New York Rumors: Beltran, Lee, Jeter, Santos

Rangers officials have told friends that they expect the Yankees to offer Cliff Lee so many years that other teams will have to back off, according to Joel Sherman of the New York Post. But team president Nolan Ryan is expected to push aggressively for Lee's return, so it's far too early to rule Texas out. Here's the latest on the Yankees and the Mets:

  • Carlos Beltran says he'd prefer to play center field, but is open to playing right, according to MLB.com's Anthony DiComo (on Twitter). Beltran also told reporters he would consider waiving his no-trade clause.
  • Sherman predicts the Yankees will sign Lee to a five-year $125MM deal. The imagined contract would pay Lee $23MM for five seasons with a sixth year option for $25MM ($10MM buyout).
  • The Yankees say they're extremely unlikely to pursue a free agent catcher, since they want to give their young catching a real chance to emerge in 2011 as Jorge Posada transitions to DH.
  • Mark Simon of ESPNNewYork.com looks back at some recent contracts to prove that locking up pitchers to long-term deals is risky.
  • The Yankees don't want to surrender a draft pick to sign a Type A free agent like Scott Downs, according to Newsday's Ken Davidoff (on Twitter).
  • It's unlikely that the Yankees will agree to a deal with Derek Jeter next week, according to Andrew Marchand of ESPNNewYork.com.
  • There's been a lot of Moneyball talk about the Mets front office, but Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports believes Sandy Alderson, J.P. Ricciardi and Paul DePodesta are not about ideology. "This is about picking the right players and all of the different ways it can be done."
  • Alderson interviewed Clint Hurdle and Don Wakamatsu at Citi Field yesterday, according to Adam Rubin of ESPNNewYork.com.  Next up, the GM will interview Mets Triple-A manager Ken Oberkfell in the Dominican Republic.
  • Omir Santos and Mike Hessman are free agents after refusing minor league assignments, according to Rubin (on Twitter).


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106 Comments on "New York Rumors: Beltran, Lee, Jeter, Santos"


myname_989
4 years 9 months ago

Anything more than four years becomes a gamble for Cliff Lee. Sure, the guy is one of the best pitchers in the game, but at 32, he’s not getting any younger. He’s also had various injuries, including his back, which could always end up being a real problem for pitchers. I’m not saying that he’s injury prone, by any means, but it has to be in the back of any team’s mind, especially a team that is going to pay him 23MM a year over, “so many years that other teams will back off.”

MetsEventually
4 years 9 months ago

Fluke Lee

MB923
4 years 9 months ago

Some pitchers have some of their best years at later ages. Andy Pettitte if he remained healthy would have had one of the best years of his career if he stayed consistent. Mike Mussina’s final season was one of his best season. Randy Johnson the year before he was traded to the Yankees had one of his best seasons and lost the Cy Young Award to Clemens

Now although this is rare to happen, you can’t just assume old age = less effective. I’m not saying Cliff Lee will be as good or better than he is currently, but it’s not guaranteed that he won’t.

myname_989
4 years 9 months ago

I wasn’t trying to imply that he’s going to become less effective as he ages, simply because he’s Cliff Lee. Lol. I just don’t think it’s a good idea to go over four years with him. Five tops. Although there are certain exceptions to the rule, guys like Mike Mussina, like YanksFan pointed out below, I just think that a 23MM a year investment for that long a period is risky for all teams, regardless of what their payroll is.

BoomDizzle
4 years 9 months ago

“Some pitchers have some of their best years at later ages. Andy Pettitte if he remained healthy would have had one of the best years of his career if he stayed consistent”.

Hello? Andy Pettite uses PED’s. I think that has something to do with his performance over his later years.

Infield Fly
4 years 9 months ago

“Hello? Andy Pettite uses PED’s.”* CORRECTION: Pettitte USED PED’s. That’s over with.Point taken, however.

MB923
4 years 9 months ago

I sincerely doubt taking PED’s/HGH or whatever would carry over 7+ years later. A-Rod used to take steroids, look how poorly his numbers are compared to when he did take his.

4 years 9 months ago

I’m not trying to argue and I know AROD took PEDs, but his production may also be going down due to his age.

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

and his hip injuries(big pivot point in the swing) but his production is still above league average but lower then his rangers years yes

Tko11
4 years 9 months ago

Doesnt your body breakdown faster due to using steriods?? So in the end the injuries may be as a result of the steriod use.

moonraker45
4 years 9 months ago

definitely .. but hard to directly correlate.

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

I think Mike Mussina is a good comparison to the Lee situation. They were both pitchers that relied on a 93-94 mph FB, good control and a great mix of off speed stuff. Mussina signed w/ the Yanks at age 32. He went thru a bump in the road or two towards the end of the deal as he moved from a power FB kind of guy to a 89-90 mph guy. But because of his ability to be a real pitcher instead of a thrower he became dominant.

4 years 9 months ago

They both also threw/throw a sick Knuckle Curve

depaolo_creed
4 years 9 months ago

I agree, back problems never entirely go away, they just get worse as you get older.

