DEC. 29, 10:07pm: Both teams have announced the trade. The Cubs will pay $3MM of Darvish’s remaining money, per Jordan Bastian of MLB.com and Heyman. Darvish has $62MM left on his contract – not the previously reported $59MM – because of the incentives he reached for finishing second in 2020 NL Cy Young voting, Bastian notes.
DEC. 28: The Cubs and Padres have agreed to a deal that will send right-hander Yu Darvish and catcher Victor Caratini from Chicago to San Diego, Mark Feinsand of MLB.com reports. The Cubs will receive righty Zach Davies, shortstops Reginald Preciado and Yeison Santana, and outfielders Owen Caissie and Ismael Mena in return. The trade is done pending medical records, and the sides could finalize it Tuesday, per Jon Heyman of MLB Network. Chicago will pick up “a minor portion” of Darvish’s remaining money, Bob Nightengale of USA Today adds.
This deal does not come as a surprise, as the two sides had been in deep discussions about Darvish throughout the day. It’s the latest bold strike for the Padres, who are coming off their first playoff season since 2006 and clearly plan to vie for their first-ever World Series title next year. Even before landing Darvish, they made a huge addition to their rotation Sunday by agreeing to pick up left-hander Blake Snell from the Rays. They also agreed to sign Korean infielder Ha-Seong Kim on Monday, making for an epic 24-hour period of dealmaking for GM A.J. Preller.
The Cubs, meanwhile, are losing perhaps their best starter in Darvish – a 2020 National League Cy Young finalist – as well as a quality catcher in Caratini. Although the Cubs are just a couple months removed from their fifth playoff berth in six years, ownership entered the offseason unlikely to spend after a pandemic-shortened campaign. Indeed, the Cubs previously saved money by saying goodbye to Kyle Schwarber and Albert Almora at the non-tender deadline, while pricey third baseman/outfielder Kris Bryant has been the subject of trade speculation. It’s unclear whether the Padres will take on all of Darvish’s remaining contract, but if they do, that’ll be $59MM on their books over the next three years. Caratini’s much more affordable, as he will earn a projected $1.2MM to $1.6MM in 2021. Caratini isn’t on track for free agency until after 2023.
In heading to San Diego, Darvish will reunite with Preller, who was part of the Rangers’ front office when they signed Darvish out of Japan before the 2012 season. Darvish, now 34, has since enjoyed a terrific career divided among the Rangers, Dodgers and Cubs, and last season was likely his best yet. He ended up with 76 innings of 2.01 ERA/2.23 FIP ball, posted 11.01 K/9 against 1.66 BB/9, and averaged a personal-high 95.5 mph on his fastball. He’ll now slot in near the top of a rotation that lost Mike Clevinger to Tommy John surgery but will still feature Snell, Dinelson Lamet and Chris Paddack as locks for rotation jobs (barring other aggressive moves). The Padres also boast multiple high-end pitching prospects, including MacKenzie Gore.
Caratini, 27, was Darvish’s personal catcher in Chicago, but he was a reserve behind No. 1 backstop Willson Contreras. Caratini debuted with the Cubs in 2017 and has since offered passable offense relative to his position, having batted .250/.327/.372 in 677 plate appearances. Caratini was also a well-regarded defender in Chicago, including when he ranked in Statcast’s 98th percentile in the pitch-framing department last season. He’ll join Austin Nola and Luis Campusano as catchers on the Padres’ 40-man roster.
For the Cubs, this deal represents their first blockbuster trade under new president of baseball operations Jed Hoyer, their former GM who earned a promotion after Theo Epstein stepped down in November. Losing Darvish and Caratini may not go over well for their fan base, but the Cubs are banking on Davies helping replace Darvish in 2021 and the young talent they received emerging as cornerstones.
Davies was somewhat quietly a top-tier starter in 2020, his only year as a Padre, as he recorded 69 1/3 frames of 2.73 ERA/3.88 FIP ball with 8.18 K/9 and 2.47 BB/9. He should look good alongside Kyle Hendricks as the Cubs’ one-two in 2021, though the 27-year-old Davies isn’t controllable beyond then. He’ll earn a projected $6.3MM to $10.6MM via arbitration next season.
The rest of the Cubs’ return doesn’t consist of any elite farmhands, but Kyle Glaser of Baseball America notes that BA was planning to rank Preciado (No. 15), Mena (17), Santana (18) and Caissie (20) among the Padres’ 20 best prospects in its upcoming Prospect Handbook.
Just 17 years old, BA rated Preciado 23rd in the Padres’ farm system midway through last season, writing that the 6-foot-4 switch hitter’s “frame provides hope he can grow into 20-plus home run power as he matures physically.”
Mena, 18, signed an expensive $2.2MM bonus with the Padres out of the Dominican Republic during the 2019-20 international signing period. BA lauded Mena’s speed, range and potential 15- to 20-home run power earlier this year.
The 20-year-old Santana put up impressive production in rookie ball from 2018-19, when he combined for a .306/.418/.425 line in 365 plate appearances. The Canadian-born Caissie, 18, was a second-round pick (No. 45) of the Padres last summer. BA wrote before the draft that Caissie possesses “exciting upside,” though there are “some significant swing-and-miss concerns” in his game.
All things considered, this looks like a trade between two NL playoff teams going in different directions. The Padres appear to be all in on playing for a championship in 2021. It’s hard to say the same for the Cubs, who seem to be a club in retooling mode.
Salary dump. Cubs have thrown in the towel like the rest of the NL Central
Towel Throwin’ Tom Ricketts! Holy “S” did Jed get FLEECED on this one! Maybe Theo would have fared a little better had he not jumped ship from this disaster!
Oh god you’re still around?
@ncaachampillini
LOL Illini champs? Of what? Women’s Volleyball? Bowling?
They have never won a championship in any major collegiate sport. They rarely ever win the Big 10 division in any sport (maybe once every decade or so).
Cubs did great. Top 20 padre prospects are top 10 for some teams. The cut a huge chunk of salary. They could take that money and sign other pitchers this year or later. Davies is a good arm for right now.
I believe Cubs are going for it one more year. They would love to trade bryant rizzo baez, they just don’t have enough value for the Cubs to move them. Unless the padres decide they want them.
Those prospects the Cubs got won’t be in their top 10 this winter. Maybe they’ll improve in the future (they are all at least 3-4 years away), but right now I’m not liking this trade. So much for “threading the needle”.
And geez, it gets worse, they’re even picking up some of Yu’s salary.
If the Padres aren’t taking on all of Darvish’s salary, then I don’t like this trade either.
And they threw in Caratini, too.
Are you new here @YourDreamGM?
They also gave Caratini up as well. Who’s going to be their C once Contreras is gone?
Amaya
No Morejon. No Weathers. No Lange. They didn’t get any starting pitching prospects, which is easily the weakest part of their system. I don’t think there’s any guarantee Marques, Azolay, or Franklin become starting pitchers in the Majors (I hope they all are).
When reading that neither Abrams, Hassell, or Campusano were going to the Cubs, I figured they’d at least get Morejon and Weathers. This trade did not address their organizational weaknesses, and for a team supposedly competing for the NL Central, this is a suspicious trade. Getting Weathers and Morejon would constitute a “retool” for 2021-22, filling out the rotation with cheap, cost-controlled pitchers with upside potential. But this return tells me it’s going for a “heavy rebuild.”
I like the return the Pirates got better for Josh Bell, getting Will Crowe and Eddy Yean, who were probably the prospects the Nationals were offering for Bryant. Those two are at least young pitching prospects with upside.
Hopefully the Cubs’ pitching lab gets going with some starting pitching results!!!!
A
M
A
Y
A
Is a 22yr old stud!!!!! Up this year starting in 2022
No. Just been haven’t commented much until these last few days of trades. And just added a avatar tonight.
All 4 of our best players? I can see Bryant getting traded, But Rizzo? Mr. Consistent? Javy? after 1 off year?
@cubs2016champs they are all free agents in a year. Would you rather get something for them now or lose them for nothing?
