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Wigginton Too Pricey For Twins?
According to Joe Christensen of the Minneapolis Star-Tribune:
The Twins like Ty Wigginton but believe he's looking for a bigger contract than the three-year, $17.5 million deal the Los Angeles Dodgers gave Casey Blake. So the Twins have had little to no dialogue with Wigginton's agent, Dan Lozano.
I had Wigginton pegged for two years and $12MM or so, but he is four years younger than Blake and outhit him in 2008 (though he had 172 fewer plate appearances and was largely aided by Minute Maid Park). If Wiggy can really get a better contract than Blake, it would've made sense for the Astros to tender him a contract and then trade him.
Christensen adds that the Twins still have hope for acquiring Mark DeRosa, but talks for Garrett Atkins and Adrian Beltre hit dead ends. Also, Jon Heyman tosses the Twins into the mix for Michael Young. We'd previously heard about the Mets, Angels, Dodgers, and Royals discussing him. Heyman did not find evidence talks for Young got serious with any team, though, and he wonders if Young would approve a trade to Minnesota.
In other Twins news, Christensen notes that the Twins expressed interest in free agent reliever Brandon Lyon, who seems to be waiting until Brian Fuentes signs.
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Twins can't be afraid to pay someone outside the organization if they want to get over the hump anytime soon.
Wigginton is clearly better than Blake, so it makes sense that he's asking for more money.
Posted by: bigpat | December 17, 2008 at 10:10 AM
Is DeRosa's name still being floated around? I figured his name only came up due to the Peavy dealings. What do the Twins have to offer for him?
Posted by: Jammin502 | December 17, 2008 at 10:12 AM
I was hoping the Giants would offer a 2yr deal, and move Sandoval to 1B...but if he wants 3 or more...Pablo will be our 3B this season!!
Posted by: 55saveslives | December 17, 2008 at 10:15 AM
We'll have to see what kind of interest Wiggy gets. It seems like a lot of teams have interest but have we seen any kind of offer? If nothing comes up right away theres no reason to think the Twins wont' get involved if the price comes down.
Posted by: MNRunLeft | December 17, 2008 at 10:16 AM
I can already see it coming on opening day when opening day lineups are announced, "Playing 3B (insert next Mike Lamb) for the Twins" when the Twins could have had Wiggy for maybe even giving him 6.5, even 7 million a year for 2-3 years and been worth every penny...
Posted by: johns | December 17, 2008 at 10:25 AM
They can't afford Ty Wigginton but they can pay a declining Michael Young $16MM a season?
I find that hard to believe.
Maybe if we hadn't wasted $8.5MM on Punto, we could afford Wigginton.
Great signing Bill!
But hey, at least you kept our idiot manager happy by re-signing and overpaying his useless best friend...
Posted by: MorneauVP | December 17, 2008 at 10:28 AM
I really hope the Twins sign Lyon, finding someone to take over the set up role is even more important than 3rd base imo.
Posted by: MNRunLeft | December 17, 2008 at 10:31 AM
Vitters and Pie for Span and Blackburn?
Posted by: Bleacher_Buddha | December 17, 2008 at 10:35 AM
Looks like this was supposed to be the year the Twins made a big splash in the offseason and improved the team significantly.
Why do I believe the hype every year?
The Twins need to look at a trade instead of FA. FA for the Twins just turns into...
Ponson, Hernandez, Everett, Batista, White...
Posted by: Pohlad's Penny Pinchers | December 17, 2008 at 10:37 AM
We get a lefty bat and a pitcher you get your 3b for the future and a lefty replacement for Span
Posted by: Bleacher_Buddha | December 17, 2008 at 10:37 AM
Yeah I don't think Young makes any sense for Minnesota financially. Even with Young at 5/60 since $20M was a signing bonus, that's clearly too pricy for that team. Maybe if the Rangers ate like $10M+ but I don't see it happening.
