Cubs Like Joe Nathan

If the Twins were offered Marmol for Nathan, I think they'd almost have to make that move.

personally i think marmol and pie for nathan and a low level prospect is more appropriate, but i know how high cubs fans are with pie

Are the Cubs linked to every available player in this years off season? I don't think there has been a rumored guy on the block that the Cubs haven't had an interest in. They don't need Roberts but they're trying to get him, they don't need Nathan but they're trying to get him. Do they think by making a splash in every off season is going to make their fans happy instead of winning a world series?

12.5 k/9, 4 year average of 31 svs. career 1.19 whip with two years till FA and is two years younger than Joe Nathan got traded for Michael Bourn, Mike Costanzo, and
Geoff Geary. Go from there minus one year of cheaper service time, a better perceived talent, and two years older.

I had no idea Nathan was 32. You've got to assume he wants to make a huge payday as its probably his only chance to nail down a big contract.

Corner outfield is set, last I checked were still trying to fill the CF hole, that's why we want Ellsbury from the BoSox.

i think its more that since the cubs did make such a big splash last year, and a more minor but still good one so far this year getting fukudome, that they are just starting to get the whole red sox/yankees treatment of being linked to every player out there true or not. especially since going after nathan really makes no sense for them at all.

Vitters is a 3B but he's not trade eligible and he wouldn't get dealt anyway.

What happened to billy koch, is he still around??

The Twins have probably been laughing at the Cubs non stop since we signed Jock.

Only seems fitting that they would rape and pillage our minors for a one year rental.

I can't remember who said

"Billy Bean trading with Hendry = Rape"

That probably applies to every other GM in MLB not employed by the Orioles.

The reason why Carlos Marmol will be an elite Closer in the next few years, or the best loogy of all time:

August at Wrigley: Cubs Phillies.

Marmol comes into face the heart of the phillies order.

I sit there and watch, from about 75 feet from home plate. I watch as the strikes out both utley and howard. And watch as Utleys Knees Buckle from 75 feet away, on the out pitch.

That kid has what it takes to be an elite closer in my opinion.

Not sure why cubs would be looking to trade for Nathan. We can manage fine with what we have and if we can't then throw big bucks at nathan in offseason when wood/howry/eyre all come off the books. If marmol is going I would prefer he be sent for a need - I know at one point there was talk that Beane might be having a firesale ( although that was when Angels were getting migs or tejada) and may offer up swisher. Colvin/Pie/Veal/Marmol/Cedeno for swisher and street. Although Beane would probably get Hendry to add in patterson too. would have to make cubs fav in the central no? way too unrealistic?

I don't think the Twins would give up Nathan. Then again I think Carlos Marol is going to do really good when the years past and a really good reliever. The Cubs should focus on starting pitching for now. They got a pretty bad rotation.

I'd rather see them get a stud starter than a stud closer for '08. But I can see both sides of why it could work.

And don't forget Jacque Jones. I'll pass, I'd rather have Marmol, thanks.

Wasn't Marmol as good as Lidge, even if it wasn't in a closers role, in bigs first full year in the bigs? He is under team control making next to nothing for years to come...how does it make sense to trade for 1 year of Nathan before he commands 12 mil per year for like 4 years??

Marmol plus one prospect is probably a good deal for Nathan for both sides. Lidge ain't no Nathan. Nathan is probably the best closer in the entire game. You pay a prospect for that, as good of a prospect as Marmol is. And the Cubs have the money to resign Nathan.

This really could have worked out a lot better before the Young trade. Then the Twins could have dealt for a Marmol/Murton package. But now Murton does nothing for the Twins, unless they move Cuddyer back to 3b, which I suppose is still possible.

To Cynic81:

I have always thought that Marmol should be a starter. He has the best arm on the team next to Big Z. Why are we wasting it on a setup spot?

"I have always thought that Marmol should be a starter. He has the best arm on the team next to Big Z. Why are we wasting it on a setup spot?"

Because he is a two, MAYBE 3 pitch pitcher and guys start to catch the slider when they have 3 at bats against him. If he could be a #4 or #5 starter at best, wouldn't you rather have a shut down reliever that posts a 1.5 era and gives you 70 or more IP each year? I think he would probably be better than Marquis or Dempster right now, but not Hill or Lilly. Problem is, Dempster and Marquis would be horrible compared to Marmol in the pen. I like having a guy that comes in for the heart of the other team's order late in the game and makes them look like fools.

You say he's "bound to be a great pitcher" but Nathan IS a great pitcher, right now. Nathan's the best closer in the game when you factor in durability/health/reliability/numbers. (Papelbon is the only guy I'd put ahead of him, but his shoulder issues move him a touch behind; difference is negligible though).

