7:29 pm: Forst addressed the club’s likely forthcoming payroll cuts this evening, telling Jon Heyman of the MLB Network (Twitter link) the team is willing to field offers for any player on the roster. “This is the cycle for the A’s. We have to listen and be open to whatever comes out of this. This is our lot in Oakland until it’s not.”
10:30 am: The Athletics’ stunning decision to let manager Bob Melvin leave to sign a three-year deal as the Padres’ new manager served as a portent for a bleak winter in Oakland, only increasing prior expectations that a payroll reduction was on the horizon. General manager David Forst spoke with John Shea of the San Francisco Chronicle and others at this week’s GM Meetings, and while he didn’t outright say that the team plans to reduce its bottom line in 2022, he implied that another “step back” is certainly a possibility.
“I think right now we’re in the middle of those conversations with [ownership],” said Forst. “We don’t have exact direction yet. But you look at our history, and we have three- or four-year runs and recognize where we are makes it necessary to step back. But we have not gotten to that point yet with ownership.”
While Forst understandably sidestepped a definitive declaration on the team’s payroll direction, USA Today’s Bob Nightengale writes that a pair of MLB executives told him Oakland is expected to slash payroll to as little as $50MM. One potential wrinkle as the A’s look to cut payroll, writes Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic, is the uncertainty surrounding the collective bargaining agreement. The league’s initial offer to the MLBPA included a proposed salary floor (in exchange for a reduction of the luxury tax threshold — a nonstarter for the players’ side of negotiations). Even though the MLBPA had no interest in the specifics of that particular proposal, the eventual possibility of a salary floor could come back to haunt the A’s if they gut the payroll early in the winter.
One way or another, it seems quite likely that the current Athletics’ core is going to be broken up this offseason — the question is to what extent rather than whether it’ll happen at all. Such an outcome wasn’t exactly difficult to foresee. I explored back in early September how, based on their typical payroll levels, the A’s were unlikely to spend to keep a deep arbitration class after projected raises to the likes of Matt Olson, Matt Chapman, Sean Manaea, Chris Bassitt and Frankie Montas (among others). Retaining that group would require an increase over this season’s $83.8MM payroll — already the fourth-highest in franchise history and not far below the team record of $92MM. That increase would come before making a single addition to the 2022 roster.
When looking for trade candidates on the Oakland roster, the top of that arbitration class is the most obvious place to begin. At $12MM, Olson leads the bunch in terms of expected salary, per MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz’s end-of-year projections. Each of Manaea ($10.2MM), Chapman ($9.5MM), Bassitt ($8.8MM) and Montas ($5.2MM) is also set to account for a notable portion of the team’s payroll next season.
The A’s would surely be open to moving outfielder Stephen Piscotty (still owed $8.25MM, including a 2023 option buyout) and shortstop Elvis Andrus ($7.25MM through 2022 after accounting for the portion of his salary paid by the Rangers). Neither player has much in the way of trade value at this point, however. Oakland currently projects for a payroll just north of $85MM, per Roster Resource’s Jason Martinez. That figure includes MLBTR’s projected arb salaries, the two guaranteed contracts and a slate of pre-arb salaries to round out the roster.
Olson, Chapman and Montas all have two years of club control remaining. Manaea and Bassitt are set to become free agents next winter. While it’s possible, if not likely, that other players on the Oakland roster will also see their names pop up in trade talks, that quintet offers the best blend of productivity, affordability (for other clubs) and trade value (for the A’s). Here’s a quick, high-level look at each:
- Olson (28 next year): A 2021 All-Star and two-time Gold Glove winner, Olson leads all first basemen with 34 Defensive Runs Saved and a 22.8 Ultimate Zone Rating since 2017. He’s sixth among first basemen in Statcast’s Outs Above Average during that time. Olson swatted a career-best 39 home runs in 2021 and, most importantly, cut his once-problematic strikeout rate to an 16.8% level that is well below the league average. Olson walks at a high clip, has massive left-handed power, plays elite defense and looks to have made huge gains in his contact skills. He hit .271/.371/.540 in 2021 despite a cavernous home stadium.
- Chapman (29 next year): As with Olson, Chapman is a preternatural defender. Since 2017, the two-time Platinum Glover leads third basemen in DRS (78) and UZR (48.7) and trails only Nolan Arenado in OAA (48). Chapman has huge power, but his contact trends have gone in the opposite direction of Olson. Chapman, whose 2020 season ended early due to hip surgery, struck out at a 22.8% clip from 2018-19 but a 33.1% pace in 2020-21. The glove is still elite, and Chapman has still bashed 37 homers in his past 774 plate appearances while walking at an 11.4% clip. The current version of Chapman has huge value, but if the strikeouts decline as he further distances himself from the hip injury, he has MVP-caliber talent.
- Manaea (30 next year): Manaea’s 2018 season ended with major shoulder surgery, and he missed most of 2019 while on the mend. Since returning, he’s delivered 263 innings of 3.73 ERA ball with near-identical reviews from fielding-independent marks like FIP (3.64) and SIERA (3.78). In that time, Manaea has a 24.8% strikeout rate, a 5.2% walk rate and a 43.8% grounder rate — all strong marks. He moved from a four-seamer to a sinker this season, and the 92.2 mph average on that sinker was the best velocity on his primary offering since his four-seamer sat 93.1 mph as a rookie in 2016. He’s a one-year rental, but a good one.
- Bassitt (33 next year): A frightening injury that saw Bassitt struck in the face by a 100 mph-plus line drive in August looked like it might end his season. Bassitt, however, returned from surgery to repair facial fractures on Sept. 23 and made two appearances to close out his season (6 1/3 innings, one run allowed). Since establishing himself as a big leaguer in 2018, the late-blooming righty has a 3.23 ERA, a 23.1% strikeout rate, a 7.1% walk rate and a 42.3% grounder rate in 412 innings. This past season’s 25% strikeout rate and 6.1% walk rate were career-highs. Like Manaea, Bassitt is a free agent next winter but would make a fine rental for a contender.
- Montas (29 next year): Montas consistently averages better than 96 mph on his heater. The 2021 season was his first topping 100 innings, thanks to a combination of injuries, the shortened 2020 campaign and an 80-game PED ban. Lack of innings notwithstanding, Montas has been effective on the whole since 2018, logging a combined 3.57 ERA with above-average strikeout and walk rates. The 2021 season looked to be a true breakout, as Montas ranked ninth in MLB with 187 innings and turned in a 3.37 ERA with a career-high 26.6% strikeout rate.
The asking price on those players, and others, will vary based on expected earnings and remaining club control. It’s not a given that the A’s trade all five, of course, and it’s possible that even as they do make some changes on the roster, some of those dollars are reallocated to low-cost free agents.
In past trades of notable players, the A’s have tended to focus on upper-level prospects and young big leaguers who’ve yet to establish themselves rather than the lower-level types often targeted by teams commencing full teardowns. That’s not a guaranteed blueprint for how they’ll operate this winter, but the focus on near-term assets is part of the reason the A’s have managed to remain so competitive amid frequent “step backs,” regular roster turnover and perennial payroll constraints.
The extent of this ostensible “step back” will be partly determined by the extent to which ownership is willing to spend in future seasons, but the A’s have never embarked on the sort of lengthy, years-long rebuilds we’ve recently seen in Baltimore, Detroit and other places. Oakland has never had more than three straight losing seasons under Billy Beane and has just eight total losing records in Beane’s 24 full seasons leading baseball operations.
Milwaukee-2208
Oakland cutting costs???
What? Never in my life have I seen this
MLBTR Commenter
Relocate relocate relocate
Braves Butt-Head
Things that the A’s have done for 120 years cut costs and relocate.
FredMcGriff for the HOF
@chi. First the team needs sold to another billionaire ownership that will actually spend money. After that the new owners need to relocate.
Benjamin101677
No Oakland needs out of Oakland; it is scary going to a Oakland game not in a great neighborhood lots of crime etc.
I think Las Vegas be the better spot with loose of California taxes be a huge win right there also very few players call the Oakland area home so not a huge loose by moving
bkwalker510
lol “it’s scary” are you a child?
Halo11Fan
A toddler was shot dead while sleeping in a car while his parent was driving. It’s a scary place.
User 1471943197
He’s either a kid…stoned…drunk..or just stupid
winonarider
Stadium not too bad but the walk from BART to the gate is like a prison walk. Barbed wire, chain linked fences, hobos, etc
Bosox2013
No it’s not. It’s basically freeway to stadium.
Pete'sView
The stadium sucks. (Thanks, Al Davis.).
bkwalker510
in Vegas you’ll get killed by a drunk driver or in a mass shooting. is it really any safer?
stymeedone
@sheer
Are you Pro-Fascism? That would make you a Fascist.
