ever heard of.

He hardly overpaided for Garcia and Podsednik. Olivo and Morse are lucky to get any playing time, and there was no room for Reed at the time. He has a chance to be good, but the overall outcome is still in the Sox favor. And trading Lee's huge salary gave KW the chance to sign many important players to last year's success. This is overpaying for Tejada though. Whenever KW makes a trade I think he overpays, but it often turns out that the players he sends don't pan out. The trades this offseason have been too much.

The Foulke trade brought us Neal Cotts. Durham, however, only brought us Jon Adkins.

GET IT DONE Kenny!!!
(CONTRERAS, URIBE, R. SWEENEY, & THROW IN LANCE BROADWAY, BUT KEEP MCCARTHY)

GRINDER RULE #2006
WIN NOW & AT WHATEVER THE COST!!!

THE SoX OWE IT TO THEIR FANS & THEMSELVES AFTER 88 YEARS OF FUTILITY TO CONTINUE SOMETHING SPECIAL ON THE SOUTHSIDE!!!

"The Foulke trade brought us Neal Cotts. Durham, however, only brought us Jon Adkins."

Considering how Foulke left Oakland after one season, whereas Cotts will be a valuable bullpen/possible starter in the coming years, it would appear Ol'Billy Boy was fleeced. I know, BLASPHOMY!

Concerning past trades--I don't believe Williams traded Morse/Olivo/Reed among others envisioning their current status. Not as if he thought, "these guys won't amount to anything." At the time of trades, Williams often looks overmatched.

For once, I just want another general manager to overpay for one of our players. Where's the overzealous officials out in baseball willing to give up top prospects and major league ready talent for one year of Contreras? Where's our Zambrano for Kazmir? Or AJ Pierz for Liriano and Nathan? Not ONE team out there is desperate for pitching? Jeff Weaver better sign quick so Contreras' value can skyrocket.

According to Rosenthal, the O's and Phillies are in discussion. Abreu, and preferrably Gavin Floyd, whos from MD, for Tejada. Heck, at this point, id even make it Hamels instead of Floyd. If Miggy moves to 3B, we have the best INF in the NL, hands down.

1B - Howard
2B - Utley
SS - Rollins
3B - Tejada

Oh, and Burrell and Rowand in the OF, along with Michaels/Victorino in RF. Id take that deal in a heartbeat.

It just gives the O's more options to choose from. All-in-all, when the day ends and not one of the deals satisfies them, then they keep Tejada. The funny thing is, everyone will blame their respective GM for not pulling off the move, when in turn, it all comes down to the O's getting the significant edge on any deal, if any deal at all.

Re: Lance Broadway, isn't there a rule that a team can't trade a signed draft pick for 12 months? For example, Broadway wouldn't be eligible to be traded until June '06?

"If Miggy moves to 3B, we have the best INF in the NL, hands down."

I think your talking about offense, because the defense would not be exceptional (average at best). And I would take the '05 Rangers infield over that one (offense wise) - and we saw where they ended up.

With respect to everyone that keeps claiming Kenny overpays for people, in some respects you are right but whoever cited the following 4 trades is wrong in saying Kenny overpaid in these deals. The Garcia deal. Freddy Garcia was a proven #2 starter that was 27 when the deal was made. Jeremy Reed was expendable cause the Sox had 3 guys at the time that project as better players in the majors than him. Brian Anderson, Chris Young and Ryan Sweeney. Olivo had a great arm but was a terrbile hitter and even worse at calling a game. Morse was a decent prospect but certainly not a cant miss. The Thome Deal. Thome when healthy is a premeir hitter not to mention that the Phils are paying for about half his salary. Gonzalez and Haigwood are good prospects but neither has pitched above Class A. If I had a nickel for everytime I heard about a Class A prospect as a cant miss that ended up missing, I'd own my own baseball team. Rowand defensively was great, offensively he's mediocre. The Sox again at the time had 4 OF's with a higher ceiling than Rowand. Anderson, Sweeney, Young and Jerry Owens. By all minor league reports, Anderson covers just as much ground, is faster and has a better arm than Rowand. Offensively I have already seen some projections for next year that place him right at or a little below what Rowand did this year. Third is the Vazquez deal.The Sox get a #3, pretty servicable starter for a broken down possibly pushing 40 yr old who was due at least 4 mil this year in Orlando Hernandez, a RP who made 1.3 mil last year, was arbitration eligible and was probably going to get close to 2 mil. Thats not bad if he's your set up guy. Unfortunately in the Sox bullpen, he's the 4th righthander on the depth chart behind Jenks, Hermanson and Politte. Chris Young is a real good prospect but again the Sox still have three OF prospects who project nicely in Anderson, Owens and Sweeney. The Dbacks also threw in 4 mil as well. Finally the Marte for Mackowiak deal. Marte was due between 2-3 mil this year. That's alot of money for a guy who is the 12th man on a 12 man staff. Mackowiak is arguably the best utility player in the majors and gives the Sox some insurance should Crede get hurt or Anderson, Owens and whoever else not pan out in CF. With this Tejada deal, The Sox would only be overpaying if they include Broadway or McCarthy. If they can swing it with giving up the three guys Contreras, Uribe, Sweeney and a mid level pitching prospect then I'd do it. The Sox had the 12 overall farm system per baseball america. Thats still easily top half, not to mention they just won a World Series and are in great shape to at least be competitive to do that same thing in 06. So I hardly think Kenny overpaid at least in the trades that were cited