You guys would love Joe in the 9th.

"True. But not at the cost of Marmol for one year of Nathan."

Agreed. Its not that Joe isn't awesome, we would LOVE him...but do you know what he would cost after this year after Cordero's contract? That mixed with giving up like 4 to 5 years of Marmol for next to nothing is just not worth it to me...

Like the Brewers?

That would seem to be a lock to me.

Always knew for a fact that Gagne was a roider (source of mine) so I'm happy that's finally out.

The Cubs would be absolute fools to trade Marmol. He was our only shining star on the pitching staff last year.

truecubs,
get a grip. Nathan is the best closer in the league. you dont give up the best closer AND someone else for another teams reliever who has had ONE good year. you're a joke.

Marmol had a low ERA in '07 but he still has poor command and only one good year. He could implode at any time. Nathan is an elite closer who has dominated real offenses... against the NL Central it wouldn't be fair.

If the Cubs want to win in the next few years, getting Nathan for a 25-year old reliever with no command, plus a prospect, is a smart move. Marmol, Wood, and the rest of the guys in the Cubs bullpen all have huge question marks.

The Cubs could make the trade contingent on negotiating an extension with Nathan, which would be cheaper than signing a similar close out of free agency.

Can the Cubs get Nathan without giving up Marmol? If not then they should stick to getting Roberts/Bedard. And if Marmol is leaving in a trade use him to get those 2 guys from Baltimore.

The Cubs haven't won a World Series since 1918 and their fans are worried about Marmol's potential 5 or 6 years from now.

If the Cubs have a shot a Nathan, they need to get him and win THIS YEAR - not 5 years from now.

"If the Cubs want to win in the next few years, getting Nathan for a 25-year old reliever with no command, plus a prospect, is a smart move."
Again, trading a 25-year with Marmol's potential for an elite closer in his free agent year. This wouldn't be winning in the next few years, it would be trying to win this year and then hoping you, and the new owners, can hold onto Nathan. Marmol will be around as a very affordable player for a few more years.

"Marmol had a low ERA in '07 but he still has poor command and only one good year."

Despite his 'poor command,' he still managed to get people to swing and miss. And he's only had one year, so you have to go with the only evidence there is.

It would be a really dumb financial move to make this trade. Not to mention that Marmol was as good as Nathan, even if it was in the 7th inning, in his ONLY full year in the bigs. Here is the thing most people don't realize. Lou brought Marmol in when it was most important. Usually in the 6th or 7th, sometimes both, when the heart of the order was up for the opposing team. Look at his ERA. Then factor that he has 4-6 years of team control left making next to nothing. Then factor in that Nathan has 1 year left, then will make at LEAST 12 to 14 mil per season. It would be dumb to make that move, period. The Cubs can just keep Marmol and sign another good reliever and still have 8 mil or so to spend....

So just to further my point...Nathan vs. Marmol next year is probably an advantage to Nathan...but not by a ton. Factor in his salary compared to Marmols and its a wash. Then, you have either:

A) Marmol for 4 years and a couple mil

B)Nathan for 4 years and 55 mil (obviously an estimate)

So, it is essentially

A) Marmol and 50 million dollars

B) Nathan

or, you could think of it as

A)Marmol and a 12 million dollar a year player, someone like say...Fukudome

or

B)Nathan until he is 36

I'm going with Marmol

nice point CHICUBS08. I think we have a great reliever in Marmol, who I have argued for all year. So many people have said he is junk and i said ok sure look at the stats.

Marmol has the stuff, and has proven it against some of the best offenses in the league last year. I was in Wrigley last year when he went two no hit innings against the Brew Crew with the 2-7 hitters. THAT WAS TOUGH LAST YEAR! also, i watched him go through the heart of the Phillies last year. He is truly an amazing pitcher, with so much potential. Nathan is established as an elite pitcher, but he is old and at prime. The Twins would make a good move to trade him now, because this is probly the best he will ever be. Marmol has years of prime in his future...

The message -- DONT MAKE THE TRADE HENDRY!!! ITS A BAD ONE!!! KEEP AFTER THAT ROBERTS KID THOUGH!

Nathan would be a SICK addition to the Cubs bullpen. I agree with some of the nonCub fans viewpoint; however, I'm thinking that a major reason (unfortunate one) that the Cubs wouldn't pull the trigger on this one is the Wood situation. I think the Cubs are very interested in having Woody come in during the 9th - consider the bonuses in his current contract. Just hope that arm can handle back to back to back games. I don't really see Nathan being dealt before Spring Training - more like June/July.

griff,

I'm a huge Cubs fan...but they do not have one of the best farm systems in baseball. I wish you are right, but believe me, you aren't.