Before Carlos Correa signed with the Twins, there was some increased buzz that Correa could be staying with the Astros, as Houston was reportedly working on a new contract offer and owner Jim Crane was getting involved in talks. However, in the aftermath of Correa’s departure, The Houston Chronicle’s Chandler Rome hears from two sources that “the Astros were not close to reuniting with their shortstop.”
In fact, the Astros didn’t even make a new offer. According to The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal, the Astros “did not budge from” the five-year, $160MM deal the club offered Correa just prior to the opening of the free agent market in November. The exact level of these latest talks between Correa and the Astros aren’t known, but Rome wonders why the team didn’t explore a contract similar to the three-year, $105.3MM pact (with two player opt-outs) that Correa landed from Minnesota, or if such a deal simply wasn’t of interest to the Astros.
More from around the American League…
- In other Astros news, Kyle Tucker told Chandler Rome (Twitter link) that the team had yet to start any talks about a contract extension. There isn’t necessarily any rush for the Astros, as Tucker is still a pre-arbitration player and isn’t eligible for free agency until the 2025-26 offseason. Still, Tucker has been excellent over his two full seasons as an everyday player, and extending him now could help Houston get some cost-certainty over what projects to be some pricey arbitration-eligible seasons for the outfielder.
- The Rays and Phillies have discussed an Austin Meadows trade, according to Scott Lauber of The Philadelphia Inquirer (Twitter link). Timing may be a factor in this report, since Lauber tweeted the news just hours before the Phillies signed Nick Castellanos, and thus Meadows may no longer be on the team’s radar. Indeed, with Castellanos and Kyle Schwarber now acquired for corner outfield and DH duty, adding a player of a similar profile like Meadows wouldn’t seem all that feasible for Philadelphia, even if Meadows is a better defender (if not a standout) than either of the two free agent sluggers.
- The Guardians “were in on” trying to acquire Jesse Winker from the Reds before Cincinnati dealt the outfielder to the Mariners earlier this week, Paul Hoynes of The Cleveland Plain Dealer reports. Seattle’s ability to absorb Eugenio Suarez’s contract gave the M’s the edge, as the Guards’ payroll limitations simply wouldn’t make it feasible for them to eat a big contract (plus, Cleveland already has Jose Ramirez at third base). Winker, however, would’ve been a big help for the Guardians’ needs in the outfield, and Cleveland has been rather quiet overall since the end of the lockout, whereas their AL Central rivals have all made significant moves.
- Justin Upton briefly started some prep work as a first baseman last season before a lumbar strain ended his season in September, but the veteran outfielder has again donned a first baseman’s glove in Angels camp this spring, The Orange County Register’s Jeff Fletcher writes. Upton has never played at first base during his entire pro career, though the lower-impact position would theoretically help the 34-year-old to stay healthy, and his right-handed bat would provide a nice complement to left-handed hitting starting first baseman Jared Walsh. After three straight injury-plagued and subpar seasons, Upton is entering the final year of his five-year, $106MM deal with the Angels.
Get Marsh and Adell starting and idc what we do w Upton
FredMcGriff for the HOF
Unless Justin Upton hits 40-50 homers this years and plays at least 150 games (which he hasn’t since 2017) this will go done as a bad contract. I thought this would be a good signing for the Angels but injuries have axed his career.
As a Tigers fan, I knew Upton was cooked before they gave him the extension
Upton will most likely be DFA’d early in the season the way Pujols was. There is no real position for him. He can’t be a 4th outfielder because he can’t play center or right. We have a DH with Ohtani, and Upton has never played first. If Adell cannot cut it in right, they could move Walsh out there and put Upton at first. But short of that, Upton is just an insurance policy right now.
On a team with Marsh, Adell and Trout, Upton is a much needed 4th outfielder and because Walsh has not shown the ability yet to hit LH pitching will play first base and do some DHing.
My guess is he get 350+ ABs. And if he doesn’t, the Angels are in great shape.
He can’t be the 4th outfielder– he doesn’t play center or right. They need someone who can play all three– that’s the problem. He will have to play a little DH and first to stick for the season, but he is in serious jeopardy. A bad Spring could see him DFA’d. They DFA’d a more productive Pujols.
Marsh can move around. With two young players, and Trout, who has a record of injuries, he’s needed.
I’m sorry for his salary, but I’m glad the Angels have him.