Halo11Fan
Walk around Vegas at 2AM, Walk around Oakland. Then get back to me.
mister guy
that didn’t happen in oakland, it happened on the freeway going past oakalnd. If the cars shooting each other on the freeway were 10 minutes out would you care? probably not because it doesn’t fit your narrative.
Halo11Fan
Going past Oakland? If a toddler wasn’t dead, I would have laughed.
mfm4200
and fascists destroyed dc with their riots.
but hey, pretend only one side does this stuff, okay?
66TheNumberOfTheBest
“A toddler was shot dead while sleeping in a car while his parent was driving. It’s a scary place.”
Just curious, are places where dudes get shot while jogging also “scary places”?
Bart Harley Jarvis
sheer,
Snowflake much?
Bart Harley Jarvis
Winona,
So, the stadium’s okay, but the parking lot frightens you?
Fever Pitch Guy
You haven’t seen scary until you’ve been to a night game at Nationals Park.
Or go about 3 blocks north of Oriole Park.
slidepiece
It is scary bk and I can totally wreck you.
tstats
Walking out of comerica is a lil scary but not terrible.
HubertHumphrey
I was in Oakland this summer. Seems nice to me.
uberalec 2
Cringe take beta man
dclivejazz
My gawd, it’s not scary to go to a Nats game. Get real.
downsr30
From a business perspective – if I told you that the Yankees profited $100m in 2021 with the payroll they had and the A’s profited $10m in 2021 with the payroll they spent, would you suggest that they should spend more money?
The amount of people that don’t understand basic economics amazes me. So many people think teams should just spend to compete with higher spending teams.
Go buy a house that is 3x more expensive than your current house, let me know how that works out for you.
kevnames42
The problem is this though. If the current ownership group can’t afford to support the team, then they should sell the team. It’s very ridiculous to have to cut spending back on a good team to $50 million. I’m not saying their a World Series contender but if they make a couple of solid additions they could push for a Wild Card or surprise us all like usual with a divisional crown.
kevnames42
They’re * oops
Philly A's
Well said Kev.
downsr30
So if they are only turning a $10m profit, you want them to spend more? That makes a lot of business sense.
Yankee Clipper
Kevnames: You’re correct, which is why forcing the major markets to support the smaller markets, and then reward those same smaller markets for losing, is an abomination.
seamaholic 2
A team’s finances have nothing whatsoever to do with how wealthy the owners are, except in very unusual circumstances like when Tom Monaghan was trying to buy a championship for Detroit before he died, and massively underwrote the team’s losses. In every other case, the team’s finances are separate from the owners’ because they are sepatate businesses, and the team spends what it can. The A’s obviously cannot spend at the level of the Yankees, or within 5x of that total (at least). They just can’t. The money is not in their account. Owners can demand their teams spend profits down to zero, sure. But the A’s profit is probably only a few million bucks so that doesn’t buy you anything.
The problem is not owners not spending, it’s that size of customer bases vary wildly among the 30 MLB businesses, and that informs local TV contracts and ticket sales (and prices) both of which affect revenue. And revenue drives expenditures, within a small band.
deweybelongsinthehall
Who believes anything related to MLB teams revenues and profits? They can’t compete with most other markets but I take what owners say with three eyes open…
Yankee Clipper
Seamaholic2: “ A team’s finances have nothing whatsoever to do with how wealthy the owners are, except in very unusual circumstances…”
I don’t see any circumstance where the two aren’t inextricably linked. One is the result of the other. Nonetheless, all teams are wealthy and don’t use that wealth in order to turn a bigger profit. The money they get from revenue sharing pay for a majority of their rosters.
This is why even big market teams would love a hard cap…wealth produces more wealth. Teams ranking is what is ruining the game and removing parity, not a disparity in team value as many purport.
Yankee Clipper
“Ranking” = tanking **
redmatt
Define “support.” Should they find the team as a nonprofit public service?
Halo11Fan
Yankee Clipper. If owners are treating teams as cash cows, you are 100 percent correct…. If owners are running in the red every year, then you are not.
stymeedone
@yankee Clippers
No more an abomination than restricting other teams from competing in the larger markets. How about the Brooklyn A’s! Let bring down market sizes to comparable levels.
Pete'sView
stymeedone – Interesting idea. Although—were that to be applied—it would limit countrywide interest, which would have its own (depressing) impact on revenues.
Yankee Clipper
Styme: I respect your views, we just differ on the fundamental cause of the problem. But, since revenue sharing has been implemented, is it making it better for the foreseeable future, with teams intentionally selling off and tanking? I’d venture to say, no.
I posit that teams striving to win are much more competitive, regardless of the market size. I am not a fan of baseball socialism. Taking money from one team to give to another doesn’t level the playing field. It allows one to try and the other to flounder while it’s owner (the smaller market) keeps getting more wealthy. Which team is restricted from competing? None, they are all incredibly wealthy, just as baseball as a whole is.
BTW, the other sports that have implemented measures to facilitate parity have far less parity than MLB has had.
Yankee Clipper
Hallo11: Which do you think is the truth? Honest question, as I respect your opinion.
downsr30
It would take a complete system overhaul and it would likely have to be implemented from the inauguration of a league, but it would make much more sense if the entire league was one entity, every team is trying to make $ to profit as a league and each team receives an equal share of the profits, players get paid based on performance, and each team has a set budget that they are allowed to spend and cannot go over. It would eliminate the big market/small market problem, it would keep contracts growing properly with the game and would promote more strategy and less overspending.
stymeedone
I’m really not suggesting they break up the current markets. I’m making the point that larger markets have an advantage. If the Rays were in NY, they would put the Yankees to shame with how they operate, and the Yankees relocated to TB would struggle and have to be selling off players. @Yankee Clipper–teams that have the money are better able to buy the players to strive to win. How much more difficult is it to run a $230 MM payroll in Pittsburgh? Teams are businesses and need to stay profitable or at least break even within their revenue stream.
ClevelandSpidersFromMars
You’re mixing up your pizza moguls. It was not the Domino’s guy, who is still alive, but the Little Caesar’s guy, Mike Ilitch, who was the free spender.
Sherm623
@YC
Ranking is an outstanding word for it, however. Should become the new vernacular.
tigerdoc616
I think you mean Mike Ilitch. Monaghan was the owner before Ilitch and he never spent that much.
Otherwise pretty spot on. Fans seem to think baseball franchises are some play toys for rich owners and don’t seem to care if they make or lose money. Well, the owners do care and they are not, except in rare circumstances, going to run their team at a loss on a consistent basis.
So the real question is how do you make smaller market teams more competitive and profitable or can you create a system where can compete on an even footing with the larger market teams even though they cannot spend and profit with those larger market teams?
iverbure
You do that by leaving it the way it is now.
baines03
your hypotheticals are based on nothing.
how about this… What if the A’s turned a profit before 1 home game was even played?… because they do. They simply want MORE profit.
downsr30
Even when the A’s are good, the stands aren’t packed. What makes the team $? Fans in the seats and watching on TV. The A’s will not be successful financially in Oakland.
seamaholic 2
This is incorrect. You are ignoring stadium costs, for one. It’s quite possible the A’s lose money on some of their home games. I know the Rays do.
Benjamin101677
Most businesses and baseball is one for huge grants; and forgivable loans for businesses during pandemic so I don’t think baseball was any different the way they moved the all star so I don’t think any team is poor
Halo11Fan
I’m glad you know this. There have been a couple team that have opened their book. One team lost over 9 figures and the other has seasons where it loses money.
But you say they are cash cows. And your proof is your lack of knowledge.
Appalachian_Outlaw
@downsr30- You’re oversimplifying that to support your whole “you people don’t understand basic economics” argument.
The Yankees profit because they have built a brand, and they’ve done so by spending money to win.
The A’s are constantly burning it to the ground.
If you opened a business and spent very little money on staff, training or marketing- how do you suppose you’d do?
downsr30
If they are being held in Oakland, and the city won’t support them in building a new stadium, it doesn’t matter what they do – they won’t pack that stadium. They need to move. That’s all there is to it. Spending more $ in the current situation will do nothing for them.
acell10
why exactly should the city be spending money on a stadium? those historically have always screwed the municipality in the long run. Perhaps billionaire owners and entities should pay for their own stadium.
seamaholic 2
No, the Yankees profit because there are 22 million people in the NYC media market, and many of them are very wealthy. Their take just from home game ticket sales is something like 7x what the A’s take.
Joe says...
The Yankees also have to share the NY market with the Mets. It’s not like they have the whole big apple to themselves.
redmatt
And they have a metro area of 12 million to draw from.
Ducky Buckin Fent
Oh, no!
Not wealthy people!
