Sheffield, Mets Agree To Deal

I see this as nothing more than a signing to keep Sheffield out of Philadelphia.

Team number 8... and counting.

Significant playing time? At whose expense?
I just don't see it. To me, he brings nothing to the table that the Mets need. I personally think he's done.

Dear God please be a late April Fool's joke.

Sherman is often wrong.

I just felt like I would throw this out there:

Sheffield last played the outfield full time in 2005, when he was 36, and he posted a -26.8 UZR. The year before, a -17.4 UZR.

Now he's 40, and has played a grand total of 203 innings in the outfield since 2005.

And they'd like him to play the outfield, consistently.

Think about that..

scribble... I don't think anyone wants to think about that. Sheffield only makes sense for DH... and he isn't hitting enough to make sense for most teams to put him as a DH... .220something average last season in 114 games. Ouch. As a Yankee fan who remembers Sheffield well we kept Abreu over him. Abreu... the gold glover lol

Yeah, all I can think if is....why????? This makes no sense to me whatsoever.

I honestly think that it's a move to block the Phillies. I think that Sheffield has a little bit left in the tank, so he's an upgrade over Marlon Anderson. I'm not sure how long he'll last in Queens...

As the owner of Johan and Mike Pelfrey in one league, I am not happy about this. But in real life, I do see the potential upside. Hopefully Beltran can make Sheffield look less bad in the OF than he might otherwise.

"As a Braves fan, I love this! Please start Sheffield in the outfield every day."

This is the most telling statement on the signing. When your rivals are happy you are giving "significant playing time" to an over-the-hill, non-fielding, one-time-slugger that can no longer hit a FB (where you play in the FB league), well...

I give it three weeks before he is on the DL. It will only take 2 weeks for him to accumulate 5 errors though. Might as well of kept Alou in my eyes; he probably would have played as many games and you know he could still hit at least.

Sheffield at league minimum can't hurt, although I think he needs to be kept as a pinch hitter only. There's zero reason he should be in the field, period.

The poor Mets are already homesick for asbestos-ridden Shea, so they're bringing in the closest thing: Gary Sheffield.

melonis - you dont want him as a pinch hitter. He will complain.

I think you all are missing the point: Mets wanted a Right handed power bat off the bench. Significant playing time after 6/7 innings in my opinion. Although I don't know what happens to Tatis' playing time now which I was looking foward to.

But he's gonna cost 1.6 million less than Thames would have cost us. I see pros and cons.

"That being said Sheffield sucked the last 2 years (plus Spring Training) and can't play the outfield and is a jerk in the clubhouse. Nothing major here.
"

he sucked in 2008. He was still very productive in 2007.
I think people also take Ryan Church having a bounce back season for granted. He was so good before his injury, but post concussion, he was not a ML caliber hitter, and like Metzfan22 said, this gives a push to Murph and Church. What's the risk here? Upside for 400 grand? If it is a month into the year and Sheff is struggling, you just cut him loose.

"12:08pm: Sherman adds that Mets GM Omar Minaya spoke to Sheffield directly recently to explain how he'd fit with the team. Meanwhile, several Phillies players have contacted Sheffield to lobby him to sign."

Lol. You make it sounds like Phillies players are calling him and begging him to sign with the Mets, which is would I'dbe doing to if I was on the Phillies. If I was the Mets I'd put him in the starting lineup and hope he hits hits 500th home run on opening day, and then release him immediately afterwards.

It is also curious to me why people care what type of person Gary Sheffield is personally. Who cares? If you don't want him because you think he is finished, okay, but if you don't want him cuz he is sort of a dick? Really? Who cares it isn't like you have to hang out with the guy.

Sheffield wanted to play for Mets. He knows he's gonna start maybe 2 games a week and I'm pretty sure he is ok with that considering no one had plans of giving him a full-time job.

His teammates in Detroit loved him. I think the media (as is most cases) makes bigger deals of things than what is factual. Good signing.

