Daniel Alvarez Montes of El Extrabase. ccording to a new report from The Athletic’s
Luis Ortiz) So, turned to the Tiburones instead of the Estrellas Orientales, the whom he played in the 2019-20 and 2020-21 offseasons. Alvarez Montes suggests the Tiburones will try to dispute the Guardians’ decision, but it’s not a fight they’re likely to win.
Clase and Ortiz have been on non-disciplinary paid administrative leave since July, due to an ongoing MLB investigation related to sports betting. Their leave was originally scheduled to last through August 31, but on August 31, MLB and the MLBPA agreed to extend the leave “until further notice.” In a short statement announcing the indefinite extension, the Guardians made clear that they would not comment further until the investigation was complete. Indeed, no meaningful details have since emerged about the situation or either player’s future in MLB. The Athletic’s Zack Meisel reported from Cleveland’s end-of-season press conference on October 7 that there was “still no clarity” regarding either Clase or Ortiz. President of baseball operations Chris Antonetti suggested he’s hopeful the investigation wraps up over the offseason, but he wasn’t able to offer a concrete timeline. “We have to plan as if they won’t be here,” the executive explained.
Obligatory sports gambling is a plague on our society.
Sports betting is not obligatory, no one is forced to bet. Neither is it a plague since only 20% or so of the US population bets, me not one of them.
I do agree that it is not good for sports, and a plague on baseball.
I’m saying my comment is obligatory to remind everyone how much sports gambling is not worth it.
But there is always the chance to win big,and then walk away.
Yeah, but how often does that happen?
As my gf who worked the pits in a casino … always said as we discussed the suckers … “ they didn’t build this place for you to win “
Unfortunately this is a true story.
Knew a guy who managed a very successful car dealership. He was the son of the owner, and was very well compensated. Beautiful wife and kids. The whole package.
He had a gambling problem. And when he couldn’t cover his bets, Dad paid off the bookies. After years of this Dad said no more, you’re on your own.
Guy very on the Superbowl and lost huge. He couldn’t cover the bet, and it was big. Dad couldn’t or wouldn’t pay them. They said if you don’t pay we’re going after family. Guy shot and killed himself in the office of the dealership so they wouldn’t.
Gambling can be fun. Gambling addiction is evil.
When I was 18, a friend and I started playing in a friend’s father’s game. You don’t think about stuff when you’re 18, but some of these guys couldn’t play whatsoever. They’d lose $100-200 every outing in the ’70s, when that was real money. I feel bad in retrospect. It was like drinking with people that you knew were driving.
There were so many ads for gambling while watching the super bowl. Not good.
The way the major sports leagues and media networks force it down the throats of the consumer could be described as a plague, perhaps…
20% of the population 90% of which are under 35. Unfortunately it takes that long to convince young people that it is a terrible habit.
Ever visit a casino? Chock full of oldsters, gambling away their Social Security.
I used to do some sports gambling (small amounts of money) but it just doesn’t pay off. That former padres player who got suspended for live lost the majority of his bets.
Sport betting brokers are smart, usually the money line is not profitable on both sides.
I once did a calculation with fangraphs game odds. Did the Math for a day with 10 games. Of the 20 sides to bet on like 2-3 where slightly profitable, the Rest both sides of the bet had negative EV. Special bets like over under, runs per game etc aren’t better.
So if you want to gamble you can do it but know that you are wasting your money, even if you have a system to predict results the betting sites have it too and have set the odds so that you will lose. Typically for example the actual odds for a game is 60 to 40 in favor of team A. But the implied odds offered are like 55 to 45, so neither side of the bet is profitable.
That doesn’t mean you cannot win some bets but long term it just is not profitable.
If you know that and you say I know I’m losing money but I play for fun anyway it is fine but mosts guys who bet regularly do thing they have found a way to outsmart the betting sites and make easy money.
Sorry my example was slightly off, of course the implied odds would be higher.
So say Yankees are 60 to 40 favorite to beat the pirates.
That means Yankees should be plus 150 and pirates minus 150. However broker will offer plus 160 for Yankees and minus 140 for pirates, so no matter what side you bet you lose long term.
You can just as well just burn your money
I like parlays in that you only have to wager a small amount to get a nice payback if you win your 3-team parley. I would never go over 4-team and it’s not worth it just doing 2. I think it’s exciting when you hit all 3 or 4 wins and you’re not wagering much to begin with so if you miss out you’re not out of pocket. I never touch straight bets or those crazy prop bets, which I think go way over the line into exploitation.