I agree Matt! Kenny has done great with trades, especially when looked at a couple of years down the road, much better than his free agent signings. If he's been overpaying so much but won the WS, then keep it up. Teams like the Cubs have "ripped off" the Pirates and Marlins for their two best players but what has it done them?

As an O's fan, my gut tells me that Contreras, Uribe and Sweeney is no where near enough. Personally, I don't consider Uribe to be anything more than a replacement-level SS. OK, maybe he's a little better than signing Alex Gonzalez, but not by far. Sweeney? How does a guy who's 6'4" end up with 1 HR in over 100 minor league games last season?! Please.

I would also prefer to take back McCarthy over Contreras, but Angelos has loved Contreras ever since he shut us down in Cuba.

I would propose sending Tejada and Matos to the White Sox for Contreras, McCarthy, and Uribe. In other words, switch McCarthy for Sweeney, and we'll include our so-so CF, in case you guys are completely overvaluing Anderson.

Not sure if this was ever really mentioned by anyone, but any "rumor" involving Lance Broadway obviously wasn't properly researched or thought out by anyone before being spread. Lance Broadway cannot be traded until he has been with the Sox for a full year. Seeing as he was drafted in June of 2005....

Broadway can't be traded yet, he is a 2005 draftee.

Thanks for all mentioning the fact that Broadway can't be dealt. I don't have an answer for you there; I asked my source about this.

"Personally, I don't consider Uribe to be anything more than a replacement-level SS."

I think you're nuts, Uribe has probably the strongest arm at ss in the league. His offensive #s are average for short stops. I would put him as a all round top 10 ss in the majors. Did you see that catch in the 9th inning of game 4 of the World Series???

I like Uribe, but I would trade Contreras, Uribe and Sweeney in a second. If McCarthy is added to this, no deal.

Yeah...Uribe is certainly above replacement level with his defense.

And as for his hitting, let's look at the average AL SS (which is above replacement level of course).

average '05: .276/.331/.412
Uribe '05: .252/.301/.412

average '04: .275/.325/.422
Uribe '04: .283/.327/.506

Below average hitter for his position? Maybe, maybe not. But replacement level, no way.

Brian,
With all due respect my friend, I can almost gurantee you the deal you proposed of McCarthy, Contreras, and Uribe for Matos and Tejada wont happen. The White Sox have a surplus of starting pitching but if they give up both of those guys the surplus is gone and their is a hole in the 5 spot. Kenny is bold but not that bold and he knows pitching is what got this team the World Series last year. This isnt even mentioning that McCarthy looks quite possibly to be a future ace with Prior like stuff and control before Prior got hurt (second half of 03 Prior) Matos would do nothing for the Sox. They have a surplus of young OF's (one reason Sweeney would be in the deal) each with a higher ceiling than Matos. My guess is if Anderson is overvalued and failed the Sox would rather try Jerry Owens (another highly though of prospect that won the AA southern league batting title and led the league in SB) Sweeney himself even though he is only 20 or move Podsednik over, and make a deal for LF or CF or even stick Mackowiak out there. If the O's include Bedard or Cabrera with Tejada then I'd say there is a 5% chance the deal could get gone. I dont envision Kenny trading McCarthy unless Contreras is removed from the deal and even then he might not trade McCarthy. Im just interested to know who was on that list (Rumors source said Broadway and McCarthy werent) of prospects and is it possible that the O's asking of McCarthy or Broadway, a last ditch effort to get more for Tejada before they possibly come back to the Sox and pick a prospect from the list the Sox gave them and settle on the Contreras,Uribe, Sweeney deal. Unless the Cubs have put in Pie with Prior or Zambrano and supposedly the Cubs would want Bedard back if that is the case, the Sox deal at least to me seems the best one out there right now for Tejada. I know the Phils offered Abreu but it hasnt been confirmed yet if they offered Floyd.