Infield Fly
4 years 9 months ago

It almost feels like the Mets are turning the manager search into a “world tour” to excite the fan base — in case that’s the only meaningful action the team will be involved in this winter. But with all the holes and question marks this team’s got, that doesn’t exactly do it for me…

rockfordone
4 years 9 months ago

Sandy hire Ryan Sandberg

Guest
4 years 9 months ago

I’m already beginning to pine for Zach Grienke in TX. I love Cliff Lee, but I’m not giving him 7 years at 23 mil + per year. That’s insane for any team except the Yankees

Baseball really needs to do something else to correct the competitive imbalance r/n. I know they have revenue sharing, and that helps a little. But when a team like the Rangers, coming off a WS appearance w/ a young, inexpensive core and lots of money to play w/ this winter can’t even afford to resign their ace, how is that fair? This isn’t a matter of Nolan Ryan and Chuck Greenberg pocketing their money from the revenue sharing and letting Lee walk, this is a matter of signing the guy to a franchise crippling contract or letting him walk to the team that makes like three times as much revenue as everyone else in the league every year. I know it’ll never happen, but baseball needs a salary cap. Big time

Guest
4 years 9 months ago

And for the record, I’m not even hating on the Yankees here. If the Rangers made the kind money they did and had the flexibility to spend big every winter, I’m sure I would be all for them doing it too. The fault lies in the system. It’s bogus, and it makes me sick thinking about it

Sorry for the rant, but I really needed to get that off my chest

Yanksfan5575
4 years 9 months ago

Dont you know that the Yankees are not the richest team in the league? Infact there are many more rich owners out there then the yanks so plz stop with the salary cap stuff. The rangers have plenty money and they just got bailed out from mlb and dont have to pay a tax if I understood right so they can afford any one they want.

Yanksfan5575
4 years 9 months ago

And they have there own network this yr ( rangers ) so there revenue will be much higher then any other yr

Sleepykarl
4 years 9 months ago

Actually it’s not their own network, same channel as it was on before. Secondly, that contract doesn’t kick in until 2015 and most of the bonus was used in paying off the purchase of the team.

Guest
4 years 9 months ago

It’s not a matter of how rich they are, it’s a matter of how much money they generate. The Yankees are a money making machine, and I’ve read they make hundreds of millions of dollars despite perenially having a payroll around $200 mil. It’s a fact of life that no other team makes anywhere close to that. Unless I’m misunderstanding something, I don’t believe the Steinbrenners have to spend much (if any) of their own money despite how much they pay their players. And that won’t change even by adding Cliff Lee this winter.

The Rangers, on the other hand, will have money to play with. But they can’t afford to take on a 7 yr $160-180 mil commitment for a 32 yr old pitcher, no matter how good he is. If we resigned Lee to that kind of deal, and then extended Hamilton, Cruz, etc, we’d be well on our way to bankruptcy again. B/c although we made money, we don’t make anywhere near THAT kind of money. So our owners would have to dig into their own pockets to keep the ship afloat, so to speak. Almost every team is in the same boat as well, with possible exceptions for the Red Sox, Cubs and Mets.

I mean, correct me if I’m wrong. But that’s how I’m understanding things to be right now

MadmanTX
4 years 9 months ago

Seems like the new cable deal plus the increased attendance likely for next season if Lee is resigned would add some money to the Rangers coffers. Not to mention an increased sale of merchandise for a team that is the current AL champ. I don’t think the kind of commitment you mention is a bankruptcy waiting to happen for the Rangers. Not unless the new ownership is completely cash poor after the purchase of the club. One would think that isn’t the case.

Guest
4 years 9 months ago

The new cable deal doesn’t take effect for a few seasons though. And one would think the Rangers are in the best shape anyone could hope to be in going into a bidding war w/ the Yanks, but nobody has the near unlimited finances they do. No matter what the Rangers offer him, and I think they’ll give him a more than competitive offer, the Yanks can always one up them. Which is extremely frustrating, and unfair

I think it’s going to take more than 5 years to get Lee too. I would think the Rangers could trump 5 years $125 mil with about a 6 year $115 mil deal, and no state income tax. What I’ve been reading is that it’s going to be around 7 yrs $160-170 mil from the Yankees. Which is just lunacy. As is a $10 mil buyout….seriously?

Yanksfan5575
4 years 9 months ago

Perhaps you should read more into what you are saying. For the past few yrs the yankees have made close to nothing despite what all people think. They lost money for a few yrs strait just a few yrs ago. I think that all teams should have to spend a dollar amount on there playes and not pocket all this money. You cant tell me that the rangers didnt take in more then 50 million last yr in revenue. The ones who owned them prior to Nolan Ryan didnt want to spend and had other obligations to spend his money on.