Too bad this isn't Pedro who I've wanted since October.

Sorry guys. My post keeps doubling even when I only click once. I hate Type Key

I have been vocal that I think Sheffield still has more play in him.

But, having said that...

Why is only NL teams talking to him? The dude still can contribute as a hitter. I'm convinced. But as a fielder? Not so much.

Aside from the fact that he can't hit and can't field, Sheffield clearly stated he wants regular playing time. Which is probably what Minaya promised him in order to get him on board. When he fails to get that time (since, as others have pointed out, his only possible utility is a RH bat off the bench) he will bitch and moan and destroy clubhouse chemistry which will make Joe Morgan cry.

Overall I don't see the point to this signing. There are other pinch-hitting options. Dude hasn't slugged .500 since 2005 - the power's not going to make a comeback in his age-40 season.

I'm on my blackberry. But thanks for telling me I have a sucky computer, I knew that already which is why I like my blackberry :)

"And Sheffield is such a positive, outgoing personality that he never disrupts chemistry.

And Sheffield loves to work with rookies and "give back" when he isn't playing, never back-biting or talking ill about his teammates.

And Sheffield comes with little baggage over the course of his career, so he'll be a pleasure to handle; never drawing attention away from the rest of the team's accomplishments."

If he disrupts team chemistry at all, then he is cut, no loss. He is on his last chance. He has no leverage.

""If it doesn't work out, what do you lose?"

Winnable games."

He isn't so horrible that he is going to cause teams to lose games by himself. I would rather have him getting PT in LF then Garret Anderson, truthfully.

"Sheffield wanted to play for Mets. He knows he's gonna start maybe 2 games a week and I'm pretty sure he is ok with that considering no one had plans of giving him a full-time job.

His teammates in Detroit loved him. I think the media (as is most cases) makes bigger deals of things than what is factual. Good signing.

Too bad this isn't Pedro who I've wanted since October."

I absolutely concur. On all your points, good post. I wish Pedro would come back also.

I really like the upside of this signing. Everyone thought Delgado was done last year, then he came back with a terriffic second half. Who knows what Sheff will do? If he hits then awesome, if not release him. If he complains because he isnt getting playing time, release him. 400k is nothing in baseball terms. can anyone argue that he is not an improvement over marlon anderson, who didnt field or hit last year and his left handed bat hurts the balance of the bench.

Might as well signed frank thomas to play right field.

Scribble -- I always respect your opinion on here, but i disagree with ya on Sheff. If he hits anywhere near 2007 levels this is a very good move from the mets. Marlon Anderson was the PH before sheff came in. Sheff could sacrifice a chicken in LF as long as he hits the ball hard and away from fielders for all i care

The more I think about it; maybe Sheffield just really impressed the Mets during his private workout. Oh wait…

And that is kind of the thing here. We have a player which was released from his AL club (which ate 14 Million to get rid of him) because of his lack of ability to play the OF and provide flexibility to the club. His playing in only 58% of the teams games the last three years, with only 39 of those being in the field (yes, he has averaged 13 games a year in the OF over the last three years) probably helped this decision quite a bit as well. Oh, and his complaining about not getting enough playing time (in the outfield none the less), and his .254/.355/.436 line over that 58% playing time the last three years might have been a factor.

So he is released. And what is the first thing we realize? Well, that not a single AL club wants anything to do with him (you know, the ones that have seen him playing regularly and have a DH spot they can use him in). But here comes the Mets (a team without a DH) guaranteeing “significant playing time” to a player they have not seen on the field since June 26th, 2005! How can they guarantee “significant playing time” to a DH that they have not seen on the field for 3 and half years? And why is it only now that a DH with questionable hitting ability is even seen as a fit for their club? Why weren’t they looking for another bat prior to an over the hill DH with major injury concerns, a bad attitude and diminishing skills at the plate was available?