Justify “huge chunk of salary”….For me and you as employer and employee astronomical. For a 3rd largest market team to pay $20 Million for a Cy Young candidate and a generational player is dirt cheap for this front office.
We get in return when we have the best young one in the game and they were supposedly high on Ed Howard. Horrible move. Can’t wait to hear what Kap has to say on this one.
Baez isn’t the best shortstop in Chicago, let alone the game.
Cubs need to make some tough decisions and lock down 1 or 2 of these guys. At this point I could see a scenario where Bryant might even accept a qualifying offer or at least think hard about it. I am very interested to see what they do to address the outfield. The cubs now have to be in the bottom half of the league in payroll. If they can sign Brantley and a few pitchers to 1-2 year deals they could be competitive. As of right now they have 2 outfielders and 2 starting pitchers that they can count on for 150+ innings. The major league ready pitching in the minors is non existent. Marquez might be a late season call up and a big pitching piece for 2022
You dont trade your top SP, IF you are going for it… Esp after losing another SP to FA.
Trading the guy who finished second in the Cy Young is never great
Alzolay looked very good in his last few appearances. What stuff.
TomL, who is the generational player in this deal? Darvish? Cy Young candidate I’ll accept, generational player, NO SHOT!!!!!!
lmao
It’s a step in their rebuild as they waited too long to retool.
Cubs gets Dabies plus SD’s #11,#13, #15, and #16 (per MLB prospect ratings)
It is amusijg when we try to grade a trade within a week of the deal when prospects are involved.
One team is getting immediate value, one is cutting payroll and attempting to get value that plays out a few years from now.
@Chitown
I don’t know about Fleeced, abd who’s to say it’s not golden?
The point of my question is that these prospects are young enough that you will not be able to evaluate this trade. three of the four prospects are either at the rookie ball or A level and are 20 years old or so which means they have physical growth ahead of them that wil vastly change their prospect value. In 3 or four years when these player mature they will provide cheap controllable production for their team. Who much remains to be seen.
Maybe Theo jumped because he knew his orders were to dump salary no matter what.
And There It Is!
Exactly why he left.
Obviously. A few goofs thought the Cubs would get a haul for some reason, but if they are reloading they should just be glad he’s gone.
Davies is a huge get and arguably the same as darvish. This is a lateral move with padres taking on additional salary in the process.
Being a Padre fan,I can assure you that Davies is not the same as Darvish. Davies got exposed against the Dodgers in the playoffs. Any team that lays off his pitches outside the strike zone and gets ahead in the count, hammers him He loves to give up the long ball. His fastball averages 88-89 and absolutely
Can not be effective pitching behind in the count.
Jmac2020, you must be living in an alternate reality because Davies isn’t as good as Darvish, it’s not even close. Darvish (2.7WAR), a power pitcher, versus Davies (1.7WAR on a better team) a soft-tosser. Davies is the same as Hendricks and Mills. The Cubs’ top 3 pitchers are Hendricks, Davies, and Mills. The average fastball velocity for those three is like 89 MPH. They couldn’t break a pane of glass.
This trade by itself is hardly an indicator that the “Cubs have thrown in the towel”. They traded their 34-year old ace and a backup catcher for a 27-year old mid-rotation starter and 4 solid prospects. The Cubs retained their starting catcher Willson Contreras and his two years of arbitration eligibility and still have all their other star quality veterans with a single season of control on the roster as well. If they follow this deal with trades of Contreras, Kris Bryant, Javier Baez and Anthony Rizzo that changes the narrative. At this point in time the trade would qualify as a retool and not the beginning of another rebuild.
Well said.
I actually would argue the opposite for the reasons you laid out. If the Cubs traded; Rizzo, Bryant, Baez, and Contreras. I think that would be more of a retool. All those players have 2 years or less of team control, will likely cost lots of money, and the Cubs have thus far shown an inability to develop pitching. Trading even the first 3 I mentioned for say 2 players each that were between double A and the majors would be the retool. They could fall back this year, be better in 2022 (in another shortened season) and be right back into a contention window by 2023. They now have less depth at a position that is the hardest in your body, not to mention more innings to eat over the next 3 years. To me, this signals that between now and the end of the contracts of Heyward, Hendricks, Bote, and Happ, (2024) they might not be much better than .500. Which for that team, with that payroll ability, in this market here, is absolutely embarrassing.
We still don’t fully know the cash exchange, if any, between the teams as we post our comments. If the Padres incur the full brunt of the Darvish contract the Cubs could potentially use some of those savings for free agent acquisitions this offseason, some in subsequent years or even utilize them in an extensions to help keep Bryant, Baez or Rizzo beyond the 2021 season.
What purpose does keeping Bryant, Baez or Rizzo do? If you are going to rebuild …. then go all the way.
I don’t get it. Last years Bryant, Baez, and Rizzo didn’t get the job done. They are great players but they need more than 3 guys. If they spend the majority of money on the 3 then that will take away from the money they will be able to spend on starters and bullpen along with other position player needs. I say keep 2, I would prefer if I was a Cub fan Bryant and Baez to help save some money to be spent on other needs in the coming years.
That is also true. And after listening to Effectively Wild this morning, it sounds like these prospects are much better than most people in this thread think. However, they are still 3 years away.
However, they are still PROSPECTS!!!! None of which is rated in the top 100 prospects in MLB, top 10 prospects in the Padres farm system, nor have reached AA. What the Cubs received is a huge stretch.
Aaron – good point on Contreras because the Cubs would need him to mentor Miguel Amaya (if he makes the 2021 team).
I agree. Since 2016-2020, Darvish and Davies have surprisingly close stats. Davies having a better record, and Darvish having a slightly better ERA. If this is the only trade the Cubs make, I think they are still the favorite in the division.
Having Darvish for 3 years rather than Davies for one, is a huge advantage, but the Cubs got 4 solid prospects.
I agree. I think that the Pads definitely won, for now, but j think it’s being overblown. If Darvish continues putting up dominant numbers, but who can say that he won’t get injured or return to his 2018 form. In that case Davies is the better option, cheaper and just as good if that situation plays out. (It may not, Darvish still could be an ace, not saying his great recent run is coming to an end as he is still very talented.)
4 solid prospects all outside the top 100
Interpreted as: 4 solid prospects that you never heard of.
Ok but does anyone honestly think they compete with the elite teams outside of weak looking NL Central for 2021?
NL Central so weak they could still win it
Say it with me. That’s it!!!! Stop pretending like you know the value of players in this market place and just realize Lindor, and anyone else will be traded for significantly less than most people here think they should be.
Pathetic move and return. Davies?! Yuck. Time to keep goin and dump Hendricks, Rizzo, Bryant, Heyward, Baez, Contreras etc, etc
Do you people that constantly say one team gets fleeced ever go back and read your own reactions to trades because I see the same people constantly shocked at the lite returns. That’s why I make fun of you by saying that’s it! Every trade.
Cubs are stuck with Heyward. They are going to have to wait until the contract expires or give away an asset to just get rid of him.
It depends on what the Cubs do with the money they just freed up. If they reinvest it in more pitching, then alongside Davies it could very well make them an overall better team considering their current severe lack of pitching depth.
This is a horrible trade for the Cubs. Not a single prospect in the Padres top 10, are you kidding? The Padres are “geniuses” I guess… they get Darvish and Clevinger (even though Clevinger won’t pitch again til 2022) for like 12 mediocre players, and not a single one of their top prospects. That’s hard to believe. I don’t understand these trades from the Indians and Cubs standpoint, but great for the Pads.
Padres are going to be the best team in the NL for several years I think. I like their team over the Dodgers. In 2022 when Clevinger returns, geez.
just speculation, but I’d assume that is the best offer both teams received. Doubt many teams wanted to take on Darvish’s contract, especially with uncertainty on what darvish you are getting. and you lose clevinger for an entire year right off the bat.
The Clevenger loss was painful. Nice to see Pads management not cry in their beer and instead go out and nab two Cy Young contenders to fill the void without increasing overall payroll and without parting with any of their top 10 prospects.
How did they not increase payroll?
This is Clevingers’ 2nd TJ surgery, not his 1st. Who knows how he’ll return.