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

want to know how much money the yankees make, just look at their brand new stadium, the ticket prices and all the yankees shirt, hoodies, jackets, sweatpants, hats and all other merch all over the country

4 years 9 months ago

Everybody talks about how the Yankees spend money. Try talking about how the Rangers got bailed out by Bud Selig and MLB to the tune of 32 million dollars. They then took that money and rented Cliff Lee. It was great move for their team and fans. But really, that money came from the rest of the league’s work. Stop worrying about how the Yankee’s spend the money they generate and worry about how other teams are run. The Yankee model puts a competetive team on the field every year. In turn, their fans buy tickets, watch games on TV, and buy Yankee merchandise. Sounds like a good investment to me.

Guest
4 years 9 months ago

I specifically said that I wasn’t criticizing the Yankees above. I was criticizing the system. And Tom Hicks is a moron; every Rangers fan out there will tell you that. And we didn’t literally borrow money to go acquire Cliff Lee. We passed a budget by Bud Selig last winter that I believe was approved by the owners in baseball, and began the season below that budget on purpose for the sole reason of maintaining flexibility for a mid season acquisition. Like Lee. We did nothing wrong, just the Yankees haven’t done anything wrong by spending money on big ticket free agents and maintaining a massive payroll. They played within the system

dickylarue
4 years 9 months ago

The Rangers were the better team this post season. Their payroll was a fraction of the Yankees. There is no competitive advantage.

However winning costs money.

What people forget about the Yankees was in the early part of the 90’s Baltimore and Toronto had higher payrolls. You know why? Because they were winning. When you win your players cost more if you want to resign them and keep the winning team together.

What happened to the Yankees payroll this decade is that they won so much in the late 90’s it cost a fortune to keep that team together. In order to keep their stars, they had to pay top dollar or lose them. The Yankees almost lost Bernie Williams to the Red Sox as a free agent and had to match their higher offer to keep him. The Yankees had match the Mets offer for Posada which added salary and years to his current deal. If Mariano Rivera was your teams closer do you let him walk or do you pay him what he asks for?

The Yankee payroll was caused by winning and it has never had a chance to recover since they continue to win.

The Rangers are about to learn that winning like they just did costs a lot more to keep it going. That’s not the Yankees fault. Look at baseball history. Teams that win get expensive as the years go on.

The Phillies have learned that lesson. The Red Sox have learned that lesson. Hell, the Twins have learned the lesson that in order to keep winning you have to spend more to keep your best players.

That’s how baseball works.

You let your stars walk and you are constantly rebuilding.

You keep a core of stars together and pay them what they are worth in order to keep winning and your payroll skyrockets.

The situation the Yankees deal with each year is that the older stars they locked up to long term deals can’t do it all on their own and they are forced to supplement with top free agents when their system doesn’t provide answers.

However, I don’t see why the Yankees should not try to sign top free agents when they have so much invested in their team already. This morality play that the Yankees should pass on Lee and his ilk for the good of the game sickens me.

Where was the outcry when the Red Sox added Lackey last season and stole him from those gritty gutty Angels? Or when Boston got Victor Martinez from Cle for pennies on the dollar at the trade deadline?

The only reason most of you have your panties in a bunch is that it’s Cliff Lee and he makes too much sense in the current Yankee rotation if they should sign him. He’ll make them better and they’ll keep winning…and it will cost more.

The Yankees tried in 2008 to go with 3 kids in the rotation and they missed the playoffs.

Winning costs money.

4 years 9 months ago

wait, wait wait…. the yankee payroll is caused by winning?? no one made them trade with the rangers to pick up A-Rod, and no one MADE them re-sign him when he opted out. No one made the yankees sign Mark Teixiera. no one made them sign CC Sabathia. Those 3 players and being paid nearly $78 Million combined. That’s more than 11 TEAMS payroll.

You proceed to say something about paying your stars what they are worth in order to keep them, but then contradict yourself by saying the Yankees have to sign top free agents in order to supplement their stars. This means that the Yankees arent paying their stars what they are worth, they are OVER paying.
Is CC Sabathia worth $24M? probably not, but they yankees are willing to OVER pay in order to get him. If A-Rod is worth $33M, Josh Hamilton is worth $40M, and Miguel Cabrera is worth at least $35M

4 years 9 months ago

Wow, someone has NO idea what they are talking about. 1) The Rangers, while owned by Tom Hicks and in bankruptcy, were on a line of credit from MLB. That money was paid back when Rangers Baseball Express (Nolan Ryan & Chuck Greenberg) bought the team. 2) Cliff Lee was NOT paid any money that was borrowed. The Texas Rangers traded EXTRA players to Seattle so that Seattle would pick up most of his contract. That is a common practice in baseball, just to let you know. 3) the Yankee “model” is unreplicateable. ONLY the Boston Red Sox can get their gear sold in every state like the Yankees. However, BoSox gear is outsold in EVERY non-home turf state by Yankee gear.

BoomDizzle
4 years 9 months ago

“Dont you know that the Yankees are not the richest team in the league?”

More non-sensical drivel from Yankee fans. Do you think the Steinbrenner’s spend the money out of their own pocket? No, the Yankees have the most revenue and therefore have more money to spend than everyone else (with the Red Sox a close second). That is why a salary cap is needed so that other teams have a better chance at competing with the Yankees. Why does every other major sports league have a salary cap?