Yankee Clipper
So, because they have more fans and their city has more people (that aren’t even all baseball fans) they deserve to have their profit reduced and given to other teams who consistently cut payroll? That is counterintuitive to any growth, financial or fans of the sport.
Benjamin101677
With profit sharing probably keeps teams through from trying to get into their markets. Wasn’t that many years ago that New York had 3 teams.
Yankee Clipper
Yes, Ducky. The disdained wealthy person. They’re basically the devil incarnate. They don’t deserve wealth, it should be spread to everyone. Next, we should demand that the fans get a piece of the pie…I mean, what about the working man too?
Ducky Buckin Fent
Well, you know my attitude on it, Clip.
Come & take it from me if you are able. I feel complete confidence in defending my family, home, & self. Hey, the taxpayers of this fine country invested quite a few resources at one time into training me in with the appropriate & requisite “skills” for such.
Plus I have a good tax guy. So.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Then you KNOW, YOU ARE NOT THE BOSS, YOU ARE THE SERVANT.
Ducky Buckin Fent
Well then I SEE IT COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.
Yankee Clipper
For some reason, when I read your comments, I actually yelled the capitalization…. Success!
stymeedone
As long as their market is protected by MLB, and that market is so much larger, yes, they deserve to have their revenue shared with the other franchises who are supposed to be equal partners, but were given smaller markets. In theory, it would make more MLB fans throughout the country. Admittedly, it needs more requirements on how the money gets used.
Sherm623
And the Yankees have fans all over the world…other teams, not as much (certainly there are some, but they are less likely to be the small markets)
Halo11Fan
Using a house is a good analogy. I have a lot of equity in my house. Why would I keep borrowing on it and continue to spend more than I make?
Some owners lose money. Sure they get it back when the sell, but why should they have to lose money every year until then?
Benjamin101677
I don’t believe any owners actually loose money or they would sell.
Why keep a team when you loose money
Halo11Fan
Ben, I do believe teams lose money. But that’s really the starting point for this discussion.
Yankee Clipper
Halo11: Using that house analogy though, would you then expect your neighbor to pay your mortgage so you can do upgrades and pad your savings account? That’s pretty much what MLB is doing….
stymeedone
Its more like putting a mortgage on your vacation property to do improvements on your own home, because all are under the management of Major League Baseball. Your neighbor has no financial reliance on your home. MLB teams do have a financial relationship with each other.
jeffmaz
Best to find a new owner whose sole source of income isn’t the team.
dodgerfan83
In 2018 the A’s received 118 million in revenue sharing. Their payroll was under 70 million. The money is there to spend, the owners would just rather pocket it.
FSF
Can you literally show us that though? I doubt your numbers are anywhere near reality.
bigeasye
Why is this team still in Oakland with this ownership group?????
downsr30
Has nothing to do with ownership.
zimerust
It is 100% ownership, what are you talking about? lol
downsr30
If they don’t make much $ in the first place, what do you suggest they do?
seamaholic 2
Ownership has nothing to do with how much revenue a team makes. The team may be marketing itself poorly, but the bigger drivers are just market size (the A’s share a medium-sized market with another team), stadium (which again is controlled by the city not the owners), and most of all TV contract.
DarkSide830
the amount being small is relative. they still make plenty of money.
Yankee Clipper
Last time they won was during the epoch with no revenue sharing. That should tell us something.
jessaumodesto
Fire sale! As an Oakland fan this is why they need to run to Las Vegas and stop this 30 year cycle
seamaholic 2
Baseball in Vegas is pretty much unwatchable. The air’s so dry the ball does crazy things. You don’t want the A’s to move there. It’s Coors Field x10.
Benjamin101677
Where would the Athletics go if not Vegas?? The giants blocked them from San Jose?
Yankee Clipper
Tennessee
DarkSide830
Vancouver
Benjamin101677
Tennesse has a ownership group in place for a expansion team
Benjamin101677
No MLB team going to Canada without it not being Montreal
The Saber-toothed Superfife
San Antonio. Tucson. Flagstaff. Albequerque.
bucketbrew35
New Mexico would be a nice addition. Years ago I would have said Portland Oregon but now they’d probably just let the stadium get burned down.
tstats
Salem Oregon
48-team MLB
Albuquerque Desert Dogs or San Antonio Scorpions
solaris602
I’d love to have a ML team here in NM, but there’s no market here large enough to support one.
Bart Harley Jarvis
The Toilet in the Desert? Really?
Milwaukee-2208
Oakland garage sale inbound. Come get your goods all on clearance.
Texas Outlaw
I expect there will be a salary floor. 75 mil makes sense. If there is no floor… HOLY SMOKES! Oakland guts the team, and loses 105 plus next year.
oldmansteve
Oakland will still manage to win 78 games with a team salary of $30mm.
Texas Outlaw
Sadly not so.
RunDMC
Beane-lieve
zacharydmanprin
Steve Adam’s is also the person who said the A’s were on fire back in late July (despite losing 10 of 14), there was no problem with Bob Melvin’s handling of the bullpen and the A’s we’re going to make the playoffs. In other words; he has no clue.
Lloyd Emerson
Says a tool who can’t even spell ADAMS properly…
Steve Adams
The A’s didn’t have a period in July where they lost 10 of 14, and I don’t recall ever being asked about Bob Melvin’s bullpen management. It’s perhaps true that I picked them to make the playoffs at some point in July, for which I deeply apologize.
Thanks for reading!
FSF
I think the call that the As would make the playoffs was by no means unreasonable.
tstats
STEVE WITH THE FIRE
top jimmy
The Yankees should offer whatever it takes to get Olson and Murphy from them.
Ronk325
Olson yes but Murphy likely isn’t available and both players would cost an arm and a leg
Joe says...
Who else feels like Andrews will be the starting SS for the Yankees next year?
Yankee Clipper
Oh man, I certainly hope not…..but I could see it (gasp)
I’d take him if it meant getting Olsen/Chapman at a lower cost though.
Joe says...
Clipper, that’s what I had in mind on that. We all know how much Cashman is loathe to part with prospects. I can definitely see that as a part of getting Olsen. Maybe even Manaea.
Yankee Clipper
Joe, I’d take that in a heartbeat.
billysbballz
Here a trade idea.
Yanks get Olsen and Anderson
A’s get Gleyber Torres, Voit, and Miguel Andujar
DODGER JR
Seager will be the starting SS for the Yankees next year.
Yankee Clipper
Dodger: I’m probably Seager’s biggest fan, and he is my top choice. However, if the years/$ for contracts is anywhere close to predictions, Story is a much better acquisition for the Yankees. Half the years, half the money, and much better defense.
Seager is the best SS bat IMO though.
Joe says...
Clipper, the Yankees could also get Andrews in a deal this year and revisit the SS market next year. If one of their prospects aren’t ready, Turner, Swanson, Xander and Tim Anderson are all FAs next year.
Joe says...
I missed the club option on Anderson. He’s not going to be available.
Xander has a player option and unless something bad happens, he’s opting out.
FSF
Yanks need to trade Voit and some prospects for Olsen. Left hand 1st baseman with great bat and glove and two years of control (which is all they need at the moment). I know, easier said than done.
iverbure
Who the hell is Andrews?
Joe says...
I misspelled his name though I’m sure you know I was referring to Elvis.
hammertime510
Relocation is a bad idea. If anything, the ownership needs to relocate if they can’t afford to keep payroll up. I have no sympathy for billionaires, the A’s made you a profit… now spend!
Oakland is way worthy of a baseball team, even more so than Vegas.
Appalachian_Outlaw
This is no knock on the A’s fan base, but the city itself has proven disinterested in doing what it takes to keep a professional sports team. That stadium is atrocious, and how long have talks for a new one been ongoing? The city shouldn’t foot the entire bill, but they have to be partners in it somewhat.
They should really just move the A’s to Vegas. It’s a shame those good teams constantly get dismantled in Oakland.
A'sfaninUK
Point to how the stadium is “atrocious” I literally grew up going there, its home to me. Its old, for sure, but there’s no obstructed views (thanks Joe Dimaggio). and the weather is nice most of the time.
I bet youve never even set foot there. Truly weak.
Not a clever name
I go to about 4 games a year it’s a dump, you just don’t realize it until you go to chavez latrine ( actually a very nice park but I hate the dodgers) Petco park or Oracle.
billysbballz
The city is a cesspool of crime and people don’t want to be around that so that could be a big reason no?
The Saber-toothed Superfife
The TRUTH is, Oakland has way more issues to worry about than any damn baseball team and the enterprises of a single set of billionaire owners – unless they CAN SEE ON PAPER, how the team can provide financing to help solve the sociopolitical issues happening in this great American city.