I really don't think the Twins need that much help on offense. Maybe they can move Cuddyer for some pop at, but otherwise I would expect a lineup based around Mauer, Morneau, Kubel, Span, Young, Casilla, Gomez, Punto and Harris/Buscher to be solid, if not good.
Posted by: scribbletone | December 17, 2008 at 10:40 AM
Isn't Vitters the offensive savior of the Cubs farm system?
Would dealing him be worth the risk of Span coming back down to reality?
Is Span going to work at Wrigley, or in a lineup that isn't totally based on speed and fundamentals like the Twins?
Posted by: MinnesotaMasher | December 17, 2008 at 10:43 AM
"Vitters and Pie for Span and Blackburn?"
Let's get this straight. The rumor is that the Twins still are interested in obtaining DeRosa. And somehow out of that you propose Vitters and Pie for Span and Blackburn. But no where do you include DeRosa.....the player they are interested in.
LMAO! Isn't there a way to filter out the truely stupid posts?
Posted by: E K | December 17, 2008 at 10:48 AM
Excuse me EK.. sorry to offend your superior sensibilities. It was a simply a suggestion.
I doubt the twins will acquire D-Ro. If they do, what good does it do? He is a 1 year rental. He is a FA next year. It would make more sense to me.. that the Cubs who are trying to win the Series in the very short window they have, to keep Derosa.
While the Twins don’t move in to their park until next year and are too cheap to get a 3 year deal for Wigginton at 7 per would want a young stud 3b under control for a while. Plus with the depth of pitching on the farm it’s a position of strength...
Maybe if you think outside the box a little you might have caught that. But next time I will be sure to use small words for you.
Posted by: Bleacher_Buddha | December 17, 2008 at 10:57 AM
Yeah, I don't think Vitters gets moved unless it's for a star. They really need him to develop, and hopefully he can replace one of our big three (Lee, Ramirez, Soriano) in a couple years.
If the Cubs could pull off some sort of DeRosa and pitching/prospects for Span deal, I'd be giddy.
Span would be great in their lineup and he could leadoff, and the Twins get DeRosa for third and can replace Span with Cuddyer.
Posted by: scribbletone | December 17, 2008 at 10:58 AM
MinneMasher,
I think that having a hitter like vitters behind either Cuddy or Morneau would add a little pop.
As for the Savior of the Cubs, he may be.. he is thier only legit Blue chipper but to get a solid young arm and young lefty outfielder who has shown something who and are fairly cheap for now might make sense. But with hendry picking up Gaithright I just dont know what makes sense any more.
Posted by: Bleacher_Buddha | December 17, 2008 at 11:02 AM
Scribbletone your probalby right.. I think that Vitters does get moved for a star or saved but if the Cubs feel pressure they may move him in desperation to win this year or next... I dont know how much time they have before they have to blow it up and start again.
The Cubs do have some very intersting SS prospects at the lower levels. But.. I doubt it would get Span and Blackburn even with De-Ro. But I honestly believe that Derosa is a cub this year.
Posted by: Bleacher_Buddha | December 17, 2008 at 11:05 AM
"Excuse me EK.. sorry to offend your superior sensibilities."
I'll excuse you this one time. Now please stick to the topic at hand.
Posted by: E K | December 17, 2008 at 11:05 AM
The reason Wigginton doesn't get much attention in the FA market is because he hits much better in the 2nd half of the season and the past few seasons he's been on teams that are either way out of it in the 2nd half or just on the fringe of Wild Card contention. He doesn't get much exposure, but he's definitely better than Blake and it was real dumb for the Astros to non-tender him.
Posted by: Teetz1 | December 17, 2008 at 11:09 AM
"I think that having a hitter like vitters behind either Cuddy or Morneau would add a little pop."
Vitters isn't going to be ready until mid 2010 at the earliest, and he doesn't project to hit for more than 25-30 HR power. The value in his bat will likely lie in a high BA, a frenzy of doubles, and a very good OBP. Basically, as Goldstein says, his perfect world projection as a hitter is Vladimir Guerrero, with slightly less power.