The Yankee fans view a salary cap the way a vampire views daylight. They hate it because their clear advantage would come to an end.

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

NY has always had an allure that drew players to them over most other markets. Let’s not act as if the Yanks were always outspending teams by 5:1 ratio. If you were a top talent and most things were equal I imagine a lot of players would see NY as more inviting then say, KC.

Vmmercan
4 years 9 months ago

“That is why a salary cap is needed so that other teams have a better chance at competing with the Yankees. Why does every other major sports league have a salary cap?”

Go look at the championships in other sports…What other league has more parity even with three different types of salary caps?

Baseball needs a salary floor and if you aren’t in the right location to compensate or you have unwilling owners, these teams need to go to locations and owners who will be able to properly fund them. Period.

4 years 9 months ago

ummm, there IS a salary floor, you just dont want to do the math to figure it out. the League minimum is $10Million. That would be paying 25 people $400k. You can’t raise that without forcing other teams out of profitability… You could, however, say that league minimum is $400k, but Team minimum is $20M, meaning that if a team wanted to field nothing but rookies, they’d have to pay each of them double.

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

If you want to get technical then yeah the league minimum x 25 is the least that a team can spend. However, in the spirit of what’s intended, there is no salary floor set by mlb.

Vmmercan
4 years 9 months ago

And as listed below, NY has a distinct advantage in addition to payroll. Manhattan night life is simply better, more powerful and more lively than any other city in the country. Not to mention all the other athlete and people appeals that New York has to offer. It has a geographical advantage other players (and their wives) don’t generally want to pass up.

4 years 9 months ago

could you be a little more vague in your expoundings? Whether Manhattan night life is better than anywhere else is purely opinion. “Not to mention all the other… appeals” yeah, you didn’t even mention one. and what “geographical advantage” does NYC have?

moonraker45
4 years 9 months ago

The salary cap is ruining the NHL

It bridges the gap between the rich and poor and the good and bad

but mostly what it does is make every team painfully mediocre..

a little restraint from the yankees and a little more spending from the marlins would be nice, but honestly its not worth if teams are all going to be average after.

kevinfoley46
4 years 9 months ago

Nationals have the richest owner. Proof that wealth isn’t the main factor as much as the owners willingness to spend.

4 years 9 months ago

The Nationals owner is willing to spend, just hasn’t had any takers yet. When Texeria was on the market, the Nationals beat the Yankees offer by $20M, and Texeria signed with the Yankees anyway. If that were to happen with Lee, he and his agent would follow the money this time out. If the Rangers/Red Sox/Yankees/Nationals get into a bidding war, you could see a record breaking contract for Lee… regardless who he signs with.

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

seriously just imagine how baseball would be if mark cuban would be allowed to buy a team (BUD IS MESSING UP BIG TIME NOT ALLOWING THIS GUY IN THE LEAGUE HE WOULD MAKE ONE TEAM A TON BETTER BY ALLOWING SOME OF HIS BILLIONS TO BE SPENT)

4 years 9 months ago

Not only does Baseball need a cap… say around $150M, but I think this pill would be easier for the union to swallow if it came with a Salary minimum. Imagine if the union got a salary minimum of $60M. Teams like Florida, San Diego and Pittsburgh would have to get off their asses and actually make an effort!

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

again wont happen, how would it work with contracts already in place…there is no way that the union or players lawyers would allow the contracts they already signed to be redone…even if it were possible to make an exemption to current deals it would take years for the salary cap to actually work…and there is ready is a league minimum for salary…I would love to see it happen but it wont in any of our lifetimes, or at least as long as bud”i have no clue what im doing” selig is in charge

Zuidvogels
4 years 9 months ago

Good thing he is retiring after 2012..

4 years 9 months ago

Fine you don’t get revenue sharing from the rich big market teams either..

4 years 9 months ago

While baseball might need a salary cap, doing so could hurt more than it might help. In today’s market, baseball is 3rd in sports, behind football and basketball. The Yankees’ success is good for baseball in general, though i don’t like that it is true. A league minimum of $60M would require MORE revenue sharing. Some teams might not have a fan base that will be able to support that payroll. Though, i do believe that no owner should be allowed to pocket ANY revenue sharings.

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

A meanigful salary cap has to be at least $100 mil and that would mean the end of baseball in florida. Regardless of how well they play or how much their income is supplemented they would not be able to survive at anything above $60 mil.