Just real quick guys good job on the all the insight about Broadway not being able to be dealt but just because that is the case dosnt mean the part about Baltimore asking for him to be in the deal makes this rumor no longer true or rumor's source not credible. It may very well may be possible that the Orioles did ask for Broadway unaware of exactly when the Sox signed/drafted him thinking it had been a year. I'm sure its possible one GM (especially guys new to the job this year like I believe at least one of the O's front office guys is) would be unaware of a fact like that.

I appreciate the defense, Matt, but it definitely seems like something a front office would know before requesting a player. Although you could be right.

I'll have an update on the Broadway thing later today.

Rumor,
Well I guess I just like to bring up and make people think of all possible angles before jumping to conclusions. You are absolutely correct in that it would be awfully hard to believe a GM would not know the particulars of any player they are wanting in a deal especially when a trade of this magnitude is being discussed. I guess my main point is whether or not Broadway was asked for or not asked for, or whether the White Sox are being truthful to VanDyck, DeLuca, Kaplan, your source and anyone in general in their talks about Tejada I guess I dont believe something like this would completely kill the deal assuming the part about the teams seemingly be in agreement about the Sox sending Contreras, Uribe and Sweeney to Baltimore and the holdup being a prospect. Certainly Baltimore could look around at their other deals and realize even if they have to take a prospect off of the White Sox list that was provided this would still be the best offer because of Contreras, Uribe, and Sweeney being in the deal and the Sox seemingly not requesting Bedard or any other players besides Tejada. I guess point was regardless of what pans out with this Broadway thing, I dont believe the deal is dead

Yeah, me neither.

Granted, my characterization of Uribe as "replacement-level" was a little over-the-top. Nonetheless, he is so far below Tejada in all offensive metrics that his inclusion is not anywhere near enough to offset the need to include more than just Contreras and Sweeney.

I mean really. If the O's aren't going to accept Ramirez and Clement, do you really think Contreras and Uribe will be enough?!

Now, obviously, my proposal of Contreras AND McCarthy is a stretch for the Sox to give up. But that's the talent level that needs to be considered when making an offer to the O's. I would be willing to accept McCarthy, Uribe, and Anderson, but unless someone else comes along, such as Woodson, I wouldnt' give up matos as part of that deal.

You can't just look at the names of Manny and Clement...that deal would have cost the O's a lot of cash to pay Manny for 2 years. The White Sox trade probably saves them money, even with a new deal for Contreras.

You get what you pay for.

Besides, there's also the chance of the O's flipping Ramirez to the Mets for a whole lot of prospects, including Heilman and Milledge. So that extra expense isn't a guarantee.

And even with all that money changing hands, I's till take the red Sox deal over the proposed White Sox ones in a heartbeat. Without McCarthy, there's basically no deal. He's the only guy who has the potential to be a superstar along the lines of Ramirez or Prior (or even Abreu). Without him, I'll take my chances with other teams.

Brian,
You are correct in thinking that if the O's rejected Manny and Clement for Tejada, why would they do any of these deals? The problem is there is more on the surface than just a trade there. The O's obviously have some worries about trading Tejada within the division and they also may be worried about taking on a player with Manny's character after just trading away a guy who has requested a trade. The McCarthy, Anderson, Uribe deal is interesting in that if I were a GM I would consider that deal. I would definitely push the Contreras deal more though. The one problem the Orioles have when trying to get equal value is that Tejada has publicly twice made it known he wants a trade so getting absolute equal value in this or any case similar is a real hard thing for any GM to do. The O's aren't dealing from a position of strength especially with the White Sox cause the White Sox dont need Tejada to be a World Series contender. Even the Phillies arent desperate for him. A team like the Cubs while probably could use him the most of all the teams in the bidding for him also have a GM who isnt just going to give up one of his only two reliable starters and not expect to get a starter in return. If Hendry trades Prior or Zambrano and doesnt get a starter back, he essentially is going in circles. Yes the offense would be much improved but his starting pitching would basically be in ruins with only 1 reliable (and if its Prior I use reliable loosely) starter. The O's can hold onto Tejada as well but Im not sure what type of mindset Tejada will have once the year starts and unless a contending team loses its ss to injury during the year, my feeling is that the longer the O's wait the less they will get for him.