If I were a Mets fan, I would be furious right about now. Signing Sheffield while passing up names like Abreu, Dunn, Burrell, etc… down to even Anderson and Griffey and Andrew Jones and Jim Edmonds and Luis Gonzalez and others. Well, this shows that the team was just unwilling to spend any money, at all, despite recognizing an area they could use help in. Are they cheap? No, obviously not because they have overspent for others. But why they would not properly allot money to all areas the team is in need of is beyond me.

And really, they are basically paying Sheffield 1.55 Million (at least, depending on the base they agree to) if they are releasing Anderson to add him to the club. But that 1.55 million (or more) couldn’t have been spent on someone who would actually fit your club a little better? (you know, someone who could have actually played the position you now expect him to play) Now instead they are spending that money on a player they have no idea can field, stay healthy, or even hit anymore really. Well, really? That is a good idea?

Just for the record. The following is a list of guys who Omar Minaya signed for crumbs in the last couple years, who also were done, and proceeded to have significant roles with the team.

Darren Oliver
Jose Valentin
Chad Bradford (to an extent)
Fernando Tatis

No matter what people want to say, there is no downside here. If he doesn't perform like they want him to, they can cut him at any moment. There is no monetary commitment to him. People (mostly Braves fans) hoping he is going to come in the clubhouse, turn everybody against eachother, cause pandemonium, and run this team into the ground are delusional. If he isn't happy with a bench role (if that is how he ends up being used), then good bye, see ya later Sheff. The first time this guy opens his mouth he will be gone.

I completely agree with nrmax88 ... if he returns to 2007 levels then he is better than Church or Murphy. If the guy is a bum you cut him and walk away.

The team is going to know how good Sheff really is. It shouldn't take long to figure out if the guy has anything left in the tank.

He signed! An early Christmas present for the rest of the NL East. I can already see current Mets players saying "We're glad we got him" as they whisper "What the F-" under their breath.

i'm assuming a platoon in right field now? this kinda screws tatis, but he'll play a lot of first and third i guess. no great risk here i guess, if its just 400k

Couldn't agree more, viteminj.

I just don't get this. Not unless it's a straight swap for a PH off the bench with Marlon. But since Sheffield wanted to come to a team who would guarantee playing time, then what the????

I love when fans talk about clubhouse chemistry

...almost as much as I like when they talk about players who are "gritty" and "play with passion".

until I hear something from Sheffield about what he thinks his role with the team is going to be, I'll withhold judgement.

If says he expects to play OF and maybe a little 1B (after a little work) once or twice a week, plus be the main right handed bat off the bench, then this is a good signing, with the potential to be more than that.

If he says he expects to be a starter, then Omar is an idiot.

Sheffield in 2007: "I called it years ago. What I called is that you're going to see more black faces, but there ain't no English going to be coming out. … [It's about] being able to tell [Latin players] what to do -- being able to control them," he told the magazine.

"Where I'm from, you can't control us. You might get a guy to do it that way for a while because he wants to benefit, but in the end, he is going to go back to being who he is. And that's a person that you're going to talk to with respect, you're going to talk to like a man.

"These are the things my race demands. So, if you're equally good as this Latin player, guess who's going to get sent home? I know a lot of players that are home now can outplay a lot of these guys."

Haha, what a great fit on the Mets.

Love this move by the Mets. If Reyes, Wright, Beltran, Delgado, and Sheff hit to their potential that lineup should rake!

Horrible move. Even if he does return to his 2007 stats, the bad will still outweigh the good. Sheff is very bad on defense, a terrible clubhouse presence (If you are being 14 million dollars not to play, then you must be a REALLY bad clubhouse presence.)And there are really no indications he will return to his 2007 form.

To the people suggesting he will be a good pinch hitter - Sheffield is 40 years old and has lost most of his bat speed. If you think he can come off the bench cold (something he would whine about doing) and get a hit, you are outta your mind.