Posted by: scribbletone | December 17, 2008 at 11:11 AM
"He doesn't get much exposure, but he's definitely better than Blake and it was real dumb for the Astros to non-tender him."
Totally agree. It shocks me that the Astros couldn't find a trade partner to move Wigginton, considering how many teams appear to be in on him now.
Ever since the end of the Killer B's and the Clemens/Pettitte era, being an Astros fan must suck..
Posted by: scribbletone | December 17, 2008 at 11:12 AM
the twins are in a slightly different predicament this year, however in the end it's still the same result. in years past, pohlad just wouldn't cough up the money for anyone (however the twins were still contenders somehow through good scouting and development). but this year, just like last year, the twins are something like $20 million under budget for their payroll. as a twins' fan, it's the same old frustration year after year...
i'm not advocating going out and throwing their money everywhere, nor am i going to get into if wiggington is a good fit for the twins, but in today's baseball market, you've got to be willing to spend a little money. twins are all too willing to be constantly outbid. look at the blake signing. wiggy's going to get a pretty decent contract this year. by that i mean he's not going to be cheap, but i don't think he will be overpad. plus, he's a free agent, without arbitration. a team doesn't have to give up anything to get him, just a little money. however, once again, the twins are just not going to pony up...
Posted by: Jon Elliot | December 17, 2008 at 11:27 AM
I feel for you Jon. But the Twins still manage to put together a pretty good team. I am looking forward to the new ballpark and hopefully a bit higher payroll.
I think the core is there a peice or two and you shoudl be in good shape. Most folks had the twins finishing only ahead of the Royals last year... and they were right there until the last game.
Posted by: Bleacher_Buddha | December 17, 2008 at 12:29 PM
DeRosa and Derrek Lee have basically become the same hitter in the Cubs lineup. Say .300 hitter give or take 20 points and around 20 homeruns. The tougher part of losing DeRosa would be his ability to play 6 positions on the field. I really don't see the Cubs trading him for prospects, since the window to win is now. I could see him traded in the Peavy deal, or for someone like Brian Roberts or Chone Figgins.
Posted by: Jammin502 | December 17, 2008 at 12:33 PM
Lee has far more upside as a hitter than DeRosa, his numbers have never matched what he's put up the past three years. Lee has much more power potential as well as the ability to make more contact, as evidenced by his performance in 2005.
Posted by: scribbletone | December 17, 2008 at 12:42 PM
I am suprised that the Twins have not talked to the Padres more about Kouzmanoff.
Young, good fielder, good hitter. I would think the Pads quest for young pitching would be a solid match for the Twins and Pads to do a deal.
What does anyone think Kouz is worth ?
Posted by: Just another idiot | December 17, 2008 at 12:50 PM
I think LEN3 had said the Twins had some interest in Kouz, but I've also seen some Twins writes say the second Kevin Slowey's name is brought up the Twins hang up the phone. So if the Pads want Slowey for Kouz theirs a dead end to that deal.
Posted by: MNRunLeft | December 17, 2008 at 01:13 PM
Kouzmanoff has serious power but lacks plate discipline. His .299 OBP last season is a clear reflection of that. He has legitimate 30+ HR power though, and his OBP was dragged down some by playing I'm SD.
Also, Kouzmanoff isn't that young (27 next season) and is a very poor defensive 3B. He'll likely need to move to LF or 1B within a couple years.
Posted by: scribbletone | December 17, 2008 at 01:29 PM
the only third-baseman that the twins should even considered trading for is beltre. however, there's no way that they will happen considering what the mariners will want in return. there's no point in trading for someone like kouz if someone like wiggy is available on the market considering there's not a whole lot of difference between the two. yes, slowey and baker should be, and probably are untouchable.
BB: you're right in us being just a piece or two away from a really good team, but as was my point earlier, what's the point of a higher payroll if you're not willing to go out there and use it? it'll all just go into pohlad's pocket. again.