Padres system is top three of all MLB. Their 11-20 prospect range are 1-10 in many other farm systems.
That’s getting carried away. They had a top 3 system primarily because they had 3 of the top 25 prospects in baseball in it, not because their system is so incredibly stacked with elite talent that their 11th best prospect is ranking as any team’s #1, or even as most teams’ #5. At best, their 11 might be a 3-5 in a really bad system like the Astros or Red Sox.
hittingnull, that isn’t necessarily true. None of those prospects is top 100 in MLB. Depth pieces for a good farm maybe, but don’t overstate their talent because of the system they are in.
Will we see the Cardinals clinch the division with 69 wins?
Watch out Dodgers! Here come the Padres!
An excellent move by the Cubs. Darvish has zero chance of staying healthy and in return they get a pitcher, Zach Davies, who will win more than Darvish not to mention some reasonable prospects. One thing the Padres do lead MLB in is over-paid players…Darvish, Myers, Hosmer, Pomeranz, Pham and Machado.
Cards Fans can just fantasize of having Owners or even a competent president of baseball operations willing to invest in a potential National League Championship team.
Instead of setting their goal to just be a .500 team. Sure —- A .500 record could win the Central Division this year easily. But —- they can’t compete with the big boys for a National league Championship
Yu is a great pitcher who needs to grow up and get off Social Media. That said, SD is the team to beat now. LOL Great moves by that organization.
These prospects the Cubs got are young long way off. These are the types of trades that will help a team if the players develop. If all three of them hit the majors and have 20+ homerun seasons like projected then this trade will look genius for the Cubs.
The Padres are obviously going for it, great times to live on the West Coast
Holy crap. They pulled it off
Padres are going to be insanely good. Dodgers fans are sweating right now.
I agree the Padres are going to be incredible, but I doubt the Dodgers really care. They’re still riding their title high.
I would think that the Dodgers were striving to win an actual title, rather than riding the high of an asterisk.
The Dodgers win big every year and will continue to do so. Btw, where do you see an asterisk? There aren’t any in the MLB record book. Not one.
@Brewer88 If the Dodgers had not enjoyed such great success the past eight years, your post would hold some credibility. If the Brewers would have won the 2020 World Series, their accomplishment would be well deserving of an asterisk. But not for this incredibly talented Dodgers team.
the only asterisk is 2017
@Brewer88:
When you post something like this, you remind me of one of my favorite Mark Twain turns of phrase:
“Better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than open your mouth and remove all doubt.”
Dodgers beat the National League’s other-best and the AL’s very best with virtually no off-days in a stadium half the country away from Chavez Ravine. Their WS victory is, in many ways, more impressive than one in a “normal” season (re: one that doesn’t involve playing against a team later found to have been cheating, etc.).
Silly comment.
I never said it wasn’t a great achievement? Just very different than a standard season I’m sure you agree. They overcame a longstanding playoff bugaboo and I was really happy for Keyshaw. My point was to the Dodger fans here reciting last seasons success as leverage over 2021, when in fact we don’t yet know who will be the best team next year. Maybe the Nats again or Cubs, who knows
Not really.
Yeah, okay.
Just hope his 2020 season wasn’t a fluke. If he regresses back to having control issues you guys would have been better off keeping Davies.
Darvish’s control has been excellent since about July of 2019.
Yes. Like I said hope he doesn’t regress to before that. What part didnt you understand?
I frankly don’t care about either team, but the Dodgers are the best team in baseball by about ten miles. And the Padres rotation is still terrible in my opinion despite these two additions. They basically just added another often injured starter when they already had one of those.
10 miles? ok
David Price, $30 million, IR
I don’t mean this as an insult, but how is it that you don’t understand that Price cost the LAD $0.00 in 2020?
Are you not aware that Price chose to sit out the season? Y’all need to try to keep more current with BB issues if you want to comment.
Context is everything. Yes I know he sat out but my point is that they paid him $30 at age 35. So Pads paying $20 for Yu isn’t so expensive as folks seem to be implying here.
Of course Yu is not expensive. If he wasn’t worth $20M, the return for him would be -0- or less. So why post Price & the IR?
My point: good teams are willing to pay extra to get the edge. Dodgers signed Price for $30m. Pads just nabbed Yu for $20m. Risks worth taking, sometimes.
Flags fly forever.
Dodgers fans aren’t sweating at all. The Padres have likely improved, but the Dodgers are still easily better. Padres fans predict they will win the division every season, it seems, and they never really come close in the end. The upcoming season will likely be more of the same.
Amazing though how many Dodger fans are posting on this Rumor that has supposedly nothing to do with or concern them.
Nothing to do with the Brewers either …. yet here you are.
Brewer88 has nothing to do with baseball or Milwaukee Enrico.
@Brewer88:
Amazing? Really? I think most Dodgers fans recognize that SD is, along with Atlanta, one of the two real threats in the National League, and the additions of Snell and now Darvish make a potentially great team in SD potentially even greater.
And unlike ATL, the Padres are LA’s direct division rival.
And this is literally a site that exists for folks to come to the comments section and discuss the moves aggregated for our reading pleasure and informational enjoyment.
What about Dodgers’ fans coming here to discuss a big move by their direct rival is…amazing, then?
Should they all just gather somewhere else, then, to continue to celebrate their team’s championship?
Or…………
Yes this is a site for everyone to comment. You missed the point – I responded to a LA fan who thought to come in to the article and say they weren’t concerned about Pads 3 big signings because the Dodgers were still so ultimately superior. That might be a valid point, but to say you’re not concerned at all, while at the same time going to great lengths to take the time to post that here, exposes perhaps some insecurity.
Gotta love the Dodgers fans who think they’re still a 100 win team, as if they’re not even aware that they’ll be playing 19 games against the Padres. These are what we call bandwagon fans. Let’s see how many of them stick around after the Padres leapfrog their team in the division.
Far beyond driven, we will all still be here will you? Last year there were several padres homers like yourself claiming the nl went through them and guess what? 3 game sweep! Magically all the padres trolls disappeared until there team makes a few moves and boom as if we forgot last year….last time I checked padres scored 6 runs over 3 games against dodgers chalk it up to injuries? Everyone on padres roster played except Yates and lamet. Neither Clevinger, lamet, darvish or snell help you score more runs lol
Every team has those Trolls, real fans of the game know who they are. I have friends who are great Dodger or Padre fans that I respect. It’s just good fun.
You know the Dodgers won the World Series a couple months back, right? And did so while going wire-to-wire and winning at a .717 pace? And when every bandwagon-hater screamed “small sample size!” and “watch out for SD/ATL/TB!.” it…didn’t matter?
It’s not that we think our team is still a 100-win ballclub; it’s that we literally JUST WATCHED THEM be much better than that.
Oh, and we’ve gone to three of the last four WS, and are one of the great franchises in MLB–and really, American sports history.
So…bandwagon?
Ummm.
Sure.
Oh, it’s more than insecurity; the Padres were a tough out two days ago, and now are every bit the equal of the Dodgers at the moment.
I have to think that there’s a Dodgers move or two coming, if only for the arms-race aspect of it all.
If we don’t add a bullpen arm beyond the projects (cough, cough Liam Hendriks cough) and, frankly, another starter–because if we’re being honest with ourselves, Kershaw could be cooked at any moment and Price may or may not be a thing and who knows what Gonsolin/May/Urias really REALLY are, then…SD will have definitely won the offseason.
I’d still rather win October though.
@Jmac2020 I’m a Mets fan. Bandwagon fans just aren’t hard to spot.
Dodgers fans are just responding to Padres fans singling out the Dodgers fan base…you are a Brewers fan pandering to the Padres fan base. Hate to use the out-dated reference, but get a life, man.
Those are just responses to people calling out the Dodgers. That should be obvious
.
I live in CA and am a lifelong Padres/Giants fan. Brewer88 has nothing to do with baseball Chief Troll Hands
Far Beyond Driven, Dodgers fans aren’t worried.
The cubs got fleeced
How? If they,sent,cash too, then you might say that. That would defeat the purpose though. If the Padres are,paying,full salary then the value,back goes,down.That is generally how these trades,work.
