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« Washburn-Yankees Trade Unlikely | Main | Twins Rumors: Bonser, Beltre, Roberts, Monroe »
Adam Dunn Rumors
THURSDAY, 10:33am: SI.com's Jon Heyman says the Reds seek players such as Jeff Niemann and Jeremy Hellickson in a Dunn trade. Niemann probably could be had.
WEDNESDAY, 10:13pm: Finally, some Dunn rumors. ESPN's Jayson Stark says the Rays are talking with the Reds about Dunn, though he's their Plan B to Jason Bay. I imagine Dunn would DH for the Rays.
9:25pm: According to SI.com's Jon Heyman, the Diamondbacks offered Chad Tracy to the Reds for Adam Dunn. He says another NL team has also inquired on Dunn.
However, GM Walt Jocketty said a few hours ago he hadn't talked to anyone about Dunn today.
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2 more bombs tonight for dunn now has 32 on the year ... i think the reds can get more for dunn than tracy
Posted by: redsfan | July 30, 2008 at 09:20 PM
I think Walt saying there has been no calls on Dunn is him just being coy with the media. The owner Castellini likes to keep things close to the vest, but yeah the D-Backs need to offer more than Tracy for Dunn. Here's to hoping the other team were the Dodgers so they can start a bidding war,
Posted by: redhawk61 | July 30, 2008 at 09:23 PM
I don't think the Reds will take a first baseman for Adam Dunn with Joey Votto and their '08 first round draft pick at 1B.
Posted by: redlegsfan21 | July 30, 2008 at 09:24 PM
Tracy's under contract for another 2 years, but Dunn is gonna be a Type A. They should be able to snag Dunn with a marginal prospect, probably in the C to C+ range.
Tim, which Red Bull are you on?
Posted by: thehoagster07 | July 30, 2008 at 09:29 PM
Is the Sox-Pirates-Marlins trade falling apart?
what's the word?
Posted by: charlie123517 | July 30, 2008 at 09:29 PM
I don't follow the Reds closely, but Tracy plays 3B too. Are they satisfied with Encarnacion and/or their other in house options there?
Posted by: GravediggerHebner | July 30, 2008 at 09:31 PM
very satisfied with edwin just hit number 20 tonight ..... and the reds can get more than a marginial prospect for dunn
Posted by: redsfan | July 30, 2008 at 09:37 PM
Thehoagster, why would Dunn go for a C range prospect if he's a type A? That makes absolutely no sense.
Posted by: Bosox4416 | July 30, 2008 at 09:39 PM
EE is horrible at 3B, but the Reds brass considers him untouchable so yeah they are happy with him there. There is no way I deal Dunn for just Tracy.
I resgin Dunn if I'm the Reds, they have alot of money coming off the books more if they can move Arroyo
Posted by: schellis | July 30, 2008 at 09:40 PM
There isn't really a position problem; Tracy to 3B and Edwin (who is indeed a butcher) to LF where Dunn was. But, agreed with all, Tracy alone should not be enough.
Posted by: Not Joe Morgan | July 30, 2008 at 09:47 PM
You hold on to Dunn if the return is just Tracy.
Posted by: bjsguess | July 30, 2008 at 09:47 PM
I wholeheartedly agree that Dunn for just Tracy is not enough, was just wondering if Tracy even being part of a package made any sense and given what I already know about Votto and what you guys just clued me in on about Encarnacion, I'd say this rumor makes little sense.
Posted by: GravediggerHebner | July 30, 2008 at 09:48 PM
Unless of course as is suggested just above Edwin goes to the OF. That's what I love about this site. To quote the Pixies, "It's Educational."
Posted by: GravediggerHebner | July 30, 2008 at 09:50 PM
That other NL team better be the Mets, because relying on Fernando Tatis for the rest of the season will only lead to failure...
Posted by: Hyro | July 30, 2008 at 09:52 PM
There is no way Walt Jocketty makes this move if Chad Tracy is all we're getting. If we don't also get Max Scherzer and Miguel Montero out of this, I'm not interested. Hopefully they'll take Homer Bailey off of our hands too.
Posted by: DJ Socrates | July 30, 2008 at 09:53 PM
DJ Socrates,
If Scherzer was off limits in trade discussions for Teixeira, you can rest assured that he definitely isn't getting moved for Dunn. Offering Tracy straight up for Dunn is just a joke though. The guy is nothing more than a reasonably signed, oft-injured, average corner guy. While he might be a nice piece to have around, he isn't going to net you anything major.