4 years 9 months ago

salary CAP of $100M?? or a salary FLOOR of $100M?? your opening statement contradicts the rest of your post. IF you mean salary cap, half the Yankees payroll has to go, say bye bye to all your stars… well they’d be grandfathered in, but as soon as their contracts came up, they’d have to leave, they couldnt re-sign for anything more than league minimum until the Yankees got under the limit. IF you mean a salary floor of $100M, i think you’re insane. There’s no guarantee that half the teams could survive at that level. The Rangers are going to find out if they can. 11 team operated at less than $75M, there’s no guarantee that you could get enough fans to float the difference (via increased ticket and merchandise sales). The Padres operated at less than $40M. Then you wind up having to move teams out of areas because it’s not economically feasible. The Yankees have to give up market share as 4 teams move to the NYC area to remain feasible. Say hello to the Staten Island Padres, Manhattan Diamondbacks, Wall Street Pirates, and the Queens Royals

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

its not a matter of resigning him its a matter of years…The nolan and the GM and the owners have all said that they have the resources to resign lee. Its just a matter of if they want to match or even beat the years other teams might give him…I will say this i do agree about needing more competitive balance, maybe mroe revenue sharing or bigger % of revenue from big market teams should be moved…there will never be a salary cap in baseball(THERE SHOULD BE) but it would be way to hard to start and implement

eneff
4 years 9 months ago

Ridiculous… Competitive imbalance? The Giants and Rangers made the World Series this year… How is that an imbalance? The Rangers just signed a multi-billion dollar tv contract with Fox Sports and Nolan got $70 million up front… The Rangers have the money… Spend it!!! “How is that fair?” Baseball, like life, is not supposed to be fair. There can only be one world series champion, how is that fair to the other 29 teams? In the last 10 years, 9 different teams have won the world series… I don’t understand where you people are coming from! A salary cap is a ridiculous idea… If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it!

4 years 9 months ago

Well, I get what you’re saying but it’s hard to argue about competitive balance when low revenue teams are still making the playoffs every year. The Reds, Rays, Rangers. The Padres almost made it. Not to mention high revenue, big spending teams like the Mets, Cubs, Dodgers, Red Sox, White Sox and others were shut out. Money certainly helps but it’s not the end all, be all. The Yankees simply do (most) things right, if not they’d be in the same shape as the Mets. The Rays have done things right for awhile too and look where they are.

Pittsburgh, KC, Milwaukee and perhaps a few others might argue that additional revenue sharing would help but the fact is that they have all made plenty of mistakes. The Brewers made the playoffs in ’08 but haven’t been able to capitalize on what they’ve got, with better decisions made on the pitchers they’ve brought in they could have gone back. They can’t afford to make $14 million dollar a year mistakes on guys like Jeff Suppan, but they did. No amount of revenue sharing is going to fix that.

Better, smarter front offices are the cheapest way to improve a team over the long haul, revenue sharing only encourages greedy owners (I’m talking to you, Jeffrey Loria) to line their pockets and bad front offices to squander more money. The Yankees have an advantage and they use it wisely without breaking any rules. That’s just how it is.

Slopeboy
4 years 9 months ago

I don’t have a real preference for Mets manager, but Hurdle would be a good choice. He’s had a taste of winning, knows the game, played briefly in NY, so he can handle the media circus that is NY and has respect around the league. But most of all he’s a guy that flies under the radar,but will take no crap from any of the Mets Prima Donnas and can lead the team forward.

Zuidvogels
4 years 9 months ago

At this point Grienke might be the best bet for Texas. Younger, cheaper and over the next few season could give you comparable performance level to Lee. It’s going to cost a few top notch prospects. But I think that is less risky then giving a 32 year old 5+ years @ 25M per.

Anyone else find it funny that Lee would be making more then CC but would be the #2? Any chance CC has a problem with that and pulls an Arod and opt out only to come back in at a higher AAV? Just playing devils advocate.

Infield Fly
4 years 9 months ago

“Any chance CC has a problem with that and pulls an Arod and opt out only to come back in at a higher AAV?”

I could be wrong but CC seems WAY too down-to-earth and levelheaded to let something like that get to him. I think he probably knows that there is always somebody who is going to get a bigger contract than he has down the line….and that hey, he IS taken care of. Besides, he’s unlikely to begrudge one of his best pals in the game (whose wife is great pals with his wife). I just don’t see it.

So to sum it up, CC’s got perspective and is not an idiot. Whereas A-Rod….
Never mind.

Zuidvogels
4 years 9 months ago

Listen it may not bother him. But being the #1 SP on the highest spending team in MLB and having someone behind you making more would bother a lot of players. Could be nothing though.

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

I don’t think it will take $25 mil per. I can’t see any team matching them @ $23 per either. IF it has to go to $25 mil then do it. IF Pettitte comes back in 2011 then so be it. If not then we have plenty of low cost starting pitching coming up in the next few years to offset CC and Lee’s contracts.

MadmanTX
4 years 9 months ago

Since this is Cliff Lee and not Chan Ho Park, the Rangers and the new ownership can shoot the dice and sign Lee to a 5-7 year deal. Nolan Ryan can assess pitchers and he obviously thinks highly of Lee. Maybe he thinks a guy with Lee’s ability to work fast and control his pitches can pitch into his 40s like he did. So at 32, a 7 year deal would lock Lee up til he is 39…that’s not so old if Lee turns out to be one of those pitchers who can endure. A better workout regimen can strengthen his back and make it less balky.