IHLgulls
Baseball teams are not responsible for fixing cities, wtf
seamaholic 2
You have no idea how businesses work, sorry to say. Owners do not subsidize businesses in the red. They cut costs until the business is back in the black. If you think the A’s profit is such that they could spend $50m more a year or something on player salaries, you need to go back and learn how to add.
Samuel
@ seamaholic 2;
Most Americans are economically illiterate.
(As Henny Youngman put it – “How can my account be overdrawn? I still have checks left!”)
I learned over 50 years ago that there are two groups of people that are at the top of the list……..
Sports fans and sports writers.
Suggest you save your breath.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
@ Samuel
BS. And you are insulting Americans.
BS!
BS!
How loyal are you to this country?
Benjamin101677
I don’t think any Major League Baseball team looses money anymore with revenue sharing etc. they may not make billions but they make a profit. I have a small business and show on paper to loose money each year but I have a house; 3 cars a boat and money in the bank so profit and loose statements don’t show the full picture
I think a lot of teams have found a model to trade off players and make a nice profit without the risk etc. of putting big money into a team.
I think the dodgers Yankees and now maybe the Braves the way the team president is speaking have figured out that winning is a whole lot more fun in October.
A'sfaninUK
Look at how the raiders are “adapting” to Las Vegas as to a future glimpse into how all pro sports teams’ effects on LV – death, chaos and destruction. No thanks. Oakland is much more deserving of a team, as is San Jose.
Benjamin101677
Giants blocked Athletics from San Jose
Dustyslambchops23
Vegas Knights seem to be doing just fine.
zacharydmanprin
Vegas was 13th in attendance last season. 8th so far this season but it’s early. But those numbers need to be eyeballed. How much are corporate tickets bought and given away? How much are based on the Knights being the new, new thing? Hard to tell if there is a fan base for a few years. Also, hard to compare NHL to MLB radio/TV contracts.
iverbure
Why should ownership sell. The team is super competitive given the small payroll. They ought to slash payroll more probably win more.
30 Parks
… Montreal.
seamaholic 2
The level at which Montreal supported the Expos back in the day is wildly exaggerated. That team moved for a good reason. They were the Rays of their day: Very good but very cheap. The city is tiny and baseball isn’t their sport.
Benjamin101677
1994 killed the Montreal they had a strong team were leading the division when the strike happened. Had no strike occurred I think Montreal would still have baseball
sdbaseballguy
If one season can kill a team then the fanbase and support is not really there. 94’ didn’t kill the Expos, it just sped up the inevitable.
30 Parks
Seamaholic, that’s a remarkably uninformed response. Montreal has a long history with baseball and you are greatly oversimplifying the matter.
Yankee Clipper
It’s interesting though, because Billy Beane is in record chastising teams’ tanking, taking advantage of MLB rewarding losing teams – and I agree. He said that teams should get higher draft pick compensation and other rewards for winning, and that’s what will make the game more competitive, and again, I agree.
I’d be very happy if the Yankees could acquire Olsen, or Chapman, or Manea, depending on costs. I’m assuming Chapman’s hip surgery will reduce the cost of acquisition in personnel, but he certainly won’t be given away.
A'sfaninUK
Yankees have nothing the A’s would take other than Dominguez. Rays, RedSox, Padres etc have much more to offer. Olson Chapman and Manaea fit on all 30 teams, why would the A’s even bother?
Joe says...
Because the Yankees have what the As want: Money
billysbballz
Yanks have a better farm so not really sure what you are talking about other than showing a bias.
Mario93
They do this all the time, yet still find ways to be somewhat competitive. Ways of the Oakland A’s.
Paulie Walnuts
Board Member 1: I’ve never heard of half of these guys and the ones I do know are way past their prime.
Charlie Donovan: Most of these guys never had a prime.
Rachel Phelps: The fact is we lost our two best players to free agency. We haven’t won a pennant in over thirty-five years, we haven’t placed higher than fourth in the last fifteen. Obviously, it’s time for some changes.
Board Member 2: This guy here is dead!
Rachel Phelps: Cross him off, then!
For Love of the Game
Thousand “thumbs up” if I could!!!
Ronk325
Brian Cashman needs to be all over Matt Olson if he’s really available. Start your offer with Oswald Peraza and Luis Gil/Clarke Schmidt and be willing to include a couple others
bkwalker510
ew no thanks on Gil/Schmidt. those guys are maybe throw ins in an Olson deal
Ronk325
Gil is a top 100 prospect right now and Schmidt was as well not too long ago. Neither of them are throw ins
hammertime510
I hope the A’s pull everyone’s carpet and spend just to spite everyone.
Benjamin101677
Oakland doesn’t have a lot of money; I got box seats into Oakland this year for almost nothing as they weren’t drawing fans
Thesecondjamie
In other news, the sun appears set to rise tomorrow morning.
Not a clever name
Not in Oakland it’s raining here.
TennVol
The Jays and A’s should be talking. Could see discussions surrounding a package from the Jays for Olson, Montas and Manaea. You could see a package from Toronto centering around Pearson, Biggio, and Kirk and a few other minor leaguers in th 10-20 range. Olson takes over first base and Vlad goes to 3rd base.
1fifth2fifthRed5thBlue5th
I dont see oakland packaging guys. They should trade each individually to get as many young cheap controllable pieces as they can.
Benjamin101677
You have a good point. I think also we forget the hard work a baseball front office does. We see the team on the field but don’t see the hours of phone calls that a team must make and research on every trade scenario they do.
I would be very surprised if any trades happen until a new bargaining agreement is in place. Especially since team salary floors are being discussed. Hate to trade your people away and find out that you have to keep a 100 million payroll
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Al Avila probably spends most his phone time ordering empanadas…….
Dustyslambchops23
Vlad’s 3rd base days are over. He went to management mid season and says he wants to stay at 1st base. Given his break out, would be best not to mess with it.
Chapman would make sense however. I’d be worried about selling low on Pearson
The Saber-toothed Superfife
That guy is AWESOME. He Knows he has to work hard training and weight control. Probably going to end up one of the all time greats!
seamaholic 2
You’re overavaluing Pearson (most recently a struggling reliever), Biggio (one of the worst hitters in baseball last year), and Kirk (the Jays’ third best catching prospect) pretty radically. That package gets you Manaea, but that’s about it. Doesn’t touch Olson.
Dustyslambchops23
You’re using one year of data to evaluate players with much longer track records, so not sure your evaluation is any more correct than the original posters. Also outside of Moreno who ranks higher than Kirk? What does a players rank within an organization have anything to do with their value to another organization anyways?
oilers777
Guerrero Jr. should not play third base because his defence at third base is poor. Chapman would make more sense than Olson for the Blue Jays.
1fifth2fifthRed5thBlue5th
Oakland plays their cards right they’ll be set for a while. Most of the name above should bring in good packages if traded individually.
antsmith7
Gleyber Torres plus prospects for Olson?
phillesfan07
I don’t think you would need to give much more than Gleyber for Olson, Probably just like a low floor high ceiling type prospect.
Dustyslambchops23
LOL
RunDMC
With Torres being the throw-in, right? His power was sapped in a bandbox. Imagine him in the Coliseum.
phillesfan07
Oakland isn’t going to get a ton in return with the salary the Yankees would have to take, but if they were to eat a little of it maybe then you could get more (Not saying hes not worth the salary but the Yankees aren’t exactly free on luxary tax space)
1fifth2fifthRed5thBlue5th
Then you trade him elsewhere for a better package. There won’t be a lack of suitors. Giants could easily put together a strong package for Olson and add his bat to the lineup across town.
Starting the package with Luis Matos plus Kyle Harrison and other pieces to build strong quantity package.
Olson has 2 years of control.
mick4488
Torres is still a thing? Really? Seriously?
phillesfan07
I Don’t really see a deal forming around him anyway. The problem would be that the Yankees would feel like they are giving too much with the contract they are taking epically since Olsen is another high K% guy maybe if they move Gallo but for now I don’t think a deal could form.
elmedius
The contract they are taking on? You mean the arb increase on Olson’s 5m from 2021? Seriously doubt the contract is a problem at all… if anything it sends more back Oakland’s way.
CCCTL
> since Olson is a high K% guy
“16.8% … well below the league average.”
And that’s why the Yankees will be outbid.
bobtillman
Torres is still a thing only to Yankee fans who are still worried about whose cap Refsnyder’s going to wear on his Hall of Fame bust.
Yankee Clipper
Not really, Torres is still an incredibly valuable player objectively. His age, his ability, and his team control are what teams like.
seamaholic 2
But his years of control aren’t. He’s entering arbitration now. The A’s don’t want players who will escalate in cost quickly. They want guys with a full six years of control.
Benjamin101677
Great point there idea before was major league ready players so they want the 5-6 years of control.
Which usually means 2-3 and hope 1 is good.