Tatis playing a lot of 1st & 3rd? You'd better send that memo out to David Wright & Carlos Delgado.

I think those projections are a little high for Shef. He's going from a hitters park to a neutralish park.

That reminds me... who's getting cut because of this? Anderson?

You know, my knee-jerk reaction to this signing was very negative. But looking at it a little closer, I don't necessarily mind it. It really puts Church under some pressure, but it sounds like Sheff will only get to play if he hits.

The thing that really sold me, or at least made me think twice, was the PECOTA Beta rating for the Mets RF candidates. "Beta" is essentially a measure of riskiness a player carries. The definition in the BP Glossary:

"A measure of the relative volatility of a player's EqA or EqERA forecast, as determined from his comparables. The Beta for an average major league player is 1.00; players with Beta's higher than 1.00 have more volatile forecasts than others ("riskier"), while Betas lower than 1.00 represent less volatile forecasts ("less risky"). Betas are adjusted for the amount of playing time that a player is expected to receive. Thus, a player's Beta will not be higher simply because he's expected to receive less playing time (as a relief pitcher might as compared with a starter, for example), which naturally produces more variance because of higher sample sizes."

Beta for each potential Mets RF:

Ryan Church: 1.21
Fernando Tatis: 1.68
Gary Sheffield: 0.91
Jeremy Reed: 0.91

That 1.68 for Tatis is enormously high, and the 1.21 for Church is pretty risky too. Now contrast that with the weighted mean projected EqA for each player as well. EqA is essentially a representation of a position player's offensive value broken into a percentage (like AVG), not accounting for playing time. EqA does account for baserunning, but not defense. The EqA of an average major league player is .260. Here's how projected EqA looks for the same group:

Ryan Church: .267
Jeremy Reed: .266
Fernando Tatis: .258
Gary Sheffield: .271

Obviously, the big question is defense. But considering Tatis isn't anything special defensively himself, this really could be a nice move. Sheffield is just another option. PECOTA projects his WARP to be somewhere between -1.1 (10th percentile) to 2.9 (90th percentile), most likely falling somewhere around 1.0 (weighted mean). Even if he's worth just half a win, Sheffield will still be well worth his 400k salary combined with Marlon Anderson's salary. If he hits one the lower end of his projection, no biggie, $400k wasted, release him and Nick Evans gets a shot.

I don't think LF is really in the discussion here. The Mets are clearly sky high on Daniel Murphy, and he'd have to really struggle before LF became a big part of this discussion. Sheffield clearly doesn't have the range he once had, but the one defensive thing Omar went out of his way to mention at the press conference was that Sheff's arm seemed to be in good shape and he was throwing well. If that's true, he might actually be a better option in RF than LF anyway, though RF in CitiField does look incredibly complicated.

MEddler-

Totally, totally agree with everything you said. And, Murphy can very easily play RF if Sheff hits well enough to platoon with Church. Murphy came up through the system as a 3B, if I'm right.

_________________

I have a question though, for the more intelligible Mets fans. Could Murphy get some PT at 2B as well on days that Tatis or Sheffield is playing in the OF? Luis Castillo, obviously, blows, and Murphy would be a plus offensive 2B. Obviously, it wouldn't be on days that Mike Pelfrey was pitching though.

melonis rex-
Murphy has played second in a winter league. No one really knows yet if he will play at second. My guess is if Castillo has a repeat of 2008, it'll work out like this-
2nd- Murphy
LF- Sheffield
RF- church
With Castillo being cut. I don't think they will release or bench Castillo just to make room for Sheffield. Omar seems determined to give Castillo a second chance. It is a very confusing situation to say the least.

"Suzy... pitiful? Cheap? Since you are a Cubs fan, who's team just gave away Mark Derosa for nothing, because they didn't want to pay him, you should be the furious one. "
----
Mark DeRosa is an average, at best, baseball player coming off of a peak year at the age of 33. The likelihood of that happening again is slim.