Ryan and the Rangers have to decide if they are going to limit themselves on Lee…then who is going to be their ace for the next 5 years. CJ Wilson isn’t it. Neither is Colby Lewis right now. They have young pitchers coming up, but who’s to say one is an ace? Trade for one? Then, they have to decide…pay big money to Lee and keep their talent or let Lee go, take the draft picks as compensation and then trade a bunch of talent to the Rays or Royals for a Greinke or Garza..if even a lot of talent is enough to make a deal.

Lee keeps the Rangers in contention and I will repeat myself that they need him more than the Yankees do. I think a dark horse team like the Nats could drive up the price, but the Rangers have to make their bid an overpriced one…because as the years pass and if Lee stays healthy, then as other contracts go up, the one for Lee won’t look so overpriced anymore. Especially if keeping Lee makes the Rangers a perennial World Series contender for the duration of the contract.

Not to mention having Lee around to help train the up and coming minor league talent means a lot. It’d be like having a second pitching coach around. How much is a great pitching coach worth these days?

4 years 9 months ago

MadmanTX, you forgot to mention that Nolan Ryan pitched into his 40s without a level of control ANYWHERE near that of Cliff Lee. I have been saying for a while now that the Texas Rangers need to put eggs in a few different baskets. They need to see what it would take to get Zack Greinke here EVEN if they manage to re-sign Cliff Lee.

The biggest question is who do you let go of. I would start with some people that aren’t expected to start in the big leagues this coming season. Scott Feldman, Matt Harrison, Pedro Strop, Eric Hurley are all options. Sending those 4 as a package, assuming that it would be accepted, would protect your best prospects (Scheppers and Perez)

pound30
4 years 9 months ago

Grienke would be nice but you have to remember he had anxiety issues or whatever. They already said he wouldn’t play for new york for that reason. I would think he would do fine in Texas for the most part but what about playoffs? I would worry he would become a headcase and not be very effective in real pressure situations.

4 years 9 months ago

I’m so tired of hearing the Yankee haters preach about the Yankees spending more than anyone else. Don’t blame Steinbrenners’ (or Yankee fans) for prioritizing winning above turning a profit. If you want to play the “its not fair that they spend so much” card, then you have to take into account the Luxury (cough cough Yankee) Tax and the fact that between that tax and revenue sharing, Yankee profits wind up falling into the pockets of greedy owners such as Jeffrey Loria. How is that fair? …. It’s a double edged sword, the entire system is flawed.

eneff
4 years 9 months ago

Every time I make this argument nobody ever replies… just like no one has replied to yours haha Nobody can argue with it! And nobody wants to admit that whoever owns their team is greedy

4 years 9 months ago

I just want to point out something I read in the past. The taxpayers of NY are not exactly paying for the new Yankee Stadium. The Yankee ownership group got subsidized loans to build the new Yankee Stadium. If you dont know what that means–the Yankees got low interest loans from the government to finance the building of their new stadium. Its just good business. Why would a government not approve those loans for the Yankees? They bring in millions in tourist money every year to the city. Thats why. I live in nyc and I am certainly happy this was done.

4 years 9 months ago

If 5 years for 125 is all the Yankees offer, Lee will sign with someone else. Lee says he expects a CC like contract. That is 6 years at $160M… if the Yankees are unwilling to go that high, I think the Rangers, Nationals, Red Sox and Orioles will be more than happy to pony it up for Lee’s services.

We’ll see how bad New York really wants him because $125M will not get the job done.

4 years 9 months ago

If no one was willing to pay CC that huge contract besides that Yankees, why would you assume anyone would now shell out that kind of money for someone who is 2 years older than CC was when he signed?

No way anyone tops 150mil unless its the Yankees, and I highly doubt the highest offer will even reach 150mil.

4 years 9 months ago

The Nationals offered Texeria $180M which was more than what the Yankees were offering when he signed with them instead. Many people have been quoted in saying that Lee will go to the highest bidder. If the Yankees are not willing to give Lee a CC contract, the Nats have proven they are willing to give him that kind of contract. I think he’ll be with the Rangers in the end, but if all the Yanks offer is $125M, they are not getting Lee.

4 years 9 months ago

First off, get your facts straight. Tex signed for 180mil w/ the Yankees, thus equal to and not less than the Nats offer. And tex is a poor example to compare to Lee, he was 4 years younger than Lee is now when he signed and thus received an 8 year deal worth that much.

Second, everything you’ve just said is strictly your opinion and can’t possibly be backed up. Unless your spoken to Lee himself, then there’s no possible way to know that he’ll go to the highest bidder, anything to that sense is pure speculation. Of course thats what his agent wants everyone to believe because it’ll be conducive to a bidding war. And secondly, there’s no possible way at this stage in free agency that you can declaratively say that Lee wouldn’t go to the Yankees for 125mil.

4 years 9 months ago

Lee said publically and through his agent that he wants a CC contract. By that figure, the Yankees are almost $40M short. You don’t think the Rangers or another team might take advantage of that and up the ante?