As a Cubs fan this was a terrible trade. They got no prospects of value. How do you deal an ace and not get at least someone like Abrams or Campusano? Those 4 prospects they got are garbage.
How do you know they got no prospects of value? And what makes you sure that Darvish at 35 will pitch better than Davies?
Welcome to the show, Jed Hoyer.
The Cubs bottom five farm just moved to average. Padres have a top five farm. Something good will come from these kids in a few years, … unless the Cubs hire Dave Dombrowski.
Davies is a good pitcher, sorry to see him go.
I wanted to keep Davies
You can have him back
Seriously. Plz, take him back. I cant watch that loser all season.
I assume you know nothing about Davies.
Yeah not sure why you’d even make a comment like that ♂️
I’d love my Brewers to take him back so I don’t have to see him pitch in a Cubs uni lol.
Davies was our best pitcher during the playoffs
None of the SPs were any good in the playoffs.
Got a feeling you’ll like Darvish and for sure Snell a lot more
Didn’t the Padres get swept by the Dodgers?
Yes they did
That this is the last year of his contract played into it. But I agree, he was the glue of the rotation last year
They can get him back, because he is just for one year.
Nothing but flyer prospects. Jed is an absolute moron even if this doesn’t pan out in 2025 when any of these teenagers will be ready.
Yu have to be kidding me!
This genuinely made me laugh
Me too.
Dad jokes are always appreciated
The other day I was washing my car with my son and he said “Dad, can’t you just use a sponge?”
Lmao
Padres have a scary rotation if all pans out. Look out Dodgers.
Trembling.
The Braves are Trembling also
Braves should always be trembling. They are vastly overrated.
What?!? So sad!!!
What are the Cubs doing??
Their owner is being a cheapskate, dumping Yu’s remaining salary.
And he’s been that way since the cubs won the world series.
Yep. He’s expecting to cash in financially for another decade off sentimental Cubs fans for that 1 long overdue championship.
I think he’s parring down payroll to sell the team.
Not quite, sounds like the Cubs will pay part of his salary too.
Cubs are cutting salary while still providing a solid replacement in the rotation, and picking up 4 good prospects to help build a future contender.
Those are not good prospects. How do you not get a single top 100 prospect in return for an ace? Idiotic trade by Jed.
Maybe? Just maybe, and this is obviously true to anyone intelligent, you don’t know his value and all the gms in the league do?
When your ace was only a ace for 2 months and is in his mid 30s. And you decide you would rather have quantity over quality. And teenage international players don’t make top 100 list unless they are huge signings.
I don’t see how this can be viewed as anything but a huge win for the Padres and a pathetic return for the Cubs. Giving up three years of a relatively cheap Darvish plus four(?) years of control of an excellent back up catcher should have gotten the Cubs WAAAAY more.
I don’t see how a package of Knowles, Barria and Kohn didn’t get this done for scary perry amd the halos. Speechless.
Give it four years. These guys are too young to truly evaluate besides broad projections. I imagine all four of the prospects will be in the Cubs top 10 since they were all in the Padres 10-20 range.
Agree, what did the pads have 6-8 top 100 prospects. And these guys are pretty young and raw. Not a bad haul imo.
After the Snell trade they had 4 not 6 or 8.
Cubs fans don’t have the patience to wait 4 years.
Most Cubs fans lack the patience to wait 4 months.
Most Cubs fans lack the patience to stay two hours at the ballgame
What are you talking about? Cubs fans waited 108 years for a championship. They’re the most loyal fans in baseball.
You’ve clearly never been to a game at Wrigley.
Lol
In four years if any of these guys are any good, the Cubs will trade them off for a declining former all star.
Likely to rank 9th-11-15th and 16th with the cubs the Padres lost alot in last summers and the Snell trades in guys in 3-15 range. Now other then the Top 5 the Padres Top 20 is weak.
It took hard work and a few years but they were 40-deep, and why assume the elite farm system won’t continually replenish? Their top 10 players (Patino aside) are still intact. Scary to think, but they’re in position to use the prospects to get much better still, and this process is developed for the long-term.
Apart from their top 4 they drop off sharply from 5 onward now.
If Darvish is relatively cheap how come Cubs fans were hoping… no… praying that he would opt out of his contract a year ago?
No we weren’t.
Uneducated comments, love em
Because….Cub fans
You mean the best fans in all of sports?
They weren’t. Not sure where you heard that.
20 plus mil a year isn’t too cheap
No, but by comparison LA signed Price for $30 million at same age as Yu. Didn’t work out but teams at the top are looking for any edge.
No way with Padres taking on Big Bucks
You have no idea yet. It absolutely looks like the Cubs got a lesser prospect package because the Padres ARE picking up the Darvish tab.
Darvish is “waaaay” overrated ate this point. Wrong side of 34. Pretty inconsistent over last few years. More of a name than a true ace.
Jah, those ’20 numbers were waaaay overrated. “More of a name than a true ace”: them’s some savvy analysis.
Fact is he was rated as being worth Davies and a bunch of teenagers, even though he finished 2nd behind Bauer for Cy Young in 2020.
It’ll be 2-3+ years before a winner/loser can be realistically argued. It could be a win/win, who knows. Obviously the Padres get the early lean because their move is for the next couple of years, and those prospects won’t be up until Darvish likely retires. As for Davies….the deal could be a fair 1:1, so then prospects turn into lotto tickets. It’ll be a minimum of 2-3+ years folks.
Zach Davies pitches very similar to Hendricks. I wonder if the Cubs preferred Davies over Paddack, or the Padres didn’t want to include Paddack.
They preferred 1 year of Davies to multiple years of Paddack? If the cubs preferred Davies they need to fire everyone in that front office.
I have to agree with you. Davies was likely chosen in part to offset some of the payroll for one year.
No Davies was not included as a salary offset smart guy. If the Padres wanted to get rid of him to offset salary he would have been non-tendered.
I said, in part. The cubs would have to send some salary relief, if they hadn’t taken on salary. If not they would have gotten a fringe prospect.
Taking Davies isn’t sending salary relief. He is more than worth what he is making. If he wasn’t, he’d have been non-tendered.
Not necessarily. It gives AJ some salary room to manuever. It sure fit in with the Ha-Seong Kim signing.
1. It really doesn’t. He is only projected to get around $7.2m
2. If Preller wanted to get rid of Davies to have “some salary room to maneuver” he would have non-tendered him. Preller wasn’t the one who asked for Davies to be in the trade, Hoyer was. What’s not obvious is why.
No, I never said he wanted to “get rid” of Davis. I said “in part”, not a salary dump. Sorry, you’re trying to parse it into something that wasn’t said. It fits, Davies and Kim are projected to make similar salaries.
Not even one bit as a salary dump. Only players with underwater contracts can be salary dumps.
Paddack makes more sense for control reasons. id imagine its the later.
If I were the Padres, I would have rather traded Paddack and kept Davies. Paddack may have the brighter future next season I would take Davies all day. Not to mention, Padres have the high ceiling pitching prospects in Gore and Weathers.
but next season*
I wouldn’t touch Paddack. We will see.
With Darvish they can’t have both Paddack and Gore unless they go to a 6 man rotation. They will probably trade him during the season or next offseason.
Darvish-Snell-Clevinger-Lamet-Gore is going to be so nasty though. Gore might move from back to the front too.
Clevinger had TJ so there is a spot open in the rotation.
*Adrian Morejon has entered the chat*
No Clevinger … he had TJ surgery
Clevinger is out for 21 with tommy john surgery
The trade seems a bit odd. If I were the Cubs I would have preferred Paddack given his control and ceiling. If I were the Padres I would have preferred Davies next season given his health and consistency. With next season being an all-in for the Padres, Davies seems like the better bet. Gore and Weathers will likely step into the rotation after 2021 anyway.
If Cubs were interested in paddock I would rather trade him and give up less prospects.
I agree but the Padres wanted to dump some money I’m sure.