You can do the parlays but the same Math applies too. They will just multiply the implied odds and still give you bad odds for the whole thing.actually the house edge is often larger on parlays since the edge in each leg gets multiplied
It can be funnier since you can win a large sum at once but long term you still will lose
If that’s the only plague on society then we are in a good spot
@queenie – If only, however the jackboots are on the march again.
Most of the time when I go to read a few baseball articles on CBS Sports, over 50% of the “articles” are simply gambling related odds and such. pathetic how gambling has been allowed to take over the sporting world.
I respect MLB, MLBPA, and Lidom for the decision. Betting on games when playing affects everyone involved. No room for it.
I am against players gambling on the sport, but this is ridiculous. How can you respect them interfering with a players career? If the investigation shows them to be guilty, then say so. After this amount of time, if they haven’t found proof, let them continue their careers. How long should MLB be able to continue their investigation without a decision? Hanging a person out to dry without proof, for a never ending length of time should not be allowed by the Union.
There is a good likelihood that a decision has already been made in the investigation. MLB, always protects it’s sacred cow, the World Series. No negative news was going to come out after the regular season was over. It’s almost a 100% certainly that both pitchers will be found guilty. The news will be announced no earlier than a week after the W S is over.
I also wonder if the MLB is negotiating with the union or the players’ lawyers. You can never be sure how much evidence baseball has. And you can’t be sure how much leverage the players have.
If Ortiz tells MLB that he knows ten other players that have done the same thing, and is thinking of writing a book, Manfred will make it go away, just like he’s done in the past.
@bbhistory
That’s a fair point. Still, if they made the decision, wouldn’t they have announced it before the end of the season so the playoffs would take over the focus? If they announce it after the playoffs, won’t it take the focus away and end the season on a sour note?
They are getting paid.
They let Ohtani slide because he’s their cash cow. No respect here.
All facts to the contrary notwithstanding.
At this point, you must want to believe it regardless of any facts that get in the way. Are you that way about the moon landing and 9/11 as well?
Most people are.
“Facts”.. You just go right ahead eat up everything you’re told, guy. Best of luck.
You go ahead and make up your own alternate facts, guy. Best of luck.
Look, a Dodgers fan who doesn’t want to believe that his favorite player is guilty of betting on baseball and the league covered it up because he’s the golden child. Meanwhile, two other players who gambled on baseball haven’t played in months. Enjoy watching Rachel Maddow.
I don’t watch cable news and I’m not a Dodgers fan. If Ohtani was guilty it would have been readily apparent from the investigation and there are too many witnesses to what actually occurred who would have leaked already that it was Ohtani all along if he actually did it. Sorry , I know it’s hard to believe these days but not everything is a grand cover up.
You got that right
Manfred wants this kept quiet, at all costs. The players are still getting paid. There is always a number that makes problems go away.
They have records, recordings, and signed paperwork besides the confession.
What more do you want?
I don’t really understand this decision from Cleveland’s perspective, personally.
Cleveland doesn’t want a gambler to gamble his elbow at the Tommy John casino, in Venezuela
Dark side
Cleveland has Clase for 2026 at $6.4 million and a pair of team options for 2027 and 2028 at $10 million. Rumor has it that Clase may be banned for gambling at least three years and more likely for “life”. Cleveland’s interest at this point is to make sure that Clase does not get paid for 2926 since he will likely never throw a pitch for them again. So all I can think is that MLB and Cleveland are unhappy with Clase.
I mean, if the U.S. is about to destabilize Venezuela is support of regime change, you would think the Guardians would want Clase to be stuck on the middle of it all.
2926? Cleveland really deferred that one. Pretty sure they can prevent him from getting paid that year
Man all of us are focused on the Los Angeles deferrals but how could we forget about Cleveland deferring until the sun explodes
Both Clase and Ortiz will get a lifetime ban.
Not sure about that. Look what happens to Boston and Houston on the sign stealing scandal. MLB set the bar with those “sanctions”.
Those aren’t analogous. Betting on games you are involved in gets you banned (a la Rose). Sign stealing by a whole organization is much more difficult to punish appropriately bc they would have had to really stick the screws to the club and in so doing breathe further life into the scandal, hurting the league overall which baseball will avoid at all costs. Suspending one player sends a message and any negative attention would fade quickly. So your analysis is incorrect not I understand why you erred.
What are you talking about? Tucupita Marcano got a lifetime ban for betting on baseball just last year.