What has he done that makes you glad to have him? He hit .220 and change against lefties. He’s always hurt. He’s not a speed guy. He ranks at the bottom in all of baseball for defense– he’s horrible. Streaky hitter, who is not consistent. He’ll take up a valuable roster spot– and for what? I’d rather roll the dice on Taylor Ward, who is a better defender with more position versatility.
Lets see if he’s healthy, because a healthy Upton is a lot better than any of the guys who got a lot of ABs in the outfield last year.. and I mean any.
I agree with that. And I think that’s where management is right now. Let’s see how he looks in the spring, and the first month and a half. If he struggles they will cut him loose. If he finds his niche and is productive– they’ll keep him.
I love it when we can agree.
I’m actually expecting him to play well and I’m expecting a lot of Angel fans to go… “sure, do this is a walk year, you jerk!!!!!”
But he hasn’t been healthy in three years, so I can understand why no one thinks he’ll be healthy this year.
Astros have quite a bit of money to spend. They should lock up Tucker and Yordan Alvarez as soon as possible. Also, use some of it on pitching.
Why sign Franco if your just going to trade away the entire supporting cast especially Meadows
Gobbledegook! What are you babbling? TB hasn’t traded away Franco’s “supporting cast”.
A few weeks ago, I really thought the Phils were gonna go with one big trade and one big FA signing–Meadows for the LF/DH and Trevor Story for SS–as I didn’t see them going over the tax.
Or, Plan B, to satisfy similar goals I wanted them to pursue the Winker/Suarez combo. This one, though, I thought was just a pipe dream; didn’t think the Reds would give up on Winker just for salary relief. Good job M’s on getting that done.
Plan C sees them actually getting the big righty and lefty power bats, but not the two that I had expected. Can’t wait to see that offense this year!
Who plays short for the trash cans this year?
Stone Cold Steve Austin
Who comes up with the unoriginal comment next?
But it’s a classic and I hope it sticks for years to come.
Don’t do the crime if you can’t do the time.
Larry Brown's crank
Who are u referring to?♂️
He was referring to Moneyballer.
Probably a reference to Gleyber Torres, who was recently moved to second base. Mike Fiers absolutely torched that man’s career SMH
Yep. Instead an oft injured SS, they can lock down other players.
Should’ve locked him down.
The Phillies are going to try to BASH its way to the NL East title
Phillies games will be entertaining.
And if you can get there early batting practice should be nuts.
Hopefully, the OF defense won’t be as bad as it seems it might be.
Repeatedly posting this won’t change the fact that they are now the Guardians.
It’s the Guardians. Cleveland doesn’t claim this negative Nancy. Grow up.
Chief Wahoo forever!!
Free Speech, Karen.
do you really think the majority of greater Cleveland likes the name change?
Most of us have lives and dont really care
Yet here you are commenting.
I don’t like it either. But I love baseball and my city. Find another team? Or just continue to be whiney Karen’s. It’s embarrassing.
The Guardians suck. The name. The whole organization. The just suck. We got Tito gonna gift his way through another campaign. No moves of any consequence except getting that payroll down to 52M this year. I bet that was Dolan’s only goal, and maybe to trade Jose….for cash. Hello Ted Stepian….They might as well move, seriously. They will blow, finish last in the division, bring the boys up from Columbus to play. No not the good ones, the mediocre ones. You can’t have good minor leaguers starting to accumulate service time. Maybe the minority guy buys Money Bags Dolan out…then again, Dolan thinks ge can take it with him
Chief Wahoo forever!!
Still think they should have went with the SPIDERS. The league is truly underrepresenting the insects/arachnids demographic.
With they would’ve went with Spiders! But nope. We got the Guardians and it sucks and all.
If you’re actually interested in why they didn’t go with the Spiders, they don’t own the rights. Technically the Cardinals would own that name, as the Spiders’ owner bought the then St Louis Browns/Perfectos and transferred all the best players to St Louis (including Cy Young). That team eventually became the Cardinals, and would still own the rights.
Further, the Spiders were an absolute embarrassment. Even before selling all their best players, they were consistently one of the rougher teams in terms of trying to intimidate umpires and cause near riots. The owner trashed Cleveland on the way out, blaming attendance woes on the city and stating that St Louis was simply a better town for baseball. That last Spiders team went 20-134, including 11-110 on the road (a record that will never be beaten).
If they wanted to cite some history in the name there were some choices. The Negro League Buckeyes would have been my choice if they could work out something with OSU. The Blues would have been an okay pick as a previous name. But of new names, Guardians was pretty clearly the best they could do.