I was incorrect about the Nationals price, but not the difference. They overbid the Yankees by $20M, cause their offer was $200M. It’s a fact that Texeria signed in NY for less cause he wanted to compete.

Do you always ask for sources, or just from people you don’t agree with?

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

Big difference between offering a position player mega bucks vs doing so for a pitcher. Perfect example is illustrated right with the Nats and the past two drafts. Which draftee was more of a riskier sign healthwise? Straburg or Harper? The Nats are praying that Stras comes back the same. In the back of their mind they know as well as anyone how risky it is to sign a pitcher to that deal.

Slopeboy
4 years 9 months ago

I think the Rangers, Nationals,Red Sox and Orioles will be surprised to know they’re going spend that kind of money on one 33 year old pitcher.

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

A) Lee didn’t publicly say what or how much he wanted. Ppl speculate that’s what he’s going to ask for simply because he’s the best pitcher on the market and the best player on the market uses the best contract signed as a template for their own deals. B) Even at 5/$125 that way surpasses the avg salary of any pitcher already signed. He might do well to accept that because I doubt anyone else is going to offer him that much. C) The Yanks were the ones that signed CC to his 7/$163 mil deal and I don’t think any other team was willing to go above $140 mil which would’ve been an avg of $20 mil per. Can you REALLY see the Rangers, Nats, Red Sox and Orioles willing to go $25 per for 6 or 7 years?

PookieGonzales
4 years 9 months ago

Beltran for Dice-k makes to much sense.

Zuidvogels
4 years 9 months ago

Except that Dice-K said he would only waive his NTC to go to the West coast.. doh..

PookieGonzales
4 years 9 months ago

Did he say the pubilcly? Must have missed it.

Zuidvogels
4 years 9 months ago

A couple reports have come out saying this. Nothing huge. Was more just taking the piss out of you 😀

MadmanTX
4 years 9 months ago

Sherman wishes that Lee will come that cheap. If that is the Yankees top offer, the Rangers will most certainly come up with a bigger bid.

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

Really? Let’s do the math.

5 year x $23mil + $10 mil option buyout = a guaranteed avg of $25 mil x 5 years.

5 years x $23 mil + $25 mil option = $140 mil w/ an avg of $23.3 mil.

You think the Rangers will ABSOLUTELY be willing to beat that deal? Arod was the only other Ranger player to ever come close to being paid what Lee is seeking and he was traded 4 years later despite averaging 52 hrs and 133 RBI. Now I understand completely the difference between the Rangers then and the Rangers now but one has to wonder how much they’ll commit to one player with guys like Hamilton, Cruz, Andrus, Felix and others coming into their pay days.

cubfan4life
4 years 9 months ago

As much as i would like to see Lee stay in Texas i have a feeling that his contract would end up like ARods did years ago.

Big money to one guy, Unable to resign in house guys or sign other upper level FA, players leave, out of contention, trade contract.

I think that almost the better option is to call up KC and make a deal for Grienke. He struggled this year but i dont think that we have seen him pitch his best baseball yet. His contract is reasonable 13.5M each year for the next 2. They have the prospects to get him. And it frees up money for Hamilton, Andrus, Wilson and Cruz. and may still allow them to pursue another FA arm to join Grienke, Wilson, Lewis, and Co. As well as bringing in a DH (Vlad or Thome) and a veteran Catcher (Olivo)

timmytwoshoezzz
4 years 9 months ago

The Derek Jeter contract negotiations is such a non-story. Derek’s going to stay in NY, he’s going to be there on a multi-year contract, and the dollars paid him in no way are going to affect the Yankees ability to sign any of the other free agents they are seeking. Someone please just tell us when it is finished and be done with it already.

Slopeboy
4 years 9 months ago

Are you nuts!!?? How do you expect to keep all these all important blog sites and
newspaper sales going?

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

beltran seems like the player and more improtantly the type of contract that kenny williams would love to get his hands on…

Zuidvogels
4 years 9 months ago

He doesn’t like dealing with Boras though. And not sure if Chicago is far enough west for Beltre’s liking. Reports are saying he would really like to be on the Weast coast. But I guess enough money will change his mind.

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

yeah sorry for the misunderstanding, i meant beltran not beltre

4 years 9 months ago

not sure the mets would gain anything worthwhile from trading beltran right now though…unless someone blows them away with an offer, which they won’t, they might be better off seeing if he can bounce back next season, and trade him if/when they fall out of contention

Slopeboy
4 years 9 months ago

Looks like Beltran is trying to impress the new bosses with his announcement of wanting to finish his career as a Met. Now he’s willing to waive his no trade contract and he’s willing to change position to help the team. That’s what he needed to do last year when it was evident he wasn’t ready to handle CF. He needs to not make too many comments and just be prepared to play and show he’s healthy.

jwsox
4 years 9 months ago

is there another legit CF in the mets system or is he saying all of that so his trade value is higher?

4 years 9 months ago

Yea his name is Angel Pagan, who is much better defensively at this point.