Davies had just one year left on his contract, and is due a big raise in 2022. So of all their SPs they had to let him go. Paddack (who desperately needs a 3rd pitch and to regain location control over his fastball), they will nurse him along again next year on a $700K salary, hoping he can turn it around.
no rush to get Gore up anyway with their 40 man crunch
How do people still not know Clev had TJ?
Prob same people that think Davies is as good as Darvish
That is a *filthy* staff. I have high hopes that the Mets can do something similar (e.g. pick up a mid-rotation guy and an even better TOR caliber starter), but SD can make these moves and not put much of a dent into their farm. The Mets will need 3+ years to rebuild their farm to even be in the top 10-12. I’m concerned about that staff for the playoffs (as a Met fan), but I LOVE that LAD needs to contend with SD now and they can’t just steamroll the division and have it locked up w. 30+ games to play.
I doubt Paddack was ever on the table.
Davies is a better pitcher than Paddack. At this time.
That ain’t saying much though. Morejon and Weathers are better than Paddack at this point. The Texan needs to figure out some things.
Hendricks and Davies is a competition of who has more mediocre stuff
After facing Hendricks (average 87.8 mph FB velo last season) and Davies (87.3), hitters will be blown away by Alec Mills’ 90.2 heat.
It will be a competition to see who can be more Maddux-like.
Amazing!
AJ Preller ladies and gentlemen. Got Snell, Kim, Darvish in 24 hours, holy wow.
and they still have Abrams, Gore, Morejon, and several other good youngsters.
I wonder if Preller makes a separate side deal, off the books with the other GMs. Kind of like Dwight doing Michael’s laundry in The Office.
Bro you’re implying he does what got the Braves GM fired and exiled a few years ago. Cmon
Lol. He got Snell and Darvish without giving up Cronenworth, Paddack, or any of the top 5 prospects. I dknt know if Preller has ever traded a top 5 prospect.
Where did Patino rank?
Some sites put him at top 15, others 20-30 range
@Randy Red Sox – I forgot about Patino. I think he was the Padres 3rd ranked prospect. My bad.
Patino no longer a prospect after his rookie season?
Campusano also still a Padre
The roomates (Jon Daniels and AJ) are having a nice offseason haha!
Merry Christmas, San Diego.
FFS, couldn’t they have also thrown in the bat boy and the groundskeeper?
Geez! Padres have GOT to capitalize on this…
But, like… as a Jays fan, please don’t capitalize on this while we’re trying to put our final pieces together.
Please.
Thanks.
You guys were the kindle that got the hot stove starting so that should be something to be proud of.
Cubs got fleeced. They just gave away Darvish.
Darvish and Davies had identical splits last year and Cubs got 4 prospects in padres top 15. Keep trying though you were the same guy saying darvish is bad last night
Remember when you said Darvish would cost more prospects than Snell. Pepperidge farm remembers. My how wrong you were.
Also, I said Darvish wasn’t worth giving up top tier talent at his current price tag. Nobody was going to give up cheap control of players to pay him. Hence why the cubs only got prospects 4-5 years away.
Lance Lynn at 8 mill netted Dane Dunning the #98 prospect. A fool like you thought Darvish at 22 mill, 19 mill, and 18 mill would net more.
Here’s my exact argument from the thread.
Padres, nor any team, are interested in:
1. giving up top prospects
2. taking on 60 million when teams are slashing financial commitments
3. taking a gamble on Darvish at his current price.
For a pitcher that
1. is 34
2. his 2 most recent seasons he was injured and pitched like a #3.
Hopefully your 2021 new years resolution is either learn how to read or get better at trolling. Cause you’re pretty bad at both.
The same dude that was saying darvish has a 110 ops+ is now saying he is a cy young caliber….ahahahahaha Davies is better than gore this upcoming season and actually helps major roster and can be flipped for additional assets in addition to what the Cubs got 4 top 15 prospects that could very well appear in the top 100 in a year or 2. Nice try but so far you are a liar and a moron. In your world though padres are perineal nl west champs with multiple titles oh wait
You: YoU cAlLeD dArViSh Cy YoUnG cAlIbEr
literally the article you’re commenting on: The Cubs, meanwhile, are losing perhaps their best starter in Darvish – a 2020 National League Cy Young finalist – as well as a quality catcher in Caratini.
Uh huh. Guess you missed where I said “taking a gamble on Darvish”
Never once said he was a bad pitcher. I did say his most recent seasons weren’t impressive and not worth the money.
Twisting my words to make you look smart isn’t working. Liking your own comments is just downright sad. I feel.sorey for you man. I really do.
How do the Padres keep making these trades without giving up their top farmhands?
$$$
They did give up a top farmhand in the Snell trade. Darvish was never going to net a top farmhand with his age, salary and 3.60 ERA in the last 3 years.
Another uneducated comment
And yet….this trade confirms it’s not “uneducated”
The reason why preciado and caissie were not rated higher is because how young they are. If it was 2022-23 they would both be Padres top 5 prospects. It’s a great haul for Cubs, in a couple years even better
Patino was a major leaguer, not a farmhand
Patino is technically still a prospect, only has like 20 MLB innings and has like 2 or 3 starts at AA level or above. He’s still listed and tracked as a prospect and he hasn’t exceeded rookie limits yet.
Honestly he’s pretty raw and even though his pure stuff is nasty his control needs work and he could probably could use some more seasoning in the minors before playing in the bigs next year.
No he will likely start the year in AA.
They are trading all their farms depth as opposed to the top guys
Dodgers will finally have some competition this year…:maybe
Wow. AJ Preller is nuts.
Padres are going for it
They’re reaping rewards of their farm system and scouting. Hard work, investment, dividends. Preller gets the credit but it’s an organizational achievement and not a short-term process.
Man. Out of everyone traded away this weekend, I think I’ll miss Davies the most! Been a fun few days though!
He seems solid. Also could be a decent deadline flip for Cubs.
He did well for a max 85 Mph heater
As a Cardinals fan, I enjoy seeing the Cubs get absolutely ripped off, but there should have been at least one San Diego Top 5 prospect going to Chicago. Absolute steal for the Padres
Not if the Padres are taking on his full salary.
The Cubs are paying part of Yu’s salary.
I would rather have 4 top 20 then a top 4 or 5 most times.
wait did preller really just pull a fleece job?
WTF! How tf did the Padres manage to pull off that minuscule of a package!?!? Terrific trade!
I know, right? While I didn’t expect Darvish to get Gore or Campusano, I expected at least 1 top 5 org prospect. They got back 1, top 10 org prospect, but that’s about it. I’m honestly shocked about Cronenworth not going to CHC though. Now that they have Kim, it made sense.
Does this make the chances for a good Musgrove return better or worse? He is way cheaper than Darvish.
Better I think. In terms of who’s been traded, he’s closer to Snell than Darvish considering age, controability and cost. I ovbisously don’t think he’ll get as good of a package as Snell, but might get a bit more than Lynn. I think Musgrove will get back a prospect in the top 50-100 range as a headliner and then another top 15 org prospect. Maybe a third piece like a throw in.
So a Rangers’ trade would start with Huff huh? Idk, I think it’d be fair if a trade with Texas started with Acosta and maybe two more top 15. Your thoughts? Acosta will be top 100 soon.
Worse. The 3 best prospect hauls of 2020 were given out by the padres. So unless they are in on Musgrove?
Why worse? I think Snell got back fair value. Why can’t Musgrove? He’s super underrated just because he plays for the Pirates and doesn’t have a great ERA. He’s fantastic once you take him off the team who’s been the 2nd worst team defensively in baseball since 2018.
To me, yes it would have to at least start with Huff, possibly Jung. While Acosta wouldn’t be bad, he’s a shortstop prospect and the Pirates have like 5 of thsoe already. The way Ben Cherington trades, we’re going to get back another RHP starter. I don’t think the Rangers have the pieces to get Musgrove though. For example if the Giants start going after Musgrove, I would expect at least Heliot Ramos as a headliner. If we’re talking about the Jays, then SWR. The Twins? Trevor Larnach. It shouldn’t be cheap to get Musgrove. According to my sources, Musgrove is highly touted throughout the industry.
Also, while the Padres have given out the most prospects, Lance Lynn was traded from the Rangers to the White Sox. Not Padres.