Posted by: Jon Elliot | December 17, 2008 at 01:34 PM
Twins fans also need to realize that they may be needing to win now. While they did manage to get Morneau locked up at a good rate, Maur's contract expires exactly when he is eligible for FA status and no guarantee he will take a home team discount and Wiggy would be about the only protection in 2009 that Maur and Morneau is going to get judging from the trade/FA rumors going around regarding the twins.
Posted by: johns | December 17, 2008 at 02:05 PM
johns-
The Twins still have Kubel, Young and Cuddyer to protect the M&M boys, as well as some good speed guys in Span, Gomez and Casilla.
They are far from in trouble offensively next season, unless Span and Casilla regress some.
Posted by: scribbletone | December 17, 2008 at 03:08 PM
Twins FA signings. WARNING YOU MAY CRY IF YOU READ THIS
07
Randy Ruiz
Howie Clark
Jon Knott
Eli Whiteside
Brian Bass
R.A. Dickey
Adam Everett
Mike Lamb
Zach Day
Randy Keisler
Livan Hernandez
06
Carmen Cali
Ken Harvey
Mike Venafro
Jeff Cirillo
Luis Rodriguez
Sidney Ponson
Brad Voyles
Randy Choate
Matt LeCroy
Ramon Ortiz
Brian Bass
05
Mike Smith
Glenn Williams
Jason Hart
Tony Batista
Shawn Wooten
Andres Torres
Matt Ford
Rondell White
Darrell May
Ryan Glynn
Peter Munro
Tim Raines Jr.
Ruben Sierra
Dennys Reyes
Steve Lomasney
04
Jason Tyner
Gil Velazquez
Juan Castro
Mike Redmond
Brad Radke
Bud Smith
Glenn Williams
Terry Mulholland
Trey Hodges
Pat Strange
Brent Abernathy
Andy Fox
Eric Munson
C.J. Nitkowski
Armando Rios
03
Seth Greisinger
Chris Heintz
Peter Munro
Joe Roa
Shannon Stewart
Henry Blanco
Kevin Tolar
Aaron Fultz
Juan Diaz
Rick Helling
Brian Simmons
Jose Offerman
02
Ben Ford
Carlos Pulido
Chris Gomez
Jose Rodriguez
Mike Fetters
Kenny Rogers
01
David Lamb
Kurt Abbott
Mike Jackson
Alex Prieto
David Lee
Jose Mijares
Warren Morris
Mike Trombley
Garrett Jones
Posted by: Twins GM | December 17, 2008 at 03:09 PM
hey, 4 out of 75 ain't bad...
Posted by: Jon Elliot | December 17, 2008 at 03:14 PM
everyone is too pricey for the twins
Posted by: jedstylesux | December 17, 2008 at 03:24 PM
I would imagine that a Cubs-Twins deal would have to center around DeRosa (3B?) for Kubel (LH RF).
What do you Twins fans think of Kubel, anyway?
Posted by: jrfukudome | December 17, 2008 at 04:02 PM
Scribbletone,
I had forgotten about Kubel having a pretty decent year in 2008, but do remember that Cuddyer was awful last season and Young strikes fear in few also, since remember that guy from his Tampa days and was glad he was dealt away.
Maur and Morneau need some protection, granted it would be nice if Cuddyer would get back to his 2006-2007 form, but Wigginton is a good bat and classy player, positive clubhouse presence also that can only help the Twins in more ways than with his bat that also remember fondly from his Tampa days.
Posted by: johns | December 17, 2008 at 04:03 PM
fukudome,
kubel got past his knee issues of past years and put together a pretty decent season, but not stellar. all in all, he's a good kid, but i wouldn't expect too much more production out of him than what you saw in 2008.
that being said, there's no way the cubs would accept that deal straight up. the twins would definitely have to sweeten the pot.
Posted by: Jon Elliot | December 17, 2008 at 04:10 PM
oh yeah, and his defense could be better...