Agreed. I don't know what the O's payroll is and how high they are willing to go, but the Red Sox offer (assuming no other trades) costs them 15-20 million per year. It must be some factor else why pass on the best offer received?

Yep you are right Ron. The other thing that is interesting is Rumor has been reporting that several sources have told him that something will get done by the end of today regarding Tejada. Other than the White Sox, Cubs, Phillies and possibly Boston there are no other trade proposals I have heard the O's have received and the latest news coming in on these proposals is that there are still some major sticking points with each one. I know it was rumored the Tigers, Angels and maybe Mets are involved too but unlike the Red Sox, White Sox and Cubs there has been no word on specific names that have been tossed around or any news other than that they are involved in the Tejada sweepstakes. It'll be interesting to see if the several sources are right and something does get done today, who knows the O's could announce they are going to keep him?

Yes, an announcement of keeping him is definitely one of the options.

No doubt the O's are hesitant to trade within the division.

The $15-20M was to be partly offset by $10M in cash that was supposedly coming with Ramirez. Also, because of deferred money, they present day difference in dollar value is a lot less. Sure they'd owe Manny $1M or so per year for about 10 years after he's long gone, but that's pennies to consider now.

Anyway, while the O's are not dealing from strength, they are not going to give Tejada away. They have made clear that any deal must include one player of superstar caliber, plus there must be additional pieces. From the ChiSox, there are no players available who are superstar level other than McCarthy. Again, without him, I wouldn't even consider a deal.

Now, once we've established that McCarthy is on the table, then we can discuss what else you can offer that will make up for the difference in actual value vs. potential value. The O's are looking for either a power-hitting 1B/corner OF or a top-notch CF type. Since you can't deal Konerko and since I'm not touching Thome's contract and back, you have Brian Anderson to offer me. I'll accept that, but I then want you to give me Uribe to fill my newly-created hole. You want Matos to replace Anderson? OK, but I want another prospect, either a Woodson or Sweeney in return.

These deals aren't that complicated. But there are some basic underlying principles that must be agreed upon before anyone gets anywhere.

In this case, McCarthy is underlying principle #1 in any Tejada-to-the-CWS deal.

I heard a repor tthat DET has, in fact, made an offer. The thinking is that the O's are looking for either Bonderman or Verlander, Shelton or Granderson, and Guillen in a deal.

And again, I prefer Bonderman to McCarthy, I prefer Guillen to Uribe, and I prefer Shelton to Anderson. Verlander is behind McCarthy and Granderson is behind Anderson in my book. So depending upon the specifics, that proposal could be ahead or behind the CWS offers.

That trade wouldn't make any sense for Detroit, they would be giving up way too much. Despite Guillen missing half the '05 season he has put up great offensive numbers the last couple years.

As if Detroit hasn't overpaid for talent the past few years.

I doubt if they'd part with Bonderman, but they might part with Verlander. Verlander, Shelton, and Guillen might get it done.

In any case, I doubt if anything happens ont he DET front, but the point is that there are plenty of offers for Tejada to consider. As much as there is this perception that they have to do something, and as much as they have made this even more noteworthy by creating this arbitrary deadline of today on themselves, the fact is that they have enough decent offers to choose from that they shouldn't accept something inferior like a Contreras, Uribe, Sweeney offer.

Brian
I'm going to enjoy watching the Bronx Bombers tear apart your O's in 06,
Tejada or No Tejada.
Be prepared for another miserable baseball season in CrabTown

in what world is Marte a "solid" reliever, i hope that world doesnt include Chicago, because he was not good coming out of the bullpen. Now as for the trade. Dont do it. Juan Uribe hit 283 with 25 HRs in 04, and trading all that seems a bit much, unless Baltimore pays everything. ya, EVERYTHING

I think the White Sox offense is fine the way it is.

If they move Contreras, and I don't mind holding on to him, I hope that they get some young pitching back for him.