Posted by: nixa37 | July 30, 2008 at 10:02 PM
LMAO at the D-backs offering just Tracy for Adam Dunn. How the **** does Tracy even have value at this point. So if the D-backs want Dunn, they're going to have to pony up more than just Tracy. Understand, Mr. Byrnes?
Posted by: Bravesfan89 | July 30, 2008 at 10:04 PM
It looks like Dunn's 2 HR's tonight have awaken some teams
Posted by: redhawk61 | July 30, 2008 at 10:17 PM
now the rays have some pieces i wouldnt mind coming to cincy rather than tracy
Posted by: redsfan | July 30, 2008 at 10:21 PM
what about Brignac and Ruggiano
Posted by: redhawk61 | July 30, 2008 at 10:25 PM
They better reap more than the Pirates will for Bay, for crying out loud!!!
As long as Krivsky's scouts sign off on prospects, I don't care what the trade is. Jocketty has proved nothing to me as a Reds fan.
Posted by: jbibbali | July 30, 2008 at 10:30 PM
I would take some of the Pitching Prospects in the Ray's system. I'll even send them Weathers and or Addefeldt if they want either
Posted by: GmblngPtchr20 | July 30, 2008 at 10:33 PM
Brignac, Davis, and Fenando Perez for Dunn and a reliever (Weathers or Affeldt heck they could have both) If I had a choice I rather go Weathers.
Then the Reds bring Dunn back as a FA. Its a brilliant plan for the Reds.
Posted by: schellis | July 30, 2008 at 10:42 PM
Look at what the Braves got for a rental of Teixeira. Isn't he going to be a Type A Free Agent too? I think soooo....
Kotchman is only a little bit better than Tracy at this point. They have pretty similar OPS+'s to this point as well (Kotchman at 101, Tracy at 106 for their careers and Kotchman at 105 and Tracy at 109 this season). I know Kotchman has more upside, but Tracy plays 3B and the OF corners as well, which is valuable. And Kotchman is under team control for only 1 more year than Tracy (assuming I read the pages right at Cot's Baseball Contracts).
Stephen Marek was rated a type C+ at the beginning of the season.
The difference between Tex and Dunn is far greater than the difference between Kotchman and Tracy.
What exactly makes you think that the Reds will get more for Dunn than the Braves got for Tex, especially considering fewer teams have interest in Dunn?
Posted by: thehoagster07 | July 30, 2008 at 10:43 PM
Some of you need to learn the art of a negotiation. You don't just go to somebody and give him an amazing offer right off the bat. Look at the Johan Santana trade for instance. Anybody remember the asking price at the beginning? Wright/Reyer. Weeks go by, weeks go by, and then what did we hear? Fernando Martinez was a must in any Johan deal. Weeks go by, weeks go by, and what happened? Minnesota ran out of time, and settled for a package of much less then they were asking for in the beginning (whether it was still too much is an entirely different question), and the Twins probably never expected to get Reyes or Wright in a deal, but they started by trying for it.
Or you can apply this to every day life. I was in Chinatown the other day and I saw a cool pipe that I liked. I asked the lady, how much do you want for this pipe? She replied 30 dollars. Now I had a decision to make. I could either try to negotiate, or I could counter her by saying.."fine! I'll give you 45 it!"
I told her I would give her 5, she countered with 20, and we ended up settling at 13 about 2 minutes later. You don't go throwing out your best offer right off the bat. The Rays never would have gotten Kazmir for Zambrano if they hadn't asked, would they?
Posted by: nrmax88 | July 30, 2008 at 10:49 PM
Maybe the Braves should've gotten more...although Kotchman's upside is worth more consideration than you gave it.
Posted by: jbibbali | July 30, 2008 at 10:51 PM
Tracy is garbage. He's been constantly hurt and just because a team plays you at a position doesn't mean you can play it well.
If the best you can get is a mediocre player and a non-factor prospect then you are far far better off taking the picks instead.
I wouldn't deal Dunn unless what the Reds get back fills a need and is obviously better then two high draft picks.
Tracy and a throw in isn't that.
Also just because the Braves were fools and dealt Tex for pretty much nothing, a below average 1B and a reliever prospect doesn't mean thats what other teams have to accept.
Posted by: schellis | July 30, 2008 at 10:55 PM
Dunn is just a joke though. The guy is nothing more than a reasonably signed, oft-injured, average corner guy.