Upton seems destined to be the next guy the Angels pay huge money to not play for them.
Matthews Jr, Wells, Hamilton, Pujols,
Downing was safe!
Sadly, I feel you’re right on this one.
Not sure he will be the clubhouse cancer that some of the others were.
Not sadly I hope you’re right HHJJ.
Downing was safe!
I hope he’s able to contribute. $28 mil of dead money is a terrible waste. Upton was an annual Allstar in the past. Maybe he’s got at least one more good year in him. His main problem, like too many other players on this roster, is staying healthy. He’s a streaky hitter who’s lava hot when things are going right and artic cold when they’re not. I’m pulling for the guy.
Walsh is not good against lefties. If Upton can play reasonable defense at first, it makes sense to try to get Upton some of these at bats. Upton didn’t have a good year, but he hit great when leading off for the team and hitting in front of Shohei.
.313 BA, .407 OBP, 5 HR in 113PA
So there is at least some hope for his bat. If you can set the table like that ahead of three of the best run creators in the game, chances are you going to score some runs.
It was Walsh’s first full year in the league. He got better against lefties and made the All-Star team. He’s also an elite defender. I don’t see platooning him. Let him continue to grow and evolve– he can only do that seeing lefties regularly.
Wa;;sh is absolute trash against LHP., .170 BA and .208 OBP. That is not promising. Doesn’t make sense to have him practice when there is a viable option. If they are out of the running, then sure go ahead..
Elite defender? How so? He is -1 dwar and -5 OAA. He is below average at best
man and that Rendon contract is looking ROUGH… Hopefully he turns it around so that they can extract some value from it….
Didn’t Toronto sign Wells to that deal & the Angels took him on?
@dsett75 Correct. Nobody wanted that contract. Arte told Reagans, the GM at the time, to get him or his was fired. This was a head scratcher at the time. It didnt make sense for the Angels. This move along with the Gary Mathews contract were heavily criticized by the fans and experts alike.
The Guardians are pathetic. Suarez is a (very flawed) 2.5-3.5 war player only making 3/33. It’s hardly a bad contract.
Where do they play him?
They have numerous youngsters coming out of this rebuild on the fly that are ready to play – at least one of whom will prove far better over the next 3 years than Suarez, and play for less money.
they could/should have gotten creative. Two years of a cheap Jesse Winker is enough to make you figure out the Suarez details after-the-fact. It’s enough to even swap out Suarez for Moose and find a place to fit that bad contract. Winker is worth it.
Getting stuck with contacts for Suarez or Moose not only limits what Cleveland can spend in 2022 – and they always leave money in reserve to pick up a necessary player or two at the trading deadline if they’re contending – but it takes away playing time for youngsters that are their future.
Small market teams cannot afford to get struck with contracts that don’t fit within their budget. It’s why the Reds have had to trade off players in one-sided deals just to get out from under. Cincy needs at least 4 years before they’ll be half-decent due to the “GO FOR IT”, “TRY TO WIN” nonsense they did when they didn’t have a young core in place. Cleveland is putting that young core in place. You want them to do what Cincy did. They’re too smart to do that.
The only thing that limits what Cleveland can spend is Cleveland. They can easily fit 11 mil a yr into their budget. They simply choose not to do so. They have no big contracts at all. Stop making excuses for cheap franchises.
Exactly!! Every team can afford it. The question is the owner….if they’re a fan, they’ll wanna win. Otherwise, they’re interested in how much money they can shove in their pockets
@ Tomahawk Takeover;
I’ve run departments in businesses…..
Please show me where the $11m is.
So if every team can do it and every owner should do it……
Then that means every team will win. Right?
Wow! 30 World Series Winners!! Is this anything like participation trophies?
upton will be a 4th outfielder and play some 1st. and that’s just great.
Upton can’t be the 4th outfielder because he can’t play center, or right. They have to have someone who can play all three. They don’t need him at DH, but could use him once a week when Ohtani is out of the lineup. He can play first against a tough lefty. He could pinch hit, or occasionally play left. But the ABs are not there. DFA six weeks into the season.
Isn’t that what Marsh could do? Why does it matter if he’s considered the 3rd or 4th OF?
Walsh can’t hit lefties, so a platoon with Upton makes sense.