First club to see two players make the 500 club in the same season? thats all i see this.

definately not going to see anything except replacing marlon anderson as a pinch-hitter. ill take sheffield over anderson any day in that situation.

“Suzy... pitiful? Cheap? Since you are a Cubs fan, who's team just gave away Mark Derosa for nothing, because they didn't want to pay him, you should be the furious one.

How is it pitiful? They were perfectly ready to go into the season with what they already had, they just saw a chance to possibly upgrade, with no risk. Sheff was very productive in 2007, and injured last year. No reason why somebody shouldn't be willing to take a chance on him for the league minimum.”

Well first, yes, I think the DeRosa deal was a horrible move. But, at least there was some logic behind it. It did open a spot for a younger player, and the money saved went towards other players. Then there was speculation that one or two of the players received could have been coveted by the Padres for Peavy, and DeRosa can not be expected to repeat his numbers anyway. So you can see, as bad as the deal was, it at least made some sense.

This move though? Well, replace an extremely versatile player you are going to pay anyway, to bring in a 40+ year old often injured DH who has posted a fairly similar line the last three years to the player you are releasing so he can get significant playing time in the OF? Again, a player that was released from his previous club because of the fact that he was limited to DH and the club needed more versatility. Again, a player who was replaced by Josh Anderson. And I mean, what, the upside you are hoping for is something somewhere between the line Marlon Anderson posted between 2006 and 2007? So the only real difference is you are paying an extra 400K (on top of the money you are now paying Anderson to go away) and losing the ability to play your fourth outfield in the field (that means each OF spot, as well as at second in a pinch).

I guess Sheffield has a flashier name, but that is really the only thing added here. Everything else is subtraction.

Sorry, that should read -0.2 VORP, not -2.5. -2.5 was his 50th percentile, weighted mean was -0.2.

Still, Marlon's 90th percentile WARP is 1.1. Sheffield's weighted mean is 1.0, and 90th percentile is 2.9, at least as of now (this should change once defense is accounted for).

''I have a question though, for the more intelligible Mets fans. Could Murphy get some PT at 2B as well on days that Tatis or Sheffield is playing in the OF? Luis Castillo, obviously, blows, and Murphy would be a plus offensive 2B. Obviously, it wouldn't be on days that Mike Pelfrey was pitching though. ''

The whole plan of Murphy being in the Winter League was to get him 40 starts at second, especially if Castillo was going to stink up the joint this year. The Mets made a plan that Murphy would have been playing second particularly on days where Santana and Oliver Perez would be pitching because of the obvious fly-ball tendencies.

Although he wasn't exactly Ozzie Smith out there during the AFL, this ''experiment'' was done primarily for this reason. I do think this has something to do with Sheffield's signing, since you now have four outfielders for two positions. Even though the media has only alluded to this idea of Murphy being a part-time contributor at second, this does make sense.

Personally I have absolutely no clue if this deal will work out, but it's not for a big monetary commitment, and if he's even a shell of his former self Sheffield could be a pretty terrorizing middle-of-the-order presence. It all depends on his shoulder and his relative health at 40, but you can't ignore the fact that he's only a year removed from a 20-20 season at 38. The Mets did need another right-handed bat - whether he's the answer will remain to be seen.

And for whoever is throwing Marlon Anderson's stats out there as him being a better alternative had better turn on SNY or a national Mets broadcast. The Mets have enough left-handed bats, and Anderson is about as inept in the field as Sheffield is.

I was throwing his stats out to show how UNvaluable, and UNversatile he is, contrary to SuzysMan

Marlon Anderson is only capable of playing 1B and LF, and he plays them both equally badly, with absolutely no offense at all. If you think Marlon Anderson is versatile, just let us know so we can know not to take you seriously in the future. Marlon Anderson is about as versatile as David Ortiz is.