============================
ARE YOU KIDDING ME???
He leads the majors in HR
he has a respectable avg.. the thing that gets me is you say he is oft-injured... That tells me you don't know anything about Adam Dunn you Moron
Posted by: redlegs-4 | July 30, 2008 at 10:57 PM
Another thing to consider is that Dunn has almost done as much as Tracy has in the last three years in just this season alone.
Wow the Reds can get the Chad Tracy. Tracy hasn't been worth anything for about two years, and has really only one season that is even close to a average Dunn year.
Dunn is two months will do more damage then Tracy will have for this season...perhaps for the last two years. But yeah he's worth Dunn.
He's barely worth the Hitter formally known as Ken Griffey Jr.
Posted by: schellis | July 30, 2008 at 11:01 PM
Dunn is injured a fair amount....however he also continues to play even with the injuries.
In the entire history of the Reds there are only two players that have hit 40 homers driven in 100 runs and scored 100 runs three times or more. The Reds have been around for well over 100 years.
Frank Robinson is one of these two
The other is Adam Dunn.
Dunn is not a average corner OF. He is a very underrated OF that has been horribly missued his entire time in Cincinnati.
He is a average defensive LF (gets stuck with the worst in the NL label even though he's greatly improved) with the most non-roid power in baseball over the last five years I believe. He hits a reasonable .250-.260 with a OBP comparable to a lead off hitter. teammates love the guy and of yeah he gets a bad rap because he isn't a rah rah type leader and looks indifferent out on the field. But anyone that will play a half season with a broken hand is a team first guy and one that loves the game in my book.
If any team gets Dunn for a player of Tracy's stature their fans should send thank you letters to the GM from now till the end of the season.
Posted by: schellis | July 30, 2008 at 11:06 PM
It isn't what other teams have to accept, true, but it certainly set the market.
Compensation draft picks are far from guarantees. If (for some very strange reason) Jim Bowden is still the GM of the Nationals next year, he'll probably chase after Dunn. If someone like the Nats signed him, the Reds would be left with a comp pick and a 2nd rounder (probably around pick #50). By then, do you think you'll get more than a C+ prospect?
And that being said, a C+ prospect isn't a non-factor one. It's one that is either high risk/high reward or lowish ceiling/projectable. I failed to clarify my stance there, but I meant adding high risk/high reward C+ guys rather than "projectability" guys.
Tracy is not garbage. Throw some stats out there or something if you're going to call a guy garbage.
According to Rosenthal, the DBacks offered Tracy and Owings for Tex. Why offer more than Tracy and a good-but-not-great prospect for Dunn?
Posted by: thehoagster07 | July 30, 2008 at 11:07 PM
And all being said, I think Dunn is a good ballplayer, and is incredibly underrated. But you're not going to get top prospects for a 2 month rental of him, especially in the current market. That's just unrealistic.
Their best bet is probably to hold on to him. I was just figuring on what the DBacks could theoretically get Dunn for. It's up to the Reds to decide whether to take it or leave it.
Posted by: thehoagster07 | July 30, 2008 at 11:10 PM
They didn't offer enough for Tex, who knows how far short they fell? Perhaps the distance between Tex and Dunn is equal to the distance between the Angels offer and the Dback's. (head explodes) Going to bed now.
Posted by: jbibbali | July 30, 2008 at 11:14 PM
Tracy is a very average 1B that can't play 100 games a year. Thats garbage in my book. Even when he can manage a full season he's a 20 homer 80 rbi type guy with roughly a .800 OPS.
The Reds have that in Votto and EE already and you can get that pretty easily off the FA market.
Adam Dunn has done more in just July this year then Tracy has done the entire season.
Posted by: schellis | July 30, 2008 at 11:33 PM
Tracy played 143 games or more from 2004-06. Just because he got injured two years in a row doesn't mean he "can't play 100 games a year."
20 homers and 80 RBI's ain't bad, especially considering the uncertainty that would be involved in going for the draft picks.
One thing that I didn't get a chance to check on-what are the chances Dunn resigns with the Reds? If the chance is, say, 40% or higher, they should keep him pretty much no matter what. They have a good enough pitching core that they're close to contending (if Dusty doesn't kill all of the young arms first). The last I saw, the chances weren't great for the Reds, but I haven't checked in a while.
Posted by: thehoagster07 | July 30, 2008 at 11:44 PM
Dunn is just a joke though. The guy is nothing more than a reasonably signed, oft-injured, average corner guy.