Woah, you have sources mlb1225? That’s cool. I want to be able to say that.
Lmao, yeah. Like I’ve said to you before, reach out on Linkedin, get more involved in stuff like writing articles for websites, like I am doing now, and you can make some of those connections.
I’m gonna dedicate this summer to getting my name out there. I want to really make my name known in the community. Take a good first step.
BTW… how juiced was the ball in 19′? lmao
You mean in the first half of 2020 as well
His k/9 last year was 50% higher then careers norms, No GM will be fooled by that over a 60 game season.. Steamers and Depth Charts project a 4.20 FIP that is a #4 on a good team. Cherrington will market him as a #2 but rival GM’s won’t bite. He will not get a 50FV pitcher like SWR .
Never implied anything about Musgrove value. To break it down more. Out of the 3 best pitchers traded. The padres aquired all of them. If the padres are not interested in Musgrove, I don’t see him getting the return of Snell. Probably closer to the return of Yu. Except 2 less players. Of course the trade also involved a solid catcher.
He probably gets something closer to Lynn. Similar numbers over the past 3 years but has more control, is younger and is trending upward. Darvish is owed way more than what Musgrove is projected to make and has been much more inconsistent. The only similarities between Musgrove and Darvish is that they’re right handed.
All of these guys are immediately in the Cubs top 10. They had good pedigree and good performance on the field, and are 20 or younger
When the dodgers acquired Jeter Downs and Josiah Gray, neither were top 100 talent. One year later they both were top 50. Think people are looking at this way too shortsightedly and claiming the Padres scammed them
Add in Davies prolly gets 2 good prospects in his own right, Darvish likely got a barren system six decent prospects, while clearing most of the 60M left
You lost me at Davies gets 2 good prospects. He was literally traded last year with Grisham for Lauer and Urias and now Davies is in his last year of Arb and making more money as a rental so his value isn’t going up.
He does not get 2 good prospects on his own. He’s basically in this deal to offset salary and eat innings.
He threw 7 less innings than Darvish with a 2.73 ERA and 1.4 WAR. Only making 7M
Last 2 years he was at least a #3
If traded now, new team can QO him in offseason. I do not see why he wouldn’t have trade value
2 will be bottom part of the top ten, the other 2 will be mid teens.
Laughing@you is the only one with a brain on this forum!!!!
No Davies is not in this deal to offset salary smart guy. If the Padres wanted to get rid of him to offset salary he would have been non-tendered.
And after this trade Padres still have top five farm system dam!!
A+ trade by the Pads. lots of lottery tickets but nothing more.
well plus Davies, but he’s a rental, as good as he is.
You have no way of knowing that.
Oh Yu!
Why couldn’t we get any good prospects exactly? Hoyer wasn’t cut for GM….major disappointment from a huge Darvish and Cubs Fan.
You got 4 plus a possible Davies trade or comp pick.
You could argue the Rangers got a better deal for Darvish at the trade deadline for only a half a season than what the Cubs got for him
Interesting comment. Going to have to think on that for a bit, but you’re right it’s a fun argument to think about
Cubs went for depth of minor league system over quality. Just looking to rebuild that system for when they need to make dumb trades like Eloy for Quintana again.
This
Boo Yaaaa!!!!
Jed making up for the shadiest trade in mlb history
Well dam best team in NL West?
Not by a mile.
Clearly Pads are equal to Dodgers in 21, favored in 22
Lay down the bottle
If everything goes perfectly, with no regression from the 2020 highs while also counting on guys like Pham to magically recover… you’re still the #1 wild card team
I would agree if Campusano sticks as the #2 Catcher.
Hey Brewer88, you’re leading the league in dumb comments.
Brewer88 is just a salty giants fan, don’t mind him, his team will emerge from the cellars at some point!
By at least 5 miles
This is going to be the most interesting division in baseball hands down. Even Arizona has some interesting players and you never know about the Giants. Kinda glad I’m not a Rockies fan though, sorry guys, love your state.
Lot of money the pads taking on, wish they would have got some back in return.
Actually the SD team salary in 21 will be about equal to that in 2020 which is extraordinary.
Almost like Padre fans need to stop pretending their team doesn’t spend
You are not counting the salaries off the books from last year. Get the facts.
Hey troll. The Padres approaching 180M with no bullpen. They are likely to be at or above this level for the next several years. Stop complaining about money. The Padres have had it for a long time. They just now are opening the purse
Very uneducated comment.
Padres don’t need to spend huge money on pen arms.
Morejon, Snell, Darvish, Paddack, Lamet are most likely the starting 5.
Wingenter and Castillo are back and Lucchesi may make a move to the pen.
They have their core in Strahm, Pomeranz, Johnson and have other arms to work with.
Theyll get some cheap options for camp and figure out who will fill out the pen.
They have options for the pen and don’t need to spend big on it.
They could also utilize Weathers and Gore out of the pen as well.
Very uneducated? Hahaha
The dodgers played at a 116 win pace and are adding David Price for free essentially
You are hoping for the Padres to rely on 2 very young, albeit talented pitchers, a guy who didn’t make your playoff rotation.. and then you are projecting based on the best of Snell and the best of Darvish, even if it’s unlikely either repeats those levels
Oh. And you want your bullpen to be mostly inexperienced, young arms. Jeez. What could possibly go wrong with that?? But I’m the uneducated one. Gotcha
Now the Dodgers sign Bauer and the Padres are just a playoff team. What are the Cubs thinking??? They most love Davies (or his salary).
Who is next out the door for the Cubs? Bryant?
No chance. They’ll save him for the deadline after he hopefully starts out hot.
That would make sense. But getting a top 50 prospect for Yu would have made sense. Getting a top 100 prospect should have been a no-brainer.
Dogshit return for the Cubs. Fire Jed Hoyer
More like a Dogbone return. Amirite?
Either works, to be honest.
Its impressive how Bad that is. Amazing work by Jed Hoyer to set a new low bar
Your name says it all
Everyone trying to throw heat nowadays. Meanwhile, the cubs will roll out davies and hendricks for BP. Btw, i love hendricks, but idk how effective two slow tossers in same roto
Don’t forget flamethrower Alec Mills
3 now. Davies, Hendricks, and Mills.
I can’t believe they didn’t get another even fringe major league player. This is just wow.
To trade Darvish AND Caratini and NOT come away with even one of SD’s top 5 prospects?!!!! The prospects they did get back won’t be ready for the Majors for like 4 years if ever. Disappointing unless you look at dumping Darvish’s salary as a win.
I would agree with you if the C sent was Contreras
We don’t need Carabiner, he will be out #3 catcher
This has to be a complete gut job rebuild unlike the retool we have been hearing about for 3 years. You don’t go after all teenagers and replace an ace with a 4 and try to win. Not to mention they didn’t get 1, not 1, fricken minor league pitcher. This trade makes no sense, none.
iml12, I agree, to not get one starting pitching prospect is terrible. I mean, make it a lesser return in terms of numbers of players by making the Padres keep Caissie and Preciado. Take a return of Mena, Santana, and Weathers. Or Morejon. Not even getting one of either Weathers or Morejon is inexcusable.
Dodgers better makes move in response
Haha no they do not need to “respond”
Because they got their title? Albeit just an asterisk
Enough with the asterisk. You can’t just keep saying something and make it the truth.
60 game season is truth
Again. Longer playoffs with fewer off days than ANY former champ. Best record in baseball with an offense on Historic paces in some regards
They beat the 2nd+3rd best record in the NL, and the best record in the AL. how much harder can it be?
You’re just a bitter troll to claim the title is illegitimate
The Cubs didn’t receive one prospect ranked in the top 100. A total salary dump and embarrassing for the Cubs organization.
Thus the reason why the return wasn’t that great. Pads took on all the cas.h and also gave a proven starter
Davies only has one arb year remaining.
Yeah, I caught that and edited.
Turns out the Pads didn’t take on all the cash, Cubs will foot some of Yu’s salary!
“A minor amount”
Sounds inconsequential
You’ll get over it once Darvish goes back to being his usual injured crap self in a Padres uniform. This was a massive win for the Cubs, just not in the way you and the rest of the fanboys had hoped.