I also think they will make a team take a bad contract back with them when or if they trade the elite stars.
Ducky Buckin Fent
“incredibly valuable player” is – at this point in time anyway – overselling him, @Clipper. According to BTV, Gleyber has a surplus trade value of $10.8MM. As a comparison, Buxton (Twins) has a value of 14.2 mil.
There’s certainly some value there. No doubt. But not a huge amount.
LordD99
I suspect a soft salary floor, if it ever were agreed to, wouldn’t happen until 2023. They would need to give teams a year to prepare. Imagine if they don’t come to an agreement until midway through Spring Training, then teams are faced with restructuring their rosters for a season starting in a few weeks to ensure they are penalized. This is quite different than when they implemented the Yankee tax, I mean the luxury tax, I mean the competitive balance tax, because it impacted a single team. This could impact many teams. A phased approach would be required. No matter. I don’t see it happening.
LordD99
…to ensure they *aren’t* penalized.
wkkortas
A’s become good enough to be on the cusp of a championship, then tear down. Rinse and repeat.
baseballpun
I see one of those pitchers going to STL.
Monkey’s Uncle
What’s French Canadian for “Come and take our players before we move to Montreal?”
DarkSide830
zut!
Rangers29
I. Want. Montas. It’s plain and simple. The Rangers need some pitching this off-season, and if they could get some big bang-for-their-buck guys it looks like Verlander, Kluber, and Montas are some of the best options out there. It won’t take a big name prospect like Jung, Foscue, or Winn to get him either, something closer to the realm of Wendzel, Owen White, Duran, and Calhoun would suffice. We have the depth to do it.
Benjamin101677
Rangers would have to overpay normally teams don’t trade much in same division. Yes I know they did the andrus deal but Oakland doesn’t want the rangers getting better
Rangers29
They’ve been pretty avid trade partners the past few years with the Minor trade, Diekman, and Andrus. Wouldn’t put it past then to line up for another.
Appalachian_Outlaw
I don’t think you’re far off. If you’re hoping the Rangers would only deal from that 2nd tier they’re probably parting with 2 of those prospects though.
❤️ MuteButton
Love competing against the A’s. I hope they get it figured out.
sox4ever
Olson to Yankees seems like a logical fit. Wonder if NY will prospect hug
Benjamin101677
This would be a good fit if Yankees choose to do it probably take less prospects if they took a bad contract back
seamaholic 2
A’s don’t have any bad contracts, at least not of any size worth mentioning. I guess they could take Andrus or Piscotty and immediately DFA him. But that’s only $7 or 8m. Many other teams would take those guys if the A’s throw in a very good player.
Benjamin101677
For a team looking to cut payroll Andrus and Pisscoty contracts are not of value so I think a team takes 1 of these with Olson to free money up for Oakland.
Remember this is a team that just let bob Melvin out of a contract as to not have to pay him his salary. So it’s about costs
sdhitman19
Oakland let Bob Melvin out of his contract out of professional courtesy. He had given enough to Oakland and didn’t need to go through another rebuild.
A'sfaninLondonUK
Cost cutting dressed up as professional courtesy. When Tony La Russa is quoted as saying “He (Melvin) is the best manager out there” I’m inclined to think Mr Melvin wasn’t prepared to pick up the pieces after a fire sale.
A'sfaninUK
How is Olson to Yankees “logical”??? He’s from Georgia, not NYC. Weirdest thing to say ever. Olson to Braves, Marlins or Rays makes more sense.
Benjamin101677
Olson has no say in where he is traded doesn’t have a no trade clause etc so he goes where the trade is made
sox4ever
@A’sfaninUK what? Did you just confuse logical with logistical?
IHLgulls
It’s fun to watch the endless comedy that is Yankee fan thinking he’s entitled to every great small market player. Why, just toss some farm system dregs at them and that guy is yours!
LordD99
This one feels different. The A’s don’t do traditional rebuilds. Sure, they take a “step back” but they never collapse for several years, and when they make trades it’s often for MLB-ready talent. Jacking up ticket prices for 2022, which will kill already weak attendance, cutting their manager to save money, and now indicating a fire sale is coming suggests something different this time. Cratering attendance could be an attempt to force the the city of Oakland to give them their new park at a new location by showing the current location is unsustainable, or setting up their move entirely to a new city. That means they may have made the decision to do a full-on rebuild for several years so that they’re good again when they arrive at their new park, wherever that is.
Trading Matt Olson, Matt Chapman, Sean Manaea, Chris Bassitt and Frankie Montas for top prospects should catapult their farm system to the top.
Whatever the A’s are up to they’ll be smart about it, so it will be fun to watch from afar. It won’t, however, be fun for A’s fans who don’t know if they’re watching a rebuild that will reward them one day, or if they’re watching their team’s funeral.
A'sfaninUK
A’s rebuilds:
2007-2011 – 5 years, ruined by trading Carlos Gonzalez for nothing
2015-2017 – 3 years, standard rebuild window
Can Beane get it down to 2022-2023 and have the A’s back by 2024 or even maybe a late ’23 run? I think if they do go this path, thats what he will aim to do.
I also think this entire narrative is wishful thinking by a bloodthirsty media who wants trades. A’s might decide they have the pieces to add to and try and win one more ring at the Coliseum.
Bart Harley Jarvis
Carlos Gonzales was purely a Colorado phenomenon. You would’ve never heard much about him if he hadn’t been traded to the the Rockies.
bravesfan
Braves might be interested in some of those pitchers. Although I see it costing a decent amount of prospect capital to get them. As I see it; Braves have 3 pitchers as locks for starters. I would say 4th with Soroka, but we don’t truly know how good he will be IF he returns. We have a ton of young pitchers lurking to take that next step, but I fully anticipate the Braves grabbing a vet or 2 in the market this year. Maybe 1 as a lock in the rotation and another on a minor league deal as a safety net. I honestly wouldn’t mind Smyly back on a super super cheap deal. That 11 mil junk ain’t gonna work. 2-4 mil, 1 year max …
seamaholic 2
Every team in baseball is interested in some of those pitchers. They are good pitchers. Basically you’re talking about 27 teams (not the A’s and not the Rays and not the Marlins, but that’s about it).
g4
What would the Brewers have to give up to get Olson? Frelick + Turang? Ashby?
Benjamin101677
Olson would be a hot ticket; probably a team would have take Andrus or Pisscoty back plus 2-3 decent prospects.
As I have predicted for months I believe that Atlanta let’s Freeman walk and ends up trading for Olson. Olson is from Atlanta still lives there in the off season. Olson would be the perfect fit while saving money compared to Freeman.
For all those who think Freeman comes back Atlanta is usually very tight lipped about things let it slip that they had made offers to Freeman during the season. So either Atlanta low balled Freeman or Freeman is looking for a bigger pay day. Either way Freeman now has 29 other teams to take offers from. I think Braves get out priced by another team now
seamaholic 2
Yep. I’ve thought for a long time that those assuming Freddie will be back next year are whistling past the graveyard. Especially now that he’s delivered a world series. Dude’s gonna cash in now, and I’m not sure the Braves can match what he’s gonna get, nor want to, nor should.
Benjamin101677
Braves fans are also forgetting the slow start he had to the season he was hitting horrible in April and May I think the Braves see a decline coming.
Just like a lot of people I think if Atlanta was going re sign him they would have done it in season. I like Freeman overall I just think AA is going stay away from a long term contracts with a aging player. 5-6 year contract puts Freddie old in MLB standards.
Appalachian_Outlaw
Freeman needs to be re-signed, and if he isn’t that’s going to be just about the only off-season non-move they could make that’d leave a sour taste in my mouth.
For arguments sake, though: how is Olson a perfect fit when you consider they wouldn’t be far from having to pay him? Plus you’re probably giving up at least 3 top quality prospects- prospects they may need at the ML level in time given the thinning farm system. Oakland is going to get a haul for Olson.
They should just give Freeman the money.
Benjamin101677
Living in California been to Oakland games a lot went to many last year the issue is the stadium and the Stadium location. Oakland for most family oriented fans is not a safe location surrounded by some very rough neighborhoods and I would never ride BART to a game.
The warriors and raiders have both flees Oakland just like the athletics should. No major free agent would want to come to Oakland and have deal with the rough neighborhoods.
Athletics need to go to Las Vegas and into that market and than money would not be a issue
bkwalker510
yes because the real estate is so much more valuable in Vegas than on the Bay Area water front. you haven’t got a clue
Benjamin101677
Bbwalker510; what city is more likely to give in and give the Athletics more? City of Oakland has fought the Athletics for years over locations. City of Oakland has done nothing to help with teams they let the warriors and raiders go.