That is the Baseball organization that was fully capable many decades ago. Now with what they wanna do and the money that they get, I don’t think they’re gonna take this very seriously and they may give them a year or two suspension. The leaders of the Baseball have changed and they don’t have the same stones as they did back then
That Cleveland is being non accommodating here tells me they’re pissed which tells me there’s SOMETHING here and something is not nothing and he needs it to be nothing to not be banned.
Wait, you need this to tell you that ‘something is there’? Of course something is there. Smoke = fire. Fire = you get burned.
Makes sense…..
Is it the impression that Clase and Ortiz somehow worked together in their cheating, or are these two separate cheating investigations not related to each other???
Technically two separate investigations but it’s not out of the question they’re linked
It’s a business decision, not emotional. Clase remains under contract with the Guardians and they need to be able to control their asset to prevent him from getting hurt.
If Cleveland is fighting it, wouldn’t that mean it’s less likely they are banned from MLB?
Hard read. You’d think they want him to have game reps after being suspended for half the season too though.
Or not get injured so they can trade him as soon as he’s reinstated.
He lost all of his value he will probably get released like Bauer after (potential) reinstatement
I don’t know if any team would give him a chance
If he’s not permanently banned Clase will be on a Major League Baseball team. I’d bet my life on it.
He committed a non violent offense. He could help a team significantly and that almost always matters the most.
Won’t he be banned for life?
They’re gonna have a tough time proving guilt on this one. Not saying he’s not guilty but proving he intentionally threw two bad pitches on prop bets is not a low bar. Do I think he’s guilty yes. Think and prove aren’t interchangeable.
Follow the money!
Oh cmon just let him throw for once, these games don’t count towards him, if he manages to come back to MLB then he’s gonna look rusty as hell and pitch like he’s Brooks Kriske.
Unless the league has moral objections to the gambling—he’ll be in the NPB or the KBO in no time. He was one of the best relievers on the planet.
Imagine a game where Julio urias goes 7 innings and Roberto osuna and clase finish it
Also how is Wander Franco not officially banned by mlb?
It’s not “the NPB” it’s just “NPB.”
Ah, yes it’s “MLB” you certainly can’t refer to it as “the MLB” in a sentence. Get the hell out.
It depends on whether the reader is sounding out all the words in his head. If it is just the letters, “The MLB” makes more sense.
No it doesn’t.
Gambling is shoved down everyone’s throats to no end these days. I really think you’re going to see more players doing this type of stuff. Won’t be too long before you hear a big three sport game was fixed. And everyone can throw up their faux outrage, like how could this happen??
But unlike the Black Sox scandal, players today make too much to risk a gambling ban. If Clase and Ortiz did, they lost way more in earnings than any betting profits they made.
Oh I don’t disagree with you there, but the temptation for some of these guys might be too much. You gotta think, many of these Latino players come from super poor situations, so the quick buck incentive versus the years it takes to get the big contract makes it seem worth it. Plus, The Black Sox scandal, Pete Rose, these are American tales. These guys probably aren’t thinking about lifetime bans. Just easy money. It’s not like they all are super millionaires. If you’re a guy making the league min, 700K ish, once taxes and agents money comes out, now we are talking 350K or less in bring home, life expenses and what not, it just doesn’t stretch super far. Might have the Porsche, but you ain’t got no gas money.
Clase made $4 million in 2025, was due $6 million for 2026 with at least $20 million beyond that. How much could he make gambling? If the allegations are true, this was just stupidity, not avarice.
I would refer you to the NBA and Tim Donaghy…
Well you nailed that Dodgers fan. Lol. Only took about 12 hours for us to look at the NBA! Billups, Rozier, & the Mafia is involved too. How many other athletes are sweating right now?
If MLB is against gambling why do they allow it in their stadiums.
Because they are not against money.
They aren’t against gambling they are against the people who control the outcome of the product gambling on the product.
MLB shouldn’t be allowed to place players on indefinite leave without some sort of accusation. We know what Luis Ortiz is accused of. We knew what was going on with Bauer and Julio Urias and all the other domestic violence incidents. Clase has yet to be publicly accused of anything beyond a vague “related to investigations.” Tell us what, specifically, you think he did. Ortiz threw a suspicious ball. Is that what Clase did? Why not show us like with Ortiz?
That’s exactly what Clase did and he did it twice.
Where is that reported? I’ve looked extensively and found nothing.
Manfred didn’t send you the link? I asked him, and he sent me the link. I’ll send it to you when I find it.
Maybe this is a push for them to retire from MLB. Can then play elsewhere. As soon as the pay stops both probably quit.
He sho don’t look too happy about it.
They’re not big enough stars to not be suspended and not be investigated.