Wat you smokin ?
Now let the Padres send C Luis Campusano & SS CJ Abrams to the Tigers for RHP Spencer Turnbull & SS Willi Castro.
That’s WAY too much to give up by the Padres. And they don’t need either of those Tigers players.
Will this finally get the Preller haters to stfu?
Winning more than a WC will
How about being competitive every year. And building on the playoff experience.
Trade summarization brought to you by 14yearoldbaseballfanatic:
Padres get: Yu Darvish, Victor Caratini
Cubs get: Zack Davies, lottery ticket, lottery ticket, lottery ticket, lottery ticket.
First reaction: Hope one of the lottery tickets pays off… or the Cubs got absolutely fleeced.
Cubs dump aging pitcher with 60MM contract, and now have room to add in their budget. Not that much difference in expected results of Davies and Yu. Wouldn’t surprise me to see Davies start more games than Darvish in 2021. Plus four prospects added to the farm. Not bad for a salary dump.
Yu was a top 10 pitcher last year. Top Ten how can you compare him to Davies?
Because Davies posted a 2.73 era himself and there are reasons to believe Darvish could regress. Could.
Davies also pitched well in the playoffs, not that the Cubs need to worry about that
They aren’t having a fire sale to “have room to add in their budget”.
“Room to add in their budget”: you realize there’s no salary cap in baseball? Since when did the Cubs become a small market team?
Harry Caray just threw up in his grave . Let’s just hope this is another Dejesus for Bowa/Sandberg.. No wonder Theo quit
Ewwww
To be honest, I was expecting Wil Myers to be in the deal to fill the hole of the non tendered shwarber
Cubs were shedding $$$$ not taking back $$$
time for the angels to get grey or musgrove
Then Bauer
lol
I’d rather have had Darvish for what could be a comparable price. Musgrove’s stats can be had on the free agent market.
Or Carrasco or Marquez.
2021 is Davies’ walk year. Unless the Cubs can extend him, it’s a waste. I don’t understand this at all from their perspective, except as a salary dump.
4 prospects. The return wasn’t about Davies
4 lottery tickets, arguably all lesser then the prospects TB got.
Tampa traded a younger and cheaper player. It should be less, because Dervish at his age, price, and inconsistent history, is the lesser player.
You have no way to know that.
so you do understand
Finally, I’ve been waiting all day
This must be revenge for Rizzo.!. I still hate the padres and Steve Garvey.
Nola-Caratini…that seems like an exceptional catching tandem
Campusano, Nola, Carabiner as the 3rd catcher
No one even close to major league ready. Crazy.
Who was the genius that was saying Darvish would cost more prospects than the Snell deal?
Lol
Davies had the same stats as darvish is younger and 15 million per year cheaper in addition Cubs picked up 4 prospects in padres top 15, go Lose some weight.
Yeah, that was total insane thinking. Young good pitcher, old good pitcher who gets paid a lot more. Hmmmm? Lmao
Precaido and Mena could be any kind. It is going to take some time, but they could end up being top prospects.
I mean, it’s easy to be intimidated when you see what your NL Central rivals are doing. Totally understandable move by the Cubs.
Underrated comment
2020 NFC East – we are the worst divison in pro sports
2021 NL Central – hold my quality talent
Hoyer should be completely embarrassed…..To not get even 1 of the Padres top 10 prospects for Darvysh? WTF was he thinking
His age 34+ and 3/$62 had a lot to do with it.
Agree with 5tool
He surely passed on a couple to headline preciado in the deal. A 17 year old already playing professional ball and a shortstop. Not sure how you’d expect much more than that ?? Comments here crazy
I like all 4 of the prospects that the Cubs are getting. All 4 of them very well could end up being top 100 prospects in a year or 2. Disappointing that not a single one of them is a pitcher though.
Reports are Cubs are eating some of Darvish salary also. Don’t forget Caratini is under control for 4 years. This is Nucking Futs.
I called it, said people would be shocked at how little they got back in the way a big prospects.
Diehard Cubs fan and really disappointed in this trade, top 3 NL pitcher and very controllable salary, and we couldn’t even get a top 5 prospect, come on now. Cubs were quick to give up top prospects in Soler, G Torres, E Jimenez, among others and this is what they get on the opposite side. Extremely disappointed, just goes to show it’s simply a salary dump.
Very good point. Look at what we gave up for 3 yrs of Quintana. Yes, more affordable but clearly less talented pitcher- still got a top prospect in Jimenez and solid arm in Cease. Disgraceful salary dump.
Your comparison is awful. It’s a totally different economy. Not to mention Quintana was far more reliable. Who knows what you’re going to get from Darvish
I can’t wait to see what the Reds get for Castillo/Gray/Saurez
Hopefully 3 low level prospects from the Angels.
They better have 3 separate trades lined up w 3 quality top prospects headlining each trade w good backup pieces. If not, reds should keep all 3
Must be nice to be a Padre fan this week. Wow. As an Angel fan all we’ve got on MLBTR Angel page has been “Howie Kendrick Retires” for a week. ZZZZZZZ
Your team won a World Series in 2002; don’t be greedy. Some children in the world will never have their team win a World Series, and many of them have to eat sand for dinner and drink dirty water.
Well this escalated quickly
Cubs get 4 high risk, high upside prospects. Those saying they got fleeced know little about baseball. Stocked farm system, building for 2023/2024. It worked last time.
Fire sale
Simple as that
Darvish wasn’t getting that return last offseason. Less simple than u think
Great return.
Cubs just saved me a few hundred bucks to not have to get Hulu Live next summer.
Kyle Davies is pretty good though.
Underrated comment. I think Hulu is actually dropping Marquee too
Padres got Darvish, Snell and Caratini for
#3 Patino
#7 Wilcox
#11 Preciado
#13 Caissie
#14 Hunt
#15 Mena
#16 Santana
+ Davies and Mejia.
Massive improvements and the original top 10 is still 80% there. SD has such a massive farm it barely dented it. Terrifying what else they might do with all these prospects that they don’t really need because they have positions spoken for long term.
Lindor. shove him in the OF if you need to.
Hader might as well book his flight to SD now.
Maybe if he does you can get all emotional and feminine about it.
They did the same thing on the Clevinger deal earlier this year too. All quantity over quality.
It’s absolutely crazy that they were able to get multiple years of control over Darvish, Snell and Clev and only gave up 1 top 100 prospect in the process.
Pure salary dump. Pitiful return for an ace with 3 years of control. Can you say punting 2021??? Sad thing is as bad as the brewers, reds and deadbirds are the Cubs may still squeak out the division since they still have far superior talent compared to the rest.
Darvish at age 36-37 could be a 2/$40m mess too.
Anything is possible, but what’s the point?
If he wasn’t pitching so well these last several seasons I’d agree with you but this guy has it working right now and worth every penny.
WOW… you can tell Theo took all the algorithms and formulas with him. Aside from Davies, I’ve never heard of the “prospects” the Cubs acquired.
Does anybody have some sabermetrics or advanced statistics on them? Please leave out old stats like batting average/HR/RBI, or wins/ERA/IP. Only sabermetrics please.
General scouting report on Mena I believe is average hit and power, plus speed, defense and arm, athletic but imposing, good instincs. Overall could be a goon if it pans out. That’s the only prospect I think I have any info on.
If you never heard of those prospects then sabermetrics aren’t going to help you.
Little theo epstein caused the cubs implodio
Surprised they havent dumped Bryant yet
Can’t get anything for him with that salary. The only hope there is if Bryant has a great first half and gets traded for something at the deadline.
Stupid question, but what exactly is the reasoning for the Chicago Cubs, one of the most iconic and recognizable sports brands, to clear their payroll? It’s not like they can’t afford to put out a good product on the field each year. Selling low on Darvish and other core players won’t result in a successful squad. Am I missing something about the financial state of the franchise currently?
The pandemic has ruined everything and every team has suffered catastrophic losses. Sadly, the game will likely never return to its pre-2020 ways. Vaccines won’t be available to the public until July or August, and over 50% of baseball fans aren’t going to take it anyway so it’s another lost year.