A lot of baseball fans are more republicans or middle of road people than democrats we saw that last year with the things mlb tried and then put away quickly. California is losing its middle class / middle of road and Republican class at record pace. Enough that California is losing seats in Congress.
We can argue about property etc but the fan base is not going be there in Oakland. Oakland is a rough city have to drive through some ghettos to get places that keeps fans away.
Las Vegas is a tourist town they see what the Athletics could be worth bringing in new people to see the game; tickets alined with casinos as
comps.
A major factor in elite players signing in places like California was the high California taxes. Las Vegas won’t have that.
A'sfaninUK
No pro athletes even live in the city their team plays in, smh you gotta be 5 years old
LV is a horrific pro sports town – look at all the death and destruction the raiders have already bought that town- if anything the Raiders will probably move back to Oakland soon.
Look at the A’s AAA team numbers – pathetic. All pitchers have ERAs of 10.00 and every hitter has an OPS over 1.000.
Las Vegas does not deserve pro sports, period. They prove this point daily.
Paulie Walnuts
You would think they would have taken notes from that dumpster fire NBA All-Star game there in 2007. But no.
Appalachian_Outlaw
No pro athletes live in the city they play in?! Really?! Lol. That’s got to be the most ridiculous thing I’ve heard today.
And no, the Raiders aren’t moving back to Oakland. They have a state of the art stadium in Vegas and aren’t forced to play on a baseball field. Your take is delusional.
As for LV not deserving pro sports, that’s bull. You’re just making up a narrative the same way you think the media is out to get the A’s. Lol.
You can rant and rave, but the more you say it doesn’t make it right.
CCCTL
> They have a state of the art stadium in Vegas
… where raiduhz fans are outnumbered by the other teams fans.
It was hilarious to see the tweets where Allegiant was rocked by “Lets Go Chiefs!” chants.
Regardless, Oakland doesn’t WANT them back, and the Coliseum development rights have been allocated.
bbatardo
Oakland is pretty good at finding young talent, so next year might not be pretty, they will probably be good again with younger talent soon.
Bob333
phillies need to put a deal together to get olsen and chapman for whoever the A’s want basically.
Benjamin101677
Phillies don’t have the farm system to get them both. Phillies need pitching more than offense.
Bart Harley Jarvis
Bohm and Moniak for Chapman. Let the A’s develop these two since it’s obvious the Phillies can’t get it done.
luca brasi
It makes no sense for the Athletics to field a bad team next year when they are about two hours the taxpayers of Las Vegas to line their pockets with cash and pay the relocation fees to MLB to move the team.
Benjamin101677
It would take 2-4 years for the Athletics to get moved a stadium built and moved endless the raiders would allow that stadium to be redone for baseball.
PadreFan19
Get that team out of Oakland. They have no business being there.
bkwalker510
why? this is about real estate, not baseball.
A'sfaninUK
The Padres don’t belong in SD, SD shouldnt have sports teams if they cant win a title. A’s have 4 in Oakland, more than even SFG ever brought the Bay. Go away troll. Win A ring before talking who has business belonging where they do.
Dan Hunter
What about Marte?
Benjamin101677
Marte is a free agent so he just walks
Dan Hunter
Thank you.
I Like Big Bunts
People think they’re gonna hire Ron Washington. Why would he come to this cheap mess and why would they pay for someone after letting Melvin walk?
luca brasi
Oakland did not let Melvin walk. John Fisher bought the Padres yes vote for relocation. Melvin was the payment.
I Like Big Bunts
Tell me you’re slow without telling me you’re slow.
A'sfaninUK
Because they were paying Bob Melvin $4M already, and maybe Washington only wants $3M?
bamck
Red Sox seem like a good trade partner for Montas and/or Olson. It would take a lot, but they have some interesting prospects. I could see something like Duran, Dalbec, and a few pitching prospects getting a deal done.
Benjamin101677
I think Olson is a fit for 20 other teams in the league so I think we could make a case for him on just about everybody’s favorite team
A'sfaninUK
The Rays are 10x a better trade partner for Olson than the Red Sox are, unless Boston wants to give up its whole top 5 prospect list for him.
48-team MLB
If they relocate then they need to change the name…with two cities as exceptions. Those cities are San Jose and Sacramento. Otherwise they need to drop the “Athletics” name.
Benjamin101677
San Jose they couldn’t relocate too because giants blocked it.
Sacramento I don’t think would draw. The kings don’t draw well. They need to move to a metro area big market.
I think someone is going to Las Vegas why not the Athletics
48-team MLB
I have no problem with them going to Las Vegas but they need to change the name if they do.
Steinbrenner2728
Sacramento River Cats (Minor league baseball) team draws a lot of crowds, Al Davis proposed a move to Sacramento in 1989/1990 along with the A’s, heck, they even have the foundation for that “future” Sacramento ballpark/football stadium near ARCO Arena just sitting there… with all that space… and with the Kings perpetually mediocre yet still can manage to bring in fans from the Delta region… with a spanking new Golden 1 Center in downtown (As opposed to the outer Natomas neighborhood, which, mind you, would be your “ideal location” for a sports venue based on your previous comments, right Benny?)
baseballguy_128
Better or Worse than the Reds payroll education lol
Strosfn79
I knowvits tough to trade within the division and the A’s simply hate the Astros
But if they could work out their differences they match up very well for a blockbuster trade.
The Astros have too many MLB ready mid-level players to fit on the 40 man roster, no shortstop, no first baseman after 2021, and a need for a top of the rotation starter.
The A’s could send Olson, Abdrus, and Manea to the Astros and save nearly $30 million in 2021.
The Astros could send several pre arbitration players
Let’s say:
Chas McCormick, Taylor Jones, Enoli Paredes, and Bryan Abreu who have all been inconsistent but have had great moments are are all arbitration eligible in 2024.
Plus
Mid level close to mlb ready( MLB pipeline team prospect #): Shawn Dubin(11), Alex McKenna( 17), Scott Manea(18), and Johansen Torres(29)
Olson starts at first moving Yuli Gurriel to a backup 1b/3b, Andrus mentors Jeremy Pena and they split time at shortstop. Manea joins McCullers and Vakdez at the top of the Astros rotation.
McCormick starts in the OF and Jones starts at first for Oakland. Paredes and Abreu can be great cheap bullpen arms.
The prospects vie for various spots as all are MLB ready or close
A'sfaninUK
Imagine actually thinking any team will make a significant trade with the trashstros, who constantly cheated against them and definitely cheated literally against them in last years playoffs. Go away troll.
Strosfn79
I am here making a legitimate post and get insulted?
What ever did I do to you?
Do you hate Astros fans that you don’t even know simply because they are Astros fans?
If not, then please enlighten me as to why I deserve that from you.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Lives with Brits, the epitomy of arrogance and self-righteousness.
Ducky Buckin Fent
Ah.
You have discovered the joy’s of @A’sFaninUK.
If you happen to disagree with him (totally understandable – we all do) you are a “troll”. & he loves his sweeping & inaccurate hot takes.
Was a good post, @Strosfn79, & I am sure most of us recognize it as such.
Apologies on behalf of the board.
But. I have Olson to the Yanks. So.
Bart Harley Jarvis
Rn,
Bad experience watching Downton Abbey?
Strosfn79
And I bet that you are much more upset and caught up than the front office and owner are.
I would bet Oakland will be happy to trade with the Astros and all the other teams, like Boston or Yankees, who cheated against them at various times.
Teams, and front offices don’t carry grudges. People – fans and players- do.
A'sfaninLondonUK
@Strosfn79….
As an A’s fan I’m more than willing for us to trade (any one of the scenarios you mentioned) with the Astros.
One slight rider – any trade should include the proviso that the Astros HAVE to pick up a free agent of the A’s choice….
We’ll see if teams/front offices bear grudges when that free agent chosen by the A’s is Mike Fiers….
bkwalker510
why would Houston move a gold glove 1B off his best position?
CCCTL
Because Olson has 2 to Gurriels’ 1.
Strosfn79
Because he CAN and because Olson can’t
Gurriel will be 38 and a FA in 2023.
He played SS, 3b, and 2b in Cuba
The Astros need a first baseman for then, and if they want Olson, now is the time not next off season
Not a perfect world but Olson is also a GG fielder. If one needs to move it has to be Gurriel.
bkwalker510
Olson can play RF
Dorothy_Mantooth
I wonder if Boston could offer a package including Bobby Dalbec and others (maybe Jeter Downs) to get Matt Olson? I know they have Tristan Casas almost ready but Casas can also play 3rd base. Once JDM is off the books, it might make sense to move Devers to DH, Casas at 3rd base and Olson at 1B. Kiké can handle 2nd base for them. That would really stack the Boston infield!
hogansgoat
As a big Braves fan I know it sounds like blasphemy but they should offer FF 4@$28 and if that doesn’t get it done offer Langeliers or Contrares, Tucker or Davidson, Waters or Pache and Ynoa for Olsen and Montas.