============================
ARE YOU KIDDING ME???
He leads the majors in HR
he has a respectable avg.. the thing that gets me is you say he is oft-injured... That tells me you don't know anything about Adam Dunn you Moron
--------------------
Notice how the first five words of that sentence you decided to start quoting in the middle of were "Offering Tracy straight up for..."? Yeah, I was saying that Dunn is obviously better than Tracy because he (meaning Tracy) is "nothing more than a reasonably signed, oft-injured, average corner guy." Now I would think anyone with even a modicum of intelligence could have figured that one out from the context. Seriously, what really gets me is that what really got you was that I didn't know Adam Dunn hadn't been injured. A normal person would probably think, "hey, maybe he's not talking about Adam Dunn," but not you. You assumed that I must be a moron who was just making something up about Dunn. What does this tell you about yourself?
Posted by: nixa37 | July 30, 2008 at 11:59 PM
Tracy for Dunn is not going to happen. A 1B/3B guy who is due 12mill over the next 2 years doesn't fit the Reds needs at all.
The DBacks need to hold on to Tracy and use him as part of a package to replace Hudson in the offseason. We'll have enough supplemental picks with the loss of Cruz, Hudson and Lyon.
Posted by: tmar | July 31, 2008 at 01:01 AM
^I would like to apologize to you...
I completely misread your comment... I did not deliberately mean to start it there... that is just how I read it the first time through...
Sorry again.. My bad
Posted by: redlegs-4 | July 31, 2008 at 01:04 AM
The Reds can't move Edwin to the OF. I don't know about the rest of Reds fans, but I'm tired of marginal outfielders. Griffey can't cover 5 feet of ground and every time he runs I think his leg will fall off, Dunn has always been shaky and made another error tonight, and Bruce isn't even a true Center.
Moving Edwin there only brings more outfield disasters for years to come. Hell, since we have Bako and Ross, why don't we give Valentin a shot out there to?
Posted by: RedsRedsReds | July 31, 2008 at 01:11 AM
I love the idea of Adam Dunn shaking things up for another team. I think whatever team gets Dunn has got to have a well balanced lineup. Dunn is a good player I just wish he didn't whiff so much.
Someone brought up the Reds OF situation. I totally agree that Griffey is losing AB because of the fielding strain. I think if Griffey were to DH he could be more like himself. Some team in the AL has got to be able to use Jr.
Posted by: manny24 | July 31, 2008 at 04:57 AM
Why would the Rays give up Hellickson for Dunn if they wouldn't do it for Bay?
Posted by: Monsterface | July 31, 2008 at 10:43 AM
Rays have to shite or get off the Pot, Why would you trade Hellickson for Dunn when they wouldn't for Bay who is light years better
Incompetence still is the word with the Rays
Posted by: Starchild | July 31, 2008 at 10:47 AM
Rays have to shite or get off the Pot, Why would you trade Hellickson for Dunn when they wouldn't for Bay who is light years better
Incompetence still is the word with the Rays
Posted by: Starchild | July 31, 2008 at 10:48 AM
God, why do the Dodgers not even ask about him?
Ethier, prospect not named mcdonald, and pierre where we eat half his contract for Dunn.
Something of that nature. Come on, do something dodgers.
Of course as I say that they will trade kemp, martin, loney, kershaw, broxton, or billingsley, who should all be untradeable.
Posted by: Ivdown | July 31, 2008 at 10:49 AM
what if the pirates are loading up all this manny talk just to raise the price on the bay to bay deal....trying to land davis or hellickson....im pretty sure the manny deal will fall through and the buccos will trade bay to the rays.....THEN the rays unload hellickson or davis with perez to the reds for Dunn.....Bay would play right on an everyday scenero and Dunn would DH.....
Posted by: j dello | July 31, 2008 at 10:55 AM
Adam Dunn is the biggest slugger in baseball right now, and the most underrated player. Here is an article comparing him to Ryan Howard (the most overrated bum in the game):
http://droppedthirdstrike.typepad.com/dropped_third_strike/2008/07/adam-dunn-vs-ry.html
Posted by: dtsmike | July 31, 2008 at 11:57 AM
Maybe CIN gets pulled into the Manny trade talks (since it appears that PIT is balking). BOS ends up with Dunn, FLA gets Manny, CIN gets ???
Posted by: kosmo @ www.ObservingCasually.com | July 31, 2008 at 01:12 PM