Posted by: Jon Elliot | December 17, 2008 at 04:16 PM
Oh, Twins Gm . . . Did you have to, really . . .
As if this offseason isn't going painfully enough . . .
If the Twins don't sign Wiggington for a three year deal people are right that the trade route is the way to go.
Unfortunately, Beltre will cost too much for a one year rental, although I do wonder if Span + Perkins/Swarzak/Humber/Mulvey/Duensing and a lower level prospect if need be could get it done. . .
Cantu and Kouzmanoff would both provide the right handed power . . . and horrid D. Plus dealing with Kevin Towers is like pulling teeth and Slowey is going nowhere. Perhaps Edwin Encarnacion? What might it take to get him away from Cincy? I tend to think it'd be more than the Harris/Slama package suggested here:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/71151-edwin-encarnacion-anyone
And, while I don't want to see Delmon traded, the Reds need a righty hitting outfielder to go with Dickerson and Bruce . . .
Delmon for EE and Jared Burton or Mike Lincoln?
They'd still have the cash to pursue Lyon and that'd get the power right handed stick at 3B, and add some depth to the 'pen
Twins gotta do something now, because it seems like Valencia is at least a couple of years away and that Luke Hughes didn't hit as well in AAA as he did in New Britain, and his Ks need to come down, so they are going to have to find a 3B solution at the big league level for the next few years..
This year and next are their "win now" window. not just scrap and compete like evrey year, but legitimately, win NOW. If they'd just spend a little money or make the moves, I think they have a real good chance at the division crown and better than the last few times showing in October
Posted by: my poor buccos | December 17, 2008 at 04:26 PM
Oh, Seeing as he's a fourth OF right now, would it have to be Delmon for EE straight up?
EE plays poor D . . .but with Young's value low right now (while his upside remains as high as Iver I believe/really hope) could the Twins get one of the better Cincy relievers in that deal?
Posted by: my poor buccos | December 17, 2008 at 04:30 PM
If the Twins dont' sing Wigginton I'd expect them to try to sign Lyon and platoon Harris and Busher at 3rd.
I think people are underestimating Kubel's value. He's got 30 HR potential (hit 20 last season) and should be able to hit to somewhere in the .270-.290 range. A lot will depend on his ability to stay healthy but hopefully that won't be an issue with him DHing.
No thanks when it comes to EE5, he's better suited in the OF rather than at 3rd anyways.
Posted by: MNRunLeft | December 17, 2008 at 04:45 PM
If Kubel gets LHP figured out a bit, he could be a scary offensive player. He put up some ridiculous minor league numbers, but destroyed his knee before he ever got a shot in the Majors really.
He's got some scary power when he makes good contact, but his fielding is admittedly not good. He wouldn't be pretty in RF for the Cubs.
However, he'd be pretty hitting in the middle of the lineup I'd say.
I think if the Cubs had the chance to take a 27-year-old right fielder with 30 HR potential in exchange for one year of DeRosa, they would do it.
Kubel will probably make around $3MM this year in arbitration, and could be locked up to an extension.
I actually think that would be a bad trade for the Twins, as Kubel is the best thing we've had going at DH in years.
As for people mentioning Span, the price on him would be insane - but Scribble hinted at the possibility that e's going to come back down to Earth... and he is. HARD. I'd love the Twins to trade him now, but they won't.
Whoever said Span/Blackburn for Vitters/Pie... Pie's a throw-in to almost any deal at this point, and the Twins aren't going to trade two of their young players that they love for a 19-year-old third baseman who hasn't made it past A-ball.
Posted by: MorneauVP | December 17, 2008 at 06:37 PM
MorneauVP,
No, I don't think so.
The Cubs wouldn't trade DeRosa for someone that DeRo can outproduce at the same position. Besides, we're shooting for a free agent lefty that has actually proven something...somewhere.
Posted by: Kory26 | December 17, 2008 at 10:22 PM