Benjamin101677
I agree 100% make a solid offer for 3-4 years to Freeman if he says no than start working on a off season plan. Would hate to wait on Freeman and loose out on Olson or someone else.
People forget baseball is a business at this level and have do what makes sense. Those 3-4 prospects you mentioned probably only 1 would pan out so be worth it to Atlanta
Appalachian_Outlaw
Can I just say how thankful I am you aren’t the Braves GM.
Benjamin101677
Remember that if Atlanta resign Freeman and he declines like most mlb players in mid 30s
Appalachian_Outlaw
Freeman is a professional hitter at a non-demanding defensive position, so I can’t see him falling off a cliff in his mid 30s. Give me one more WS win in the next 3 years and I don’t care if he does, though. By year five or six they’d be nearing the end of their Championship window, so Freddie will either retire or I can just watch and celebrate the last season or two of his career.
fudd5150
Offer him 8 years. Let him know that you want him to finish his career in Atlanta. As he gets older and looses some of his defensive ability, he can DH which is coming. Freddie Freeman will stay in Atlanta. His life, his friends, and the organization that has taken care of him should mean a lot to him. Chipper has even told him to stay. He’s a franchise player.
FredMcGriff for the HOF
Tucker Davidson is 1 player. No thanks on that trade proposal. Good try though.
bkwalker510
the owner of the A’s cares only about real estate development, not baseball. the real estate in the bay area vs Vegas real estate isn’t even close. a’s ownership wants to develop water front property on the Bay because it’s literally the most expensive in the country. Vegas can’t match that.
Benjamin101677
Bkwalker5150
My opinion when companies leave California like they have in groves it makes the property less valuable as who would you sell this real estate too?
15 years ago I would have said your right but Google how many major companies have left California. Once they leave California they will
never be back.
Way baseball has changed with gambling won’t even surprise me if the Athletics ended up
partnered up with a casino
Orel Saxhiser
I think you mean “droves,” not groves. Either way, your premise is untrue. Just like the person last night who claimed there is a mass exodus going on in New York. Both states are doing just fine.
Samuel
@ Cey Hey;
I’m probably the guy. I noted that PROFESSIONAL people were leaving large markets for mid-sized and smaller cities.
Check moving figures – particularly from rent-a-truck companies and cross country movers. For the last few years national rent-a-truck companies are charging 4-6 times more for a truck to go from California to Texas than visa versa. In fact, they had to pay people to drive trucks back to California.
Elan Musk stopped expanding his Haywood plant and moved his corporate headquarters and family to the Austin area. Professional people that can work from home have no reason to be in a large city. This site your reading – MLBTR – has had its writers working from home for years.
One other thing…….
We hear the leftist politicians talk about “Income Disparity”. Uh-Huh. A study was done about 18 months ago using IRS tax records. The 4 top states in Income Disparity are (in order): NY, California, Illinois, Massachusetts.
Let’s come back to baseball – more and more organized baseball personnel that do technical work are working from home. And who cares what area of the country they live in if they’re doing the job.
You may want to investigate Crypto. The media creates the impression that it’s all about buying tokens and making or losing money. Actually, Crypto companies / projects are computer networks on which applications can run on top of them via the Internet….which in turn will be running more and more off of satellites. This gives people fast world wide access to anything that can be electronically transported, including video of MLB games. Today it’s common usage to some people like myself. Sort of like Internet usage was in the mid-late 1990’s. It will have more affect on people around the world than the Internet did over the next 100-20 years.
mfm4200
ah, leftist.
tell me you’re stupid without saying you’re stupid.
bkwalker510
The Giants and Dodgers and Padres are all doing just fine. even the Angels make money at least.
Property on the Bay is still some of the most valuable in the country and that will never change due to geography alone
Samuel
@ bkwalker510;
What national real estate experience have you had?
I’m sure property on the East Bay is valuable. But hardly among the top in the country.
I wrote a long post about the Bay area about a week ago. I did consulting work in a building facing the Bay (all 8 feet of it in that area). It was in an industrial park 5 minutes from the Oakland airport and a short walk to a Jack-In-The-Box, Coliseum and basketball arena across the street. I went to Jack London Square to buy some books one weekend. Nice, but hardly a world class area. There weren’t streams of shoppers making their way to it. Bay area money is in the west and south sides. That is a bad area, and hardly picturesque. Sure, it can be improved. But I don’t see people driving over from the south and west Bay areas when they already have places to go there.
bkwalker510
lol ah so you’re not from around here.
carry on
Bart Harley Jarvis
Benj,
Companies aren’t leaving California in groves (or droves, whichever you prefer). That’s a lazy generalization. Yeah, and let’s pair the A’s with yet another sad, smoke-filled casino. That’ll classy it up.
fudd5150
In other news, water is wet.
A'sfaninUK
@Steve Adams
Did you write this article because you personally want the A’s to sell? Because you literally wrote in the first paragraph “while he didn’t outright say that the team plans to reduce its bottom line in 2022, he implied that another “step back” is certainly a possibility.” but your headline reads a lot more concrete “Athletics Appear Set For Significant Payroll Reduction” – can you see the dishonesty here?
It seems that MLB media is pushing this narrative, the A’s brass has said nothing of the sort. Bob Melvin left because he felt the Padres were closer to winning a World Series than the A’s were, but the A’s are not a bad team in his eyes, it was moving from a contender to another – nothing to do with this entirely made-up “A’s are definitely selling” angle you media types seem to love to want to write about.
Will be funny if the Fisher and Beane spend $100M this offseason just to bob when you say they will weave.
Dorothy_Mantooth
@ A’s fan, this is a RUMOR site, not a sports media outlet. In his title, Steve uses the word “Appear”, so he’s not declaring they are doing it, but based on that press conference by the GM, it was clearly inferred that they team is considering resetting again after their latest 3-4 run at a title. All the writing on the wall shows that the A’s are going to move a considerable number of their arbitration eligible players and will reduce payroll. There’s no chance whatsoever the A’s will green light a $100M for 2022; they simply can’t afford it. With that said, be thankful Billy Beane is still running things as he will find value in cheaper, major league ready prospects to keep this team quasi-competitive next year after such a large payroll / talent purge. It’s tough being an A’s fan these days. The current owner should sell the team to someone like Steve Balmer who will do whatever is necessary to build a perennial contender, which would most likely include relocating the team to a market where fans will actually show up to games. While everyone seems to think Vegas is their next destination, I think Portland, OR makes a lot of sense too. The Portland Athletics has a nice ring to it too. Hang in there, trust that Billy will find the next crop of young stars who they might actually be able to hold onto this time around so long as the stadium / ownership issues are resolved over the next 3-4 years.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Well, I thought it was a fun article that certainly sparked the imagination……and world of possibilities.
hogansgoat
So Appalachian, are you saying that’s too much? You’re not going to get 2 high quality players for a bag of peanuts.
Appalachian_Outlaw
I’m saying I believe it’s a terrible offer to Freeman, and they need to go 6/180m.
I also believe your offer to Oakland is too light, and the Braves shouldn’t gut a thinning farm system to avoid paying a player (Freeman) they can afford.
I’m saying “no” to all of it.
FredMcGriff for the HOF
@hogan. I think it’s too much. That’s a lot of prospects for 2 years of Olson and 2 years of Montas which I am not too impressed with. I’d rather see Freeman resigned and I think the Braves will be good pitching wise with Tucker Davidson and Ynoa in the mix for 2022.
Appalachian_Outlaw
I should clarify I believe his trade offer is heavy for Atlanta, but it’s going to be too light compared to the bids. I expect the NYY will go hard after Olson.
That said, I’m not high on Davidson.
Benjamin101677
Braves for Tim Hudson for very little from Oakland
That’s the hard part of baseball figuring out what players to keep and those to let go
FredMcGriff for the HOF
@app. I like Tucker Davidson (reminds me of a young Glavine). But I will readily admit I’m not a fan of prospect trading. It actually paid off in 2021 for the Braves but they’ve made some that killed the team for years in the past too (Teixeira/JD Drew).
Appalachian_Outlaw
@McGriff- My concern with Davidson is the walk rate coupled with his age. I’m a little afraid he’s going to become Newcomb V2.0.
Orel Saxhiser
Significant Payroll Reduction. That’s SPR to all you A’s and Reds fans.
padam
I can see the Mets knocking on the door for Manaea, Bassett, and Chapman. Of course they don’t have the assets the A’s would be interested in, but nonetheless.
geoffb1982
John Fisher is a multibillionaire. I hope he rots in hell for what he’s done to this team.