The Guardians better hope that F. Reyes stays healthy because, otherwise, there goes Ramirez’s protection. It looks like a very lean offensive lineup right now.
I know it’s too late but I still love Spiders as team name. Plus when playing well we can call them the Cleveland spiders ( from Mars) & everybody will feel better
Cleveland’s fans deserve better, they deserve MUCH BETTER!!
I’ve been to 12 different ballparks, so I cannot 100% say they have the most loyal fans in baseball, but I can say their fans are some diehards that love their team. Unlike most fans who are exiting after about 5-6 innings, Cleveland’s fans stay the entire game rooting, hooting, and cheering just as hard as if they’re always winning. Even down 8-1, their fans all stayed and continued to rally and roar for each hit as if it would be the one to start the comeback…
As a guest in and around their park park city, you could tell young and old their moods were dictated by a W or an L..Even still, even still though in defeat they lost with grace and supporting their team to the fullest…I don’t see that in very many fanbases these days, hardly any in fact..It was extremely refreshing, seeing young kids with enthusiasm cheering up their parents and grandparents with an “ehhh they’ll win next time..” Seeing life lessons being passed down from generation to generation…Thank you all..
I have nothing but respect for Cleveland baseball fans, but this tightwad owner and these execs don’t deserve you…You guys deserve so much more, and I hope you all eventually get it!!
That’s all well and good.
But the fact is that Cleveland’s revenue stream is pretty much that that of Tampa’s, Oakland’s, KC’s, Pittsburgh’s and others (and Oakland has fanatical A’s fans as well). So like those teams, Cleveland has to go through periods of rebuilding.
Fans always complain about a part of a team that looks weak, instead of understanding how the team is constructed. Cleveland is a pitching-first team. They may well be the best in MLB at developing their own pitchers, as well as squaring away young pitchers from other teams that aren’t developing (see Cal Quantrill who was stuck with the Padres). Because of the strong pitching they don’t need a lot of bashers on O. What they do need is decent defense to support the pitchers and a reasonable amount of runs manufactured. Francona is very good at squeezing this out of the position players.
I do believe that they have a very good chance of winning the ALC this year as they have well over a half-dozen position players coming up from their farm system; and will be even stronger in 2023 as their young players get more experience.
P.S. I’m not a fan of the current ownership. On the other hand, if they had any money they wouldn’t constantly be looking for a minority owner to join them……and if the franchise was such a good investment, they wouldn’t have such problems finding a minority owner.
Ckeveland’s revenue stream?
Every team receives at least $90M just from national and local TV revenue.
Add to that (conservatively) 1.5 million attendance at an average of $46/ticket= $69M- I believe they are guaranteed to keep 52% of this, so say $36M.
Merchandising- about $13M per team minimum.
Most teams clear about $1.00 in concession revenue for every $5-6 in ticket revenue so add at least $6M.
Parking, corporate sponsorships and stadium advertising not included this would be about $145M before depreciation of assets and other tax writeoffs. All told,a minimum of well over $150M.
Plus the owners have an asset that appreciates seemingly 10% or more every year. Then of course they receive revenue sharing through the CBT levied on the teams who actually try to win.
Yeah, I’d say those poor small market teams who generate at least $150M are justified having payrolls of $30-60M right?
There needs ve a MINIMUM payroll- say $90M or so, to ensure teams put a major league product on the field and not 20 pre-arbitration players and 6 dead end guys making less than the median salary. Add in player benefit costs, draft signing bonuses, minor league operations, scouting, staff and stadium operations and there would still be perhaps a $40M profit
Revenue stream my arse
You have to pay more than just players
People on here think:
Revenue – Payroll = Money In The Owners Pocket
The have no clue how much it costs to run a ML franchise.
The problem has been not enough of those fans go to the ballpark. Low attendance limits what can be done financially.
Much more money comes in from TV than attendance. Attendance/concessiobs are perhaps 25% of the revenue stream and most “small market” teams generate more in TV/radio revenue alone than their entire payroll/operations expenses. Ticket sales. concessions and merchandising are profit.
A’s owner wants to cry poverty while making money. A’s double prices and decided to put AAA players out there. No different than renting a luxury car price and get to drive around in a Hyundai compact.
@ ARC 2;
The owner of a business that invested money to buy it; has to oversee it and work at it 365 days a year; is liable to a point for losses (the Pirates were sold in Bankruptcy Court – one owner lost almost everything he and his family owned); but it’s a crime if he makes money?