They’re touting parlays in game. It’s the next opioid addiction crisis.
I have a buddy that thinks “he’s figured it out”. At this point, he’s like a drug addict. Pretty much all he talks about. Parlay this. Need so and so to cover that. He even made a few bets this year on the WNBA. I knew he was gonna pretty much gone at that point.
If he’s watching wnba games for gambling reasons, someone needs to help him.
Oh I highly doubt he’s ever actually watched a WNBA game. As far as helping him, he’s pretty successful in business and his wife makes good dough too, so it’s not like intervention time or anything. Dude has taken the fun and purity out of sports. The joy of just watching your team play in a big game. I mean, can you even have a favorite team anymore when only the outcome matters. I don’t know. It’s not for me. A fun 50 dollar office bet or something, sure. But all this other madness is just that, madness.
That’s usually how you can figure it out. If I bet the Raiders or the RS jus to watch the game, it’s no big deal (and no, I don’t need any snark about betting on the Raiders). But if you’re betting ten games a week, every week, he might have a problem.
You never said if you bet on the Raiders to win or lose. 😉
I’ve looked at a couple of games where I figured the Raiders had no chance, but I couldn’t bring myself to bet against them.
When I went to LC with friends, we’d commingle our bets, and all make a selection. The one rule was that we could never bet against any of our favorite teams.
Its funny, during probably the best season of “The Simpsons” in decades last season they did an episode where Moe and Grandpa recruit a two-way star from Macedonia to the Springfield MLB team and of course he becomes a huge star and of course becomes addicted to gambling on Baseball. During his press conference to confess his gambling, Moe acting as his interpreter turns everything around and blames all of the reporters representing news outlets named after betting apps. At the end they cut to Kevin Burkhart and Kevin Millar covering the results of MLB’s investigation and declare after a “20 minute investigation” the player was found completely innocent and Moe was blamed for everything. Obviously this was a rif on the Ohtani situation but it points out the absurdity in the fact that MLB can absolve Ohtani of any wrong doing in 5 minutes but almost 4 months later Clase and Ortiz are still in limbo
I wonder if stupidity is contagious. It appears to be.
It is a legitimate question.
At this point, it almost qualifies as a rhetorical question. If we were able to prove it either way, I’d make a substantial wager Ohtani was involved, without a doubt in my mind.
But I still agree that a coverup was in everyone’s best interest. Ohtani is huge. Clase and Ortiz are small potatoes
The evidence in the Ohtani case proves otherwise. People like you choose to ignore it.
The number of coincidences one would have to believe is astronomical. He would have to have not looked at a bank statement for 26 months. You’d have to believe that his $200k translator had a $16M++ line of credit. You’d have to believe that his translator could outwit major banks who have entire departments devoted to fraud prevention.
And probably a dozen other things. There really is almost no chance.
I too place no credence in any investigation performed by MLB but you can’t simply ignore the reports made public by the FBI and the District Attorney. Or I suppose I should say, YOU can ignore them or dismiss them. After all, that’s the kind of approach that makes a great conspiracy theory and endless fantasy entertainment.
The FBI report certainly has to be considered, but every facet of this works against Ohtani. Just this morning I read:
“The bookie, who says he had taken $1 billion in wagers from his 1,200 clients that year betting on sports games
…..
Bowyer was sentenced 12 months and one day for running an illegal gambling operation, money laundering and filing falsified tax returns.”
A billion $$$ bookie with tax problems gets one year?
And that reflects on Ohtani how exactly?
I, for one, would just like to see sports betting cease to exist. Just another addiction for this nation to pretend isn’t an addiction.
People gamble everyday of their lives? Can i make it through the light before it turns? Is that a fart i can trust? All of life is a gamble
Gambling that you can trust a fart is exactly like gambling in a casino.
You’re guaranteed to lose over the long runs.
While I don’t agree that we should free Luigi, we can definitely agree that humans are the worst.
I don’t mind gambling but why do they even have bets based on a single pitch or single AB during a game?
That’s an easy answer – profits. Those bets provide them with more money quicker from more people.
I guess it makes sense that they will deny him. If i understand correctly, no member of the club is allowed to have contact Clase.. so having him pitch competively without being able to relay training and health information could be risky.
Probably not going to matter in a couple weeks though..
With tensions building over US sinking their boats, it is smart for Cle not to send him. Even though is is not from US being a MLB player would him a target.
Should’ve just blamed his translator
It wasn’t hard to figure out Ohtani was gambling and using his interpreter to cover his a$$. But he’s still playing.
I love how simple life is for those who who think simply.