Samuel
Other than keep the team in Oakland which new owners wouldn’t do – and which MLB has long wanted done – what exactly is his crime?
letsplay2
Google John Fisher / cheap
Salvi
Time for Contraction. Bay Area doesn’t need 2 teams. If a team needs a firesale because they cant afford a $100m payroll, they are not worthy of call themselves a ML team. Other team’s payroll is more than double that. My point being competition isn’t close. Now there’ll be a firesale, and the rich will get richer.
Turn them into a triple A team for the Giants MLB could drop 4 to 6 teams, and not miss a thing. Talent on the field would improve as well.
Samuel
The A’s have these cycles every 4-5 years.
Most other small and mid-market MLB teams do the same thing when they have too many veterans that eat up large salaries and the team is not a real contender.
FredMcGriff for the HOF
@denny. Exactly. Contraction I’ve been preaching for years while others want expansion. My first reason 3-4 teams who cannot draw fans where they currently are located and some of that due to those owners being cheap. The other reason being every team has 3-4 players on the active roster who are AAA players at best. I don’t like seeing the completion thinned out and it has been for years.
hogansgoat
Kyle Tucker you bimbo.
letsplay2
This guarantees they will suck upon arrival in Las Vegas.
SportsFan0000
A’s and Bay Area Sports Fans need to Unite, Back the A’s efforts to stay in the SF Bay Area.
Save the team like the A’s owners and fans helped save the Giants from moving to Tampa Bay when the Giants had their moving vans all packed and ready to roll to Florida.
A’s should reassert their Territorial Rights to the entire SF Bay Area…..
The same territorial rights the A’s owned 50/50 with the Giants when the Giants were on their way to Tampa Bay. A’s gave up some of their territory to allow the Giants to build a new stadium in Santa Clara County/San Jose area. (The 49ers new stadium is in that area far from San Francisco) The Giants reneged on that deal and built their stadium in downtown San Francisco and not Santa Clara County or San Jose.
Giants fans and lawyers in the SF Bay Area should sue MLB on this and Antitrust issues.
Congress should REPEAL MLB’S ANTI TRUST EXEMPTION.
THEIR IS BIPARTISAN SUPPORT TO REMOVE MLB’S ANTITRUST EXEMPTION.
In 2013, San Jose sued MLB on grounds it had engaged in an illegal conspiracy to deny the city of a big league team (namely, the A’s). MLB prevailed in part because it was exempt from antitrust claims. In a world without the exemption, MLB would lose a powerful defense should team eye a new home.
sportico.com/law/analysis/2021/mlb-antitrust-exemp…
semut
LOLLLLLLLLLLLLL you could just recycle this same headline every year
VegasSDfan
The As are trying to destroy their welcome in Oakland. Poor attendance, last place on the horizon, and a future relocation in their sights. 300 million dollar relocation fee
LLGiants64
The A’s cutting payroll? Can’t be. Oh, wait, they just let their world class manager slip away to save money, too.
bighiggy
Cards have 40 man roster problems with rule 5 coming. Would the A’s take nootbaar, rondon, rodriguez and Robertson for manaea or bassitt plus piscotty and his whole contract? A’s get an exciting young outfielder who can do alittle of it all and may win a gold glove, a back end rotation piece, a young great fielding catcher who has a nice bat but has been hurt and a middle infielder who can play good defense and has alittle pop, for a front line rotation piece with an expiring contract and a bad contract outfielder?
bighiggy
Make it even bigger, we throw in sosa, a cost controlled decent starting short stop, and take andrus contract, but get montas instead of bassitt or manaea, and you throw in a.j puk or luzardo? I think both teams would benefit greatly from that. So sosa, nootbaar, Robertson, angel rondon and Rodriguez. For montas, puk or luzardo, piscotty and andrus(with full contracts). Cards get a Frontline controlled starter, reclamation in puk or lizards, and 2 players being overpaid with just 1 year left. Also get rid of one roster spot. A’s get starting shortstop, potential starting outfielder, back end rotation piece, project young catcher, and utility who can field and has alittle pop and sheding a ton of payroll. Win win for everybody
WrongM
Oakland trimming costs is nothing new, but if they cut down to $50M? A payroll that low would be one thing for a team for a team that’s already bad and actively in the middle of a rebuild, but for a team that’s as regularly good and fun as the A’s are, that’s sad.
If their finances are that dire, though, I wonder whether some team would take on Andrus’ or Piscotty’s contract to lower the acquisition cost of Bassitt, Manaea, or Montas.
tedtheodorelogan
I’m sure there would be plenty of teams that are in a position to do that. Giants come to mind as they have a ton of money to spend and need pitching.
geoffb1982
This is self inflicted!!! Owner is a multi-BILLIONAIRE!!!!!!!
Gwynning's Anal Lover
They already sent Jose Herrera to the Diamondbacks. What next?!?
mjpeez
The Philadelphia Kansas City Oakland Athletics are moving to Vegas baby!
Bart Harley Jarvis
FFS
GETBUCKETS
2 things are clear from the start of this offseason.
Athletics and reds are cutting cost and will rebuild.
That’s 2 teams that were in the playoff race till near the end.
ElectricJ
Broadcasting this out to other teams will not necessarily help the potential return of prospects to the A’s IMO. There will be a bidding war to some extent but understanding that Beane is going to cut payroll will mean a lower starting point in negotiations for most of their team.
With a $50M payroll, that suggests all of Olson, Manea, Bassitt, Piscotty, Chapman, and Montas are gone.
Samuel
@ ElectricJ;
Amazing comment……
You actually think MLB FO’s didn’t figure this out long ago? You think players on the A’s and players from other teams talking to A’s players before and after games didn’t know this?
L O L
I saw it coming this year, and when Melvin was allowed to go to the Padres that was the official announcement…..and I’m just a baseball fan living 2,000 miles away.
ElectricJ
Yeah right. We aren’t all as sharp and amazing as you… and what about my comment makes you believe I didn’t think other teams knew this was coming? It’s been all over the place since the season ended.
Move along if you have nothing substantial to add other than belittle other posters.
Jerryred
Matt Olson to rangers for nate lowe and prospect
angt222
Apparently the Yankees are interested in Olson.
jvent
Cheaper than Rizzo, plus if Voit isn’t involved in that deal, they can trade Voit for something else
Samuel
The Yankees, their fans and media are interested in every single name player that is a FA or rumored to be available in trade every single offseason. And they have nothing but garbage and overpaid veterans that no one wants, to offer in return….Every. Single. Year.
jvent
Chapman and Laureano to the Mets for Davis,Smith,Lee and Megill which none are really making any money, helps the Mets at 3b and CF ( when Laureano comes back from suspension). Than I would use Vientos in RF and spend $$ on SP and RP
rangers92
They should move the Athletics to Sacramento and the River Cats to Oakland.
Or just go to Las Vegas
zacharydmanprin
Sacramento is a government town. The State of California is the largest employer. There aren’t enough wealthy/well-to-do people to buy season tickets or luxury boxes (owner profit). Further, Sacramento blew its wad dropping coin and concessions on a ridiculous arena for the Kings.
ElectricJ
Cubs should be on the phone and in on talks for Manea, Bassitt, or Montas.
Samuel
@ ElectricJ;
Right.
A team with few good young players and a terrible farm system. Sure. The A’s FO can’t wait to do business with them.
ElectricJ
You’re quite the treat aren’t you. Do some research and you’ll discover the Cubs have one of the best farms in baseball.
And be prepared for them to do a deal with the A’s… they will be all over their pitching and have the resources to make a trade happen.
377194
Lowest payroll, zero paid attendance. Great! Is there an award that comes with that?
theodore glass
They need to agree to a new stadium soon. Kaval said that’s when they will start spending. But how much can you believe what he says? Time will tell.
HawaiiPhil2020
I would like to see the phils offer bohm & hoskins & moniak for both both Matt’s at the corners.
we need defense and hitting. Our draft picks rarely amount to much at the big league level
mils100
Does anybody have the Charlie Finley everybody for sale sign ready to go?
Honestly, wonder if we have the Major League movie scenario going on. I mean they have done everything possible to tank their attendance. Maybe put a lousy team on the field, draw 5k a night and claim poverty prior to a relocation.
I really wouldn’t be surprised if they end up with lowest payroll in the league in 2021 – total firesale.
zacharydmanprin
The A’s are always open to trading anyone…that hasn’t changed since Sandy Alderson took over in 1981.
Dadbodfromseattle
Chapman to the mariners just makes sense
jerry_maguire
Everyone shoots for the World Series..A’s shoot for the lowest payroll and attendance…I’m pretty sure Old Navy, Banana Republic and The Gap isn’t hurting for money either. Fisher needs to go and take his tax write offs with him. He doesn’t care about the fans or baseball….