The man could take the same money, buy a tax free bond and make a nice bundle without aggravation or putting himself at risk.
Heck, you’re so smart – why don’t you and your buddies rustle up some money and buy a ML franchise. All you have to do is sit around, not spend on player salaries, and count the profits! Almost as good as working for the government.
Happy to see the fellas at MLBTR acknowledge that Upton has been bad for the Angels.
Even the Angels acknowledge how bad he’s been:
“He’s also seen his production decline over the last three years, batting just .211/.299/.414 with 38 homers and 103 RBIs in 194 games while grading out as a below-average left fielder defensively.”
Some people on here defend him as a good ball player. I can’t understand how.
He used to be a good offensive player but he’s also always been lazy on defense and on the bases. Now, injuries have taken away his only true skill.
The Cleveland team is owned by a cheap owner who’s content with a AAA team.
I think it’s pretty interesting the Astros may have never budged on their initial offer. I loved the player, but he was an 800 OPS player with an elite glove. Super valuable, but irreplaceable.
I wouldn’t take that story to the bank as gospel. It said two sources said that the Astros didn’t budge, but somebody had reports to the contrary before. We may never know the truth. What we do know is that they couldn’t come to an agreement. I suspect they are very high on Peña and saw him as a better value. Not a better player, just better bang for the buck
Agreed. None of us know the truth about what happened and never will.
What we can do as fans is look that the patterns of organizations. The Astros under the ownership of Jim Crane have been very fair about paying out salaries, but they’ve also been very smart about it. When Jeff Luhnow was canned James Click was brought in from the Rays. They continued an approach of allowing players to leave if their salary demands exceeded what they project as future production. In Correa’s case I’d suspect they found the risk/reward ratios based on his past physical issues made an $30m-plus long-term contract a risk that they could not take if they were going to finance a team that would continue to be a sustainable contender.
The Astros are very smart MLB organization – up there in the elite category with the Rays, Brewers, Giants, Braves and Dodgers. They’re going to stay within their revenue stream and not give up future contention. They will not replace what Correa did for them in the past. What they can do is make other position players better with the cumulative effect being that they replace his production – and they’ll do it in line with their revenue stream.
Saying “Austin Meadows is a better defender than Schwarber and Castelanos” is the definition of a back-handed compliment.
The Phillies would be a dynasty if MLB played beer league softball instead of baseball.
Have your fun Phokes, but if nothing else, the Phillies will be a fun team to watch..
Say that in June when they have LOST their 3rd 9to8 game in a row
So, CC basically walked away from 55m and the only team he has ever known (in a state with no income tax) over 3m a year difference in salaries, his take home pay would have been less with twins…. Something tells me toxic club house
the astros did not want to give him the opt outs thats why he signed with the twins
Houston didn’t make an offer like Minnesota because they weren’t about to give Correa a contract where he holds all the cards
Correa screwed up in free agency. He wanted too much too early, and by the time his price came down, most of the teams had signed other Shortstops. He’s hoping his 3 year deal will turn into a 1 year deal and he performs at an equal or better level to try out free agency again next year.
Justin Upton is the oldest 33 year old in the league
Better than an old BJ
The guardians are always in on everyone,but nothing ever happens. Just like Georgy Girl.. Always window shopping,but never stopping to buy.
Lake on Fire
Cleveland’s TV commentators kept calling them Guardians “Injuns” in first exhibition game.. They’d better keep that $100 swear jar handy.
We have been having the whole “Dolan is cheap” argument since we traded Sabathia and Lee. That was almost THIRTEEN YEARS AGO. Since then we have been in the playoffs five times and in the World Series once. We had 7 winning records. That is very comparable to other Mid-market ballclubs. It certainly is better than the team I grew up with that rarely won more than 80 games. It is certainly better than the Browns over the same period and is comparable to the Cavs.
Aren’t you sick of this argument? After 13 years? I was sick of it more than ten years ago, yet, here we are.
The name change is done. Are we going to be arguing over this for the next thirteen years? I’m already sick of this one, too.
You have to ask if all of you who are so upset about these two arguments (and many of you have your panties in a twist about BOTH) are CREATING YOUR OWN MISERY.
It isn’t that important to be so upset for so long.
Hug your kids. Buy a pet. Meditate. Go for a walk and enjoy the sunshine.
It is a big world. Maybe you should enjoy a day or two.
The Angels should be working Upton out at Bullpen Catcher & DH