Yet the Padres can afford to spend…
My thoughts exactly. Cincinnati’s attempt to shed payroll at least makes sense given their small market status, but the Cubs? I know the pandemic has negatively affected each club’s finances, but if San Diego can add ~$50 million to their payroll, I don’t understand the Cubs motivation to clear the books just to mitigate their financial losses. They still had a very competitive team in a faltering division!
Ricketts has spent billions on the stadium and neighborhood, and the loot that was supposed to come from Marquee network hasn’t shown up yet. Gotta save some money until the people can come back.
As it stands at this point in time after today’s transactions the Padres payroll for 2021 is no more than $5 million more than 2020.
They had the 3rd highest payroll in 2020 and 2nd highest in 2019 with nothing really to show for it.
With $150m tied up and 5-6 holes to fill this offseason, they’re either committing to top $200m again, or somewhat conceding to LAD/ATL and find some savings while committing to make playoffs instead of win playoffs.
Heyward and Kimbrel are huge handcuffs.
They’re now projected around $120m and can add a few pieces without limiting themselves from making a trade deadline splash if they feel confident about playoff chances.
Does any combination of adds give them confidence to get through Dodgers in playoffs? Tough to commit to spending.
Just checking instead of going all in for now.
The Cubs will still be able to field a competitive team in a very weak division.
Or using the pretense of the Pandemic to Huizenga the roster, having already benefited from the massive appreciation of the asset due to WS’ 16. Ready to peddle false hope to a new generation.
I don’t believe that the Cubs have $50MM in space below the tax threshold. It may not be a CAP, but it works like one.
But….but….Cubs not a small market team. Unless Cub fans have been Huizengaed!
Selling “low” on Darvish..? No, the took the opportunity to dump a hot stock at its peak. I wish they would’ve landed more, and I would’ve been happy to keep Yu and retool around him. But make no mistake, he has been peaking the last year and a half. How long can he keep it up..? Who knows. But a good time to sell.
I agree. 1 year ago YU was considered a sunk cost. Sell high.
Being able to afford a mega payroll has nothing to do with it making sense. With 3 aging, declining, expiring players. 3 teams that right now should destroy you in the nl playoffs. And little likely hood of needing to fill wrigley this year. It makes perfect sense to cut salary and stock up on prospects.
Not an even one American in the prospects from the Padres. It’s an international game.
Truth be told, international prospects are more volatile. Bigger bang/bust potential. US prospects have been scouted inside out and are better known commodities. Just adds to the “lotto ticket” nature of these prospects. Not top draft picks, just international signing $.
Trader Jerry Dipito has some company. Preller is got that itch. The Padres didn’t really have to give up much it seems and they got Caratini too!
I feel like kramer test driving that car.I don’t want this ride to end.
Forgive me for being ignorant but is the return for the Cubs that bad (I’m not familiar with the Padres’ farm)? Darvish has all those innings on his arm from before coming to MLB and has been terrible outside mid-2019 and on. If you compared it to the Snell trade it should be about 65-70 of his return. Is this worse than that?
They traded a top of the rotation arm for 4 magic beans and Zach Davies. Trade might look awesome in 4 years but it’s not going to help them win any time soon.
Fernando Tatis was nothing but a magic bean when the Padres picked him up.
That’s a fair point but none of these guys are going to help the cubs win a very winnable division in the next 2-3 years. My only hope is somehow Davies outperforms Darvish next year. Hoyer will then look like a genius but I wouldn’t bet the house on it.
Here’s the reality, committing to winning the central isn’t really committing to winning a title. Are you going to be happy with a LDS appearance? Maybe LCS? If they got lucky
They’re committing to building a legitimate next contender. I can respect that
No you can’t.
Hey nonsense. WC or weak division champs often go on to win WS as recent history has shown.
Your name is lolz. No one cares what you think
Majority of fans will use terms like fleeced etc if a trade doesn’t involve a star or some websites top 100 prospect. Cubs didn’t receive any elite highly regarded prospects. They aren’t major league ready for years. But could be in few years. You want one elite prospect that could be ready in 2022 or 3 or 4 with less pedigree but still have high upside but won’t be ready until 2023 2024?
Wow 2 solid pickups for the Padres. Just glad darvish is on the Padres and not my Dodgers come playoff time.
They traded a 34 year old “ace” that has injury history and a ton of money left. If Cubs didn’t retain any of the contract, I’m okay with it. They needed to restock the system. Davies will slide into rotation and those kids will all probably be in the Cubs top 10-12 prospects. Cubs system was not stocked well at all.
The Cubs are paying the Friars some of his salary.
“Y’know, the offseason has seemed a little slow…”
-San Diego Padres
Good day (on paper) to be a Padres fan. I’m trained to be skeptically optimistic, but can’t help but feel excited today!
This shows just how much pressure ownership put on Theo, now Jed to cut payroll NOW….there has got to be more cutting….errr…trades coming….
A year ago the Cubs couldn’t trade him for a bucket of baseballs because of his big contract, mostly poor performance and injury history. Yes, he was great last year in an unusual short season with no fans in the stands.
I’m not crazy about the return, but I was always waiting for the other shoe to drop with him. I feel like the Cubs saw an opportunity to get out of that contract while they could and took it.
I’d say this is the most fair and unbiased opinion on the matter I’ve yet seen
The Cubs got 4 of the Padres top 16 prospects (11, 13, 15 and 16) from the #2 ranked farm system and a decent starter who they may be able to eventually flip. This doesn’t sound all that bad to me.
And they could flip all 4 of those prospects in a few years for the next Jose Quintana. Genius.
#2 according to who? After the Snell trade lucky if they are Top 10
100% agree. Nice take.
He was really good in 2019 too.
Darvish was “really good in 2019” in the second half. His ERA was 5.01 in the first half.
Brewer88 since when is a 3.98 era really good?
230 Ks in 180 innings in 2019. Very strong second half when health improved. His numbers are elite over past 35-40 starts.
Over the last 3 years an ops+ of 110 I’ll pass thanks. According to you the asterisk season means little to everyone other than the dodgers but yet you site numbers from that season to one sidedly support your already weak argument
What a terrible trade by a terrible GM. Jed never was meant to be anything in life other then Theos gopher. Ricketts sees it as just a big salary dump for him and his family
Great for the Padres. I’m so happy that we didn’t have to give up any top prospects for this. Darvish is a legit ace, and Caratini is a capable backup catcher. I feel really bad for Cubs fans right now, as this move probably pushes them out of playoff contention next year, though all these prospects could end up becoming great players in the future.
oof.
Yes?
No horse in the race here, but really like seeing a rotation Maddux broke out in yearssss ago that sees control guys Hendricks, and to a lesser degree, Davies taking the ball. If you’re not getting Gore (and they never were) Davies is a really great consolation building block to go along with the newfound financial flexibility.
Except he’s only controlled for a year and then hits FA after 2021
Someone let the Mets and Blue Jays know that Padres didn’t receive the memo that they were getting every player. If they don’t get that memo over to the Padres, they may end up signing Bauer, Springer and Realmuto next, along with trading for Lindor.
But the Mets are still better according to Metsfan22.
Hahaha
So true. We have to remember that all of the Mets OFs are better than Marcel Ozuna; the Braves aren’t as good as everyone thinks; the Nats and Phillies aren’t as good as the Mets; and the Marlins are so bad that, even in a 60-game season, they’ll finish 15 games out of fourth place – 25 out of first because Brandon Nimmo and Amed Rosario are better hitters than all of the Marlins. It’s proven in Nimmo’s OBP (but batting average is antiquated according to MF22) and in Amed Rosario’s batting average (but with an OBP that MF22 will not mention).. And Syndergaard and Stroman are studs whose absences this year was one of the many excuses…I mean…reasons why the Mets finished in last.
Mets are still best team in baseball. Maybe the dodgers are better. You is old, had 2 good months. Snail can’t go more than 5 innings. Lamant was a fluke. Just wait, the Mets have the richest owner in baseball. We are going to get Baur and Springer. Probably Hendrick.