RumorMonger,
Just wondering if you were able to get an update on the Broadway thing or anything else with the Sox and Tejada. I know you had mentioned you hoped to have an update on the Broadway issue later today but also mentioned your source was more of a financial guy and may be cut out of the personnel discussions. Guess just curious if the Kaplan source saying the Sox are out of it was ever confirmed or anything. Although there are 4 hrs left in the night, it doesnt seem very likely Tejada will be moved by the end of today or the O's will make an announcement they are keeping him. Regardless great job on digging up info on Tejada to the Sox, Cubs and all the other stuff this site provides.

All I can give you on Broadway is that he could've been included as a PTBNL and sent months later if necessary.

The problem is that Orioles have to trade Tejada; the Sox don't have to trade Conteras. This nonsense of McCarthy and Contreras - for Tejada???? That's just silly stuff. Keep your 7 home runs after all star break player.

DrBox,
Yeah I'm totally with you. I have no problem with the White Sox making Jose Contreras the centerpiece of a deal to get Tejada. In fact Im for it. Contreras is 34 maybe older, is an FA after this year and will likely be gone after this year since the Sox (and rightfully in my opinion) seemed to have committed to Garland by signing him. Contreras supposedly wants between 11-13 mil/year. Thats an awful lot to pay a guy when essentially the WHite Sox have 5 starters who are all younger, already tied up for the next two years. Garcia is signed through 07, Buerhle is signed through this year but has an option for 07 which Im almost positive the Sox will exercise. Vazquez is under their control for 3 years (through 08) because he demanded to be traded in a multi-year contract, Garland obviously just resigned through 08 and McCarthy is still 6 years away from being FA eligible. Not to mention they still have some decent pitching prospects in the minors (Sean Tracey who led AA in wins), Lance Broadway, Ray Liotta, Charles Haeger and Arnie Munoz is still pretty highly regarded even though he stunk the couple starts he had up here in 04) But Yeah including McCarthy and Contreras is ludicrious and im sure Kenny isnt stupid enough to do that. I'm not even sure I would put McCarthy in the deal (taking Contreras out) I really think this kid could be a future ace. He has control, 3 good pitches, fastball, curve and change, knows how to change speeds and locations, and has some poise he showed when pitching in Texas and Boston and shutting those teams out when the Sox desperately needed wins last year. I still think Tejada could end up with the Sox with that Contreras deal, it seems the major sticking point is what prospect the O's will get. Sox dont seem to have an issue giving up Contreras, Uribe and Sweeney.

There is no way I would trade McCarthy in this deal PERIOD. It makes no sense; we need a few cheap players and this guy has a ton of potential - and for a prospect, he's as proven as you can get; he pitched his a$$ off when it counted last year (labor day).
I understand why the Orioles are leery of Contreras because of his signability - all that means is that we shouldn't do a deal. But this business of Conteras plus 2 top prospects (if McCarthy can still be called that) or 3 top prospects is sheer insanity.
They ought to go get prior, and Kenny should trade Contreras for some prospects and a reliever.
Uribe's important to this club for his D, which really, really backs up the pitching.

If I'm Kenny Williams, I don't even think about doing that deal. I'd keep 6 starters until the trading deadline. Keep workloads down for the first half considering how many innings White Sox starters threw in 2005. It would also help to protect McCarthy's arm from throwing too many innings in his first real season. Have him as the #5 for only half a seasons and ease his way into the rotation.
On top of that, there's a good chance the Sox would catch a desperate team at the All-Star break and get a great return. Besides, I think it would be much smarter to save trading Contreras because who knows what holes might become apparent by July? Someone might get seriously hurt and Contreras could be used to fill an actual need. Uribe is no Tejada, but he's more than adequate. He's a free swinger, but 70-something RBI's from the 9-hole is impressive, and his defense is awesome, which is crucial for up-the-middle positions (especially now that Rowand won't be making amazing plays look easy in Chicago anymore). Defense wins games. It's not a coincidence that all the White Sox pitchers had great seasons as soon as the White Sox upgraded their defense. You can win with mediocre offense. You can't win with a medicore defense. Not consistently.

A lot of great comments. Obviously most of the posters really know and follow baseball. The White Sox do NOT need Tejada, so I hope KW does not overpay for him. If Tejada still wants to be traded then offer Contreras and Uribe, take it or leave it. I think the Sox would be better off with Uribe because defense wins along with good pitching, ie the SOX are 2005 WS champs because of both! Uribe is no slouch hitting and most likely will get even better. McCarthy is going to be a star. Anyone with his stuff that stated 'I HATE walking people' is going to be good for a long time. Hold on to Contreras and if we don't need him when the trading deadline comes then maybe get top value from a desperate team.

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