Ferrariman
4 years 9 months ago

Why would Beltran care about his trade value? I think that is a problem for the mets, not the player

4 years 9 months ago

If Don Wakamatsu was being interviewed by the Mets’, I hope the Mets asked the Jays permission to interview first.

dickylarue
4 years 9 months ago

They don’t have to. Wakamatsu has a clause in contract as bench coach in Toronto that if he’s asked to interview for a manager job, he’s allowed to without permission.

4 years 9 months ago

Really? How do you know? (It would be great if you could get me a link…)

wakefield4life
4 years 9 months ago

“The Yankees don’t want to surrender a draft pick to sign a Type A free agent like Scott Downs”

I don’t understand this. Aren’t they going hard for Cliff Lee? Isn’t Lee a Type A? Isn’t Lee a higher type A than Downs? You’d only potentially be giving up a 2nd rounder for Downs – the sandwich pick that isn’t taken from the Yankees would be worth more than the actual pick.

Also, didn’t Cashman say that left-handed relief pitching was a top priority for the Yanks?

I don’t believe this for a second. I think we’ll see more of a spending spree a la 2009. The Yanks are the type of team that would rather keep spending money once the first check is written – once they loose their first rounder, they don’t really care about keeping their later rounders secure. Sure, they’d love to have the pick, but they’re not banking on the pick.

Whole_New_World
4 years 9 months ago

Going even 5 years for Cliff Lee is insane. Going 5 years for almost ANY pitcher who qualifies for Free Agency is insane. And Lee will likely get 6 years. Barry Zito sends his best.

4 years 9 months ago

Give Hessman regular at-bats and he’d put up Russell Branyan-like numbers. He was also coming off of a hand injury when he joined the Mets. He’s been a 4-A player, but can definitely play for a team that has an opening.

Infield Fly
4 years 9 months ago

Got that right. My biggest fear is that after all the hoopla, Alderson & Co. will go with a name that has “Wally” + “Backman” in it — just to please the crowd (and that guy who hired him).

As a fan who is concerned with more than cosmetics, I want someone who can help mold the team into the contender they should be, and it takes more than just a name to do that. Wally’s been successful as a player in 1986, and recently as a manager in the minors….but this isn’t 1986….and regardless of rumors to the contrary, this isn’t the minors either!

4 years 9 months ago

Exactly. The Yankees can afford to worry about the present, for the most part, and worry about the future in the future. If Lee’s back goes out when he is 37 and he is on the DL all year, the Yankees won’t be crippled by his contract. They can just get someone else to replace him.

Also, no matter what happens with Lee, the Yankees will be portrayed as the losers on this site. If someone else gets him it will be “Oh the Yankees got beat at their own game and couldn’t land their prized pitcher. They are screwed.” If the Yankees do sign him it will be “The Yankees just signed another aging veteran to a long term deal. They are screwed.”

They should just give up because they will be screwed either way apparently.

Tko11
4 years 9 months ago

Hurdle sounds good.

EdinsonPickle
4 years 9 months ago

In regards to the Yanks signing Lee, you’re right, It’s just one of those classic, “Damned if you do, Damned if you don’t” situations.

Tko11
4 years 9 months ago

The Yankees realized that they messed up with the Arod contract and you can’t deny that they are regretting it. I just dont understand how a fan of baseball can actually endorse this kind of philosophy. Signing players by giving them overwhelming years and money(which other teams arent able to afford) and then if those players dont do anything the last few years of the contract thats ok according to you because it wont cripple the team. Something has to be done so that teams(not just the yankees) think about the repercussions of long term contracts. There will need to be a reform sooner or later, the only thing I can think of is a salary cap.

andrewyf
4 years 9 months ago

Thankfully for the Yankees, no one cares what people on this site think about them. The only thing they care about is that their fans love their team – and boy do they ever.

kevinfoley46
4 years 9 months ago

I agree, Hessman may strikeout a lot. But so does Mark Reynolds. So do a lot of guys. There is a place in baseball for guys like Hessman, if only as a bench player, he can be a scary guy to pitch to under the right circumstances.

eneff
4 years 9 months ago

You didn’t hear about it because the Nats never offered him that much lol All the writers were talking about Teixeira making $200 mil but the bidding only got to $180 mil (Yankees)

dickylarue
4 years 9 months ago

I’m fairly certain the Nats offered a 200 million deal to Tex. He’s not making it up.

alphakira
4 years 9 months ago

Wally was fired from a team called the “Joliet JackHammers” just 3 years ago…He’s had one season with the Cyclones…Why in God’s name does anyone think the guy deserves a shot at the big leagues already?! I’d love to see what he can do with the kids on the team, but can we give him a bench coach position for now instead of pushing him up so quickly?!

YanksFanSince78
4 years 9 months ago

Teams seldom come out and say what they offered but there WERE reports by “sources” that said Tex turned down 10/$200 mil from the Nats. That I clearly remember.

Dauger
4 years 9 months ago

I think a salary cap would be great. Make teams that dont spend money on payroll to put a quality product on the field have to.